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View Full Version : When Does Durant start getting the James Treatment?



More-Than-Most
02-19-2015, 08:09 PM
He has so much Talent around him year after year... His team again just got much better... When will he get that pressure that James had from day 1? Durant is a superstar but without the pressure that a James/Jordan/Kobe and so on had on them year after year after year if their teams didn't win it all.

Sportfan
02-19-2015, 08:20 PM
Never because Kevin Durant plays in the most competitive conference in the history of the league and he isn't on Lebron's level of stardom


He'll get "Karl Malone Treatment" if anything

tredigs
02-19-2015, 08:20 PM
#1: Jordan had a massive amount of pressure on him to win. They were saying you couldn't win as a top scorer in the late 80's and he was questioned massively.

#2: Lebron was both self professing, "The Chosen One", and there was MUCH, MUCH more anticipation of his arrival than KD, who wasn't even a #1 draft pick. He was just a lanky top notch scorer that people thought would eventually be a killer in the NBA (they were right).

#3: Durant plays in the West, and when your #2 and #3 go down in back to back years during the playoffs, it rightfully alleviated some scrutiny on him. He did not struggle in the playoffs, he absolutely crushed. Just wasn't enough.

#4: Kobe never had that pressure coming in. Only after he 3 peated as a #2 and started entering "All Time" discussions did fans and the media begin to question if he could do it as the alpha.

Even this season, it's a very, VERY tough slate for KD. Assuming they get in and have to play a healthy GS, that's an uphill battle. They rightfully won't be favorites even in round 1, let alone to win it all.

Context my dear Watson. He gets his share of scrutiny, but he's never been in a place where his team was favored to win a title going into the WCF's.

jerellh528
02-19-2015, 08:43 PM
He also hasn't had the team talent james had on his champ teams. Even when harden was in okc, they were basically a group of 20/21 yr olds with no real leader or much experience.

Hawkeye15
02-19-2015, 08:46 PM
never. He wasn't thrown down our throats as a 16 year old, plays in a small market, isn't in the news, etc. He will probably never face that pressure unless he moves to a large market.

KnicksorBust
02-19-2015, 08:46 PM
He also hasn't had the team talent james had on his champ teams. Even when harden was in okc, they were basically a group of 20/21 yr olds with no real leader or much experience.

LOL. Holy **** I cant believe this post.

Hawkeye15
02-19-2015, 08:48 PM
He also hasn't had the team talent james had on his champ teams. Even when harden was in okc, they were basically a group of 20/21 yr olds with no real leader or much experience.

why does that matter? LeBron was being thrown under the bus for not winning with a roster exponentially inferior to what Durant has had.

KnicksorBust
02-19-2015, 08:49 PM
he also hasn't had the team talent james had on his champ teams. Even when harden was in okc, they were basically a group of 20/21 yr olds with no real leader or much experience.

why does that matter? Lebron was being thrown under the bus for not winning with a roster exponentially inferior to what durant has had.

x1000

Hawkeye15
02-19-2015, 08:50 PM
#1: Jordan had a massive amount of pressure on him to win. They were saying you couldn't win as a top scorer in the late 80's and he was questioned massively.

#2: Lebron was both self professing, "The Chosen One", and there was MUCH, MUCH more anticipation of his arrival than KD, who wasn't even a #1 draft pick. He was just a lanky top notch scorer that people thought would eventually be a killer in the NBA (they were right).

#3: Durant plays in the West, and when your #2 and #3 go down in back to back years during the playoffs, it rightfully alleviated some scrutiny on him. He did not struggle in the playoffs, he absolutely crushed. Just wasn't enough.

#4: Kobe never had that pressure coming in. Only after he 3 peated as a #2 and started entering "All Time" discussions did fans and the media begin to question if he could do it as the alpha.

Even this season, it's a very, VERY tough slate for KD. Assuming they get in and have to play a healthy GS, that's an uphill battle. They rightfully won't be favorites even in round 1, let alone to win it all.

Context my dear Watson. He gets his share of scrutiny, but he's never been in a place where his team was favored to win a title going into the WCF's.

not going to deny it, but you and everyone knows, SI, and every media outlet was following him around like he was ****ing Jack Nicholson by age 14. That would get to anyones head.

Bruno
02-19-2015, 08:50 PM
He has so much Talent around him year after year... His team again just got much better... When will he get that pressure that James had from day 1? Durant is a superstar but without the pressure that a James/Jordan/Kobe and so on had on them year after year after year if their teams didn't win it all.

when they get knocked out of the playoffs at full strength. hasn't happened since they lost in the finals.

