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HandsOnTheWheel
06-26-2016, 06:36 PM
So far:
1: Lebron James

Sadds The Gr8
06-26-2016, 07:05 PM
easily Curry, then Durant. After that it'll get interesting

More-Than-Most
06-26-2016, 07:16 PM
Westy or curry here.

ManRam
06-26-2016, 07:48 PM
It's Curry. These playoffs matter, and were telling, but you can't ignore what he's done the past two seasons outside of that. Those LARGE sample sizes matter. Now we know he's not perfect, but he's still undeniably amazing. #2 it is.

Saddletramp
06-26-2016, 08:05 PM
^Same

DanG
06-26-2016, 08:09 PM
Currryyyy. If you don't vote Steph then you're still living in the moment.

3. KD
4. Westy

after that there are several players who could go #5 imo.

mngopher35
06-26-2016, 08:11 PM
Curry here for me as well. His regular season performance was unbelievable, it's a shame he got banged up in the playoffs and didn't look quite the same.

Bruno
06-26-2016, 08:22 PM
I know I'm in the minority but Im not as interested in a players metrics when half of the 82 game sample size is against average or scrub teams. we're taking about a 9.2 drop off in PER against real competition and tough match ups, which is the largest drop off of all time if I'm not mistaken. this is the second year in a row he's dropped off once the real season starts. Tough call but I'd go Westbrook.

Bruno
06-26-2016, 08:28 PM
I'd also argue that durability is a part of the greatness equation. maybe steph was more banged up than the average NBA star at that point in the season, maybe he wasn't. was that the case last year as well?

ManRam
06-26-2016, 08:40 PM
I'd also argue that durability is a part of the greatness equation. maybe steph was more banged up than the average NBA star at that point in the season, maybe he wasn't. was that the case last year as well?

I think that's fair. We'll see if this becomes a trend. The health tool is one of LeBron's greatest strengths, for example. TBD for Curry. And the ability to stay healthy and able to play huge minutes matters a ton.

I'm actually willing to cut him some slack for the injuries but what really caused me to knock him down a slight peg was his inability to take over when the shot wasn't falling. Maybe that's purely a resultant of said nicks and bruises, but I don't know. He just couldn't contribute outside of the three point shot. He's a much better playmaker than what he displayed in those Finals, but man...he was just running off screens trying to hoist threes. The offense rarely was running through him. That's why I lost a little love for him. That's where I think there's room for Russ, KD, Kawhi etc. to maybe overtake him eventually if teams can replicate that Cavs defense against him a little more regularly.

Cal827
06-26-2016, 08:40 PM
2. Curry? (He's gonna win anyways :laugh2: )
3/4: KD/Westrbrook
5: George


Then it gets fun :laugh2:

MagicBucsSox
06-26-2016, 08:41 PM
It's Curry. These playoffs matter, and were telling, but you can't ignore what he's done the past two seasons outside of that. Those LARGE sample sizes matter. Now we know he's not perfect, but he's still undeniably amazing. #2 it is.

I'll take Durants last 7 over Currys 2

MagicBucsSox
06-26-2016, 08:43 PM
Currryyyy. If you don't vote Steph then you're still living in the moment.

3. KD
4. Westy

after that there are several players who could go #5 imo.

Same thing can be said for you ppl voting FOR curry. No way in hell you can be a top 5 player and teams LITERALLY target you on defense.like your the weak link. Nah brah

Cal827
06-26-2016, 08:48 PM
Same thing can be said for you ppl voting FOR curry. No way in hell you can be a top 5 player and teams LITERALLY target you on defense.like your the weak link. Nah brah

:laugh2: that's true.... Kyrie probably shouldn't be on this list either.... Both have been lit up by opposing PGs this season.

Guess Westbrook is the second best player in the League right now, cause Durant isn't exactly great either. I have a feeling that if things go well with their offseason moves, Paul George will be looked at as top 3 again.... especially if he one mans the team in the playoffs like he almost did to Toronto

mngopher35
06-26-2016, 08:48 PM
I'd also argue that durability is a part of the greatness equation. maybe steph was more banged up than the average NBA star at that point in the season, maybe he wasn't. was that the case last year as well?

