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View Full Version : Should the Clippers retire Elton Brand's jersey?



Chronz
08-28-2015, 05:28 PM
He retires as their All-Time leader in O-Reb and Total Rebounds, #2 in Blocks , #3 in PTS. Hes a 2x All-Star and made All-NBA 2nd team (This was during the Wests heyday where every dominant team had a stud PF).

He averaged a solid 20-10-3Ast with high blocks+steals, was money from midrange, could hit his free throws and was a demon on the offensive glass. He has the highest WinShare total and ranks #2 in PER/VORP for the franchise.



The negatives are he only had that 1 playoff run alongside Sam Cassell (who brought out the best in him) and his defense was inconsistent throughout his career but it was arguably the best playoff run we've ever seen from a player in a Clippers uniform and he nearly upset Nash's Suns (He averaged 30 on those midgets). Aside from that he betrayed Baron Davis and the Clips by signing with the Sixers. My hatred for that act has since subsided and I dont think a bitter ending should erase the workhorse load he carried for years.


He was never a spectacular highlight reel but he was gritty and a blue collar guy that was a pleasure to watch compete. I've been going to Clipper games long before him but those cheap seats were alot more enjoyable knowing we had 1 guy who would always come to work.

Do the Clips immortalize this man?

goingfor28
08-28-2015, 05:31 PM
F no. He bolted after saying he would stay when the Clips signed Baron.
Of course it turned out for the better, getting Blake and CP, but that wasn't bc of Brand, it just happened to work out that way.
Ralph Lawler should be the first one retired and his number should be however many games he finishes his announcing career with.

Clippersfan86
08-28-2015, 06:09 PM
Nope. Had he left on better terms or tried to make peace years later maybe. But he screwed us over (whether or not Griffin came, that was a miracle in itself, just like grabbing DJ as the 35th pick) and has never apologized for how he handled it. In fact he's essentially moved on like the Clippers never existed. So fu** him. Just like fu** Andre Miller.

The first jersey retirement by the Clippers will be Ralph Lawler. Followed by Chris Paul and Blake Griffin. Oh I'd even be cool with them retiring Bob McAdoo.

Chronz
08-29-2015, 01:32 PM
Arent grudges petty?

KnicksorBust
08-29-2015, 01:34 PM
Arent grudges petty?

Aren't his accomplishments historically petty?

Silent
08-29-2015, 01:50 PM
nope

PhillyFaninLA
08-29-2015, 02:05 PM
no, he was very good....you need special for that.

Chronz
08-29-2015, 02:21 PM
Aren't his accomplishments historically petty?
I dunno, wats the standard for getting your jersey retired, surely easier than the HOF and the HOF is pretty easy. As a player, I think Brand was better than some HOF'ers but thats not really about how good of a player you were, rather how good your teammates were. That said, should it depend on the team and their history? Clips dont have much of a history, Im shocked we havent retired the only MVP we've ever had. Would retiring these guys diminish the franchise's cred?

PowerHouse
08-29-2015, 02:22 PM
Sure he should. Aside from CP3 or Blake he's had the best Clipper career of anybody else and had some damn good years with the Clips. A lot of people will complain about the terms of how he left but that doesnt bother me at all considering the massive decline he had immediately after his departure. He wasnt going to help much anyway had he stayed.

PowerHouse
08-29-2015, 02:26 PM
If Vlade Divac has his number retired by Sac, Brand should get his retired. Why the hell did Sacramento do that anyways?

Cracka2HI!
08-29-2015, 04:59 PM
This is great question. I like all Clipper fans was really bitter about Brand leaving. I have an autograph jersey of his. I took it down and put it in my closet for about 3 years. I got over it but honestly I'm not sure I want to see his number retired. He doesn't feel like a part of the Clipper "family" if there even is one. That said I would be okay with it. His play certainly warrants it. I also think it makes sense to hold out for CP3 and Blake assuming things continue to go as they are for a few more years. Lawler will definitely be honored at Staples when he retires but that isn't really a jersey imo.

I think it would be a good idea to have a night where the team honor's the 05-06 team. I think the fans could have a poor reaction to Brand. If they did I think retiring his jersey would be a bad idea. If they have a good reaction then go for it.

Sadds The Gr8
08-29-2015, 05:03 PM
I don't know if 7 yrs (6 really, his last year he barely played) with 2 ASG's and limited playoff success is enough to get your jersey retired, especially if he left on bad terms.

Terrible franchises usually have low standards when it comes to retiring jerseys tho, so if I had to guess, I think they retire it.

JasonJohnHorn
08-29-2015, 05:33 PM
In my eyes, to be retired you either have had to sustain long-term excellence to the team, have helped them win, or do something very special.

in the case of the Clippers, his career stats might look decent, but that is because the bar is set low. The team traditionally had a high turnover rate with players, so very few (outside of Danny Manning) stayed longer than 4 or 5 years.