If Durant played in the east he'd be given less slack.

tredigs
02-19-2015, 08:53 PM
not going to deny it, but you and everyone knows, SI, and every media outlet was following him around like he was ****ing Jack Nicholson by age 14. That would get to anyones head.

Of course. But, that's why the expectations were there. He was anointed a future All Time Great before he played a game in the NBA. And he bought into it (and achieved it). Their expectations were never in the same boat, and never will be. That said, his path was unquestionably and undeniably easier than what KD has tried to achieve with OKC (mostly because of the injuries they faced in the playoffs the past two seasons, but also obviously because of the conference disparity).

jerellh528
02-19-2015, 08:53 PM
why does that matter? LeBron was being thrown under the bus for not winning with a roster exponentially inferior to what Durant has had.

It matters because op mentioned kds "so much talent around him" did you read the op? Lebron thrown under the bus? He wasn't until he went to Miami, he was loved by most. Even I liked him in Cleveland

Hawkeye15
02-19-2015, 08:57 PM
It matters because op mentioned kds "so much talent around him" did you read the op?

I did. But Durant has had exponentially more talent around him his first 7 seasons, while LeBron was getting literally murdered by the media and main stream fans by year 4 for not winning with that POS roster he carried to it's success. Durant is getting a total pass, even with a far, far superior roster. For the reasons I stated above.

Your post was ridic.

jerellh528
02-19-2015, 08:57 PM
LOL. Holy **** I cant believe this post.

What do you mean?

Hawkeye15
02-19-2015, 08:58 PM
Of course. But, that's why the expectations were there. He was anointed a future All Time Great before he played a game in the NBA. And he bought into it (and achieved it). Their expectations were never in the same boat, and never will be. That said, his path was unquestionably and undeniably easier than what KD has tried to achieve with OKC (mostly because of the injuries they faced in the playoffs the past two seasons, but also obviously because of the conference disparity).


agreed, which I mentioned in my post above as a reason.

Question, if you give LeBron that roster his first 7 years, you really don't think they probably have a chip or 2?

jerellh528
02-19-2015, 08:59 PM
I did. But Durant has had exponentially more talent around him his first 7 seasons, and was getting literally murdered by the media and main stream fans by year 4 for not winning with that POS roster he carried to it's success. Durant is getting a total pass, even with a far, far superior roster. For the reasons I stated above.

Your post was ridic.

No way, unless I'm forgetting all the scrutiny during his first Cleveland stint. From what I can remember he was almost universally loved by all and the NBAs golden ticket/ espn God

Bruno
02-19-2015, 09:02 PM
agreed, which I mentioned in my post above as a reason.

Question, if you give LeBron that roster his first 7 years, you really don't think they probably have a chip or 2?

Which roster though? 2012 when they were healthy babies? 2013 with no Russ, or 2014 with Ibaka on one leg?

also, against which years competitive field? which conference?

lots of in, lots of outs, lots of what have yous. haha.

KnicksorBust
02-19-2015, 09:02 PM
#1 overall pick out of HS faces significantly more scrutiny than a #2 pick from college. LeBron going home also I think added to the drama. And he was more of a guaranteed star. And he was and always will be a more complete player than Durant. And Durant is super humble and quiet. He almost seemed to avoid the spotlight while Lebron revelled in it.

Cal827
02-19-2015, 09:02 PM
Never because Kevin Durant plays in the most competitive conference in the history of the league and he isn't on Lebron's level of stardom


He'll get "Karl Malone Treatment" if anything

Probably this.

Hawkeye15
02-19-2015, 09:02 PM
No way, unless I'm forgetting all the scrutiny during his first Cleveland stint. From what I can remember he was almost universally loved by all and the NBAs golden ticket/ espn God

you are not remembering correctly. Literally, the only reason I became a huge LeBron supporter, was because by year 4, he was being called out daily by the media and fans for not being able to win a chip. With that roster. with a GM who wouldn't trade TT for Amare, because Tristan had "potential". With his 2nd best player a throw in for the all star game in Mo.

LeBron was getting destroyed by the media and fans. Which is why I said, "jesus, calm down everyone, look at his team", and started to root for him. I could have cared less about him prior to that turn of the tide against him.

KnicksorBust
02-19-2015, 09:04 PM
LOL. Holy **** I cant believe this post.

What do you mean?

