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View Full Version : Who's having the worst offseason so far?



JasonJohnHorn
07-17-2015, 11:47 PM
There are teams who are rebuilding (Magic, T-Wolves, Jazz ect) who nobody expects is going to be making a big splash in the offseason. They got drafts picks and will be developing young talent this year.

And there are teams that knew they would be taking a hit in terms of lost players (the Trailblazers namely).

These teams were fairly expected to have a bad offseason, but among teams who were looking to move into contention, or improve their contending status, who do you think has has the worst offseason so far?

Rockets? Will they backslide without adding anybody? Or will a healthy roster be a difference maker? Can the same could be said of OKC? LAL and NY? BK looks to be taking a step back. And Dallas is likely disappointed with how things have played out, but they've made some shrewd moves to compensate. Phoenix cleared some space, but didn't get to do anything with it.

What are your thoughts?

DODGERS&LAKERS
07-18-2015, 12:43 AM
I don't think the Trailblazers expected to lose their entire starting 5 with the exception of Lillard. They were a playoff team that was expected to grow together. There has been no worse off his season then that

JasonJohnHorn
07-18-2015, 12:52 AM
I don't think the Trailblazers expected to lose their entire starting 5 with the exception of Lillard. They were a playoff team that was expected to grow together. There has been no worse off his season then that

It seemed to me when they traded Batum, and had already heard word that LMA was leaving, they knew it was rebuild time.

I would agree that these changes make the team bad in the short term, but I don't think LMA is an efficient scorer. I like him. He seems like a hard worker and a smart guy, but he simply doesn't score the ball efficiently. Building around him would be like the Nuggets building around Melo (though the two are very different players). It would simply mean a series of first-round exits. They didn't push for him, and they could have offered him more money, but they realized he wasn't worth it, and decided to re-build. I think that was, in part, a conscious choice on their part.


The same with Wes. They let him go.

Portland to me has been overachieving with that roster. Good coaching, hard working players, team attitude. It helped them win games in the West during the regular season, but it wasn't going to be winning them any championships if they didn't have the top tier talent to go with it, and they knew it. Making an honest effort next year, likely picking up a lottery pick, and then going into the next offseason with some serious cap space when the cap jumps up. This seems calculated to me, not the disaster that LAL and NY have had with free agents rejecting them left and right.

But your point is a valid one. Losing 4/5 starters.... that's not good news for this upcoming season, and as such, they certainly have a STRONG case for most disastrous offseason.

slaker619
07-18-2015, 01:15 AM
Trailblazers - Lost Starters
Dallas - Getting Old and Lost Scorer in Ellis
Knicks - Got No Real Help

mngopher35
07-18-2015, 01:27 AM
I don't think the Trailblazers expected to lose their entire starting 5 with the exception of Lillard. They were a playoff team that was expected to grow together. There has been no worse off his season then that

If you want to say they are the losers because they will have a big drop off without Aldridge I can understand that. Losing the other guys was a smart move though so to me that is more of a win for them (mathews not worth the price and Batum got them cheaper young talent). They can likely get a higher pick, they acquired some cheap young talent, and kept flexibility moving forward with cap space instead of being a fringe playoff team with some highly paid vets. They chose to go a different way without Aldridge but outside of him I think it was a pretty solid off season for them.

Edit: Looked into it and the other 3 Portland starters make about 42 mil in salary per year (probably more after next season when Batum is owed a new one). To me having 70ish million in these guys once Lilliards contract kicks in is way too much and would really hurt their rebuild around Lilliard.

TylerSL
07-18-2015, 01:28 AM
I would have to say Portland or Sacramento. Portland because they have lost all of their core save Lillard and really just need to rebuild around him at this point and Sacramento gets mentioned because I don't know what the hell they are doing. Giving Rondo $9.5 million is crazy, they failed to get Mbah a Moute because he didn't pass the physical, they still have Rudy Gay on the roster, and their coach not only poisoned the well with their franchise player, he doesn't have the trust of ownership anymore. The state of the Kings is in pretty dire straits right now. Cousins has seen 5 different coaches in his 5 year career. That organization wants to start winning they need to show some stability and bring in some strong veterans for leadership. I did however, like them taking WCS at #6 in the draft. I don't care what people say, he is for real. I just worry the Kings organization is going to ruin him like they seem to be trying to do with Cousins.

