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JasonJohnHorn
11-15-2014, 04:50 PM
http://prosportsdaily.com/Headlines/ExternalArticle?articleId=329633


Read this and rolled my eyes. Given that Kobe is largely the reason for the 'up-and-down' stuff in LAL, I find it odd that he is jealous of Tim Duncan's situation.

Anybody who has watched Duncan play knows that dude could have been averaging 30/15 a game, but that he played into the team and put team first. Even Kobephiles have to concede that he is a glory hound who wants to play hero-ball all the time. Duncan has sacrificed personal stats since he got into the league to keep the Spurs in a winning situation.

Thoughts

Goose17
11-15-2014, 04:54 PM
"he's got the same competitive fire as I do. It's been a joy to compete against him for all these years."

Talent recognise talent. Real recognise Real.

Longhornfan1234
11-15-2014, 04:57 PM
Duncan is most luckiest star in history.

abe_froman
11-15-2014, 04:57 PM
who doesnt?

KnicksorBust
11-15-2014, 05:06 PM
Duncan is most luckiest star in history.

He created his own luck with his professional mentality, work ethic, and dedication.

jerellh528
11-15-2014, 05:13 PM
I agree with kobe. Spurs have been so consistent since pop got there.

zn23
11-15-2014, 05:13 PM
This coming from a guy who wouldn't take a pay cut. This coming from a guy who ran both Shaq and Dwight Howard out of town.

Watch and Learn Kobe...

5ass
11-15-2014, 05:15 PM
He created his own luck with his professional mentality, work ethic, and dedication.

I agree somewhat, but still he was lucky. Getting drafted by the spurs, Robinson came back, getting pop, great team management...

Longhornfan1234
11-15-2014, 05:15 PM
He created his own luck with his professional mentality, work ethic, and dedication.

He won a championship '99 alongside top 10 player during that time and top 20 player in history. The Admiral anchored Spurs' defense in '99. Duncan had the best back court in the NBA in 05-07. Duncan also had the MOST STACKED team in the league '13 season and '14 season. Don't bring up '03 season. They beat bunch of weak teams. Shaq -Kobe were fueding. Shaq was also playing hurt

There's not a player in history who is more lucky .

Raps18-19 Champ
11-15-2014, 05:29 PM
This coming from a guy who wouldn't take a pay cut. This coming from a guy who ran both Shaq and Dwight Howard out of town.

Watch and Learn Kobe...

Lol this.

You helped drive Shaq out of there. Then you decided you wanted $24 mil and screw the Lakers' cap situation.

Duncan is lucky but Kobe could've had continuity if it wasn't for his ego.

lamzoka
11-15-2014, 05:41 PM
This is more about Kobe praising the Spurs more than anything else.

Teeboy1487
11-15-2014, 05:58 PM
Lol this.

You helped drive Shaq out of there. Then you decided you wanted $24 mil and screw the Lakers' cap situation.

Duncan is lucky but Kobe could've had continuity if it wasn't for his ego.
Yet both of them have #5Ringz.

Bruno
11-15-2014, 06:17 PM
Lol this.

You helped drive Shaq out of there. Then you decided you wanted $24 mil and screw the Lakers' cap situation.

Duncan is lucky but Kobe could've had continuity if it wasn't for his ego.
Kobe taking less money means the Lakers would have had the same continuity that Duncan and Pop have spent two decade building? Chandler Parsons and Eric Bledsoe would have been nice additions but the Lakers wouldn't have gotten out of the second round, or been on the same planet as the Spurs in terms of continuity and consistency.

Shaq demanded 30 million dollars a year as a 32 year (with 2004 salary cap, when the cap was 43.87M per team) and called out Buss during games, he made his own bed.

jerellh528
11-15-2014, 06:20 PM
Kobe taking less money means the Lakers would have had the same continuity that Duncan and Pop have spent two decade building? Chandler Parsons and Eric Bledsoe would have been nice additions but the Lakers wouldn't have gotten out of the second round, or been on the same planet as the Spurs in terms of continuity and consistency.

Shaq demanded 30 million dollars a year as a 32 year (with 2004 salary cap, when the cap was 43.87M per team) and called out Buss during games, he made his own bed.

