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BuckWilliams
01-08-2016, 02:03 PM
21.9 ppg
9.5 rebs
3.8 ast
1.6 stls
1.7 blks
.482 FG%
2.6 turnovers
71 Games
39-32 W-L record

if so then how judge this season aswell

20 ppg
13 rebs
4.1 ast
1.4 stls
2.1 blks
3.5 turnovers
42 out of 50 games
22-20 W-L record


Would a player that averages this for a season make an All Star game most likely?

tredigs
01-08-2016, 06:27 PM
Not nearly enough information. Depends on the other players in the conference, the year/pace of the game, and I'd need to see more efficiency #'s. All-NBA is a better question by the way. ASG is a popularity vote.

Also, what's up with the random game totals? This thread is improved from your "Lebrat" thread, and I appreciate you trying to drum up discussion, but you might want to consider sitting the next few plays out and watch how better posters create worthwhile discussion. You feel like a troll through and through. Likely a dupe.

Redrum187
01-08-2016, 06:34 PM
James Harden or Kawhi Leonard defense?

IBleedPurple
01-08-2016, 07:19 PM
Also, what's up with the random game totals? This thread is improved from your "Lebrat" thread, and I appreciate you trying to drum up discussion, but you might want to consider sitting the next few plays out and watch how better posters create worthwhile discussion. You feel like a troll through and through. Likely a dupe.This.

BuckWilliams
01-08-2016, 10:37 PM
James Harden or Kawhi Leonard defense?

Defense about like Kawhi.

tredigs
01-09-2016, 03:01 AM
James Harden or Kawhi Leonard defense?


Defense about like Kawhi.
To be clear, he would very likely rate Doug Christie's defense over Kawhi's. Keep that in mind during this epic debate.

WaDe03
01-09-2016, 03:42 AM
Tod Wilkinson

JasonJohnHorn
01-09-2016, 04:22 AM
I think so, but it depends. I'm guessing this is a post player. Is he a stretch four? Is so, the 48% shooting is fine if he shoots a lot of 3's. If he's strictly a post player (say Al Jefferson or LMA), he might struggle because he won't be seen as efficient.

I have a soft spot for post players, even in the age of the 3-ball.

What's the second guy's FG%?


20/10 is usually good for an All-Star big, so I'll go with yes, but Jefferson got snubbed the other year when he was having a great season, and I think he and Millsap both got snubbed in Utah with relatively similar numbers (thugh they didn't win a lot of games).

BuckWilliams
01-09-2016, 06:03 PM
I think so, but it depends. I'm guessing this is a post player. Is he a stretch four? Is so, the 48% shooting is fine if he shoots a lot of 3's. If he's strictly a post player (say Al Jefferson or LMA), he might struggle because he won't be seen as efficient.

I have a soft spot for post players, even in the age of the 3-ball.

What's the second guy's FG%?


20/10 is usually good for an All-Star big, so I'll go with yes, but Jefferson got snubbed the other year when he was having a great season, and I think he and Millsap both got snubbed in Utah with relatively similar numbers (thugh they didn't win a lot of games).

He's a power player that posts up, that can step out and make the 15 footer and even 20 footer. 48% is better than any guard why do people hold post players to a different standard. If you shoot 48% you will win every game or atleast go 60 and 22.
He makes players around him better and makes the game easy for his team. He can even play POINT CENTER.

Raps18-19 Champ
01-09-2016, 07:10 PM
It depends on his name of course.

ewing
01-09-2016, 08:09 PM
yes he would most likely make the All Star team

JasonJohnHorn
01-10-2016, 11:25 AM
He's a power player that posts up, that can step out and make the 15 footer and even 20 footer. 48% is better than any guard why do people hold post players to a different standard. If you shoot 48% you will win every game or atleast go 60 and 22.
He makes players around him better and makes the game easy for his team. He can even play POINT CENTER.


Players at different positions are held to different standards for good reason.

You have to have different options.

You give a guy in the paint or a slasher the ball to score at a high percentage because they are taking layup or put backs. They better hit at over .500 because the shooting guard can already hit at .470.

Now if you leave the guard open, his percentage goes up, so you need a post up player that hits at a higher percentage than a guard to make him worth double teaming. If he hits at the same percentage as the guard, then the defence doesn't get spread around.

And over all FG% is going to be lower for a guy who takes 3's. For example, if one guy takes 15 shots a game but 10 are 3ptrs, and only 5 are 2ptrs, his 2pt FG% may be over .500 and his 3pt% may be over .400, but his FG% may be 45.

