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View Full Version : Dwight has missed about half the season and the Rocket lead the division: surprised?



JasonJohnHorn
12-07-2014, 12:41 AM
With the loss of Chandler Parsons, Omer Asik, and Jeremy Lin, many though the Rockets would take a step back and there were predictions that Kevin McHale would an early coaching casualty.

On top of the loss of Parsons, the Rockets have also been without Howard for about half the season as well, yet they are still on top of the division almost a quarter of the way through the season.


Anybody surprised? And what do you think the reason for their success is?
Lots of great three-point shooters is a huge benefit: Jones, Beverly, Canaan, Harden and Ariza.

nastynice
12-07-2014, 12:44 AM
what happened to dwight?

nastynice
12-07-2014, 12:46 AM
whoa, they're 16-4 w/o dwight for 10 games huh. Yes, that is kinda surprising, that's a good sign for sprocket fans

JOSETHEALLSTAR
12-07-2014, 12:51 AM
3 out of the starting five have missed significant time so far.

Htownballa1622
12-07-2014, 12:59 AM
Jones has missed almost all games but 2 or 4. Can't remember.

I'm I surprised? Yeah, a lil but their schedule hasn't been too tough.
Good wins over Memphis and Dallas though.

TrueFan420
12-07-2014, 01:01 AM
I'm impressed by Ariza. Up till now he's been a contract player. I'm glad he's playing well. Him at his best is a great fit for them.

goku
12-07-2014, 01:03 AM
I for one didn't think the loses of lin and Parsons were bad Terry and cannon > lin
Ariza and Parsons basically wash missing asik size worried me but we went 22-12 without him last year rockets embracing defense and morey finding depth has helped the rockets out so far

Can't wait till we get healthy

rhino17
12-07-2014, 01:05 AM
I think thats why its hard not to have harden as MVP right now

the rockets bench is a lot better than I gave it credit for. Terry, Canaan, Papa, and Jones is a way better bench than last season

cmellofan15
12-07-2014, 01:30 AM
harden4mvp

tredigs
12-07-2014, 01:40 AM
What's crazy is that they're doing this while putting up a paltry 98.9 points a night despite average pace. That's 3rd least in the conference. Their D has just been fantastic across the board, and that's very surprising without Dwight and Beverly for so many of the games. Hollinger's Rankings still doesn't have them as a top 10 team, but they'll get there statistically once they get healthy.

goingfor28
12-07-2014, 02:30 AM
Got to give them credit where credit is due. I did not see this coming. Figured they'd be good in a loaded West but not THIS good. :hat-tip: to Houston

CluTcH_c1tY
12-07-2014, 02:52 AM
The addition of RJ Dunn to the coaching staff has to be praised. This team is playing and staying in gamed due to their defense. Injuries keep plaguing this team (Tjones/Dwight/Bev/Canaan/Papanikalou) but they find ways to win. A lot of the success can also be attributed to Terry and the recent play of Dmo and Black who's been a solid rookie thus far.

LAKERS4LIFE!!
12-07-2014, 04:37 AM
I honestly wanted them to suck because I think the Lakers have their pick and I was hoping it would be in the low 20's but I have to admit they're playing great. I'm really impressed with how well they're playing without Howard. I think as of right now they're exceeding everyone's(outside of rockets fans) expectations of them.

jerellh528
12-07-2014, 04:52 AM
It means dwights impact is overrated

ILLUSIONIST^248
12-07-2014, 05:53 AM
It means dwights impact is overrated

Not only that, but when he comes back, the chemistry will plummet.

Ariza's Better
12-07-2014, 08:41 AM
It means dwights impact is overrated


Not only that, but when he comes back, the chemistry will plummet.
No not really

JasonJohnHorn
12-07-2014, 09:46 AM
It means dwights impact is overrated

They were playing better with him:
9-1 with Howard
6-3 without

nyyfan4life
12-07-2014, 10:05 AM
Their overall team defense has been very good.

Ariza obviously helps but Harden has been putting in the effort on that end and their big man, Motiejunas (sp?) has been anchoring the defense extremely well.

They are still a piece away though, IMO. Not necessarily a superstar but they need a guy that can create offense on the perimeter to give Harden some help. He's been carrying that team.