Thank you for putting this into perspective. I don't understand why certain posters can't grasp this concept

Hotone1401
11-15-2014, 06:31 PM
He created his own luck with his professional mentality, work ethic, and dedication.

Yes I'm sure he created his own luck by being drafted into a championship caliber team straight out of college and to an organization that has had the best front office for almost 2 decades. Let's be real here, Kobe was fortunate to end up with the Lakers but Duncan was also fortunate to be drafted by the Spurs.

There's not one person who can say how Duncan's career would've turned out if he was drafted by the Timberwolves. I'd guarantee you he wouldn't have a champsionship if that ever happened.

SF8
11-15-2014, 06:34 PM
Lol Kobe the same guy who drove Shaq out of town, the same guy who made LAL fire Phil Jackson once, the same guy who signed a $26M/yr contract instead of taking a paycut to allow the Lakers to sign other good role player FAs (like the Mavs) is jealous of Duncan?

Duncan is everything that Kobe is not. Only thing similar is that they have rings. Duncan is a better human being, a better personality and a much better role player than Kobe.

Kobe had his chance to make a financial sacrifice like Duncan and yet he passed because of his selfishness and greed.

PurpleLynch
11-15-2014, 06:48 PM
It's a different kind of jealousy,from what I understand he's praising Duncan and Spurs as a whole. Nothing of bitter imo,just real respect(and a bit of positive jealousy).

SanAntonioSpurs23
11-15-2014, 06:48 PM
He won a championship '99 alongside top 10 player during that time and top 20 player in history. The Admiral anchored Spurs' defense in '99. Duncan had the best back court in the NBA in 05-07. Duncan also had the MOST STACKED team in the league '13 season and '14 season. Don't bring up '03 season. They beat bunch of weak teams. Shaq -Kobe were fueding. Shaq was also playing hurt

There's not a player in history who is more lucky .

It's Duncans fault that the Spurs know how to run an organization? Without Duncan those "stacked" teams don't sniff the finals. Tim Duncan has been the most important player on the Spurs since day 1. Same can't be said about Kobe who was carried by Shaq and MVPau.

kdspurman
11-15-2014, 07:02 PM
He won a championship '99 alongside top 10 player during that time and top 20 player in history. The Admiral anchored Spurs' defense in '99. Duncan had the best back court in the NBA in 05-07. Duncan also had the MOST STACKED team in the league '13 season and '14 season. Don't bring up '03 season. They beat bunch of weak teams. Shaq -Kobe were fueding. Shaq was also playing hurt

There's not a player in history who is more lucky .

Classic...
Tell me, had the Spurs won a title prior to Duncan's arrival? Had they even played in the finals?

He got drafted into a nice situation and a stable organization (though when he got drafted it was not what it is today obviously) and Pop will be the first to say they were lucky. But sure, there was some luck on both ends... But, as usual, you're off the grid.

to say he's the luckiest guy ever is just bonkers. They didn't go out and draft big names. He didn't demand trades. He even said when they drafted Manu & Parker, he figured they were just guys who would be "projects" and wouldn't work out. He didn't jump ship to go play with other superstar players in their prime. He stayed with them during the good and bad times. Would he be "less lucky" to you if he jumped ship to Orlando and won titles with Hill/T-Mac?

And even though they never missed the playoffs, they certainly had some down years where the roster maybe could have been improved. (RJ/Bogans era for example)

And regarding the "MOST STACKED" teams comment... Did you happen to think that it's because of Duncan's leadership/attitude/team first mentality that guys are willing to come in and take lesser roles for the better of the team? And buy into a system, and allow Pop to coach them the way he sees fit? Instead of giving him a hard time, you're failing to see that it's because of him they were able to establish such an amazing team & culture. Duncan is the glue for what happens with that team, both on and off the court.

There's 2 reasons the Spurs are where they are now, and that's Pop & Duncan.... Duncan is still anchoring their defense and leading by example, like he has been for many years. Some luck involved? Sure... It's like that with any superstar. You need it to win in the league. But he's earned everything he got. And he's worked very hard to establish what they have now

kdspurman
11-15-2014, 07:05 PM
It's a different kind of jealousy,from what I understand he's praising Duncan and Spurs as a whole. Nothing of bitter imo,just real respect(and a bit of positive jealousy).