How can you compare Lebron dragging the carcasses of Eric Snow and Drew Gooden to the NBA Finals and Durant getting there with two bonafide young superstars like Westy and Harden.?

Hawkeye15
02-19-2015, 09:04 PM
Which roster though? 2012 when they were healthy babies? 2013 with no Russ, or 2014 with Ibaka on one leg?

also, against which years competitive field? which conference?

lots of in, lots of outs, lots of what have yous. haha.

the thing is, Lebron, by year 2, was super elite. The window was much longer. And he was just flat out much better than Durant from year 2-7. It would have mattered.

Cal827
02-19-2015, 09:05 PM
you are not remember correctly. Literally, the only reason I became a huge LeBron supporter, was because by year 4, he was being called out daily by the media and fans for not being able to win a chip. With that roster. with a GM who wouldn't trade JJ for Amare, because Hickson had "potential". With his 2nd best player a throw in for the all star game in Mo.

LeBron was getting destroyed by the media and fans. Which is why I said, "jesus, calm down everyone, look at his team", and started to root for him. I could have cared less about him prior to that turn of the tide against him.

Fixed :D

With TT's contract demands, it's gonna suck for him when nobody wants to pay him in the off-season, and he has to sign the QO like Monroe did (At least Monroe will probably get a similar contract offer this off-season lol)

Hawkeye15
02-19-2015, 09:06 PM
Fixed :D

With TT's contract demands, it's gonna suck for him when nobody wants to pay him in the off-season, and he has to sign the QO like Monroe did (At least Monroe will probably get a similar contract offer this off-season lol)

haha, my b. It was JJ

jerellh528
02-19-2015, 09:08 PM
How can you compare Lebron dragging the carcasses of Eric Snow and Drew Gooden to the NBA Finals and Durant getting there with two bonafide young superstars like Westy and Harden.?

I was talking about Miami. I was under the impression that Lebron received his strongest ridicule after joining Miami. I don't recall him having a ton of critics before that

FraziersKnicks
02-19-2015, 09:08 PM
#1: Jordan had a massive amount of pressure on him to win. They were saying you couldn't win as a top scorer in the late 80's and he was questioned massively.

#2: Lebron was both self professing, "The Chosen One", and there was MUCH, MUCH more anticipation of his arrival than KD, who wasn't even a #1 draft pick. He was just a lanky top notch scorer that people thought would eventually be a killer in the NBA (they were right).

#3: Durant plays in the West, and when your #2 and #3 go down in back to back years during the playoffs, it rightfully alleviated some scrutiny on him. He did not struggle in the playoffs, he absolutely crushed. Just wasn't enough.

#4: Kobe never had that pressure coming in. Only after he 3 peated as a #2 and started entering "All Time" discussions did fans and the media begin to question if he could do it as the alpha.

Even this season, it's a very, VERY tough slate for KD. Assuming they get in and have to play a healthy GS, that's an uphill battle. They rightfully won't be favorites even in round 1, let alone to win it all.

Context my dear Watson. He gets his share of scrutiny, but he's never been in a place where his team was favored to win a title going into the WCF's.

This isn't entirely true, certainly last season anyway.

He actually experienced the 2nd biggest dropoff in PER and WS/48 for a reigning MVP in the playoffs ever (after Dirk got bounced in the first round in 2007). Although the numbers were still great, his play dropped in the playoffs.

KD just doesn't evoke the emotions that LeBron, Jordan, Shaq, Kobe, Magic etc. do. He comes across quite bland without much of a personality so outside of OKC he doesn't have a huge fan base. He's not unlikable, but he's not hugely likeable.

If you're just looking at the players he's had on some of his teams he certainly deserves a bit of pressure. Westbrook, Harden, Ibaka are all better players than what LeBron ever had in Cleveland.

Hawkeye15
02-19-2015, 09:10 PM
I was talking about Miami. I was under the impression that Lebron received his strongest ridicule after joining Miami. I don't recall him having a ton of critics before that

you might actually not remember it how it happened, but are you serious? He was getting killed by the media/fans by year 4 in Cleveland.

tredigs
02-19-2015, 09:14 PM
agreed, which I mentioned in my post above as a reason.

Question, if you give LeBron that roster his first 7 years, you really don't think they probably have a chip or 2?

