PDA

View Full Version : Is it okay for a referee to tell a player to shut up?



RLundi
06-12-2015, 03:56 PM
In game 4 yesterday between the Cavs and Warriors, Mozgov was approaching Joey Crawford about a foul that was called, and Crawford angrily retorted, "Do me a favor and SHUT UP!"

http://www.sbnation.com/lookit/2015/6/12/8771307/obnoxious-nba-referee-joey-crawford-told-timofey-mozgov-to-shut-up

Was he out of place? We know players routinely yell and scream and berate and disrespect officials in the heat of the game, but is it okay for the referees to yell or scream or berate or disrespect the players back? Was Crawford unprofessional? Should he be fined or suspended?

Pierzynski4Prez
06-12-2015, 03:59 PM
They can say whatever they want. Just do insinuate that a players mother went to hell instead of heaven, like what happened to Jackie Moon.

ILLUSIONIST^248
06-12-2015, 04:01 PM
Sure they can, just imagine how annoying it is to have 20 players cry and complain for 48 minutes.

Gibby23
06-12-2015, 04:03 PM
SUre, better than giving him a T

Big Zo
06-12-2015, 04:03 PM
They can. But Joey Crawford is still a douche.

Hawkeye15
06-12-2015, 04:08 PM
Sure they can, just imagine how annoying it is to have 20 players cry and complain for 48 minutes.

haha, exactly this. You left out coaches, who can be even worse...

Refs get aggravated and stressed too, they are only humans. And they know all the players pretty well.

I would have said a lot worse than that over the years to a ton of players.

"Timmy, put your ****ing eyeballs back inside your eye sockets, turn around, and walk the other way...."

2-ONE-5
06-12-2015, 04:10 PM
so the players can say whatever they want but the refs cant?

kingsdelez24
06-12-2015, 04:18 PM
Not from the ref who challenged Tim Duncan to a fight for laughing on the bench

IndyRealist
06-12-2015, 04:21 PM
He could have T'd him up, or tossed him depending if he thought Mosgov was disrespecting the ref. Was Crawford the lead ref that game? Because if he was then it was his place to step in when Mosgov was badgering another ref. That was the BEST case for the Cavs, frankly.

D-Leethal
06-12-2015, 04:22 PM
Come on dude, they are big boys.

Raps18-19 Champ
06-12-2015, 04:22 PM
I'm fine with them talking to players and explaining their POV but not things that would provoke the players, especially when refs are wrong consistently.

Obviously a guy telling you to shut up could provoke a player. If Mozgov said something back to him, Joey gives him the T, Mozgov gets fined, other team gets a FT, and Joey probably goes unharmed.

IndyRealist
06-12-2015, 04:31 PM
I'm fine with them talking to players and explaining their POV but not things that would provoke the players, especially when refs are wrong consistently.

Obviously a guy telling you to shut up could provoke a player. If Mozgov said something back to him, Joey gives him the T, Mozgov gets fined, other team gets a FT, and Joey probably goes unharmed.
The refs don't have to explain anything to the players, other than "You don't like the call? Tough." Being 7'1" and stomping up and screaming at a ref is far more provocative than telling someone to shut up. The refs are authority figures on the court, they have to establish that they are in charge to people who are bigger, more famous, and make loads more money. You don't get to question the refs, the NBA has always held that position.

Hawkeye15
06-12-2015, 04:34 PM
The refs don't have to explain anything to the players, other than "You don't like the call? Tough." Being 7'1" and stomping up and screaming at a ref is far more provocative than telling someone to shut up. The refs are authority figures on the court, they have to establish that they are in charge to people who are bigger, more famous, and make loads more money. You don't get to question the refs, the NBA has always held that position.

furthermore, all refs are rated. If you are a problem, you will work yourself out of the league fast.

Kevj77
06-12-2015, 04:35 PM
SUre, better than giving him a T+1

Raps18-19 Champ
06-12-2015, 04:40 PM
The refs don't have to explain anything to the players, other than "You don't like the call? Tough." Being 7'1" and stomping up and screaming at a ref is far more provocative than telling someone to shut up. The refs are authority figures on the court, they have to establish that they are in charge to people who are bigger, more famous, and make loads more money. You don't get to question the refs, the NBA has always held that position.