I don't worry about the chemistry being off when Howard comes back but he does hurt the offensive flow a bit when he tries to get post touches. At times, that's cool but he should focus more on being primarily a PnR player with Harden and doing what does best (defense + cleaning up the boards).

jerellh528
12-07-2014, 10:22 AM
They were playing better with him:
9-1 with Howard
6-3 without

Oh, so whats even the point of the thread then? 6-3 isnt something amazing or anything. Winning at that rate wouldnt even make the playoffs. The real title of this thread so be, " rockets started off fast then lost dwight, they slowed down as expected, but are still decent...is this cool or lame? Thoughts"

ghettosean
12-07-2014, 10:35 AM
They were playing better with him:
9-1 with Howard
6-3 without

Oh, so whats even the point of the thread then? 6-3 isnt something amazing or anything. Winning at that rate wouldnt even make the playoffs. The real title of this thread so be, " rockets started off fast then lost dwight, they slowed down as expected, but are still decent...is this cool or lame? Thoughts" Lame

nastynice
12-07-2014, 11:05 AM
I think thats why its hard not to have harden as MVP right now


whoa, really? Is he really playing that good?

mightybosstone
12-07-2014, 11:23 AM
Oh, so whats even the point of the thread then? 6-3 isnt something amazing or anything. Winning at that rate wouldnt even make the playoffs. The real title of this thread so be, " rockets started off fast then lost dwight, they slowed down as expected, but are still decent...is this cool or lame? Thoughts"

Dude.... They're not just missing Dwight. Canaan has misses six games, Beverley has missed 12 and Jones has missed 16. That's four of their 9-10 best rotational guys that have missed a huge chunk of the season so far. And it's not like they're beating up on cupcakes. They trounced Memphis, beat Dallas, Sacramento, Milwaukee and Phoenix.

Before the season, all I kept hearing was about how much worse the Rockets were going to be and how horrible their depth was. I told people that Canaan, Motiejunas, Papanikoloau and Black would surprise people, and I got laughed at. Now the Rockets are faced with a worst case scenario and they're still beating playoff teams every week. Clearly that depth wasn't as bad as some people made it seem.

Yeah, it's early in the season and nobody gives out awards for playing well for 20 games. But at least give credit where credit is due and eat a little crow. The Rockets are contenders in the West and are playing even better basketball than last season.

5ass
12-07-2014, 11:45 AM
Not only that, but when he comes back, the chemistry will plummet.

Remember when your username was d12fan lol

mightybosstone
12-07-2014, 11:58 AM
It means dwights impact is overrated


Not only that, but when he comes back, the chemistry will plummet.

Also, you're both blatantly wrong about this. Let's not forget that this Houston team with Dwight started the season off at 6-0 with the best point differential in the league before he missed his first game and then the Rockets went on the dreaded Mexico City trip. There's literally zero reason to believe that this team will somehow play worse with the addition of the best big man on the roster. As much as I like Tarik Black, it's not like he and Joey Dorsey are contributing hardly anything on the offensive side of the basketball right now. And they're not remotely the defender that Dwight is.

KnickNyKnick
12-07-2014, 12:34 PM
yeah rockets are awesome this year. I feel it is the year they come back to the WCF. Impressive so far without their center. GJ in getting rid of Lin.

cmellofan15
12-07-2014, 01:16 PM
It means dwights impact is overrated

lol, really? look at the teams he's left....

Verbal Christ
12-07-2014, 02:03 PM
I'm still somewhat wary and aloof of the recent defensive transformation. TJones has nerve damage, and I wouldnt be surprised if he sits the year at this point. DMo has made the most of his time and its going to be interesting to see how he and Dwight will be able to coexist in the paint. I dont want DMo to be a stretch 4 spot up guy, he needs touches in the post. Harden has elevated his game, to the point of physical breakdown. Earning his way into all time top Rocket performances for me. 60 games is a stupid amount of games for anything to go wrong and luck to change though just gotta keep grinding away.