Assuming it's a younger version of himself alongside 22 yr old Harden/Ibaka and Harden pulled the same disappearing act playing Miami Lebron with that cast? Nah, I don't. And the other years when they lost Ibaka/Westbrook during the playoffs (which is tougher then if they lost them earlier in the year and had time to work in a different lineup), I don't see him winning either. It would be close, but no, I'd argue 0 ships. Such a more grueling regular season as well. That adds up.

FraziersKnicks
02-19-2015, 09:21 PM
Assuming it's a younger version of himself alongside 22 yr old Harden/Ibaka and Harden pulled the same disappearing act playing Miami Lebron with that cast? Nah, I don't. And the other years when they lost Ibaka/Westbrook during the playoffs (which is tougher then if they lost them earlier in the year and had time to work in a different lineup), I don't see him winning either. It would be close, but no, I'd argue 0 ships. Such a more grueling regular season as well. That adds up.

What about the 22 year old LeBron who had one of the greatest postseason performances of all-time knocking off the Pistons and taking a team who's next best player was Big Z to the Finals?

tredigs
02-19-2015, 09:25 PM
What about the 22 year old LeBron who had one of the greatest postseason performances of all-time knocking off the Pistons and taking a team who's next best player was Big Z to the Finals?

The same Lebron who shot 35% in the Finals with a 42% TS while being swept by SAS? No, not him either. The West is not the East.

cmellofan15
02-19-2015, 09:25 PM
you might actually not remember it how it happened, but are you serious? He was getting killed by the media/fans by year 4 in Cleveland.

yeah, maybe my recollection is a little better because i live in ohio but LeBron was hated by many, called a crybaby and soft, the whole nine. I remember papa johns even made t shirts that said crybaby on them and sold pizzas for 23 cents as an apology haha

Cal827
02-19-2015, 09:26 PM
Actually, if he stays in the West, he'll continue to get the Malone treatment (as a poster suggested).

If he comes to the East, he better win an NBA title within the first couple years, or else he'll be ganged up on.

Carmelo didn't face that much scrutiny over the Denver teams losing (despite a quite balanced roster, people said he had no support). Once he came to NY and people saw his issues, the press has been more on his *** over little things lol

FraziersKnicks
02-19-2015, 09:28 PM
The same Lebron who shot 35% in the Finals with a 42% TS while being swept by SAS? No, not him either. The West is not the East.

You think he would've shot those same numbers if he had Westbrook, Harden and Ibaka on his team?

tredigs
02-19-2015, 09:39 PM
You think he would've shot those same numbers if he had Westbrook, Harden and Ibaka on his team?

It was a much less refined/potent form of those three players. They were kids whose only playoff experience was a first round loss to the Lakers in the year Lebron had that first finals run. I'm sure he'd have shot better, but I'm very confident they'd have lost soundly. If it helps give you reference, with that squad he'd have been playing the Mavs team that embarrassed him in the Finals with Miami where he was not even his own teams best player in the series. It's a pretty straight forward answer. More than likely they'd have fared worse than he did with the Miami cast against them.

Like I said, the West is not the East.

FraziersKnicks
02-19-2015, 09:48 PM
It was a much less refined/potent form of those three players. They were kids whose only playoff experience was a first round loss to the Lakers in the year Lebron had that first finals run. I'm sure he'd have shot better, but I'm very confident they'd have lost soundly. If it helps give you reference, with that squad he'd have been playing the Mavs team that embarrassed him in the Finals with Miami where he was not even his own teams best player in the series. It's a pretty straight forward answer. More than likely they'd have fared worse than he did with the Miami cast against them.

Like I said, the West is not the East.

Yet those 3 players were infinitely more talented than the other starters the Cavs trotted out in that series. Larry Hughes at PG? Sasha Pavlovic? Big Z? Drew Gooden?

Fact of the matter is LeBron was getting absolutely slaughtered by the media for not leading these guys to an NBA title (when the East was closer to the West as well), whereas KD has kinda got by without anyone saying anything with a far superior supporting cast

tredigs
02-19-2015, 09:55 PM
Yet those 3 players were infinitely more talented than the other starters the Cavs trotted out in that series. Larry Hughes at PG? Sasha Pavlovic? Big Z? Drew Gooden?

Fact of the matter is LeBron was getting absolutely slaughtered by the media for not leading these guys to an NBA title (when the East was closer to the West as well), whereas KD has kinda got by without anyone saying anything with a far superior supporting cast

I mean, the real fact of the matter is that those Mavs would have abused him in the WCF's (if he made it that far) rather than him having that ECF run where he was in turn abused in the Finals instead. Seeing that we saw him with a better cast get handled, that's not exactly debatable.