I never once said they have to explain themselves. I'm saying if they want to, they can go ahead and talk to them.

PowerHouse
06-12-2015, 06:10 PM
haha, exactly this. You left out coaches, who can be even worse...



The players are out there to play the game and keep their mouths shut. The head coaches are out there to verbally communicate with players, refs, etc. So its accepted from the refs to listen to the complaints or other various issues from the coaches as long as it doesnt get too disrespectful.

Jarvo
06-12-2015, 08:00 PM
Hell yeah, These players today are soft as baby **** and always screaming and "aayyyyeeee" when they get touched in the paint lol

RLundi
06-12-2015, 08:14 PM
The professionalism of a referee doesn't matter? That's like a student mouthing off and a teacher stooping to his level by insulting him back. They have their jobs because they are supposed to be looked at as higher than the subordinates, so to speak. The players can do whatever they want, that's on them and there'll be adequate punishment for that. But a ref is supposed to be held to a higher standard isn't he?

Imagine if a ref was out there yelling at players, verbally insulting them, telling them to "shut the **** up, you piece of ****," that wouldn't fly, would it? That's an abuse of power. The way Crawford was speaking to Mozgov is a cut below that. It wouldn't be long before Crawford felt like he COULD say whatever he wanted, if the NBA doesn't step in and fine him or discipline him in some manner.

GiantsSwaGG
06-12-2015, 08:19 PM
Joey Crawford a triple OG, he can do whatever he wants

JasonJohnHorn
06-12-2015, 08:27 PM
I think it depends on context. If a player is getting away with an illegal move and the officials call it the wrong way, I think it is reasonable for the player to make his case, not so much to reverse the call, but so that the officials can keep an eye on it later in the game.

If a player is badgering an official, demanding a reversal, or repeatedly saying the same thing and the official has heard him out, then yeah, have at it: SHUT UP!

It'd be more professional to just tell them the conversation is done and let them know they'll be T'd up if they continue.

That said, Joey Crawford is an @$$

kubernetes
06-12-2015, 09:01 PM
furthermore, all refs are rated. If you are a problem, you will work yourself out of the league fast.

The fact that guys like Joey Crawford still have jobs would seem to belie that statement.

flea
06-12-2015, 09:11 PM
Lol this thread could only have been created by someone between the ages of 12 and 25. "Is it okay?" Who gives a rip what is "okay," people get told to shut up all the time. Are we worried that Joey is emotionally abusing some basketball players? qq

RLundi
06-12-2015, 10:13 PM
Lol this thread could only have been created by someone between the ages of 12 and 25. "Is it okay?" Who gives a rip what is "okay," people get told to shut up all the time. Are we worried that Joey is emotionally abusing some basketball players? qq

This retort equally reeks of someone with the IQ of an adolescent. There is such a thing as professionalism, undoubtedly not in the high school you attend, but in a league in which the officials rise above the conduct of the players, I'd imagine it.

Phantom Dreamer
06-12-2015, 10:15 PM
I saw this and of course the ABC/ESPN camera cut away.

bleedprple&gold
06-13-2015, 02:23 AM
A ref told a player to shut up? Omg no way! I'm sure refs have told players much worse and vice versa. Not sure why this is even a story...

Minimal
06-13-2015, 03:44 AM
There is no professionalism to this ref. He can't even do his job properly, same time he abuses his powers. You just don't say that to an NBA player. I don't think that players can say something similar to a ref or they are gonna be ejected. Ref needs to understand that players get frustrated and they want to know the reason the call was called, and if you make a lot of unreasonable calls (do a bad job), you will get a lot of angry players. Ref needs to be an impersonation of calm, most NBA refs are like that in NBA, Crawford is obnoxious idiot, who is awful at his job, he should be fired from NBA.