benny01
12-07-2014, 02:16 PM
lol, really? look at the teams he's left....
Orlando was built perfectly to suit his skillset or lack thereof, and blew themselves up when he left. LA was grasping at straws when they got him and continued to when he left. Before and after is an incredibly short sighted comparison. LA is I recall correctly was better without him then with him as well. His impact on game's is certainly overated. He's a stat stuffer.

nastynice
12-07-2014, 03:21 PM
Orlando was built perfectly to suit his skillset or lack thereof, and blew themselves up when he left. LA was grasping at straws when they got him and continued to when he left. Before and after is an incredibly short sighted comparison. LA is I recall correctly was better without him then with him as well. His impact on game's is certainly overated. He's a stat stuffer.

you cant be serious. How is there even a question on how big an impact he has on the defensive side of the ball? Offensively, personally I'm very impressed with where he was toward the end of last year and beginning of this year, but I can see why some may not be sold on his offense. But I don't understand how his defensive impact could come into question. Your post makes no sense. Have you seen him play in Houston?

ghettosean
12-07-2014, 03:21 PM
Also, you're both blatantly wrong about this. Let's not forget that this Houston team with Dwight started the season off at 6-0 with the best point differential in the league before he missed his first game and then the Rockets went on the dreaded Mexico City trip. There's literally zero reason to believe that this team will somehow play worse with the addition of the best big man on the roster. As much as I like Tarik Black, it's not like he and Joey Dorsey are contributing hardly anything on the offensive side of the basketball right now. And they're not remotely the defender that Dwight is.

I admit Houston is playing far beyond anyone expectations including my own but lets not use the 6-0 start to praise them like it's superb they played against:

1. Lakers
2. Utah
3. Boston
4. Philly
5. Miami
6. San Antonio (Duncan was not playing and neither was Ginobli)

There only real test in that stretch was Miami the rest was a wash.

LAKERS4LIFE!!
12-07-2014, 03:34 PM
If they win against the warriors on wednesday, then I'd be extremely impressed. At this point though, I feel like the warriors are better but we'll see.

benny01
12-07-2014, 03:38 PM
you cant be serious. How is there even a question on how big an impact he has on the defensive side of the ball? Offensively, personally I'm very impressed with where he was toward the end of last year and beginning of this year, but I can see why some may not be sold on his offense. But I don't understand how his defensive impact could come into question. Your post makes no sense. Have you seen him play in Houston?
Yes clogging the lane is his main skill as he has no game outside of ten feet. Everything he gives you defensively he takes from you offensively.

astrosmaniac
12-07-2014, 04:04 PM
If they win against the warriors on wednesday, then I'd be extremely impressed. At this point though, I feel like the warriors are better but we'll see.

I honestly don't feel that that's a fair evaluation for the Rockets though. I'll admit that the Warriors have been the best team in the league so far, but aside from that Houston is most likely playing that game without Caanan, Dwight, Jones, Papanikolau, Garcia (i heard he got hurt last night?). Plus it'll only be Beverly's 2nd game back so he'll probably still have some limited minutes.

So yeah, if they come out and beat the Warriors I'll be super impressed, but i'm not gonna be surprised or take it as a slight to an extremely banged up Rockets team to lose to the Warriors in Oracle at this point in the year.

astrosmaniac
12-07-2014, 04:05 PM
Yes clogging the lane is his main skill as he has no game outside of ten feet. Everything he gives you defensively he takes from you offensively.

that's literally what we're rolling with now with Black and Dorsey, it's just that Dwight is better than either of them at both sides of the court.

nastynice
12-07-2014, 04:45 PM
Yes clogging the lane is his main skill as he has no game outside of ten feet. Everything he gives you defensively he takes from you offensively.

He's one of the most intimidating presence in the paint of the last decade. He doesn't need to have any type of game outside of ten feet.

I think you're underrating his offense. He actually started developing a post game late last year. Nothing spectacular, but at least something to work with, and I've seen them run the offense through him for small stretches and it was pretty effective. He's nowhere near some of the other big men in the league, but I think he's leaps and bounds ahead of his Laker and early Rockets days.

benny01
12-07-2014, 05:41 PM
He's one of the most intimidating presence in the paint of the last decade. He doesn't need to have any type of game outside of ten feet.

