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ILLUSIONIST^248
05-20-2015, 02:56 PM
The worst ran/overall big market franchise in professional sports?

It astonishes me how bad they have been for so long. I've been watching basketball for about 20 years and I can't get over how irrelevant they've been for 40 plus years. The team plays in the "Mecca of basketball" but are never succeeding there. I just feel like the team is a joke and doesn't hold up to its name. It's been 42 years since the Knicks have been able to call them selves champions. 4 decades!!!! I honestly feel bad for the fans, because knick fans as a whole are very loyal. How do you guys feel about them?

NYKnickFanatic
05-20-2015, 03:01 PM
I'll keep this short.

Yes.

Iron24th
05-20-2015, 03:15 PM
Yep their fans don't deserve that.

pebloemer
05-20-2015, 03:32 PM
The worst ran/overall big market franchise in professional sports?

It astonishes me how bad they have been for so long. I've been watching basketball for about 20 years and I can't get over how irrelevant they've been for 40 plus years. The team plays in the "Mecca of basketball" but are never succeeding there. I just feel like the team is a joke and doesn't hold up to its name. It's been 42 years since the Knicks have been able to call them selves champions. 4 decades!!!! I honestly feel bad for the fans, because knick fans as a whole are very loyal. How do you guys feel about them?

If we are going across sports, they have some competition from the Toronto Maple Leafs. They haven't won since 1967 and are closing in on 50 years pretty quickly.

mudvayne387
05-20-2015, 03:33 PM
Hmmmm

From a business stand point not even close. They are one of the most profitable teams in professional sports. Purely from a basketball standpoint I would say absolutely. In all honesty it starts at the top. **** runs downhill.

I do think they are on the right track though. Even picking #4, they should be able to nab Russell or Mundilay. With a nice chunk of cap space and with the cap going up, I don't think it's a stretch to say the future is finally bright.

Other teams in consideration: Raiders, Browns, Redskins, Astros, Mets, Clippers, Cavaliers, Coyotes, Leafs.

lol, please
05-20-2015, 03:45 PM
Were world beaters with Ewing. That was like yesterday, unless you were born yesterday, they will be back on top before you know it.

NYKnickFanatic
05-20-2015, 03:46 PM
Were world beaters with Ewing. That was like yesterday, unless you were born yesterday, they will be back on top before you know it.

Were we ever really on top though?

ILLUSIONIST^248
05-20-2015, 04:01 PM
Were world beaters with Ewing. That was like yesterday, unless you were born yesterday, they will be back on top before you know it.

Were we ever really on top though?

Yeah I'm not sure what he's trying to say?

Vee-Rex
05-20-2015, 07:47 PM
Knicks will be fighting for a playoff spot next year, if not better. I'd love to see Melo bounce back and have a terrific year.

Hawkeye15
05-20-2015, 07:51 PM
Yes, they are. A market that attracts everything, money out the ***, history, and they have been mostly irrelevant for 40 years.

For the advantages they have, they have absolutely been an embarrassment for their city and fans.

jeter 2
05-20-2015, 07:57 PM
I gotta question for everyone. Knick fans act like getting #4 pick is the end of the world. They will probably get Mundiay or trade down. They do have cap space and Carmelo Anthony. Now one free agent the Knicks are poaching is Marc Gasol. Does he anyone think here that Melo and Gasol can't be doing what Howard and Harden are doing in the WCF?

FOXHOUND
05-20-2015, 08:02 PM
No, the answer is clearly no.

Things have gotten way worse since Dolan took over, there's no doubt about that, but you have franchises like the Clippers who have never even made a conference finals. The Knicks were in the ECF 16-years ago and in the NBA Finals the year before that. That may seem like a long time ago, and it is, but it's a hell of a lot shorter than the never the Clippers have reached in 45-seasons.

The Clippers have made the playoffs just 11-times period in their 45 years and have a career franchise record of 1416-2226, a winning percentage of .389. The Knicks have made the playoffs 42 times in 69-years, have 2 championships and have appeared in 8 NBA Finals with a career winning percentage of .495. Not the best franchise around, but not even close to the worst.