MonroeFAN
06-13-2015, 06:32 AM
I'm fine with it. But perhaps in the after life they will meet again.

jimm120
06-13-2015, 06:51 AM
I say yes. The ref is being even nicer than usual. Instead of giving a tech, they're giving a warning

ghettosean
06-13-2015, 08:03 AM
The professionalism of a referee doesn't matter? That's like a student mouthing off and a teacher stooping to his level by insulting him back. They have their jobs because they are supposed to be looked at as higher than the subordinates, so to speak. The players can do whatever they want, that's on them and there'll be adequate punishment for that. But a ref is supposed to be held to a higher standard isn't he?

Imagine if a ref was out there yelling at players, verbally insulting them, telling them to "shut the **** up, you piece of ****," that wouldn't fly, would it? That's an abuse of power. The way Crawford was speaking to Mozgov is a cut below that. It wouldn't be long before Crawford felt like he COULD say whatever he wanted, if the NBA doesn't step in and fine him or discipline him in some manner.

I think it's the opposite a teacher saying shut up to certain students for disrupting class and that is generally accepted.

Lil Rhody
06-13-2015, 08:56 AM
You don't **** with Joey. The man has seen everything basketball and has s lot of games under his belt........ Hate him when he is a dick to your team but love him when it's the opponent.

I love him as a red because he makes it interesting and you know he don't give a ****

ewing
06-13-2015, 10:07 AM
its never OK to tell someone to shut up.

Alan Shore
06-13-2015, 10:15 AM
Joey Crawford, I thought he became a nice fellow after messing with Timmy.

Who cares about it seriously, but Joe sometimes sends the vibe that he thinks he is as big as the game and the players.

Scoots
06-13-2015, 08:38 PM
Refs often give a nice warning, a not so nice warning, and then a T ... this sounded like an extra warning after the not so nice 2nd warning. I'd consider it a favor.

The best refs (and Crawford is one of them) talk to and get to know the players and the players get to know the refs. It's when the ref DOESN'T give them the warning (rude or not) that the players get upset.

flea
06-13-2015, 09:32 PM
This retort equally reeks of someone with the IQ of an adolescent. There is such a thing as professionalism, undoubtedly not in the high school you attend, but in a league in which the officials rise above the conduct of the players, I'd imagine it.

Whoa everyone look out, big man right here.

Lakers + Giants
06-13-2015, 09:40 PM
I always viewed the refs as the authority when it comes to basketball. I'm not saying I'm right, that's just how I've always seen it.

I have no problem with a ref telling a player to shut up, and if the player said that to the ref, I'd have no problem with the ref giving a T.

moshy2
06-13-2015, 09:52 PM
Nothing wrong with it IMO. The amount of complaining these players do even when they blatantly foul someone is ridiculous. I commend refs for not blowing up on players more. I wouldn't be able to stay calm watching a player slap a guy across both arms and then come yell at me that they didn't touch him. There's 100 worse things he could have said than shut up. This isn't elementary school where shut up is cussing. I highly doubt Mozgov was phased by it or cares

Raps18-19 Champ
06-13-2015, 10:49 PM
Refs often give a nice warning, a not so nice warning, and then a T ... this sounded like an extra warning after the not so nice 2nd warning. I'd consider it a favor.

The best refs (and Crawford is one of them) talk to and get to know the players and the players get to know the refs. It's when the ref DOESN'T give them the warning (rude or not) that the players get upset.

And that's not really right. Refs shouldn't do anything that would provoke a player into a technical (which could happen if a player responds) or anything that would save a player from getting a technical (since they're not going to do it for every player, creating inconsistency).

Scoots
06-14-2015, 12:16 AM
And that's not really right. Refs shouldn't do anything that would provoke a player into a technical (which could happen if a player responds) or anything that would save a player from getting a technical (since they're not going to do it for every player, creating inconsistency).

I don't think you understood me. Let's say a player is calling a ref a phalus inhaler, the ref tells him to stop, he does it again, the ref tells him to stop, the player does it again, at that point would you prefer the ref give him a T/eject him or tell him to "shut up" because obviously he wasn't getting the point when more polite language was used? NOT giving a player a T is a favor if he's been warned.

Gibby23
06-14-2015, 12:21 AM
And that's not really right. Refs shouldn't do anything that would provoke a player into a technical (which could happen if a player responds) or anything that would save a player from getting a technical (since they're not going to do it for every player, creating inconsistency).

