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View Full Version : Mike Conley: Where Does He Rank?



Shammyguy3
12-10-2014, 06:16 PM
In the Bulls' forum we were talking about Rose's trade value and what PGs we'd jokingly and seriously trade him for if presented with an offer. Conley was one where I'd hesitate, but after 2nd thought my "let's win this year" mentality took over, and I had to say yes and that was even before I really looked at his production thus far.

The stat lines he's putting up this year instantly reminded me of Chauncey Billups with the Pistons. Wow, right? Then I thought, no way... but, I had the inkling that I may have found something nifty. So I dug a little deeper, and i was absolutely shocked at how IDENTICAL they're seasons were when comparing Chauncey in 2004 and Conley this season.

Conley is straight up beasting, and has always been a fringe top-7 PG in the league imo. He's a player that can seriously do everything you want him to (career 37.5% from deep, 44% this season). Now what you've all been waiting for: the statistical analysis. Seriously, look at these numbers for the year Chauncey Billups and the Pistons won the ring compared to Conley now with Memphis:

16.9ppg 6.1apg 2.8rpg 32.2mpg 118 ORtg 23.5usg% 58.8ts% 21.2 PER 31.1ast% 12.7tov%
16.9ppg 5.7apg 3.5rpg 35.4mpg 112 ORtg 23.5usg% 55.0ts% 18.6 PER 29.3ast% 13.6tov%

Can you tell me who is which player without looking it up?

So, this thread brings about a couple of questions:
1. Major similarities between Conley/Billups, presented above
2. Similarities in the structure of this Memphis team and the Detroit team back then
3. Do you take this Memphis team more seriously after thinking about Conley in this light, or has your perception of him not changed at all?
4. Where does Conley rank among PGs today?

Go!

JEDean89
12-10-2014, 09:08 PM
IMO he's the defensive version of Ty Lawson. Probably a top 3 defensive PG. I think he's a big reason why the Grizz are where they are, I'd rank him around 10-11. He's consistent and his defense is top notch and his play results in regular season and playoff wins.

Tony_Starks
12-10-2014, 09:57 PM
I think Chauncey is a great comparison. A really nice pg that probably will never get his full credit unless he's shipped back east and people are forced to recognize that he's really good.

ThuglifeJ
12-10-2014, 10:15 PM
He's such a great leader. Very very good consistent PG who makes great decisions. I'd take him 3rd behind CP3 and Curry.

Blitzbolt
12-10-2014, 10:34 PM
Conley almost always controls the tempo of the game which to me is his best trait.Almost every teams trys to run on us because of Zbo and Gasol yet Conley is able to slow the game down for them but could also run with the other PGs on the other end.

Of course he will never outscore the Curry's or the Westbrook's of the world but he slows them down just enough.

Shammyguy3
12-10-2014, 10:37 PM
I only watch a couple of Memphis games during the regular season (almost only the Bulls/Grizzlies games). I wish I could watch him play more often, and Memphis just in general

MrfadeawayJB
12-11-2014, 01:07 AM
Conley is quite possibly the smartest pg on the NBA. Makes hardly any mistakes, has no real weakness. He will never get the credit he's due, but hey, neither will the whole Memphis team due to the small market.

I attribute the grizz success to

1) conley's improved play (improved every year)
2) Gasols aggressiveness on offense
3) improved bench scoring

Chronz
12-11-2014, 01:58 AM
Top5

ghettosean
12-11-2014, 02:11 AM
He's such a great leader. Very very good consistent PG who makes great decisions. I'd take him 3rd behind CP3 and Curry.

On top of your top 2 I'd also take:

Lillard
Parker (always underrated)
Lowry
Westbrook (He's been playing like a stud since he's come back)

Over him right now.

JasonJohnHorn
12-11-2014, 02:37 AM
If I were the Cavs, I'd be looking for a deal to secure him and another asset for Kyrie to be honest. Kyrie is a better iso player, but Conley is a better defender and better team player and facilitator. He would be a much better fit. LBJ and Love woudl shine, and Conley woudl be a defensive lock down.

I think Kyrie/Waiters/Thompson/First for Conley and Gasol would put the Cavs over the top and give the Grizzlies a lot of tools to build something The Grizzlies are good, don't get me wrong, but in the west, they just don't have what it takes to contend.

Obviously I'd take Curry and CP3 over Conley.... and Parker as well for the short term... but Conley is a great glue guy. It's hard to rank him because a guy like Wall, Kyrie, and likely even Lowry are guys that will score the ball for you and would likely be seen as better individual players, but if you are a contender... Conley is the guy you want to add to your roster.

Look at teams like Cleveland, Miami, Dallas, NO, and even OKC (assuming Westy moved to SG), and you put Conley on those teams... and they are looking REAL good.... LAC, SAS and GSW are set.... but those other teams.

ThuglifeJ
12-11-2014, 02:42 AM
He's such a great leader. Very very good consistent PG who makes great decisions. I'd take him 3rd behind CP3 and Curry.