Portland will be forced to take a step back and remodel their entire team around Lillard. Top level free agents want to win so Portland will have a hard time bringing top level talent to Lillard in that form for the foreseeable future. They are going to have acquire more talent around Lillard before they can become relevant again, it's that simple. It's probably going to take two or three years of being in the lottery for that to happen. Lillard is still young so he can sit through a rebuild and still have a good career. Personally, he reminds me alot of a young Dwyane Wade so I believe the NBA as a whole just got a quick taste of Lillard his first couple years, he's gonna be around for a very long time.

FriedTofuz
07-18-2015, 01:49 AM
Trailblazers - Lost Starters
Dallas - Getting Old and Lost Scorer in Ellis
Knicks - Got No Real Help

This. And every year, knick fans will rationalize how samual dalembert is an upgrade over tyson chandler, how they won 54 games 3 years ago, and say the east sucks and that it is wide open.

Kyben36
07-18-2015, 02:02 AM
I don't think the Trailblazers expected to lose their entire starting 5 with the exception of Lillard. They were a playoff team that was expected to grow together. There has been no worse off his season then that

this was my pick, the sad thing for that team, is they actually have played the hand they were dealt rather well. When 5 of your top 6 leave, im talking Wes, Batum, Aldridge, Lopez, and 6th man Affalo (yes he was starting, but wes was injured, if they all came back, likely off the bench ) Sure they dealt batum, but only to get a young Prospect PF to replace aldridge back. they also got a pretty nice player in Henderson, not bad considering. but they lost an allstar, 2 starting cailbler SGs, a Starting SF and a Starting Center. and unfortunatly, i think thhey overpaid for Aminu who ive never liked as a starter, off the bench, OK, but that team was easily set back at least 3 years IMO.

Kyben36
07-18-2015, 02:04 AM
Trailblazers - Lost Starters
Dallas - Getting Old and Lost Scorer in Ellis
Knicks - Got No Real Help

Dallas Replaced Ellis with an overpaid Wes, who is a better defesnive player, and got a Starting PG who isnt going to thow their team Under a bus, i dont hate their offseason, in fact, i think Jordan on that team would look really bad. i think if he had left chris paul, he would suffer big time.

Knicks did OK, they got a Starting SG, STarting Center, and a prospect at PF ( too early to say for Prozingis but hopefully he can contribute, if they could somehow get ta guy like Ty Lawson that team would be in playoff contention, not a guarentee, but still, i think they could try and sqeez in for that last spot.

Kyben36
07-18-2015, 02:05 AM
im going to give a shout out to the bulls, who did nothing but pray that their young guys can step up and Healthy players can play better, and the Cavs, who did nothing but overpay the guys on their roster.

FraziersKnicks
07-18-2015, 06:41 AM
Raps lose by default for paying DeMarre Carroll $60m :laugh2:

DanG
07-18-2015, 06:47 AM
How can you have the worst offseason if you got better? So IMO knicks shouldn't be in the discussion.

Blazers are not even making the playoffs this year so it's them

warfelg
07-18-2015, 07:04 AM
Blazers for me based on how much they lost. It's Lillards team now plain and simple.

Honorable mention goes to the Knicks. They seem stuck between rebuild and win. That's because of Melo. I think if they could move Melo for a max return they would. Drafting Grant and Porzingas are moves for the future. Signing Aflallo and Lopez are for now. And the Lopez contract is blech to me. He was underrated, but he's not worth $13 mil per season.

deaner
07-18-2015, 08:01 AM
Knicks and Lakers for striking out in free agency after clearing their rosters.

Portland for sure is the leader of this list.

cmellofan15
07-18-2015, 08:23 AM
I think it's obviously the blazers.

And how were the Knicks or lakers off seasons bad? Both teams are in a much better place than where they started this offseason. I understand the expectations were much greater, but that doesn't make their off season any worse.

