2015 ATRD Archive Thread

[homestarunner93]

Board should be up-to-date right now. Been moving stuff all day so have mostly been on my phone.

[Ebbs]

Ty Law

[homestarunner93]

Time to get old: Triangles select OT/G Cal Hubbard

[killthesux]

Titans select G Mike Munchak

[The Long Shot]

Eh, I'll take 7th. I think once we get our QB, we'll be top 5 for sure.

[homestarunner93]

Cowboys request Larry Little, G

[homestarunner93]

Round 14

222. Canton Bulldogs - 4:15-4:30
223. Philadelphia Eagles - 4:30-5:00
224. Phil-Pitt Steagles - 5:00-5:30
225. Pottsville Maroons - 5:30-6:00
226. Baltimore Colts (via Wolverines) - 6:00-6:30
227. Dayton Triangles - 6:30-7:00
228. Minnesota Vikings (via Titans) - 7:00-7:30
229. Kansas City Cowboys - 7:30-8:00
230. Buffalo All-Americans - 8:00-8:30
231. Minnesota Vikings - 8:30-9:00
232. Decatur Staleys - 9:00-9:30
233. Miami Dolphins - 9:30-10:00
234. Los Angeles Raiders - 10:00-10:30
235. Providence Steam Roller - 10:30-11:00
236. New York Jets - 11:00-11:30
237. Duluth Eskimos - 11:30-12:00
238. Baltimore Colts - 8/02 AM 10:00-10:15

Round 15

239. Baltimore Colts - 10:15-10:30
240. Duluth Eskimos - 10:30-11:00
241. New York Jets - 11:00-11:30
242. Providence Steam Roller - 11:30-12:00
243. Los Angeles Raiders - PM 12:00-12:30
244. Pottsville Maroons (via Dolphins) - 12:30-1:00
245. Decatur Staleys - 1:00-1:30
246. Minnesota Vikings - 1:30-2:00
247. Buffalo All-Americans - 2:00-2:30
248. Kansas City Cowboys - 2:30-3:00
249. Tennessee Titans - 3:00-3:30
250. Dayton Triangles - 3:30-4:00
251. Detroit Wolverines - 4:00-4:30
252. Pottsville Maroons - 4:30-5:00
253. Phil-Pitt Steagles - 5:00-5:30
254. Philadelphia Eagles - 5:30-6:00
255. Canton Bulldogs - 6:00-6:15

[TDjacksonville]

Rickey Jackson Leo

[homestarunner93]

Rickey Jackson is a badass pick, but the LEO thing still cracks me up.

[The Long Shot]

Uhhhh...I guess Vikings select LB-Bill George.

[BCB mwat15]

Staleys select WR Bobby Mitchell

[The Jokemaker]

With the 199th pick, the Miami Dolphins again dip into their past and select middle linebacker Zach Thomas.

[warfelg]

Rickey Jackson is a badass pick, but the LEO thing still cracks me up.

Leo Leo hut hut LEO!!

[StriveGreatness]

LA Raiders will take Charlie Sanders

[homestarunner93]

SRs request Lenny Moore

[Andrei00]

Haloti Ngata, DL

[Wrench]

Jason Witten, TE

[homestarunner93]

Wolverines request Bill Willis and Elvin Bethea.

[Wrench]

Claude Humphrey, DE

[Andrei00]

Ronde Barber, CB

[AP=MVP]

Rollers take Larry Fitzgerald

[WildWesty]

Thanks Jokemaker for PRs! Glad someone took notice to my ridic offense as I usually fly under the radar in these.

[homestarunner93]

Thanks Jokemaker for PRs! Glad someone took notice to my ridic offense as I usually fly under the radar in these.

ur team sux and u shuld b embarrassed

[WildWesty]

Sorry friends, Hanford Dixon and Frank Minnifield

[WildWesty]

ur team sux and u shuld b embarrassed

Hey shuddup u ritard haha loser

Lol jk voat 4 me l8er

[WildWesty]

JUST TO LET YALL KNOW I forgot to put Antonio gates in my clubhouse so feel free to make PRs again and rank me super-first

[StriveGreatness]

LA Raiders will take Jackie Slater

[The Jokemaker]

With the 210th pick, the Miami Dolphins select hall of fame Art Donovan, Defensive Tackle.

[BCB mwat15]

Staleys select OT Willie Roaf

[TDjacksonville]

Vikings time slot passed at 12pm.

Aa's select HOF t ron Yary

[homestarunner93]

Cowboys request Harvey Martin

[homestarunner93]

Titans request Cliff Harris

[homestarunner93]

Triangles select "Bullet" Bob Hayes

[Wrench]

.

[homestarunner93]

mmmm Bullet Bob running under passes from that Favre cannon

[TDjacksonville]

Homie has my list

[Ebbs]

We want John Stallworth HOF WR, if he's still there.

[The Long Shot]

With our skipped pick, Vikings select our franchise quarterback in Dan Fouts.

[WildWesty]

Sorry friends, Hanford Dixon and Frank Minnifield

Can someone update the board with this plz

[homestarunner93]

Can someone update the board with this plz

done

[WildWesty]

Nvm me stupid

[Plague]

Think Maroons are skipped, if he's somehow still available Steagles want Troy Polamalu

Cowboys took Troy P in the 5th round.

[AP=MVP]

he is not

[WildWesty]

Alright Steagles will try Henry Jordan* if he is still available somehow

*changed from stautner and I can't wait till I have ctrl f again lol

[BDawk4Prez]

Kinard to eagles

[Plague]

Canton will take John Lynch

Other pick upcoming in a minute.

[Plague]

Cantons two picks are

S-John Lynch
G-Tom Mack

[warfelg]

Offensive End/Defensive end Red Badgro.

[BDawk4Prez]

Will shields - eagles

[WildWesty]

Let's go with Joe Thomas

[warfelg]

Joe Jacoby

[unleashthebeast]

The Colts will take the better version of John Lynch, from the 70's

"The Assassin" Jack Tatum, S

[homestarunner93]

Jim Taylor *****es

[Norm]

If Jim Brown never existed, Jim Taylor would probably go top 50 in this lol.

I think he would have lead the NFL in rushing like 6? years in a row.

[Wrench]

228. Minnesota Vikings (via Titans) - 7:00-7:30 - skipped, time is up
229. Kansas City Cowboys - 7:30-8:00 - OTC

[Wrench]

229. Kansas City Cowboys - 7:30-8:00 - Slot is up
230. Buffalo All-Americans - 8:00-8:30 - otc

[TDjacksonville]

Michael Irvin

[rawz]

Cowboys take Curtis martin

[AP=MVP]

Michael Irvin

lol

[The Long Shot]

Vikings take Bill Hewitt and Darren Woodson.

[BCB mwat15]

Staleys select RB/DB Harold "Red" Grange.

[The Jokemaker]

With the 233rd pick, the Miami Dolphins select hall of fame offensive tackle Lou Creekmur.

[StriveGreatness]

LA Raiders will take Isaac Bruce

[AP=MVP]

Rollers take HOF LB Les Richter

[Andrei00]

Walt Kiesling, G

[Wrench]

Reggie Wayne, WR

[Wrench]

Bob Brown, OT to UTB for his first pick.

[Wrench]

10 hours later UTB requests Gene Hickerson, OG

[Wrench]

Danny Fortmann, OG to my team

[Andrei00]

George McAfee, HB/DB

[AP=MVP]

Rollers -- Albert Lewis

[StriveGreatness]

LA Raiders will take Joe DeLamielleure

[SteelCurtain]

How the hell did I miss this?!?!?!

[TDjacksonville]

With the control f fail for Irvin I'll select Johnny Robinson db/wr/hb

[rawz]

list sent to homie

[warfelg]

Got a message at 1:00am I was up, so with my pick (and I can't believe he's available) the Maroons take WR Don Maynard.

[BCB mwat15]

Staleys select TE Jackie Smith

[The Long Shot]

Vikings select DE-Dwight Freeney.

[Ebbs]

Michael Irvin

:laugh: Steal

[TDjacksonville]

Adrian wilson

[rawz]

Tony boselli LT cowboys

[Wrench]

Jerome Bettis, RB to the Titans per request.

[homestarunner93]

Triangles select Jim Tyrer

[Plague]

I am unlikely to be on at 6 PM EST. If I am not available who is likely to be on at that time so I can send a list?

[The Long Shot]

I am unlikely to be on at 6 PM EST. If I am not available who is likely to be on at that time so I can send a list?

You can send it to me.

[Plague]

You can send it to me.

Thanks, if I have to leave before my pick I will send you my list....Thank you very much.

[Plague]

I wont be home so I sent my picks 2 homestarrunner and The long shot.

[Ebbs]

S, 1x DPOY, 1970's All Decade safety my main man Dick Anderson

[warfelg]

Maroons pick Mick Tingelhoff OC/OG

[Ebbs]

Most 100 yard receiving games in the post-season from 1960 until now:

Jerry Rice - 8.
Michael Irvin - 6.
Andre Reed - 5.
John Stallworth - 5.
Undrafted - 5.