I think his injury was at the very least in his head this post season, maybe more significant but not sure. He seemed hesitant to attack like he has been doing on the regular (even last post season) and someone else has brought up how lower body injuries affect jump shots as well. I am not sure how much it played into it but I am willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.

Last year I do not think he was injured but I do think he was getting ridiculous attention from defenses opening up other people which can't be ignored and doesn't show up in the numbers. Teams were legitimately playing 3 on 4 defensively at times to ensure Curry got rid of the ball of the high picks etc. While he did have some poor games mixed in it seemed like the team as a whole was just better than their competition and whenever they needed to turned it on (so while numbers were down, it wasn't like he dropped the ball in crucial moments). Last year I feel pretty confident saying he was the 2nd best player overall based on his performance and this year I have a hard time judging due to the injury (best in RS for sure).

I do agree his post season play hasn't been quite up to expectations so it is worth discussion though. I also think Westbrook has been playing amazingly so while I disagree with you in the end I wouldn't call your opinion absurd or anything. I probably put a little more weight in his regular season performance this year than you do given I think the injury affected him some.

Kush McDaniels
06-26-2016, 08:55 PM
how Kawhi gets no love is beyond me. Dude is efficient as it gets on offense, and plays defense as good as anyone. If the Spurs had the Warriors' depth and balance, people would be talking about Kawhi and not Curry as the best player in the league (not named LeBron).

Shammyguy3
06-26-2016, 09:02 PM
Curry here, Durant #3, #4 Leonard, then it becomes more of a debate.

Also, I nominate Butler to be on the next poll

More-Than-Most
06-26-2016, 09:17 PM
I have no issues with curry/westy/durat here of course.... I jsut think westy does more on both sides of the ball and more in all areas of the game even above KD. People really undervalue what KD has done as well over the past 7 seasons.... We use curry last 2 seasons but negate durant over more than triple that time and westy over double that 2 year time.... Curry will keep doing what he has been doing but when its as close as it is how do we negate playoffs/longevity?

Arguments can be made for all 3 but again curry was literally targeted all finals long and it exposed him severely... What other top player recently was the focal point of a teams attack like curry was? Even iverson who was small and defensively flawed never got exposed to that degree. Again these are the top 5 and there is arguments for all id just take the all around game of Westy over anyone not named lebron.

More-Than-Most
06-26-2016, 09:27 PM
Its no jab at Kwhai either... My list would probably go

Lebron

Westy
Curry/Durant
Khawi/Davis/CP3

Ive come back down to earth on Klay a bit though he would be in my top 10.



Why is Rose not an option? If we are going by PSD he is clearly gonna return to the GOAT because he is on a new team :D

tredigs
06-26-2016, 10:38 PM
It's Curry. These playoffs matter, and were telling, but you can't ignore what he's done the past two seasons outside of that. Those LARGE sample sizes matter. Now we know he's not perfect, but he's still undeniably amazing. #2 it is.

We know he's the only superstar in NBA history to tear his knee - or have any significant injury what so ever in the playoffs - and return to said playoffs.

Frankly I'm sick of people not understanding how dominant this dude is when at full strength. Downgrading him for injury is fair, but please don't think that tearing your MCL MID-POST-SEASON does not massively effect your play. People - like yourself here- acting like this did not happen is just funny to me. I was a fully paid collegiate soccer player and tore my MCL mid-season... I have never been close to the same player since. I assure you, it matters.

More-Than-Most
06-26-2016, 11:14 PM
We know he's the only superstar in NBA history to tear his knee - or have any significant injury what so ever in the playoffs - and return to said playoffs.

