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mrblisterdundee
04-26-2016, 05:13 PM
Chris Paul and Blake Griffin are done for the season. The team has no chance with even one of them missing. There was an interesting article by Michael Lee of The Vertical about the bad luck of the Clippers (http://sports.yahoo.com/news/clippers--sad-sack-run-continues-145433430.html):

Aside from winning the No. 1 pick a few times, the Clippers havenít had much reason for optimism for much of their time as the second-most relevant NBA team in Los Angeles. Anytime they did acquire some talent, there was always some disappointment to follow. Lamar Odomís untapped potential. Elton Brandís ruptured Achillesí tendon. Griffinís knee cap. And on and on.
What should the team do, with both Paul and Griffin free agents next summer? Should the Clippers make one more run next year with their current core? Should they try to trade Paul and/or Griffin for younger assets?

DboneG
04-26-2016, 05:58 PM
The Clippers are in a tough situation. If I were a top free agent I really wouldn't be looking forward to playing with Blake Griffin or DeAndre Jordan. Let's face it, the only thing Blake can do is jump and dunk. DeAndre is awesome! But, he can't hit free throws. Team is playing hard, just to have the game in tow because of a no-free-throw-shooting-guy. Chris Paul and DeAndre got into this a lot last year. Chris asking/telling DeAndre to stay late and work on his free throws to no avail.

Something has to happen...fire the coach! Make a huge push for Brad Stevens...I don't really know. Tough situation...sucks for them.

Method28
04-26-2016, 06:03 PM
The Clippers are in a tough situation. If I were a top free agent I really wouldn't be looking forward to playing with Blake Griffin or DeAndre Jordan. Let's face it, the only thing Blake can do is jump and dunk. DeAndre is awesome! But, he can't hit free throws. Team is playing hard, just to have the game in tow because of a no-free-throw-shooting-guy. Chris Paul and DeAndre got into this a lot last year. Chris asking/telling DeAndre to stay late and work on his free throws to no avail.

Something has to happen...fire the coach! Make a huge push for Brad Stevens...I don't really know. Tough situation...sucks for them.
They are most definitely in a tough situation but right off the bat it is easy to tell you do not watch many Clipper games, if any at all. To say Blake can only jump and dunk is ridiculous. The guy is an all around monster. He is one of the best passing bugs in the game and has developed his shot and drastically improved his ft game.

If I'm the Clips....I do shop around but most likely would stand pat and fire Doc as a GM. Get someone in here who can round out the roster

numba1CHANGsta
04-26-2016, 06:14 PM
Both Paul and Griffin are FA's after next season I think. The Clippers messed up spending all that money on DJ, should have just let him go to DAL. I expect them to keep the team together for 1 more year and then you'll see the end for them as CP3 and Griffin leave and a possible DJ trade. JJ is also a FA after next season so expect them to begin rebuilding after next season.

valade16
04-26-2016, 06:26 PM
Paul and Griffin are FAs at the end of next season. So the question is, do you let Paul/Griffin/DAJ have a chance to finally get healthy and make a playoff run but run the risk of them getting injured/underachieving and walking for nothing, or do you trade them now while their value is high and get back assets.

Keep in mind trading them now signals essentially a rebuild as I can't envision a way where the Clippers get back anything close to what Paul and Griffin are capable of giving in terms of wins.

DboneG
04-26-2016, 06:26 PM
People that know the game. Knows Blake suck. He's a head case, he'll beat up the equipment manager, but, won't go after guys that hard foul him/talk stuff in his ear. He can't shoot that well.(He's getting better) So, he can't stretch the floor. If Blake wants to shoot a 3, I'd let him ALL DAY.

I'd try and trade Blake. Fire Doc Rivers...and tell him to take his son with him! Hire racist Rick Barry to teach DeAndre Jordon how to shoot free throws over the summer. Tough situation really.

KnicksorBust
04-26-2016, 08:16 PM
Trade Blake for Beal and Otto Porter Jr and live and die with CP3 next season.

basketballkitty
04-26-2016, 08:22 PM
They are most definitely in a tough situation but right off the bat it is easy to tell you do not watch many Clipper games, if any at all. To say Blake can only jump and dunk is ridiculous. The guy is an all around monster. He is one of the best passing bugs in the game and has developed his shot and drastically improved his ft game.