Yea, that's how I took it as well.

TrueFan420
11-15-2014, 07:06 PM
There's not one person who can say how Duncan's career would've turned out if he was drafted by the Timberwolves. I'd guarantee you he wouldn't have a champsionship if that ever happened.

Do you understand what's wrong with this?

KnicksorBust
11-15-2014, 07:06 PM
I agree somewhat, but still he was lucky. Getting drafted by the spurs, Robinson came back, getting pop, great team management...

Just so we're clear... playing with a past his prime 33 year old David Robinson means we have to diminish his legacy with a label like "luck?" You're really okay with that?

KnicksorBust
11-15-2014, 07:11 PM
He won a championship '99 alongside top 10 player during that time and top 20 player in history. The Admiral anchored Spurs' defense in '99. Duncan had the best back court in the NBA in 05-07. Duncan also had the MOST STACKED team in the league '13 season and '14 season. Don't bring up '03 season. They beat bunch of weak teams. Shaq -Kobe were fueding. Shaq was also playing hurt

There's not a player in history who is more lucky .

:laugh: Top 10 player? Then how come he didn't make an all-nba team or even an all-star team. D-Rob couldn't hold Zo, Shaq, or Dream's jock at that point in his career. Duncan was the most important player on all of those championship teams and it's not even debatable. I also love that you start the discussion by immediately dismissing the entire 2003 nba season where he led the Spurs to a title with one of the weakest supporting casts in history. As if we can just ignore that because you asked so politely. :) It's not luck when you are the franchise player of all your title teams.

beasted86
11-15-2014, 07:12 PM
Kobe taking less money means the Lakers would have had the same continuity that Duncan and Pop have spent two decade building? Chandler Parsons and Eric Bledsoe would have been nice additions but the Lakers wouldn't have gotten out of the second round, or been on the same planet as the Spurs in terms of continuity and consistency.

Shaq demanded 30 million dollars a year as a 32 year (with 2004 salary cap, when the cap was 43.87M per team) and called out Buss during games, he made his own bed.

While you make some valid points, why even bring up the cap in 2004 when we all.know with those soft cap rules it didn't matter what the cap was or how much Shaq asked for. You could make lopsided salary trades as the incoming salary differences were allowed to be a higher percentage, and you could continue using the full MLE and BAE every year. End of the day Kobe should have been paid less. Listen to those words carefully. I didn't say he should have taken less... management should have had hindsight and decided to offer less. Its not as if they only offered $19-20m that any team this summer would have been stupid enough to waste their cap space on a 36yr old.

KnicksorBust
11-15-2014, 07:17 PM
Yes I'm sure he created his own luck by being drafted into a championship caliber team straight out of college and to an organization that has had the best front office for almost 2 decades. Let's be real here, Kobe was fortunate to end up with the Lakers but Duncan was also fortunate to be drafted by the Spurs.

Championship caliber team? They had only made the conference finals once in the decade before he got there and had never won a title in franchise history. This fairy-tale championship pedigree is not based in reality or facts.


There's not one person who can say how Duncan's career would've turned out if he was drafted by the Timberwolves.

But WAIT, because you're going to try to do it anyway! :)


I'd guarantee you he wouldn't have a champsionship if that ever happened.

And I guarantee he still would have been a league MVP. I guarantee Marbury would have stayed. I guarantee they would have gone on playoff run after playoff run just like the Spurs did. And finally I guarantee with the continuity and chemistry of an unselfish leader who plays his best in big moments, they would have broken through and won the NBA title. Wasn't that fun?

Longhornfan1234
11-15-2014, 08:02 PM
:laugh: Top 10 player? Then how come he didn't make an all-nba team or even an all-star team. D-Rob couldn't hold Zo, Shaq, or Dream's jock at that point in his career. Duncan was the most important player on all of those championship teams and it's not even debatable. I also love that you start the discussion by immediately dismissing the entire 2003 nba season where he led the Spurs to a title with one of the weakest supporting casts in history. As if we can just ignore that because you asked so politely. :) It's not luck when you are the franchise player of all your title teams.