Rice + Stallworth on one team . . .Good lord.

(Both on my team.)

[.Sean.]

Lol, I'm not mad. But it's a game. Half the fun is debating stuff.

I love that you did PR's. But the aim of the game is to convince people your team is the best lol.

No you're not allowed to defend your team in these anymore without being mad or an excessive homer. Shutup and draft, no discussion allowed.


How the hell did I miss this?!?!?!

Homestar arranged private signups in a conspiracy to prevent you from signing up so he'd actually have a chance

[The Jokemaker]

Irvin's 6 are more impressive given he did that in 16 games. Rice had 8 in 29 games

[The Long Shot]

Canton requests OT-Joe Stydahar and OT-Dan Dierdorf.

[warfelg]

I felt the need to balance this a bit so here is a defense only PR

1) Eagles - This team has a big time difference maker at each level, along with some good supporting players with that difference maker. Clearly a lot was invested in the D here to shut your offense down.

2) Maroons - Some older players where certain stats weren't kept, but the line is a good one. The secondary needs a ball hawking FS, but man, that's a tough group to complete a pass against. The run defense is nothing to snooze on either.

3) Vikings - I like this defense, but time to get some DT's. That pass rush can get there, but like another team, I feel as though I could argue running the ball a lot to not let them pin their ears back.

4) Dolphins - Nice balance here between run and pass defense. Still could use some parts added. Would be interesting to see 3-4 or 4-3 scheme because that front 7 can do either.

5) Eskimos - Like the team right above them. Nice balance. I think this is looking more like a 4-3 base team. Some ball hawks in the secondary.

6) Wolverines - Fits right between the two teams on either side. Good parts, flexibility, but it's not scary in any certain way.

7) Triangles - That's a nasty line. Some good players in the secondary too. Might be able to spread them and beat them if you truly need to.

8) Colts - Good players. Feel like if you are really well balanced you might have a very good chance.

9) Jets - Like with the Colts, if you stay balanced you could have a very good chance.

10) Steamrollers - I like this D and think it's going to be sneaky tough when it's all said and done. But that other CB spot needs to be filled, and the one that is filled isn't overly impressive.

11) Staleys - Steamrollers, Titans, Staleys are all about the same level of defense to me. They are solid, with some areas that will be problems, but not overly studly in one spot.

12) Titans - Thats a nice pass rush, underrated secondary. But it's going to take a thumper of a ILB and a stud NT to not convince someone of the ability to run on that defense.

13) Raiders - Invested a lot on defense at the expense of the defense. I think more modern players will her a little too. But it needs help at every level.

14) Bulldogs - Like the Raiders, lots of resources went to the offense, at the expense of the defense. I feel like at this point you could have your way.

15) Steagles - You can copy and past things from above into this slot.

16) All-Americans - The names are on offense, and the defense really has 2 game changers. Not loving this defense as I feel you can still move the ball on them.

17) Cowboys - I think this is incomplete because it's barely filled. Good players, but I only really see 2 players who can make a difference.

[warfelg]

Don Burroughs - FS

[WildWesty]

Future HOFer Julius Peppers please, also no need to skip as I have returned from vaca. Or at least if you skip me at least tell me

[The Long Shot]

Future HOFer Julius Peppers please, also no need to skip as I have returned from vaca. Or at least if you skip me at least tell me

Still have one more pick to make up.

[WildWesty]

So where does my defense suffer when I have two HOF LBs, a HOF DE, a future HOF DE, HOF DT, and arguably the greatest CB tandem in NFL history? Yeah also with a Dan Marino - Earl Campbell - Randy Moss - Steve Largent - Antonio Gates group of skill players blocked by Walter Jones, Mike Webster, and Joe Thomas. Just asking..

[WildWesty]

Jerry Kramer if he is still there

[Ebbs]

Taking my QB Kurt Warner

[Wrench]

So where does my defense suffer when I have two HOF LBs, a HOF DE, a future HOF DE, HOF DT, and arguably the greatest CB tandem in NFL history? Yeah also with a Dan Marino - Earl Campbell - Randy Moss - Steve Largent - Antonio Gates group of skill players blocked by Walter Jones, Mike Webster, and Joe Thomas. Just asking..

Uhh my entire D is in the Hall of fame.

[warfelg]

Uhh my entire D is in the Hall of fame.

Exactly. These D's all have HOF's :laugh:

[WildWesty]

Exactly. These D's all have HOF's :laugh:

Answer the question. Where does the D suffer?

[Norm]

No you're not allowed to defend your team in these anymore without being mad or an excessive homer. Shutup and draft, no discussion allowed.



Homestar arranged private signups in a conspiracy to prevent you from signing up so he'd actually have a chance
I actually posted a link in every team forum that was active when we were short. I just assumed he didn't use PSD anymore. Should have asked him directly.

[Ebbs]

I realize I'm rosterbating and that will piss you guys off. But I feel like Warner is received real hot and cold in this game and really shouldn't be. . .

The obvious, I gave him Jerry Rice, John Stallworth, Marshall Faulk and the best O-line in the game.

Facts:
6th all time in playoff TD's.

8th in playoff completion %.
- Minimum 150 passes attempted in the post-season he has the highest completion %. . .
(Him, Ryan, Undrafted, Undrafted, Rodgers) If you're curious.

7th in playoff passing yards (Brady, Manning, Favre, Montana, Marino, and Elway the only QB's higher, and none of them have as high of a completion %.)

2X MVP. . . (One of only 8 QB's to win 2+ MVP's.)

I knew he'd fall but I wanted him from the moment I drafted Faulk. Easy to sell chemistry, I've brought the Greatest Show on Turf to an all new level. . . He's a modern QB playing in a system he's comfortable in, with upgraded talent.

I saw some Warner hate in the chatzy so I figured I'd get ahead of Homestar and whoever.

[The Long Shot]

Here's how many Hall of Famers are on each team's defense:

homie/Norm: 8
Wrench: 8
AP: 7
BCB: 7
jokemaker: 7
TLS: 7
warfelg: 7
tdj: 6
utb: 6
BDawk: 5
ebbs: 5
kts: 4
Plague: 4
rawz: 4
Strive: 4
WildWesty: 4

Your defense is nothing special, dude. At least not in this.

[Ebbs]

That's interesting but HOF is one of a 100 things to hang your hat on in this.

[warfelg]

I got 4 players from the 20/30/40's. All are two way players. If you need one let me know.

[The Long Shot]

If I'm not mistaken, this is what the time-slots should look like for the next 5 rounds. Just posting this for everyone to use as a reference until homestar can post the official time-slots.

Round 16

256. Canton Bulldogs - 6:15-6:30
257. Philadelphia Eagles - 6:30-7:00
258. Phil-Pitt Steagles - 7:00-7:30
258. Pottsville Maroons - 7:30-8:00
260. Detroit Wolverines - 8:00-8:30
261. Dayton Triangles - 8:30-9:00
262. Tennessee Titans - 9:00-9:30
263. Kansas City Cowboys - 9:30-10:00
264. Buffalo All-Americans - 10:00-10:30
265. Minnesota Vikings - 10:30-11:00
266. Decatur Staleys - 11:00-11:30
267. Miami Dolphins - 11:30-12:00
268. Los Angeles Raiders - 8/03 AM 10:00-10:30
269. Providence Steam Roller - 10:30-11:00
270. New York Jets - 11:00-11:30
271. Duluth Eskimos - 11:30-12:00
272. Baltimore Colts - PM 12:00-12:15

Round 17

273. Baltimore Colts - 12:15-12:30
274. Duluth Eskimos - 12:30-1:00
275. New York Jets - 1:00-1:30
276. Providence Steam Roller - 1:30-2:00
277. Los Angeles Raiders - 2:00-2:30
278. Miami Dolphins - 2:30-3:00
279. Decatur Staleys - 3:00-3:30
280. Minnesota Vikings - 3:30-4:00
281. Buffalo All-Americans - 4:00-4:30
282. Kansas City Cowboys - 4:30-5:00
283. Tennessee Titans - 5:00-5:30
284. Dayton Triangles - 5:30-6:00
285. Detroit Wolverines - 6:00-6:30
286. Pottsville Maroons - 6:30-7:00
287. Phil-Pitt Steagles - 7:00-7:30
288. Philadelphia Eagles - 7:30-8:00
289. Canton Bulldogs - 8:00-8:15

