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View Full Version : Kobe got 6,000 assists, and a triple double while he was at it



nickdymez
12-01-2014, 01:08 AM
Congrats to Kobe! Amazing stat for him

jaydubb
12-01-2014, 01:15 AM
Lakers won tho.. :down:

Tony_Starks
12-01-2014, 01:24 AM
More records at the Raptors expense! Lol

Zefflin
12-01-2014, 01:29 AM
What a ****ing living legend. I'll soak this Kobe stat and Laker victory up no doubt about it. Suck me hard that was awesome.

Lakers + Giants
12-01-2014, 02:28 AM
Congrats to Kobe! Amazing stat for him

This


More records at the Raptors expense! Lol

and This

Raps18-19 Champ
12-01-2014, 02:36 AM
Tbe.

JasonJohnHorn
12-01-2014, 02:40 AM
WOW!!! Kobe hater here... that was a GREAT game and is an amazing milestone.

Wish he played that well every night.

PowerHouse
12-01-2014, 02:54 AM
WOW!!! Kobe hater here... that was a GREAT game and is an amazing milestone.

Wish he played that well every night.

Being a self-titled Kobe hater that would mean you dont wish he played that well every night. Unless Im misunderstanding the definition of hate.

PowerHouse
12-01-2014, 03:13 AM
He is also the oldest player ever to record 30/10/10 in a game.

murphturph
12-01-2014, 04:08 AM
****iinngg KOBEEE!!! Thats the man right there. He never fails to amaze me and torcure me as a raptor fan. speechless after that game. I will saver this game and tell my kids along with the time her rained liked Three threes and and dunked the game away against the raptors couple years ago. Not to mention ....81.... Congrats to Kobe. F U C K I N G Legend. Never doubt that mans greatness, you make gawk his efficiency but he impacts the game in so many more ways than stats can point to, such as his amazing ability to make amazing unguardable contested jumpers when the offence breaks down and there is no set play and someone has to take a "Low percentage" one on one shot with the clock winding down

curtcocaine
12-01-2014, 04:32 AM
Being a self-titled Kobe hater that would mean you dont wish he played that well every night. Unless Im misunderstanding the definition of hate.
Im assuming he hates the way he plays now. The 30/30 Kobe 30 points of 30 shots.....

Munkeysuit
12-01-2014, 05:41 AM
I think its now time to unleash a theory of mines, I deeply feel like Kobe will try to break as much records as he can this season with the Lakers and then he bolts to NY w/ CP3 and form a super team that will try to get him 2 more rings before he's done, just so that he can sleep better at night knowing that he will never be greater than Jordan but he has better stats in the areas that supposedly count.
So basically Kobe/ Melo/ CP3 will form a super team out in NY.

Ty22Mitchell
12-01-2014, 07:20 AM
I think its now time to unleash a theory of mines, I deeply feel like Kobe will try to break as much records as he can this season with the Lakers and then he bolts to NY w/ CP3 and form a super team that will try to get him 2 more rings before he's done, just so that he can sleep better at night knowing that he will never be greater than Jordan but he has better stats in the areas that supposedly count.
So basically Kobe/ Melo/ CP3 will form a super team out in NY.

Chris Paul is in the second year of a five year deal, it'll be awhile before he leaves the Clips.

Doogolas
12-01-2014, 08:04 AM
I think its now time to unleash a theory of mines, I deeply feel like Kobe will try to break as much records as he can this season with the Lakers and then he bolts to NY w/ CP3 and form a super team that will try to get him 2 more rings before he's done, just so that he can sleep better at night knowing that he will never be greater than Jordan but he has better stats in the areas that supposedly count.
So basically Kobe/ Melo/ CP3 will form a super team out in NY.

Not only is CP3 not in a position to do that, how exactly will Kobe leave after this year? He's not a FA next year I don't believe.

More-Than-Most
12-01-2014, 09:20 AM
Im assuming he hates the way he plays now. The 30/30 Kobe 30 points of 30 shots.....

basically this. Great game though

PurpleLynch
12-01-2014, 09:27 AM
Kobe,you are making me cry. What a legend.

pebloemer
12-01-2014, 10:30 AM
More records at the Raptors expense! Lol

Yah, tell me about it. Kobe always seems to torch our team. And here I thought we had a group that was finally prioritizing defense :).

In seriousness, Kobe played a great game last night and the milestone is quite spectacular when you step back to appreciate it.

Goose17
12-01-2014, 11:00 AM
Longevity ftw.

Good on him.

Chronz
12-01-2014, 11:06 AM
That Kobe guy is pretty good. Great game to watch tho. Lakers have some of the best back stage interviews when they win.

ILLUSIONIST^248
12-01-2014, 12:32 PM
He is also the oldest player ever to record 30/10/10 in a game.

Thank you I've been looking for that stat. Sweet.

ILLUSIONIST^248
12-01-2014, 12:33 PM
****iinngg KOBEEE!!! Thats the man right there. He never fails to amaze me and torcure me as a raptor fan. speechless after that game. I will saver this game and tell my kids along with the time her rained liked Three threes and and dunked the game away against the raptors couple years ago. Not to mention ....81.... Congrats to Kobe. F U C K I N G Legend. Never doubt that mans greatness, you make gawk his efficiency but he impacts the game in so many more ways than stats can point to, such as his amazing ability to make amazing unguardable contested jumpers when the offence breaks down and there is no set play and someone has to take a "Low percentage" one on one shot with the clock winding down

Thanks for noticing bro. Now you know why I live and die by Kobe.

ILLUSIONIST^248
12-01-2014, 12:36 PM
Longevity ftw.

Good on him.

GTFO with that bs. What a hater

ILLUSIONIST^248
12-01-2014, 12:37 PM
That Kobe guy is pretty good. Great game to watch tho. Lakers have some of the best back stage interviews when they win.

You know,I wouldn't hold it against you if you wanted to jump ship and become a laker fan.

FraziersKnicks
12-01-2014, 12:42 PM
And LeBron will get there in about 14 games at the tender age of... I'm just playing Lakers fans.

Congrats Kobe, fantastic display of longevity.

Chronz
12-01-2014, 12:49 PM
You know,I wouldn't hold it against you if you wanted to jump ship and become a laker fan.

But they gon lose ... like alot

Goose17
12-01-2014, 12:52 PM
GTFO with that bs. What a hater

How am I hating? I said good on him and praised him for his longevity in the league. Are the Kobe knob gobblers on this forum so paranoid about people thinking Kobe is anything less than the best athlete that ever existed in any sport that they perceive everything as hate? Remove his pubic hair from your eyes and take his black thickness out of your mouth and away from your face, maybe you will be able to see things clearer.

aman_13
12-01-2014, 12:52 PM
....

aman_13
12-01-2014, 12:55 PM
But they gon lose ... like alot

Lol

ILLUSIONIST^248
12-01-2014, 12:57 PM
You know,I wouldn't hold it against you if you wanted to jump ship and become a laker fan.

But they gon lose ... like alot

That would make your jump look even better. Joining us while we're down would make you look good. I don't want you to think about this is in 10 years when we're back on top and wished you came to this side.

ILLUSIONIST^248
12-01-2014, 12:59 PM
GTFO with that bs. What a hater

How am I hating? I said good on him and praised him for his longevity in the league. Are the Kobe knob gobblers on this forum so paranoid about people thinking Kobe is anything less than the best athlete that ever existed in any sport that they perceive everything as hate? Remove his pubic hair from your eyes and take his black thickness out of your mouth and away from your face, maybe you will be able to see things clearer.

You think your silent jabs are cute. Just like a kobe hater, you have to attack someone with nonsense like this. I could say the same thing about you and curry but I don't. Your just jealous that you best player will never be half of what kobe is today.

Chronz
12-01-2014, 01:06 PM
That would make your jump look even better. Joining us while we're down would make you look good. I don't want you to think about this is in 10 years when we're back on top and wished you came to this side.

Ill hop on when ur closer than a decade away from contention. Lakes gon suck for a LONG time IMO.