Top 10 player?


Yes...easy. Despite Robinson's low minutes... he was 5th FG%, 9th in blocks, 10th rebound, and came 4th DPOY. He was best defender in league. He focused more on defense that year. He guarded Shaq very well in Semis. Admiral's D is huge part of the reason the Spurs won so decisive. He was the leading scorer in Conference Finals against the Blazers. So stop acting like Robinson wasn't All Star top player. :laugh:


Who said Duncan wasn't most important player? I'm just saying Duncan is the MOST luckiest basketball player in history. He played alongside top 8 C in history. Robinson anchored the D in '99. Duncan had the best back court in 05-07. . Duncan was on the most stacked team in '13 and '14 in the league. You can't deny he fell in great situation.,

KnicksorBust
11-15-2014, 08:10 PM
:laugh: Top 10 player? Then how come he didn't make an all-nba team or even an all-star team. D-Rob couldn't hold Zo, Shaq, or Dream's jock at that point in his career. Duncan was the most important player on all of those championship teams and it's not even debatable. I also love that you start the discussion by immediately dismissing the entire 2003 nba season where he led the Spurs to a title with one of the weakest supporting casts in history. As if we can just ignore that because you asked so politely. :) It's not luck when you are the franchise player of all your title teams.

Top 10 player?


Yes...easy. Despite Robinson's low minutes... he was 5th FG%, 9th in blocks, 10th rebound, and came 4th DPOY. He was best defender in league. He focused more on defense that year. He guarded Shaq very well in Semis. Admiral's D is huge part of the reason the Spurs won so decisive. He was the leading scorer in Conference Finals against the Blazers. So stop acting like Robinson wasn't All Star top player. :laugh:


Who said Duncan wasn't most important player? I'm just saying Duncan is the MOST luckiest basketball player in history. He played alongside top 8 C in history. Robinson anchored the D in '99. Duncan had the best back court in 05-07. . Duncan was on the most stacked team in '13 and '14 in the league. You can't deny he fell in great situation.,

Best defender in the league? Zo and Mutombo say hi. And your argument of "in one series Drob scored the most points!!!" Hardly proves anything.

"Fell into a great situation" is closer to what I would describe it as. But I would challenge you to name me all of the players you believe could have been put on those Spurs teams and immediately been an all-nba player and led them to a title...

Jordan? Magic? Bird? Duncan? What he did on those teams ans bis value to them FAR outweighs the "luck" of him being on them. He maximized the value of everybody else. He saved Drobs legacy and created legacies for Parker and Manu.

Longhornfan1234
11-15-2014, 08:18 PM
Best defender in the league? Zo and Mutombo say hi. And your argument of "in one series Drob scored the most points!!!" Hardly proves anything.

"Fell into a great situation" is closer to what I would describe it as. But I would challenge you to name me all of the players you believe could have been put on those Spurs teams and immediately been an all-nba player and led them to a title...

Jordan? Magic? Bird? Duncan? What he did on those teams ans bis value to them FAR outweighs the "luck" of him being on them. He maximized the value of everybody else. He saved Drobs legacy and created legacies for Parker and Manu.


Robinson would have went down a top 20-30 player with out Duncan. The Admiral was 3rd best C in 90s(most stacked C era. Hakeem & Shaq only ones with an argument over him). He won MVP and DPOY. He was top 5 player in most of the 90s.


You could put Anthony Davis in the same situation and he would produce the same or better results.

JasonJohnHorn
11-15-2014, 09:26 PM
I agree with kobe. Spurs have been so consistent since pop got there.

This is spot on. People forget how close the Spurs were to firing Pop during their three-year drought. They won one championship, and then lost three straight years with Robinson in his prime. Management was close to firing Pop and Duncan stood up for him.

Duncan opted to STAY with the Spurs unlike Hill and McGrady who left their teams for Orlando, and this allowed the Spurs to build on him.

Duncan SHARED the ball with late picks like Manu and Parker (Kobe took YEARS to let Bynum touch the ball and alienated players on the roster early in his career by chucking up shots).