Round 18

290. Canton Bulldogs - 8:15-8:30
291. Philadelphia Eagles - 8:30-9:00
292. Phil-Pitt Steagles - 9:00-9:30
293. Pottsville Maroons - 9:30-10:00
294. Detroit Wolverines - 10:00-10:30
295. Dayton Triangles - 10:30-11:00
296. Tennessee Titans - 11:00-11:30
297. Kansas City Cowboys - 11:30-12:00
298. Buffalo All-Americans - 8/04 AM 10:00-10:30
299. Tennessee Titans (via Vikings) - 10:30-11:00
300. Decatur Staleys - 11:00-11:30
301. Miami Dolphins - 11:30-12:00
302. Los Angeles Raiders - PM 12:00-12:30
303. Providence Steam Roller - 12:30-1:00
304. New York Jets - 1:00-1:30
305. Duluth Eskimos - 1:30-2:00
306. Baltimore Colts - 2:00-2:15

Round 19

307. Baltimore Colts - 2:15-2:30
308. Duluth Eskimos - 2:30-3:00
309. New York Jets - 3:00-3:30
310. Providence Steam Roller - 3:30-4:00
311. Los Angeles Raiders - 4:00-4:30
312. Miami Dolphins - 4:30-5:00
313. Decatur Staleys - 5:00-5:30
314. Minnesota Vikings - 5:30-6:00
315. Buffalo All-Americans - 6:00-6:30
316. Kansas City Cowboys - 6:30-7:00
317. Tennessee Titans - 7:00-7:30
318. Dayton Triangles - 7:30-8:00
319. Detroit Wolverines - 8:00-8:30
320. Pottsville Maroons - 8:30-9:00
321. Phil-Pitt Steagles - 9:00-9:30
322. Philadelphia Eagles - 9:30-10:00
323. Canton Bulldogs - 10:00-10:15

Round 20

324. Canton Bulldogs - 10:15-10:30
325. Philadelphia Eagles - 10:30-11:00
326. Phil-Pitt Steagles - 11:00-11:30
327. Pottsville Maroons - 11:30-12:00
328. Detroit Wolverines - 8/05 AM 10:00-10:30
329. Dayton Triangles - 10:30-11:00
330. Tennessee Titans - 11:00-11:30
331. Kansas City Cowboys - 11:30-12:00
332. Buffalo All-Americans - PM 12:00-12:30
333. Minnesota Vikings - 12:30-1:00
334. Decatur Staleys - 1:00-1:30
335. Miami Dolphins - 1:30-2:00
336. Los Angeles Raiders - 2:00-2:30
337. Providence Steam Roller - 2:30-3:00
338. New York Jets - 3:00-3:30
339. Duluth Eskimos - 3:30-4:00
340. Baltimore Colts - 4:00-4:30

[BDawk4Prez]

George papa bear Halas

[Andrei00]

Here's how many Hall of Famers are on each team's defense:

homie/Norm: 8
Wrench: 8
AP: 7
BCB: 7
jokemaker: 7
TLS: 7
warfelg: 7
tdj: 6
utb: 6
BDawk: 5
ebbs: 5
kts: 4
Plague: 4
rawz: 4
Strive: 4
WildWesty: 4

Your defense is nothing special, dude. At least not in this.

Me and Quinn also have two, in case anyone's interested. :sigh:

[WildWesty]

Here's how many Hall of Famers are on each team's defense:

homie/Norm: 8
Wrench: 8
AP: 7
BCB: 7
jokemaker: 7
TLS: 7
warfelg: 7
tdj: 6
utb: 6
BDawk: 5
ebbs: 5
kts: 4
Plague: 4
rawz: 4
Strive: 4
WildWesty: 4

Your defense is nothing special, dude. At least not in this.

Ebbs hinted at it I think (and maybe I poorly placed my argument) but if the HOF is your argument then you're ignoring a lot of what the process is. The way I have built my team is by grabbing the best players that I felt were available (part of the reason my dumb *** kept picking guys that were already taken) and I ended up with a lot of stud O guys early: Marino, Moss, Campbell, Jones, etc. Defense definitely came after, but there is no reason to say I suffered at all when you consider who I was able to grab, and if you're willing to discount Frank Minnifield and Hanford Dixon for not being in the HOF then you are willing to discount a very significant part in NFL history, and if that's the reason that costs me your vote then I'm cool with it. I'm just not picking my players based off of who I find in the HOF website, and who's available, but rather who I find would make my team the best in this hypothetical game.

And wrench I saw your comment and wanted to look at your team and bash but I couldn't, you and your ****ing knack for finding great players lol

[Wrench]

257. Philadelphia Eagles - 6:30-7:00 - no pick
258. Phil-Pitt Steagles - 7:00-7:30 - Jerry Kramer
258. Pottsville Maroons - 7:30-8:00 - Don Burroughs
260. Detroit Wolverines - 8:00-8:30 - Kurt Warner
261. Dayton Triangles - 8:30-9:00 - no pick
262. Tennessee Titans - 9:00-9:30 - OTC
263. Kansas City Cowboys - 9:30-10:00
264. Buffalo All-Americans - 10:00-10:30
265. Minnesota Vikings - 10:30-11:00
266. Decatur Staleys - 11:00-11:30
267. Miami Dolphins - 11:30-12:00

[WildWesty]

258. Phil-Pitt Steagles - 7:00-7:30 - No pick
258. Pottsville Maroons - 7:30-8:00 - Don Burroughs
260. Detroit Wolverines - 8:00-8:30 - Kurt Warner
261. Dayton Triangles - 8:30-9:00 - no pick
262. Tennessee Titans - 9:00-9:30 - OTC
263. Kansas City Cowboys - 9:30-10:00
264. Buffalo All-Americans - 10:00-10:30
265. Minnesota Vikings - 10:30-11:00
266. Decatur Staleys - 11:00-11:30
267. Miami Dolphins - 11:30-12:00

Jerry Kramer for Steagles

[Norm]

Triangles skipped pick is Jim Langer, C

[Plague]

These are the players who have been picked since the list was last updated. I would of listed them by team but very few people include their team name in the posts with their pick

Jim Tyrer
Dick Anderson
Jim Langer
Joe Strydahar
Dan Dierdorf
Jerry Kramer
George Halas
Kurt Warner
Julius Peppers
Don Burroughs
Mick Tingelhoff
Bob St Clair
George Trafton
Alex Karras

[killthesux]

Titans pick Bob St Clair

[BDawk4Prez]

Wait, teams will be judged on numbers of HOF players?

How dumb.

[Wrench]

Wait, teams will be judged on numbers of HOF players?

How dumb.

No. But Westy was trying to point out he had all these HoFers on his team, when he doesn't have many at all.

[BDawk4Prez]

George Trafton - Eagles

[warfelg]

Fine I'll go through:
You have three DL listed. I like all of them, but in a game about all time greats, it leaves me kinda meh. Deam was a fringe HOF type in my mind. He's behind some of the top sack guys. Henry Jordan is a very fine player, but I feel as though you could have had many other better players in there at this point. Julius Peppers, most the time from I've seen in this, is a backup. Peppers is good, but I don't consider him an all time great yet.

Huff I love so I can't knock that pick.

Chris Hanburger, just doesn't move the needle very much for me. Solid guy, but eh. Like Jordan and Peppers, I feel like he is usually a backup in this game.

Your secondary. I think game teammates can be a blessing and a curse. The blessing is you can say how good they were together. The curse is people look at that teammate thing, and say they were like that because they rarely faced two great WR's at the same time. One of them ended up on a decidedly average for the time WR 95% of the time.

I don't hate your D. I just think as far as the players and the setup of the other D's in the game, it falls a little behind. You need 2 safties, a run stuffing DL, a cover LB, a nickle....there's still a lot to be addressed on your team.

[homestarunner93]

How the hell did I miss this?!?!?!

I tried to drag out the process as much as I could. :(

[homestarunner93]

Sorry guys, big moving day today. I'm whipped. If I can't update everything tonight, I will tomorrow. Thanks for doing the time slots, TLS.

[homestarunner93]

7th best defense hahahahaha. That's rich. And wrong.

[warfelg]

Wait, teams will be judged on numbers of HOF players?

How dumb.

What Wrench said and how it was mentioned that some go to the HOF site and pick players off of that. Which couldn't be further from the truth.

[The Long Shot]

Sorry guys, big moving day today. I'm whipped. If I can't update everything tonight, I will tomorrow. Thanks for doing the time slots, TLS.

No problem. If you need the remainder of the time slots updated for some reason, let me know.

[The Long Shot]

Cowboys and All-Americans have both been skipped.

Vikings select DT-Alex Karras.

[rawz]

cowboys take sam adams, dt

[BDawk4Prez]

7th best defense hahahahaha. That's rich. And wrong.

In the words of Nelly, I am number 1.

[homestarunner93]

In the words of Nelly, I am number 1.

lol, not in actuality though

[BCB mwat15]

Staleys select OG Russ Grimm

[The Jokemaker]

With pick 267, the Miami Dolphins select Stan Jones, offensive guard.

[BDawk4Prez]

lol, not in actuality though

I won't argue our teams being 1/2 in D rankings.

[BDawk4Prez]

I got 4 players from the 20/30/40's. All are two way players. If you need one let me know.
Yep.