ILLUSIONIST^248
12-01-2014, 01:08 PM
That would make your jump look even better. Joining us while we're down would make you look good. I don't want you to think about this is in 10 years when we're back on top and wished you came to this side.

Ill hop on when ur closer than a decade away from contention. Lakes gon suck for a LONG time IMO.

Don't people say that every time we're down? You should know that we'll be back strong sooner than later.

Chronz
12-01-2014, 01:17 PM
Don't people say that every time we're down? You should know that we'll be back strong sooner than later.

I dont care about what other people say. I havent felt this way since the Lakers traded Shaq, and back then I (accurately) predicted the 3-4 year rebuild and that was with a prime Kobe already on board. Now I think we're looking at the leagues worst roster from an asset standpoint. An older team thats losing its way upstairs. I think you can see why I dont think they will get back to the top any time soon. Maybe you can start thinking playoffs in 3 more years tho.

Hawkeye15
12-01-2014, 01:23 PM
More records at the Raptors expense! Lol

exactly what I thought..

Goose17
12-01-2014, 01:23 PM
You think your silent jabs are cute. Just like a kobe hater, you have to attack someone with nonsense like this. I could say the same thing about you and curry but I don't. Your just jealous that you best player will never be half of what kobe is today.

What are you even talking about? I clearly wasn't hating. LOL can't even compliment the guy without Kobe fangirls getting their panties wet.

Pull your skirt up and learn to take a compliment when one is dished out.

ILLUSIONIST^248
12-01-2014, 01:30 PM
Don't people say that every time we're down? You should know that we'll be back strong sooner than later.

I dont care about what other people say. I havent felt this way since the Lakers traded Shaq, and back then I (accurately) predicted the 3-4 year rebuild and that was with a prime Kobe already on board. Now I think we're looking at the leagues worst roster from an asset standpoint. An older team thats losing its way upstairs. I think you can see why I dont think they will get back to the top any time soon. Maybe you can start thinking playoffs in 3 more years tho.

I doubt one of the best franchise in the world will lay down and die for 10 plus years. I know you would love that, but history repeats itself. There's no doubt we'll be back by the end of the decade.

ILLUSIONIST^248
12-01-2014, 01:33 PM
You think your silent jabs are cute. Just like a kobe hater, you have to attack someone with nonsense like this. I could say the same thing about you and curry but I don't. Your just jealous that you best player will never be half of what kobe is today.

What are you even talking about? I clearly wasn't hating. LOL can't even compliment the guy without Kobe fangirls getting their panties wet.

Pull your skirt up and learn to take a compliment when one is dished out.

Cut the bs clown. There you go again with nonsense talk. Try arguing without having to say stupid things like that. You sound like a little kid.

Goose17
12-01-2014, 01:49 PM
Cut the bs clown. There you go again with nonsense talk. Try arguing without having to say stupid things like that. You sound like a little kid.

Arguing what? I gave him kudos and you started crying like a child. I don't even know how you manage to interpret what I said as hate. It makes no sense. You're acting like a fan girl. Plain and simple.

Goose17
12-01-2014, 01:51 PM
Damn Kobe fans seem like they're always menstruating

This^

DODGERS&LAKERS
12-01-2014, 01:52 PM
I have hated the way Kobe has played this year but he was pretty great last night. He won't duplicate the results but I hope he plays with that mindset more often

Chronz
12-01-2014, 02:31 PM
I doubt one of the best franchise in the world will lay down and die for 10 plus years. I know you would love that, but history repeats itself. There's no doubt we'll be back by the end of the decade.

I almost pity you, wishful thinking and history is all you will have to cling to for quite some time. Then I remember the kind of fan you are and I think its a humbling experience you might need. Enjoy losing your pick this year. LOL, no doubt.

Chronz
12-01-2014, 02:32 PM
Arguing what? I gave him kudos and you started crying like a child. I don't even know how you manage to interpret what I said as hate. It makes no sense. You're acting like a fan girl. Plain and simple.

To them, longevity is a bad thing.

Goose17
12-01-2014, 02:34 PM
To them, longevity is a bad thing.

Lol. Kobe fans are crazy.

Tony_Starks
12-01-2014, 03:17 PM
That's the 40th best player in the league for ya!

Hawkeye15
12-01-2014, 03:33 PM
That's the 40th best player in the league for ya!

He has not been good this year at all, considering. 40 is about right.

ILLUSIONIST^248
12-01-2014, 03:45 PM
Cut the bs clown. There you go again with nonsense talk. Try arguing without having to say stupid things like that. You sound like a little kid.

Arguing what? I gave him kudos and you started crying like a child. I don't even know how you manage to interpret what I said as hate. It makes no sense. You're acting like a fan girl. Plain and simple.
Instead of just saying congrats, you have to add in other bs just to downgrade his accomplishment. Your trolling sucks.

ILLUSIONIST^248
12-01-2014, 03:47 PM
I doubt one of the best franchise in the world will lay down and die for 10 plus years. I know you would love that, but history repeats itself. There's no doubt we'll be back by the end of the decade.

I almost pity you, wishful thinking and history is all you will have to cling to for quite some time. Then I remember the kind of fan you are and I think its a humbling experience you might need. Enjoy losing your pick this year. LOL, no doubt.

That's fine FC. Even if we don't win anything for 30 years, your joke of a franchise still wouldn't catch us in trophies. Try getting to the second round before you start talking trash.

ILLUSIONIST^248
12-01-2014, 03:49 PM
That's the 40th best player in the league for ya!

He has not been good this year at all, considering. 40 is about right.

You must be joking hawk! He's 36 and leading the league in scoring. I don't think anyone at his age has ever had a triple double.

Hawkeye15
12-01-2014, 03:55 PM
You must be joking hawk! He's 36 and leading the league in scoring. I don't think anyone at his age has ever had a triple double.

he has not been very good. That is not a joke. He is shot killing his team out of games, his defense is embarrassing, and his advanced numbers are terrible. Shortly into the season, Kobe is nowhere near a star level player. None.

But he is 36, coming off serious injuries. This should be expected. You can justify his play by throwing his age/injuries out there, but simply put, he isn't a great player anymore. Not even close so far.

Goose17
12-01-2014, 03:57 PM
Instead of just saying congrats, you have to add in other bs just to downgrade his accomplishment. Your trolling sucks.

What? What did I add in? Jesus christ be specific or just stfu. I was congratulating the man and you started whining about nothing. Get outta here.

MonroeFAN
12-01-2014, 03:57 PM
Kobe is turning it on, and that was a really impressive game.

Hawkeye15
12-01-2014, 03:57 PM
That's fine FC. Even if we don't win anything for 30 years, your joke of a franchise still wouldn't catch us in trophies. Try getting to the second round before you start talking trash.

you act as if your teams success is your own. You are interesting, I give you that. I mean, nothing that comes from your keystrokes ever makes me think, you are just an interesting young fella

MonroeFAN
12-01-2014, 04:02 PM
Most of Illusionists comments on here give me diarrhea. I stopped saying anything because quite frankly, I'm not sure he understands English or logic.

I blame his parents for allowing him to run wild on the computer when they are at work.

Hawkeye15
12-01-2014, 04:08 PM
Most of Illusionists comments on here give me diarrhea. I stopped saying anything because quite frankly, I'm not sure he understands English or logic.

I blame his parents for allowing him to run wild on the computer when they are at work.

the only issue I have with him is that even a Kobe congrats thread, he is able to turn into a war, because he doesn't think anyone's congrats of Kobe are good enough, therefore they must be a hater. And it rubs people the wrong way, because most of us don't worship our favorite athletes to the point of protecting them like they are one of their children being picked on in school.

Take it ****ing easy dude, we are trying to give the man a compliment. Sorry it's not enough for you, move on..

ILLUSIONIST^248
12-01-2014, 04:10 PM
You must be joking hawk! He's 36 and leading the league in scoring. I don't think anyone at his age has ever had a triple double.

he has not been very good. That is not a joke. He is shot killing his team out of games, his defense is embarrassing, and his advanced numbers are terrible. Shortly into the season, Kobe is nowhere near a star level player. None.

