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View Full Version : POTENTIAL CAVS ROSTER (and its cost)



Kyben36
07-02-2015, 11:13 PM
So, it seems that the Cavs are on a spending Frenzy, to resign the players currently on the roster, and with cap going up, nobody has asked the question, HOW MUCH ARE THEY REALLY SPENDING, Well, Im here to answer than question, as well as ask a few of my own.

FIRST OFF, lets talk about current Contracts,

Current Players

$14,746,000 Kyrie Irving
$10,522,500 Brendan Haywood
$9,638,554 Anderson Varijao
$4,950,000 Timofey Mozgov
$2,854,940 Mike Miller
$845,059 Joe Harris

Total - $43,557,053

AND, their Most Recent Signings, while some have not been signed yet...., and Contract information not divulged entirely, i utilized the Projected Numbers, of years, and Total to calculate using Draft Express's Contract Calculator (http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-contract-calculator/)


$18,181,818 Kevin Love (5 year 110 mil)
$13,223,140 Tristian Thompson (5 year 80 mil)
$8,639,309 Iman Shumpert (4 year 40 mil)

Also, Adding On Lebron, who, can be expected to receive the Max, which acording to This Article (http://www.businessinsider.com/lebron-james-free-agency-plan-2015-6), could probably be a 2 year max, with an option for the 2nd year, either way, max first year for him is $22,100,000

TOTAL ADDITIONS -$62,144,267

OVERALL TOTAL - $105,701,320


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NOW FOR THE INTERESTING PART, LUXURY TAX

Cavs are REPEAT OFFENDERS (they were over last season), They were over the cap last season, and they will surely be over the cap this season, Using the Calculations from Wiki (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NBA_salary_cap) (probably not the most acurate but will use anyway) here is what i have found they owe in Lux Tax

First Via Original Projections, they are Over the Cap $38,601,320 and $24,101,320 over the Lux Tax Threshold,

NOW, According to the way i understand this works, They Will Owe

(5 mil x 2.5) + (5 mil x 2.75) + (5 mil x 3.5) + (5 mil x 4.25) + (4.101320 mil x 4.75) =

This = $84,481,270 in Luxury Tax

That means the Cavs Will Be Spending Approximately $190,182,590



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Now they are talking with Delevadova, about a deal in the 3-5 mil range, just to be clear on how much more this adds to the payroll

at 3mil it would cost them an extra 11.031 mil in lux tax, on top of his salary giving him a total net cost of 14 mil a year

(0.89868 x 4.75) + (2.10132 x 5.25) = $11,031,930

at 5 mil, it would cost them an extra 21.53193 in lux tax giving him a total net cost of 24.5 mil

(0.89868 x 4.75) + (5.10132 x 5.25) = $21,531,930

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HERE is where my questions comes in, if the Cavs do sign all of these guys to reported deals, they will be spending Approximately 205 million dollars ( the original 190 mil + delevadovas potential 3 mil contract which adds 14 mil, + a few more players (which they need to fill out their roster) )

The Cavs Revenue VIA FORBES (http://www.forbes.com/teams/cleveland-cavaliers/) is 149 Million Dollars

That MEANS the Cavs will be Spending Approximately $56 million more than they make in a year.

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Are the Cavs Spending Too much??

IS THIS OK??????

is this going to be the most money spent on a team ever?

Should the league step in and do something ????

And what are your takes on how much money they are/are going to be spending??




....

BTW, im sorry this is such a long read, but to get all the information in, it had to be.

Nikeman
07-02-2015, 11:26 PM
Good post, but the link you posted is not updated. Take a look,

"With James back on the team, the Cavaliers saw their revenue jump 45% this season compared to the 2013-14 season, according to Sports Business Daily.