I think you're underrating his offense. He actually started developing a post game late last year. Nothing spectacular, but at least something to work with, and I've seen them run the offense through him for small stretches and it was pretty effective. He's nowhere near some of the other big men in the league, but I think he's leaps and bounds ahead of his Laker and early Rockets days.
I think that his impact on games is overated. I think your taking that as he sucks, which isn't what I'm saying. He doesn't add any thing offensively that an average big wouldn't give you except he get a few more put-backs on a few more boards. What he does do is take up a ton of space in the lane and is largely inneffective outside of it. This actually hurts a team. Also, he should be improving in the post he's been a pro basketball player for ten years.

Munkeysuit
12-07-2014, 07:08 PM
The Beard...that is all

JasonJohnHorn
12-07-2014, 07:52 PM
Oh, so whats even the point of the thread then? 6-3 isnt something amazing or anything. Winning at that rate wouldnt even make the playoffs. The real title of this thread so be, " rockets started off fast then lost dwight, they slowed down as expected, but are still decent...is this cool or lame? Thoughts"

A 6/3 winning percentage (which is just about 70%) isn't enough for a playoff run? That is 54 wins. That is as many wins as they had last year WITH Dwight.

Now, if heard at the end of the season that Parsons, Asik and Lin would all be gone and Dwight would miss half the game int he first quarter of the season, do you think you would assume they'd be on pace to win more or less games than last year?


Half their games are without Dwight and they are STILL at the top of of the hardest division in the league. I'd say that's pretty good.

JasonJohnHorn
12-07-2014, 07:56 PM
I admit Houston is playing far beyond anyone expectations including my own but lets not use the 6-0 start to praise them like it's superb they played against:

1. Lakers
2. Utah
3. Boston
4. Philly
5. Miami
6. San Antonio (Duncan was not playing and neither was Ginobli)

There only real test in that stretch was Miami the rest was a wash.

Dude... a quarter of the season is GONE and they are still at the top of the toughest division in the league in the tougher conference.

Just because they had a few soft games to start the season, doesn't discredit what they are doing. Winning those games is what great teams are supposed to do.

Tony_Starks
12-07-2014, 08:34 PM
The Houston Rockets have had the second most favorable schedule in the NBA, only second to the Torronto Raptors.

mightybosstone
12-07-2014, 08:39 PM
I admit Houston is playing far beyond anyone expectations including my own but lets not use the 6-0 start to praise them like it's superb they played against:

1. Lakers
2. Utah
3. Boston
4. Philly
5. Miami
6. San Antonio (Duncan was not playing and neither was Ginobli)

There only real test in that stretch was Miami the rest was a wash.

Two things:
1. This thread really isn't about the 6-0 start. It's about the fact that they're 16-4 despite missing three of their starters for like half of those games. I was merely using the 6-0 start as an example of how good they are with Dwight Howard.
2. It's not just that they were 6-0. It's that they were 6-0 and they beat every one of their opponents by double digits. That's pretty freaking hard to do. Sure the schedule was soft, but those are still NBA teams they were playing.

Chrisclover
12-07-2014, 09:05 PM
yea, they are so amazing. I thought their record would hover at the 7rd when Parsons and Lin left for little in turn. Dunno if this trend will last.

Chrisclover
12-07-2014, 09:07 PM
Not only that, but when he comes back, the chemistry will plummet.
Oh, seriously? Howard is not such a poison. Just bench him and you will be fine.

alexander_37
12-08-2014, 12:14 AM
Lol Rockets beat bad teams oh they are supposed to win it's a gimmie.

Rockets beat good teams oh so and so just played badly/down to the Rockets it means nothing.

Meanwhile the Rockets are sitting in 2nd place in the conference while 3 of their starters missing a combined what 30 games?

They beat the Grizzlies with a late first round super raw rookie and d-league player as their 2 centers.

Thumper 88
12-08-2014, 12:27 AM
Got to give them credit where credit is due. I did not see this coming. Figured they'd be good in a loaded West but not THIS good. :hat-tip: to Houston
This

likemystylez
12-08-2014, 12:30 AM
I honestly don't feel that that's a fair evaluation for the Rockets though. I'll admit that the Warriors have been the best team in the league so far, but aside from that Houston is most likely playing that game without Caanan, Dwight, Jones, Papanikolau, Garcia (i heard he got hurt last night?). Plus it'll only be Beverly's 2nd game back so he'll probably still have some limited minutes.

