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View Full Version : Raptors- What offseason moves do they need to make to get over the hump?



FriedTofuz
06-01-2015, 07:40 PM
Disappointed that they lost two 1st round series despite being the atlantic division champs. What can they do? Rehaul the entire roaster and trade lowry and derozan for picks and tank for quality players for a few years? At this point, I think trying to go after Kevin Durant in 2016 Free agency is pointless because this team is worse than Washington and washington is a much more attractive destination for Kevin Durant at this point.

Bruno
06-01-2015, 08:00 PM
i think Toronto should move Lowry while they still can. he's been good the past two seasons and proved a lot of people wrong, but hell be 30 this season. he showed signs of injury/regression/age late this season. he's still an all-star and could land toronto a quality draft pick or rookie/sophmore talent.

I think Toronto should move DeRozen while they still can (or decide right now if he's worth a big max when the cap expands). he is an expiring contract (year after next is play option and he will opt out), and he's going on 26. Will he want to stick around for a rebuild? Is he too talented to allow a lowryless Raptors to get a quality enough lottery pick to make trading Lowry worth it? I think you move DeRozen and get great assets for him, because I think he walks after next season anyways.

Toronto won't get the FA they need to move up another tier in the east. they should put Bruno on the fast track to development, let him start and develop chemistry with Jonas (or trade Joans if you're Masai and you like Nogueira better behind the scenes). Toronto can build around Bruno/Jonas (or Nogueira) along with whatever assets they get for Lowry and Derozen (or Jonas). without those guys, Toronto might be bad enough to get a top pick and take a stab at Thon Maker in 2016.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-VFbiqe0kQ

Toronto won't be getting Durant, but with Bruno and the possibility of getting lottery next season with a rebuild, they might be able to develop their own version of Durant.

I think Masai is forward thinking, and this core along with its coach aren't his guys. he inherited them with the job. GMs always get their own people eventually, I like for Masai to go for it before his top two assets lose value. I think he got a glimpse of this teams ceiling this year, it's not enough.

If Masai can get some one in free agency, different story. Toronto has max cap money. but if he doesn't I expect a rebuild.

GiantsSwaGG
06-01-2015, 08:09 PM
I've said numerous of times they should of let Lowry walk, now their stuck with him. Blow up the roster while you still can.

Bruno
06-01-2015, 08:13 PM
Lowry to Sacramento for #6?

If you're the Kings and you want to build around Boogie and Rudy, how about trying to make a trade for Lowry? Would they trade #6 for Lowry? Lowrys getting 12 M a year through 2018, so if you're the Kings his contract will be a steal if he produces at Toronto levels, and priced accordingly if he drops off.

Sacramento is the only team with a quality lottery pick who's an attractive trade partner for a PG like Lowry, in the sense that they want to win now, and in the sense that they have neither a top 15 PG or a PG who hopes to eventually become one.

Of course, the Kings wouldn't have a need for this had they selected Elfrid Payton over Nik. But right now I think this one might be a fit.

slaker619
06-01-2015, 08:19 PM
They need a better bench and help at 3 position

Bruno
06-01-2015, 08:22 PM
I've said numerous of times they should of let Lowry walk, now their stuck with him. Blow up the roster while you still can.

I mean I think it's classic Masai/Morey GMing and was a good call, in the long run. Toronto without Lowry probably doesn't get a top 10 lottery selection anyways (too much talent left, too poor of a conference). So why not ink up an asset long term on a deal that will look excellent under new television money? Lowry is on a very trade friendly contract. If you're Masai you sign Lowry as an asset and hope he repeats his 2013-2014 campaign. Then you have the flexibility to trade him for a lottery pick next summer, or to take a stab in 2015 FA and grow the core. either way if you're Masai you have options, and thats all you can ask for. Look at a franchise like the Lakers, as big as they are. they haven't had trade pieces because of all the one year deals they signed going back two years. thats not how run the ship, you always collect assets, not rentals.

I think Lowrys value on the trade market is higher than the potential lottery pick they would have gotten after a season of no lowry, with the rest of the pieces still intact. maybe Masai has it worked out with ownership who want Toronto to be exciting, I keep us competitive until 2015 or 2016, but if we can't break the glass ceiling, I blow it up and rebuild the new under my vision. we have no idea how those guys are negating behind the scenes. I think Bruno as his selection last season supports this theory. they snagged him late, but he's a guy who could have been top five in the draft had he waited a few seasons. I think he quietly already acquired the first piece of his rebuild.