Lebron was certainly unfairly criticized though (albeit some of that brought upon by himself), which is why I defended the guy on here constantly at the time and could not stand the media brainwashed and/or Kobe-stan baiters.

FraziersKnicks
02-19-2015, 10:08 PM
I mean, the real fact of the matter is that those Mavs would have abused him in the WCF's (if he made it that far) rather than him having that ECF run where he was in turn abused in the Finals instead. Seeing that we saw him with a better cast get handled, that's not exactly debatable.

Lebron was certainly unfairly criticized though (albeit some of that brought upon by himself), which is why I defended the guy on here constantly at the time and could not stand the media brainwashed and/or Kobe-stan baiters.

You're basing it off one series though, the worst series LeBron has ever played in his NBA career. The Mavs game planned for him extremely well and he was caught out.

Anyway, that's not what this thread is about. It's about the fact KD has had so much more talent on his teams than LeBron had and completely avoids criticism for not winning a title. It's the double standards that rule the NBA.

tredigs
02-19-2015, 10:17 PM
You're basing it off one series though, the worst series LeBron has ever played in his NBA career. The Mavs game planned for him extremely well and he was caught out.

Anyway, that's not what this thread is about. It's about the fact KD has had so much more talent on his teams than LeBron had and completely avoids criticism for not winning a title. It's the double standards that rule the NBA.

Lmfao -- I'm basing it off of the DIRECT COROLLARY of the argument YOU brought up to try to prove your point. I'm spelling out for you that with a better cast than KD had at that time Lebron got smashed by those Mavs (and is a 22 yr old Lebron >27 yr old Lebron to you? That's another factor that further hurts your case imo). And worst series ever? Highly debatable. See Spurs/Cavs finals comments from page 1.

I already said my piece on the argument as a whole in my first post. There are plenty of reasons why KD hasn't/won't/shouldn't be under the same microscope as Lebron.

/Thread for me. Too easy

PowerHouse
02-19-2015, 10:35 PM
Since Dragic is going to make Kobe/Lebron kind of money on his next contract, what kind of pressure will he have to get a ring?

FraziersKnicks
02-19-2015, 10:39 PM
Lmfao -- I'm basing it off of the DIRECT COROLLARY of the argument YOU brought up to try to prove your point. I'm spelling out for you that with a better cast than KD had at that time Lebron got smashed by those Mavs (and is a 22 yr old Lebron >27 yr old Lebron to you? That's another factor that further hurts your case imo). And worst series ever? Highly debatable. See Spurs/Cavs finals comments from page 1.

I already said my piece on the argument as a whole in my first post. There are plenty of reasons why KD hasn't/won't/shouldn't be under the same microscope as Lebron.

/Thread for me. Too easy

This isn't what I'm trying to argue though. I am arguing KD's cast is exponentially better than LeBron's cast in his first tenure in Cleveland and if LeBron had Westbrook/Harden/Ibaka from age 21 he would've won a chip.

Your basically arguing that the strength of the West the past 4-5 years is more decisive to KD's failings than LeBron's awful teammates in his first tenure in Cleveland were to his, which I just flatly disagree with. LeBron from 21-26 playing with Westbrook/Harden/Ibaka absolutely wins at least 1 title regardless of the conference he's in.

More-Than-Most
02-19-2015, 10:54 PM
How can you compare Lebron dragging the carcasses of Eric Snow and Drew Gooden to the NBA Finals and Durant getting there with two bonafide young superstars like Westy and Harden.?

this and what hawk is stating. People destroyed lebron from like year 4 on with insanely less talent than Kobe/Jordan/Durant ever had

Hawkeye15
02-19-2015, 11:36 PM
Assuming it's a younger version of himself alongside 22 yr old Harden/Ibaka and Harden pulled the same disappearing act playing Miami Lebron with that cast? Nah, I don't. And the other years when they lost Ibaka/Westbrook during the playoffs (which is tougher then if they lost them earlier in the year and had time to work in a different lineup), I don't see him winning either. It would be close, but no, I'd argue 0 ships. Such a more grueling regular season as well. That adds up.

you are ignoring how beast LeBron was in the playoffs so fast.

IKnowHoops
02-20-2015, 01:06 AM
#1: Jordan had a massive amount of pressure on him to win. They were saying you couldn't win as a top scorer in the late 80's and he was questioned massively.

