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View Full Version : giannis antetokounmpo the next KG?



Lim
03-08-2016, 01:35 PM
thoughts?

ewing
03-08-2016, 01:41 PM
they are both long

JLynn943
03-08-2016, 01:53 PM
thoughts?

Good points. Not sure how I could argue against that.

-Kobe24-TJ19-
03-08-2016, 01:58 PM
I see.

Kyben36
03-08-2016, 02:20 PM
not even close, first off, KGs jump shot was Way better than Antetokumpos's, i mean, its sad how bad he is shooting, he could be a real beast with a solid shot. but he cant do anything outside of 5 feet, athletic beast, solid at getting the the rim, good defender, KG is an all time great though.

mrblisterdundee
03-08-2016, 02:29 PM
I would compare Giannis to Kirilenko. Both are skinny small- and power-forward combos who do it all and play good defense.
Playing like Kirilenko is a solid aspiration for Giannis, who hasn't been as good in his first three seasons. Hopefully he stays healthier than Kirilenko did.

beasted86
03-08-2016, 02:57 PM
Troll thread?

Anyway, Milwaukee can't draw top tier free agents and are stuck in No Man's Land being too crappy to make the playoffs, but not bad enough to win a top 5 pick. I expect them to make another panic move and overpay this kid $25M+ a season when the cap balloons to $108M and think they are doing a good thing locking him up, when actually they are just putting the nail in their own coffin.

They should do themselves a favor and dump Monroe off on the first blind fool to come along and trade Giannis draft night to the Celtics for a haul of picks and tank. It's their only chance to be a relevant playoff team again.

shep33
03-08-2016, 02:58 PM
Giannis is gonna be a great player for a while

Alayla
03-08-2016, 04:29 PM
Troll thread?

Anyway, Milwaukee can't draw top tier free agents and are stuck in No Man's Land being too crappy to make the playoffs, but not bad enough to win a top 5 pick. I expect them to make another panic move and overpay this kid $25M+ a season when the cap balloons to $108M and think they are doing a good thing locking him up, when actually they are just putting the nail in their own coffin.

They should do themselves a favor and dump Monroe off on the first blind fool to come along and trade Giannis draft night to the Celtics for a haul of picks and tank. It's their only chance to be a relevant playoff team again.

Hell no khris middleton and jabari parker are way to talented to waste there time tanking they just need to find people to fill some holes but monroe was a really bad choice bad fit and he sucks.

Alayla
03-08-2016, 04:31 PM
http://deadspin.com/giannis-antetokounmpo-is-a-point-guard-now-and-its-awe-1763527813

5ass
03-08-2016, 05:36 PM
He's a point power forward. He's going to be really good. Not sure why people think this is a troll thread. He's like a smart j-smoove.

Shammyguy3
03-08-2016, 08:37 PM
Comparing an above average starter with decent passing and a terrible jumpshot to a top-20 player of all time and one of the greatest defenders/passers/shooters for his position is insane.


The AK47 & J-Smoove comps are far more accurate and realistic

Raps08-09 Champ
03-08-2016, 09:19 PM
Scottie Pippen.

Blink
03-08-2016, 09:27 PM
He's a point power forward. He's going to be really good. Not sure why people think this is a troll thread. He's like a smart j-smoove.

Lol perfect comparison. I actually agree with this 100%

mrblisterdundee
03-08-2016, 09:37 PM
Hell no khris middleton and jabari parker are way to talented to waste there time tanking they just need to find people to fill some holes but monroe was a really bad choice bad fit and he sucks.

I would say Giannis is the best player on the Bucks until proven otherwise on the court. Middleton is the best scorer, and Jabari is still the upstart. The Bucks definitely should not be tanking. They have a decent core already.
As for your following post about Giannis being a point guard, it's been a fun experiment by Kidd, but Giannis is no point guard. He's a forward who knows how to pass. Middleton gets more assists, so you could just as easily call him the point guard.
But I think Milwaukee has several guys who can pass really well, which is a must in today's NBA. They just need to get rid of the albatrosses like Monroe and Carter-Williams. Schöder would be a great target for a point guard.

Alayla
03-08-2016, 10:45 PM
I would say Giannis is the best player on the Bucks until proven otherwise on the court. Middleton is the best scorer, and Jabari is still the upstart. The Bucks definitely should not be tanking. They have a decent core already.
As for your following post about Giannis being a point guard, it's been a fun experiment by Kidd, but Giannis is no point guard. He's a forward who knows how to pass. Middleton gets more assists, so you could just as easily call him the point guard.
But I think Milwaukee has several guys who can pass really well, which is a must in today's NBA. They just need to get rid of the albatrosses like Monroe and Carter-Williams. Schöder would be a great target for a point guard.

Honestly i find it really interesting in the sense that its working id like to see how far they take it as it does fit his skillset well really like the point forward types alot more than i should

Mave1002
03-08-2016, 11:38 PM
The Lakers end up with pick #3, i'd offer it to the Bucks (along with Nick Young/Anthony Brown) in exchange for the Greek Freak and Greivis Vasquez.

A little help via free-agency and were good to go.

1.) Harrison Barnes/Allen Crabbe
2.) Horford-Noah-Whiteside-Ezeli

Horford-Ezeli
Randle-LNJ-Bass
Barnes-Giannis
Clarkson-Lou
Russell-Vasquez

Jeffy25
03-08-2016, 11:52 PM
I don't see Garnett quite within his reach, he'll never rebound like him. But I think he'll top Kirlinko

Bostonjorge
03-08-2016, 11:56 PM
KG from this year maybe

Shady66
03-09-2016, 04:36 AM
I would compare Giannis to Kirilenko. Both are skinny small- and power-forward combos who do it all and play good defense.
Playing like Kirilenko is a solid aspiration for Giannis, who hasn't been as good in his first three seasons. Hopefully he stays healthier than Kirilenko did.
Much better comparison

MILLERHIGHLIFE
03-09-2016, 08:59 AM
In nine games since the All-Star break, Antetokounmpo is posting numbers that would be worthy of the annual midseason classic: 19.9 points, 10.9 rebounds and 7.6 assists per outing.