If I'm the Clips....I do shop around but most likely would stand pat and fire Doc as a GM. Get someone in here who can round out the roster




Blake has little trade value at all. Forget the fact that he is a Broken down version of himself. But he is a walk away free agent after next season. And he has already said he is not signing a new deal with anyone. So at MOST the Clips might get is a single 1st round pick for him in the 20-25 range ( Maybe ) But that is it.

ManningToTyree
04-26-2016, 08:27 PM
See what the market is on the two stars but most likely one more failed attempt before rebuilding

Scoots
04-26-2016, 08:48 PM
Rough. The only players signed to the end of 2018 are DJ and Paul Pierce (who may retire before then).

CP3, JJ, and Blake could all be gone by then ... I honestly don't know what they are going to do. That said I'm amazed by what they were able to do last off-season.

FOXHOUND
04-26-2016, 08:58 PM
I would test the market for Blake and try to trade him to a team like Orlando or Boston, try to get a good PF and SF to help complete and balance the roster. You won't get equal value talent wise in a trade but can potentially end up with a better fit.

But maybe the market for him isn't strong with everything going on and his impending FA. If so, you just run it back one more year and see what happens.

Ty22Mitchell
04-26-2016, 11:41 PM
I don't want to be "that guy"; I've been wrong my fair share of times. But this is hilarious. Does anyone want to admit that they were for keeping the Clips together? Several members on this forum maintained Clips were title contenders. They'll now certainly not even sniff the WCF (again).

The Clips waited too long to make a move. They're between a rock and a hard place. Short of acquiring a superstar (KD, etc) they're not going to win a championship.

If I'm an owner, I let this team play it out. They're the second fidle in LA, so no pressure. Just rake in the money by putting forth a solid team.

If I'm GM and I need to win championships, then I swing big on a level B superstar or on an aging superstar and hope I stike magic. Rebuilding isn't ab option because I don't believe Doc has enough pull to endure such a process.

This team will muddle in 2nd round mediocrity until it's rebuilt. The only question is how long will Steve allow it to occur.

NetsPaint
04-26-2016, 11:59 PM
Hire Vinny Del Negro and bring back Lob City.

FlashBolt
04-27-2016, 12:12 AM
Hire Vinny Del Negro and bring back Lob City.

Lob City is fun but it doesn't and won't win you a championship.

DODGERS&LAKERS
04-27-2016, 01:11 AM
Blake has little trade value at all. Forget the fact that he is a Broken down version of himself. But he is a walk away free agent after next season. And he has already said he is not signing a new deal with anyone. So at MOST the Clips might get is a single 1st round pick for him in the 20-25 range ( Maybe ) But that is it.

Wtf? Kevin Love was in a walk year and garnered the first overall pick as well as another first overall pick from a year or two past. Granted he was a bust but still, they got two first overall picks. Blake could bring a haul.

Scoots
04-27-2016, 01:29 AM
Wtf? Kevin Love was in a walk year and garnered the first overall pick as well as another first overall pick from a year or two past. Granted he was a bust but still, they got two first overall picks. Blake could bring a haul.

The market is different now.

DODGERS&LAKERS
04-27-2016, 01:38 AM
The market is different now.
Maybe, but if Blake is traded for a late first round pick, Doc will be burned at the stake. Love was traded two years ago. I doubt the market has changed greatly since then. There are no examples that show top end talent being traded for pennies on the dollar.

Monta is beast
04-27-2016, 04:04 AM
If you dont get a top 3 pick for blake griffin you need to be out of a job

basketballkitty
04-27-2016, 10:22 AM
If you dont get a top 3 pick for blake griffin you need to be out of a job



More like if any team GIVES a top-3 pick for a Broken Down Blake Griffin who can walk after next season WOULD be out of a Job.

Hawkeye15
04-27-2016, 10:25 AM
well, the Warriors had like 30 years of bad luck and ineptitude, and came around. Hopefully the Clips bad luck can end at some point soon.