Frankly I'm sick of people not understanding how dominant this dude is when at full strength. Downgrading him for injury is fair, but please don't think that tearing your MCL MID-POST-SEASON does not massively effect your play. People - like yourself here- acting like this did not happen is just funny to me. I was a fully paid collegiate soccer player and tore my MCL mid-season... I have never been close to the same player since. I assure you, it matters.

You are sick of it? Injuries happen... He didnt exactly play up to his level in the finals before against a team with just lebron james... Maybe just maybe him playing against actual good teams consecutively brought him down to earth a bit instead of just playing **** nightly like in the regular season... His defense got exposed in these playoffs... The team was better while he was on the bench and it annoyed him to the point where he would take dumb shots much like the final shot after kyrie dropped a dime in his face for the win. He finally gets the scrutiny that comes along with being a top player and people are tired of it? It comes with the territory period... If people are gonna blow this guy when he plays well he is gonna get destroyed when he has one of the worst finals in history for an mvp.

Was he still not 100 percent? Probably but there is no excuse for the way he played even if at 75 percent with how often he was iso himself/taking dumb shots and taking dumb fouls because he was getting exposed defensively... This i guess can be excused as well if he had a head injury i guess because he was playing beyond dumb most of the playoffs.... When he has a great game he is back and great much like after game 7 of the thunder series or game 4 of the cavs series like people were shouting from the rooftops until he went right back down the ******* and then its hes injured again.

The excuses get old. He needed to play alot better than he did and injuries were not half the reason for it. If you are sick of hearing him get crapped on when he plays badly maybe you and others should jump off your high horse from time to time when you constantly look down or **** on other posters because your team is finally great and you have great players... You are one that likes to crap on the nba area and the posters and call people morons and complain about said area but are just as much a part of the overall problem.

We get it he wasnt fully healthy... But he still should have played better period and when you get sucked off like he was you deserve to get **** on like lebron always does or Kobe use to and so on down the list when you are bad and the fact that most of the fanbase on here outside of a few constantly trolls because you guys are great is what adds to the fire.

Sadds The Gr8
06-26-2016, 11:17 PM
I have no issues with curry/westy/durat here of course.... I jsut think westy does more on both sides of the ball and more in all areas of the game even above KD. People really undervalue what KD has done as well over the past 7 seasons.... We use curry last 2 seasons but negate durant over more than triple that time and westy over double that 2 year time.... Curry will keep doing what he has been doing but when its as close as it is how do we negate playoffs/longevity?

Arguments can be made for all 3 but again curry was literally targeted all finals long and it exposed him severely... What other top player recently was the focal point of a teams attack like curry was? Even iverson who was small and defensively flawed never got exposed to that degree. Again these are the top 5 and there is arguments for all id just take the all around game of Westy over anyone not named lebron.

KD is a better defender than Westbrook...

More-Than-Most
06-26-2016, 11:22 PM
and i was just as much of a problem like riv said where I got so wrapped up in people having hate for lebron that I was acting the same way others did against him... We wanna make this area better and have legit discussions like people use to without resorting to baiting/trolling or MY TEAM IS WINNING THE SHIP WHERE IS YOURS OR I will laugh as my team wins the ship and hahaha ******** and any notion that someone might be on a curry level would get people called idiots or morons by people that would ***** and moan about other people doing just that but they themselves started doing just that... The **** gets old honestly.

More-Than-Most
06-26-2016, 11:23 PM
KD is a better defender than Westbrook...

I wouldnt argue against it i guess but Westy is the one defending the other teams PG top player most of the time right? I dont think either is a bad defender

JordansBulls
06-26-2016, 11:28 PM
I'm sorry not sure why Curry wasn't #1. What other player would not be #1 after an unanimous vote? Not MJ, Shaq, Wilt, Kareem, Lebron. All would be #1 after a unanimous vote even if they lost in the playoffs especially considering the level of competition and missing your #2 or #3 guy for a games and your center for the last 2 games. Would 2013 Lebron not had been #1 if he lost to Indiana in the ECF or San Antonio in the finals?

