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View Full Version : Mock Trade Game (Round 2) Golden State vs Portland



Shammyguy3
02-18-2015, 04:56 PM
The Bulls' forum hosted the Mock Trade game again this year. Teams were combined to make an even 20 team league. Conferences were adjusted to compensate for disparity in talent. The top-8 teams in each conference made the playoffs. Vote on the poll for which team you think would win in a 7-game series. Players are considered 100% healthy. If they have been out the whole year, use the last season that they played and take about 80% of their production to vote (e.g. Paul George).

2. Golden State (Home Court Advantage)
Stephen Curry - Shaun Livingston
Klay Thompson - Leandro Barbosa - Brandon Rush
Harrison Barnes - Andre Iguodala
David Lee - Marreese Speights
Andrew Bogut - Mason Plumlee - Festus Ezeli - Ognjen Kuzmic

3. Portland
PG: John Wall - Steve Blake
SG: Courtney Lee - Jordan Adams
SF: Tobias Harris - Dorell Wright - Kostas Papanikolaou
PF: Blake Griffin - Charlie Villanueva
C: Joakim Noah - Larry Sanders - Joel Freeland


Portland Writeup

Congratulations on Ryu and Golden State making it to the 2nd round. This series will highlight the difficulty of the Western Conference playoffs but I strongly think I will win for one reason:

Ryu took the championship favorite Warriors and made them worse. He traded Draymond Green for Mason Plumlee, and in doing that he changed everything.

Consider this article that talks about why Golden State has been doing so good:

http://www.sbnation.com/nba/2015/1/10/7524605/golden-state-warriors-steve-kerr-mark-jackson

The changes to the starting lineup have produced results
Jackson used a starting lineup of Curry, Thompson, Iguodala, Lee and Bogut for the majority of his time in Golden State. The unit was good but the numbers showed it became great whenever Draymond Green played power forward in Lee's stead, so Kerr made that adjustmen. Draymond Green has emerged as a force on defense thanks to his ability to cover ground quickly and gives the team more flexibility on offense by stretching out the defense all the way to the three-point line and with his ability to put the ball on the floor.

The reason Golden State went from good to great is primarily because of the lineup change of swapping Draymond Green with David Lee. David Lee is a sieve on defense and Blake Griffin is simply too athletic for David Lee to stop in any meaningful way. Additionally, on offense David Lee provides very little spacing as he is shooting 30% from 16-23 ft. this season (and he wasn't any better last season: 35.7% 16-23 ft. and 39.0% 10-16 ft). This will take away Curry and Thompson's ability to drive to the basket as it will once again be clogged for Noah to protect the rim.

This is not a problem restricted to David Lee either. The guy they traded Draymond Green for, Mason Plumlee, is a quality player however he creates even more matchup problems for GS. 97% of his shots are within 10 feet of the basket (and 75% are within 3 feet). He provides less spacing than David Lee. So they run the risk of clogging the lane with Plumlee and Bogut or they take out Bogut, their only rim protector.

This lack of spacing will allow our perimeter defenders to play right up on Golden State's guards to take away the 3-point line and force them to try to put the ball on the floor and drive into a heavily contested paint. It also helps that Golden State's best penetrator, Curry, is guarded by our best defender (Wall)

On defense they lose their most versatile defender and the only guy who had any chance of guarding Blake Griffin. Last postseason Blake Griffin averaged 23.3 PPG (on 53.2% FG) to David Lee's 13.9 PPG.

They have solid perimeter defense but again, David Lee is their weak link and we will exploit that. By attacking Lee and beating him it forces Golden State's entire defense to shift, taking Golden State out of their defensive game plan and allows for our offense to pass the ball and find the open man.

Remember, Wall, Griffin and Noah are excellent passers for their positions (Wall 1st in APG for PGs, Griffin 1st in APG for PFs, Noah 1st in APG for C's last season), and when Golden State is scrambling to cover Lee's mistake and help and switch, we will easily be able to find the open man, whether it's a shooter or a cutter.

In conclusion, while I think this will be a hard fought series, I think Golden State no longer has the defensive versatility to win and we all saw what happened when a David Lee starting GS went up against an athletic PG/PF combo last season in the Clippers. They lost then, and will lose now.

Thanks for voting!