Ball_Out
04-27-2016, 10:49 AM
They should move to San Diego because they are a joke of a franchise. Since the Paul debacle, the Lakers have won 9 playoff games and the Clippers won 15. That's a joke. Lmao

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BallDontLie
04-27-2016, 10:53 AM
these posts about Girffin and his game and his value couldnt be more off. Griffin is a stud and certainly proved last year he can a whole lot more than just dunk

basketballkitty
04-27-2016, 11:00 AM
these posts about Girffin and his game and his value couldnt be more off. Griffin is a stud and certainly proved last year he can a whole lot more than just dunk



That was last year...before his TWO more Major Injuries. And the fact that he is a walk away free agent after next season....something he has already said he WILL do. He wants to be wooed during the free agency of 2017. So...what Value does that carry ?.....Next to None. Nobody gives up any real assets for a 1 year rental of a player who is also a walking M.A.S.H. unit as well.

mrblisterdundee
04-27-2016, 12:05 PM
It's too bad the Clippers didn't try to seize on the drama in Cleveland to try and swing a deal to send Chris Paul there for Kyrie Irving. Now the Cavaliers are rolling and unlikely to make a trade. Paul and LeBron James would have been killer, and Irving would have been a good way for Los Angeles to start the rebuild.

valade16
04-27-2016, 12:08 PM
It's too bad the Clippers didn't try to seize on the drama in Cleveland to try and swing a deal to send Chris Paul there for Kyrie Irving. Now the Cavaliers are rolling and unlikely to make a trade. Paul and LeBron James would have been killer, and Irving would have been a good way for Los Angeles to start the rebuild.

I'm sure the Clippers could revisit that deal anytime they wanted to considering Paul is vastly better than Kyrie.

mrblisterdundee
04-27-2016, 12:09 PM
They should move to San Diego because they are a joke of a franchise. Since the Paul debacle, the Lakers have won 9 playoff games and the Clippers won 15. That's a joke. Lmao

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San Diego doesn't even have a proper stadium, which is a precursor to any move. San Jose and Anaheim both have hockey stadiums that would work for basketball.

Scoots
04-27-2016, 12:24 PM
I'm sure the Clippers could revisit that deal anytime they wanted to considering Paul is vastly better than Kyrie.

Not right now he's not :)

Scoots
04-27-2016, 12:25 PM
well, the Warriors had like 30 years of bad luck and ineptitude, and came around. Hopefully the Clips bad luck can end at some point soon.

And just the same as almost every other team that turns things around the Warriors got the right people in the right leadership roles and things started turning fairly quickly. The Clippers owner has and is willing to spend big money ... but his choice for GM was a bad first major decision.

Scoots
04-27-2016, 12:27 PM
Maybe, but if Blake is traded for a late first round pick, Doc will be burned at the stake. Love was traded two years ago. I doubt the market has changed greatly since then. There are no examples that show top end talent being traded for pennies on the dollar.

Next year is Blake's last on his contract. A lot of teams have big cap space they can use on players of Blake's caliber. The Clippers leverage is getting to be less every day.

xnick5757
04-27-2016, 12:56 PM
trade blake for melo and sign a few 3&D types

Chronz
04-27-2016, 01:45 PM
How is breaking your hand a major injury? I mean what's the track history on that cuz it's definitely not on par with most nba related injuries

Blake is fine, only reason he was rushed back was cuz of the playoffs. I'm actually glad he's shutting it down

Vinylman
04-27-2016, 02:00 PM
First of all ... with Doc in charge nothing probably happens

I would definitely trade Deandre and I wouldn't even need a big return on it. A lot of teams will have the cap to absorb him and will gladly give up a first and solid big (he only has 3 years left on his deal after this year and the third year is a player option).

That gives them the money to be able to go after Durant and swing for the fences.

sign vet min guys and give it another shot next year

Chronz
04-27-2016, 02:03 PM
First of all ... with Doc in charge nothing probably happens

I would definitely trade Deandre and I wouldn't even need a big return on it. A lot of teams will have the cap to absorb him and will gladly give up a first and solid big (he only has 3 years left on his deal after this year and the third year is a player option).

That gives them the money to be able to go after Durant and swing for the fences.

sign vet min guys and give it another shot next year
Why over Blake or CP3?

Vinylman
04-27-2016, 02:21 PM
Why over Blake or CP3?

he isn't needed quite frankly......... there are plenty of serviceable bigs at a lot less money. I am only proposing it if you can get Durant. You wouldn't want Durant over DJ?