[StriveGreatness]

LA Raiders will take Ken Riley

[AP=MVP]

Rollers - Everson Walls

[Andrei00]

Neil Smith, DE

[Plague]

My mistake

[Wrench]

Billy Shaw, OG

[TDjacksonville]

Tom fears for aa

[unleashthebeast]

The colts want:

CB Louis Wright

and HOF WR Charley Taylor

[Wrench]

Mike McCormack, OT

[Andrei00]

my bad

[Andrei00]

Todd Christensen, TE

[StriveGreatness]

Steam Roller requests Rayfield Wright

[StriveGreatness]

LA Raiders will take Johnny "Blood" McNally

[The Jokemaker]

With the 278th pick, the Miami Dolphins complete their secondary with the selection of the Torpedo, Donnie Shell, S.

[Wrench]

An update to where we are

281. Buffalo All-Americans - 4:00-4:30
282. Kansas City Cowboys - 4:30-5:00
283. Tennessee Titans - 5:00-5:30
284. Dayton Triangles - 5:30-6:00
285. Detroit Wolverines - 6:00-6:30
286. Pottsville Maroons - 6:30-7:00
287. Phil-Pitt Steagles - 7:00-7:30
288. Philadelphia Eagles - 7:30-8:00
289. Canton Bulldogs - 8:00-8:15

Round 18

290. Canton Bulldogs - 8:15-8:30
291. Philadelphia Eagles - 8:30-9:00
292. Phil-Pitt Steagles - 9:00-9:30
293. Pottsville Maroons - 9:30-10:00
294. Detroit Wolverines - 10:00-10:30
295. Dayton Triangles - 10:30-11:00
296. Tennessee Titans - 11:00-11:30
297. Kansas City Cowboys - 11:30-12:00
298. Buffalo All-Americans - 8/04 AM 10:00-10:30
299. Tennessee Titans (via Vikings) - 10:30-11:00
300. Decatur Staleys - 11:00-11:30
301. Miami Dolphins - 11:30-12:00
302. Los Angeles Raiders - PM 12:00-12:30
303. Providence Steam Roller - 12:30-1:00
304. New York Jets - 1:00-1:30
305. Duluth Eskimos - 1:30-2:00
306. Baltimore Colts - 2:00-2:15

Round 19

307. Baltimore Colts - 2:15-2:30
308. Duluth Eskimos - 2:30-3:00
309. New York Jets - 3:00-3:30
310. Providence Steam Roller - 3:30-4:00
311. Los Angeles Raiders - 4:00-4:30
312. Miami Dolphins - 4:30-5:00
313. Decatur Staleys - 5:00-5:30
314. Minnesota Vikings - 5:30-6:00
315. Buffalo All-Americans - 6:00-6:30
316. Kansas City Cowboys - 6:30-7:00
317. Tennessee Titans - 7:00-7:30
318. Dayton Triangles - 7:30-8:00
319. Detroit Wolverines - 8:00-8:30
320. Pottsville Maroons - 8:30-9:00
321. Phil-Pitt Steagles - 9:00-9:30
322. Philadelphia Eagles - 9:30-10:00
323. Canton Bulldogs - 10:00-10:15

Round 20

324. Canton Bulldogs - 10:15-10:30
325. Philadelphia Eagles - 10:30-11:00
326. Phil-Pitt Steagles - 11:00-11:30
327. Pottsville Maroons - 11:30-12:00
328. Detroit Wolverines - 8/05 AM 10:00-10:30
329. Dayton Triangles - 10:30-11:00
330. Tennessee Titans - 11:00-11:30
331. Kansas City Cowboys - 11:30-12:00
332. Buffalo All-Americans - PM 12:00-12:30
333. Minnesota Vikings - 12:30-1:00
334. Decatur Staleys - 1:00-1:30
335. Miami Dolphins - 1:30-2:00
336. Los Angeles Raiders - 2:00-2:30
337. Providence Steam Roller - 2:30-3:00
338. New York Jets - 3:00-3:30
339. Duluth Eskimos - 3:30-4:00
340. Baltimore Colts - 4:00-4:30

[BCB mwat15]

Staleys select OG George Musso

[The Long Shot]

Vikings select OT-Gary Zimmerman.

[Plague]

I won't be deciding who has the best team by the number of Hall Of Fame members. The Hall Of Fame is subjective and filled with politics just like my opinion minus the politics. I am going to pick the best teams based on how I think that team would actually perform with the mix of players that is currently on that team.

[homestarunner93]

Round 16

256. Canton Bulldogs - 6:15-6:30
257. Philadelphia Eagles - 6:30-7:00
258. Phil-Pitt Steagles - 7:00-7:30
258. Pottsville Maroons - 7:30-8:00
260. Detroit Wolverines - 8:00-8:30
261. Dayton Triangles - 8:30-9:00
262. Tennessee Titans - 9:00-9:30
263. Kansas City Cowboys - 9:30-10:00
264. Buffalo All-Americans - 10:00-10:30
265. Minnesota Vikings - 10:30-11:00
266. Decatur Staleys - 11:00-11:30
267. Miami Dolphins - 11:30-12:00
268. Los Angeles Raiders - 8/03 AM 10:00-10:30
269. Providence Steam Roller - 10:30-11:00
270. New York Jets - 11:00-11:30
271. Duluth Eskimos - 11:30-12:00
272. Baltimore Colts - PM 12:00-12:15

Round 17

273. Baltimore Colts - 12:15-12:30
274. Duluth Eskimos - 12:30-1:00
275. New York Jets - 1:00-1:30
276. Providence Steam Roller - 1:30-2:00
277. Los Angeles Raiders - 2:00-2:30
278. Miami Dolphins - 2:30-3:00
279. Decatur Staleys - 3:00-3:30
280. Minnesota Vikings - 3:30-4:00
281. Buffalo All-Americans - 4:00-4:30
282. Kansas City Cowboys - 4:30-5:00
283. Tennessee Titans - 5:00-5:30
284. Dayton Triangles - 5:30-6:00
285. Detroit Wolverines - 6:00-6:30
286. Pottsville Maroons - 6:30-7:00
287. Phil-Pitt Steagles - 7:00-7:30
288. Philadelphia Eagles - 7:30-8:00
289. Canton Bulldogs - 8:00-8:15

Round 18

290. Canton Bulldogs - 8:15-8:30
291. Philadelphia Eagles - 8:30-9:00
292. Phil-Pitt Steagles - 9:00-9:30
293. Pottsville Maroons - 9:30-10:00
294. Detroit Wolverines - 10:00-10:30
295. Dayton Triangles - 10:30-11:00
296. Tennessee Titans - 11:00-11:30
297. Kansas City Cowboys - 11:30-12:00
298. Buffalo All-Americans - 8/04 AM 10:00-10:30
299. Tennessee Titans (via Vikings) - 10:30-11:00
300. Decatur Staleys - 11:00-11:30
301. Miami Dolphins - 11:30-12:00
302. Los Angeles Raiders - PM 12:00-12:30
303. Providence Steam Roller - 12:30-1:00
304. New York Jets - 1:00-1:30
305. Duluth Eskimos - 1:30-2:00
306. Baltimore Colts - 2:00-2:15

Round 19

307. Baltimore Colts - 2:15-2:30
308. Duluth Eskimos - 2:30-3:00
309. New York Jets - 3:00-3:30
310. Providence Steam Roller - 3:30-4:00
311. Los Angeles Raiders - 4:00-4:30
312. Miami Dolphins - 4:30-5:00
313. Decatur Staleys - 5:00-5:30
314. Minnesota Vikings - 5:30-6:00
315. Buffalo All-Americans - 6:00-6:30
316. Kansas City Cowboys - 6:30-7:00
317. Tennessee Titans - 7:00-7:30
318. Dayton Triangles - 7:30-8:00
319. Detroit Wolverines - 8:00-8:30
320. Pottsville Maroons - 8:30-9:00
321. Phil-Pitt Steagles - 9:00-9:30
322. Philadelphia Eagles - 9:30-10:00
323. Canton Bulldogs - 10:00-10:15

Round 20

324. Canton Bulldogs - 10:15-10:30
325. Philadelphia Eagles - 10:30-11:00
326. Phil-Pitt Steagles - 11:00-11:30
327. Pottsville Maroons - 11:30-12:00
328. Detroit Wolverines - 8/05 AM 10:00-10:30
329. Dayton Triangles - 10:30-11:00
330. Tennessee Titans - 11:00-11:30
331. Kansas City Cowboys - 11:30-12:00
332. Buffalo All-Americans - PM 12:00-12:30
333. Minnesota Vikings - 12:30-1:00
334. Decatur Staleys - 1:00-1:30
335. Miami Dolphins - 1:30-2:00
336. Los Angeles Raiders - 2:00-2:30
337. Providence Steam Roller - 2:30-3:00
338. New York Jets - 3:00-3:30
339. Duluth Eskimos - 3:30-4:00
340. Baltimore Colts - 4:00-4:30

[TDjacksonville]

Aa LaDainian Tomlinson

[homestarunner93]

Aa LaDainian Tomlinson

hahahahahahahahahahahaha

[Ebbs]

Aa LaDainian Tomlinson

Irvin and LT? You're a freaky impressive finding these steals.

