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View Full Version : Will there ever be a team that Dion Waiters could thrive with?



Chronz
02-04-2015, 04:48 PM
Some guys need a change of scenery, some need more/less playing time, others need a change in the talent around them... WTF does Waiters need?
I know its only been 2.5 years but this guy has tricked some people into thinking hes already a starter when hes not even a quality rotational guy. Hes been on wildly different teams so maybe he needs time to adapt but how can he do that when hes so out of touch with his own talent/production.

He has 1 NBA level skill, creating his own shot (long 2's). His first 2 years he was actually a threat from 3, he was really good at making set jumpers last year but I guess that could be a result of garbage time. Thing is, just how valuable can you be if all you're good at is creating bail out shots? How cancerous can you be when you combine that skill with the notion that its a good shot early in the clock despite better options abound?

Is Waiters on his way out of the league or does he have hope? Hes been awful in every situation thus far, hes down to 38% shooting in OKC. Has struggled to play with every great player hes come across and has no humility to him.


Can you create a team/role for Waiters to succeed, does such a role exist? It doesn't even have to be a good team, obviously thats preferable but is there even a horrible team situation that would mutually benefit both parties?




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I cant think of any, he reminds alot of Al Thornton, SG version. Thornton convinced Clipper fans of all ages that he was a quality player when he didn't even belong in the league. He too shared the same trait, he could make long 2's at a decent clip, only as a 6"8 SF, he at least appeared athletic enough to warrant some drooling.

Anyone remember Ron Mercer?

D-Leethal
02-04-2015, 04:55 PM
The OKC trade really didn't make any sense for a lot of reasons.

I honestly have no idea how he couldn't hack it in Cleveland if JR Smith went gangbusters the second he got there...

D-Leethal
02-04-2015, 04:56 PM
I could see him maybe filling the Lance Stephenson starting 2 psycho wildcard role on last years Indy team, it would just require way more playmaking usage out of George and might require more of a playmaker than Hill at PG.

Vee-Rex
02-04-2015, 05:28 PM
I've watched a lot of Dion these last three years.

Most of his problems are mental. He has shown ability to defend, pass, and obviously score. He's not freaky athletic or anything but he's not a snail either. He can be explosive and attack the rim when he wants.

His basketball IQ leaves much to be desired. He takes contested long 2's after wasting away 12+ seconds on the shot clock as if he's a superstar. He isn't humble enough to accept a bench role until he adjusts to the game. He gets frustrated easily after missing shots/layups he should make, which tends to affect him for the rest of the game.

If he doesn't learn to let the game come to him and play team ball he will be out of the league. He has a killer mentality but isn't talented enough for it and that's the basis of his problems. If he can mature mentally and improve his basketball IQ I believe he could eventually be a starter averaging 18-20ppg AT BEST.

crewfan13
02-04-2015, 07:04 PM
While not identical player, he does have some Monta Ellis in him. Monta was always a stubborn, foolish player and a guy who really could thrive if he accepted his role. It seems as if Monta is accepting his role in Dallas better than he ever has, and that helped him thrive. I think Waiters could be successful in a similar role.

I think you almost need to build the offense to really incorporate him. Although he isn't a stud, I think you have to make a conscious effort to get a guy like Waiters involved early and often in the offense. At times I felt as if he felt he was being left out and every time he got the ball he wanted to prove himself. If you involve him in the offense, he will still take some dumb shots, but he usually shows more willingness to pass and distribute more.

FraziersKnicks
02-04-2015, 07:26 PM
He would probably help a D-League team.

Goose17
02-04-2015, 07:36 PM
I reckon if you swap him with Redick the Clippers would win about the same amount of games so Dion>Redick he should go to L.A

Or the D-league. It's pretty much the same thing. :)

dalton749
02-04-2015, 07:42 PM
He would fit in perfectly in Toronto, where it's perfectly acceptable to walk up the floor and take long contested jump shots without even attempting to make a basketball play, as long as you let the other teams guards burn you for career highs every night

Chronz
02-04-2015, 08:06 PM
I reckon if you swap him with Redick the Clippers would win about the same amount of games so Dion>Redick he should go to L.A

Or the D-league. It's pretty much the same thing. :)

I dont get the joke.

Goose17
02-04-2015, 08:08 PM
I dont get the joke.

I'll add it to the list.

Things Chronz doesn't get;

- Team Chemistry.
- My Jokes.
- This list.