In those games, Milwaukee's starting lineup with Antetokounmpo at the "point" has posted an offensive efficiency of of 109.1, per NBA.com/stats, which would rank third in the NBA on the season. Those lineups also feature a 63% assist rate, which would third in the league this year.

“The ball is moving, our pace is up, all the stats are up,” Kidd says. “(Giannis's) skillset is like no other. He has the ability to put it on the floor, he’s working hard on his jump shot, he can post up, he can pass. Giannis is just going through the process, understanding things don’t happen overnight.”


http://www.si.com/nba/2016/03/08/giannis-antetokounmpo-milwaukee-bucks-jason-kidd-kobe-bryant Also three triple doubles in a week and half. Would of had 4 but was a rebound shy of another one.

MILLERHIGHLIFE
03-09-2016, 09:19 AM
Troll thread?

Anyway, Milwaukee can't draw top tier free agents and are stuck in No Man's Land being too crappy to make the playoffs, but not bad enough to win a top 5 pick. I expect them to make another panic move and overpay this kid $25M+ a season when the cap balloons to $108M and think they are doing a good thing locking him up, when actually they are just putting the nail in their own coffin.

They should do themselves a favor and dump Monroe off on the first blind fool to come along and trade Giannis draft night to the Celtics for a haul of picks and tank. It's their only chance to be a relevant playoff team again.
Troll thread? Since you put it so elegantly.
You guys already did your panic move and over paid Dragic. Bosh might be forced to retire if his health doesn't improve. Also his contract will be paid by 80% from insurance. But still be on the cap. Trust me I know we had Redd on super max and injured most of that contract. Also good luck over paying knucklehead Whiteside. Also Wade on wrong side of 30. Wade be playing like Kobe before you know it. Then see what free agents go to Miami. I'd take Giannis over your entire roster any day of the week. Them Celtic picks are pathetic.

Nets pick is #4. Also very weak draft. Worst case scenario is Bucks trade Monroe to Pelicans for bad contract of Asik and #6 pick. That could be Hield. Then at #9 we take Skal. Besides the $25M in cap we could land a free agent PG. Also Blazers had interests in Monroe. So maybe we get CJ out of the deal. Old rumor at trade deadline was Moose for CJ and either Davis or Plumlee. Also Pelicans wanted Moose. Holiday? Or pick and Asik?

MILLERHIGHLIFE
03-09-2016, 09:28 AM
The Lakers end up with pick #3, i'd offer it to the Bucks (along with Nick Young/Anthony Brown) in exchange for the Greek Freak and Greivis Vasquez.

A little help via free-agency and were good to go.

1.) Harrison Barnes/Allen Crabbe
2.) Horford-Noah-Whiteside-Ezeli

Horford-Ezeli
Randle-LNJ-Bass
Barnes-Giannis
Clarkson-Lou
Russell-Vasquez

Giannis is untouchable. Lakers have nothing we want. Also a weak draft. Also believe there's like 40% odds Lakers pick falls to #4 or #5 and lose it.

JasonJohnHorn
03-09-2016, 09:40 AM
Wouldn't they need to play the same position?

I mean, Garnett was a power forward and during the course of his first run with Minny and his time in Boston, there likely wasn't a better rebounder in the league throughout that time (Ben Wallace had a high peak where he was better, but KG was better before and after). The only other guy who is close is Duncan. As a small forward, GA simply doesn't provide the kind of rebounding that KG did.


As for his D, I'd have to see more of his games. His defensive stats look decent, but KG was so intense and could really shut a good post player down. That isn't not even a skill set that is a big priority in today's NBA, and though I haven't watched a lot of Bucks games (so I could be WAY off on this), I assume that GA guards other SFs mostly? Yes? No? In which case he wouldn't have to guard the post a lot (though I imagine given his size that Kidd puts him in the paint to defend sometimes).


As for those who are comparing him to other SFs..... the guys mentioned all have a better 3pt shot.

GA is a good rebounder for his position, and a solid play maker for his position as well. But he's on a losing team, so it's hard to evaluate his numbers without seeing him, and I have admittedly not seen him play this season.


I will be sure to keep an eye out next a Bucks game is on.


Thanks!

MILLERHIGHLIFE
03-09-2016, 09:55 AM
Wouldn't they need to play the same position?

I mean, Garnett was a power forward and during the course of his first run with Minny and his time in Boston, there likely wasn't a better rebounder in the league throughout that time (Ben Wallace had a high peak where he was better, but KG was better before and after). The only other guy who is close is Duncan. As a small forward, GA simply doesn't provide the kind of rebounding that KG did.


As for his D, I'd have to see more of his games. His defensive stats look decent, but KG was so intense and could really shut a good post player down. That isn't not even a skill set that is a big priority in today's NBA, and though I haven't watched a lot of Bucks games (so I could be WAY off on this), I assume that GA guards other SFs mostly? Yes? No? In which case he wouldn't have to guard the post a lot (though I imagine given his size that Kidd puts him in the paint to defend sometimes).


As for those who are comparing him to other SFs..... the guys mentioned all have a better 3pt shot.

GA is a good rebounder for his position, and a solid play maker for his position as well. But he's on a losing team, so it's hard to evaluate his numbers without seeing him, and I have admittedly not seen him play this season.


I will be sure to keep an eye out next a Bucks game is on.


Thanks!

Giannis plays PF mostly now. He does switch it up with Parker and goes to SF sometimes on match ups. Giannis also played point center versus KAT in the Wolves game and also ended up playing against Rubio for a stint as well. Giannis can play all 5 positions. He's mainly point forward at PF spot though. No point in him at PG chasing midgets all game. But yeah if he did that he boost his block shots even more. Also Bucks have 4 guys injured and can receive the hardship for extra guy to sign. So Bucks are gassed now playing 40 minutes a night. Also Kidd going with 8 man rotations.

Lim
03-16-2016, 12:58 PM
This guy is a stud. Future superstar. Compare kg,s stats in his third year to Gianni's third year. They are not that far off.

jerellh528
03-16-2016, 01:18 PM
I don't think KG is a good comparison.

I didn't think anyone in the NBA could average a triple double, but after seeing Giannis lately, he's the only one close to being able to

nycericanguy
03-16-2016, 02:24 PM
KG couldn't handle the ball like Giannis... Giannis is truly something special, I think by next season he'll be a 22/10/5/2 guy at 21/22 years of age.