TylerSL
05-20-2015, 08:40 PM
In 2015, the New York Knicks are the worst run franchise in all of sports, with the Sacramento Kings, Oakland Raiders, and Jacksonville Jaguars all in the conversation. However if you look back over the last 15 years it isn't even a question. The Knicks were well run in the 90's with Pat Riley and then Jeff Van Gundy afterwards, but since then they have just been floating in irrelevancy, making constant mistakes.

Whether it's trading Ewing to Seattle, hiring Isiah Thomas, trading for Eddy Curry, constantly giving out terrible contracts, constantly allowing the players to literally quit on every head coach they seem to hire (Larry Brown, Mike D'Antoni, Mike Woodson), or paying Phil Jackson $12 million to basically do nothing, the Knicks always seem to be doing something wrong. They are not any closer to winning than they were 15 years ago and I would argue they are farther from it. Right now the Knicks have glaring holes at every position save Small Forward.

Honestly as of right now, it looks like Phil Jackson has played Carmelo Anthony for a fool by convincing him to stay in New York. When Jackson was hired the Knicks were basically just underachieving. They were a talented squad who quit on Mike Woodson and therefore underachieved and missed the postseason. Jackson promised the team would fight for a playoff spot and win in the near future. Instead of instilling a new culture into the team, Jackson flipped that team on its head. First off, he gives a rookie head coach $5 million, making one of the highest paid head coaches. He traded Tyson Chandler, the rock of that defense, just so he could get rid of Raymond Felton, and Jose Caulderon was just as putrid as Felton was. When the team collapsed afterwards he trades Smith and Shumpert for a menial amount of cap space.

All in all Phil Jackson had an embarrassing start as an NBA Executive and if he does not significantly improve the Knicks this offseason, he should be fired. He's making too much money to make the fan base wait until 2016 or beyond to compete. Carmelo Anthony's years are dwindling and him resigning could be the biggest mistake of his career if the team is putrid for the first 2 or 3 years of his 5 year deal. Melo will be 34 when his contract is up, so his best chance of competing is arguably the first 3 years of his contract (age 30-32 seasons). His age 30 season was wasted between the team being terrible and injury. If all that comes out of this offseason is the #4 pick it's likely they will be terrible again next year. It's just a sorry situation

The Knicks need a complete culture overhaul and I honestly don't know how or when that will happen. They haven't won a championship in 42 years and at the rate they are going they could become the NBA's version of the Chicago Cubs. It's just bad. Really, really bad.

FlashBolt
05-20-2015, 09:04 PM
The sad part is the Knicks management doesn't even realize this. It's almost as if they are happy with just making the playoffs. Knicks being a top five team of basketball is an amazing thing for basketball because of the exposure it can garner. It's pathetic they have been this awful. Honestly, I live in NYC and I find myself wanting to root for them but it is just very difficult to do when you consider how inefficient they are. The only excitement was Lin.. I can give a rat's *** about Melo.

GiantsSwaGG
05-20-2015, 09:28 PM
Yes, they are. A market that attracts everything, money out the ***, history, and they have been mostly irrelevant for 40 years.

For the advantages they have, they have absolutely been an embarrassment for their city and fans.

This

PowerHouse
05-20-2015, 09:38 PM
4 decades aint that horrible in comparison to some other sports franchises.

When was the last time the Chicago Cubs won anything?

Vampirate
05-20-2015, 10:08 PM
Yes, they are. A market that attracts everything, money out the ***, history, and they have been mostly irrelevant for 40 years.

For the advantages they have, they have absolutely been an embarrassment for their city and fans.

I could argue the Leafs have been worse.

THE MTL
05-20-2015, 10:27 PM
The worst ran/overall big market franchise in professional sports?