Sadds The Gr8
06-26-2016, 11:32 PM
I wouldnt argue against it i guess but Westy is the one defending the other teams PG top player most of the time right? I dont think either is a bad defender

And kinda sucks at it. He's been a below averagee defender for awhile. Ppl assume because he's a steal chaser that he's nice on D. He's Iverson-ish

More-Than-Most
06-26-2016, 11:34 PM
I'm sorry not sure why Curry wasn't #1. What other player would not be #1 after an unanimous vote? Not MJ, Shaq, Wilt, Kareem, Lebron. All would be #1 after a unanimous vote even if they lost in the playoffs.

Well again because Lebron does much more than curry on every side of the ball but he doesn't go all out in the regular season like he could which has been proven... Lebron is still the best he just inst stupid enough to kill himself before the playoffs. Lebron is a great 2 way player who just lead the finals in every category against that number 1 player.. Lebron was always the best player in the world and should have never lost the title.

Defense matters and lebron can still be a top defender in basketball. Curry is a top 2 or 3 player no doubt but James doesnt give a **** about the regular season and when you have as many minutes player in 11 seasons that equal to about 15 seasons of play you need to be smart about it. Its also easier for a curry to play the way he does considering he is a shooter where lebron driving all game every game and defending/rebounding/passing and so on he would be dead by mid season.

More-Than-Most
06-26-2016, 11:36 PM
And kinda sucks at it. He's been a below averagee defender for awhile. Ppl assume because he's a steal chaser that he's nice on D. He's Iverson-ish

I actually think his steals make his defense seem worse than it is... He goes for steals way to much and gets caught alot with it... He isnt a bad on the ball defender by any means and if he would gamble less and play it safe more he would def be alot better and has shown it more often than not.

JordansBulls
06-26-2016, 11:41 PM
Well again because Lebron does much more than curry on every side of the ball but he doesn't go all out in the regular season like he could which has been proven... Lebron is still the best he just inst stupid enough to kill himself before the playoffs. Lebron is a great 2 way player who just lead the finals in every category against that number 1 player.. Lebron was always the best player in the world and should have never lost the title.

Defense matters and lebron can still be a top defender in basketball. Curry is a top 2 or 3 player no doubt but James doesnt give a **** about the regular season and when you have as many minutes player in 11 seasons that equal to about 15 seasons of play you need to be smart about it. Its also easier for a curry to play the way he does considering he is a shooter where lebron driving all game every game and defending/rebounding/passing and so on he would be dead by mid season.

Still doesn't change what actually happened. We are ranking based on how good they were for the season and Curry was significantly better. Not to mention his comp was wayyy better as well.

More-Than-Most
06-26-2016, 11:45 PM
Still doesn't change what actually happened. We are ranking based on how good they were for the season and Curry was significantly better. Not to mention his comp was wayyy better as well.

again he was better in certain areas but without really trying lebron was a much much better defender and the playoffs matter.... I dont put a ton into rings like others but their playoff performances matter... You cant just throw them out either.

HandsOnTheWheel
06-26-2016, 11:47 PM
Not much of an argument against Curry here.

JordansBulls
06-26-2016, 11:48 PM
again he was better in certain areas but without really trying lebron was a much much better defender and the playoffs matter.... I dont put a ton into rings like others but their playoff performances matter... You cant just throw them out either.

Yeah playoffs matter, but you have to consider competition as well. Cleveland won because Draymond was suspended in game 5 not because Lebron dominated them. He dominated when Draymond went out and then Bogut was out for the last 2 not before. Would be one thing if up when that happened, but only won due to those things.

Imagine the Cavs playing OKC or SAS beforehand before they get to GSW? We wouldn't have this conversation at all. That is why I say competition matters. Playing Det, Atl, and Toronto doesn't compare, not even close either. And I gave Lebron all credit for beating GSW as well this year.

I'm not trying to change your mind or anything as the #1 poll is over with. But nobody with an unanimous vote would have lost the #1 vote if they made the finals and went to game 7 when they had the best stats on the season.