Now you need a lot to go right and a helluva work ethic to become the player KG did, but Giannis has the tools for sure. but overall they are different players.

Right now we are seeing some big men with tools that you can't really compare to past players. I mean Porzingis, Giannis, Towns... these guys have a chance to revolutionize the big man position and make it a big man's game again.

Alayla
03-16-2016, 02:35 PM
The Lakers end up with pick #3, i'd offer it to the Bucks (along with Nick Young/Anthony Brown) in exchange for the Greek Freak and Greivis Vasquez.

A little help via free-agency and were good to go.

1.) Harrison Barnes/Allen Crabbe
2.) Horford-Noah-Whiteside-Ezeli

Horford-Ezeli
Randle-LNJ-Bass
Barnes-Giannis
Clarkson-Lou
Russell-Vasquez

Giannis is likely untouchable

beasted86
03-16-2016, 02:36 PM
Troll thread? Since you put it so elegantly.
You guys already did your panic move and over paid Dragic. Bosh might be forced to retire if his health doesn't improve. Also his contract will be paid by 80% from insurance. But still be on the cap. Trust me I know we had Redd on super max and injured most of that contract. Also good luck over paying knucklehead Whiteside. Also Wade on wrong side of 30. Wade be playing like Kobe before you know it. Then see what free agents go to Miami. I'd take Giannis over your entire roster any day of the week. Them Celtic picks are pathetic.

Nets pick is #4. Also very weak draft. Worst case scenario is Bucks trade Monroe to Pelicans for bad contract of Asik and #6 pick. That could be Hield. Then at #9 we take Skal. Besides the $25M in cap we could land a free agent PG. Also Blazers had interests in Monroe. So maybe we get CJ out of the deal. Old rumor at trade deadline was Moose for CJ and either Davis or Plumlee. Also Pelicans wanted Moose. Holiday? Or pick and Asik?

C'mon son, your roster peaked at .500 basketball and a road playoffs series last year. This year you're likely finishing 10 games under .500.

Stop kidding yourself and get over the off topic talk about the HEAT because you're salty or a hater or whatever stick is up your ***. Let's talk about the Bucks... M'kay?

Non-trolling serious, and pertinent questions:
1. Is Milwaukee a prime free agent destination?
2. Is a late lottery draft pick player addition going to cement you as a home playoff team along with the answer to the next question?
3. Does Milwaukee have enough internal potential to turn things around?

I'll answer number 1 as the undisputed answer is a clear "No" for your city. No debating that whatsoever, so cap space means almost nothing. Also no superstar is forcing a trade to Milwaukee which would allow them to give up lopsided assets for a talent surplus.

As far as number 2 and 3, it depends on how optimistic and/or a homer you are. The Bucks could pull a Stephen Curry or Paul George out of nowhere... It happens... But it's not a "likely". A 7th-12th pick maybe gets you a rotation player if that. So that leaves the main burden of improvement on internal development of your young players.

Monroe is what he is, Middleton probably is what he is along with Henson. So the question remains is there enough internal growth in Parker, MCW and Giannis to be a home playoff team for the next 4 years. If the answer is not a fully assured "yes" then the Bucks need to tank and rebuild.

This is just speaking the obvious opinion from anyone with common sense who can tell it like they see it. If you don't like it bring up some type of solid take or alternative or go cry to someone else. Dumping a scoring big who can't defend his shadow and just "led a team" as the "big free agent veteran" to the lottery for a top 6 pick? Put the pipe down, son. Also shows how much analytical ability you have mentioning taking $12M+ salary dumps and then in the same breath $25M in cap space for Grand-fashioned Milwaukee, the paradise of free agency...

beasted86
03-16-2016, 03:26 PM
I don't think KG is a good comparison.

I didn't think anyone in the NBA could average a triple double, but after seeing Giannis lately, he's the only one close to being able to

Yeah, not that Westbrook guy, Giannis.

jay87shot
03-16-2016, 04:08 PM
I don't think you can make a Giannis comparison for another year or two and we see what his mid-range/outside game looks like and he gets to is ideal weight. If his mid range game becomes competent he truly has no comparison, there has never been a 6'11" point guard who could cover all 5 positions (if he puts on 20-25 pounds). I envision a potential of Draymond Green (with more quickness) in Kevin Garnett's body maybe 22/10/7 if he sticks at point like he has the past 10 games and play 38ish mins/per (and continues to improve). I know lots of if's.

naps
03-16-2016, 04:47 PM
Haha. I had a good laugh. KG is argaubly the most well rounded bigman of all time. That AK47 is a perfect comparison.

nycericanguy
03-16-2016, 05:00 PM
AK47 never put up the numbers that Giannis at 21 is putting up, and he wasn't almost 7 feet tall. I don't get that comparison at all.

AK47 for his career was a 11/5/2.7 player. Giannis next year will probably be 20/8/5 at 21 years of age. The sky's the limit.

I think people are sleeping on Giannis because this is his 3rd year, but he was drafted at like 18 years old. What he's doing at barely 21 is almost as impressive as what Towns has done this year.

Chronz
03-16-2016, 05:28 PM
I don't remember young KG. I know he played SF but he was more of a miss range scorer wasn't he?

mngopher35
03-16-2016, 05:40 PM
I don't remember young KG. I know he played SF but he was more of a miss range scorer wasn't he?

Well it has always been part of his game but if I remember right he attacked more than mid range scoring earlier on (although he probably started in the mid range a ton if that's what you meant). I think he increased his volume on the mid range scoring in his prime compared to when he was younger with a less developed shot.

Chronz
03-16-2016, 06:03 PM
Well it has always been part of his game but if I remember right he attacked more than mid range scoring earlier on (although he probably started in the mid range a ton if that's what you meant). I think he increased his volume on the mid range scoring in his prime compared to when he was younger with a less developed shot.

No doubt, but this is a comparison vs Giannis, who lacks range altogether imo. I haven't checked the numbers in awhile but i seem to remember a young kg stacking up favorably to league average from the mid range.

mngopher35
03-16-2016, 06:10 PM
No doubt, but this is a comparison vs Giannis, who lacks range altogether imo. I haven't checked the numbers in awhile but i seem to remember a young kg stacking up favorably to league average from the mid range.