Sactown
07-18-2015, 02:09 PM
Blazers obviously, when you lose that many assets you hope you get something in return, which they didn't

OKC continues to have lack luster off seasons which is bizzare since they just continue to get worse each off season

Dallas. Put them selves in a position to lose their draft pick without being competitive in the difficult west

flea
07-18-2015, 03:23 PM
Surprised at people saying the Blazers did nothing. They actually did a lot, in spite of losing 4 starters. They figured they have the guard position locked down, between McCallum and Crabbe and of course Lillard.

On the wings they did what they could, getting a very underrated veteran in Henderson and picking up a flier on Harkless. Aminu does nothing but hustle and he's definitely a useful NBA rotation player. That's not going to do you many favors offensively, but Henderson has a crafty slashing game even if the j is streaky. It should help Lillard progress as a PG, which TBH I have been disappointed in that aspect of his game even if he was a pure scoring guard coming out of college.

The frontline though is where I think their team has a chance to be really good. Probably not next year but soon. They've stacked up athletes down there, and generally when you say that you mean they've got a bunch of guys who can't shoot or pass but that's not the case.

- Leonard was a draft pick based on his athleticism at his size but that 3 point shot looks like a weapon. A stretch 4/5 that you give up nothing with defensively and on the boards is what people hope Porzingis turns into. The release may be a bit slow, and Porzingis is allegedly a pick and pop monster which I'm not sure Leonard will be, but a guy that big who can shoot and stick defensively is at the very least a very good first big off the bench.

- Mason Plumlee is another great athlete for a big man. He may not shoot but he's solid around the rim and looks like a player who does everything right for a big man (p&r, defense, box out) at the NBA level. He was the best player on a really underrated Duke team that lost to the eventual champs his senior year, and really brought his offensive game around. Glad he's out of Brooklyn so we can see what he can do at this level.

-Noah Vonleh is what people think/hope Karl Anthony Towns will be. Very good athlete who can shoot (and has proven it in gametime, unlike Towns), has length, can defend, and has a respectable inside game. He's got better size than Towns despite giving up a couple inches in height, and while he may not be the shotblocker Towns is ever he could be just as good defensively. I'm still skeptical of Towns's ability to stick at the 5 somewhat, but Vonleh could handle it with a guy like Leonard next to him.

So while their team will be worse next year, that collection of young bigs rivals any team in the league's with upside IMO (even Sixers).

TylerSL
07-18-2015, 04:12 PM
Surprised at people saying the Blazers did nothing. They actually did a lot, in spite of losing 4 starters. They figured they have the guard position locked down, between McCallum and Crabbe and of course Lillard.

On the wings they did what they could, getting a very underrated veteran in Henderson and picking up a flier on Harkless. Aminu does nothing but hustle and he's definitely a useful NBA rotation player. That's not going to do you many favors offensively, but Henderson has a crafty slashing game even if the j is streaky. It should help Lillard progress as a PG, which TBH I have been disappointed in that aspect of his game even if he was a pure scoring guard coming out of college.

The frontline though is where I think their team has a chance to be really good. Probably not next year but soon. They've stacked up athletes down there, and generally when you say that you mean they've got a bunch of guys who can't shoot or pass but that's not the case.

- Leonard was a draft pick based on his athleticism at his size but that 3 point shot looks like a weapon. A stretch 4/5 that you give up nothing with defensively and on the boards is what people hope Porzingis turns into. The release may be a bit slow, and Porzingis is allegedly a pick and pop monster which I'm not sure Leonard will be, but a guy that big who can shoot and stick defensively is at the very least a very good first big off the bench.

- Mason Plumlee is another great athlete for a big man. He may not shoot but he's solid around the rim and looks like a player who does everything right for a big man (p&r, defense, box out) at the NBA level. He was the best player on a really underrated Duke team that lost to the eventual champs his senior year, and really brought his offensive game around. Glad he's out of Brooklyn so we can see what he can do at this level.

-Noah Vonleh is what people think/hope Karl Anthony Towns will be. Very good athlete who can shoot (and has proven it in gametime, unlike Towns), has length, can defend, and has a respectable inside game. He's got better size than Towns despite giving up a couple inches in height, and while he may not be the shotblocker Towns is ever he could be just as good defensively. I'm still skeptical of Towns's ability to stick at the 5 somewhat, but Vonleh could handle it with a guy like Leonard next to him.