But he is 36, coming off serious injuries. This should be expected. You can justify his play by throwing his age/injuries out there, but simply put, he isn't a great player anymore. Not even close so far.

It's not his fault he's playing on a d league team. Who else is going to shoot? His defense hasn't been that bad. Please name me 39 better players in the NBA.

Hawkeye15
12-01-2014, 04:11 PM
It's not his fault he's playing on a d league team. Who else is going to shoot? His defense hasn't been that bad. Please name me 39 better players in the NBA.

Why would I bother spending more than 30 seconds mindlessly stroking the keys, in a debate with you?

What I said is true, you see it however you like.

ILLUSIONIST^248
12-01-2014, 04:12 PM
That's fine FC. Even if we don't win anything for 30 years, your joke of a franchise still wouldn't catch us in trophies. Try getting to the second round before you start talking trash.

you act as if your teams success is your own. You are interesting, I give you that. I mean, nothing that comes from your keystrokes ever makes me think, you are just an interesting young fella

Isn't that the point of being a sports fan?

ILLUSIONIST^248
12-01-2014, 04:13 PM
Most of Illusionists comments on here give me diarrhea. I stopped saying anything because quite frankly, I'm not sure he understands English or logic.

I blame his parents for allowing him to run wild on the computer when they are at work.

Yet another clown trying to take shots because they have nothing useful to add. Keep the hate coming.

ILLUSIONIST^248
12-01-2014, 04:15 PM
Most of Illusionists comments on here give me diarrhea. I stopped saying anything because quite frankly, I'm not sure he understands English or logic.

I blame his parents for allowing him to run wild on the computer when they are at work.

the only issue I have with him is that even a Kobe congrats thread, he is able to turn into a war, because he doesn't think anyone's congrats of Kobe are good enough, therefore they must be a hater. And it rubs people the wrong way, because most of us don't worship our favorite athletes to the point of protecting them like they are one of their children being picked on in school.

Take it ****ing easy dude, we are trying to give the man a compliment. Sorry it's not enough for you, move on..

Don't be a liar on top of trolling. I'm not talking about you, but the others. Also I have never seen more delusional fans than Lebron fans. You guys make the most ridiculous statements.

ILLUSIONIST^248
12-01-2014, 04:16 PM
It's not his fault he's playing on a d league team. Who else is going to shoot? His defense hasn't been that bad. Please name me 39 better players in the NBA.

Why would I bother spending more than 30 seconds mindlessly stroking the keys, in a debate with you?

What I said is true, you see it however you like.

To say kobe is around 40 is just plain wrong and you know it.

Hawkeye15
12-01-2014, 04:48 PM
To say kobe is around 40 is just plain wrong and you know it.

by what measure? Seriously.

PurpleLynch
12-01-2014, 04:58 PM
by what measure? Seriously.

I can think at 20 players who are better than Kobe so far in this season. But 40 players better than him,in my opinion, is way too much. Maybe around 25-30.

Hawkeye15
12-01-2014, 05:00 PM
I can think at 20 players who are better than Kobe so far in this season. But 40 players better than him,in my opinion, is way too much. Maybe around 25-30.

eh, I don't know. Impact wise, I think there are a lot of players better than Kobe. A lot. This year anyways..

Goose17
12-01-2014, 05:03 PM
eh, I don't know. Impact wise, I think there are a lot of players better than Kobe. A lot. This year anyways..

I agree^

That's not selling Kobe short, you're lucky if there's even 5 guys in the league right now close to the level he was at in his prime.

But right this very minute, there's easily 30 guys ahead of him, 40 isn't a push. I may even take it further.

Tony_Starks
12-01-2014, 05:03 PM
If leading the league in scoring, dropping triple doubles, still drawing double teams and taking over games at 36 is not very good then I don't know man I guess I'll take the "not very good" Kobe....

The Lakers are competitive in almost every game because of him. If you watch the games they typically play well for 3-1/2 quarters then blow their lead as Kobe runs out of gas in the 4th. It's no coincidence that Kobe had his best game of the season after Byron started dialing down his minutes the past few games....

Goose17
12-01-2014, 05:11 PM
If leading the league in scoring

Based on their efficiency, you could give Brandon Jennings the same amount of shots Kobe is taking and he would then lead the league in scoring.

Kobe is AVERAGING 23.1 shots per game, on 39%

If Jennings averaged 23 shots per game (about double his current average), his ppg would be similar if not higher than Kobes.

And Jennings is absolute garbage.

Tony_Starks
12-01-2014, 05:16 PM
Based on their efficiency, you could give Brandon Jennings the same amount of shots Kobe is taking and he would then lead the league in scoring.

Kobe is AVERAGING 23.1 shots per game, on 39%

If Jennings averaged 23 shots per game (about double his current average), his ppg would be similar if not higher than Kobes.

And Jennings is absolute garbage.

That's a nice stat but does the calculator tell you if Jennings has the stamina to get up 23 shots a night? Does it tell you how many shots he has to take as the shot clock winds down to bail his team out? Also Jennings NEVER gets doubles teamed, Kobe does night in night out.

Big difference.

ILLUSIONIST^248
12-01-2014, 05:19 PM
To say kobe is around 40 is just plain wrong and you know it.

by what measure? Seriously.

By watching basketball. You're absolutely foolish to think there are 39 better players than kobe right now. And you have the nerve to say you guys are complimenting him in this thread.

ILLUSIONIST^248
12-01-2014, 05:20 PM
eh, I don't know. Impact wise, I think there are a lot of players better than Kobe. A lot. This year anyways..

I agree^

That's not selling Kobe short, you're lucky if there's even 5 guys in the league right now close to the level he was at in his prime.

But right this very minute, there's easily 30 guys ahead of him, 40 isn't a push. I may even take it further.

Only prime lebron and prime Duncan compare to kobe.im not sure where you were going with that. Please list me 40 players better.

ILLUSIONIST^248
12-01-2014, 05:22 PM
Based on their efficiency, you could give Brandon Jennings the same amount of shots Kobe is taking and he would then lead the league in scoring.

Kobe is AVERAGING 23.1 shots per game, on 39%

If Jennings averaged 23 shots per game (about double his current average), his ppg would be similar if not higher than Kobes.

And Jennings is absolute garbage.

That's a nice stat but does the calculator tell you if Jennings has the stamina to get up 23 shots a night? Does it tell you how many shots he has to take as the shot clock winds down to bail his team out? Also Jennings NEVER gets doubles teamed, Kobe does night in night out.

Big difference.

Haters look at fg percentage only

Vinylman
12-01-2014, 05:23 PM
whats truly funny is all the POS who are ripping on kobe but use to suck off Iverson for putting up very similar shooting numbers...

the good thing is kobe really doesn't give a fcuk what any of you think

Vinylman
12-01-2014, 05:26 PM
Based on their efficiency, you could give Brandon Jennings the same amount of shots Kobe is taking and he would then lead the league in scoring.

Kobe is AVERAGING 23.1 shots per game, on 39%

If Jennings averaged 23 shots per game (about double his current average), his ppg would be similar if not higher than Kobes.

And Jennings is absolute garbage.


This is what happens when people are uneducated and can't understand context let alone how statistics can't be applied in a linear fashion when it comes to athletics

i am sure every person feels dumber for reading your post

ILLUSIONIST^248
12-01-2014, 05:33 PM
I'm still waiting on that list of 39 better players in the NBA. Goose, Hawk, anyone?

Goose17
12-01-2014, 05:35 PM
This is what happens when people are uneducated and can't understand context let alone how statistics can't be applied in a linear fashion when it comes to athletics

i am sure every person feels dumber for reading your post

LOL, it was done that way to prove a point. :facepalm: never mind...

Vinylman
12-01-2014, 05:38 PM
LOL, it was done that way to prove a point. :facepalm: never mind...

you mean like your intelligent banter on why a guy would rather play in the D league than in the NBA...

and your back tracking now on your jennings logic is typical... you always twist **** when people point out the stupidity of your posts...

Goose17
12-01-2014, 05:38 PM
Only prime lebron and prime Duncan compare to kobe.im not sure where you were going with that. Please list me 40 players better.