WaDe03
02-04-2015, 08:09 PM
Well of course. People were calling him the next Dwyane Wade before the season started.

KnicksorBust
02-04-2015, 08:13 PM
No. He wack.

SPURSFAN1
02-04-2015, 08:22 PM
Well of course. People were calling him the next Dwyane Wade before the season started.

:laugh2:

KingstonHawke
02-04-2015, 08:36 PM
At the beginning of the season I thought that the Bucks should've traded Sanders and Mayo to the Cavs for Waiters, Thompson, and Verajao. Obviously that deal can't happen now, but I still would like the location for him. Especially if the Bucks moved Knight to a team like the Lakers for either a pick or Randle.

Let Waiters play on a team where he can just come off the bench and take all the shots he wants. Either that or you've gotta teach him how to play the point. No way he should've been selected as high as he was. I always hated that pick. Almost as much as I hated the Bennett and Thompson picks. Amazing how one team could be so bad at drafting. Surprised they didn't go Darko over Lebron lol

northpass523
02-04-2015, 08:45 PM
Waiters needs to go to the Kings or Lakers. Somewhere where his awfulness won't affect the great players in this league like it is right now.

FlashBolt
02-04-2015, 08:51 PM
If you're trying to win rings, there are much better options than him. He's a player who would excel if placed on a team with low expectations. On a team with expectations? No thanks. Dude is a bench player thinking he's a starter.

GunFactor187
02-05-2015, 01:56 AM
It's simple, the guy simply needs to be coached up. He'd thrive on a team with 2 things: an elite coach/solid coaching staff and vets that are true professionals. He's never had that since being drafted. Look at what SVG has done for Jennings, almost a 180 since Smith was released. He was labeled as a boneheaded player who's selfish but prior to his Achilles injury he was playing the best basketball of his career. Also being around guys who are true pros that have been there and seen it all like Caron Butler and Jodie Meeks helps as well. Those two factors help in growth, development, and maturity which Dion sorely has lacked, being around KD, Collison, Westbrook, etc. should help a bit though, however the Thunder needs a better coaching staff to really maximize the roster IMO.

Minimal
02-05-2015, 10:52 AM
Reminds me of Evan Turner too

koreancabbage
02-05-2015, 11:03 AM
i thought they gave him the ball?

koreancabbage
02-05-2015, 11:04 AM
Reminds me of Evan Turner too

well Evan Turner could a lot more things like rebound and dish the ball at times. not good but he's more toolsy than Waiters.

kobebabe
02-05-2015, 01:39 PM
The problem is simple: he is a bench player at best who sees himself as a superstar. Try fix that kind of problem and see how far you can go ;)

IKnowHoops
02-05-2015, 04:16 PM
Not till he learns how to play basketball past his tunnel vision, one on one game.

Tony_Starks
02-05-2015, 04:44 PM
I'm not down on Waiters at all and really don't see why he gets such harsh criticism. His flaws are very obvious but the guy has serious skills if utilized properly.

He reminds me of Chauncey Billups. Labelled a loser and bounced around, people hated his style of play, until he hit with the right coach right team then it was happily ever after.....

Chronz
02-05-2015, 05:07 PM
Im guessing nobody remembers Ron Mercer?



I'm not down on Waiters at all and really don't see why he gets such harsh criticism. His flaws are very obvious but the guy has serious skills if utilized properly.

He reminds me of Chauncey Billups. Labelled a loser and bounced around, people hated his style of play, until he hit with the right coach right team then it was happily ever after.....

Maybe he will eventually get it, maybe hes the next Rashad McCants.

Chauncey is an interesting comp, but what Chauncey needed more than anything was to find a situation that would play him at PG and a mentor to show him the ropes. PG's and Bigmen take the longest to develop IMO, and I dont see the same game in Waiters.

Tony_Starks
02-05-2015, 05:34 PM
Im guessing nobody remembers Ron Mercer?



I'm not down on Waiters at all and really don't see why he gets such harsh criticism. His flaws are very obvious but the guy has serious skills if utilized properly.

He reminds me of Chauncey Billups. Labelled a loser and bounced around, people hated his style of play, until he hit with the right coach right team then it was happily ever after.....

Maybe he will eventually get it, maybe hes the next Rashad McCants.

Chauncey is an interesting comp, but what Chauncey needed more than anything was to find a situation that would play him at PG and a mentor to show him the ropes. PG's and Bigmen take the longest to develop IMO, and I dont see the same game in Waiters.

