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View Full Version : Where would the casual fan rank Charles Barkley had he played his career in Chicago?



JTRobinson
01-23-2016, 05:28 PM
So Charles Barkley plays his entire Career in Chicago on the same team as Michael Jordan, Scottie Pippen and the rest of the team and he wins 6-7 NBA Titles to go along with his career stats of 25, 13, 4, 2, 1, 55% (during his 10-11 year prime), Where does he now get ranked by the average casual fan?

DR_1
01-23-2016, 05:39 PM
So Charles Barkley plays his entire Career in Chicago on the same team as Michael Jordan, Scottie Pippen and the rest of the team and he wins 6-7 NBA Titles to go along with his career stats of 25, 13, 4, 2, 1, 55% (during his 10-11 year prime), Where does he now get ranked by the average casual fan?

His stats wouldn't be as good, so the same or maybe even a bit lower.

JTRobinson
01-23-2016, 05:45 PM
His stats wouldn't be as good, so the same or maybe even a bit lower.

Why do you think that? He got all his points on the fast break and offensive rebounds. They never called a play for him. He averaged 18 ppg on the Dream team both years 92 and 96 and led them in scoring. He shoots 56% for his career.

also for the exercise lets say he averages the same 25-26 a game and 13 rebounds, Lets also say he gets Two Finals MVP's and gets two Regular Season MVP's in the Golden Era.

So 7 Titles
2 MVP's
2 Finals MVP's

Prime career averages of 26/13/4/2/1. Infact sure he would average 5-6 assist and get about 20 Triple doubles per game passing to Jordan and Pippen after he draws the double team.

The reason he would get 2 MVP's is because his team would win 75 games every season.

Infact they would probably win about 8-9 Titles.

DR_1
01-23-2016, 05:47 PM
Why do you think that? He got all his points on the fast break and offensive rebounds. They never called a play for him. He averaged 18 ppg on the Dream team both years 92 and 96 and led them in scoring. He shoots 56% for his career.

also for the exercise lets say he averages the same 25-26 a game and 13 rebounds, Lets also say he gets Two Finals MVP's and gets two Regular Season MVP's in the Golden Era.

So 7 Titles
2 MVP's
2 Finals MVP's

Prime career averages of 26/13/4/2/1. Infact sure he would average 5-6 assist and get about 20 Triple doubles per game passing to Jordan and Pippen after he draws the double team.

The reason he would get 2 MVP's is because his team would win 75 games every season.

Infact they would probably win about 8-9 Titles.

What I'm saying though is that on such a great team his numbers would be significantly less as a third wheel - look at Bosh and Love.

valade16
01-23-2016, 05:49 PM
What I'm saying though is that on such a great team his numbers would be significantly less as a third wheel - look at Bosh and Love.

Would he be a third wheel though? I think he'd be the second in the hierarchy below MJ.

JTRobinson
01-23-2016, 05:49 PM
Lets also say he comes out of high school early and was hyped by ESPN in highschool and then paid 50 million dollars a season every year.

I know darn well he would be the second best player ever in ranking.


hyped
2 MVP's of which over MJ those 2 times
2-3 FINALS MVPS
15 ALL STAR GAME STARTS
lets even say he focuses on passing and aveages
22/12/8 assist per game for the best overall stats in NBA history and he ends up getting 500 Triple doubles in his career.

Then he would be the second best player ever.

DR_1
01-23-2016, 05:50 PM
Would he be a third wheel though? I think he'd be the second in the hierarchy below MJ.

I don't think Pippen's ego would have allowed that to happen lol

JTRobinson
01-23-2016, 05:54 PM
Would he be a third wheel though? I think he'd be the second in the hierarchy below MJ.

I don't really get into all that talk. Infact the offense would be run through Barkley so the stats would be there. I getting the impression that many of you never saw prime Barkley. Probably just watched Barkley in his last season with Houston. Barkley would average so many assist playing for Phil Jackson much of his career and being able to throw passes to Pippen and Jordan.

Jordan played off the ball and so did Pippen for the most part. Barkley would still have huge games of like 45 points here and there.