#2: Lebron was both self professing, "The Chosen One", and there was MUCH, MUCH more anticipation of his arrival than KD, who wasn't even a #1 draft pick. He was just a lanky top notch scorer that people thought would eventually be a killer in the NBA (they were right).

#3: Durant plays in the West, and when your #2 and #3 go down in back to back years during the playoffs, it rightfully alleviated some scrutiny on him. He did not struggle in the playoffs, he absolutely crushed. Just wasn't enough.

#4: Kobe never had that pressure coming in. Only after he 3 peated as a #2 and started entering "All Time" discussions did fans and the media begin to question if he could do it as the alpha.

Even this season, it's a very, VERY tough slate for KD. Assuming they get in and have to play a healthy GS, that's an uphill battle. They rightfully won't be favorites even in round 1, let alone to win it all.

Context my dear Watson. He gets his share of scrutiny, but he's never been in a place where his team was favored to win a title going into the WCF's.

Actually in that Memphis series last year, Tony Allen made him very inefficient and he struggled mightily. He didn't play well at all. Probably the worst he's played in years.

Hawkeye15
02-20-2015, 01:07 AM
yeah, maybe my recollection is a little better because i live in ohio but LeBron was hated by many, called a crybaby and soft, the whole nine. I remember papa johns even made t shirts that said crybaby on them and sold pizzas for 23 cents as an apology haha

he was **** on by year 4. Those who don't remember it weren't paying attention.

IKnowHoops
02-20-2015, 01:11 AM
Which roster though? 2012 when they were healthy babies? 2013 with no Russ, or 2014 with Ibaka on one leg?

also, against which years competitive field? which conference?

lots of in, lots of outs, lots of what have yous. haha.

Well to be fair, Lebron won with D wade on one knee, and Bosh missing an entire series with no abs. So...Lebron has shown that he can go to a level Durant can't. Lebron can put a team on his back and effect ever single aspect of that game. What ever you lost from a guy being injured, Lebron will just do his work. Thats why he's the best.

IKnowHoops
02-20-2015, 01:16 AM
Assuming it's a younger version of himself alongside 22 yr old Harden/Ibaka and Harden pulled the same disappearing act playing Miami Lebron with that cast? Nah, I don't. And the other years when they lost Ibaka/Westbrook during the playoffs (which is tougher then if they lost them earlier in the year and had time to work in a different lineup), I don't see him winning either. It would be close, but no, I'd argue 0 ships. Such a more grueling regular season as well. That adds up.

Considering Lebron had to carry the Cavs, and with Harden and Westrbrook, he would not of had to, not even close, I think the season would of been easier for him playing with those guys. When on Cleveland he lead the team in pts/reb/asst/blocks/steals many years and in may playoffs. With Ibaka and Westy, you can take off ASSts and boards making it much easier on him to play the 3 rather than play the 12345.

Dade County
02-20-2015, 01:20 AM
He also hasn't had the team talent james had on his champ teams. Even when harden was in okc, they were basically a group of 20/21 yr olds with no real leader or much experience.

Cocaine


I was talking about Miami. I was under the impression that Lebron received his strongest ridicule after joining Miami. I don't recall him having a ton of critics before that

I'm done

IKnowHoops
02-20-2015, 01:25 AM
I would say Lebron at least has 1-2 chips with that roster. The guy basically dominated every series he was in accept 1 in his hole career. Basically an anomaly that I still can't even rap my head around. Thats only going to happen once. So 4-5 years with that roster, he is going to get through 1-2 times for sure. That Mavs series was his own doing IMO. Its like he quit trying.

tredigs
02-20-2015, 01:50 AM
So much wrong with the comments in here right now. I don't even have the energy or care to bother, but there's some serious blind ignorance.

FlashBolt
02-20-2015, 02:03 AM
Lmfao -- I'm basing it off of the DIRECT COROLLARY of the argument YOU brought up to try to prove your point. I'm spelling out for you that with a better cast than KD had at that time Lebron got smashed by those Mavs (and is a 22 yr old Lebron >27 yr old Lebron to you? That's another factor that further hurts your case imo). And worst series ever? Highly debatable. See Spurs/Cavs finals comments from page 1.

I already said my piece on the argument as a whole in my first post. There are plenty of reasons why KD hasn't/won't/shouldn't be under the same microscope as Lebron.