But if you remember under Larry Brown his game didn't change all that much. His pull up 3 off the break was something his previous coaches hated and tried to get him to stop, instead Brown showed him when and where in the game he should take those. He also gave him a little more leeway on offense if he played the right way defensively.

I think that's what Waiters needs, a no nonsense proven coach to get the most out of him. But in a vacuum he's definitely not the type of player you can just put on any team and get valuable production.....

Goose17
02-05-2015, 05:43 PM
Im guessing nobody remembers Ron Mercer?


I remember Boston fans arguing with each other over who was better, Mercer or Pierce. :laugh2:

Mercer just never really found a "fit".

Chrisclover
02-05-2015, 10:34 PM
He is hungry like a young Kobe but he is not as talented or hardworking. He needs to learn more from the stars. Prior to his arriving in the OKC, he really didn't have many mentor s to guide him. Kyrie is a scoring machine but rather less of a facilitator and a leader. And I really think that some shining moments of Waiters came as a result of his attempts to outscore Irving. He was meant to leave because he couldn't replace Irving.
If I were him, i would try to be patient to absorb more knowledge from KD and Westbrook. When he is fledged enough, he will have his moments either in OKC or elsewhere. Considering his hunger for ball, I think he loves the idea of being the alpha dog in the bottom team. But right now, he needs to be a patient disciple first.

JasonJohnHorn
02-05-2015, 10:53 PM
He seems to me to be at the point in his career where he needs to be on a lottery team that has no scorers. He's fit in great there.

Some guys mature and find their spot. Like Monta Ellis. Some guys flounder after showing potential, like Mayo.

Waiters' biggest problem seems to be that he thinks he is at a James Harden level when he'd be lucky to be at a Mayo level. There is not shame in being a third or fourth option. Look at guys like AC Green and Horace Grant. The each get some rings, make an All-Star game or two, get paid, and play with legendary guys. Ron Harper was a hell of a player; he took a secondary role and won three rings playing with MJ as the fourth or fifth option.

The problem is the money. I forget who posted that Horace Grant interview (thanks again, that was great), but Grant said it best in there: back then, there wasn't an insane amount of money. All stars got paid well, the rest got paid a million or two. You knew if you won, you've get a pay check. Now you have guys who haven't even made the playoffs making 15 milllion a year (as much as Jordan got paid his first 5 or six season combined). Guys WANT the money and they know they have to have a career year going into the contract, so they want a chance to show what they got so they can get the money. Once they got the money, THEN they could chase the ring. So I understand that Waiters wants a chance to shine so he can get paid, but if he proved himself a legit 3rd or 4th option on a conference champ, he'd be doing himself and his team a big favour.

cmellofan15
02-05-2015, 11:14 PM
I reckon if you swap him with Redick the Clippers would win about the same amount of games so Dion>Redick he should go to L.A

Or the D-league. It's pretty much the same thing. :)

seems like you've become quite the troll ever since Chronz ripped you to shreds in the Klay Thompson or Harden thread. you should get over it.

BKdoubleStacker
02-05-2015, 11:44 PM
I wish I could say I'm surprised the thunder give him so many minutes, but I'm not. The thunder are going to be irrelevant pretty soon.

eibbor
02-06-2015, 12:02 AM
He is an absolute BUST. Why doesn't anybody have the guts to say so?

InRoseWeTrust
02-06-2015, 12:34 AM
He is an absolute BUST. Why doesn't anybody have the guts to say so?

He's a bust.

eibbor
02-06-2015, 12:39 AM
He's a bust.

Thank you. Glad it wasn't only obvious to me

flea
02-06-2015, 12:47 AM
I like his physicality, size, and handles as a 2. But his IQ, shooting, and overall defensive game leave a lot to be desired. I remember one of these Cavs fans in the offseason saying he's better than Beal - that's a pretty funny idea at this point.

But Waiters isn't totally worthless. He just has a lot of growing to do, and he has no readily exploitable NBA skill except on a team with a coach like Scott Brooks who lets him do whatever the hell he feels like. I still think he's probably what he is currently: a sub-par combo guard in the mold of Jarrett Jack. These days, to stick as a 2 you really need to be able to defend your position and at least one other pretty well - as well as not need the ball in your hands offensively. Dunno that he'll ever meet those qualifications. But I do know he'll never be a primary offensive option for a playoff contender.