If they can work out a deal with Sacramento for the 6th around a Lowry package, Toronto could probably draft Cauley-Stein or Winslow (if Orlando passes on him). That would create a brilliant wing duo of Winslow and Bruno. Imagine if they're bad enough and add Thon Maker in 2016? it'd be amazing. it would have a much higher ceiling. I think Toronto should delay gratification and build something special.

Raps18-19 Champ
06-01-2015, 08:24 PM
They need to blow it up if they want to get over the hump.

GiantsSwaGG
06-01-2015, 08:28 PM
Lowry to Sacramento for #6?

If you're the Kings and you want to build around Boogie and Rudy, how about trying to make a trade for Lowry? Would they trade #6 for Lowry? Lowrys getting 12 M a year through 2018, so if you're the Kings his contract will be a steal if he produces at Toronto levels, and priced accordingly if he drops off.

Sacramento is the only team with a quality lottery pick who's an attractive trade partner for a PG like Lowry, in the sense that they want to win now, and in the sense that they have neither a top 15 PG or a PG who hopes to eventually become one.

Of course, the Kings wouldn't have a need for this had they selected Elfrid Payton over Nik. But right now I think this one might be a fit.

Why would the Kings do that? They're better off keeping Collison (who's younger and cheaper) and keeping the pick. Drafting Kozprings or Kamiskey, they need a stretch 4 to par with Boogie or move Cousins back to the 4 and draft Stein

Bruno
06-01-2015, 08:37 PM
Why would the Kings do that? They're better off keeping Collison (who's younger and cheaper) and keeping the pick. Drafting Kozprings or Kamiskey, they need a stretch 4 to par with Boogie or move Cousins back to the 4 and draft Stein

I think if they keep the pick and Winslow falls to them they should take him. he became an elite three point shooter last year, perfect for them at the SF if boogie is wiling to keep playing center.

they only consider a Lowry trade if Vivek really wants to compete now, and it seems like he does. Lowry and #20 for #6 is interesting for Sacramento. Sacramento won't do anything out west until they develop a third all-star. Is it Mclemore, can they get him with #6? if theres doubt, a trade for Lowry on a great contract is at least interesting.

bucketss
06-01-2015, 08:38 PM
the more i rewatch the first round, the more i think lowry might have quit. than theres also talks he wouldn't resign if casey was still the head coach(obvious bluff but still). if lowry doesn't work out lets go back to rebuilding like we were suppose to after the rudy gay trade.

GiantsSwaGG
06-01-2015, 09:02 PM
I think if they keep the pick and Winslow falls to them they should take him. he became an elite three point shooter last year, perfect for them at the SF if boogie is wiling to keep playing center.

they only consider a Lowry trade if Vivek really wants to compete now, and it seems like he does. Lowry and #20 for #6 is interesting for Sacramento. Sacramento won't do anything out west until they develop a third all-star. Is it Mclemore, can they get him with #6? if theres doubt, a trade for Lowry on a great contract is at least interesting.

Lowry isn't going to help them compete. You're sleeping on Collison, he's an above average PG you can live with. Rebuild right, keep the pick. I doubt Winslow drops (unless the Knicks pass on him which I pray doesn't happen) but Stein, Kamiskey, Porzing are just what the Kings need. But Winslow would make so much sense, move Gay to the 4 where he will be a match up nightmare (similar to Melo) and Winslow can play the 2 or the 3. The Kings just need veteran leadership. Put it like this if they wanted a trading partner, the Pacers are the perfect ones.

Pacers - #6

Kings - #11 pick & David West

The Pacers are in love with Stein but they would have to move up to get him

PG- Colliso
SG- McLemore
SF- Gay
PF- West
C- Cousins

Bench:
Kamiskey (draft pick)
Stauskas
McCullom

That's pretty damn good starting 5, add a couple of veterans in that young bench and they'll be find

FriedTofuz
06-01-2015, 09:32 PM
Trade Lowry and NYK's 2016 1st round pick back to the Knicks for the #4 pick in the draft.
I pray that D'angelo Russel falls to the 4th spot and the sixers take someoen else.

FriedTofuz
06-01-2015, 09:41 PM
Id then trade demar derozan to another team for 2 future 1st round picks
They will likely be mid-late picks if it's to a contending team. Maybe one like the Cleveland.