Oh I just meant in general, you would be right in comparison haha. He was probably around league average when he first came in if I had to guess and increased it while he matured.

Chronz
03-16-2016, 06:26 PM
Lol. Miss range.

phantasyyy
03-16-2016, 06:39 PM
C'mon son, your roster peaked at .500 basketball and a road playoffs series last year. This year you're likely finishing 10 games under .500.

Stop kidding yourself and get over the off topic talk about the HEAT because you're salty or a hater or whatever stick is up your ***. Let's talk about the Bucks... M'kay?

Non-trolling serious, and pertinent questions:
1. Is Milwaukee a prime free agent destination?
2. Is a late lottery draft pick player addition going to cement you as a home playoff team along with the answer to the next question?
3. Does Milwaukee have enough internal potential to turn things around?

I'll answer number 1 as the undisputed answer is a clear "No" for your city. No debating that whatsoever, so cap space means almost nothing. Also no superstar is forcing a trade to Milwaukee which would allow them to give up lopsided assets for a talent surplus.

As far as number 2 and 3, it depends on how optimistic and/or a homer you are. The Bucks could pull a Stephen Curry or Paul George out of nowhere... It happens... But it's not a "likely". A 7th-12th pick maybe gets you a rotation player if that. So that leaves the main burden of improvement on internal development of your young players.

Monroe is what he is, Middleton probably is what he is along with Henson. So the question remains is there enough internal growth in Parker, MCW and Giannis to be a home playoff team for the next 4 years. If the answer is not a fully assured "yes" then the Bucks need to tank and rebuild.

This is just speaking the obvious opinion from anyone with common sense who can tell it like they see it. If you don't like it bring up some type of solid take or alternative or go cry to someone else. Dumping a scoring big who can't defend his shadow and just "led a team" as the "big free agent veteran" to the lottery for a top 6 pick? Put the pipe down, son. Also shows how much analytical ability you have mentioning taking $12M+ salary dumps and then in the same breath $25M in cap space for Grand-fashioned Milwaukee, the paradise of free agency...

This is pretty ignorant post regarding the current affairs of the Bucks.. I mean how can you say that one of the youngest teams in the L, with their core 3 players being aged 21/21/24 - Giannis/Jabari/Middleton have peaked when they haven't even entered their primes yet..

I mean you have Giannis who was drafted at the tender of age 18, Parker who is coming back from major surgery, and Middleton who only broke out when he finally got traded to the Bucks. I mean in the case of Middleton this year he has shown more than the 3-D mold we tend to throw on players and has been handling the ball a lot more and has shown he can defend multiple positions as well with him playing part-time PG to PF. To a lesser extent you can even through Henson in there as well as had shown a pretty good trajectory in terms of improvements until the injury bug hit him - but he is also only 25 as well.

In regards to your post about being able to attract star free-agents there are a lot of other teams that fit the same boat but not every team is willing to go the 76ers route and trade away all their talent and just tank... You act as if Giannis/Parker aren't two players that other teams would consider cornerstones and build their roster around. Their production at the age of 21 isn't going to be their final production as they gain more experience in the L. Trading Giannis to the Celtics for draft picks?? - Like really, what good is that going to do for them when they wont be able to find players with as much potential is Giannis and to a lesser extent Parker. The Celtics would take make a deal with the Bucks in a heartbeat if that was what it took to get him.

I mean you act as if free-agency is all about signing stars and only stars but what this team really needs is proven-vets and complementary pieces to plug the holes on their team. I would argue that they already have their "star player" in Giannis, and if you cant see that then clearly you cant talent. What he is doing at age 21, is putting up ~17/8/4 on 50% shooting - clearly there is room to improve his 3pt% but to get that production from a player at that age is something that other teams would drool over.

Chronz
03-16-2016, 06:47 PM
Well ****ing put

Lim
03-16-2016, 07:24 PM
Lolz.... giannis is already 5000 times better than AK47 ever was. When KG was in his third year i bet no one thought he would become arguably the best all around big man ever. Food for thought. Giannis just needs a jump shot and then the sky is the limit for him.

MILLERHIGHLIFE
03-16-2016, 07:43 PM
C'mon son, your roster peaked at .500 basketball and a road playoffs series last year. This year you're likely finishing 10 games under .500.

Stop kidding yourself and get over the off topic talk about the HEAT because you're salty or a hater or whatever stick is up your ***. Let's talk about the Bucks... M'kay?

Non-trolling serious, and pertinent questions:
1. Is Milwaukee a prime free agent destination?
2. Is a late lottery draft pick player addition going to cement you as a home playoff team along with the answer to the next question?
3. Does Milwaukee have enough internal potential to turn things around?

I'll answer number 1 as the undisputed answer is a clear "No" for your city. No debating that whatsoever, so cap space means almost nothing. Also no superstar is forcing a trade to Milwaukee which would allow them to give up lopsided assets for a talent surplus.

As far as number 2 and 3, it depends on how optimistic and/or a homer you are. The Bucks could pull a Stephen Curry or Paul George out of nowhere... It happens... But it's not a "likely". A 7th-12th pick maybe gets you a rotation player if that. So that leaves the main burden of improvement on internal development of your young players.

Monroe is what he is, Middleton probably is what he is along with Henson. So the question remains is there enough internal growth in Parker, MCW and Giannis to be a home playoff team for the next 4 years. If the answer is not a fully assured "yes" then the Bucks need to tank and rebuild.

This is just speaking the obvious opinion from anyone with common sense who can tell it like they see it. If you don't like it bring up some type of solid take or alternative or go cry to someone else. Dumping a scoring big who can't defend his shadow and just "led a team" as the "big free agent veteran" to the lottery for a top 6 pick? Put the pipe down, son. Also shows how much analytical ability you have mentioning taking $12M+ salary dumps and then in the same breath $25M in cap space for Grand-fashioned Milwaukee, the paradise of free agency...