It astonishes me how bad they have been for so long. I've been watching basketball for about 20 years and I can't get over how irrelevant they've been for 40 plus years. The team plays in the "Mecca of basketball" but are never succeeding there. I just feel like the team is a joke and doesn't hold up to its name. It's been 42 years since the Knicks have been able to call them selves champions. 4 decades!!!! I honestly feel bad for the fans, because knick fans as a whole are very loyal. How do you guys feel about them?

I wouldn't call the 90s knicks irrelevant. A finals appearance in 1994 and 1999 with a few conference finals appearances in between

More-Than-Most
05-20-2015, 10:30 PM
Yes and by alot and its a shame because the NBA needs teams like the Lakers/Knicks to be great.... If you have Lakers/Knicks/Sixers/Celtics/Bulls and a few others are great its really good for the NBA and the casual and hard core fans... Lakers and Knicks as much as I hate them I love watching them when they are great.

IBleedPurple
05-20-2015, 11:32 PM
Were world beaters with Ewing. That was like yesterday, unless you were born yesterday, they will be back on top before you know it.I loved watching almost all of Ewing's career, but unless you plan on living hundreds of years, that was not yesterday, or even close.

Slimsim
05-21-2015, 07:03 AM
At the end of the day NYC is all about making money which the Knock do very well with or without results Championship really doesn't matter to ownership. Can't buy **** with a trophy btw to answer the question yes Knicks are the joke of all sports

MonroeFAN
05-21-2015, 07:20 AM
Yes they are.

SeoulBeatz
05-21-2015, 08:01 AM
I think the Isaiah Thomas era is still burned in peoples memory, but they haven't been "irrelevant" as the OP mentioned.

NYC is a great basketball city, unfortunately this year's tank didn't quite work out for them.

I think they should trade the #4 pick for an established player who can help them win now.

They should also look to sign a big whether it be Greg Monroe, Lemarcus, or Gasol.

They can still pull of a quick turnaround but it would've been much easier had they ended up with a top 2 pick.

That's the risk in tanking though.

PhillyFaninLA
05-21-2015, 08:10 AM
I think the Isaiah Thomas era is still burned in peoples memory, but they haven't been "irrelevant" as the OP mentioned.

NYC is a great basketball city, unfortunately this year's tank didn't quite work out for them.

I think they should trade the #4 pick for an established player who can help them win now.

They should also look to sign a big whether it be Greg Monroe, Lemarcus, or Gasol.

They can still pull of a quick turnaround but it would've been much easier had they ended up with a top 2 pick.

That's the risk in tanking though.


Off topic but I think people need to look up Isiah's new job...talk about horrific decision making

NYKnickFanatic
05-21-2015, 08:12 AM
The sad part is the Knicks management doesn't even realize this. It's almost as if they are happy with just making the playoffs. Knicks being a top five team of basketball is an amazing thing for basketball because of the exposure it can garner. It's pathetic they have been this awful. Honestly, I live in NYC and I find myself wanting to root for them but it is just very difficult to do when you consider how inefficient they are. The only excitement was Lin.. I can give a rat's *** about Melo.

As long as they keep bringing in money, with people supporting a **** franchise, I don't see things changing anytime soon.

Teeboy1487
05-21-2015, 09:21 AM
Free Agency with be key with them. I think they have the best shot at Love, Aldridge, Monroe and Gasol. If they can get two of them especially Aldridge and Gasol, watch out especially in a weak eastern conference. Knicks are in terrific shape imo. Draft Mudiay no question. They need a guard.

2-ONE-5
05-21-2015, 09:45 AM
i have always said the Knicks are the most overrated franchise in all over sports

lamzoka
05-21-2015, 10:04 AM
i have always said the Knicks are the most overrated franchise in all over sports

Overrated? What is you talking about? Does anybody even rate them?

Avenged
05-21-2015, 10:08 AM
i have always said the Knicks are the most overrated franchise in all over sports

Overrated? What is you talking about? Does anybody even rate them?