We're not talking about throughout history and in his prime. We mean today, right this second. And Kobe is past it. As a Kobe fan girl I don't expect you to admit that though.

In terms of impact there isn't that many but in terms of being better, there are easily 40. I don't even have to pick them, just pick the 40 players you think are behind Kobe in the top 40 and that's your list. Your fangirlism is blinding you.

Goose17
12-01-2014, 05:45 PM
you mean like your intelligent banter on why a guy would rather play in the D league than in the NBA...

and your back tracking now on your jennings logic is typical... you always twist **** when people point out the stupidity of your posts...

Not twisting anything. I'm making a point about "leading the league in scoring" is a stupid argument. He's shooting BELOW 40% from the field. There is no other player in the top 20 PPG that is shooting below 40% Davis, James, Curry and Melo are all about 2-3 points behind and shooting about 7-10% better. It's a moronic argument.

Now imagine if they were taking 23/24 shots per game instead of 17? They would eclipse Kobe's PPG.

Give me any decent scorer, give them 23/24 shots per game on AVERAGE. And they will make the same amount of shots.

If Lebron, Melo, Curry, Griffin etc was leading the league in scoring but shooting less than 40% you would never hear the end of it. Yet Kobe gets a pass.

It's a terrible argument.


And the D-League chat is just a conversation, what's the big deal? I don't even know what you're getting at here, you're not making sense. There's no back tracking going on here, just your inability to understand a very simple point that I was making. Anyone can make a stupid argument for almost any player. Get it yet?

Hawkeye15
12-01-2014, 05:52 PM
By watching basketball. You're absolutely foolish to think there are 39 better players than kobe right now. And you have the nerve to say you guys are complimenting him in this thread.

I can't believe for a second you watch anything outside Laker games, and I think I have made it abundantly clear I don't value your opinion regarding the game of basketball at all. I tend to ignore you, but at times, you crack me up, I can't help myself.

Hawkeye15
12-01-2014, 05:53 PM
I'm still waiting on that list of 39 better players in the NBA. Goose, Hawk, anyone?

Why would anyone waste 6 minutes of their life coming up with a well thought out list, to get "Hater!" typed right back at them from you?

Tony_Starks
12-01-2014, 05:55 PM
Kobe shoots 38% and leads the league in scoring= not a very good player.

Harden shoots 40% and is second in scoring= best SG in the league.

Gotta love the logic!

Hawkeye15
12-01-2014, 05:55 PM
you mean like your intelligent banter on why a guy would rather play in the D league than in the NBA...

and your back tracking now on your jennings logic is typical... you always twist **** when people point out the stupidity of your posts...

Kobe leading the league in scoring doesn't mean anything outside him compiling up more numbers individually. It's not helping his team, it doesn't mean he is a good offensive player anymore, etc. He is awful on defense, doesn't trust anyone, and is basically just gunning away for his own well being at this point. Nobody is saying he isn't an all time great, or that his career numbers aren't incredible. I am personally saying, he aint that good this year.

Goose17
12-01-2014, 05:58 PM
Kobe shoots 38% and leads the league in scoring= not a very good player.

Harden shoots 40% and is second in scoring= best SG in the league.

Gotta love the logic!

When did I say Harden is the best SG in the league this year?

I'm looking at the guys 3rd through 10th in scoring. Who are all significantly more efficient than both of those guys who are essentially chucking right now (can't blame Kobe really, his cast sucks).

Hawkeye15
12-01-2014, 05:58 PM
Kobe shoots 38% and leads the league in scoring= not a very good player.

Harden shoots 40% and is second in scoring= best SG in the league.

Gotta love the logic!

Kobe: 49.3% TS, 103 Off rtg, 23.1 attempts a game to get his 26.6 ppg
Harden: 57.7% TS (low for him too), 115 Off rtg, 17 attempts per game to get his 24.4 ppg

Yeah, Harden is absolutely beating up Kobe this year as far as impact is measured. And he isn't the best SG in the league this year most likely.

Vinylman
12-01-2014, 05:59 PM
Not twisting anything. I'm making a point about "leading the league in scoring" is a stupid argument. He's shooting BELOW 40% from the field. There is no other player in the top 20 PPG that is shooting below 40% Davis, James, Curry and Melo are all about 2-3 points behind and shooting about 7-10% better. It's a moronic argument.

Now imagine if they were taking 23/24 shots per game instead of 17? They would eclipse Kobe's PPG.

Give me any decent scorer, give them 23/24 shots per game on AVERAGE. And they will make the same amount of shots.

If Lebron, Melo, Curry, Griffin etc was leading the league in scoring but shooting less than 40% you would never hear the end of it. Yet Kobe gets a pass.

It's a terrible argument.


And the D-League chat is just a conversation, what's the big deal? I don't even know what you're getting at here, you're not making sense. There's no back tracking going on here, just your inability to understand a very simple point that I was making. Anyone can make a stupid argument for almost any player. Get it yet?

More pure ignorance extrapolating statistics...

there was a guy whose EFG% when he led the league in scoring was .439,.447,.422,.453

Of course his supporting cast was playoff caliber each year and in one of those years he made the finals...

This player is sucked off continually in these forums yet KB24 whose EFG% which is slightly worse than the above is ridiculed right and left.

Your inability to understand context results in you being mocked in thread after thread...

Maybe you can expand on your thesis that Lance Stephenson is total garbage despite the fact that on Friday last week he was leading charlotte in both rebounding and assists.... I noticed you didn't use any statistics to support your opinion in that thread

Tony_Starks
12-01-2014, 06:04 PM
Kobe leading the league in scoring doesn't mean anything outside him compiling up more numbers individually. It's not helping his team, it doesn't mean he is a good offensive player anymore, etc. He is awful on defense, doesn't trust anyone, and is basically just gunning away for his own well being at this point. Nobody is saying he isn't an all time great, or that his career numbers aren't incredible. I am personally saying, he aint that good this year.

You do realize the Lakers have literally had the toughest schedule in the league thus far right? GS twice, Memphis twice, Clppers, Spurs, Houston, Phoenix, NO......

With two season ending injuries to start off plus no Nick young off the bench I'm not sure what kind of record you expect them to have with a schedule like that.

But never mind, it's Kobe's fault.

Vinylman
12-01-2014, 06:08 PM
Kobe leading the league in scoring doesn't mean anything outside him compiling up more numbers individually. It's not helping his team, it doesn't mean he is a good offensive player anymore, etc. He is awful on defense, doesn't trust anyone, and is basically just gunning away for his own well being at this point. Nobody is saying he isn't an all time great, or that his career numbers aren't incredible. I am personally saying, he aint that good this year.

typical PSD response... cut out half a quote and then change the subject

Where did i say anything in my posts that kobe was setting the world ablaze? Please point it out...

If you don't see the stupidity in the comment that give another guy like brandon jennings the same amount of shots as kobe and he would put up the same numbers I don't know what to tell you...

Again, read what i post before you try to spin my comments to fit your agenda...

Hawkeye15
12-01-2014, 06:09 PM
typical PSD response... cut out half a quote and then change the subject

Where did i say anything in my posts that kobe was setting the world ablaze? Please point it out...

If you don't see the stupidity in the comment that give another guy like brandon jennings the same amount of shots as kobe and he would put up the same numbers I don't know what to tell you...

Again, read what i post before you try to spin my comments to fit your agenda...

I am not going to address your points to another poster one by one when I am not defending them.

haha, how am I spinning your comments? I am giving you my opinion on Kobe Bryant's play this season, statistics and all..

Hawkeye15
12-01-2014, 06:10 PM
You do realize the Lakers have literally had the toughest schedule in the league thus far right? GS twice, Memphis twice, Clppers, Spurs, Houston, Phoenix, NO......

With two season ending injuries to start off plus no Nick young off the bench I'm not sure what kind of record you expect them to have with a schedule like that.

But never mind, it's Kobe's fault.

oh, it's not Kobe's fault they are losing, they suck. But he no longer is a player capable of leading even a bad team to being ok. He isn't part of the answer, he is just part of the problem now. New, for sure.