Guess i'll take the high road. What did Miami sign with the capspace of LeBron bolting? Wasn't it just old burned out Granger? Then you traded him right away? Thought that was funny. He even signed cheap to play in Miami then your burn him. But Granger had lots of injuries in the past and wasnt the same since. Bet agent be like once Wade retires no way Miami doing anything other then farming draft picks. Cant remember if old man Deng signed there or was traded there. But he was declining with Bulls/Cavs years prior. Dragic was traded there then signed new deal recently. Which was over paid. lol

But back to Miami what have you signed? Zo was part of Glen Rice trade. Shaq was traded there. Only big time free agent beyond the whole buddy pairing of Wade and LeBron which then Bosh joined up. But beyond that I believe Ray Allen was ring chasing and bolt from Boston since their cast was getting old. But all in all. If LeBron never signed there doubt Miami do much even with the state income tax.

Being traded to a destination isn't not a free agent signing. I apologise if I missed some big name free agent your so called #1 top free agent desination market of Miami. Anthony "Cheese Burger" Mason! Thats it!!!! But then my lowly Milwaukee ended up getting him from you guys in a sign and trade of Scott Williams.

But all in all thanks for stopping by and getting off topic in the Giannis discussion. Bad enough I stooped to your level about free agent destinations. Back to Giannis. In blow out loss he would of had another triple double last night but Kidd pulled him with few minutes left. Yeah Monroe wasn't a perfect fit for Milwaukee. But he shunned bigger markets. Even though we may trade him this summer.

DillyDill
03-16-2016, 10:36 PM
Best player in league potential once he hits prime scary thought

beasted86
03-16-2016, 11:28 PM
Guess i'll take the high road. What did Miami sign with the capspace of LeBron bolting? Wasn't it just old burned out Granger? Then you traded him right away? Thought that was funny. He even signed cheap to play in Miami then your burn him. But Granger had lots of injuries in the past and wasnt the same since. Bet agent be like once Wade retires no way Miami doing anything other then farming draft picks. Cant remember if old man Deng signed there or was traded there. But he was declining with Bulls/Cavs years prior. Dragic was traded there then signed new deal recently. Which was over paid. lol

But back to Miami what have you signed? Zo was part of Glen Rice trade. Shaq was traded there. Only big time free agent beyond the whole buddy pairing of Wade and LeBron which then Bosh joined up. But beyond that I believe Ray Allen was ring chasing and bolt from Boston since their cast was getting old. But all in all. If LeBron never signed there doubt Miami do much even with the state income tax.

Being traded to a destination isn't not a free agent signing. I apologise if I missed some big name free agent your so called #1 top free agent desination market of Miami. Anthony "Cheese Burger" Mason! Thats it!!!! But then my lowly Milwaukee ended up getting him from you guys in a sign and trade of Scott Williams.

But all in all thanks for stopping by and getting off topic in the Giannis discussion. Bad enough I stooped to your level about free agent destinations. Back to Giannis. In blow out loss he would of had another triple double last night but Kidd pulled him with few minutes left. Yeah Monroe wasn't a perfect fit for Milwaukee. But he shunned bigger markets. Even though we may trade him this summer.

You clearly have no clue about basketball. Your knowledge is really lacking.

Mourning FORCED a trade to Miami. Mourning at the time was way better. Tim Hardaway FORCED a trade to Miami, Miami gave up garbage. Shaq FORCED a trade to Miami, Lamar Odom + horrible contract Brian Grant + Caron does not = Shaq. Dragic FORCED a trade to Miami and handicapped Phoenix. Juwan Howard essentially signed with Miami as basically the very best free agent at his time until Stern nixed the deal on a technicality. Elton Brand signed an offer sheet with the HEAT as the best restricted free agent a his time. LeBron and Bosh both signed with Miami as top free agents obviously. This is just 28 years of HEAT basketball. Nonetheless, what does Miami have to do with the stinking Bucks?

How many top free agents in the 50 years of Bucks basketball forced their way there or signed there as a free agent? Did any key players force a trade to Milwaukee or was it the other way around like Kareem? Totally hilarious you bring up Mason after taking his old *** after Miami tossed him aside. Your front office overpaid him to destroy the locker room of your last true 'glory days' in Milwaukee. I mean he was your "big free agent" at the time to help "put you over the top" since you were close to getting to the Finals the year before he came.

But seriously, in the history of your franchise Monta Ellis and Greg Monroe are probably the biggest names you've gotten which is a total joke, son. Your team is way below .500 with this "great core" and you think adding 'supplemental' players in free agency is going to turn things around? Mkay... whatever dude. Stay in fairy-tale land. Funny that you keep bringing up Miami in a thread about the Bucks, and have a long standing history of telling me ad nauseum the HEAT who are 3rd in the East should have blown up the team and tanked, but when I tell you a team 10 games under .500 should tank, I'm suddenly an idiot who knows nothing. Go figure.

beasted86
03-16-2016, 11:42 PM
This is pretty ignorant post regarding the current affairs of the Bucks.. I mean how can you say that one of the youngest teams in the L, with their core 3 players being aged 21/21/24 - Giannis/Jabari/Middleton have peaked when they haven't even entered their primes yet..

I mean you have Giannis who was drafted at the tender of age 18, Parker who is coming back from major surgery, and Middleton who only broke out when he finally got traded to the Bucks. I mean in the case of Middleton this year he has shown more than the 3-D mold we tend to throw on players and has been handling the ball a lot more and has shown he can defend multiple positions as well with him playing part-time PG to PF. To a lesser extent you can even through Henson in there as well as had shown a pretty good trajectory in terms of improvements until the injury bug hit him - but he is also only 25 as well.

In regards to your post about being able to attract star free-agents there are a lot of other teams that fit the same boat but not every team is willing to go the 76ers route and trade away all their talent and just tank... You act as if Giannis/Parker aren't two players that other teams would consider cornerstones and build their roster around. Their production at the age of 21 isn't going to be their final production as they gain more experience in the L. Trading Giannis to the Celtics for draft picks?? - Like really, what good is that going to do for them when they wont be able to find players with as much potential is Giannis and to a lesser extent Parker. The Celtics would take make a deal with the Bucks in a heartbeat if that was what it took to get him.

I mean you act as if free-agency is all about signing stars and only stars but what this team really needs is proven-vets and complementary pieces to plug the holes on their team. I would argue that they already have their "star player" in Giannis, and if you cant see that then clearly you cant talent. What he is doing at age 21, is putting up ~17/8/4 on 50% shooting - clearly there is room to improve his 3pt% but to get that production from a player at that age is something that other teams would drool over.