KnicksorBust
02-18-2015, 06:38 PM
Portland

Shammyguy3
02-18-2015, 07:12 PM
Leaning Warriors, but i want some debate if possible from the GMs

curtcocaine
02-18-2015, 07:17 PM
I dont understand why portland was granted Griffin and Noah while the warriors recived just mason. Take out david lee add anthony davis then well talk.....

valade16
02-18-2015, 08:26 PM
I dont understand why portland was granted Griffin and Noah while the warriors recived just mason. Take out david lee add anthony davis then well talk.....

I wasn't granted Griffin and Noah I had the original TrailBlazers roster and through various trades acquired Griffin and Noah.

Shammyguy3
02-18-2015, 08:35 PM
I dont understand why portland was granted Griffin and Noah while the warriors recived just mason. Take out david lee add anthony davis then well talk.....

that is not what happened

valade16
02-18-2015, 08:57 PM
Leaning Warriors, but i want some debate if possible from the GMs

The way I see it is the LAC beat GS in last years playoffs when GS started David Lee. I have a better version of the Clippers. He basically took the main reason why GS is doing so much better this season than last season (Draymond Green) off the team. Draymond is vital to GS because he spaces the floor at the PF position (something David Lee can't do) and he is such a versatile defender he could guard bigs and smalls allowing GS to switch on screens.

Now they can't. And nobody on that team is stopping Blake Griffin. David Lee certainly isn't. Also, Steph Curry, their best player, is guarded by our best defender (Wall). They are a terrible matchup for facing my team. If they had Draymond it'd be a different story, but they just don't have the defensive versatility and offensive spacing to match my team.

greg_ory_2005
02-18-2015, 09:52 PM
The Portland team is solid. But that bench.....

Shammyguy3
02-18-2015, 10:09 PM
The way I see it is the LAC beat GS in last years playoffs when GS started David Lee. I have a better version of the Clippers. He basically took the main reason why GS is doing so much better this season than last season (Draymond Green) off the team. Draymond is vital to GS because he spaces the floor at the PF position (something David Lee can't do) and he is such a versatile defender he could guard bigs and smalls allowing GS to switch on screens.

Now they can't. And nobody on that team is stopping Blake Griffin. David Lee certainly isn't. Also, Steph Curry, their best player, is guarded by our best defender (Wall). They are a terrible matchup for facing my team. If they had Draymond it'd be a different story, but they just don't have the defensive versatility and offensive spacing to match my team.

GSW of this year is so different than last season. And i don't see how this is a "terrible" matchup for Golden State. If anything these teams matchup equally. The Warriors have by far the best player in the series, and Thompson's been nearly as productive as Griffin this year. Noah's been struggling, mostly due to health so i'll give you a pass there.

Ryu_24
02-19-2015, 12:30 AM
I think Noah has shown flashes of returning to form over the last week or two. However, for the season I think Wall is the only good defender in Portland's starting lineup. Portland would struggle to score in half court offensive situations with a starting lineup of Wall, Courtney Lee, Harris, Griffin and Noah. The reason David Lee wasn't as productive as he could have been against the LAC in the playoffs is due to the fact that Bogut missed the series, so he had to start at center which got him in foul trouble trying to battle DeAndre Jordan for rebounds.

Allphakenny1
02-19-2015, 01:26 AM
The way I see it is the LAC beat GS in last years playoffs when GS started David Lee. I have a better version of the Clippers. He basically took the main reason why GS is doing so much better this season than last season (Draymond Green) off the team. Draymond is vital to GS because he spaces the floor at the PF position (something David Lee can't do) and he is such a versatile defender he could guard bigs and smalls allowing GS to switch on screens.

Now they can't. And nobody on that team is stopping Blake Griffin. David Lee certainly isn't. Also, Steph Curry, their best player, is guarded by our best defender (Wall). They are a terrible matchup for facing my team. If they had Draymond it'd be a different story, but they just don't have the defensive versatility and offensive spacing to match my team.

I love Green, but you are giving him way too much credit. The Warriors defense was great last year and is great this year. The main reason they are better is the ball movement on offense which is getting players open looks as opposed to the isolation ball they played last year which had most players just standing around on offense.

lol, please
02-19-2015, 01:43 AM
The way I see it is the LAC beat GS in last years playoffs when GS started David Lee. I have a better version of the Clippers. He basically took the main reason why GS is doing so much better this season than last season (Draymond Green) off the team. Draymond is vital to GS because he spaces the floor at the PF position (something David Lee can't do) and he is such a versatile defender he could guard bigs and smalls allowing GS to switch on screens.