Vinylman
12-01-2014, 06:15 PM
I am not going to address your points to another poster one by one when I am not defending them.

haha, how am I spinning your comments? I am giving you my opinion on Kobe Bryant's play this season, statistics and all..

Don't quote me then... your response has nothing to do with what i said... i was responding to a totally different subject

and no... you didn't give any statistical response... your response was your opinion supported by nothing statistical.

Goose17
12-01-2014, 06:17 PM
Your inability to understand context results in you being mocked in thread after thread...


Your inability to understand the point I'm making makes me think you're an absolute fool. And I shant be discussing the beautiful game of basketball with the likes of you.

Hawkeye15
12-01-2014, 06:18 PM
Don't quote me then... your response has nothing to do with what i said... i was responding to a totally different subject

and no... you didn't give any statistical response... your response was your opinion supported by nothing statistical.

Do I really need to post Kobe's statistics? He has been no bueno

Sorry to intrude there

Tony_Starks
12-01-2014, 06:21 PM
oh, it's not Kobe's fault they are losing, they suck. But he no longer is a player capable of leading even a bad team to being ok. He isn't part of the answer, he is just part of the problem now. New, for sure.

Kevin Love was putting up numbers on a "bad team" that he never made ok, but you never had any problem calling him one of the top players in the league and blaming the talent around him. Kobe's in the same situation but somehow you want to use that as an excuse to he's not good.

Big time double standard for a player you blatantly don't like to begin with.

Goose17
12-01-2014, 06:22 PM
I just realised you're a Lakers fan Vinyl... now it makes sense. You're not a fool, just a blind homer. My bad. I definitely shant be discussing Kobe with a Lakers homer, pointless discussion.

ILLUSIONIST^248
12-01-2014, 06:22 PM
I'm still waiting on that list of 39 better players in the NBA. Goose, Hawk, anyone?

Why would anyone waste 6 minutes of their life coming up with a well thought out list, to get "Hater!" typed right back at them from you?

You made a stupid statement and now you can't take it back.you know for a fact kobe better than that. Quit lying to impress your lebro buddies.

Vinylman
12-01-2014, 06:23 PM
Do I really need to post Kobe's statistics? He has been no bueno

Sorry to intrude there

once again you miss the point... i never said kobe was having a great year.... in fact i think he is having a below average statistical year... yet, the hate he receives on here for having a year that is eerily similar to someone who won 4 scoring titles with the same basic stats is hilarious...

again, you said you pointed out the statistics in your post... you didn't

ILLUSIONIST^248
12-01-2014, 06:24 PM
Only prime lebron and prime Duncan compare to kobe.im not sure where you were going with that. Please list me 40 players better.

We're not talking about throughout history and in his prime. We mean today, right this second. And Kobe is past it. As a Kobe fan girl I don't expect you to admit that though.

In terms of impact there isn't that many but in terms of being better, there are easily 40. I don't even have to pick them, just pick the 40 players you think are behind Kobe in the top 40 and that's your list. Your fangirlism is blinding you.

I'm glad your admitting you can't come up with a list.

jerellh528
12-01-2014, 06:24 PM
Same people coming into an accomplishment thread to show thier saltiness for kobe. So old already haha

Vinylman
12-01-2014, 06:27 PM
I just realised you're a Lakers fan Vinyl... now it makes sense. You're not a fool, just a blind homer. My bad. I definitely shant be discussing Kobe with a Lakers homer, pointless discussion.

yes, i am a blind laker homer.... LMFAO

keep em coming because I didn't think your posts could get more ignorant...

but again... tell us how brandon jennings could score as much as kobe if only given the shots

ILLUSIONIST^248
12-01-2014, 06:28 PM
Same people coming into an accomplishment thread to show thier saltiness for kobe. So old already haha what's hilarious is they claim they're coming in To compliment him. And the hawk says folkish things like he's the 40th best player in the league

Hawkeye15
12-01-2014, 06:32 PM
once again you miss the point... i never said kobe was having a great year.... in fact i think he is having a below average statistical year... yet, the hate he receives on here for having a year that is eerily similar to someone who won 4 scoring titles with the same basic stats is hilarious...

again, you said you pointed out the statistics in your post... you didn't

I am not missing the point you are trying to make, that just saying Jennings would score what Kobe does by shooting as much, etc. I get that.

Who are you referring to, AI? If you knew me, you would know I am very harsh on AI.

His TS% is crap at 49.3, his offensive rating of 103 is well below star level, he needs more than 23 shot attempts to score his points, he isn't guarding anyone, and his team has been better with him sitting, though that is much more on his starting lineup help than it is him. His opponent (SG) per 48 minute production is more efficient than he is. What the **** is he doing shooting so many 3's, when he has never been able to hit those?

He is not having a good year. At all. Basically, if he was anyone other than Kobe, his coach would have benched him if he kept shooting at that rate.

ILLUSIONIST^248
12-01-2014, 06:33 PM
oh, it's not Kobe's fault they are losing, they suck. But he no longer is a player capable of leading even a bad team to being ok. He isn't part of the answer, he is just part of the problem now. New, for sure.

Kevin Love was putting up numbers on a "bad team" that he never made ok, but you never had any problem calling him one of the top players in the league and blaming the talent around him. Kobe's in the same situation but somehow you want to use that as an excuse to he's not good.

Big time double standard for a player you blatantly don't like to begin with.

Great point

ILLUSIONIST^248
12-01-2014, 06:35 PM
once again you miss the point... i never said kobe was having a great year.... in fact i think he is having a below average statistical year... yet, the hate he receives on here for having a year that is eerily similar to someone who won 4 scoring titles with the same basic stats is hilarious...

again, you said you pointed out the statistics in your post... you didn't

I am not missing the point you are trying to make, that just saying Jennings would score what Kobe does by shooting as much, etc. I get that.

Who are you referring to, AI? If you knew me, you would know I am very harsh on AI.

His TS% is crap at 49.3, his offensive rating of 103 is well below star level, he needs more than 23 shot attempts to score his points, he isn't guarding anyone, and his team has been better with him sitting, though that is much more on his starting lineup help than it is him. His opponent (SG) per 48 minute production is more efficient than he is. What the **** is he doing shooting so many 3's, when he has never been able to hit those?

He is not having a good year. At all. Basically, if he was anyone other than Kobe, his coach would have benched him if he kept shooting at that rate. and replace him with who? Ellington? Get real, the lakers have no other player to score when they need it.

Hawkeye15
12-01-2014, 06:40 PM
and replace him with who? Ellington? Get real, the lakers have no other player to score when they need it.

if you are getting pounded nightly, experiment. But like I said, he is Kobe. He will be allowed to play that inefficient. He has earned it..

Vinylman
12-01-2014, 06:46 PM
if you are getting pounded nightly, experiment. But like I said, he is Kobe. He will be allowed to play that inefficient. He has earned it..

I guess in a sense he has but his chucking and playing so much has to do with the idiot Buss family who are basically whoring him out to TWC.... now don't get me wrong... he is easily the highest paid whore in Sports but that doesn't change the fact that both the Lakers and Kobe are getting what they want this year

Hawkeye15
12-01-2014, 06:51 PM
I guess in a sense he has but his chucking and playing so much has to do with the idiot Buss family who are basically whoring him out to TWC.... now don't get me wrong... he is easily the highest paid whore in Sports but that doesn't change the fact that both the Lakers and Kobe are getting what they want this year

agreed.

Vinylman
12-01-2014, 06:55 PM
I am not missing the point you are trying to make, that just saying Jennings would score what Kobe does by shooting as much, etc. I get that.

Who are you referring to, AI? If you knew me, you would know I am very harsh on AI.

His TS% is crap at 49.3, his offensive rating of 103 is well below star level, he needs more than 23 shot attempts to score his points, he isn't guarding anyone, and his team has been better with him sitting, though that is much more on his starting lineup help than it is him. His opponent (SG) per 48 minute production is more efficient than he is. What the **** is he doing shooting so many 3's, when he has never been able to hit those?

He is not having a good year. At all. Basically, if he was anyone other than Kobe, his coach would have benched him if he kept shooting at that rate.