That translates to an estimated 2014-15 revenue of $216 million, a $67 million increase from the season before, based on a 2013-14 revenue estimation of $149 million by Forbes.com."

http://www.businessinsider.com/lebron-james-return-to-cleveland-boosted-cavs-revenue-2015-6


I am also pretty sure this does not take into account further revenue the Cavs made from the playoffs, as this article was written June 18th. So no, the Cavs are not LOSING money. And I am sure I can speak for Cavs players, fans etc etc, nobody gives a ****, its Dan Gilbert's money, why does anyone else care?

HuRRiCaNeS324
07-02-2015, 11:28 PM
That is ****ing absurd lol

Good stuff btw. I was interested in how ridiculous it was and i'm amazed.

To me, this team is simply not worth 200 million dollars. But whatever floats Dan Gilbert's boat.

Scoots
07-03-2015, 12:00 AM
Excellent post. This is what I've been talking about elsewhere.

Add in:

Thompson is still looking for more money (he isn't signed yet).

JR Smith hasn't signed elsewhere and he's probably the top talent they could bring in with their cap situation and he's looking for $8M+

The MLE is reduced for tax paying teams to around $3.4M ... have the Cavs spent it yet?

And with those 2 players added there is still a roster spot or 2 open.

Mozgov is in the last year of his deal and if they don't re-sign him soon he'll be unrestricted next off-season and he cost almost as much as Love to bring in. Also, playing on this team his value is likely to climb so while they might be able to sign him right now to a deal in the $11M a year range, next off-season it may be closer to $17M, so much better to extend him now while the getting is good.

Add those numbers to your calculation and I think the Cavs are probably not profitable on paper.

But I believe all NBA teams are profitable in reality. The Warriors were purchased for $450M 5 years ago and are now valued at essentially double that ... that's an additional $100M every year ... add in that they are the title winners and are moving to a new stadium and their value will soon be over $1B. The same is true of the Cavs. Gilbert bought the team 10 years ago for $300M or so and the team is now worth north of $900M.

Don't worry about Gilbert, he can afford it without having to break any piggy banks.

Kyben36
07-03-2015, 12:01 AM
Good post, but the link you posted is not updated. Take a look,

"With James back on the team, the Cavaliers saw their revenue jump 45% this season compared to the 2013-14 season, according to Sports Business Daily.

That translates to an estimated 2014-15 revenue of $216 million, a $67 million increase from the season before, based on a 2013-14 revenue estimation of $149 million by Forbes.com."

http://www.businessinsider.com/lebron-james-return-to-cleveland-boosted-cavs-revenue-2015-6


I am also pretty sure this does not take into account further revenue the Cavs made from the playoffs, as this article was written June 18th. So no, the Cavs are not LOSING money. And I am sure I can speak for Cavs players, fans etc etc, nobody gives a ****, its Dan Gilbert's money, why does anyone else care?

Thanks for the Update, I just used what i could find, obviously, if thats incorrect nothing i can do about it. Still, its interesting to see how much money this team is spending on their top 10/11 guys.

LA_Raiders
07-03-2015, 12:05 AM
Commish should veto them...

More-Than-Most
07-03-2015, 12:22 AM
That is ****ing absurd lol

Good stuff btw. I was interested in how ridiculous it was and i'm amazed.

To me, this team is simply not worth 200 million dollars. But whatever floats Dan Gilbert's boat.

they got to the finals and would have made more money than they lost last years which makes it worth it... as long as they are making money which they will because they will sell out every game and be in the finals yet again everything will be fine.

Raps08-09 Champ
07-03-2015, 12:29 AM
Let them.

NFLNBA
07-03-2015, 02:04 AM
Lmao what more does LeBron need lol get him a 120 mil dollar roster and try again. I have never seen a man catered to so much and have to much talent come to him and be 2-6 in his finals lol he is biggest finals loser

FriedTofuz
07-03-2015, 02:17 AM
Lmao what more does LeBron need lol get him a 120 mil dollar roster and try again. I have never seen a man catered to so much and have to much talent come to him and be 2-6 in his finals lol he is biggest finals loser

I knew you were a lebron hater after this before reading the rest of your post :laugh2:

More-Than-Most
07-03-2015, 02:32 AM
Lmao what more does LeBron need lol get him a 120 mil dollar roster and try again. I have never seen a man catered to so much and have to much talent come to him and be 2-6 in his finals lol he is biggest finals loser

His team isnt better than several teams out west if you actually understand basketball... They have this high dollar amount because this is the only way to get James Help by overpaying their players to stay.

airforceones25
07-03-2015, 03:06 AM
$205 million.. That's is? You haven't heard Floyd Mayweather makes that in 36 minutes of work. Lol

DeadWrestler
07-03-2015, 03:10 AM
Cavs would be dumb to go into the season with 5 big men making 10 million+. They will trade Varejao and Haywood before they take the cap hits. They will probably trade for a couple of cheap pieces in their back court.

C Tristan Thompson
PF Kevin Love
SF Lebron James
SG Iman Shumpert
PG Kyrie Irving

Backups
C Timofey Mozgov

If they resign Delly then make a couple moves for some back court players this team will be set, and not nearly as expensive as people are pretending.

DeadWrestler
07-03-2015, 03:12 AM
I love that lineup by the way. Mozgov might start instead, but I expect this to be the main lineup next season for the cavs. They could be the best defensive and offensive team in the NBA next year. The talent is all there.

ROY 2 MVP Braun
07-03-2015, 04:03 AM
I love that lineup by the way. Mozgov might start instead, but I expect this to be the main lineup next season for the cavs. They could be the best defensive and offensive team in the NBA next year. The talent is all there.

IDK if I like the idea of Shump starting at the 2. Do they have any other options? I do like Thompson and Love starting together. That may be a blessing in disguise because than AV can come off the bench and not log so many minutes leading to him being healthy next season. Figure he'd be behind TT, Love, and Mozgov.
Or do you think they'll try to trade AV or Mozgov for back court help?
I don't think they get anything or anyone worth anything for Haywoods non guaranteed deal.

jerellh528
07-03-2015, 04:11 AM
I read they could try to move love within the next year. You think if love believes these rumblings he breaks off the deal? They can't technically sign until like the 10th right?

http://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nba/report-cavs-could-put-love-on-trading-block-within-next-year/ar-AAcvmlp

bucketss
07-03-2015, 04:16 AM
Lmao what more does LeBron need lol get him a 120 mil dollar roster and try again. I have never seen a man catered to so much and have to much talent come to him and be 2-6 in his finals lol he is biggest finals loser

your comment would have credibility if you didn't count the 2007/2015 finals losses considering he was playing with scrubs in one, and three starters out in the other.


overall i give this comment 1/10.

DeadWrestler
07-03-2015, 05:08 AM
IDK if I like the idea of Shump starting at the 2. Do they have any other options? I do like Thompson and Love starting together. That may be a blessing in disguise because than AV can come off the bench and not log so many minutes leading to him being healthy next season. Figure he'd be behind TT, Love, and Mozgov.
Or do you think they'll try to trade AV or Mozgov for back court help?
I don't think they get anything or anyone worth anything for Haywoods non guaranteed deal.

Oh absolutely. He has his whole career. He's definitely more the build of a SF but when you play behind Carmelo then behind LBJ you're gonna play another position if you want minutes :).

Shump plays monster defense, and is good at moving without the ball. He provides spacing on offense while being a huge energy boost on defense. Plus he's young. He's getting better. The more minutes he gets with this lineup the more you'll see him gel.

Then you got Lebron playing his typical point forward role, and Kyrie being Kyrie. Thompson is an excellent defender who will be as good as any player in the game at switching in the next couple of years. Then Love is still an offensive force that is probably still (even after a down season) the best, or close to the best stretch 4 in the game. Then you got Mozgov as a rim protector who allows versatility to your lineup. You can switch him for Love to play big and physical or switch him up with Thompson to create more spacing.

Haywood is actually the guy I think that would be easiest to trade. He can be waived at anytime without any cap hit. A team that is looking to make a free agent signing while dumping a player for cap space would likely look to trade for Haywood's contract and terminate it. Maybe the Mavs/Clippers/Spurs/Rockets depending on what happens to Aldridge or Jordan.