More-Than-Most
06-27-2016, 01:47 AM
Yeah playoffs matter, but you have to consider competition as well. Cleveland won because Draymond was suspended in game 5 not because Lebron dominated them. He dominated when Draymond went out and then Bogut was out for the last 2 not before. Would be one thing if up when that happened, but only won due to those things.

Imagine the Cavs playing OKC or SAS beforehand before they get to GSW? We wouldn't have this conversation at all. That is why I say competition matters. Playing Det, Atl, and Toronto doesn't compare, not even close either. And I gave Lebron all credit for beating GSW as well this year.

I'm not trying to change your mind or anything as the #1 poll is over with. But nobody with an unanimous vote would have lost the #1 vote if they made the finals and went to game 7 when they had the best stats on the season.

Its not worth... No offense to you but after his historic win I stopped arguing with the lebron haters and you have hated him since day one... The arguments for why he is still the best is simple and there is so much weight to back it up its insane... it seems like the majority of everyone kind of agree.... Defense/All around game and historic playoff performances in back to back years.... Both years he lead both teams in like every area.... Also using a weak east just isnt factual... If anything the warriors had an easier path... They played the better team in the thunder but again the cavs beat the warriors and outside of the thunder the warriors played 2 D-League teams while the cavs played the hawks/Raptors and a young good pistons team... There is arguments on the warriors having a much easier path considering the warriors only beat the thunder and lost to the cavs where the cavs beat everybody they played including the warriors/raptors/Hawks... East continues to get underrated but its any argument really for people to try and nit back to find anything against James but there is nothing left... He is one of the best players in the regular season without even going all out on top of historical performance after historical performance in the playoffs on the road against arguably the best team ever without nearly the help curry has around him... Ask yourself this.... If you take curry off of the warriors how many wins do they have? If you take James off the cavs they dont make the playoffs out east.

Anywho I am not gonna change your mind so this is pointless. agree to disagree and move on.

Sadds The Gr8
06-27-2016, 03:23 AM
I actually think his steals make his defense seem worse than it is... He goes for steals way to much and gets caught alot with it... He isnt a bad on the ball defender by any means and if he would gamble less and play it safe more he would def be alot better and has shown it more often than not.
In iso he's ok but pnr he's trash

FlashBolt
06-27-2016, 11:44 AM
Yeah playoffs matter, but you have to consider competition as well. Cleveland won because Draymond was suspended in game 5 not because Lebron dominated them. He dominated when Draymond went out and then Bogut was out for the last 2 not before. Would be one thing if up when that happened, but only won due to those things.

Imagine the Cavs playing OKC or SAS beforehand before they get to GSW? We wouldn't have this conversation at all. That is why I say competition matters. Playing Det, Atl, and Toronto doesn't compare, not even close either. And I gave Lebron all credit for beating GSW as well this year.

I'm not trying to change your mind or anything as the #1 poll is over with. But nobody with an unanimous vote would have lost the #1 vote if they made the finals and went to game 7 when they had the best stats on the season.

What are you talking about? So is Draymond Green the best player for the Warriors or Curry? Because you're making a case for Draymond. LeBron in game 5 was destroying the Warriors via long range shots so Draymond being there wouldn't have changed much. He alters LeBron's post game/drives, not jumpers.

Imagine the Cavs playing OKC or SAS? Uhhh, buddy, how about beating a 73-9 team down 3-1 when you have to play two games at their turf in what is arguably the loudest arena in NBA? You are delusional. Stop discrediting them. They won fair and square. You never gave LeBron an excuse when his two teammates were injured last season but you're finding every excuse to defend the Warriors now.. you're terrible with your analysis.

Here's a hint for you: No team down 3-1 in the Finals has ever won before Cleveland did a week ago. That's a total of 32 teams that lost. 1-32. Cleveland is that 1. That's less than a 3% chance. Give credit where credit is due. LeBron had no competition? Jordan was favored to win practically every NBA Finals.

