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View Full Version : How bad is Westbrook defensively?



Chronz
05-07-2016, 04:48 PM
http://www.welcometoloudcity.com/2016/5/7/11614470/russell-westbrook-defense-playoffs-game-three

I want to say most us have always known how inconsistent he is on that end, he relies purely on athletic ability and without the headiness to back it, hes often slower than he should be. If he doesn't have to defend too many options hes pretty good but the article above points to bigger problems. Such as, is he crashing the offensive glass too much for his teams own good?

Its a good run down on why teams like the Spurs and Dubs can crossmatch and effectively find their assignments in transition. The reason is due offensive balance in terms of player positioning whereas OKC often finds itself covering for RWB because hes crashing the glass. Read the article for the full explanation.



When RWB gets those triple doubles those gambles tend to pay off, but when they dont its surrendering points when they have the talent to be elite defensively.

I remember when Phil Jackson played them in R.1 (and again later) and was mentioning how they were crashing the glass AND getting back, perhaps they had better balance or were more athletic, or maybe they were just playing an older Lakers squad. Whatever the reason, do you prioritize defense against these final 3 teams or do you just live with RWB and hope he racks up triple doubles against the best?


I like what Pop said last night, its all about defense first, THEN you get the rebound. Seems like RWB is over prioritizing rebounds

Chronz
05-07-2016, 04:51 PM
How far removed is he from Harden levels? Harden often plays bad defense on purpose, RWB tries to play good defense and ends up backfiring due to a lack of instincts.

NYKnickFanatic
05-07-2016, 04:55 PM
Probably the same as BG.

kdspurman
05-07-2016, 04:57 PM
I was watching a coach nick break down earlier and he pointed out several times WB was ball watching and left Parker alone. Also several times he hit the deck (being out of control) and not running back in transition, which lead to points.

Just not disciplined at all. There's not really a leader in that starting unit to get on him about that. And honestly, he doesn't seem like someone you can talk to during the game

DboneG
05-07-2016, 05:12 PM
Westbrook has D. It's not great. Westbrook defense is NOWHERE near that of Harden's defense. Westbrook is in better shape, he has the energy to play on both ends, but, Westbrook gamble a bit too much. He's trying to make things happen, instead of letting the game come to him. It's a learning process. He will figure it out. Sooner! Rather than later. Hopefully.

Another thing is...Serge Ibaka and Steven Adams is supposed to have his Westbrook's back on the defensive side. They don't.

Maybe Steve Adams is upset he's not getting more shots. Steve Adams should be killing Tim Duncan! But, the guy gets one shot last game. lol

eDush
05-07-2016, 05:21 PM
Westbrook has D. It's not great. Westbrook defense is NOWHERE near that of Harden's defense. Westbrook is in better shape, he has the energy to play on both ends, but, Westbrook gamble a bit too much. He's trying to make things happen, instead of letting the game come to him. It's a learning process. He will figure it out. Sooner! Rather than later. Hopefully.

Another thing is...Serge Ibaka and Steven Adams is supposed to have his Westbrook's back on the defensive side. They don't.

Maybe Steve Adams is upset he's not getting more shots. Steve Adams should be killing Tim Duncan! But, the guy gets one shot last game. lolWestbrook D is comparable to Kyrie but to compare him with Harden is an insult cause he just stands there conjuring how to stir the pot on his next ball hog attempt while his defender dribble by to score uncontested. I think that's a fair assessment.

DboneG
05-07-2016, 06:06 PM
Westbrook D is comparable to Kyrie but to compare him with Harden is an insult cause he just stands there conjuring how to stir the pot on his next ball hog attempt while his defender dribble by to score uncontested. I think that's a fair assessment.

I can agree to that.

RWB gambles a lot for steals, he's so athletic that he can get away with it. sometimes leaving his man too much when he's off the ball, and lets Serge and Adams to guard his man. But, you have to have guys having your back. He's good at fighting through screens and staying in front of his man. It's a process with this guy. But, if you think about it...It would be almost humanly impossible for a player like him to do all the things he does and play lock down D.

Chronz
05-07-2016, 06:09 PM
Probably the same as BG.

Not a bad comparison actually. Both can flummox an offense with their physical traits, the difference is the motor it takes to be a great defensive big is much greater and Blake tires quickly. I know it sounds presumptuous but I feel like Blake prioritized offense abit too much in his career, working with Melo, developing a jumper to accommodate CP3. If not for Reggie Evans, I wonder if he ever learns to box out and push back on the blocks as quickly. Blake should be a 32MPG player who can absolutely terrorize teams defensively with his strength on the blocks and his agility in PnR, envision a less talented KG (neither blocked shots despite the tools in favor of positioning). He has the motor for that, I know it. I just dont know how the team unlocks that strength or if Doc has the balls to make it happen. Blake wants the sexy stat line, I doubt he ever maximizes his efficiency the way the elite PF's have over the years but Im hoping Im wrong. A 2-way franchise player is truly a game changer.

Chronz
05-07-2016, 06:17 PM
Westbrook has D. It's not great. Westbrook defense is NOWHERE near that of Harden's defense. Westbrook is in better shape, he has the energy to play on both ends, but, Westbrook gamble a bit too much. He's trying to make things happen, instead of letting the game come to him. It's a learning process. He will figure it out. Sooner! Rather than later. Hopefully.

Another thing is...Serge Ibaka and Steven Adams is supposed to have his Westbrook's back on the defensive side. They don't.