:laugh2:

Da Knicks
05-21-2015, 10:23 AM
As far as money goes they do a very good job, product on the floor not so much. The fan base is so loyal that the nba and Knicks ownership don't care if they suck. Nba does a good job of keeping the fans going to games. Anytime a team is struggling with attendance they step in and help. Heat, Cavs, Hawks, Lakers got the help when the fans didn't show up, I guess Knicks fans loyalty f'd us up.

2-ONE-5
05-21-2015, 10:59 AM
Overrated? What is you talking about? Does anybody even rate them?

every year we have to hear about how the Knicks will be good, come on its the same **** every year even when most fans know its not true. Do we need to recall the posts about the Knicks prior to the last 2 seasons?

D-Leethal
05-21-2015, 11:09 AM
every year we have to hear about how the Knicks will be good, come on its the same **** every year even when most fans know its not true. Do we need to recall the posts about the Knicks prior to the last 2 seasons?

Well there was reason to believe they would be good after they won 54 games. We looked stupid this year, but fans should have hope.

2-ONE-5
05-21-2015, 11:35 AM
hope is one thing but even you guys had to see that 54 win team was a fluke that declined by the month after relying on the deep ball.

YashBoone
05-21-2015, 11:41 AM
The worst ran/overall big market franchise in professional sports?

It astonishes me how bad they have been for so long. I've been watching basketball for about 20 years and I can't get over how irrelevant they've been for 40 plus years. The team plays in the "Mecca of basketball" but are never succeeding there. I just feel like the team is a joke and doesn't hold up to its name. It's been 42 years since the Knicks have been able to call them selves champions. 4 decades!!!! I honestly feel bad for the fans, because knick fans as a whole are very loyal. How do you guys feel about them?

This is such a complicated thing.
As a LOOOOOOOONG time knick fan, I can't disagree.

Despite them not winning for a veeeery long time, they were still the same as any other team, with its highs and lows. Watching the rough and tough Knicks of the 90's was amazing. Heart breaking at times, but still amazing.

Then enter Dolan in 1999 and literally ruined the Knicks and we have been trying to recoup ever since.

Like I said, its so complicated.

And anytime they have made progress in the right direction, enter Dolan to **** **** up.

I still have faith in Jackson.
Dolan has finally admitted to making awful decisions and stepped away to let Jackson take control.

And despite the collective amnesia by everyone who calls themselves a sports analyst, Jackson is still trying to dig the Knicks out of that hole and build a team the right way.

And in order to do so, he finally realized that blowing it up was the best option.

IMO screw melo. The knick CANT go back to that WIN NOW mentality. It has ****ed us for the past 15 years.

YashBoone
05-21-2015, 11:58 AM
I also want to call out the collective hate their is for Knick fans on this forum.

Despite a few bad apples / trolls , new york sports fans are passionate and knowledgable.

And all i ever hear is complaints about how Knicks fans pump up their team every year ... LOL

All we want is for our team to matter again.

2-ONE-5
05-21-2015, 12:21 PM
I also want to call out the collective hate their is for Knick fans on this forum.

Despite a few bad apples / trolls , new york sports fans are passionate and knowledgable.

And all i ever hear is complaints about how Knicks fans pump up their team every year ... LOL

All we want is for our team to matter again.

after this years pre season the hate is warranted. i mostly just hate bcuz their div rivals so i enjoy the failure regardless.

YashBoone
05-21-2015, 12:40 PM
after this years pre season the hate is warranted. i mostly just hate bcuz their div rivals so i enjoy the failure regardless.

Why was it warranted?

Chronz
05-21-2015, 12:58 PM
this comes down to whether u think its best to intentionally not give a **** about the product and run a business (clips), or actually try to build a winner by throwing big money at name brands only to watch them falter.

YashBoone
05-21-2015, 01:31 PM
It comes down to selling tickets in a huge market vs actually knowing how to build a championship team.

2-ONE-5
05-21-2015, 01:33 PM
Why was it warranted?

go look up some old threads from the last offseason

Hawkeye15
05-21-2015, 01:39 PM
I could argue the Leafs have been worse.