/Thread for me. Too easy

To be fair, LeBron playing vs the Mavs wouldn't have happened because he'd probably have a ring already with Harden+Westbrook+Ibaka. I mean, c'mon. James+Westbrook, two explosive players? You can't stop that. Against Spurs, can you really fault him for THAT? His teammates completely blew and of course Spurs collectively could stop him. He was rather inexperienced while Spurs were the best defending team in the NBA..

YAALREADYKNO
02-20-2015, 10:17 AM
It matters because op mentioned kds "so much talent around him" did you read the op? Lebron thrown under the bus? He wasn't until he went to Miami, he was loved by most. Even I liked him in Cleveland

Lol LeBron was getting criticized for not winning by his 4th-5th yr with the cavs. Even last yr in the finals against the spurs when he was the only consistent player and scoring 21 of the heats 22 points in a quarter people were still saying it was lebrons fault lmao

Goose17
02-20-2015, 10:34 AM
CP3 has more pressure to win a chip than the "second best" player in the world. I find it crazy that Durant gets a pass.

YAALREADYKNO
02-20-2015, 11:26 AM
CP3 has more pressure to win a chip than the "second best" player in the world. I find it crazy that Durant gets a pass.

Right lol

KnicksorBust
02-20-2015, 11:55 AM
CP3 has more pressure to win a chip than the "second best" player in the world. I find it crazy that Durant gets a pass.

Chris Paul should have more pressure than Durant. His window of winning a title as a #1/#2 player is significantly smaller than Durant's. He's a few months from 30 and has already seen his peak play come and go...

papipapsmanny
02-20-2015, 01:41 PM
I guess the day that he proclaims himself as the chosen one, the King, or predicts 8 championships, or basically tries to manufacture himself a super team, as a pathetic attempt to win as many as Jordan.

Goose17
02-20-2015, 01:54 PM
Chris Paul should have more pressure than Durant. His window of winning a title as a #1/#2 player is significantly smaller than Durant's. He's a few months from 30 and has already seen his peak play come and go...

He's had the pressure since he joined the Clips though it isnt something new.

phantasyyy
02-20-2015, 02:02 PM
Chris Paul should have more pressure than Durant. His window of winning a title as a #1/#2 player is significantly smaller than Durant's. He's a few months from 30 and has already seen his peak play come and go...

I agree, Chris Paul it seems has been given a pass for years now, yet his playoff sucess:

08' 2nd round exit vs spurs
09' 1st round exit vs nuggets
10' missing playoffs
11' 1st round exit vs lakers
12' 2nd round exit vs spurs
13' 1st round exit vs grizzlies
14' 2nd round exit vs thunder

Miltstar
02-20-2015, 04:12 PM
when he takes his talents to south beach!

Sadds The Gr8
02-20-2015, 04:13 PM
If/when he leaves

Jamiecballer
02-20-2015, 04:33 PM
the answer is when James retires, or if James outlasts Durants prime years,



He'll get "Karl Malone Treatment" if anything

this

IKnowHoops
02-20-2015, 05:13 PM
To get that treatment, you have to be as good. He'll get the treatment that Chris Paul gets right now, but never the Lebron level, because as a player, he is not Lebron level.

Cal827
02-20-2015, 05:18 PM
I agree, Chris Paul it seems has been given a pass for years now, yet his playoff sucess:

08' 2nd round exit vs spurs
09' 1st round exit vs nuggets
10' missing playoffs
11' 1st round exit vs lakers
12' 2nd round exit vs spurs
13' 1st round exit vs grizzlies
14' 2nd round exit vs thunder

I never understood that. I think that he's a bigger playoff choker than Carmelo, but always has the excuse that "he's on a weak team". In New Orleans, they were fairly talented/loaded (they were 2 and 3 seed a few years back), the Clippers rosters have been the most loaded that I've seen in some time, but they haven't gotten past the second round yet.

They need a WCF appearance, soon, or else.

More-Than-Most
02-21-2015, 03:13 AM
James is literally the best thing that has happened to Durant... Durant can do no wrong when it comes to media/fans and spotlight. He is getting a free ride with half the pressure and none of the scrutiny James had to deal with from day one... James has never had all around team talent like Durant has on the Thunder even when he had Wade/Bosh. Durant has been force fed talent around him his entire career and has 0 wins to show for it.... Yet again this year his team got even better at the deadline... If he goes 1 and done in the playoffs people will blame westbrook.

flea
02-21-2015, 03:44 AM
I never understood that. I think that he's a bigger playoff choker than Carmelo, but always has the excuse that "he's on a weak team". In New Orleans, they were fairly talented/loaded (they were 2 and 3 seed a few years back), the Clippers rosters have been the most loaded that I've seen in some time, but they haven't gotten past the second round yet.