So while their team will be worse next year, that collection of young bigs rivals any team in the league's with upside IMO (even Sixers).

When I stated Portland it wasn't because they did anything wrong, it's just based on events that have transpired this offseason they are going to have to rebuild around Lillard. Portland isn't going to be competing for a Western Conference playoff spot in the near future and will be in the lottery for 2-3 years. They have a good organization and Lillard is only 25 so we will see a lot more from Portland in the next 5-7 years I have no doubt, but it's obvious they took a major step back this summer. It wasn't incompetence on their part, like Sacramento, but it doesn't change the fact they have to start over.

flea
07-18-2015, 04:54 PM
Eh I guess but saying they had the worst offseason means they did something wrong to me. In fact, they did everything right by collecting big men with upside. Big men have always been, and will always be, how championships are won in basketball. Keeping around 3 and D players only makes sense if you think you're going to compete for championships for the duration of their contracts. Once LMA is gone, might as well see what you can get, and I think they got just about the best set of assets they possibly could have.

Scoots
07-18-2015, 05:53 PM
The worst offseason? Lakers fans who think their team is going to contend for the playoffs ... they just don't know that their offseason is bad yet. At least the Blazers fans are not delusional. :)

After the Blazers Dallas has to be high on the list. In effect they lost 2 starting centers this offseason, that's really hard to do.

JasonJohnHorn
07-18-2015, 06:34 PM
How can you have the worst offseason if you got better? So IMO knicks shouldn't be in the discussion.


Did they get better? I hadn't noticed ;-)

BHF
07-18-2015, 06:52 PM
Raps lose by default for paying DeMarre Carroll $60m :laugh2:

troll much?

The Senator
07-18-2015, 07:46 PM
Sacramento would be a good choice, followed by the Blazers(although I think they'll be back in a few years), OKC(did nothing of note and fall backwards by default), Dallas(got caught with their pants down), and the Bulls(see OKC)

GiantsSwaGG
07-18-2015, 08:13 PM
Raps lose by default for paying DeMarre Carroll $60m :laugh2:

:laugh2:

GiantsSwaGG
07-18-2015, 08:16 PM
Did they get better? I hadn't noticed ;-)

They didn't get better from last season? Lol

Lopez
O'Quinn
Affalo
Zinger
Grant

That's definitely an upgrade from last season, we won't make the playoffs but we are headed in the right direction for once lol

Tony_Starks
07-18-2015, 09:16 PM
I don't think the Trailblazers expected to lose their entire starting 5 with the exception of Lillard. They were a playoff team that was expected to grow together. There has been no worse off his season then that


Trailblazers will be OK. They knew Aldridge was jumping ship and went into contingency mode. Lillard will basically get his Russell Westbrook on this year, he has the keys now. They take a step back but not the end of the world.

Dallas takes the biggest hit by FAR. Built around DJ, misses out on Hibbert, West, Chandler, hell even Robin Lopez or Jordan Hill. Plus Monta getting away.

Its going to be ALL bad for them this year in a serious way.

Corey
07-18-2015, 09:33 PM
Trailblazers will be OK. They knew Aldridge was jumping ship and went into contingency mode. Lillard will basically get his Russell Westbrook on this year, he has the keys now. They take a step back but not the end of the world.

Dallas takes the biggest hit by FAR. Built around DJ, misses out on Hibbert, West, Chandler, hell even Robin Lopez or Jordan Hill. Plus Monta getting away.

Its going to be ALL bad for them this year in a serious way.

Dallas is still in a better position this season than Portland though. They lost Chandler and should have got DJ, but rolling out a lineup of D-Will - Wes - Parsons - Dirk - Zaza...They could at least make noise in the right system...they need to solidify the bench though.

For the sake of the Celtics, I hope they end up missing the playoffs and fall in the 8-14 range though

HT9Canada
07-18-2015, 09:48 PM
I think it's obviously the blazers.