Of course i am referring to AI and while you might look down upon his numbers there are very few on here that do.

As for kobe being benched ... not a chance... the Buss Family is all in on whoring him out to TWC for the next two years

mngopher35
12-01-2014, 07:17 PM
Kevin Love was putting up numbers on a "bad team" that he never made ok, but you never had any problem calling him one of the top players in the league and blaming the talent around him. Kobe's in the same situation but somehow you want to use that as an excuse to he's not good.

Big time double standard for a player you blatantly don't like to begin with.

Are we really going to compare Kobe to Love because "good player on bad team"? I am sorry but if you can't tell why Love was a top like 10-15 player last year and why Kobe is closer to the 30-40 range then that is on you not someone else's double standard. Ill give you a start by telling you to look at their huge difference in efficiency. Then I will ask which one had another elite skill outside of scoring (such as maybe rebounding). Those two factors easily separate Love last year compared to Kobe this year. We can get into PER, WS, VORP, on/off court etc. too if you want but it will be favoring Love.

There is no "big time double standard" here even though I'm 99% sure you are right he doesn't like Kobe. You can easily be objective and see the differences between the two, you are just reaching here.

Tony_Starks
12-01-2014, 07:29 PM
At the end of the day the season is still young. They gave Lin a shot to run the team but it's become obvious that Kobe is going to have to be the defacto pg with Lin playing the Chalmers role.

I don't sweat his fg%, that's not going to last. Most people around here were predicting that Kobe would average like 18 points on 20 something shots AND shoot a low percentage anyway so it is what it is....

AIRMAR72
12-01-2014, 09:11 PM
****iinngg KOBEEE!!! Thats the man right there. He never fails to amaze me and torcure me as a raptor fan. speechless after that game. I will saver this game and tell my kids along with the time her rained liked Three threes and and dunked the game away against the raptors couple years ago. Not to mention ....81.... Congrats to Kobe. F U C K I N G Legend. Never doubt that mans greatness, you make gawk his efficiency but he impacts the game in so many more ways than stats can point to, such as his amazing ability to make amazing unguardable contested jumpers when the offence breaks down and there is no set play and someone has to take a "Low percentage" one on one shot with the clock winding down Kobe Bryant is FINISH that's just an illusion like the 81points against a young worthless Toronto Raptors team those stats gained NOTHING for the Lakers its not the playoff Kobe Bryant FINISH

andy2518
12-01-2014, 09:13 PM
Amazing game and amazing accomplishment. I still don't understand why this guy has so many haters.

PowerHouse
12-01-2014, 10:34 PM
I am a Kobe fan and I can certainly admit that so far his efficiency sucks this year. Although I would be quite a bit more concerned had he not been coming off two major injuries. He is playing on a surgically re-attached achilles tendon for christ sake. Most of us if not all of us here cant even imagine what that must be like for him. He still has a lot of rust to knock off, but he is knocking it off slowly but surely. His efficiency has been dramatically improved over the last two games. Small sample size yes but hopefully a sign that he's coming around to what he was 2-3 years ago.

andy2518
12-01-2014, 10:37 PM
yes, i am a blind laker homer.... LMFAO

keep em coming because I didn't think your posts could get more ignorant...

but again... tell us how brandon jennings could score as much as kobe if only given the shots

Haha. I love when people use the argument that if someone just shot enough they could average the same ppt as Kobe. They clearly have no idea how the game of basketball works.

LakersEaglesLA
12-01-2014, 10:48 PM
Kobe is obviously a top 10 player in nba This Year.. You gotta be stupid, dumb, biased, and a damn f@@I not to see it...

ILLUSIONIST^248
12-01-2014, 11:07 PM
Kevin Love was putting up numbers on a "bad team" that he never made ok, but you never had any problem calling him one of the top players in the league and blaming the talent around him. Kobe's in the same situation but somehow you want to use that as an excuse to he's not good.

Big time double standard for a player you blatantly don't like to begin with.

Are we really going to compare Kobe to Love because "good player on bad team"? I am sorry but if you can't tell why Love was a top like 10-15 player last year and why Kobe is closer to the 30-40 range then that is on you not someone else's double standard. Ill give you a start by telling you to look at their huge difference in efficiency. Then I will ask which one had another elite skill outside of scoring (such as maybe rebounding). Those two factors easily separate Love last year compared to Kobe this year. We can get into PER, WS, VORP, on/off court etc. too if you want but it will be favoring Love.

There is no "big time double standard" here even though I'm 99% sure you are right he doesn't like Kobe. You can easily be objective and see the differences between the two, you are just reaching here.

Do you mind posting that list I've been asking for? No one has proved me wrong yet.

ILLUSIONIST^248
12-01-2014, 11:08 PM
****iinngg KOBEEE!!! Thats the man right there. He never fails to amaze me and torcure me as a raptor fan. speechless after that game. I will saver this game and tell my kids along with the time her rained liked Three threes and and dunked the game away against the raptors couple years ago. Not to mention ....81.... Congrats to Kobe. F U C K I N G Legend. Never doubt that mans greatness, you make gawk his efficiency but he impacts the game in so many more ways than stats can point to, such as his amazing ability to make amazing unguardable contested jumpers when the offence breaks down and there is no set play and someone has to take a "Low percentage" one on one shot with the clock winding down Kobe Bryant is FINISH that's just an illusion like the 81points against a young worthless Toronto Raptors team those stats gained NOTHING for the Lakers its not the playoff Kobe Bryant FINISH

Lol, this is absolute gold.

Tony_Starks
12-01-2014, 11:17 PM
To say Kobe has been inefficient so far is one thing. That's reasonable. To say he's not good anymore or that he is actually making a bad team WORSE is absolute utter preposterous rubbish.

mngopher35
12-01-2014, 11:34 PM
Do you mind posting that list I've been asking for? No one has proved me wrong yet.

A list of players better than Kobe as of today? I won't admit to being able to watch all of these guys play a ton but I will list a lot of players who I think are generally at the level or above based on a mix what I have seen and statistics I have looked up. You should know that I do not think high volume shooting on low efficiency is big impact (like a rim protector/defender) so we may differ on the value he has right now. I also could see Kobe moving up if he continues his recent trend of play (been better than what I saw earlier in the season). I am probably fine with some being off the list and maybe others being added on too but I'll make this quick and we can discuss after if needed.

Lebron, Durant, Westbrook, A Davis, Curry, Klay Thompson, Love, Kyrie, Marc Gasol, J Noah, J Butler, Cousins, Parker, Duncan, Dirk, Lowry, Derozan, Harden, Dwight, Lilliard, Aldridge, Lawson, CP3, Blake Griffin, Bledsoe, Rondo, Melo, Bosh, Wade, Wall

Then you have players I haven't seen much but who are supposedly having very good years Gordon Hayward, Vucevic, Rudy Gay, Khawi but I am not sure that they would be higher. Also Paint protectors who are 3rd options like Ibaka and Deandre may bring more impact at this point as well, especially for their teams. Wolves game starting so I will end this list here and maybe add or discuss later.

bucketss
12-01-2014, 11:49 PM
i think if derozan was playing he would have kobe huffing and puffing in the fourth.

jerellh528
12-02-2014, 01:15 AM
i think if derozan was playing he would have kobe huffing and puffing in the fourth.

Kobe already does huff n puff in the 4th

mngopher35
12-02-2014, 01:34 AM
I will add that this 30000 6000 6000 mark is a great feat that deserves acknowledgement. Just because I don't think Kobe is quite the same anymore at like age 37 i know he has had a great career and this mark shows his great ability, effort, and longevity. I just think the injuries and age took a lot out of him limiting his impact at this point in his career. He will continue to play how he wants this year taking tons of shots and there is absolutely no problem with that IMO (won't help them win but they are bottom team with no real chance anyways).

Sean Moore
12-02-2014, 04:12 AM
A list of players better than Kobe as of today? I won't admit to being able to watch all of these guys play a ton but I will list a lot of players who I think are generally at the level or above based on a mix what I have seen and statistics I have looked up. You should know that I do not think high volume shooting on low efficiency is big impact (like a rim protector/defender) so we may differ on the value he has right now. I also could see Kobe moving up if he continues his recent trend of play (been better than what I saw earlier in the season). I am probably fine with some being off the list and maybe others being added on too but I'll make this quick and we can discuss after if needed.