On top of your top 2 I'd also take:

Lillard
Parker (always underrated)
Lowry
Westbrook (He's been playing like a stud since he's come back)

Over him right now.

I would take Conley.

Lowry maybe. He's a warrior. Lillard no, too chucky. Parker too old. Westbrook too oc.

Kaner
12-11-2014, 02:58 AM
If I were the Cavs, I'd be looking for a deal to secure him and another asset for Kyrie to be honest. Kyrie is a better iso player, but Conley is a better defender and better team player and facilitator. He would be a much better fit. LBJ and Love woudl shine, and Conley woudl be a defensive lock down.

I think Kyrie/Waiters/Thompson/First for Conley and Gasol would put the Cavs over the top and give the Grizzlies a lot of tools to build something The Grizzlies are good, don't get me wrong, but in the west, they just don't have what it takes to contend.

Obviously I'd take Curry and CP3 over Conley.... and Parker as well for the short term... but Conley is a great glue guy. It's hard to rank him because a guy like Wall, Kyrie, and likely even Lowry are guys that will score the ball for you and would likely be seen as better individual players, but if you are a contender... Conley is the guy you want to add to your roster.

Look at teams like Cleveland, Miami, Dallas, NO, and even OKC (assuming Westy moved to SG), and you put Conley on those teams... and they are looking REAL good.... LAC, SAS and GSW are set.... but those other teams.


:speechless:

A terrible trade for Memphis, that's a huge stepback for a team that has proven they can compete with anyone in the playoffs and are looking better then ever... a dream come true for Cleveland thou.

Lol that's basically trading the core of a 30 win team for the core of a 50+ win team.

meloman1592
12-11-2014, 02:59 AM
Curry
Paul
Westbrook
Lillard
Conley

Kaner
12-11-2014, 03:02 AM
Paul, Westbrook, Curry are the only point guards I'd comfortably take before him. Then I think it's probably lowry at 4 and then him at 5.

Sadds The Gr8
12-11-2014, 03:09 AM
6-8 area

PurpleLynch
12-11-2014, 08:38 AM
Top 5 right now. I'd take just Curry,Westbrook and Paul ahead of him.
But Conley,along with Paul,are the best point guard for a contender team.
They control the pace as they wish and they can dictate the offense just passing the ball.

tredigs
12-11-2014, 09:49 AM
Paul, Westbrook, Curry are the only point guards I'd comfortably take before him. Then I think it's probably lowry at 4 and then him at 5.

Came in to write essentially the same sentence.

I'd sandwich him just after the top 3 + Lowry and the Wall/Lillard/Irving group (you can throw TP in there too). I'd say he's a super underrated player from a media/household standpoint, but true fans of the game know his impact is large. Without him, the beast that is Memphis doesn't run.

arlubas
12-11-2014, 05:21 PM
I've been watching Conley since HS, mainly because he was the sidekick to Greg Oden both there and in Ohio State afterwards. The guy has really worked his butt off ever since entering the league and is now a beast of stability at the point guard spot. I remember so vividly fighting with guys on b-ball forums (probably over here as well) 4 years ago when he signed that extension and people were calling him over payed and that his deal will come back and bite Memphis in the butt. Those 40 mil for 5 seasons now look like a STEAL with full caps.

As for Memphis as a team, I always took them seriously but in all honesty they were a 2nd round exit at best previously. Now with Mark Gasol going HAM this squad is looking scary and if they continue to play the way they play I could easily see them going to the WCFs or even the finals. I just hope they don't hit any wall come spring time or any major injuries occur for them, cause this team should be a player in this year's POs.

PS: Good look on the Billups comparison. Another amazing PG that never really got his full dues imo,

Shammyguy3
12-11-2014, 08:50 PM
Anyone disagree on the Billups comparison? Or anyone have a better comparison?

Jamiecballer
12-11-2014, 10:19 PM
I refuse to participate in a thread in which I am told to "go!"

I liken him to peak Terrell Brandon

ghettosean
12-12-2014, 12:18 AM
He's such a great leader. Very very good consistent PG who makes great decisions. I'd take him 3rd behind CP3 and Curry.

On top of your top 2 I'd also take:

Lillard
Parker (always underrated)
Lowry
Westbrook (He's been playing like a stud since he's come back)

Over him right now.

I would take Conley.

Lowry maybe. He's a warrior. Lillard no, too chucky. Parker too old. Westbrook too oc.

Fair enough on Lillard and Parker but Westy be beasting!!!

Tonight against the Cavs 28pts 8Asts 7Rebs and 50% from the field. Though i don't watch Memphis enough to be the best judge i admit.

LA_Raiders
12-12-2014, 02:07 AM
Top 5 no question

ThuglifeJ
12-12-2014, 02:10 AM
He's such a great leader. Very very good consistent PG who makes great decisions. I'd take him 3rd behind CP3 and Curry.

On top of your top 2 I'd also take:

Lillard
Parker (always underrated)
Lowry
Westbrook (He's been playing like a stud since he's come back)

Over him right now.

I would take Conley.