Sadds The Gr8
06-01-2015, 09:44 PM
Lowry to Sacramento for #6?

If you're the Kings and you want to build around Boogie and Rudy, how about trying to make a trade for Lowry? Would they trade #6 for Lowry? Lowrys getting 12 M a year through 2018, so if you're the Kings his contract will be a steal if he produces at Toronto levels, and priced accordingly if he drops off.

Sacramento is the only team with a quality lottery pick who's an attractive trade partner for a PG like Lowry, in the sense that they want to win now, and in the sense that they have neither a top 15 PG or a PG who hopes to eventually become one.

Of course, the Kings wouldn't have a need for this had they selected Elfrid Payton over Nik. But right now I think this one might be a fit.
I'd gladly do that trade.

Why would the Kings do that? They're better off keeping Collison (who's younger and cheaper) and keeping the pick. Drafting Kozprings or Kamiskey, they need a stretch 4 to par with Boogie or move Cousins back to the 4 and draft Stein
Because they're the kings.

FriedTofuz
06-01-2015, 09:47 PM
I'd gladly do that trade.

Because they're the kings.

Same.

Bruno
06-02-2015, 07:46 PM
Lowry isn't going to help them compete. You're sleeping on Collison, he's an above average PG you can live with. Rebuild right, keep the pick. I doubt Winslow drops (unless the Knicks pass on him which I pray doesn't happen) but Stein, Kamiskey, Porzing are just what the Kings need. But Winslow would make so much sense, move Gay to the 4 where he will be a match up nightmare (similar to Melo) and Winslow can play the 2 or the 3. The Kings just need veteran leadership. Put it like this if they wanted a trading partner, the Pacers are the perfect ones.

Pacers - #6

Kings - #11 pick & David West

The Pacers are in love with Stein but they would have to move up to get him

PG- Colliso
SG- McLemore
SF- Gay
PF- West
C- Cousins

Bench:
Kamiskey (draft pick)
Stauskas
McCullom

That's pretty damn good starting 5, add a couple of veterans in that young bench and they'll be find
I like your trade idea for Indy a lot, but i don't know if David West at his age and recent level of production is worth dropping back five picks in the draft for Sacramento. they need a piece that can complete a big three and I think West is past that point (will be 35 next season, Lowry will be 30). I think Collison is a respectable player. But the position is stacked league wide, Lowry when he's productive is in the 2nd tier of PGs, a couple tiers up from Collison.

The Kings can always move Collison, his contract is trade friendly.

i actually think its better for Sacramento to keep #6, they won't contend for a title with Lowry. but their owner might take a stab at winning now. the trade makes them better for next season for sure, even if they're not top tie title contenders.

Bruno
06-02-2015, 08:00 PM
I'd gladly do that trade.

Because they're the kings.


Same.

is it a little unrealistic skewing too far in favor of Toronto? Is Lowry and #20 for #6 a fair deal?

Sadds The Gr8
06-02-2015, 08:02 PM
is it a little unrealistic skewing too far in favor of Toronto? Is Lowry and #20 for #6 a fair deal?
Maybe I'm biased but it seems fair to me. Or probably the 2016 Knicks pick is more fair than the 20th

Bruno
06-02-2015, 08:05 PM
Maybe I'm biased but it seems fair to me. Or probably the 2016 Knicks pick is more fair than the 20th

do you think Lowry/Knick first is too much for 2016 Knicks. that could be a really good pick to have.
maybe Lowry/20th/Ross

Cal827
06-02-2015, 08:11 PM
Maybe I'm biased but it seems fair to me. Or probably the 2016 Knicks pick is more fair than the 20th

There's no way in hell that I'm trading that Knicks pick. The potential of it being a high one is fairly big (since Denver will probably be rebuilding, and the Knicks are going to need to hit the lottery with FAs)

I think that Ujiri will spend the first part of free agency trying to improve the current team. We have a buttload of money to spend, and some supposed assets (Ross :laugh2: ) that might be able to get teams to send over legitimate players. If those players sign with other teams, then I can immediately see him offering up the team players. Try to lure a team that just lost out on another good player into a bad deal. But we'll see.