It doesn't really matter though because Doc is to emotionally tied to players (especially CP3) and won't make the "Big" move imo

what is most likely to happen is you guys stand pat lose Crawford and Green and sign some other guys with the little cap you have and try to make it work... it won't... both Griffin and CP3 opt out so they can cash in on the cap going up again.... assuming this summer Durant/Lebron sign a 2 year deal with a 1 year opt out then they can make a run at a super team.................. EXCEPT... they will have to fire sale DJ at that point to clear cap.

KnicksorBust
04-27-2016, 03:08 PM
First of all ... with Doc in charge nothing probably happens

I would definitely trade Deandre and I wouldn't even need a big return on it. A lot of teams will have the cap to absorb him and will gladly give up a first and solid big (he only has 3 years left on his deal after this year and the third year is a player option).

That gives them the money to be able to go after Durant and swing for the fences.

sign vet min guys and give it another shot next year

If anything this season showed me that they can be successful with DJ at C and then a bunch of shooters surrounding CP3... Blake for Beal/Porter allows them to go all in on that theory.

JasonJohnHorn
04-27-2016, 05:44 PM
I mean.... if they want to extend their window, they can push CP3 on CLE and pick up Irving, but to be honest, CP3 is the best point guard for that team.


I say hang onto them both unless they get a really tempting offer from another team.

Vinylman
04-27-2016, 07:11 PM
If anything this season showed me that they can be successful with DJ at C and then a bunch of shooters surrounding CP3... Blake for Beal/Porter allows them to go all in on that theory.

meh... they could do better if that is the route they want to go... plus beal can only be S&T this offseason

valade16
04-27-2016, 07:38 PM
Blake for McCollum and Allen Crabbe.

5ass
04-27-2016, 08:48 PM
It's going to take a top 5 pick, a high potential prospect, some good player(s) and a few picks. I think that's the type of package Doc would want in return.

basketballkitty
04-27-2016, 09:01 PM
It's going to take a top 5 pick, a high potential prospect, some good player(s) and a few picks. I think that's the type of package Doc would want in return.





You're high :-)

No way does Blake get that, or do the Clippers have any leverage. Blake is a Broken down player, and who's contract is up after next season. And you think THAT will get a top-5 pick ? Let alone additional players ?



Pass that Pipe over here...must be some great stuff! :smoking:

Scoots
04-27-2016, 10:26 PM
No way does Blake get that, or do the Clippers have any leverage. Blake is a Broken down player, and who's contract is up after next season. And you think THAT will get a top-5 pick ? Let alone additional players ?

I agree. A "high potential" player is essentially a recent high draft pick. So that's 1 top 5 pick, a recently drafted top 10 player, multiple good players, and 3 more picks ... 7+ players in the end! That's an INSANE haul for any player, let alone on the last year of his deal.

KnicksorBust
04-28-2016, 11:44 AM
meh... they could do better if that is the route they want to go... plus beal can only be S&T this offseason

Unless you have no faith in Beal I'm not sure they could do better than that... a Blazer fan just offered McCollum and Crabbe and was serious.

ewing
04-28-2016, 11:55 AM
Lose and then go on vacation

Tony_Starks
04-28-2016, 12:01 PM
You can almost gaurantee CP3 will end up in Cleveland.

Just like the Wiggins deal it will be foolish, but just like the Wiggins deal they are going to fold to the pressure to give Lebron the guy he wants to win now with.

The Clippers will be fine with Kyrie, although I'd still trade Blake while his value is high. I don't think him and Kyrie are a good fit.

basketballkitty
04-28-2016, 12:43 PM
You can almost gaurantee CP3 will end up in Cleveland.

Just like the Wiggins deal it will be foolish, but just like the Wiggins deal they are going to fold to the pressure to give Lebron the guy he wants to win now with.

The Clippers will be fine with Kyrie, although I'd still trade Blake while his value is high. I don't think him and Kyrie are a good fit.





But Blake's value is NOT high!!

Tony_Starks
04-28-2016, 12:45 PM
But Blake's value is NOT high!!

How?

Still an allstar, hasn't even hit his prime yet, and can sell mad tickets.

When they thought he was on the trading block this year the phones were still ringing off the hook for Blake, don't get it twisted.