He also didn't accomplish much with the team. Yes, they made the playoffs, but all kinds of players help teams make the playoff and earn a couple of ASG appearances in the process.

I like Brand a lot. But I don't think he should get his number retired anywhere.

As for people complaining he bolted... Philly offered him more. LAC choose to spend their money on Baron Davis. That was a reasonable response for a player.

Chronz
08-29-2015, 07:09 PM
As for people complaining he bolted... Philly offered him more. LAC choose to spend their money on Baron Davis. That was a reasonable response for a player.

LOL, thats not what happened. Brand RECRUITED BD and when it came time to resign, left us high and dry.

CityofTreez
08-29-2015, 07:47 PM
If Vlade Divac has his number retired by Sac, Brand should get his retired. Why the hell did Sacramento do that anyways?

He's easily the best center the Kings ever possessed taking away what the future holds.
Vlade's arrival to Sacramento sparked our franchise success in those early days with us acquiring Webber, drafting Stojakovich, and trading for Bibby & Christie. Let's not forget our playoff match ups where it was either both us to go on and crush the Nets in that NBA Finals. He was instrumental to our success, which leads to my opinion that Elton Brand should get his jersey retired by the Clips. It's for the players/fans for those retired jerseys, not on career stats.

Teams have "Sixth Man" banners right beside retired jerseys....
IMO, Elton Brand gave the Clips the first belief in "hope" and therefore he should be rewarded with that petty accomplishment like a retired jersey.

D-Leethal
08-30-2015, 12:25 PM
Aren't his accomplishments historically petty?
I dunno, wats the standard for getting your jersey retired, surely easier than the HOF and the HOF is pretty easy. As a player, I think Brand was better than some HOF'ers but thats not really about how good of a player you were, rather how good your teammates were. That said, should it depend on the team and their history? Clips dont have much of a history, Im shocked we havent retired the only MVP we've ever had. Would retiring these guys diminish the franchise's cred?

No way the standards are less for jersey retires over HOF. How many jerseys are retired around the league? How many HOFers?

JasonJohnHorn
08-30-2015, 04:32 PM
LOL, thats not what happened. Brand RECRUITED BD and when it came time to resign, left us high and dry.

I remember reading interviews with him after and he'd said that Philly was giving him all they could; LAC wasn't willing to do the same. I've also never read anything about Brand recruiting Baron Davis. From the reports I read at the time, the Clippers wanted flexibility to build, so they asked Brand to opt out of his deal. He did, they sign Davis, Brand got a better deal and took it.

It seemed a lot like what happened with Boozer and the Cavs; the let him out of the contract early thinking they were going to sign him at a discount, then the Jazz dropped a huge offer on the table that the Cavs couldn't match. Not quite the same, but similar.

Reports varied a little. Other said the Clippers were surprised that Brand opted and brought Davis in thinking that would woo him, and it didn't.

I did hear that Brand wanted Davis on the team and was hoping to stay, but we hear that kind of talk coming out of players all the time.


Besides, they both made commitments during the moratorium, and both signed on the same day, so it's not like one happened and then the other happened. And at the end of the day, Brand did the Clippers a favor signing in Philly, because he was never the same after that.

Clippersfan86
08-30-2015, 06:03 PM
Not exactly. Initially Clippers offered less like most teams do to make cap room (See Draymond Green and now Tristan Thompson recently) and his agent was offended. Clippers then offered to match and he said no.

hugepatsfan
08-30-2015, 06:27 PM
What he did on the way out means no despite all the great he did IMO. At least when it comes to retiring his number. I think retiring numbers is as much about intangibles as it is performance though.

Clippersfan86
08-30-2015, 07:28 PM
What he did on the way out means no despite all the great he did IMO. At least when it comes to retiring his number. I think retiring numbers is as much about intangibles as it is performance though.

If he got us anywhere special, maybe it would matter but we made the playoffs twice in like 6 or 7 years and he only had one run past the first round. Jersey retirements are very sentimental things for a franchise, even one like the Clippers that has none.

spreadeagle
08-30-2015, 09:43 PM
yes, yall youngsters prob dont remember how nice Brand was back in the day

Chronz
08-31-2015, 04:42 PM
I remember reading interviews with him after and he'd said that Philly was giving him all they could; LAC wasn't willing to do the same. I've also never read anything about Brand recruiting Baron Davis. From the reports I read at the time, the Clippers wanted flexibility to build, so they asked Brand to opt out of his deal. He did, they sign Davis, Brand got a better deal and took it.

It seemed a lot like what happened with Boozer and the Cavs; the let him out of the contract early thinking they were going to sign him at a discount, then the Jazz dropped a huge offer on the table that the Cavs couldn't match. Not quite the same, but similar.