(There's an article about this already but I can't post it apparently because I'm too new)

Andy V might be a bit more difficult. They might just have to bite the bullet, and trade him and a couple of picks for peanuts, or they might get lucky and get a tanking team to get rid of a cheap contract guard or something. I don't think either are untradeable though.

They have to trade Andy and Haywood. There really isn't an option. With Love/Mozgov/Thompson they won't have the minutes to have a 4th big man making 10 mill a year.

Lastly I just wanted to mention on a separate matter that that the cap is going up by a lot after next season. I would bet that the Cavs will draw a line in the sand at 90-95 million and then they'll have another chunk of money to spend next season.

Edit: Bad Math

ROY 2 MVP Braun
07-03-2015, 05:19 AM
I read they could try to move love within the next year. You think if love believes these rumblings he breaks off the deal? They can't technically sign until like the 10th right?

http://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nba/report-cavs-could-put-love-on-trading-block-within-next-year/ar-AAcvmlp


I would if I were him or at least not a 5 year deal. I'd tell them I wanna switch to a 2 year deal with a player option on year 2.
Players can still back out. I remember Carlos Boozer and the Cavs agreeing on a deal only for him to bolt to Utah when it was time to sign. It's obviously looked down upon, but if the teams thinking about trading you before you even sign your contract than why not!

DeadWrestler
07-03-2015, 05:23 AM
your comment would have credibility if you didn't count the 2007/2015 finals losses considering he was playing with scrubs in one, and three starters out in the other.


overall i give this comment 1/10.

Also he's 2-4 in the finals or has won 2/6 finals...

ROY 2 MVP Braun
07-03-2015, 05:43 AM
[QUOTE=ROY 2 MVP Braun;30129223]
Oh absolutely. He has his whole career. He's definitely more the build of a SF but when you play behind Carmelo then behind LBJ you're gonna play another position if you want minutes :).

Shump plays monster defense, and is good at moving without the ball. He provides spacing on offense while being a huge energy boost on defense. Plus he's young. He's getting better. The more minutes he gets with this lineup the more you'll see him gel.

Then you got Lebron playing his typical point forward role, and Kyrie being Kyrie. Thompson is an excellent defender who will be as good as any player in the game at switching in the next couple of years. Then Love is still an offensive force that is probably still (even after a down season) the best, or close to the best stretch 4 in the game. Then you got Mozgov as a rim protector who allows versatility to your lineup. You can switch him for Love to play big and physical or switch him up with Thompson to create more spacing.

Haywood is actually the guy I think that would be easiest to trade. He can be waived at anytime without any cap hit. A team that is looking to make a free agent signing while dumping a player for cap space would likely look to trade for Haywood's contract and terminate it. Maybe the Mavs/Clippers/Spurs/Rockets depending on what happens to Aldridge or Jordan.

(There's an article about this already but I can't post it apparently because I'm too new)

Andy V might be a bit more difficult. They might just have to bite the bullet, and trade him and a couple of picks for peanuts, or they might get lucky and get a tanking team to get rid of a cheap contract guard or something. I don't think either are untradeable though.

They have to trade Andy and Haywood. There really isn't an option. With Love/Mozgov/Thompson they won't have the minutes to have a 4th big man making 10 mill a year.

Lastly I just wanted to mention on a separate matter that that the cap is going up by a lot after next season. I would bet that the Cavs will draw a line in the sand at 87-89 million (just under that highest luxury tax hits) and then they'll have another chunk of money to spend next season.

Yeah I like the hustle and defense Shump bring to the table, but just think they need a better shooter from the 2. He was huge for them this year and had a good showing in the playoffs. Hopefully he can improve his spot up 3pt shooting this offseason because than he'd be the perfect fit.