DR_1
04-28-2016, 12:48 PM
They are most definitely in a tough situation but right off the bat it is easy to tell you do not watch many Clipper games, if any at all. To say Blake can only jump and dunk is ridiculous. The guy is an all around monster. He is one of the best passing bugs in the game and has developed his shot and drastically improved his ft game.

If I'm the Clips....I do shop around but most likely would stand pat and fire Doc as a GM. Get someone in here who can round out the roster

Ya I didnt understand the Blake comment either, dude is a straight up beast

Vinylman
04-28-2016, 01:06 PM
Unless you have no faith in Beal I'm not sure they could do better than that... a Blazer fan just offered McCollum and Crabbe and was serious.

and none of those guys are as good as blake... not to mention that both Beal and Crabbe are FA this summer so if people are going to propose trades they should at least make sense in terms of CBA restrictions.

basketballkitty
04-28-2016, 02:07 PM
How?

Still an allstar, hasn't even hit his prime yet, and can sell mad tickets.

When they thought he was on the trading block this year the phones were still ringing off the hook for Blake, don't get it twisted.




Not a team player...flies off the handle at a moments notice ( See broken hand )...has had 3 duplicate injuries, and is a walk away free agent after next season who has said he will NOT re-sign a new deal.....there, does that answer your question on why his trade value is for S H ! T!!

Tony_Starks
04-28-2016, 02:17 PM
Not a team player...flies off the handle at a moments notice ( See broken hand )...has had 3 duplicate injuries, and is a walk away free agent after next season who has said he will NOT re-sign a new deal.....there, does that answer your question on why his trade value is for S H ! T!!

Well call the gm's around the league and convince them not me because they are still willing to trade for him...

5ass
04-28-2016, 02:30 PM
I agree. A "high potential" player is essentially a recent high draft pick. So that's 1 top 5 pick, a recently drafted top 10 player, multiple good players, and 3 more picks ... 7+ players in the end! That's an INSANE haul for any player, let alone on the last year of his deal.

if I'm the Celtics i would give up the BKN pick (top 5 pick), Smart (top 10 pick) and Olynyk (solid player). Even add more late firsts.

I just worry about Blake bolting to the Lakers when his contract is up.

5ass
04-28-2016, 02:33 PM
or atleast i think that offer is much closer to what it would take than the packages being suggested so far.

Scoots
04-28-2016, 08:31 PM
or atleast i think that offer is much closer to what it would take than the packages being suggested so far.
Maybe but thats a huge price to pay for a player they could sign outright in a year

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KnicksorBust
04-29-2016, 02:35 PM
if I'm the Celtics i would give up the BKN pick (top 5 pick), Smart (top 10 pick) and Olynyk (solid player). Even add more late firsts.

I just worry about Blake bolting to the Lakers when his contract is up.

But wouldn't that be rebuilding? a rookie + Smart drastically reduces their chances of winning a title next season. Unless they trade CP3 too and tear it down but that would be moronic considering how good they are when healthy. A fully healthy Clips team is one of best 5 teams in the NBA.

KnicksorBust
04-29-2016, 02:37 PM
Maybe but thats a huge price to pay for a player they could sign outright in a year

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Is it that huge? Olynyk is a role player and Smart makes Rubio look like Mark Price.

5ass
04-29-2016, 03:10 PM
But wouldn't that be rebuilding? a rookie + Smart drastically reduces their chances of winning a title next season. Unless they trade CP3 too and tear it down but that would be moronic considering how good they are when healthy. A fully healthy Clips team is one of best 5 teams in the NBA.
They could trade the BKN pick to a third team for a more impactful player. They could definitely use a forward. Maybe Gordon Hayward if the Jazz feel they want another chance at drafting a star. Maybe they're high on Buddy Hield and feel he could be a great fit with Exum. Give them all the picks incoming from the celtics if you feel its worth it. The Jazz are good drafters outside the lottery so i'm sure they'd value those late picks.

Paul
Smart/Redick
Hayward
Olynyk or Amir Johnson
Deandre

Sign a FA powerforward with whatever capspace you have.

5ass
04-29-2016, 03:13 PM
Is it that huge? Olynyk is a role player and Smart makes Rubio look like Mark Price.
i dont think its a huge price to pay for a star even with his contract expiring. If i'm the Celtics i give that up without hesitation. You're consolidating good assets for a great one.