Lebron, Durant, Westbrook, A Davis, Curry, Klay Thompson, Love, Kyrie, Marc Gasol, J Noah, J Butler, Cousins, Parker, Duncan, Dirk, Lowry, Derozan, Harden, Dwight, Lilliard, Aldridge, Lawson, CP3, Blake Griffin, Bledsoe, Rondo, Melo, Bosh, Wade, Wall

Then you have players I haven't seen much but who are supposedly having very good years Gordon Hayward, Vucevic, Rudy Gay, Khawi but I am not sure that they would be higher. Also Paint protectors who are 3rd options like Ibaka and Deandre may bring more impact at this point as well, especially for their teams. Wolves game starting so I will end this list here and maybe add or discuss later.

I would agree with the exception of Derozan, Dwight, Lawson, Rondo, Noah, Parker, Wade and Melo. He is on par with Dirk or Duncan from an impact standpoint. I would still take Kobe over a number of the guys on your list in a close playoff series as well, but surely not over the course of an 82 game season. Dude has a lot of rust to shake off still. As he gets more confident about going to the hole more often, his efficiency will rise no doubt and he will not be taking as many low percentage shots.

FraziersKnicks
12-02-2014, 05:22 AM
I would agree with the exception of Derozan, Dwight, Lawson, Rondo, Noah, Parker, Wade and Melo. He is on par with Dirk or Duncan from an impact standpoint. I would still take Kobe over a number of the guys on your list in a close playoff series as well, but surely not over the course of an 82 game season. Dude has a lot of rust to shake off still. As he gets more confident about going to the hole more often, his efficiency will rise no doubt and he will not be taking as many low percentage shots.

I can say with 100% confidence not one logical thinking fan in the NBA would take Kobe over Melo, Dwight or Noah.

mngopher35
12-02-2014, 05:35 AM
I would agree with the exception of Derozan, Dwight, Lawson, Rondo, Noah, Parker, Wade and Melo. He is on par with Dirk or Duncan from an impact standpoint. I would still take Kobe over a number of the guys on your list in a close playoff series as well, but surely not over the course of an 82 game season. Dude has a lot of rust to shake off still. As he gets more confident about going to the hole more often, his efficiency will rise no doubt and he will not be taking as many low percentage shots.

Dwight easily is above him and melo too IMO. parker and noah bring different things to the table and i have them pretty solidly above him at this point. I think dirk could be argued roughly on par but Duncan still has a bigger impact due to his defense IMO. Derozan is either way but his defense and helping a winning team is why I have him here. When healthy wade is better too but questioning his health I can see.

Rondo ill give you actually thinking about it more. Rondo hasn't been good this year after looking into it.

As I said before though I probably rate Kobe lower than some at this point because I am not too impressed with high scoring on low efficiency (plus bad d and no other elite ability). He seems like a monta Ellis basically at this point to me (not skillet wise but impact wise). Right now the lakers have a slightly better orating as a team with Kobe off the court and a much better drating (per 100 possessions they are -11.7 with him on and +.6 off overall). I dunno though since its hard to gauge how much of it is because of the lakers situation. You could definitely be right about the rust part too as he has played better as the seasons gone on.

ILLUSIONIST^248
12-03-2014, 06:14 PM
Do you mind posting that list I've been asking for? No one has proved me wrong yet.

A list of players better than Kobe as of today? I won't admit to being able to watch all of these guys play a ton but I will list a lot of players who I think are generally at the level or above based on a mix what I have seen and statistics I have looked up. You should know that I do not think high volume shooting on low efficiency is big impact (like a rim protector/defender) so we may differ on the value he has right now. I also could see Kobe moving up if he continues his recent trend of play (been better than what I saw earlier in the season). I am probably fine with some being off the list and maybe others being added on too but I'll make this quick and we can discuss after if needed.

Lebron, Durant, Westbrook, A Davis, Curry, Klay Thompson, Love, Kyrie, Marc Gasol, J Noah, J Butler, Cousins, Parker, Duncan, Dirk, Lowry, Derozan, Harden, Dwight, Lilliard, Aldridge, Lawson, CP3, Blake Griffin, Bledsoe, Rondo, Melo, Bosh, Wade, Wall

Then you have players I haven't seen much but who are supposedly having very good years Gordon Hayward, Vucevic, Rudy Gay, Khawi but I am not sure that they would be higher. Also Paint protectors who are 3rd options like Ibaka and Deandre may bring more impact at this point as well, especially for their teams. Wolves game starting so I will end this list here and maybe add or discuss later.

Come on man, you know kobe is a better than a lot of players you just listed. He still has the ability to take over games. He has a slow start to the season, but he's starting to come around.

Tony_Starks
12-03-2014, 06:58 PM
25 assist the last 2 games. Both in wins. Lakers have been playing good ball and trending up the last 5 games.

But whatever. Let the haters hate, I'm enjoying the victory lap.

mngopher35
12-03-2014, 07:36 PM
Come on man, you know kobe is a better than a lot of players you just listed. He still has the ability to take over games. He has a slow start to the season, but he's starting to come around.

Feel free to bring an actual argument to the table. You asked for a list and I made one off the top of my head before a game. I think Rondo should definitely be taken off and there are a couple others that could go either way but what is your argument? If you want to say Kobe is better than people on that list because he is just getting his feet under him and will improve then fine I am willing to say maybe and wait for that but he hasn't been so far.

As I stated right now Kobe is a bad defender who jacks up tons of shots to get a high point total which doesn't impress me personally. The plus minus when he is on-off the court has already been mentioned and it is very bad. He is not nearly the same player he used to be which is totally fine due to injuries and age. He is still very good and deserves his "victory lap" as others have said, but that doesn't mean he is still elite.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&p1=bryanko01&y1=2015&p2=millspa01&y2=2015&p3=ellismo01&y3=2015&p4=gasolpa01&y4=2015&p5=jeffeal01&y5=2015&p6=hibbero01&y6=2015

5 players not even mentioned above and Kobe doesn't stand out greatly compared to them statistically. Then you factor in he puts his numbers up because of volume on a bad team and isn't bringing defense to the table anymore. Not saying he isn't better than them but he isn't just destroying them like he normally would.

Tony_Starks
12-03-2014, 07:45 PM
Feel free to bring an actual argument to the table. You asked for a list and I made one off the top of my head before a game. I think Rondo should definitely be taken off and there are a couple others that could go either way but what is your argument? If you want to say Kobe is better than people on that list because he is just getting his feet under him and will improve then fine I am willing to say maybe and wait for that but he hasn't been so far.

As I stated right now Kobe is a bad defender who jacks up tons of shots to get a high point total which doesn't impress me personally. The plus minus when he is on-off the court has already been mentioned and it is very bad. He is not nearly the same player he used to be which is totally fine due to injuries and age. He is still very good and deserves his "victory lap" as others have said, but that doesn't mean he is still elite.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&p1=bryanko01&y1=2015&p2=millspa01&y2=2015&p3=ellismo01&y3=2015&p4=gasolpa01&y4=2015&p5=jeffeal01&y5=2015&p6=hibbero01&y6=2015

5 players not even mentioned above and Kobe doesn't stand out greatly compared to them statistically. Then you factor in he puts his numbers up because of volume on a bad team and isn't bringing defense to the table anymore. Not saying he isn't better than them but he isn't just destroying them like he normally would.

The stats you mention are overall, they don't take into account Nick Young being gone the first 10 games making Kobe the teams only offensive threat. Or Ellington, the teams best 3 point shooter, being gone giving them no floor spacing. Kobe did what he had to do and now that they have a steady rotation surprise surprise he's playing a better all around game.