Maybe Steve Adams is upset he's not getting more shots. Steve Adams should be killing Tim Duncan! But, the guy gets one shot last game. lol

To his credit, RWB did mention he needed to find a way to get him more shots. He took the L on this one but its not a one time thing with him. Its who he is at this point but there are subtle differences he can take if he listens to reason. Its just a matter of believing if its a good reason and if theres a middle ground.

Like Rondo used to do the same thing with the Celtics, he was so crafty, quick and most importantly, BEYOND Intelligent. Doc trusted him with those gambles but could also reign him in when he disagreed. Doc also employed a Pop style abandon offensive rebounds and get the **** back mentality whereas the Thunder usually leverage Kanters size against opposing benches, its playoffs tho, maybe they have to choose to play less RWB and Kanter together against these teams.

ewing
05-07-2016, 06:39 PM
he makes a lot of "mistakes" as a basketball player often though mistakes turn to gold b/c he is so gifted. I have not broken it down but i get the impression that he both makes good and bad on D

ewing
05-07-2016, 06:43 PM
Westbrook has D. It's not great. Westbrook defense is NOWHERE near that of Harden's defense. Westbrook is in better shape, he has the energy to play on both ends, but, Westbrook gamble a bit too much. He's trying to make things happen, instead of letting the game come to him. It's a learning process. He will figure it out. Sooner! Rather than later. Hopefully.

Another thing is...Serge Ibaka and Steven Adams is supposed to have his Westbrook's back on the defensive side. They don't.

Maybe Steve Adams is upset he's not getting more shots. Steve Adams should be killing Tim Duncan! But, the guy gets one shot last game. lol


well ****!

Scoots
05-07-2016, 07:22 PM
Westbrook is maybe the greatest athlete to play PG in the NBA. I'm not sure he's not basketball stupid though.

Curry is near the other end of the scale of explosive athleticism compared to Westbrook but Curry can fool Westbrook and get past him regularly, and that more than anything gives Curry the head to head edge.

ewing
05-07-2016, 07:26 PM
Westbrook is maybe the greatest athlete to play PG in the NBA. I'm not sure he's not basketball stupid though.

Curry is near the other end of the scale of explosive athleticism compared to Westbrook but Curry can fool Westbrook and get past him regularly, and that more than anything gives Curry the head to head edge.\


everyone needs to stop pretending the Curry is athletically equivalent to me.

More-Than-Most
05-07-2016, 07:31 PM
\


everyone needs to stop pretending the Curry is athletically equivalent to me.

I have never seen anything like it... Even Nash was ****ing built.... curry is build well with how small he is

More-Than-Most
05-07-2016, 07:32 PM
as for the topic.. Westy would be mediocre to above average on defense but like the OP stated he takes a ton of risks and sometimes it pays off and he can defend like the best of them with other times looking really really bad.... Not harden bad but bad.

ewing
05-07-2016, 07:34 PM
I have never seen anything like it... Even Nash was ****ing built.... curry is build well with how small he is


I'm built better

NYKnickFanatic
05-07-2016, 08:01 PM
Not a bad comparison actually. Both can flummox an offense with their physical traits, the difference is the motor it takes to be a great defensive big is much greater and Blake tires quickly. I know it sounds presumptuous but I feel like Blake prioritized offense abit too much in his career, working with Melo, developing a jumper to accommodate CP3. If not for Reggie Evans, I wonder if he ever learns to box out and push back on the blocks as quickly. Blake should be a 32MPG player who can absolutely terrorize teams defensively with his strength on the blocks and his agility in PnR, envision a less talented KG (neither blocked shots despite the tools in favor of positioning). He has the motor for that, I know it. I just dont know how the team unlocks that strength or if Doc has the balls to make it happen. Blake wants the sexy stat line, I doubt he ever maximizes his efficiency the way the elite PF's have over the years but Im hoping Im wrong. A 2-way franchise player is truly a game changer.

Not sure if you thought I was being sarcastic but I wasn't. Was driving and I know you are a Clippers fan so you could relate.

IKnowHoops
05-07-2016, 08:57 PM
I have never seen anything like it... Even Nash was ****ing built.... curry is build well with how small he is

Yeah Curry is very underrated athletically. He may not be a top leaper, but he is at top of the NBA with his first step. He accelerates to top speed very quickly. Like a Jerry Rice.

Scoots
05-07-2016, 08:57 PM
\


everyone needs to stop pretending the Curry is athletically equivalent to me.

I specifically said compared by explosive athleticism. Curry can just barely dunk the ball. I didn't diminish his athleticism overall, just the explosion.

ewing
05-07-2016, 09:14 PM
I specifically said compared by explosive athleticism. Curry can just barely dunk the ball. I didn't diminish his athleticism overall, just the explosion.


you did but it is starting to become a bird like narrative (it is a bit closer to truth then the idea the Larry wasn't an athlete but you get the idea)

ewing
05-07-2016, 09:15 PM
Yeah Curry is very underrated athletically. He may not be a top leaper, but he is at top of the NBA with his first step. He accelerates to top speed very quickly. Like a Jerry Rice.

see this guys knows hoops

IKnowHoops
05-07-2016, 09:27 PM
see this guys knows hoops

And if you don't know, now ya know, ninja.

Kyben36
05-07-2016, 09:43 PM
its not that bad, when he tries he can play it, but its about consistancy to be great.

Scoots
05-07-2016, 09:59 PM
you did but it is starting to become a bird like narrative (it is a bit closer to truth then the idea the Larry wasn't an athlete but you get the idea)

I know, but the point was just about explosion. A player with that kind of explosion has a big advantage on D over guys who don't have that ability because they can make up more easily for mental mistakes or delays. And even with that elite level of explosion and quick twitch ability Westbrook is still not a good defender.

There ... I said it better that time.