Have you played an organized sport? You sound soft. Shut up!

Raps18-19 Champ
06-14-2015, 12:25 AM
I don't think you understood me. Let's say a player is calling a ref a phalus inhaler, the ref tells him to stop, he does it again, the ref tells him to stop, the player does it again, at that point would you prefer the ref give him a T/eject him or tell him to "shut up" because obviously he wasn't getting the point when more polite language was used? NOT giving a player a T is a favor if he's been warned.

No I understood you and that's my point. Refs is doing a player a favor by not giving him a tech that he deserves, when he shouldn't be doing anyone any favours. If a guy does something to deserve the tech,then it's pretty simple and he should get the technical foul. A ref shouldn't bail out players and if a player didn't understand the ref the first couple of times, then that's his fault.

And in that scenario, I expect a technical. If the rule of thumb is say 2 warnings before a tech, give him the tech. If a ref saves player X from a technical, then he better save player Y in that same situation but the ref more than likely wouldn't.

Raps18-19 Champ
06-14-2015, 12:29 AM
Have you played an organized sport? You sound soft. Shut up!

Soft how? By advocating that it's not Joey's job to do Mozgov any favours or to provoke him. If Mozgov deserves a tech there, give him the ****ing tech. Telling him to shut up could have resulted in the Warriors missing an extra FT when he had no right to "protect" Mozgov.

Gibby23
06-14-2015, 12:31 AM
Soft how? By advocating that it's not Joey's job to do Mozgov any favours or to provoke him. If Mozgov deserves a tech there, give him the ****ing tech.

Mozgov was on the verge of a tech. He told him to shut up. He shut up an no tech. You still soft.

Gibby23
06-14-2015, 12:33 AM
He did Green some favors by not T ' ing him up a few times.

Raps18-19 Champ
06-14-2015, 12:34 AM
Mozgov was on the verge of a tech. He told him to shut up. He shut up an no tech. You still soft.

Yup, and it cost the Warriors a FT. One they didn't need but one that should have happened. Joey's given out how many techs? How many times has he tried to save a player from a tech before? Maybe he should have told TD to shut up on the bench before giving him techs.

But yea, so soft for wanting the game to be called fairly and accurately.

Gibby23
06-14-2015, 12:37 AM
Yup, and it cost the Warriors a FT. One they didn't need but one that should have happened. Joey's given out how many techs? How many times has he tried to save a player from a tech before? Maybe he should have told TD to shut up on the bench before giving him techs.

But yea, so soft for wanting the game to be called fairly and accurately.

He let a bunch go on both sides.

Raps18-19 Champ
06-14-2015, 12:37 AM
He did Green some favors by not T ' ing him up a few times.

And Green should have gotten techs in those situations.

It's really no different than when refs allow players to play more physical (which usually benefits teams who may be in foul trouble, in the penalty, late in the game, etc), resulting in missed foul calls that should have been called.

Gibby23
06-14-2015, 12:41 AM
And Green should have gotten techs in those situations.

It's really no different than when refs allow players to play more physical (which usually benefits teams who may be in foul trouble, in the penalty, late in the game, etc), resulting in missed foul calls that should have been called.

Refs are allowed to ref how they see fit. They are not deciding a finals game on free thows.

Raps18-19 Champ
06-14-2015, 12:41 AM
He let a bunch go on both sides.

Last I checked, a tech is a tech. And you just told me Green should have gotten a few. So assuming that's true, it should have resulted in an ejection and given the Cavs 2 FTs.

Just because he let it go on both sides doesn't make it any better really. It's like disregarding fouls for both teams because you allow players to get more physical on the court, which happens a lot in the playoffs and most of the time, it's usually 1 team who benefits more than the other.

Raps18-19 Champ
06-14-2015, 12:44 AM
Refs are allowed to ref how they see fit. They are not deciding a finals game on free thows.

Not really. They are supposed to call the game based on the rulebook.

You know how everyone complains about superstar calls, even though a foul should really be a foul, regardless of who the offensive and defensive player is? Yea, but saying what you just said, you're encouraging inconsistencies like that.