You should actually watch the game man, you cant just go by the TNT/ espn games and advanced stats....

mngopher35
12-03-2014, 08:09 PM
The stats you mention are overall, they don't take into account Nick Young being gone the first 10 games making Kobe the teams only offensive threat. Or Ellington, the teams best 3 point shooter, being gone giving them no floor spacing. Kobe did what he had to do and now that they have a steady rotation surprise surprise he's playing a better all around game.

You should actually watch the game man, you cant just go by the TNT/ espn games and advanced stats....

I have watched him play 7 games this year and parts of a couple others, and stated that I haven't been able to watch everyone earlier. I also stated that he has looked better recently in another post and was well aware of nick young's injury and the death of Ellington's father keeping him away. I happen to have league pass and get to watch a lot of games with extra free time right now. If you have anything to add to the actual discussion feel free and tell me why I am wrong.

My eyes have told me he is chucking shots he shouldn't even without those players. My eyes are telling me he is playing bad defense most of the time. My eyes are telling me that he just doesn't have the same jump/step he used to (which is expected). I then also used statistics to help give more insight above what just my eyes have told me. I used them to see that as a team the lakers offense has been slightly more efficient when he is off the court and the defense has been way more efficient. I used them to see that what my eyes saw during the games was confirmed because his TS% is under .500. Sure maybe he did need to shoot a lot of those early on but it doesn't change the fact that he can't do it at a decent efficiency like he used to (which is why he is now ranked lower). Let me ask you how many games of the players I listed have you watched 5+ times or more? How about instead of assuming someone doesn't watch games because they use some stats you instead have an actual debate about the points they are bringing up.

mngopher35
12-03-2014, 08:20 PM
Edit: Look overall I get that Kobe is playing more team ball recently and that the lakers didn't have everyone healthy for parts, but a lot of teams don't have everyone at this point and he has still struggled being efficient even since. We will see if he improves or not moving forward but right now he hasn't shown to be near the same player which is why he dropped in many people's rankings. If you want to discuss some players or the points brought up I would definitely be willing. I am guessing there are things I have missed but don't just tell someone to watch the games without actually discussing their points...

Tony_Starks
12-03-2014, 08:46 PM
Well specially to address the defense being better when Kobe sits, that's because their second unit is better defensively as a whole. Price is light years better than Lin on D, who typically starts the game getting abused by the opponents pg. Davis and Sacre are better shot blockers than Boozed and Hill who are both undersized as well. Also Swag P defense is vastly improved. So I would expect that to be the case.

Kobe's decline in defense is way exaggerated. I'll be the first to admit he will coast, gamble, and cherry pick (which I don't like). But he also picks his spots to lock in as well. He's no James Harden.

But I'll agree to disagree. You previously spoke about Monta Ellis as if he wasn't very helpful to a team so we'll probably never agree on what a good player is..

jerellh528
12-03-2014, 09:11 PM
Everyone can knock kobe for his fg% that matches hardens(mvp candidate) minus the free throws. Fact is, he's playing hard every night and putting up 26,5,5 on a **** team where they can double kobe every possesion. Nobody in nba history that has played as many mins as kobe can do what hes doing right now. In fact kobe is still outplaying about 90% of nba players.

mngopher35
12-03-2014, 09:11 PM
Well specially to address the defense being better when Kobe sits, that's because their second unit is better defensively as a whole. Price is light years better than Lin on D, who typically starts the game getting abused by the opponents pg. Davis and Sacre are better shot blockers than Boozed and Hill who are both undersized as well. Also Swag P defense is vastly improved. So I would expect that to be the case.

Kobe's decline in defense is way exaggerated. I'll be the first to admit he will coast, gamble, and cherry pick (which I don't like). But he also picks his spots to lock in as well. He's no James Harden.

But I'll agree to disagree. You previously spoke about Monta Ellis as if he wasn't very helpful to a team so we'll probably never agree on what a good player is..

Alright, now this is what I am talking about. You have a couple of valid points there about the rotations and how it isn't all on Kobe. From what I have seen some of your bench players are better defensively so rotations will impact that stat a bit for sure. However when you look at the rotations they don't get drastically better even when Kobe is with Price and Davis (extremely small sample though so hard to really say). Also with that logic why then is the team shooting slightly better offensively when he sits (with Nick and Ellington out for chunks too). I can agree to disagree on Kobe's defense if you want but I do think he is at least below average at this point in his career. Right now while playing at the SG position Kobe has a PER of 17.9 and his opponent has a PER of 18.0 (league average is 15 and this can be found at 82 games website).

With all of that being said I do agree that I have seen him lock in for portions as well, but it isn't enough to negate his poor d most of the games.

Also I was not saying that Ellis is a bad player or doesn't help a team win, unless you think that is where Kobe is now. I said Kobe's impact right now isn't much different than Ellis (which is part of my reasoning for ranking him more in the 30+ range). I think that Ellis has been playing good this year but I wouldn't call him elite or anything.

nickdymez
12-03-2014, 09:21 PM
Everyone can knock kobe for his fg% that matches hardens(mvp candidate) minus the free throws. Fact is, he's playing hard every night and putting up 26,5,5 on a **** team where they can double kobe every possesion. Nobody in nba history that has played as many mins as kobe can do what hes doing right now. In fact kobe is still outplaying about 90% of nba players.

This is pretty much it. But whatever. People just hate the man..

Chronz
12-04-2014, 05:31 PM
Everyone can knock kobe for his fg% that matches hardens(mvp candidate) minus the free throws. Fact is, he's playing hard every night and putting up 26,5,5 on a **** team where they can double kobe every possesion. Nobody in nba history that has played as many mins as kobe can do what hes doing right now. In fact kobe is still outplaying about 90% of nba players.

I get the point your trying to make but your still deceiving people with the fg% complaint. The difference in efficiency between the 2 players is much, MUCH larger than FG% would have you believe.

Sactown
12-04-2014, 06:25 PM
25 assist the last 2 games. Both in wins. Lakers have been playing good ball and trending up the last 5 games.

But whatever. Let the haters hate, I'm enjoying the victory lap.

What victory lap? They're 1-13 against the Western conference... There is no victory lap, and they're being outscored by 7 1/2 points per game...

lol, please
12-05-2014, 02:26 AM
Kobe will go down as a top 15 all time player, and the fact that some people have the nerve to put LeBron in the same sentence is just pathetic and downright irresponsible.

rhd420
12-05-2014, 04:28 PM
I can say with 100% confidence not one logical thinking fan in the NBA would take Kobe over Melo, Dwight or Noah.

WITH the exception of Lakers management because they have the most to profit from Kobe
If Kobe signs a extension with the Lakers, you'll see a over inflation of his personal stats elevating him, not the team and with proper reason, a bad team surrounding him, perfect for maintaining his legacy even with the losses from the Lakers

No other player can do that currently with any other team ... even LeBron in Cleveland, low expectations but high returns on marketing and stats. Brilliant move from Lakers management

Crackadalic
12-05-2014, 04:41 PM
Just a huge accomplishment. Props to Mr Bean Bryant

koreancabbage
12-05-2014, 04:49 PM
Kobe will go down as a top 15 all time player, and the fact that some people have the nerve to put LeBron in the same sentence is just pathetic and downright irresponsible.

i know right? why would they put Lebron down to Kobe's level?

doesn't make sense.

kobe4thewinbang
12-05-2014, 10:48 PM
Congrats to Kobe! Amazing stat for himEasily my favorite player, and this game reminded me why. Outstanding game by Kobe. Getting the ball picked off, but getting it back, passing the ball--OMG--and nailing huge shots. Next game wasn't too bad either. :-)

jerellh528
12-06-2014, 12:17 AM
Easily my favorite player, and this game reminded me why. Outstanding game by Kobe. Getting the ball picked off, but getting it back, passing the ball--OMG--and nailing huge shots. Next game wasn't too bad either. :-)

My favorite player too. But he sure did suck tonight

jerellh528
12-06-2014, 12:17 AM
Kobe will go down as a top 15 all time player, and the fact that some people have the nerve to put LeBron in the same sentence is just pathetic and downright irresponsible.

Youre about 7 years late with this reply

jerellh528
12-06-2014, 12:18 AM
i know right? why would they put Lebron down to Kobe's level?

doesn't make sense.

Stoops