And how were the Knicks or lakers off seasons bad? Both teams are in a much better place than where they started this offseason. I understand the expectations were much greater, but that doesn't make their off season any worse.

the difference is first round picks. if melo or kobe are out injured, they would even get their early picks. the blazers want to have a rebuild year. get a stud in the draft. this isnt a battle to who will be the best team this year, its to who is building to be a contender in the shortest amount of time

FriedTofuz
07-19-2015, 12:47 AM
They didn't get better from last season? Lol

Lopez
O'Quinn
Affalo
Zinger
Grant

That's definitely an upgrade from last season, we won't make the playoffs but we are headed in the right direction for once lol

Lopez is not even better than Chandler and the knicks had chandler and still sucked.
Who's Chris o'quinn?
Affalo does NOT play defense anymore, he's overrated
Zinger is miles away from contributing, give it 3-4 year.
Grant is a good prospect as well, dont expect something amazing but these two picks by phil look promising. In terms of having a good offseason, Id say they failed because they signed Melo and want to compeat now but are most likely going to be a <30 win team this year.

NYJ - NYY
07-19-2015, 11:30 AM
Lopez is not even better than Chandler and the knicks had chandler and still sucked.
Who's Chris o'quinn?
Affalo does NOT play defense anymore, he's overrated
Zinger is miles away from contributing, give it 3-4 year.
Grant is a good prospect as well, dont expect something amazing but these two picks by phil look promising. In terms of having a good offseason, Id say they failed because they signed Melo and want to compeat now but are most likely going to be a <30 win team this year.

I know Kyle o'quinn is a young guy who was on Orlando who could very well be a tough blue collar lunch pale PF/back up C we've needed. Chris o'quinn on the other hand is an example of your ineptitude of knowing anything about the Knicks

FOXHOUND
07-19-2015, 12:06 PM
I would say Dallas, being that they put all of their eggs in the Jordan basket and got screwed. Not only that, but part of that was a risky signing in Matthews and the fallout including their signees contract getting pumped up.

phantasyyy
07-19-2015, 12:59 PM
I don't why Knicks fans still try to bait raptors fans in every thread lol.

Its like you do it in order to make your selves feel better even though you and everyone on this forum knows that the Raptors > Knicks in the foreseeable future. We have assets, our own draft picks, and a bunch of young guys all while still contending for a playoff spot. Sure the team currently isn't built to truck through the playoffs, but we've made some solid additions just as the Knicks have this off season.

To be fair we don't have the allure of the MSG, so we aren't going to catch the big fishes. Therefore our organization has to overpay for our free agents (see Carroll @15m & Joseph @7.5m), but it was done in order to shore up weaknesses (defensively and backup pg ability). The jury is still out on whether or not Carroll will fit in seamlessly but we finally gotten our premier 3&D player in Carroll and he should allow us to match up better with the bigger wings that we have struggled to contain in the last two playoff series (Johnson... then Pierce).

If anything our roster breakup in terms of salaries is >> the Knicks. We have no max contracts on the books, most of our core are locked up on reasonable deals even with the current CBA.

At the end of the day we're at least a lock for the playoffs, while the Knicks will be fighting for the 8th seed in nba purgatory hell. Even in the chance that your team is not competitive and you bottom out, you guys don't even have your first round pick to continue your rebuild on..

Also, I am not saying you guys didn't have a good offseason, because I do like the moves the Knicks have made even though they too did not reel in a big free agent. The additions of Lopez, Afflalo, Porzingis, and Grant will shore up some of the defensive woes, but at the end of the day your team will only go as far as Melo will carry them. No real beef here, just don't understand why Knicks fans continue to try and troll Raptors fans when in all facets of the game our team is superior. Other than the fact that you play at the MSG, and have a more recognizable superstar in Melo.

phantasyyy
07-19-2015, 01:06 PM
To add to the thread though, the Kings have to be the choice here.. They're management is already beefing with the newly signed coach, the star player and coach aren't seeing eye-to-eye since he tried to trade him... They made the worst trade ever to clear up cap space to the 76ers giving up on their recent lottery pick (in Stauskas) as well as a future first as well as rights to swap.. all for the cap space to sign... Rondo, Bellinelli, and Koufos.