Duncan took less so the team could afford to keep other talent (not saying guys should have to do that, especially in LAL where they can afford to spend, but Kobe's lack of self-sacrifice is apparent).

And it's not like Duncan had ring chasers like Karl Malone and Payton and Ron Artest signing with the Spurs at a discount like Kobe did.


Duncan always made sure talented players were welcome and included: nobody EVER left the Spurs because Duncan wasn't sharing the ball. Kobe ran Shaq out, then he alienated Dwight, which left the Lakers with nothing and sent Gasol away as well.

Kobe was more than happy to see Brown and 'Antoni go, and he was really the reason Phil left the first time around, so Kobe has not only chased out coaches, he's chased out HOF coaches.


the Spurs' stability is the result of Duncan's maturity.

The Lakers' instability is a result of Kobe's hero-ball attitude.


And those who say "Duncan is lucky" forget how luck Bird and Magic were.... Magic won a championship AS A ROOKIE. Bird won his first as a SOPHOMORE. Russel won his first season as well. Kobe was a rookie on a team with THREE ALL-STARS and was one of FOUR all-stars his second season. It's not like Kobe didn't have as much luck. I mean, he was playing with Shaq his first year, and Shaq was better than D-Rob by that point.

JasonJohnHorn
11-15-2014, 09:29 PM
While you make some valid points, why even bring up the cap in 2004 when we all.know with those soft cap rules it didn't matter what the cap was or how much Shaq asked for. You could make lopsided salary trades as the incoming salary differences were allowed to be a higher percentage, and you could continue using the full MLE and BAE every year. End of the day Kobe should have been paid less. Listen to those words carefully. I didn't say he should have taken less... management should have had hindsight and decided to offer less. Its not as if they only offered $19-20m that any team this summer would have been stupid enough to waste their cap space on a 36yr old.

Word. And let's not forget, LAL got Malone and Payton at a discount in 2004 and Kobe still didn't manage to win it. They were tore apart by Detroit in the finals.

AIRMAR72
11-15-2014, 09:56 PM
he won a championship '99 alongside top 10 player during that time and top 20 player in history. The admiral anchored spurs' defense in '99. Duncan had the best back court in the nba in 05-07. Duncan also had the most stacked team in the league '13 season and '14 season. Don't bring up '03 season. They beat bunch of weak teams. Shaq -kobe were fueding. Shaq was also playing hurt

there's not a player in history who is more lucky . negative!!

sheesh
11-16-2014, 12:01 AM
If you can't concede that Kobe Bryant is a brash personality then the thread should be closed.

SoCal Bob
11-16-2014, 03:43 AM
What's with all the Kobe hate threads man?

Mr_Jones
11-16-2014, 04:17 AM
It's all about perspective. Media dictates what people think about certain players. Fabricated reports or hiding stories happens all the time.

Kobe can envy them. Surely people will blame him for the downfall in LA. I don't think much of it. But that's just because I am better than all of you.

koreancabbage
11-16-2014, 06:42 AM
Thank you for putting this into perspective. I don't understand why certain posters can't grasp this concept

cept Shaq could carry the entire team on his back and can win a championship(s) by himself in his prime. He was one of the most dominating players in NBA history. grasp that.

MTar786
11-16-2014, 08:58 AM
It's Duncans fault that the Spurs know how to run an organization? Without Duncan those "stacked" teams don't sniff the finals. Tim Duncan has been the most important player on the Spurs since day 1. Same can't be said about Kobe who was carried by Shaq and MVPau.

you mean like the first 4 rimgs right? because i would say parker and leonard are the most important and best two players on this team last year and especially this year.

jerellh528
11-16-2014, 10:41 AM
cept Shaq could carry the entire team on his back and can win a championship(s) by himself in his prime. He was one of the most dominating players in NBA history. grasp that.

So? This can be said for kobe as well. Except for winning championships by himself which is a stupid statement because nobody can do that.

kdspurman
11-16-2014, 11:58 AM
you mean like the first 4 rimgs right? because i would say parker and leonard are the most important and best two players on this team last year and especially this year.

that's certainly debatable. Parker struggled at times, whereas Duncans production and defensive impact was far more consistent.