Reports varied a little. Other said the Clippers were surprised that Brand opted and brought Davis in thinking that would woo him, and it didn't.

I did hear that Brand wanted Davis on the team and was hoping to stay, but we hear that kind of talk coming out of players all the time.


Besides, they both made commitments during the moratorium, and both signed on the same day, so it's not like one happened and then the other happened. And at the end of the day, Brand did the Clippers a favor signing in Philly, because he was never the same after that.

LOL and you believe him? You're right we hear alot of BS from players, but what you cant deny is that those players were just as shocked, he led multiple teammates on that he and BD were gonna do damage. You're wrong about the Clippers wanting Brand to opt out, they actually wanted him to play out his contract and reevaluate where he was at afterwards (you know, cuz he was coming off an injury that ultimately derailed his career), when that didn't fly they began wooing Brand with an admittedly inferior deal, but it was one that was agreed upon. He went out of his way to recruit Baron (who himself had to opt out of a deal that would pay him more, when he could've just reupped with GS for more money than he settled for, again because Brand wooed him), its a he said she said but the facts dont support you IMO.

Boozer's was far more greedy than an outright betrayal, tough to say which is worse. Booz convinced the owner he would reup on a long term deal and he agreed because it would be to his benefit. Both sides knew he could leave the team high and dry cuz Cleveland couldn't match. Clips were prepared to match anything and were working alongside Brand to recruit other players, Brand led the team on for weeks, and then took a slightly better deal that the Clips were willing to match. He bolted anyways. You can believe the agent or the players/coaches who experienced it from a less biased pov.


No way the standards are less for jersey retires over HOF. How many jerseys are retired around the league? How many HOFers?

I look at it like this, how many in the HOF have had their jerseys retired, some by multiple teams. Pretty sure its impossible to find someone in the HOF who doesn't have a retired jersey. However, I think you can get your jersey retired yet never make the HOF.

mngopher35
08-31-2015, 05:26 PM
I would think no because of the way he left. He is probably borderline having his jersey retired and if he stayed there his whole career as a fan favorite I think that might have been enough to get it in the rafters.

JasonJohnHorn
08-31-2015, 10:44 PM
Boozer's was far more greedy than an outright betrayal, tough to say which is worse. Booz convinced the owner he would reup on a long term deal and he agreed because it would be to his benefit. Both sides knew he could leave the team high and dry cuz Cleveland couldn't match. Clips were prepared to match anything and were working alongside Brand to recruit other players, Brand led the team on for weeks, and then took a slightly better deal that the Clips were willing to match. He bolted anyways. You can believe the agent or the players/coaches who experienced it from a less biased pov.

The Cavs deserved to get burned on that, one for being stupid enough to fall for that, and two, for negotiating an illegal deal that would circumvent the salary cap. That was poor management.

As to what players did and said, it's no less likely that you can believe the owners than the players.

I remember speculation about BD going to LAC mid season, and people projecting what it would be like to have EB and BD together. I also remember BD stating that he'd prefer if Brand had stayed, but he came to LAC because it was where he wanted to be because he had producing interesting and projects going on and he wanted to be close at hand for them.

Again, the reports I read (and some conflicted) were that the Davis was signed as a means to woo Brand. I've never heard Davis say he was recruited by Brand, I've never heard Brand say he recruited Davis. Without documentation from either, it's hard to say what went down for sure, but from a national perspective, I don't remember people making a big deal out of that they way they did about DaJ this season. But it's always a bigger deal locally when a All-Star leaves in free agency, so I'm sure you heard a lot more rumours/details than I did living on the other side of the continent, so I'll defer to you on this one.

Clippersfan86
08-31-2015, 11:29 PM
The Cavs deserved to get burned on that, one for being stupid enough to fall for that, and two, for negotiating an illegal deal that would circumvent the salary cap. That was poor management.

As to what players did and said, it's no less likely that you can believe the owners than the players.

I remember speculation about BD going to LAC mid season, and people projecting what it would be like to have EB and BD together. I also remember BD stating that he'd prefer if Brand had stayed, but he came to LAC because it was where he wanted to be because he had producing interesting and projects going on and he wanted to be close at hand for them.

Again, the reports I read (and some conflicted) were that the Davis was signed as a means to woo Brand. I've never heard Davis say he was recruited by Brand, I've never heard Brand say he recruited Davis. Without documentation from either, it's hard to say what went down for sure, but from a national perspective, I don't remember people making a big deal out of that they way they did about DaJ this season. But it's always a bigger deal locally when a All-Star leaves in free agency, so I'm sure you heard a lot more rumours/details than I did living on the other side of the continent, so I'll defer to you on this one.

Thats because nobody paid attention to the Clippers back then.