So yeah, if they come out and beat the Warriors I'll be super impressed, but i'm not gonna be surprised or take it as a slight to an extremely banged up Rockets team to lose to the Warriors in Oracle at this point in the year.

good point- It looks like these teams could meet in the second round- and itd be a great series if the rockets were healthy and david lee was back with the warriors. I think the warriors would come out on top if both teams are healthy. Just dont think houston could contend with the warriors depth- and I think thompson would do a decent job on harden

alexander_37
12-08-2014, 12:34 AM
good point- It looks like these teams could meet in the second round- and itd be a great series if the rockets were healthy and david lee was back with the warriors. I think the warriors would come out on top if both teams are healthy. Just dont think houston could contend with the warriors depth- and I think thompson would do a decent job on harden

A team in second place while missing 3 starters doesn't have depth? Curious.

nastynice
12-08-2014, 12:40 AM
I think that his impact on games is overated. I think your taking that as he sucks, which isn't what I'm saying. He doesn't add any thing offensively that an average big wouldn't give you except he get a few more put-backs on a few more boards. What he does do is take up a ton of space in the lane and is largely inneffective outside of it. This actually hurts a team. Also, he should be improving in the post he's been a pro basketball player for ten years.

sure, fair

likemystylez
12-08-2014, 12:52 AM
A team in second place while missing 3 starters doesn't have depth? Curious.

I never said they didnt have depth.....

ghettosean
12-08-2014, 01:05 AM
I admit Houston is playing far beyond anyone expectations including my own but lets not use the 6-0 start to praise them like it's superb they played against:

1. Lakers
2. Utah
3. Boston
4. Philly
5. Miami
6. San Antonio (Duncan was not playing and neither was Ginobli)

There only real test in that stretch was Miami the rest was a wash.

Two things:
1. This thread really isn't about the 6-0 start. It's about the fact that they're 16-4 despite missing three of their starters for like half of those games. I was merely using the 6-0 start as an example of how good they are with Dwight Howard.
2. It's not just that they were 6-0. It's that they were 6-0 and they beat every one of their opponents by double digits. That's pretty freaking hard to do. Sure the schedule was soft, but those are still NBA teams they were playing.



I admit Houston is playing far beyond anyone expectations including my own but lets not use the 6-0 start to praise them like it's superb they played against:

1. Lakers
2. Utah
3. Boston
4. Philly
5. Miami
6. San Antonio (Duncan was not playing and neither was Ginobli)

There only real test in that stretch was Miami the rest was a wash.

Two things:
1. This thread really isn't about the 6-0 start. It's about the fact that they're 16-4 despite missing three of their starters for like half of those games. I was merely using the 6-0 start as an example of how good they are with Dwight Howard.
2. It's not just that they were 6-0. It's that they were 6-0 and they beat every one of their opponents by double digits. That's pretty freaking hard to do. Sure the schedule was soft, but those are still NBA teams they were playing.

They are NBA teams your playing but there all NBA teams including the rockets. 6-0 with Dwight against those teams doesn't make me think he's the huge piece that beat up against the bottom feeders of the league.

I admit again that they are playing beyond my expectations and are definitely another team to be reckoned with in the stacked west as they've beaten some of the elite teams in the league already. i was just pointing out from you post on how they started the season that a 6-0 record against some of the worst teams in the league isn't something to go nuts over even if it's in double digits.

ghettosean
12-08-2014, 01:08 AM
I admit Houston is playing far beyond anyone expectations including my own but lets not use the 6-0 start to praise them like it's superb they played against:

1. Lakers
2. Utah
3. Boston
4. Philly
5. Miami
6. San Antonio (Duncan was not playing and neither was Ginobli)

There only real test in that stretch was Miami the rest was a wash.

Dude... a quarter of the season is GONE and they are still at the top of the toughest division in the league in the tougher conference.

Just because they had a few soft games to start the season, doesn't discredit what they are doing. Winning those games is what great teams are supposed to do.