Gibby23
06-14-2015, 12:45 AM
Not really. They are supposed to call the game based on the rulebook.
There is no rule book on Ts

Raps18-19 Champ
06-14-2015, 12:50 AM
There is no rule book on Ts

Technical fouls are clearly classified in the NBA rulebook. Section V - Conduct.

http://www.nba.com/analysis/rules_12.html?nav=ArticleList



a. An official may assess a technical foul, without prior warning, at any time. A technical foul(s) may be assessed to any player on the court or anyone seated on the bench for conduct which, in the opinion of an official, is detrimental to the game. A technical foul cannot be assessed for physical contact when the ball is alive.

...

d. A technical foul shall be assessed for unsportsmanlike tactics such as:
(1) Disrespectfully addressing an official
(2) Physically contacting an official
(3) Overt actions indicating resentment to a call
(4) Use of profanity
(5) A coach entering onto the court without permission of an official
(6) A deliberately-thrown elbow or any attempted physical act with no con-tact involved
(7) Taunting

So if Mozgov committed those acts, then a tech should be easily called.

And if he didn't do those acts, then why is Joey telling him to shut up? To "save" him from a tech that should/might be called in the future and will probably benefit 1 team over another?

IBleedPurple
06-14-2015, 02:08 AM
Technical fouls are clearly classified in the NBA rulebook. Section V - Conduct.

http://www.nba.com/analysis/rules_12.html?nav=ArticleList



a. An official may assess a technical foul, without prior warning, at any time. A technical foul(s) may be assessed to any player on the court or anyone seated on the bench for conduct which, in the opinion of an official, is detrimental to the game. A technical foul cannot be assessed for physical contact when the ball is alive.

...

d. A technical foul shall be assessed for unsportsmanlike tactics such as:
(1) Disrespectfully addressing an official
(2) Physically contacting an official
(3) Overt actions indicating resentment to a call
(4) Use of profanity
(5) A coach entering onto the court without permission of an official
(6) A deliberately-thrown elbow or any attempted physical act with no con-tact involved
(7) Taunting

So if Mozgov committed those acts, then a tech should be easily called.

And if he didn't do those acts, then why is Joey telling him to shut up? To "save" him from a tech that should/might be called in the future and will probably benefit 1 team over another?1 and 3 are not even close to a fine line, way too much room for subjectivity. Do you want Ts for every argued call? Better start up about 2 more D-Leagues.

RLundi
06-14-2015, 05:53 AM
Whoa everyone look out, big man right here.

Did you feel cool typing that?

IndyRealist
06-14-2015, 07:16 AM
Technical fouls are clearly classified in the NBA rulebook. Section V - Conduct.

http://www.nba.com/analysis/rules_12.html?nav=ArticleList



So if Mozgov committed those acts, then a tech should be easily called.

And if he didn't do those acts, then why is Joey telling him to shut up? To "save" him from a tech that should/might be called in the future and will probably benefit 1 team over another?

Sorry but you can't argue both sides. You say that Crawford would provoke him into a tech, AND that Crawford was no-calling a tech that should have happened anyway. You're arguing that Crawford both should be more restrained and that he was too restrained, at the same time. Your arguments contradict each other. That's something people do when they just want to win an argument, not to prove their point.

Scoots
06-14-2015, 10:52 AM
Yup, and it cost the Warriors a FT. One they didn't need but one that should have happened. Joey's given out how many techs? How many times has he tried to save a player from a tech before? Maybe he should have told TD to shut up on the bench before giving him techs.

But yea, so soft for wanting the game to be called fairly and accurately.

When it comes to talk there are no specific rules. It's the refs job to keep the game from getting out of hand and they have a lot of tools more than just techs to do that. Do you think police should warn, warn, shoot too? Or do you think there is room for variety in how officials respond to people and situations?

Hawkeye15
06-14-2015, 01:06 PM
The fact that guys like Joey Crawford still have jobs would seem to belie that statement.

problem is, his calls are probably correct at a high rate. His theatrics are terrible at times, but he does a good job.