Lowry maybe. He's a warrior. Lillard no, too chucky. Parker too old. Westbrook too oc.

Fair enough on Lillard and Parker but Westy be beasting!!!

Tonight against the Cavs 28pts 8Asts 7Rebs and 50% from the field. Though i don't watch Memphis enough to be the best judge i admit.

He does beast it but I dont trust him. There's no thought that goes through that guys head lol

tredigs
12-12-2014, 03:15 AM
He does beast it but I dont trust him. There's no thought that goes through that guys head lol

Correction. There's one thought: "Destroy". And he's generally on the right side of it. He's so much better than a guy like Lillard it isn't fair.

rhino17
12-12-2014, 03:37 AM
top 5 for me are

Curry
Westbrook
Paul
Parker
Lillard

he's somewhere after that, I think he is a bit overrated

Chrisclover
12-12-2014, 03:40 AM
He's such a great leader. Very very good consistent PG who makes great decisions. I'd take him 3rd behind CP3 and Curry.
You overrated him. Parker says hi.

ThuglifeJ
12-12-2014, 04:20 AM
He does beast it but I dont trust him. There's no thought that goes through that guys head lol

Correction. There's one thought: "Destroy". And he's generally on the right side of it. He's so much better than a guy like Lillard it isn't fair.

I like him better than lillard as well. Westbrook has grown on me..used to get real annoyed by his celebrations and chucks but can't hate on a guy that fearless and puts his body on the line. I'd take him over a healthy rose too.

I still like a decision maker like Conley. And its not like he's boring to watch he's pretty darn fancy with his finishes and 3s. His D is just phenomenal too.

ThuglifeJ
12-12-2014, 04:21 AM
He's such a great leader. Very very good consistent PG who makes great decisions. I'd take him 3rd behind CP3 and Curry.
You overrated him. Parker says hi.

Im a big Tony Parker guy but age matters dude.

MonroeFAN
12-12-2014, 04:47 AM
I think Conley is superior to Billups (it's a valid comparison). I just think Billups is crazy overrated. I watched him run down the lane and cry for contact pretty much every game. Outside of that his percentages for his career were average or below and he was not a great facilitator until Flip came along. He is easily one of the most overrated players in basketball and im a Piston fan.

tredigs
12-12-2014, 05:05 AM
Billups commanded a team though. For whatever reason, he had it. By all accounts the man was a real professional and taught so many dudes how to win. To call him "one of the most overrated players in basketball" would be simultaneously ignoring everything the vast majority of his teammates have said about him. Chauncey was a winner. Period.

ThuglifeJ
12-12-2014, 05:45 AM
Billups commanded a team though. For whatever reason, he had it. By all accounts the man was a real professional and taught so many dudes how to win. To call him "one of the most overrated players in basketball" would be simultaneously ignoring everything the vast majority of his teammates have said about him. Chauncey was a winner. Period.

Dont let his big bald shiny head fool you..



Kidding, I like me some billups. Slightly overrated by the masses, yes, but he had his time with the pistons you just had to admire his leadership and talent. It was more so the after that was overrated and annoying. Like I remember with the clippers he'd get hyped for every shot and pass when really he was w.e. then.

MonroeFAN
12-12-2014, 08:17 AM
Billups commanded a team though. For whatever reason, he had it. By all accounts the man was a real professional and taught so many dudes how to win. To call him "one of the most overrated players in basketball" would be simultaneously ignoring everything the vast majority of his teammates have said about him. Chauncey was a winner. Period.

I guess that's just where we will have to disagree. He enjoyed success under one of the GOAT coaches, and then put up big numbers in Flip's scheme which seem kind of inflated when comparing it to his career averages. I agree, he was a winner, but that was a team... It wasn't one stand out talent. It it were, it would be Rasheed or Ben.

I realize that's not what we were debating, and yes I was overly dramatic. It's a great comparison, I just always feel the need to throw my 2 cents in when his name comes up.

arlubas
12-12-2014, 09:16 AM
It was more so the after that was overrated and annoying. Like I remember with the clippers he'd get hyped for every shot and pass when really he was w.e. then.
You do remember Melo and the Nuggets had their only great PO run when he was on board right? Not the same can be said for the Melo/AI teams, mind you.

ghettosean
12-13-2014, 01:48 AM
Billups commanded a team though. For whatever reason, he had it. By all accounts the man was a real professional and taught so many dudes how to win. To call him "one of the most overrated players in basketball" would be simultaneously ignoring everything the vast majority of his teammates have said about him. Chauncey was a winner. Period.

I guess that's just where we will have to disagree. He enjoyed success under one of the GOAT coaches, and then put up big numbers in Flip's scheme which seem kind of inflated when comparing it to his career averages. I agree, he was a winner, but that was a team... It wasn't one stand out talent. It it were, it would be Rasheed or Ben.

I realize that's not what we were debating, and yes I was overly dramatic. It's a great comparison, I just always feel the need to throw my 2 cents in when his name comes up.

I think your forgetting how Denver got drastically better when theyare swapped AI for Billups. He's a bit under rated in my opinion.