When I say peaked, I don't mean literally as in none of their players are getting better and they will always be .500 at best. What I'm saying is this core is clearly, clearly.... not good enough to contend, they will need KEY additions. Not run of the mil role players, not supplemental players, not overpaying Greg Monroe types.

You need at least 1 more legit all-star player along with Middleton, Parker, and Giannis. The question remains will you be able to draft that guy via late lottery picks in the next 2 years? or will you be forced to max out Parker and Giannis in the next 2 years and be forced to commit to this core "AS IS" a team that's currently 10 games under .500 without any injuries at all to your best 4 players.

I don't know. Like I said, I'm just calling it like I see it. It's possible you are more optimistic about it. We both will agree they have internal growth potential, but I don't think they have enough potential to guarantee home court in the playoffs for multiple years. Just my take on it.... but Bucks hype reminds me of all the people talking up the Wizards' two stars who also currently have their team nowhere near the playoffs. The difference, at least Washington can make excuses with Beal injuries. What is it for the Bucks? The team is just not good, and because of the city you are most likely bargain bin shopping and relying on gold-strike scouting or overpaying players. I just think Giannis is so good the Bucks could get a boat load of picks for him right now rather than paying him $25M next October.

Jets012
03-16-2016, 11:56 PM
Lolz.... giannis is already 5000 times better than AK47 ever was. When KG was in his third year i bet no one thought he would become arguably the best all around big man ever. Food for thought. Giannis just needs a jump shot and then the sky is the limit for him.

Really? You must have forgotten how ****ing amazing Peak Kirilenko was from '02-'06. Giannis isn't on his level yet.

Not saying Giannis cannot reach him since Giannis is fantastic now and his potential is amazing now that Kidd is utilizing him better, but do not disservice AK47. He was truly one of the better players in the league when he was at his best.

Lim
03-17-2016, 06:43 AM
giannis already has him beat in every aspect of the game except defense however giannis' defense is top notch and only going to get better. yall underestimating this kid and need to watch more bucks games.

Munkeysuit
03-17-2016, 09:17 AM
Body types maybe similar but Giannis can handle the ball and is turning out to be quite the playmaker...I can see Giannis being more KD type than KG.

MILLERHIGHLIFE
03-17-2016, 11:59 AM
You clearly have no clue about basketball. Your knowledge is really lacking.

Mourning FORCED a trade to Miami. Mourning at the time was way better. Tim Hardaway FORCED a trade to Miami, Miami gave up garbage. Shaq FORCED a trade to Miami, Lamar Odom + horrible contract Brian Grant + Caron does not = Shaq. Dragic FORCED a trade to Miami and handicapped Phoenix. Juwan Howard essentially signed with Miami as basically the very best free agent at his time until Stern nixed the deal on a technicality. Elton Brand signed an offer sheet with the HEAT as the best restricted free agent a his time. LeBron and Bosh both signed with Miami as top free agents obviously. This is just 28 years of HEAT basketball. Nonetheless, what does Miami have to do with the stinking Bucks?

How many top free agents in the 50 years of Bucks basketball forced their way there or signed there as a free agent? Did any key players force a trade to Milwaukee or was it the other way around like Kareem? Totally hilarious you bring up Mason after taking his old *** after Miami tossed him aside. Your front office overpaid him to destroy the locker room of your last true 'glory days' in Milwaukee. I mean he was your "big free agent" at the time to help "put you over the top" since you were close to getting to the Finals the year before he came.

But seriously, in the history of your franchise Monta Ellis and Greg Monroe are probably the biggest names you've gotten which is a total joke, son. Your team is way below .500 with this "great core" and you think adding 'supplemental' players in free agency is going to turn things around? Mkay... whatever dude. Stay in fairy-tale land. Funny that you keep bringing up Miami in a thread about the Bucks, and have a long standing history of telling me ad nauseum the HEAT who are 3rd in the East should have blown up the team and tanked, but when I tell you a team 10 games under .500 should tank, I'm suddenly an idiot who knows nothing. Go figure.

A FORCED trade isn't a free agent signing yet. Only big name was LeBron and Bosh. If LeBron wasn't close buddies with Wade it probably never happened beside Bosh probably would of stayed with Raptors. So only big name beyond them two which are very big names. You got me on that. But pretty much ring chaser of Ray Allen and that was it after big 3.

So really beyond the big decision on TV of LeBron leaving for Miami. Miami hasn't lured big name free agents beyond that decision. You just mentioned big trades. So get all bent out of shape for nothing. Think its funny. With very little talent in the NBA very seldom big names switch teams. More trades of big names over signings. Or sign and trades.

Yet you bring this whole Miami attention in a Giannis discussion thread. Mods here should of delete your post and gave you a time out for a couple weeks. Looks like you could use it. Yeah for trade I could come up with a mile long list of Bucks trades if you wanted it. Bucks trade more often them most the league combined. Heck this was first trade deadline we didn't do anything yet we still had the most active trade deadline of Howard, Rubio, Martin, Teague, Lawson and plenty of others were linked to us.

Yeah for free agent we have done much other then Monroe,Dunleavy JR ,Bobby Simmons,Zaza,Bayless,Copeland,Gilliam. Not much really. But for trades we had washed up Payton but still a big name at the time. Desmond Mason,Anthony Mason, Kukoc, Cassell, Joe Smith, Andrew Lang, Tim Thomas, Keith Van Horn, Magloire, Richard Jefferson,Stephen Jackson,Cory Maggette,Monta Ellis,Tyronne Hill, Terrell Brandon, Charlie Villanueva,Knight, Middleton, Plumlee, MCW, Ennis. I could keep going but waste of time.

MILLERHIGHLIFE
03-17-2016, 12:07 PM
Oh Big O was traded to us. Mr triple double.

beasted86
03-17-2016, 12:36 PM
A FORCED trade isn't a free agent signing yet. Only big name was LeBron and Bosh. If LeBron wasn't close buddies with Wade it probably never happened beside Bosh probably would of stayed with Raptors. So only big name beyond them two which are very big names. You got me on that. But pretty much ring chaser of Ray Allen and that was it after big 3.