FlashBolt
06-27-2016, 11:47 AM
Stephen Curry is the obvious answer here. For all of Curry's struggles, he clearly wasn't 100% and Westbrook/KD didn't play well enough in the playoffs to make up for the regular season deficit. Both players were healthy and battling it out in the regular season so it's not like anyone was coasting. Haters need to stop. There is no way Curry is below #2... Westbrook/KD choked hard.

MagicBucsSox
06-27-2016, 12:27 PM
Stephen Curry is the obvious answer here. For all of Curry's struggles, he clearly wasn't 100% and Westbrook/KD didn't play well enough in the playoffs to make up for the regular season deficit. Both players were healthy and battlingd it out in the regular season so it's not like anyone was coasting. Haters need to stop. There is no way Curry is below #2... Westbrook/KD choked hard.

Lmaooooooooooooo they choked in selfishness, if they choked what did the MVP(?) do? I do wanna hear about his health. When he's winning he's dancing, laying on the benching laughing, turning up the court before shots go in etc, but when he chokes he's injured lol. Spare me.

That's the same bs Dwayne Wade fans pull

FlashBolt
06-27-2016, 12:33 PM
Lmaooooooooooooo they choked in selfishness, if they choked what did the MVP(?) do? I do wanna hear about his health. When he's winning he's dancing, laying on the benching laughing, turning up the court before shots go in etc, but when he chokes he's injured lol. Spare me.

That's the same bs Dwayne Wade fans pull

What? Curry may have choked in the Finals but it's pretty clear he wasn't 100%. KD+Westbrook were 100% but just resorted back to iso play. They lost the game for OKC. Westbrook/KD turned the ball over like 5/6 times in the last five minutes of the fourth quarter in game 6. They were up by 9 heading to the fourth and KD+Westbrook stopped making an effort to pass the ball to guys like Roberson and Ibaka. Our offense went stagnant and zero effort was made to improve that. I never said Curry didn't choke but he did show up the final three games and also, his regular season was better than KD+Westbrook. There simply isn't a huge production difference that we saw from James vs Curry to make up for that regular season disadvantage.

Hawkeye15
06-27-2016, 01:01 PM
It's Curry. These playoffs matter, and were telling, but you can't ignore what he's done the past two seasons outside of that. Those LARGE sample sizes matter. Now we know he's not perfect, but he's still undeniably amazing. #2 it is.

pretty much. We can't live in the moment when judging Curry.

MagicBucsSox
06-27-2016, 01:38 PM
What? Curry may have choked in the Finals but it's pretty clear he wasn't 100%. KD+Westbrook were 100% but just resorted back to iso play. They lost the game for OKC. Westbrook/KD turned the ball over like 5/6 times in the last five minutes of the fourth quarter in game 6. They were up by 9 heading to the fourth and KD+Westbrook stopped making an effort to pass the ball to guys like Roberson and Ibaka. Our offense went stagnant and zero effort was made to improve that. I never said Curry didn't choke but he did show up the final three games and also, his regular season was better than KD+Westbrook. There simply isn't a huge production difference that we saw from James vs Curry to make up for that regular season disadvantage.
Stop. He said himself "I'm back" so just stop

FlashBolt
06-27-2016, 01:54 PM
Stop. He said himself "I'm back" so just stop
I have no clue what you're referencing to.

MagicBucsSox
06-27-2016, 02:02 PM
I have no clue what you're referencing to.

Vs Portland when he went on a barrage, he danced in front the crowd shouting "I'm back". No limp nothing. So spare me. Let's also not act like Kyrie didn't do whatever he wanted last ur Game1 one one leg and even won the game blocking a Steph layup. Like the guy can be a defensive LIABILITY .

For the record he had 1 good finals game this year. 2 last year

CardinalRed24
06-27-2016, 03:55 PM
Curry here for me as well. His regular season performance was unbelievable, it's a shame he got banged up in the playoffs and didn't look quite the same.

This.