JTRobinson
01-23-2016, 06:02 PM
So by your logic LeBron playing his career in Chicago is robin to Jordan that would definitely bring LeBron's ranking WAY DOWN. Cause that is all people like about LeBron is that he has the ball all the time and calls every shot. (it's actually a negative trait on a basketball court, but I know how the casual fan is, they like that).

Some of you just need to go look at Charles Barkley's career playoff stats and career stats.
5th ALL TIME in NBA HISTORY actually better than adjusted Wilt stats. Wilt was really only about 20 and (13) in the playoffs. (rebounds adjusted). Barkley was 26 and 14 in the playoffs on 56% shooting. Also 5 Dimes.

Go look it up.

Of all the players in NBA history that had better playoff stats and regular season stats it's


It's just

Jordan
Shaq
Hakeem

and that's about it.

maybe Kareem although he wasn't a rebounder much of his career.

Lebron can be there but he gets his stats by just taking every shot and having the ball. Also he's yet to play those seasons where he averages like 17 and 4/4.

Bostonjorge
01-23-2016, 06:05 PM
I don't really get into all that talk. Infact the offense would be run through Barkley so the stats would be there. I getting the impression that many of you never saw prime Barkley. Probably just watched Barkley in his last season with Houston. Barkley would average so many assist playing for Phil Jackson much of his career and being able to throw passes to Pippen and Jordan.

Jordan played off the ball and so did Pippen for the most part. Barkley would still have huge games of like 45 points here and there.

Jordan would demand a trade.

JTRobinson
01-23-2016, 06:12 PM
Jordan would demand a trade.

why do you think such a strange idea.

Jordan would pass the ball. Jordan is not a player that would just shoot more just to average the most points in the NBA. If Jordan had a big post up player down low that could average 25 a game he would pass to him more times than not. Jordan was a TEAM player, that is why Jordan is the best ever. It's why he and Scottie won 6 NBA TITLES basically in a row in the Golden Era.

I have seen Jordan's career and he would pass about 70 times a game. Barkley passed a lot too, I'd average about 50 times a game.

Chronz
01-23-2016, 06:34 PM
What I'm saying though is that on such a great team his numbers would be significantly less as a third wheel - look at Bosh and Love.

While thats true in any era, before the zone era, it was easier to get away with multiple ball dominant players because defenses couldn't overload any one side as constantly, you didn't have to worry about having as many outlet shooters, thats why you could get away with so many non-shooters because you could play alot more 1v1.

In the triangle, Chuck would have thrived, it maximizes spacing that the zones couldn't yet shrink. I could see Chuck operating at every corner of the triangle, top of the key, in the pinch post and on the blocks, he was that versatile and so was MJ so the 2 could have taken turns depending on matchups and how the defense reacts. The only guy that would really suffer is Pippen, he struggled in Houston when he had to share the post with Hakeem and Chuck and although that was a MUCH older Pippen it still wasn't his best role, him not playing the full time Point-Forward would hurt him as Chuck did like to pound the **** out of the ball, especially in the clutch. Hed still be elite defensively and would prolly be more efficient as he would get a higher% of his shots in transition and cuts off the attention these gifted 2 passers would draw.

Scoots
01-23-2016, 06:34 PM
I got stuck on Barkley never having a play called for him. Really?

WaDe03
01-23-2016, 06:35 PM
How you been BuckWilliams?

effen5
01-23-2016, 06:35 PM
I think Barkley numbers would go up and Jordans number would go down

Chronz
01-23-2016, 06:38 PM
I don't really get into all that talk. Infact the offense would be run through Barkley so the stats would be there. I getting the impression that many of you never saw prime Barkley. Probably just watched Barkley in his last season with Houston. Barkley would average so many assist playing for Phil Jackson much of his career and being able to throw passes to Pippen and Jordan.

Jordan played off the ball and so did Pippen for the most part. Barkley would still have huge games of like 45 points here and there.

Pippen for the most part was the Point Forward, he was dubbed that precisely because he DID have the ball so much more and did run the offense so much more than your typical SF.

valade16
01-23-2016, 06:46 PM
I got stuck on Barkley never having a play called for him. Really?

Is that really worse than him saying Michael Jordan played primarily off-ball lol?

Dude really has no clue what he's talking about.

Scoots
01-23-2016, 06:47 PM
Is that really worse than him saying Michael Jordan played primarily off-ball lol?