GiantsSwaGG
06-02-2015, 08:20 PM
I like your trade idea for Indy a lot, but i don't know if David West at his age and recent level of production is worth dropping back five picks in the draft for Sacramento. they need a piece that can complete a big three and I think West is past that point (will be 35 next season, Lowry will be 30). I think Collison is a respectable player. But the position is stacked league wide, Lowry when he's productive is in the 2nd tier of PGs, a couple tiers up from Collison.

The Kings can always move Collison, his contract is trade friendly.

i actually think its better for Sacramento to keep #6, they won't contend for a title with Lowry. but their owner might take a stab at winning now. the trade makes them better for next season for sure, even if they're not top tie title contenders.

I agree but let's not forget Lowry is injury prone, David West imo has at least 2 more years until he's on the down side. Plus he can mentor Cousins and Kamiskey.

deaner
06-04-2015, 12:01 PM
To me the biggest issue continues to be the coaching. It doesn't matter about the roster moves when the guy with the reins is this inept. You try to add Melvin Hunt for team dynamics, you try to add Shane Battier for intelligence, and you try and add a guy like Sabonis to teach our front court.

IndyRealist
06-04-2015, 12:24 PM
I agree but let's not forget Lowry is injury prone, David West imo has at least 2 more years until he's on the down side. Plus he can mentor Cousins and Kamiskey.

As a Pacers fan, David West is already on the downside.

JasonJohnHorn
06-04-2015, 08:04 PM
I think trading DMDR and Lowry for Klay and Curry would be a HUGE help... they might throw in Lou williams to sweeten the pot. Then do a sign-and-trade for Marc Gasol and send Val to the Grizz. Then sign both Love and LBJ to the vet min, assuming they opt out.

After that, they just need to bring in Rodno, Pierce and Garnett for the vet min to come off the bench, and perhaps see if they can work out a deal to bring Pop in. Maybe let the Spurs swap second round picks in the draft this year and next.

If they get that all done, I think they'd wrap up the finals for the next 3-4 years.

dtmagnet
06-04-2015, 08:43 PM
I think trading DMDR and Lowry for Klay and Curry would be a HUGE help... they might throw in Lou williams to sweeten the pot. Then do a sign-and-trade for Marc Gasol and send Val to the Grizz. Then sign both Love and LBJ to the vet min, assuming they opt out.

After that, they just need to bring in Rodno, Pierce and Garnett for the vet min to come off the bench, and perhaps see if they can work out a deal to bring Pop in. Maybe let the Spurs swap second round picks in the draft this year and next.

If they get that all done, I think they'd wrap up the finals for the next 3-4 years.

What was the point of that.

smith&wesson
06-04-2015, 08:47 PM
Lowry to Sacramento for #6?

If you're the Kings and you want to build around Boogie and Rudy, how about trying to make a trade for Lowry? Would they trade #6 for Lowry? Lowrys getting 12 M a year through 2018, so if you're the Kings his contract will be a steal if he produces at Toronto levels, and priced accordingly if he drops off.

Sacramento is the only team with a quality lottery pick who's an attractive trade partner for a PG like Lowry, in the sense that they want to win now, and in the sense that they have neither a top 15 PG or a PG who hopes to eventually become one.

Of course, the Kings wouldn't have a need for this had they selected Elfrid Payton over Nik. But right now I think this one might be a fit.

Lowry and Gay are best friends, and have played together on the Grizz and Raps. I think they just don't mesh well, it didn't work on either team.

I understand your train of thought on this though.

GiantsSwaGG
06-04-2015, 09:34 PM
I think trading DMDR and Lowry for Klay and Curry would be a HUGE help... they might throw in Lou williams to sweeten the pot. Then do a sign-and-trade for Marc Gasol and send Val to the Grizz. Then sign both Love and LBJ to the vet min, assuming they opt out.

After that, they just need to bring in Rodno, Pierce and Garnett for the vet min to come off the bench, and perhaps see if they can work out a deal to bring Pop in. Maybe let the Spurs swap second round picks in the draft this year and next.

If they get that all done, I think they'd wrap up the finals for the next 3-4 years.

After reading this post, I didn't laugh

albertajaysfan
06-04-2015, 11:04 PM
To me the biggest issue continues to be the coaching. It doesn't matter about the roster moves when the guy with the reins is this inept. You try to add Melvin Hunt for team dynamics, you try to add Shane Battier for intelligence, and you try and add a guy like Sabonis to teach our front court.