I didn't think about a team trying to sign a free agent and not having enough cap space. Yeah that would work for one of the western conference teams trying to sign LA or Jordan. Just not sure what any of those teams would have to offer. Maybe if LA agrees to go to Phoenix they would send Cleveland the other Morris twin and PJ Tucker for Haywood so they could cut him to clear the cap to be able to give LA the max. Not sure if Cleveland would want PJ or Morris, but they could turn around and look for trades for players they feel fit better.

As far as AV goes I totally forgot he's making 10 mil+ Thing is would Lebron be okay with AV being traded? I know they're close friends. Be interesting to see if maybe Lebron would be like ship out Mozgov and keep Andy. They probably get more for Mozgov but he's also the more valuable piece to the team. Interesting....

I don't think Gilbert cares about the tax. He probably still would make a ton of money. I could even see him being OK with being in the tax for this season and losing money this season especially if it ups the chances of Lebron, Love, and Irving bringing a championship to Cleveland.

JasonJohnHorn
07-03-2015, 06:52 AM
They will be WELL over the cap this upcoming season, but the following season, with the cap jumping up, they won't be in bad shape at all. And what's more, they'll have these other guys locked in while other teams are going well over the cap.


Oh... and don't forget Hayward contract, which they may be using for a sign-and-trade to take on another contract.

Iron24th
07-03-2015, 07:10 AM
Commish should veto them...

for basketball reasons.

Vee-Rex
07-03-2015, 09:09 AM
Oh absolutely. He has his whole career. He's definitely more the build of a SF but when you play behind Carmelo then behind LBJ you're gonna play another position if you want minutes :).

Shump plays monster defense, and is good at moving without the ball. He provides spacing on offense while being a huge energy boost on defense. Plus he's young. He's getting better. The more minutes he gets with this lineup the more you'll see him gel.

Then you got Lebron playing his typical point forward role, and Kyrie being Kyrie. Thompson is an excellent defender who will be as good as any player in the game at switching in the next couple of years. Then Love is still an offensive force that is probably still (even after a down season) the best, or close to the best stretch 4 in the game. Then you got Mozgov as a rim protector who allows versatility to your lineup. You can switch him for Love to play big and physical or switch him up with Thompson to create more spacing.

Haywood is actually the guy I think that would be easiest to trade. He can be waived at anytime without any cap hit. A team that is looking to make a free agent signing while dumping a player for cap space would likely look to trade for Haywood's contract and terminate it. Maybe the Mavs/Clippers/Spurs/Rockets depending on what happens to Aldridge or Jordan.

(There's an article about this already but I can't post it apparently because I'm too new)

Andy V might be a bit more difficult. They might just have to bite the bullet, and trade him and a couple of picks for peanuts, or they might get lucky and get a tanking team to get rid of a cheap contract guard or something. I don't think either are untradeable though.

They have to trade Andy and Haywood. There really isn't an option. With Love/Mozgov/Thompson they won't have the minutes to have a 4th big man making 10 mill a year.

Lastly I just wanted to mention on a separate matter that that the cap is going up by a lot after next season. I would bet that the Cavs will draw a line in the sand at 90-95 million and then they'll have another chunk of money to spend next season.

Edit: Bad Math

You've pretty much hurt the LBJ/Cavs haters. Lol, great post.

It's Dan Gilbert's money. Do people think the fans and/or LeBron care? Dude is a mafia billionaire. He owns all of Detroit and half of Cleveland (including our casino which is generating revenue for him like MAD). He owns casinos in Detroit and Cincinnati as well.

We'll be fine. I'm sure Gilbert is willing to fork it over until we win one championship, at which point he'd probably look to cut costs.

WITZ
07-03-2015, 12:01 PM
I read they could try to move love within the next year. You think if love believes these rumblings he breaks off the deal? They can't technically sign until like the 10th right?

http://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nba/report-cavs-could-put-love-on-trading-block-within-next-year/ar-AAcvmlp

lmao never change media. Love how the narrative was love was leaving at first ,now that he is prepared to sign its switched to they could potentially deal him away :laugh2:

Aust
07-03-2015, 12:20 PM
Shows what a hypocrite Gilbert is. He's the only reason I dislike the Cavs.