Dude really has no clue what he's talking about.
I never even got to that lol

JTRobinson
01-23-2016, 06:55 PM
I think they would have an offense that would average 115 a game many of those seasons and they would force a bunch of turnovers with their steals, defections, blocks and just overall defense.

Pippen would get even more fast breaks dunks. Pippen would be fine at about 18-21 a game.

Barkley would bring in most seasons at about 24-26 a season

Jordan would averaged about 26-28 a season.

but why does ppg matter so much to everyone?

The important thing is they would pass the ball very well and they're defense would still be elite, Barkley was great at getting steals and blocks.

To be fair since all the casual fans like to drastically move lebrat and wade up the list of rankings even when they just make the finals in a bad east today, it's only fair to put Barkley around 2-3 in the all Time ranks with 6-7 Rings, A couple of MVP's and FInals MVPs'.


I actually have him ranked about 10-11 all time.

Maybe had he playd with the Bulls he would've played even greater. Maybe with 6-7 Rings playing along side Jordan and Pippen I'd move him up just a little to about 6-7.

That's because I'm FAIR!

unlike these LeBron fans that move LeBron from 18 all the way to 6 when he makes a finals in a lousy East today. I mean it's really a joke. And the wade fans are just as bad. move him from like 40 to 20 with just from making the finals and losing in the bad East. I don't even think words can say just how bad and uncompetitive the East as been the last 15 years.

valade16
01-23-2016, 07:15 PM
If Barkley won 7 titles and 2 MVPs he'd be Top 10 ever, I just don't think Barkley would win an MVP on the same team as Jordan.

There's a reason Jordan won all 6 Finals MVPs over Scottie. He was the best player ever and nobody, not even Charles Barkley was going to outplay him on his own team for a season (heck, Barkley didn't even outplay MJ when he won MVP in Phoenix)

slashsnake
01-23-2016, 08:54 PM
I think if he was on that team, he'd have found out how important playing D was much earlier (don't mistake playing D from rebounding and swiping at the ball, had someone just tell me Love and Irving were great defenders for that reason I think) and been one of the all time greats.



I did love his quotes on D though...

"I don't play much defense for the Phoenix Suns either. I get paid to score and rebound. I'll need another $1 million for defense"

"As long as Larry Bird is in the NBA I will only be the 2nd worst defender"

"it's called defense. I mean, I wouldn't know anything about it personally, but I've heard about it through the grapevine."

slashsnake
01-23-2016, 08:57 PM
Is that really worse than him saying Michael Jordan played primarily off-ball lol?

Dude really has no clue what he's talking about.

lol dude probably only watched Jordan in his last season in Washington when he'd give up the ball to go to the post and get it back.

KnicksorBust
01-23-2016, 10:40 PM
I got stuck on Barkley never having a play called for him. Really?

Is that really worse than him saying Michael Jordan played primarily off-ball lol?

Dude really has no clue what he's talking about.

Yeah it is ridiculous but I did have some fun imagining the Chuckster in Chicago. I have to agree with Valade. Barkley would never win an MVP on an MJ team.

All-Time all those rings would have bumped him up. Instead of a PF debate for spots 2-5. It would clearly be Duncan than Barkley.

KnicksorBust
01-23-2016, 10:41 PM
What about Timmy in Chicago?

ewing
01-24-2016, 01:16 AM
no one wins every time but Micheal. Scottie Pippen isn't a all time great without Mike. Mike was babe ruth.

ManningToTyree
01-24-2016, 01:52 AM
Oh Buck

Raps18-19 Champ
01-24-2016, 02:09 AM
He would never put up those numbers. But assuming he posted those stats and won his MVP, he'd be ranked slightly higher. If his production dropped but won 6 titles, he should be ranked lower.

Bostonjorge
01-24-2016, 02:09 AM
Barkley thought he was better then Jordan. The year Barkley won MVP and went to the finals I was starting to believe it my self. Barkley had monster games but couldn't win even with home court advantage.

Now in Chicago Barkley never loses to Jordan. Barkley would want control of the team and most team with bigs like Barkley get it. Phill would use Barkley in the post and have him make the plays instead of pippen throwing in Jordan. The 2 years Jordan retires bulls still win with Barkley. When Jordan comes back no way he gets control of Barkley's team.