And do people want to just get rid of a lot of these refs? If there were better, they would be in the league.

Hawkeye15
06-14-2015, 01:08 PM
He did Green some favors by not T ' ing him up a few times.

exactly. Green had 3 times where I thought he could have gotten a T

Hawkeye15
06-14-2015, 01:11 PM
Technical fouls are clearly classified in the NBA rulebook. Section V - Conduct.

http://www.nba.com/analysis/rules_12.html?nav=ArticleList



So if Mozgov committed those acts, then a tech should be easily called.

And if he didn't do those acts, then why is Joey telling him to shut up? To "save" him from a tech that should/might be called in the future and will probably benefit 1 team over another?

refs are also not robots. During the regular season, sure, Green probably gets a T or booted for overreacting like he did for example. One ref might think a player is being excessive, another may not. Refs still have to interpret the rules if they aren't straight up obvious violations.

And I guarantee you players and coaches are given more leeway in the playoffs. Emotions are much higher, the intensity level and aggressiveness is much higher. It's why the pool of refs for the playoffs is a small one. Only the best rated get to ref those games.

ILLUSIONIST^248
06-14-2015, 01:32 PM
Lol this thread could only have been created by someone between the ages of 12 and 25. "Is it okay?" Who gives a rip what is "okay," people get told to shut up all the time. Are we worried that Joey is emotionally abusing some basketball players? qq

Good post

NYKnickFanatic
06-14-2015, 02:28 PM
Funniest part is Lionel laughing in the back. :laugh2:

Raps18-19 Champ
06-14-2015, 02:41 PM
Sorry but you can't argue both sides. You say that Crawford would provoke him into a tech, AND that Crawford was no-calling a tech that should have happened anyway. You're arguing that Crawford both should be more restrained and that he was too restrained, at the same time. Your arguments contradict each other. That's something people do when they just want to win an argument, not to prove their point.

Not close to what I said. I said they should call techs in the normal course of the game, not something the refs may cause. I want techs to be called. I just dont want techs to occur because a ref provoked him. If it was a player provoking another player, call techs all you want.

Raps18-19 Champ
06-14-2015, 02:44 PM
1 and 3 are not even close to a fine line, way too much room for subjectivity. Do you want Ts for every argued call? Better start up about 2 more D-Leagues.

Of course not, I'm saying telling a guy to shut up is not an appropriate replacement for a tech. If a guy is arguing a call and their whining doesn't deserve a tech, then what grounds does Joey have to tell a player to shut up? I'm only bringing techs into this because everyone here is saying that Joey may have saves Mozgov from a tech, and if he did, then he's wrong.

Raps18-19 Champ
06-14-2015, 02:48 PM
When it comes to talk there are no specific rules. It's the refs job to keep the game from getting out of hand and they have a lot of tools more than just techs to do that. Do you think police should warn, warn, shoot too? Or do you think there is room for variety in how officials respond to people and situations?

I agree they should keep the game in control. They just shouldn't commit actions that could cause the game. Obviously telling a guy to shut up could cause Mozgov responds there. If Joey gives him a T for his response, then Warriors just got a FT for what was really Joeys doing.

I'm not arguing anything so much about warnings. Just warn them properly. If that deserved a tech, give them the tech. If that didn't deserve a tech, then its really Joey who ahould shutup and shouldn't ddo anything that could provoke a techtech and should warn him properly instead.

Raps18-19 Champ
06-14-2015, 02:55 PM
refs are also not robots. During the regular season, sure, Green probably gets a T or booted for overreacting like he did for example. One ref might think a player is being excessive, another may not. Refs still have to interpret the rules if they aren't straight up obvious violations.

And I guarantee you players and coaches are given more leeway in the playoffs. Emotions are much higher, the intensity level and aggressiveness is much higher. It's why the pool of refs for the playoffs is a small one. Only the best rated get to ref those games.

That's fine by me. If you dont given him a tech, whatever.

I'm just saying there was no grounds for the ref telling the guy to shut up ( people here were sayong its fine brcause he saved Mozgov a tech). If ref said "stop complaining like a ***** and play on", we'll all probably laugh but will we excuse him too?