They need a WCF appearance, soon, or else.

As a NO fan I can't really blame Paul for the playoffs. His only really good shot was 08 when they took the Spurs to 7 and he went for 24/10 on good efficiency. I think it was kind of weak of him how he left, but NBA guys tend to be little drama queens and I'm, at my core, a MLB fan so I had to kind of accept that diva crap as par for the course eventually. Still root for him to have success but I'm glad the future is brighter than it was with him for my team now.

They weren't great teams he had, but some of them were very good and, to this day, I feel like prime West and Chandler were the best frontcourt for Paul to have. Yes Chandler was hurt a fair amount, but injuries happen. He's been pretty healthy since all the whining and moaning back then, and it's easy to say hindsight is 20/20 but sometimes you just need to roll with the guys you got. That's usually how the great NBA teams amass success. Even in 2015 a West/Chandler frontcourt with a decrepit Rasual Butler and CP3 is still a solid base for your team, which is funny to think about considering the talk at the time of how flawed that team was.

At the end of the day it's a big man's league. A 5'11 PG is very nice, but if your frontcourt can't hang defensively or isn't versatile offensively then you're pretty much screwed.

Tony_Starks
02-21-2015, 04:00 AM
KD has had to face the two most dominant franchises of the last 2 decades from day 1. With no hype or grand proclamations. Instead of inferior competition he's in the most competitive conference in history. How dare anyone even compare him to that other guy.....

Tony_Starks
02-21-2015, 04:50 AM
To get that treatment, you have to be as good. He'll get the treatment that Chris Paul gets right now, but never the Lebron level, because as a player, he is not Lebron level.


I'm pretty sure if KD announced he's leaving OKC on national TV to team up with two superstars, then predicted they would win like 7 chips, and then choked in the Finals and told everyone they "had to go back their lives" in defeat......he would be treated a certain type of way as well.

SF8
02-21-2015, 06:00 AM
never. He wasn't thrown down our throats as a 16 year old, plays in a small market, isn't in the news, etc. He will probably never face that pressure unless he moves to a large market.
LeBron had a ton of pressure when he was in Cleveland.

And since when is Cleveland a big market?

FraziersKnicks
02-21-2015, 06:10 AM
I'm pretty sure if KD announced he's leaving OKC on national TV to team up with two superstars, then predicted they would win like 7 chips, and then choked in the Finals and told everyone they "had to go back their lives" in defeat......he would be treated a certain type of way as well.

What about the hate LeBron got before he left Cleveland then?

Tony_Starks
02-21-2015, 11:21 AM
I'm pretty sure if KD announced he's leaving OKC on national TV to team up with two superstars, then predicted they would win like 7 chips, and then choked in the Finals and told everyone they "had to go back their lives" in defeat......he would be treated a certain type of way as well.

What about the hate LeBron got before he left Cleveland then?

I wouldn't call that hate. He had the same pressure of any great player of that magnitude, but still got a lot of love. The only "hate" came from people that felt some kinda way about him being crowned the new king of the league with no ring to show for it.

But still I remember everybody saying him being able to pull off one championship in Cleveland would be equivalent to like 2 or 3 rings because of the talent. Bottom line is he plays a huge role in how his narrative has gone, KDs career doesn't even really compare.....

Dade County
02-21-2015, 11:55 AM
I would say Lebron at least has 1-2 chips with that roster. The guy basically dominated every series he was in accept 1 in his hole career. Basically an anomaly that I still can't even rap my head around. Thats only going to happen once. So 4-5 years with that roster, he is going to get through 1-2 times for sure. That Mavs series was his own doing IMO. Its like he quit trying.

It was rigged... He followed orders to throw the series.

avg like 2.7 pts in 4 straight games in the 4th quarter of a Final's series.

Dade County
02-21-2015, 12:00 PM
when he takes his talents to south beach!

I see that happening too. Or Anthony Davis.

IKnowHoops
02-21-2015, 04:08 PM
I'm pretty sure if KD announced he's leaving OKC on national TV to team up with two superstars, then predicted they would win like 7 chips, and then choked in the Finals and told everyone they "had to go back their lives" in defeat......he would be treated a certain type of way as well.

Only problem is, Lebron got that treatment by the 4th year in cleveland. Another problem is that Bron has two rings with dominant playoff runs and finals MVP's and is still under the gun. Next.