I just think Barkley needs to lose to Jordan to finally believe he's not better. That's why I believe eventually one guy leaves. Back then when you never traded a big for a small and how the Bulls management was. Not to far fetch to believe Jordan was the guy going out.

the avenger
01-24-2016, 09:20 AM
A few thoughts:
1/ I think Barkley, playing for the Bulls, would've taken much better care of his body. His prime would have lasted longer.
2/ Barkley never choked in the play-offs and surely would have been the MVP at least once while being on the same team as MJ (I mean the NBA dooesn't want to give the MVP the MVP to the same player every year)
3/ Imagine him and Rodman on the same team...
4/ Barkley would be considered top 10 all time (instead of Hakeem) had he won the championship in 94 and 95... And damned, he was reaaaaallly close. Rockets beat the Suns twice with lots of luck and very small margin

sep11ie
01-24-2016, 02:51 PM
Who the F cares?

Would you bang your uncle if he was your aunt?

Jamiecballer
01-26-2016, 10:42 AM
If I assume all of those things he'd be one of the 5 best ever. Question is why would I assume those things.

Tony_Starks
01-26-2016, 12:23 PM
Casual fan would give him the Scottie Pippen treatment, underrate him for playing with MJ.

Knowledgeable fans would have him about the same, arguably best PF ever.

JasonJohnHorn
01-26-2016, 02:23 PM
Jordan is Jordan. He's getting his 32 a game. Period.

Having Barkley on the team would likely have diminished Pippen, not Barkely.

Barkley could pass, and score in the post.

But there would have been personality issues. Barkley would want to be the man. He also couldn't play D. Jordan would want a guy who worked harder in practice, and would D-up.

There would have been serious tension there. I think there would have been a trade.


That said, had they stayed together long enough to last to MJ's first retirement, the Bulls could have still reached the finals both years, and the second year I'm sure the Bulls GM would have brought in some 3-ballers to compete with Houston afte getting their @$$ handed to them because of Houstons' long-bomb game.

KDSpurman4
01-26-2016, 08:07 PM
Barkley would get his 25 reguardless. Barkley is Barkley. Jordan would get his 28. Jordan is great, but now he has a great post up player to throw to. I know Pippen was great down there too.

Playing alongside Jordan would only help.

Barkley would still have the
26/13/5/ 1.6 steals 1 block. So that means he deflected another 10 and was very aware. I was watching a game on classic and Chuck Daly was calling it. He confirmed what I was saying forever. "Barkley is one of the best help defenders and team defenders in our league". That was Chuck Daly saying that. He also said he's also a great man to man defender.

Then he would still get the MVP because he got it over MJ anyway.

Also he probably would've won the Finals MVP

So he'd have a few MVP's, some of the best stats in league history and 8 RINGS

I'd say he would be considered the second best player ever.

In other words the only thing holding back Barkley from being the second best ever is Rings. (or what team he played on).

Chronz
01-26-2016, 09:25 PM
Barkley would get his 25 reguardless. Barkley is Barkley. Jordan would get his 28. Jordan is great, but now he has a great post up player to throw to. I know Pippen was great down there too.

Playing alongside Jordan would only help.

Barkley would still have the
26/13/5/ 1.6 steals 1 block. So that means he deflected another 10 and was very aware. I was watching a game on classic and Chuck Daly was calling it. He confirmed what I was saying forever. "Barkley is one of the best help defenders and team defenders in our league". That was Chuck Daly saying that. He also said he's also a great man to man defender.

Then he would still get the MVP because he got it over MJ anyway.

Also he probably would've won the Finals MVP

So he'd have a few MVP's, some of the best stats in league history and 8 RINGS

I'd say he would be considered the second best player ever.

In other words the only thing holding back Barkley from being the second best ever is Rings. (or what team he played on).

Anyone want to put this post to bed or do we continue ignoring his charm?

Why keep coming back as obvious alternatives? Oh right, he wants us to know its Buck. TBH, hes not even Buck, his spirit/spark comes from way back, much further than Buck. I forgot the moniker but hes been trolling since trolling was in its daddy's nutsac.