I don't follow hockey really, could be right. But for the NBA, my statement holds true.

NYKnickFanatic
05-21-2015, 02:07 PM
When we start to affect Dolan's pockets, that is when things will turn around.

We support team no matter what. We keep buying these expensive *** tickets, to go watch a **** product.

Dolan really doesn't care because he is still profiting off of this loser of a team.

I could only imagine how much more he would profit, if we were a championship caliber team.

Also, get rid of the ****ing orange paint and go back to the blue!!!

http://fc02.deviantart.net/fs71/i/2011/214/2/a/new_york_knicks_court_1992_95_by_s231995-d42mxrd.jpg

YashBoone
05-21-2015, 02:28 PM
go look up some old threads from the last offseason

Lol, Thats the answer I expected ...

No thanks.

If you don't know to answer yourself, then you apparently dont know what your talking about.

2-ONE-5
05-21-2015, 03:28 PM
Lol, Thats the answer I expected ...

No thanks.

If you don't know to answer yourself, then you apparently dont know what your talking about.

i know exactly what im talking about, im not gonna dig through it all and most know exactly what im talking about. even worse was the majority of them tried to act like they didnt talk all the **** they did once the season fell apart.

colinskik
05-21-2015, 03:43 PM
Do people not remember the '90s? Or were they not old enough to process thoughts at that point in time ... because the Knicks were really good that decade.

colinskik
05-21-2015, 03:46 PM
i know exactly what im talking about, im not gonna dig through it all and most know exactly what im talking about. even worse was the majority of them tried to act like they didnt talk all the **** they did once the season fell apart.

Dude, all you do is talk *****, and then you can't even back it up. You're the worst kind of troll that exists.

2-ONE-5
05-21-2015, 03:52 PM
Dude, all you do is talk *****, and then you can't even back it up. You're the worst kind of troll that exists.

is what i said untrue? every knick fan claimed the atlantic and talked **** on the raps and then went back on it 2 months later.

NYKnickFanatic
05-21-2015, 04:08 PM
is what i said untrue? every knick fan claimed the atlantic and talked **** on the raps and then went back on it 2 months later.

Stop. Not EVERY Knicks fan claimed the Atlantic. I know I personally said that the Raptors would win it, followed by Brooklyn.

Don't be ignorant.

YashBoone
05-21-2015, 04:11 PM
is what i said untrue? every knick fan claimed the atlantic and talked **** on the raps and then went back on it 2 months later.

How is it different from any other sports fan anyway?

You don't gas your team up??

2-ONE-5
05-21-2015, 04:16 PM
not when they suck.

D-Leethal
05-21-2015, 04:20 PM
hope is one thing but even you guys had to see that 54 win team was a fluke that declined by the month after relying on the deep ball.

Thats not true, we finished that season 16-3 with a 13 game winning streak.

D-Leethal
05-21-2015, 04:23 PM
Do people not remember the '90s? Or were they not old enough to process thoughts at that point in time ... because the Knicks were really good that decade.

I was gonna mention that, but I'm not sure there has been a team in any sport thats been terrible for 15 straight years, save one decent season. I mean even the Raiders made the Superbowl in 2002. I'm sure there has been a baseball team thats been terrible over the same span but I don't think there are many out there with the same lack of success we have had for 15 years.

D-Leethal
05-21-2015, 04:25 PM
When people hate on you for pumping up your own team it says more about them than it does about us. Look in the mirror brah, your hate comes from within.

YashBoone
05-21-2015, 05:23 PM
When people hate on you for pumping up your own team it says more about them than it does about us. Look in the mirror brah, your hate comes from within.

Well said d.
One of the only poster in this Knicks forum who I agree with 99. 999% of the time .

Jamiecballer
05-21-2015, 07:13 PM
i know exactly what im talking about, im not gonna dig through it all and most know exactly what im talking about. even worse was the majority of them tried to act like they didnt talk all the **** they did once the season fell apart.

fyi you are talking to one of the more "optimistic" posters if i recall