[Wrench]

Cowboys request

William "The refrigerator" Perry, DT

[Wrench]

Titans request

Eddie Meador, S

[homestarunner93]

Triangles select Dave Robinson

[TDjacksonville]

Aa's select Kevin williams

[BDawk4Prez]

I won't be deciding who has the best team by the number of Hall Of Fame members. The Hall Of Fame is subjective and filled with politics just like my opinion minus the politics. I am going to pick the best teams based on how I think that team would actually perform with the mix of players that is currently on that team.

Someone understands.

[homestarunner93]

Someone understands.

LOL

This isn't baseball. The PFHOF is not as overtly political as the NBHOF. Being in the Hall of Fame does, and should, matter. The media who saw these guys obviously thought they were among the greats in their time. Are there snubs? Sure. Are there guys who probably shouldn't be in, especially in the earlier years of the game? Probably. But who are we to say so? We didn't watch them. All we can do is read about them, maybe see a highlight here or there on youtube for a lot of these guys. You can learn a ton by doing the research, but there is only so much information out there on these players.

To completely discount whether or not someone is in the HoF is patently stupid.

[Ebbs]

Dick Barwegen I.e. all 1950's G to Wolverines

[Ebbs]

Like I said earlier, it's a good accolade to hang your hat on but it isn't the only one.

[homestarunner93]

Like I said earlier, it's a good accolade to hang your hat on but it isn't the only one.

Right, but when a guy isn't in, you have to ask why. What was the short-coming in his game? Or was he simply in an era where there were more dominant players at his position?

[Plague]

Sent my picks to homestar

[warfelg]

Maroons select Richard Seymore DT

[BDawk4Prez]

Then why not just do a HOF redraft?

[warfelg]

Right, but when a guy isn't in, you have to ask why. What was the short-coming in his game? Or was he simply in an era where there were more dominant players at his position?

It takes a little research to figure that out, but not too much to be honest. And in same eras less dominating players got in because of lack of quality at their position.

I'll agree that HOF isn't the only measuring stick. But it's a good one to start with.

[homestarunner93]

Then why not just do a HOF redraft?

Because there aren't enough players to fill out but a few teams? You'd only have enough OLs for 11 teams. There are only 8 modern TEs in the Hall and another few pre-modern "ends" that you could call TEs.

Sorry that you made bad picks drafting guys that have half-completed primes. Their careers should continue to be judged for what they are right now, not what they will be if they stay healthy and on their current trajectory.

[The Long Shot]

I'm curious to know who said that being a Hall of Famer is the only thing that matters. Westy was bragging about his defense and pointing out the Hall of Famers on it, and a few people pointed out that every defense in this has Hall of Famers. I tallied up all of the Hall of Famers on each defense (besides the Jets; sorry for forgetting you guys) and Westy's was tied for dead last. I just found it amusing, that's all.

[homestarunner93]

I'm curious to know who said that being a Hall of Famer is the only thing that matters. Westy was bragging about his defense and pointing out the Hall of Famers on it, and a few people pointed out that every defense in this has Hall of Famers. I tallied up all of the Hall of Famers on each defense (besides the Jets; sorry for forgetting you guys) and Westy's was tied for dead last. I just found it amusing, that's all.

No one. BDawk is just nervous about how people are going to judge Revis, Watt, Gronk, etc.

[WildWesty]

If he's still there we'll take Joe Perry FB

[WildWesty]

No. But Westy was trying to point out he had all these HoFers on his team, when he doesn't have many at all.


Westy was bragging about his defense and pointing out the Hall of Famers on it, and a few people pointed out that every defense in this has Hall of Famers.



Ebbs hinted at it I think (and maybe I poorly placed my argument) but if the HOF is your argument then you're ignoring a lot of what the process is.

...

I'm just not picking my players based off of who I find in the HOF website, and who's available, but rather who I find would make my team the best in this hypothetical game.

Reading comprehension. And go back and read my first post, never did I say I have "all these HOFers" nor was I trying to imply that the HOF tag alone means all. I said my D didn't suffer because I started with offense, that's the damn point. I even mentioned my two non HOF players, lol. I'm not trying to attack anyone else's team, either, I'm just defending mine.

And I'm somewhere in the middle with this HOF argument. I think it totally matters, but you'd be sorely mistaken if you think players don't sometimes get screwed by non-football circumstance. Look at all the AFL guys that were getting screwed by NFL bias, or how long Derrick Thomas had to wait.

[warfelg]

So where does my defense suffer when I have two HOF LBs, a HOF DE, a future HOF DE, HOF DT, and arguably the greatest CB tandem in NFL history? Yeah also with a Dan Marino - Earl Campbell - Randy Moss - Steve Largent - Antonio Gates group of skill players blocked by Walter Jones, Mike Webster, and Joe Thomas. Just asking..

This is the original jumping point. You asked where you defense suffers then go on to list your HOFers and talk about your offense when my PRs were defense only.

[Wrench]

Reading comprehension. And go back and read my first post, never did I say I have "all these HOFers" nor was I trying to imply that the HOF tag alone means all. I said my D didn't suffer because I started with offense, that's the damn point. I even mentioned my two non HOF players, lol. I'm not trying to attack anyone else's team, either, I'm just defending mine.

And I'm somewhere in the middle with this HOF argument. I think it totally matters, but you'd be sorely mistaken if you think players don't sometimes get screwed by non-football circumstance. Look at all the AFL guys that were getting screwed by NFL bias, or how long Derrick Thomas had to wait.





So where does my defense suffer when I have two HOF LBs, a HOF DE, a future HOF DE, HOF DT, and arguably the greatest CB tandem in NFL history? Yeah also with a Dan Marino - Earl Campbell - Randy Moss - Steve Largent - Antonio Gates group of skill players blocked by Walter Jones, Mike Webster, and Joe Thomas. Just asking..

Your main argument was that you had all of this HOF talent on your D, thats where all of this HOF talk started.

[homestarunner93]

oops disregard

[warfelg]

To which I quipped (I forget if in chatzy or here) that every team is mostly HOFers and that talking about them as if it's something your team should be ranked higher on is useless.

Edit:
Add to it look at my D. It's almost filled out and all but two guys are in the HOF and one of the two that isn't has a strong possibility of getting in.

[WildWesty]

This is the original jumping point. You asked where you defense suffers then go on to list your HOFers and talk about your offense when my PRs were defense only.

Your PRs were just defense? God damnit I'm stupid, my bad war

[warfelg]

Your PRs were just defense? God damnit I'm stupid, my bad war

I kinda put that right at the start....

[WildWesty]

Your main argument was that you had all of this HOF talent on your D, thats where all of this HOF talk started.

Which is why I clarified in the second post that it wasn't my main argument, I even admitted the way I put it was poor

[WildWesty]

I kinda put that right at the start....

I usually just skip to wherever I'm ranked tbh

[Ebbs]

lol

[BDawk4Prez]

Me, nervous? Not at all.

[homestarunner93]

BDawk wants Dante Lavelli

[homestarunner93]

Bulldogs request Terrell Suggs. Will have to make their second pick.

[Plague]

Canton takes terrell suggs and pat swilling. If either is gone skip my pick and I will pick later

[homestarunner93]

Eagles request Tuffy Leemans

[Norm]

Here's how many Hall of Famers are on each team's defense:

homie/Norm: 8
Wrench: 8
AP: 7
BCB: 7
jokemaker: 7
TLS: 7
warfelg: 7
tdj: 6
utb: 6
BDawk: 5
ebbs: 5
kts: 4
Plague: 4
rawz: 4
Strive: 4
WildWesty: 4

Your defense is nothing special, dude. At least not in this.

Don't worry. We suck

[Norm]

This is why roster baiting and PRS are dumb. It makes everyone behave like 8 year olds and like any of this matters lol.

It should be fun not frustrating and full of cat fighting

[WildWesty]

If he is still there I'd like Tommy McDonald

[warfelg]

Maroons take LC Greenwood DE

[warfelg]

This is why roster baiting and PRS are dumb. It makes everyone behave like 8 year olds and like any of this matters lol.

It should be fun not frustrating and full of cat fighting

I think PR's should be more of a way to understand how other people see your team and use it as a little advice.

[warfelg]

I think PR's should be more of a way to understand how other people see your team and use it as a little advice.

[rawz]

i gleefully logged on to psd, and when i saw power rankings, i got giddy.. anticipation killed me and i clicked on the link... i looked, and scrolled way down to the bottom.....

i told my wife, and kids i had to leave... i couldn't stop the tears... it looked like it was storming, the rain wouldn't stop. i couldn't even drive away.... couldn't see... i looked in my rear view mirror and shouted at myself.. "your stupid rawz.. your dumb. you thought you had a championship team?! you idiot!! NOBODY LIKES YOUR TEAM, IT SUCKS. YOU MORON" then i realized, i hadn't updated my clubhouse, hoped creeped in, and i rejoiced. i opened my car, and it wasn't raining, it was sunshine. ( the rain was actually my tears)

i live again...