So really beyond the big decision on TV of LeBron leaving for Miami. Miami hasn't lured big name free agents beyond that decision. You just mentioned big trades. So get all bent out of shape for nothing. Think its funny. With very little talent in the NBA very seldom big names switch teams. More trades of big names over signings. Or sign and trades.

Yet you bring this whole Miami attention in a Giannis discussion thread. Mods here should of delete your post and gave you a time out for a couple weeks. Looks like you could use it. Yeah for trade I could come up with a mile long list of Bucks trades if you wanted it. Bucks trade more often them most the league combined. Heck this was first trade deadline we didn't do anything yet we still had the most active trade deadline of Howard, Rubio, Martin, Teague, Lawson and plenty of others were linked to us.

Yeah for free agent we have done much other then Monroe,Dunleavy JR ,Bobby Simmons,Zaza,Bayless,Copeland,Gilliam. Not much really. But for trades we had washed up Payton but still a big name at the time. Desmond Mason,Anthony Mason, Kukoc, Cassell, Joe Smith, Andrew Lang, Tim Thomas, Keith Van Horn, Magloire, Richard Jefferson,Stephen Jackson,Cory Maggette,Monta Ellis,Tyronne Hill, Terrell Brandon, Charlie Villanueva,Knight, Middleton, Plumlee, MCW, Ennis. I could keep going but waste of time.
If a free agent forces a sign and trade to a certain team that couldn't sign him otherwise leaving his former team with lesser players/assets, how is that not the same as a player picking his team? Is the team/city not drawing that player's interest to want to play there?

Which top tier player has even signed an offer sheet in Milwaukee? I'm mentioning Shaqs and a LeBrons and other best of the market at the time players, and you're mentioning Richard Jefferson, LOL! I could name a ton more middle tier not even worth talking about guys like Eddie Jones but those are completely irrelevant. It's clear you're willing to lie to yourself about the obvious limitations your team has to attract (TOP TIER) players to want to play there.

It's also clear you're delusional as the first person to mention Miami in a thread about the Bucks, for unknown reasons (hater?).

By November 2017 the Bucks will have committed $65M per season split between Parker, Giannis, and Middleton. I hope for the better fans of Milwaukee that's enough to make the playoffs and you guys aren't instead crying about parity. Like I said in my first post on the thread, if I'm GM, I sell high on Giannis and gut the Celtics for all the picks you can manage for the next 6 years, they will believe he is that final piece and give up a ton. I would then tank over the next 2 years and reassess the same time Parker is due for an extension.

phantasyyy
03-17-2016, 01:22 PM
When I say peaked, I don't mean literally as in none of their players are getting better and they will always be .500 at best. What I'm saying is this core is clearly, clearly.... not good enough to contend, they will need KEY additions. Not run of the mil role players, not supplemental players, not overpaying Greg Monroe types.

You need at least 1 more legit all-star player along with Middleton, Parker, and Giannis. The question remains will you be able to draft that guy via late lottery picks in the next 2 years? or will you be forced to max out Parker and Giannis in the next 2 years and be forced to commit to this core "AS IS" a team that's currently 10 games under .500 without any injuries at all to your best 4 players.

I don't know. Like I said, I'm just calling it like I see it. It's possible you are more optimistic about it. We both will agree they have internal growth potential, but I don't think they have enough potential to guarantee home court in the playoffs for multiple years. Just my take on it.... but Bucks hype reminds me of all the people talking up the Wizards' two stars who also currently have their team nowhere near the playoffs. The difference, at least Washington can make excuses with Beal injuries. What is it for the Bucks? The team is just not good, and because of the city you are most likely bargain bin shopping and relying on gold-strike scouting or overpaying players. I just think Giannis is so good the Bucks could get a boat load of picks for him right now rather than paying him $25M next October.

I mean your obviously entitled to your opinion but clearly your evaluation of Giannis and to a lesser extent Parker clearly aren't in line with any body else who watches NBA basketball. I've been reading your posts and I just don't get how you can't see how they cant be cornerstones for the team? I mean Parker was the #2 overall pick for god sakes, and Giannis is like the ultimate potential player in the L besides maybe Porzingis.. and in a redraft he'd definitely go #1. Trade Giannis for picks? - who would they draft that would have as much potential as himself? Your posts allude to the fact that NBA players are what they are when their drafted and will never improve..

You keep stating they are .500 at best but how can you be so sure? Parker and Giannis are so young they haven't even approached their prime yet and Middleton is just entering his. They have two of their cornerstones still on rookie contracts, and will have plenty of room to build around this core. The team also doesn't have any horrendous contracts and everything is short enough that they can move pieces that don't fit - Monroe, MCW.. They'll have plenty of cap space to create a better fit around their core with a floor spacing PG and a defensive anchor I assume on their priority list.

Post allstar break the core 3 are all averaging 20+ on great efficiency and if your basing your decisions off this season then I suggest you look a larger scope of things. Sure their primary players didn't have any injury issues this year but like I stated in my last post Parker is coming back from major ACL surgery, Mayo has been in/out of the lineup and now out for the season GV has been injured all season, MCW/Novak is now out for the season, Henson has been injured since January, and even Kidd missed a few games with surgery. So its not like they haven't had their fair of share of injuries..

beasted86
03-17-2016, 02:54 PM
I mean your obviously entitled to your opinion but clearly your evaluation of Giannis and to a lesser extent Parker clearly aren't in line with any body else who watches NBA basketball. I've been reading your posts and I just don't get how you can't see how they cant be cornerstones for the team? I mean Parker was the #2 overall pick for god sakes, and Giannis is like the ultimate potential player in the L besides maybe Porzingis.. and in a redraft he'd definitely go #1. Trade Giannis for picks? - who would they draft that would have as much potential as himself? Your posts allude to the fact that NBA players are what they are when their drafted and will never improve..

You keep stating they are .500 at best but how can you be so sure? Parker and Giannis are so young they haven't even approached their prime yet and Middleton is just entering his. They have two of their cornerstones still on rookie contracts, and will have plenty of room to build around this core. The team also doesn't have any horrendous contracts and everything is short enough that they can move pieces that don't fit - Monroe, MCW.. They'll have plenty of cap space to create a better fit around their core with a floor spacing PG and a defensive anchor I assume on their priority list.