Agree that coaching is a huge problem. What do you think of the roster?

I personally believe I rebuild is a good idea. I also wonder if Casey was retained only because winning isn't important next season. I haven't decided one way or another but it seems logical enough.

In terms of the Lowry trade ideas. Only way it happens is if the Raptors take on some contracts. Carl Landry and Jason Thompson's contracts add up, plus I assume Sacramento would love to unload them. A trade for their draft pick would require Sacramento to make the selection and then make the trade after since they have already committed to trading a future first.

As for Derozan I think Charlotte is the perfect trade candidate. Take on Stephenson's contract to facilitate the deal.

ballallday
06-05-2015, 01:04 AM
I think trading DMDR and Lowry for Klay and Curry would be a HUGE help... they might throw in Lou williams to sweeten the pot. Then do a sign-and-trade for Marc Gasol and send Val to the Grizz. Then sign both Love and LBJ to the vet min, assuming they opt out.

After that, they just need to bring in Rodno, Pierce and Garnett for the vet min to come off the bench, and perhaps see if they can work out a deal to bring Pop in. Maybe let the Spurs swap second round picks in the draft this year and next.

If they get that all done, I think they'd wrap up the finals for the next 3-4 years.

I thought it was funny it's just about as accurate as all these other trade proposals u hear thrown out....

Saying stuff like x player should be traded and why great. The other guys post talking bout Bruno and if we keep Val etc was money. But these other trade idea threads are as useless as above post without the funny part. So people getting pissed lighten up

rockets-fan
06-05-2015, 03:48 AM
18th pick
31st pick
Future 1st
Terrance Jones
KJ McDaniels

If they're wanting to dump Lowry why not? Two picks and a future first, Jones has shown awesome potential just don't have enough PT with Dmo and Smith in Houston, and KJ is a young prospect...

vics
06-05-2015, 05:17 AM
Buy a camel. Seriously go for a real superstar.

bucketss
06-05-2015, 03:25 PM
18th pick
31st pick
Future 1st
Terrance Jones
KJ McDaniels

If they're wanting to dump Lowry why not? Two picks and a future first, Jones has shown awesome potential just don't have enough PT with Dmo and Smith in Houston, and KJ is a young prospect...

would do.

deaner
06-05-2015, 09:04 PM
Agree that coaching is a huge problem. What do you think of the roster?

I personally believe I rebuild is a good idea. I also wonder if Casey was retained only because winning isn't important next season. I haven't decided one way or another but it seems logical enough.

In terms of the Lowry trade ideas. Only way it happens is if the Raptors take on some contracts. Carl Landry and Jason Thompson's contracts add up, plus I assume Sacramento would love to unload them. A trade for their draft pick would require Sacramento to make the selection and then make the trade after since they have already committed to trading a future first.

As for Derozan I think Charlotte is the perfect trade candidate. Take on Stephenson's contract to facilitate the deal.

You're talking to the wrong guy. I feel there's no need to worry about the roster if Casey stays. You might as well give him 15 versions of Rasual Butler. Casey's system and rotations aren't worth the effort of paying attention to next season. Spend all the money on a player that Casey can't use to chuck. My frustration with the roster is mostly usage and shot selection. Again the coach is happy with the shots they take... I have nothing to say other than its pathetic. I've been a raps fan from the beginning and I've never witnessed this horrible of a brand. I can't watch it let alone get excited about the upcoming season.

Cal827
06-06-2015, 01:59 AM
18th pick
31st pick
Future 1st
Terrance Jones
KJ McDaniels

If they're wanting to dump Lowry why not? Two picks and a future first, Jones has shown awesome potential just don't have enough PT with Dmo and Smith in Houston, and KJ is a young prospect...

:laugh2: Absolutely Love this offer!

Wow, if this deal is on the table, and Ujiri doesn't jump on it immediately, I'd call for his job.

rockets-fan
06-06-2015, 04:09 PM
:laugh2: Absolutely Love this offer!

Wow, if this deal is on the table, and Ujiri doesn't jump on it immediately, I'd call for his job.

I know it's a lot, but I don't think that the players at 18 or 31 will help Houston make the next step and the future first is to sweeten the deal. Jones really doesn't have a place in Houston anymore because of Dmo and smith and KJ is a filler.

Lowry I think would help Houston get over the hump.