Most teams in the league should win those games. I only pointed it out because the poster brought it up.

nyyfan4life
12-08-2014, 04:05 AM
Spurs, Rockets, Warriors, Mavs, Clippers, Blazers, Grizzlies, Thunder (they'll be the 8th seed I bet)...
God damn. The top 8 in the West are all borderline elite level teams. Absolutely ridiculous.

Jeffy25
12-08-2014, 04:18 AM
Oh, so whats even the point of the thread then? 6-3 isnt something amazing or anything. Winning at that rate wouldnt even make the playoffs. The real title of this thread so be, " rockets started off fast then lost dwight, they slowed down as expected, but are still decent...is this cool or lame? Thoughts"

What?

What 55-27 team hasn't made the playoffs?

FOBolous
12-08-2014, 04:52 AM
I think that his impact on games is overated. I think your taking that as he sucks, which isn't what I'm saying. He doesn't add any thing offensively that an average big wouldn't give you except he get a few more put-backs on a few more boards. What he does do is take up a ton of space in the lane and is largely inneffective outside of it. This actually hurts a team. Also, he should be improving in the post he's been a pro basketball player for ten years.

would you say Dwight Howard will have more impact on offense than Tarik Black, Joey Dorsey, and Donatas Montiejunas? Cause those 3 players are who Houston has playing at the 4 and 5 right now.

MonroeFAN
12-08-2014, 07:02 AM
Yes I'm very surprised. I entertained the idea of them missing the playoffs during the off-season. Time will tell if it lasts, but I owe the Rox an apology. They're playing impressive ball.

I think Motiejunias has a lot to do with it.

Gagan136
12-08-2014, 10:29 AM
Houston is a good team, will only get better with Howard and Jones returning whenever they do. Look for a deeper run in the post season too.

nyyfan4life
12-08-2014, 11:00 AM
The Rockets defense has been pretty fantastic this season and that's the main reason why they are 16-4. Replacing Ariza with Parsons turned out to be the perfect move. Harden is showing more effort than ever on defense and the coaching staff has completely shifted it's defensive philosophy. Motiejunas has developed into a terrific positional defender in the post and a guy that can hedge on the perimeter.

2-ONE-5
12-08-2014, 11:14 AM
Not only that, but when he comes back, the chemistry will plummet.

lol except they are 9-1 with him on the floor.

nice try though

TrueFan420
12-08-2014, 12:25 PM
What 55-27 team hasn't made the playoffs?
With the way the west is looking now we might see something absurd like that happen this year.

clutchfan
12-08-2014, 04:31 PM
Oh, so whats even the point of the thread then? 6-3 isnt something amazing or anything. Winning at that rate wouldnt even make the playoffs. The real title of this thread so be, " rockets started off fast then lost dwight, they slowed down as expected, but are still decent...is this cool or lame? Thoughts"

Joey Dorsey is getting minutes.

Tony_Starks
12-09-2014, 03:05 AM
Montiejunas ( however you spell it) has been a pleasant surprise. He has game!

The Rox still don't want anything to do with the Clippers, Blazers, or Dubs in a series but they are at least beating the teams they're supposed to beat.....

CluTcH_c1tY
12-09-2014, 12:05 PM
I like the Rockets chances versus any of those teams mentioned above with a healthy roster. Keep in mind Morey still has a TE at his arsenal. This team will only get better as the year moves along.

GunFactor187
12-09-2014, 12:07 PM
What the hell happened to him anyways? Why is he out?

nyyfan4life
12-09-2014, 12:10 PM
What the hell happened to him anyways? Why is he out?

Knee sprain, I think.

DreamShaker
12-09-2014, 01:24 PM
The addition of RJ Dunn to the coaching staff has to be praised. This team is playing and staying in gamed due to their defense. Injuries keep plaguing this team (Tjones/Dwight/Bev/Canaan/Papanikalou) but they find ways to win. A lot of the success can also be attributed to Terry and the recent play of Dmo and Black who's been a solid rookie thus far.

Very true. I think it's TR Dunn, but he was on the staff with Addleman when he was here. D-Mo and Terry have been the biggest surprises to me. I thought Terry was washed up, and D-Mo was garbage, but they have been great. Harden is also playing defense, and is an overall more complete player.