Raps18-19 Champ
06-14-2015, 03:03 PM
exactly. Green had 3 times where I thought he could have gotten a T

Its not so much they're allowing leeway for techs, its that Joeys actions could have caused a tech.

Scoots
06-14-2015, 03:40 PM
I don't think a ref telling a player to shut up could cause the player to retaliate.

Raps18-19 Champ
06-14-2015, 03:42 PM
It could, and that could be an issue. It's an emotional game, so if someone tells someone else to shut up, it could cause a tech, and while it would technically be a valid tech in a player retaliates in a certain way, I'm sure no one would want a tech to occur because the ref may have provoked him.

Hawkeye15
06-14-2015, 03:45 PM
That's fine by me. If you dont given him a tech, whatever.

I'm just saying there was no grounds for the ref telling the guy to shut up ( people here were sayong its fine brcause he saved Mozgov a tech). If ref said "stop complaining like a ***** and play on", we'll all probably laugh but will we excuse him too?

I am not sure you are rating the intensity level and pressure going on though. I could never be a ref, I would get my *** beat

Raps18-19 Champ
06-14-2015, 03:52 PM
I am not sure you are rating the intensity level and pressure going on though. I could never be a ref, I would get my *** beat

I'm sure refs have a hard job, but just because there's a lot of pressure doesn't make it okay (the question of the thread). I've seen Joey ref a playoff game just fine before.

Vinylman
06-14-2015, 03:59 PM
And that's not really right. Refs shouldn't do anything that would provoke a player into a technical (which could happen if a player responds) or anything that would save a player from getting a technical (since they're not going to do it for every player, creating inconsistency).

solid logic :rolleyes:

the ref is responsible for his actions but the player must be "provoked"

Merica... you are dying a slow miserable progressive death

Raps18-19 Champ
06-14-2015, 04:05 PM
solid logic :rolleyes:

the ref is responsible for his actions but the player must be "provoked"

Merica... you are dying a slow miserable progressive death

Yea, I've been arguing the whole time that if a player deserves a tech, they should get one and the refs shouldn't be bailing them out by telling them to shut up instead (holding them to their actions). I also said that if a player responds to a ref due to being provoked, they should still get a tech because they are responsible for their actions (but it doesn't change the fact that refs shouldn't do anything to put a player into that position to begin with).

But sure, we'll go with what you said. F America too. Which really just made me laugh.

Teufelshunde4
06-14-2015, 04:06 PM
In game 4 yesterday between the Cavs and Warriors, Mozgov was approaching Joey Crawford about a foul that was called, and Crawford angrily retorted, "Do me a favor and SHUT UP!"

http://www.sbnation.com/lookit/2015/6/12/8771307/obnoxious-nba-referee-joey-crawford-told-timofey-mozgov-to-shut-up

Was he out of place? We know players routinely yell and scream and berate and disrespect officials in the heat of the game, but is it okay for the referees to yell or scream or berate or disrespect the players back? Was Crawford unprofessional? Should he be fined or suspended?

Yep the ref, or ump has the right to tell a player to be quiet. There is video of Steve Kerr back when he was a Bull trying to talk to Crawford about a foul call and Crawford very aggressively tell Kerr to turn a around and walk away.

That's one of the things I detest about both the NBA and NFL is after every play players are throwing their hands up *****ing.

Scoots
06-14-2015, 05:50 PM
It could, and that could be an issue. It's an emotional game, so if someone tells someone else to shut up, it could cause a tech, and while it would technically be a valid tech in a player retaliates in a certain way, I'm sure no one would want a tech to occur because the ref may have provoked him.

I think that's an extreme reach.

Raps18-19 Champ
06-14-2015, 06:09 PM
I think that's an extreme reach.

Not really. Never seen a player get a tech after mouthing back at a ref before?

buck4493
06-14-2015, 06:16 PM
Joey Crawford is a Dick

andy2518
06-14-2015, 06:21 PM
It's still better than a T.

Gander13SM
06-15-2015, 04:01 PM
so the players can say whatever they want but the refs cant?

This.

The refs should be saying this more often. Especially to guys that talk a lot.