Lowry/Terry/Lull
Harden/Johnson
Ariza/Brewer/Pap
Dmo/Smith
Howard/Capela/Dorsey

I think that lineup can compete with anyone in the league...

Raps18-19 Champ
06-06-2015, 04:21 PM
Contingent he doesn't fight with McHale again.

North Yorker
06-06-2015, 04:47 PM
Can Houston even trade McDaniels? Thought he was a FA this offseason.

mike_noodles
06-06-2015, 05:06 PM
would do.

I'd do it and be out of there so fast, you wouldn't even see my dust.

mike_noodles
06-06-2015, 05:09 PM
So in all seriousness, the only way the Raps get over the hump is to get a superstar. They can either try to consolidate talent to do it, or get it through the draft, or wait for Wiggins. Whatever takes them in that direction is what's needed. Any combination of Lowry, Derozan and Val as your "big two" isn't good enough to ever get to the conference finals in a weak conference, let alone beat a Western team in 7 games.

IndyRealist
06-06-2015, 05:19 PM
18th pick
31st pick
Future 1st
Terrance Jones
KJ McDaniels

If they're wanting to dump Lowry why not? Two picks and a future first, Jones has shown awesome potential just don't have enough PT with Dmo and Smith in Houston, and KJ is a young prospect...

I don't know that the Rockets can afford to trade away that much cheap depth and have 3 guys (Dwight, Harden, Lowry) on huge deals. Terry and Prigioni are not getting younger, and even with Beverly on the bench in this scenario, you're still hoping Capela, Popanikolaou, Canaan, and Nick Johnson develop into solid rotation guys. I guess you can hope guys come in on vet min deals to chase a ring, but that's going to be 3rd pickings after Golden State and Cleveland get the prime free agents (Golden State because they are just better, and Cleveland because it's a cake walk to the Finals).

bucketss
06-06-2015, 05:48 PM
I know it's a lot, but I don't think that the players at 18 or 31 will help Houston make the next step and the future first is to sweeten the deal. Jones really doesn't have a place in Houston anymore because of Dmo and smith and KJ is a filler.

Lowry I think would help Houston get over the hump.

Lowry/Terry/Lull
Harden/Johnson
Ariza/Brewer/Pap
Dmo/Smith
Howard/Capela/Dorsey

I think that lineup can compete with anyone in the league...

in all honesty id throw in the 20# pick to make that happen. probably Tross as well.

SteveNash
06-06-2015, 05:58 PM
Toronto doesn't have any guy you could see starting on a championship caliber team. Best thing to do now is tank for 4 years then go after Wiggins.

nycericanguy
06-06-2015, 06:40 PM
I know it's a lot, but I don't think that the players at 18 or 31 will help Houston make the next step and the future first is to sweeten the deal. Jones really doesn't have a place in Houston anymore because of Dmo and smith and KJ is a filler.

Lowry I think would help Houston get over the hump.

Lowry/Terry/Lull
Harden/Johnson
Ariza/Brewer/Pap
Dmo/Smith
Howard/Capela/Dorsey

I think that lineup can compete with anyone in the league...

Terrance Jones alone probably has more value than Lowry right now when you factor in age and contract.

Jones is only 23, he'll be a beast once he starts getting more minutes.

GiantsSwaGG
06-06-2015, 07:42 PM
Toronto doesn't have any guy you could see starting on a championship caliber team. Best thing to do now is tank for 4 years then go after Wiggins.

They should of tanked when Wiggins was in the draft. A mistake that will set them back for YEARS

bucketss
06-06-2015, 08:27 PM
Toronto doesn't have any guy you could see starting on a championship caliber team. Best thing to do now is tank for 4 years then go after Wiggins.

lowry is a starter, so is derozan, even a guy like valanciaunas could start on the cavs.

bucketss
06-06-2015, 08:28 PM
They should of tanked when Wiggins was in the draft. A mistake that will set them back for YEARS

what if we tanked and still dropped to 4 lol that would suck. we tanked REAL hard back in 2011, got the 3rd worst record, and still dropped to five. i don't like the raps luck lol.

GiantsSwaGG
06-06-2015, 08:44 PM
what if we tanked and still dropped to 4 lol that would suck. we tanked REAL hard back in 2011, got the 3rd worst record, and still dropped to five. i don't like the raps luck lol.

I thought the Knicks was going to end up with the 14th pick with our luck, surprise we got the 4th pick lol