[Ebbs]

Patrick Willis

[Norm]

I think PR's should be more of a way to understand how other people see your team and use it as a little advice.


Even if my PMs are full, it still posts. YOu don't have to unquote me and do it again or anything.

[warfelg]

i gleefully logged on to psd, and when i saw power rankings, i got giddy.. anticipation killed me and i clicked on the link... i looked, and scrolled way down to the bottom.....

i told my wife, and kids i had to leave... i couldn't stop the tears... it looked like it was storming, the rain wouldn't stop. i couldn't even drive away.... couldn't see... i looked in my rear view mirror and shouted at myself.. "your stupid rawz.. your dumb. you thought you had a championship team?! you idiot!! NOBODY LIKES YOUR TEAM, IT SUCKS. YOU MORON" then i realized, i hadn't updated my clubhouse, hoped creeped in, and i rejoiced. i opened my car, and it wasn't raining, it was sunshine. ( the rain was actually my tears)

i live again...

lol I love this post.

[Ebbs]

J.J. Watt = Round 7

Patrick Willis = Round 18.

Patrick Willis > J.J. Watt for this game comftorably.

Ebbs > Bdawk

Cowboys > Eagles.

A simple formula really.

[Norm]

J.J. Watt = Round 7

Patrick Willis = Round 18.

Patrick Willis > J.J. Watt for this game comftorably.

Ebbs > Bdawk

Cowboys > Eagles.

A simple formula really.

I kind of don't agree.

But I don't want to get into it.

I guess I'm pretty convinced barring death, and even that wouldn't matter. Watt is the better player. Watt has shown himself not to be a fluke and has been the best player on defense how long?

But there's the trap of "active guys in the decline"

the worse they get, the more they drop. Which is dumb. Career is already set with him.

[Ebbs]

J.J. Watt has been the best defensive player for 2 of the last 3 years? 3x first team All-Pro.

Willis was the best at his position 4 or 5 x. 5x first team all pro.

Watt plays a more important position but when I draft Willis 11 rounds later that's an insta win.

Also wtf are you doing biting on bait I left for Bdawk.

[Norm]

Jimmy Graham, TE

[killthesux]

Titans select DT Ndamukong Suh

[rawz]

cowboys take, warren moon, qb

[homestarunner93]

Watt is not better than P-Will in this. lol

[Ebbs]

Watt is not better than P-Will in this. lol

Bookmarked. Saved forever. Screen shot.

Homie + Ebbs vs. the world.

[warfelg]

Here's the thing IMO:
Willis just had a sad and abrupt ending to his career. Watt is dominating currently, so it's something in the forefront of our minds.

While a agree Willis>Watt right now....it's not that big to be honest.

[warfelg]

Here's the thing IMO:
Willis just had a sad and abrupt ending to his career. Watt is dominating currently, so it's something in the forefront of our minds.

While a agree Willis>Watt right now....it's not that big to be honest.

[Norm]

Here's the thing IMO:
Willis just had a sad and abrupt ending to his career. Watt is dominating currently, so it's something in the forefront of our minds.

While a agree Willis>Watt right now....it's not that big to be honest.

It's all how you view it. Better career>>> doesn't always win, for me.

Willis to Watt is probably closer than I intimated but considering Watt's position and what he does to teams in this era. It's pretty nuts. He'll go down, barring steroids or something insane as a top 5 DL all time, if I had to speculate.

[Norm]

Also wtf are you doing biting on bait I left for Bdawk.

Being an adult.

[Norm]

Watt is not better than P-Will in this. lol

He's already proven, to me, he's a better player in his prime than Willis was in his.

Just my POV. Then there's positional value and what else is at ILB.

[BDawk4Prez]

Never fear, my last 2 picks were HOF guys. Whew.

[Norm]

Never fear, my last 2 picks were HOF guys. Whew.

And you didn't take a quitting coward like Patrick Willis.

[Ebbs]

He's already proven, to me, he's a better player in his prime than Willis was in his.

Just my POV. Then there's positional value and what else is at ILB.

Yea positional value matters for sure, I agree.

And I agree full heartedly on Watt in the future. Barring a setback (injury, personal tragedy, etc) he will go down as an all time great.

[warfelg]

And you didn't take a quitting coward like Patrick Willis.

Damn Chris Borland was my next pick....

[Ebbs]

And you didn't take a quitting coward like Patrick Willis.

I'm not a San Fran fan, but that's really harsh.

Guy was done, didn't want to end up a vegtable, was an elite player, and made his money.

I can't really knock it.

[Norm]

Willis was a god. Didn't he almost make the PB every single year of his career. How awesome would that have been.

[Norm]

I'm not a San Fran fan, but that's really harsh.

Guy was done, didn't want to end up a vegtable, was an elite player, and made his money.

I can't really knock it.


Also wtf are you doing biting on bait I left for Bdawk.

Returning the favor ;)

[Norm]

i gleefully logged on to psd, and when i saw power rankings, i got giddy.. anticipation killed me and i clicked on the link... i looked, and scrolled way down to the bottom.....

i told my wife, and kids i had to leave... i couldn't stop the tears... it looked like it was storming, the rain wouldn't stop. i couldn't even drive away.... couldn't see... i looked in my rear view mirror and shouted at myself.. "your stupid rawz.. your dumb. you thought you had a championship team?! you idiot!! NOBODY LIKES YOUR TEAM, IT SUCKS. YOU MORON" then i realized, i hadn't updated my clubhouse, hoped creeped in, and i rejoiced. i opened my car, and it wasn't raining, it was sunshine. ( the rain was actually my tears)

i live again...

If you send me money I will make PRs that put you first.

[Norm]

Damn Chris Borland was my next pick....

I still think I nailed the Martin thing.

Dude was a *****. Incog is about to start in the NFL still and he's toast.

[WildWesty]

Willis was a god. Didn't he almost make the PB every single year of his career. How awesome would that have been.

Like Joe Thomas? ;)

Two things. In this game, I can't give Watt credit for years that he didn't play. So active guys like him I'm just assuming retired the moment the draft started and treating careers as such, even with my own guy (JT).

Secondly, Watt to Willis is ****in tough, and norm is right that there might be short-sighted bias at least on my part. I think if they played the same position it would be easier but comparing longevity to impact is just tough in general. Willis had the career but the impact Watt has made in his short career is more than any football player I've ever seen and maybe will ever see. That's not to say Willis wasn't really really great, either and him being picked where he was has so much value, but I think even if Watt had to retire right now, doing what he has already done would have him end up in the HOF.

[warfelg]

I still think I nailed the Martin thing.

Dude was a *****. Incog is about to start in the NFL still and he's toast.

I think that situation got blown out of proportion. Was Incog a little over the top? Sure. Was Martin a bit sensitive? Yes. But IMO something happened that wasn't kosher.

[Norm]

I think that situation got blown out of proportion. Was Incog a little over the top? Sure. Was Martin a bit sensitive? Yes. But IMO something happened that wasn't kosher.

Martin said terrible crap back but once they got the bully hook, it didn't matter.

[Norm]

Like Joe Thomas? ;)

Two things. In this game, I can't give Watt credit for years that he didn't play. So active guys like him I'm just assuming retired the moment the draft started and treating careers as such, even with my own guy (JT).

Secondly, Watt to Willis is ****in tough, and norm is right that there might be short-sighted bias at least on my part. I think if they played the same position it would be easier but comparing longevity to impact is just tough in general. Willis had the career but the impact Watt has made in his short career is more than any football player I've ever seen and maybe will ever see. That's not to say Willis wasn't really really great, either and him being picked where he was has so much value, but I think even if Watt had to retire right now, doing what he has already done would have him end up in the HOF.

:)

I do not think he would make the HOF. But the rest of it is pretty much my view.

[TDjacksonville]

Lee roy jordan

[killthesux]

Titans select OG Grover "Ox" Emerson

[Norm]

Amendola isn't injury prone

[BCB mwat15]

Staleys select DE Jared Allen, assuming he is still there.

[The Jokemaker]

With the 301st pick, the Miami Dolphins complete their defensive line with the addition of Joe Klecko, DT.

[Plague]

If your barometer who is the best player is the Hall Of Fame then why even play the game? lets just limit the game to picking Hall Of Fame players and then flip coins to see who won. What makes Hall Of Fame a better barometer than Pro Bowls?

I personally seen players from the 70's to the present so if I will basing a lot of these teams on my opinion of what I have seen. I am not going to let the HOF tell me that some player who was excellent for 5 years and in the HOF is better than a player who was excellent for 8 years and not in the HOF.