It really is a shame. All GS had to do was win one of those last 3 games, and just like that, the #1 slot in these rankings would have been a hot debate. Regardless if James still finishes #1, the voting would have been much closer. James should really be kissing Tristian Thompson's arse [the unsung hero of the series].
Either way, Curry , despite his lackluster performance throughout the playoffs (being fresh in ppls minds) would have put up a much better fight against LBJ for #1.
Now I'm not saying Curry was badly injured or anything. When you're on that stage, there's no excuses. And to his defense, he didn't use any. Others may be a diff story. But He was hurt, kept his mouth shut..he played his heart out, and in the end, he and his Warriors fell 1 minute short of earning a 2nd straight title. And that's the difference here.
Cuz let's face it, [imo at least] another finals loss for Bron and his legacy would have taken a massive hit. And If they had lost, his hold on the #1 spot would be in grave danger. And ppl would quickly forget about Curry's playoff struggles.
But again, no excuses. Esp for a 2 time MVP in his prime. MJ, Kobe..true champions would let their team cave in like that. Esp when its kill or be killed time. All bets are off. You leave everything you got out on the court. And I credit the Cavs for wanting it more. They were the hungrier team and they got the job done when it mattered most. Irving stepped up and hit the biggest shot of his career. Can't take that away from them.
James is phenomenal, but I personally do not see him as the clear cut #1 player in the NBA. I think Steph AND KD are right there with him. But that's my opinion.

FlashBolt
06-27-2016, 04:40 PM
Vs Portland when he went on a barrage, he danced in front the crowd shouting "I'm back". No limp nothing. So spare me. Let's also not act like Kyrie didn't do whatever he wanted last ur Game1 one one leg and even won the game blocking a Steph layup. Like the guy can be a defensive LIABILITY .

For the record he had 1 good finals game this year. 2 last year

Saying something doesn't mean it's true.

JordansBulls
06-27-2016, 06:24 PM
What are you talking about? So is Draymond Green the best player for the Warriors or Curry? Because you're making a case for Draymond. LeBron in game 5 was destroying the Warriors via long range shots so Draymond being there wouldn't have changed much. He alters LeBron's post game/drives, not jumpers.

Imagine the Cavs playing OKC or SAS? Uhhh, buddy, how about beating a 73-9 team down 3-1 when you have to play two games at their turf in what is arguably the loudest arena in NBA? You are delusional. Stop discrediting them. They won fair and square. You never gave LeBron an excuse when his two teammates were injured last season but you're finding every excuse to defend the Warriors now.. you're terrible with your analysis.

Here's a hint for you: No team down 3-1 in the Finals has ever won before Cleveland did a week ago. That's a total of 32 teams that lost. 1-32. Cleveland is that 1. That's less than a 3% chance. Give credit where credit is due. LeBron had no competition? Jordan was favored to win practically every NBA Finals.

You keep saying a 73 win team but it isn't a 73 win team if one of it's best players is out in the playoffs. I mean OKC played GSW where everyone was playing and nearly beat them, Cavs played them and was down 3-1 and came back but mainly due to the suspension in game 5. Before that game, Kyrie nor Lebron were really going off. Draymond's suspension made it easy for them to get what they wanted and then after that Bogut was gone and GSW had nothing down low. In GSW's case, its second-best player missed one of those games. Then its second-best defensive player injured his back. Then its starting center missed the last 2 games. Again Cleveland won ultimately due to those things, but let's not act like it was the same as how OKC had them when they had all of there guys for the series.
And I said Lebron had no competition in the East, not no competition at all.

Imagine 2013 the Heat playing the Pacers (series that went 7 anyway). Heat up 3-1 and then say Wade is suspended in game 5 and then Games 6 and 7 Bosh is out. Pacers may have very have won due to that. But it isn't the same as them beating them with all of there guys there. They would have won due to the suspension and then there big getting injured which certainly means they wouldn't had beaten a true 66 win team.