MILLERHIGHLIFE
07-03-2015, 12:48 PM
I read they could try to move love within the next year. You think if love believes these rumblings he breaks off the deal? They can't technically sign until like the 10th right?

http://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nba/report-cavs-could-put-love-on-trading-block-within-next-year/ar-AAcvmlp


Yeah I read that on front page when I booted up my PC this morning.

LakerShow
07-03-2015, 01:04 PM
Commish should veto them...

gilbert is the ultimate hypocrite. for basketball reasons lol.

Scoots
07-03-2015, 02:10 PM
Cavs would be dumb to go into the season with 5 big men making 10 million+. They will trade Varejao and Haywood before they take the cap hits.

not nearly as expensive as people are pretending.

AV is LeBron's best buddy, is unhealthy, and has a bad contract ... they don't have the resources to move him. Heywood can just have his option not picked up and be gone so likely he's off the roster.

They will be over the tax and after that it's all bad news financially.

Scoots
07-03-2015, 02:15 PM
They will be WELL over the cap this upcoming season, but the following season, with the cap jumping up, they won't be in bad shape at all. And what's more, they'll have these other guys locked in while other teams are going well over the cap.


Oh... and don't forget Hayward contract, which they may be using for a sign-and-trade to take on another contract.

But after next season when LeBron opts out and re-signs for $33M they will be right back over the tax.

DeadWrestler
07-03-2015, 03:15 PM
AV is LeBron's best buddy, is unhealthy, and has a bad contract ... they don't have the resources to move him. Heywood can just have his option not picked up and be gone so likely he's off the roster.

They will be over the tax and after that it's all bad news financially.

Andy V can be easily moved. He is on the final year of his deal. There will be plenty of people looking for a short term big man. Especially with all the teams that will have insane cap space left over after Aldridge and Jordan sign. It might just be a dump off move where they don't get anything in return, but this will be an extremely easy year to move him.

They might just get rid of Haywood, but again his value could be great for a team that is looking to make cap space. I would say trading Haywood to Spurs for Patty Mills, and maybe even squeeze a pick or 2 out of them. Spurs will be looking to make space if they sign Aldridge and that would free up 13 million for them. Then Cleveland would get a back up guard. Then sign maybe tayshaun prince/Delly. A few filler players, and they would be set for the season.

smith&wesson
07-03-2015, 03:41 PM
Obviously Haywood has to go.

Teeboy1487
07-03-2015, 04:16 PM
I would love to see Lebron win a championship for the city of Cleveland. They are due but at the same time, I despise Gilbert. I hate him and his hypocritical ways.

Scoots
07-03-2015, 05:31 PM
Andy V can be easily moved. He is on the final year of his deal. There will be plenty of people looking for a short term big man. Especially with all the teams that will have insane cap space left over after Aldridge and Jordan sign. It might just be a dump off move where they don't get anything in return, but this will be an extremely easy year to move him.

They might just get rid of Haywood, but again his value could be great for a team that is looking to make cap space. I would say trading Haywood to Spurs for Patty Mills, and maybe even squeeze a pick or 2 out of them. Spurs will be looking to make space if they sign Aldridge and that would free up 13 million for them. Then Cleveland would get a back up guard. Then sign maybe tayshaun prince/Delly. A few filler players, and they would be set for the season.

Varejao has 3 years and $29M left on his contract.

WITZ
07-03-2015, 05:52 PM
Varejao has 3 years and $29M left on his contract.

Most likely 2, since 3rd year is team option that should be declined lol.

GeronimoSon
07-03-2015, 06:07 PM
Obviously Haywood has to go.

Go where?.. for what? or who?

DeadWrestler
07-03-2015, 06:26 PM
Varejao has 3 years and $29M left on his contract.

My bad I thought this was his last year with his option year after that. But apparently he's got 2 more then his option.

Still think he can easily be moved though. Going to be a lot of teams with extra cap room who need big men.