I am not a big fan of picking players from the 20-50's. Who in this draft has seen any of those players play? Red Grange and Jim Thorpe are legends, like Bigfoot and the Yeti, we all have heard of them but we have never seen them. We are making decisions on these players based on if they were in the HOF or not, or for some of us a few sentences here and there talking about the player.

[homestarunner93]

He's already proven, to me, he's a better player in his prime than Willis was in his.

Just my POV. Then there's positional value and what else is at ILB.

Who cares. Watt retires tomorrow, the only thing people will ever say about him again is what could have been. Not what he was. This isn't the NFL Mock. This is not a projection game. It's about what has been, not what will be.

I can understand the positional value argument, but from a position-neutral standpoint, Willis' resume is better and frankly it's not particularly close.

[StriveGreatness]

LA Raiders will take Joe Fortunato

[AP=MVP]

The Steam Rollers add another HOFer to our front line with Frank Gatski

PS - very glad Strive didn't grab him, I thought he might with Otto

[homestarunner93]

If your barometer who is the best player is the Hall Of Fame then why even play the game? lets just limit the game to picking Hall Of Fame players and then flip coins to see who won. What makes Hall Of Fame a better barometer than Pro Bowls?

I personally seen players from the 70's to the present so if I will basing a lot of these teams on my opinion of what I have seen. I am not going to let the HOF tell me that some player who was excellent for 5 years and in the HOF is better than a player who was excellent for 8 years and not in the HOF.

I am not a big fan of picking players from the 20-50's. Who in this draft has seen any of those players play? Red Grange and Jim Thorpe are legends, like Bigfoot and the Yeti, we all have heard of them but we have never seen them. We are making decisions on these players based on if they were in the HOF or not, or for some of us a few sentences here and there talking about the player.

Well, I already addressed this once. If it was just a Hall of Fame player draft, you would have like 8 teams. That would be boring.

Uhh, maybe because the Hall of Fame is way more selective than the Pro Bowl? That's probably a good place to start.

I don't know why you're so disillusioned with the PFHOF, but there are not a ton of political exclusions. Jim Tyrer has a good case to be one, because of a murder/suicide. Who else was excluded for "political reasons" like you claimed earlier? I can't think of one.

Is there a particular example of someone that belongs in that was passed over for a lesser player in his era that you're thinking of? Or is that just a hypothetical situation that you're putting out there so you can claim later that a guy "should" be in the HoF because there are "worse" players that are in?

That's part of the fun. It's supposed to be a research-based game. I have always had fun reading about those guys, looking at their resumes, and picking the ones I like best.

[Plague]

Well, I already addressed this once. If it was just a Hall of Fame player draft, you would have like 8 teams. That would be boring.

Uhh, maybe because the Hall of Fame is way more selective than the Pro Bowl? That's probably a good place to start.

I don't know why you're so disillusioned with the PFHOF, but there are not a ton of political exclusions. Jim Tyrer has a good case to be one, because of a murder/suicide. Who else was excluded for "political reasons" like you claimed earlier? I can't think of one.

Is there a particular example of someone that belongs in that was passed over for a lesser player in his era that you're thinking of? Or is that just a hypothetical situation that you're putting out there so you can claim later that a guy "should" be in the HoF because there are "worse" players that are in?

That's part of the fun. It's supposed to be a research-based game. I have always had fun reading about those guys, looking at their resumes, and picking the ones I like best.

The Pro Bowl only has 1st and 2nd team. If you make the Pro Bowl in any given season your considered 1 of the 2 best players at your position, or 1 of the 4 best if its a position like CB. Hall Of Fame, they just vote to add new players every season.

In my opinion Lynn Swann did not deserve to be in the HOF, you can make a argument for others but I think Lynn Swann is cut and dry. Lynn Swann as a pro was overrated. I don't see what he did that he deserves to be in the HOF. Players off the top of my head in that ERA who did not make the HOF who are better than Lynn Swann....Harold Carmichael, Cliff Branch, and Harold Jackson

Fred Dean is another player. I am not even going to look for DE better than him. He was excellent for a small span, but he wasn't a game changer, and it wasn't long before he became a liability against the run and he was nothing more than a sack specialist. P.S. Give me without a doubt Mark Gastineau over Fred Dean.

Terry Bradshaw. QB of the most loaded teams in the history of my lifetime. Half the QB's in the NFL could of won 3 Super Bowls starting for the Steelers. Ken Stabler, Ken Anderson, and Archie Manning in my opinion all better QB's than Terry Bradshaw. If Archie Manning could of just played for a decent franchise he probably would be listed as 1 of the top 10 QB's of the last 50 years. If your going to judge QB's by Super Bowls then Terry Bradshaw and Troy Aikman deserve to be in the HOF, but if your going to judge by on field performance then they are lacking.

Joe Namath. John Hadl was a better QB but that 1 Super Bowl prediction and the rock star persona helped Joe Namath into the HOF.

I could go through and find a ton of comparisons of players who with argument you could argue are better than players who played at the same time. Clay Matthews about the same as Andre Tippet. Doug English and Dan Hampton. If I wanted to spend the next 2 hours I can probably find a 100 players that are from the same time span that did not make the HOF that can be compared to players who did make the HOF.

I am not disillusioned about the HOF. I just don't think because your in the HOF that your better than someone who is not in the HOF.

When I say political, I don't mean something live on ESPN. I don't think Jack Tatum deserves to be in the HOF, but his reputation probably killed any chances of him getting in the HOF. Floyd Little has attributed his induction into the Hall Of Fame in large part to John Mackey lobbying for him. I know its another sport but I was listening to Rick Barry talk on the radio and he said that when he was a player he was a huge A Hole to his teammates, when his career was over he couldn't get a job as a coach because everyone hated him as a player. You know there is players who lost votes because they were A-Holes. The politics of voting plays a part in who get elected or not elected.

[WildWesty]

Well, I already addressed this once. If it was just a Hall of Fame player draft, you would have like 8 teams. That would be boring.

Uhh, maybe because the Hall of Fame is way more selective than the Pro Bowl? That's probably a good place to start.

I don't know why you're so disillusioned with the PFHOF, but there are not a ton of political exclusions. Jim Tyrer has a good case to be one, because of a murder/suicide. Who else was excluded for "political reasons" like you claimed earlier? I can't think of one.

Is there a particular example of someone that belongs in that was passed over for a lesser player in his era that you're thinking of? Or is that just a hypothetical situation that you're putting out there so you can claim later that a guy "should" be in the HoF because there are "worse" players that are in?

That's part of the fun. It's supposed to be a research-based game. I have always had fun reading about those guys, looking at their resumes, and picking the ones I like best.

All of the AFL guys that had to wait/have waited because the NFL at one point refused for recognize it as a cog in pro football history, guys like Derrick Thomas who likely would have been in and just as deserving had it not been for an early death, the ridiculous bottleneck of great receivers who get forced to wait because the hall doesn't want to add multiple of the same position annually (go ahead and try to make an argument that Bullet Bob, John Stallworth, Lynn Swann, Art Monk, and James Lofton are all clearly more deserving than Marvin Harrison, despite the fact that he's the only one that isn't in the hall of the group). Oh, not to mention ****ing Chris Carter. Prior to when Carter got in, were we really going to put him in a tier lower than all of the HOF guys?

There's totally bias that goes into the votes, and I think it's delusional to think there isn't at least some. That's part of the reason they established the senior committee, to pluck out the greats that somehow got overlooked at the time: Humphrey, Hanburger, Butler, etc. It'll get Kramer in there someday too, I'm sure of it. I think the HOF tag definitely holds weight and I totally respect the guys who get in, but I hate the idea of totally discounting some of the greats just because of a process that is super subjective and definitely not fool proof when it comes to recognizing football's best players ever

[AP=MVP]

The Pro Bowl only has 1st and 2nd team. If you make the Pro Bowl in any given season your considered 1 of the 2 best players at your position, or 1 of the 4 best if its a position like CB. Hall Of Fame, they just vote to add new players every season.

In my opinion Lynn Swann did not deserve to be in the HOF, you can make a argument for others but I think Lynn Swann is cut and dry. Lynn Swann as a pro was overrated. I don't see what he did that he deserves to be in the HOF. Players off the top of my head in that ERA who did not make the HOF who are better than Lynn Swann....Harold Carmichael, Cliff Branch, and Harold Jackson

Fred Dean is another player. I am not even going to look for DE better than him. He was excellent for a small span, but he wasn't a game changer, and it wasn't long before he became a liability against the run and he was nothing more than a sack specialist. P.S. Give me without a doubt Mark Gastineau over Fred Dean.

Terry Bradshaw. QB of the most loaded teams in the history of my lifetime. Half the QB's in the NFL could of won 3 Super Bowls starting for the Steelers. Ken Stabler, Ken Anderson, and Archie Manning in my opinion all better QB's than Terry Bradshaw. If Archie Manning could of just played for a decent franchise he probably would be listed as 1 of the top 10 QB's of the last 50 years. If your going to judge QB's by Super Bowls then Terry Bradshaw and Troy Aikman deserve to be in the HOF, but if your going to judge by on field performance then they are lacking.