However, he still scores more points with 10 shots than a C or PF who shoots at .500


In order to make defences move, you have to have different guys who can score effectively in different ways. With the rate guys shoot 3's these days, .500 form the post is ineffective. So the only purpose of using a post player is to get defences to open up and spread the floor with the end goal, not of getting the ball in the paint, but of kicking it out to a shooter.

In this case, 48% is good for a guy like, say Garnett or Duncan, who step outside to 15 feet and take effective jumpers, but it wouldn't be effective for a guy like Shaq, who only takes shots within a metre from the basket, because that won't open things up the way Duncan and Garnett would open things out with their mid-range jumper.

BuckWilliams
01-10-2016, 11:31 AM
Players at different positions are held to different standards for good reason.

You have to have different options.

You give a guy in the paint or a slasher the ball to score at a high percentage because they are taking layup or put backs. They better hit at over .500 because the shooting guard can already hit at .470.

Now if you leave the guard open, his percentage goes up, so you need a post up player that hits at a higher percentage than a guard to make him worth double teaming. If he hits at the same percentage as the guard, then the defence doesn't get spread around.

And over all FG% is going to be lower for a guy who takes 3's. For example, if one guy takes 15 shots a game but 10 are 3ptrs, and only 5 are 2ptrs, his 2pt FG% may be over .500 and his 3pt% may be over .400, but his FG% may be 45.

However, he still scores more points with 10 shots than a C or PF who shoots at .500


In order to make defences move, you have to have different guys who can score effectively in different ways. With the rate guys shoot 3's these days, .500 form the post is ineffective. So the only purpose of using a post player is to get defences to open up and spread the floor with the end goal, not of getting the ball in the paint, but of kicking it out to a shooter.

In this case, 48% is good for a guy like, say Garnett or Duncan, who step outside to 15 feet and take effective jumpers, but it wouldn't be effective for a guy like Shaq, who only takes shots within a metre from the basket, because that won't open things up the way Duncan and Garnett would open things out with their mid-range jumper.

So you would rather have a SG that shoots 43% than a Pf that shoots 49%.

It's not a trick question.

BuckWilliams
01-10-2016, 11:32 AM
Jason John let me ask you and others this too. You're down 1 point in a close game and you NEED a basket.

Do you pass to a 43% shooter or a 49% shooter?

ewing
01-10-2016, 11:37 AM
who are the ****ing players?

JasonJohnHorn
01-10-2016, 11:51 AM
It depends on his name of course.

Too true... too true.....

Most young guys that develop into All-Stars (not those who storm onto the scene with an ROY and a big hype machine) have to play like an All-Star for a couple of seasons before they get on the team, and some actually get on AFTER they declined a little.

Al Jefferson, for example, was putting up 20/10 in Minny and never got an All-Star bid, and people said it was because they were losing, but that didn't stop people from putting Love on the team. Then when he helped Charlotte turn around and posted 20/10, with over 2 assists and over a bloc a game, he got overlooked in favour of Bosh, who was getting 16/6 on a team where he was the third, not the first option.

Don't get me wrong Bosh was an important piece on conference champions, but Jefferson deserved a spot that year, no doubt. Paul Millsap got on the team, and deserve a spot, but he also had fewer points and rebound than Jefferson. And the Hawks for FEWER wins, so people can't argue that this was a case of 'one guy is winning'.


Alternately, you get Joe Johnson in the ASG in 2014, but he wasn't playing nearly as well as he was in 2004, 05, and 06, each seasons where he was overlooked. His per36 averages in 2014 are more favourable than the per-game averages, granted, but BK was a losing team at the time, or was hovering around .500 (I forget at what point they turned it around that year), where as in 05 he was playing on a 62-win team. So despite putting up better number on a winning team, he get looked over, but when putting up lower numbers on a team with far less wins, get a spot. And that spot he got over Lowry who was the most important player on the best team in the same division that JJ was playing in. And that was the coaches pick.


Name recognition is important, with fans in particular, but with coaches as well.

A name can sometimes and often does get you on a roster ahead of you level of play.

hugepatsfan
01-10-2016, 09:02 PM
Jason John let me ask you and others this too. You're down 1 point in a close game and you NEED a basket.

Do you pass to a 43% shooter or a 49% shooter?

It's not as simple as just listing their percentages. Kendrick Perkins shot 61.5% the year BOS won the title with him, easily better than any of the Big 3. No one would pass to him over those guys because they know he just gets his buckets on "clean up" plays. Obviously that's an extereme example but the same type of logic applies. You can't just go y numbers without further context.