Now they can't. And nobody on that team is stopping Blake Griffin. David Lee certainly isn't. Also, Steph Curry, their best player, is guarded by our best defender (Wall). They are a terrible matchup for facing my team. If they had Draymond it'd be a different story, but they just don't have the defensive versatility and offensive spacing to match my team.

Let's pretend Bogut wasn't injured, and let's be close minded and blame a series loss on a single player. For the record, Lee guards Blake well.

lol, please
02-19-2015, 01:44 AM
I love Green, but you are giving him way too much credit. The Warriors defense was great last year and is great this year. The main reason they are better is the ball movement on offense which is getting players open looks as opposed to the isolation ball they played last year which had most players just standing around on offense.

Exactly this. His post was absurd.

lol, please
02-19-2015, 01:45 AM
I think Noah has shown flashes of returning to form over the last week or two. However, for the season I think Wall is the only good defender in Portland's starting lineup. Portland would struggle to score in half court offensive situations with a starting lineup of Wall, Courtney Lee, Harris, Griffin and Noah. The reason David Lee wasn't as productive as he could have been against the LAC in the playoffs is due to the fact that Bogut missed the series, so he had to start at center which got him in foul trouble trying to battle DeAndre Jordan for rebounds.

Thank you.

Silent
02-19-2015, 01:57 AM
I wasn't granted Griffin and Noah I had the original TrailBlazers roster and through various trades acquired Griffin and Noah.

u one hell of a fantasy GM u got my vote

valade16
02-19-2015, 08:16 AM
Let's pretend Bogut wasn't injured, and let's be close minded and blame a series loss on a single player. For the record, Lee guards Blake well.

Griffin is averaging 22 PPG, 10 RPG and 3.7 APG on 50.7% FG against David Lee.

So if by well you mean "not well at all" then yes you're right.

valade16
02-19-2015, 08:25 AM
I love Green, but you are giving him way too much credit. The Warriors defense was great last year and is great this year. The main reason they are better is the ball movement on offense which is getting players open looks as opposed to the isolation ball they played last year which had most players just standing around on offense.

It's not me givand ng him that much credit, it's everybody:


http://www.sbnation.com/nba/2015/1/10/7524605/golden-state-warriors-steve-kerr-mark-jackson

That article says statistically GS is simply a better team when Draymond Green starts over David Lee, and now he's gone. Heck, if Bogut is so valuable to their defense then how many minutes does Plumlee get? He's listed as the backup Center, so is he taking minutes away from Bogut?

The best defender on GS last season statistically was Iggy, and he's benched now. The best defender on GS this season is Draymond, and he's gone. He has gotten worse on defense.

And as for the passing offense, you don't think Draymond helps there with his spacing and passing?

Shammyguy3
02-19-2015, 06:05 PM
bump

valade16
02-19-2015, 06:39 PM
Here's an article on how Golden State became the "best defensive team in the league", they dedicate an entire part to Draymond:

Draymond Green began his Warriors career backing up Jeremy Tyler in summer-league games. Little more than two years later, Jeff Van Gundy is proclaiming Green an All-Star candidate and max contract-level player.

Green now epitomizes Golden State's defense as someone who tenaciously switches onto anybody and challenges jumpers viciously. As of Tuesday, the Warriors led all teams with 17 blocked 3-pointers, of which Green has swatted seven -- more than twice the amount of Cleveland's entire roster (three) and as many as Anthony Davis. At this point, it's not a stretch to say he's gone from the second round to Golden State's best defensive player.

It's easy to forget Green wasn't projected as someone who would frustrate guys such as Blake Griffin

So the guy he traded they actually point out in the article on their defense as someone who would be good against Blake Griffin. And he's not on their team.

Here is their conclusion:

Golden State's defensive success was all by design, except not completely. Did the Warriors expect Green to morph into an integral part of the league's best defense?

They flat out lost too much versatility on defense to beat me. Draymond Green is perfect for the defense they run.

lol, please
02-19-2015, 10:30 PM
Green will be packaged in a 3 way trade that lands Davis on the dubs.
Curry/Klay/Iggy/Lee/Davis = quadruplepeat

Shammyguy3
02-20-2015, 08:18 PM
GSW wins