Saddletramp
06-27-2016, 07:34 PM
You keep saying a 73 win team but it isn't a 73 win team if one of it's best players is out in the playoffs. I mean OKC played GSW where everyone was playing and nearly beat them, Cavs played them and was down 3-1 and came back but mainly due to the suspension in game 5. Before that game, Kyrie nor Lebron were really going off. Draymond's suspension made it easy for them to get what they wanted and then after that Bogut was gone and GSW had nothing down low. In GSW's case, its second-best player missed one of those games. Then its second-best defensive player injured his back. Then its starting center missed the last 2 games. Again Cleveland won ultimately due to those things, but let's not act like it was the same as how OKC had them when they had all of there guys for the series.
And I said Lebron had no competition in the East, not no competition at all.

Imagine 2013 the Heat playing the Pacers (series that went 7 anyway). Heat up 3-1 and then say Wade is suspended in game 5 and then Games 6 and 7 Bosh is out. Pacers may have very have won due to that. But it isn't the same as them beating them with all of there guys there. They would have won due to the suspension and then there big getting injured which certainly means they wouldn't had beaten a true 66 win team.



Cry me a ****ing river. Steph wasn't "out" in the Finals. He wasn't 100% (not sure yet how bad his injuries were) but even he said he's out there and no excuses and blahblahblah. I give him props for that but at the same time, injuries are a part of the game, wether they are season ending or uncomfortable tweeks and I bet every starter on both teams had some sort of ailment.

And stop it with the Bogut excuse. If he was so pivotal, then Curry didn't matter as much as people think. And Green got suspended because he's a cheap shot dope and he deserved it. If GS couldn't close out the Cavs in one of three games with two being at home because Bogut wasn't playing his normal 15 minutes a night or whatever then they weren't who everyone thought they were.

Saddletramp
06-27-2016, 08:14 PM
And your second paragraph is dumb because those Heat teams were top heavy with Lebron/Wade/Bosh. The Warriors were way deeper for someone to step up. No one did. Ezeli was garbage, AV was a flopping detriment, Speights wasn't given enough minutes (although I doubt that would have mattered) and McAdoo was just a fouling machine. None of those guys could do what Bogut was doing but that was on GS for trusting the Glass Aussie.

Bruno
06-27-2016, 09:27 PM
I think that's fair. We'll see if this becomes a trend. The health tool is one of LeBron's greatest strengths, for example. TBD for Curry. And the ability to stay healthy and able to play huge minutes matters a ton. Yeah, well see. I'm predicting another title in the next three years if they are healthy.


I'm actually willing to cut him some slack for the injuries but what really caused me to knock him down a slight peg was his inability to take over when the shot wasn't falling. Maybe that's purely a resultant of said nicks and bruises, but I don't know. He just couldn't contribute outside of the three point shot.
Steph is so specifically excellent in one aspect of the game (and very good, if not great in several others), but if that aspect gets marginalized he can't offer as much across the board because of his size. LeBron goes 9-24 in the biggest game of his career, Kobe goes 6-24 in the biggest game of his career, MJ shoots 5-19 in game six of the 1996 NBA Finals. But LeBron triple doubles, Kobe grabs 15 boards in a series where the winner of the glass won every game and MJ grabs nine boards with seven assists while getting to the line @ 11/12.

Everybody's percentages drop off when the series gets tight but Curry is more vulnerable because he can't rebound, get to the line or disturb the paint at an elite level like the great wings can. he tries, and he gambles.


He's a much better playmaker than what he displayed in those Finals, but man...he was just running off screens trying to hoist threes. The offense rarely was running through him. That's why I lost a little love for him. That's where I think there's room for Russ, KD, Kawhi etc. to maybe overtake him eventually if teams can replicate that Cavs defense against him a little more regularly.

I agree. cleveland is a bad match up for him and he relied too much on the home run.

Corey
06-27-2016, 09:33 PM
Jaylen Brown is the only answer to this poll

Bruno
06-27-2016, 09:37 PM
Westbrook was 8.5/24 FGA per game in games six and seven, but he did average 12 assists and 8 boards in the two losses.