Post allstar break the core 3 are all averaging 20+ on great efficiency and if your basing your decisions off this season then I suggest you look a larger scope of things. Sure their primary players didn't have any injury issues this year but like I stated in my last post Parker is coming back from major ACL surgery, Mayo has been in/out of the lineup and now out for the season GV has been injured all season, MCW/Novak is now out for the season, Henson has been injured since January, and even Kidd missed a few games with surgery. So its not like they haven't had their fair of share of injuries..

Your best 4 players, Giannis, Parker, Middleton and Monroe basically haven't missed a game all season, and up to the point MCW went down, all your starters might have missed a combined 10 games just estimating looking at the game logs. Are you explaining the losing on lack of role players? If OJ Mayo makes or breaks the team, they are flawed beyond repair.

The post all-star record is still just .500 which is not very good if "everyone is clicking".


I'm not alluding to the core not being better than .500...No. Instead I'm alluding to your market situation and cap situation and results of the current team's progress thru a season with everyone healthy.

If the records were flipped between this year and last year there would be no cause for alarm because the team is getting better. 10 games under .500 the first year and .500 the following season speaks progression. But seeing as that they basically added two way above average players in Parker and Monroe and subsequently got worse is a real issue to me.

Hawkeye15
03-17-2016, 03:45 PM
I mean your obviously entitled to your opinion but clearly your evaluation of Giannis and to a lesser extent Parker clearly aren't in line with any body else who watches NBA basketball. I've been reading your posts and I just don't get how you can't see how they cant be cornerstones for the team? I mean Parker was the #2 overall pick for god sakes, and Giannis is like the ultimate potential player in the L besides maybe Porzingis.. and in a redraft he'd definitely go #1. Trade Giannis for picks? - who would they draft that would have as much potential as himself? Your posts allude to the fact that NBA players are what they are when their drafted and will never improve..

You keep stating they are .500 at best but how can you be so sure? Parker and Giannis are so young they haven't even approached their prime yet and Middleton is just entering his. They have two of their cornerstones still on rookie contracts, and will have plenty of room to build around this core. The team also doesn't have any horrendous contracts and everything is short enough that they can move pieces that don't fit - Monroe, MCW.. They'll have plenty of cap space to create a better fit around their core with a floor spacing PG and a defensive anchor I assume on their priority list.

Post allstar break the core 3 are all averaging 20+ on great efficiency and if your basing your decisions off this season then I suggest you look a larger scope of things. Sure their primary players didn't have any injury issues this year but like I stated in my last post Parker is coming back from major ACL surgery, Mayo has been in/out of the lineup and now out for the season GV has been injured all season, MCW/Novak is now out for the season, Henson has been injured since January, and even Kidd missed a few games with surgery. So its not like they haven't had their fair of share of injuries..

Giannis isn't a #1 on a contender down the line imo. Parker we don't even know if he is a net gain due to defensive liability. Middleton is a floor spacing, pretty well rounded offensive player, but what kind ceiling does he really have? I like those players, but none of them says "LeBron, Durant, etc".

Fact is, you are a bottom 10 team on both sides of the ball, and neither of your 1-2 year players show star power, with MAYBE the exception of Giannis, but I still don't see superstar with him.

The core you have, to me, is going to be a 3-5 seed out east possibly, and not contend. You are still missing talent. May as well go high on Giannis and rack in a bunch of picks.

5ass
03-17-2016, 05:40 PM
Giannis isn't a #1 on a contender down the line imo. Parker we don't even know if he is a net gain due to defensive liability. Middleton is a floor spacing, pretty well rounded offensive player, but what kind ceiling does he really have? I like those players, but none of them says "LeBron, Durant, etc".

Fact is, you are a bottom 10 team on both sides of the ball, and neither of your 1-2 year players show star power, with MAYBE the exception of Giannis, but I still don't see superstar with him.

The core you have, to me, is going to be a 3-5 seed out east possibly, and not contend. You are still missing talent. May as well go high on Giannis and rack in a bunch of picks.

What's your definiton of a superstar? Does he have to be a #1 option? When you say LeBron, Durant, ect. Is Paul George for example part of the group? You can argue he's not a clear #1 option on a contender, but are you saying he shouldn't even be your best player?

By contender I mean a 50+ win team and decent shot at the finals.

phantasyyy
03-17-2016, 08:21 PM
Your best 4 players, Giannis, Parker, Middleton and Monroe basically haven't missed a game all season, and up to the point MCW went down, all your starters might have missed a combined 10 games just estimating looking at the game logs. Are you explaining the losing on lack of role players? If OJ Mayo makes or breaks the team, they are flawed beyond repair.

The post all-star record is still just .500 which is not very good if "everyone is clicking".


I'm not alluding to the core not being better than .500...No. Instead I'm alluding to your market situation and cap situation and results of the current team's progress thru a season with everyone healthy.

If the records were flipped between this year and last year there would be no cause for alarm because the team is getting better. 10 games under .500 the first year and .500 the following season speaks progression. But seeing as that they basically added two way above average players in Parker and Monroe and subsequently got worse is a real issue to me.

Well I mean you cant play with only 4 players.. haha but I see what you mean. The team just doesn't fit right now imo, MCW is just a terrible fit overall and without any depth there is nobody on the team capable of playing PG, thus why you see Giannis handling the duties at the moment. Monroe has also been a bad fit and ruined their defensive identity by pretty much being a door stop in the post - thus why he is now coming off the bench.

Normally role players shouldn't make or break a season but with the roster being so young and implementing new parts(Monroe/Parker), and pieces that just don't their record is what it is. The team has no defensive presence in the post and their defense is what got them into the post season last year.

I guess I just see more optimism that negatives with the team, blowing a team that so young just seems hasty. Like for example, if you put Giannis in next years draft, there are plenty of teams that would use that #1 pick on him if they could. Trading him to Boston for their stash of picks isn't really going to do them any better as they still will have to pick an unproven player. Ben Simmons doesn't strike me as that mega superstar either.. in the Lebron/Durant tier. At least Giannis plays both sides of the floor and has shown steady improvement in each NBA season

The teams heading back to the lottery this year anyways so its not like they wont have a high-ish pick to select some talent from this offseason.

Bruno
03-18-2016, 01:23 AM
Giannis is a star player. but he's nothing like KG.