Talk about a bad off season, plus so many free agents spurned them...despite giving them more money.

Nycbball08
07-19-2015, 01:32 PM
How can you have the worst offseason if you got better? So IMO knicks shouldn't be in the discussion.

Blazers are not even making the playoffs this year so it's them

Thank you, don't know what that idiot talking about!!!

Nycbball08
07-19-2015, 01:40 PM
Did they get better? I hadn't noticed ;-)

The thread is NOT about who got better, it's about who got worst!!!

FOXHOUND
07-19-2015, 04:04 PM
I don't why Knicks fans still try to bait raptors fans in every thread lol.

Its like you do it in order to make your selves feel better even though you and everyone on this forum knows that the Raptors > Knicks in the foreseeable future. We have assets, our own draft picks, and a bunch of young guys all while still contending for a playoff spot. Sure the team currently isn't built to truck through the playoffs, but we've made some solid additions just as the Knicks have this off season.

To be fair we don't have the allure of the MSG, so we aren't going to catch the big fishes. Therefore our organization has to overpay for our free agents (see Carroll @15m & Joseph @7.5m), but it was done in order to shore up weaknesses (defensively and backup pg ability). The jury is still out on whether or not Carroll will fit in seamlessly but we finally gotten our premier 3&D player in Carroll and he should allow us to match up better with the bigger wings that we have struggled to contain in the last two playoff series (Johnson... then Pierce).

If anything our roster breakup in terms of salaries is >> the Knicks. We have no max contracts on the books, most of our core are locked up on reasonable deals even with the current CBA.

At the end of the day we're at least a lock for the playoffs, while the Knicks will be fighting for the 8th seed in nba purgatory hell. Even in the chance that your team is not competitive and you bottom out, you guys don't even have your first round pick to continue your rebuild on..

Also, I am not saying you guys didn't have a good offseason, because I do like the moves the Knicks have made even though they too did not reel in a big free agent. The additions of Lopez, Afflalo, Porzingis, and Grant will shore up some of the defensive woes, but at the end of the day your team will only go as far as Melo will carry them. No real beef here, just don't understand why Knicks fans continue to try and troll Raptors fans when in all facets of the game our team is superior. Other than the fact that you play at the MSG, and have a more recognizable superstar in Melo.

I think it's just a few Knicks/Raptors fans who were having arguments during the Bargnani trade who still have issues with each other :D

Other than that, I don't see why there would be any rivalry there when they haven't played each other in any games of significance in well over a decade. I don't think either come close to qualifying for the thread topic, I think both actually had really good offseasons.

phantasyyy
07-19-2015, 04:53 PM
I think it's just a few Knicks/Raptors fans who were having arguments during the Bargnani trade who still have issues with each other :D

Other than that, I don't see why there would be any rivalry there when they haven't played each other in any games of significance in well over a decade. I don't think either come close to qualifying for the thread topic, I think both actually had really good offseasons.

Even then.. any reasonable fan could see that the knicks got fleeeeced in that trade

FOXHOUND
07-19-2015, 05:09 PM
Even then.. any reasonable fan could see that the knicks got fleeeeced in that trade

:burn:

Kinda proving my point lol.

Tony_Starks
07-19-2015, 08:50 PM
Trailblazers will be OK. They knew Aldridge was jumping ship and went into contingency mode. Lillard will basically get his Russell Westbrook on this year, he has the keys now. They take a step back but not the end of the world.

Dallas takes the biggest hit by FAR. Built around DJ, misses out on Hibbert, West, Chandler, hell even Robin Lopez or Jordan Hill. Plus Monta getting away.

Its going to be ALL bad for them this year in a serious way.

Dallas is still in a better position this season than Portland though. They lost Chandler and should have got DJ, but rolling out a lineup of D-Will - Wes - Parsons - Dirk - Zaza...They could at least make noise in the right system...they need to solidify the bench though.

For the sake of the Celtics, I hope they end up missing the playoffs and fall in the 8-14 range though

Oh trust me they will. I love me some D Will but he left his game in Utah. Parsons isn't built to carry a team and Dirk can't anymore.

Throw in a weak bench and they have .500 team written all over them which isn't going to cut it in the West.