Joe Namath. John Hadl was a better QB but that 1 Super Bowl prediction and the rock star persona helped Joe Namath into the HOF.

I could go through and find a ton of comparisons of players who with argument you could argue are better than players who played at the same time. Clay Matthews about the same as Andre Tippet. Doug English and Dan Hampton. If I wanted to spend the next 2 hours I can probably find a 100 players that are from the same time span that did not make the HOF that can be compared to players who did make the HOF.

I am not disillusioned about the HOF. I just don't think because your in the HOF that your better than someone who is not in the HOF.

When I say political, I don't mean something live on ESPN. I don't think Jack Tatum deserves to be in the HOF, but his reputation probably killed any chances of him getting in the HOF. Floyd Little has attributed his induction into the Hall Of Fame in large part to John Mackey lobbying for him. I know its another sport but I was listening to Rick Barry talk on the radio and he said that when he was a player he was a huge A Hole to his teammates, when his career was over he couldn't get a job as a coach because everyone hated him as a player. You know there is players who lost votes because they were A-Holes. The politics of voting plays a part in who get elected or not elected.
You do know that the Pro Bowl and All-Pro teams are different right? Fans vote for the Pro Bowl.. yeah HOF matters way more than Pro Bowl

[AP=MVP]

Basing stuff purely on if a guy is in HOF is obviously not correct but is it a tool to use in this game, of course it is.

Sorry, I never post in lounges and will go back to ignoring it now, just saw Plaque's last few arguments about this and figured I'd share my thoughts.

[Plague]

You do know that the Pro Bowl and All-Pro teams are different right? Fans vote for the Pro Bowl.. yeah HOF matters way more than Pro Bowl

You do know that until 1995 the fans did not vote for the pro bowl?

Before 1995 only the players and the coaches voted for the Pro Bowl. After 1995 the fans were included into the vote, the players get 1/3, coaches 1/3, and fans 1/3.....

The HOF is voted strictly by media, people that generally have never played on a football field or played with or against any of the players getting voted into the HOF. It baffles me that you would dismiss the Pro Bowl which is primarily voted by players and coaches, and give credit to the HOF with is voted by media whom are almost 100 percent people who have never played on a NFL football field.

[AP=MVP]

I don't dismiss it. But it is not a better measuring stick than HOF, you don't think players have biased opinions of other players. Just cause you don't play in the NFL doesn't mean that you don't know about the game.

Anyway, I'm going to bed, hopefully I have another HOFer on my roster by the time I wake up.

[WildWesty]

You do know that until 1995 the fans did not vote for the pro bowl?

Before 1995 only the players and the coaches voted for the Pro Bowl. After 1995 the fans were included into the vote, the players get 1/3, coaches 1/3, and fans 1/3.....

The HOF is voted strictly by media, people that generally have never played on a football field or played with or against any of the players getting voted into the HOF. It baffles me that you would dismiss the Pro Bowl which is primarily voted by players and coaches, and give credit to the HOF with is voted by media whom are almost 100 percent people who have never played on a NFL football field.

Exactly! And like I said, although I'm not completely sure, but a huge reason the senior committee was established was to combat the bias and inconsistency from the regular com.

[WildWesty]

I don't dismiss it. But it is not a better measuring stick than HOF, you don't think players have biased opinions of other players. Just cause you don't play in the NFL doesn't mean that you don't know about the game.

Anyway, I'm going to bed, hopefully I have another HOFer on my roster by the time I wake up.

You don't think the media and regular joes voting might have bias too? I mean, look at the trends of who get in, flashy guys like Namath go right away and quiet players like Hanburger wait years and years until a new process is established. There's many more cases like I mentioned early, but to discount a player's knowledge of the game in comparison to a fan because of bias is a little bit incomplete. These players know the ins and outs of the game far more than the fans and the media, and until pretty recent they were the only ones who had (and were forced to KNOW) the insider stuff.

[warfelg]

HOF for Profootball is about the most consistent.

If it were about politics Michael Irving wouldn't be in the hall of fame. Plenty of others with off field questionable pasts that are in the HOF, unlike PBHOF who are about the most judgmental voters in all HOF's.

Even though pre-1995 the NFL Pro Bowl was voted by players and not fans, it still wasn't the best barometer because guys were injured or dropped out or whatever. You just have to look at the resume as a whole and what they did. And I also think that just because you personally think a guy wasn't HOF worthy, doesn't mean you can just ignore that accolade.

[BDawk4Prez]

Lost in this is homie/norm last pick, Jimmy Graham, who they will try to sell as a great pick, despite homies thoughts on Revis (sure fire HOF), Watt (best defensive player in the game today) and Gronk (best TE since Gonzo).

[WildWesty]

HOF for Profootball is about the most consistent.

If it were about politics Michael Irving wouldn't be in the hall of fame. Plenty of others with off field questionable pasts that are in the HOF, unlike PBHOF who are about the most judgmental voters in all HOF's.

Even though pre-1995 the NFL Pro Bowl was voted by players and not fans, it still wasn't the best barometer because guys were injured or dropped out or whatever. You just have to look at the resume as a whole and what they did. And I also think that just because you personally think a guy wasn't HOF worthy, doesn't mean you can just ignore that accolade.

Not saying anything is the best, I consider the HOF higher than the PB too, but both are significant and you need to look at a player's whole body of work,

And really, with Irvin? He broke records, won championships, and played under one of the biggest spotlights in the NFL in the 90s. He was guaranteed a spot the moment he retired, off the field issues and whatnot can hold the smaller names off maybe, but an obvious candidate like Irvin was never going to be held out. Like I said, it's not always going to be political and the best players usually get in, but to say ALL do is insane.

And lastly to combat your Irvin statement: Chris Carter.

[WildWesty]

Oh and I could be incorrect (and I'm not sure how long it has been this way) but when a player is elected to the pro bowl and cannot play due to injury, he is still recognized in the books for it.

[warfelg]

Not saying anything is the best, I consider the HOF higher than the PB too, but both are significant and you need to look at a player's whole body of work,

And really, with Irvin? He broke records, won championships, and played under one of the biggest spotlights in the NFL in the 90s. He was guaranteed a spot the moment he retired, off the field issues and whatnot can hold the smaller names off maybe, but an obvious candidate like Irvin was never going to be held out. Like I said, it's not always going to be political and the best players usually get in, but to say ALL do is insane.

And lastly to combat your Irvin statement: Chris Carter.

On the first half we agree.

As for the second half:
Irving shows that the NFL HOF cares about on field not off. Guys like Monk and CC waited because there was a glut of WRs that were all deserving. CC's wait had to do with that not off field.

[warfelg]

Oh and I could be incorrect (and I'm not sure how long it has been this way) but when a player is elected to the pro bowl and cannot play due to injury, he is still recognized in the books for it.

Correct. But so is the replacement. Which is why the PB argument can get mocked from time to time. I mean think: Andy Dalton is forever a pro bowler now.

Edit:
It's why I think that All Pro is a little higher accolade. You can't drop out of it because you don't have to play. It's voted on by people who had a chance to see everyone play. Of course unless someone pulls a Boomer and votes a guy out of position because he can't be a man and make a decision.

[WildWesty]

On the first half we agree.

As for the second half:
Irving shows that the NFL HOF cares about on field not off. Guys like Monk and CC waited because there was a glut of WRs that were all deserving. CC's wait had to do with that not off field.

Yeah, I think if he was more fringe of a HOFer then his off field antics keeps him from being elected first ballot, but I totally agree that they don't care as much off the field as other biases that affect the voting.

And I think Carter just flat out got screwed. Since being eligible in 2008 (i believe), he went six years until being elected in the sixth of eligibility. During that span only two WRs were voted in over him: Art Monk and Jerry Rice (Bob Hayes was a senior vote).


Correct. But so is the replacement. Which is why the PB argument can get mocked from time to time. I mean think: Andy Dalton is forever a pro bowler now.

Edit:
It's why I think that All Pro is a little higher accolade. You can't drop out of it because you don't have to play. It's voted on by people who had a chance to see everyone play. Of course unless someone pulls a Boomer and votes a guy out of position because he can't be a man and make a decision.

I'm for sure with you on all-pro, and really like it as an accolade especially because it's less players (just top two in general whereas the pro bowl used to do top two from each conference). The pro bowl thing has definitely gotten carried away as of recent, especially since they idiotically moved it to before the SB. Before that I don't recall the alternates common, especially the further back you go in history. The Dalton thing is pretty funny but clearly a significant outlier that only the people who don't watch football would believe to be legit.

The main thing that worries me with the pro bowl is player politics and (since the fans have been allowed to vote) the players that play for teams in lesser markets (Buffalo, Jacksonville, etc) not getting voted in. It totally happens to, which is why, like the HOF, you have to look at the whole body of work from a player.

[Andrei00]

Ernie Nevers, HB

[Wrench]

Dermontti Dawson, C