Chronz
04-29-2016, 03:40 PM
Blake wont be sold low, dude will recover from his injury and have another MVP caliber year. At which point Doc will reevaluate. It sucks because this was suppose to be the year we find our core bench guys, namely our wings. We've tried a litany of them and they each bring something the team has always lacked since the dawn of CP3 era. Moute is an elite defender, Wesley is our first bonafide springer who can shoot 3's and Green supposedly has talent, Pierce is useless outside of his leadership but even that is worth retaining IMO. Its just we never got to tinker with Blake and the wings. Bringing them all back will be tricky, bringing them back on the same bargain deals we gave them should be impossible. I hope we keep Wes and Moute and trade Green away.


More than anything tho, Aldrich has been a revelation and hes certainly going to command more than the min. Doc wasted a 3rd of the season playing Josh Smith at Center and his son at PG, once he realized he had two true players at those positions, the bench turned the season around. Pablo is old as **** but I would bring him back if he wants the min. Aldrich should take up our miniMLE but thats me hoping.

Overall, I would LOVE to go to war with this team healthy, the problem is we have so many injury prone players that need a break, it may be time to sacrifice some of this top heavy talent for guys who can lessen the load.


Jamal Crawford wants to retire a Clipper but given his recent award, I doubt he settles for less. Which is what we need these old fogies to take if they want to remain.

Chronz
04-29-2016, 03:44 PM
Maybe but thats a huge price to pay for a player they could sign outright in a year

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Where you have to compete with other potential suitors (including the Clips), what teams would be trading for is the right to offer him the highest possible max or even sign and trade him away if he wants to leave. That trade is decent to me but I would hope for an established, lower tiered star in addition to the assets.

Chronz
04-29-2016, 03:45 PM
Not a team player...flies off the handle at a moments notice ( See broken hand )...has had 3 duplicate injuries, and is a walk away free agent after next season who has said he will NOT re-sign a new deal.....there, does that answer your question on why his trade value is for S H ! T!!

Not a team player? Hes suffered one broken hand, that doesn't make you Dr.Phil. 3 duplicate injuries? Whats that mean? The same injury never healing doesn't count, it was our training staffs fault for misdiagnosing him

MonroeFAN
04-30-2016, 09:50 AM
Not sure why people are even responding to this "griffin has no value" nonsense.

Dude's a stud, but it might not work for the Clips.

Heediot
04-30-2016, 09:53 AM
Sign a cheaper option at C in Bismack Biyombo. I think Doc can mold him to be close to what DJ is.

Trade DJ for a SF, maybe S & T DJ for Deng if the Heat lose Whiteside. Or Trade him for a above average SF.

Let Jamal and Pierce (if possible) go. Try to keep the rest. Get a backup PG that can run the second unit, be able to shoot 3's and is adequate on D. Move rivers to the 2.

Chronz
04-30-2016, 01:32 PM
Sign a cheaper option at C in Bismack Biyombo. I think Doc can mold him to be close to what DJ is.

Trade DJ for a SF, maybe S & T DJ for Deng if the Heat lose Whiteside. Or Trade him for a above average SF.

Let Jamal and Pierce (if possible) go. Try to keep the rest. Get a backup PG that can run the second unit, be able to shoot 3's and is adequate on D. Move rivers to the 2.

Deng isn't a viable option at his age. If only MJ had kept Biyombo, I would've taken Biyombo+Batum+Assets for DJ or something.

Biyombo is an interesting option, but the guy I would really want from Toronto would be Pat Patterson. DJ for PP+Biyombo+Pick or something.

Blake for DD, PP and Ross would be another deal I would make.

valade16
04-30-2016, 03:54 PM
Apparently I have a way higher opinion of Jordan's trade value because I would not even consider Deng or Batum for him.

Heediot
04-30-2016, 04:14 PM
Apparently I have a way higher opinion of Jordan's trade value because I would not even consider Deng or Batum for him.

Yeah he has higher value than those guys. If they can sign Biyombo for half his price and coach him ip, I would trade DJ for some other pieces to fill out the roster and make better use of finances.

Chronz
04-30-2016, 04:21 PM
Apparently I have a way higher opinion of Jordan's trade value because I would not even consider Deng or Batum for him.

I'd take Butler and Taj