Jamiecballer
11-16-2014, 01:18 PM
how did this thread devolve into serious discussion when such a ripe opportunity to laugh our ***** off at Kobe presented itself? is this bizarro-PSD?

we are talking about a player that is about as far from the spurs mentality as it gets. the lack of awareness this guys shows is positively incredible.

next up on PSD - Russell Westbrook gives a seminar on the importance of deferring to teammates...

Leftcoast_yg
11-16-2014, 02:19 PM
Thank you for putting this into perspective. I don't understand why certain posters can't grasp this concept

Because they choose to act like morons.

Leftcoast_yg
11-16-2014, 02:22 PM
cept Shaq could carry the entire team on his back and can win a championship(s) by himself in his prime. He was one of the most dominating players in NBA history. grasp that.

He decided to carry a pack of twinkies instead. More on.

Bruno
11-16-2014, 04:35 PM
While you make some valid points, why even bring up the cap in 2004 when we all.know with those soft cap rules it didn't matter what the cap was or how much Shaq asked for. You could make lopsided salary trades as the incoming salary differences were allowed to be a higher percentage, and you could continue using the full MLE and BAE every year. End of the day Kobe should have been paid less. Listen to those words carefully. I didn't say he should have taken less... management should have had hindsight and decided to offer less. Its not as if they only offered $19-20m that any team this summer would have been stupid enough to waste their cap space on a 36yr old.

the emphasis on my post was continuity. there is no signing the Lakers could have put together this off-season to match the continuity the Spurs have built. if Dwight had stayed, the continuity wouldn't have been the same. we're talking about a 18 year relationship between Pop and Duncan. that's the heart of the Spurs stability. people here are missing that. Kobe misses Phil. people are failing to read between the lines with this one.

you're putting emphasis on nuance with the 2004 salary cap. trade values didn't have to be exactly equal, the full MLE (do you know what kind of plays got MLEs in 2004?) and the BAE variables were less strict. but thats childs play in the grand scheme. the cap was what it was, and Shaq asked for what he asked for. surely if you have a problem with a 36 year old taking 23, then you'd have a problem with a 32 year old asking for 30M with a smaller salary cap.

Bruno
11-16-2014, 04:37 PM
Word. And let's not forget, LAL got Malone and Payton at a discount in 2004 and Kobe still didn't manage to win it. They were tore apart by Detroit in the finals.

they were washed up, the Lakers had no bench, no quality small forward, and Detroit executed perfect defense. the better team won. what Detroit did defensively was special.

did the Lakers get a discount on Nash too?

Chronz
11-16-2014, 05:21 PM
Kobe was a root issue for the Lakers instability. His feuds and immaturity hurt him early on. Still had it far better than most could have expected from their franchises tho. So Im sure there are plenty who envy both Tim and Kobe.

YashBoone
11-16-2014, 05:40 PM
Duncan is most luckiest star in history.

Luck literally has absolutely nothing to do with it at all.
Such a stupid statement.
I know I'll never convince you other wise so I won't even try,
But that's just stupid bro.

ink
11-17-2014, 10:15 AM
This coming from a guy who wouldn't take a pay cut. This coming from a guy who ran both Shaq and Dwight Howard out of town.

Watch and Learn Kobe...

Or better yet, just retire and free up some cap space.

Munkeysuit
11-17-2014, 10:40 AM
The entire league envies the Spurs stability.

Jarvo
11-17-2014, 11:38 AM
He won a championship '99 alongside top 10 player during that time and top 20 player in history. The Admiral anchored Spurs' defense in '99. Duncan had the best back court in the NBA in 05-07. Duncan also had the MOST STACKED team in the league '13 season and '14 season. Don't bring up '03 season. They beat bunch of weak teams. Shaq -Kobe were fueding. Shaq was also playing hurt

There's not a player in history who is more lucky .

So what you're saying is all luck and no talent?

alexander_37
11-17-2014, 12:56 PM
Because Duncan isn't a douche who let his ego throw his team into turmoil for half a decade.

futureman
11-17-2014, 02:56 PM
Stability happens when you have a guy that doesn't take 1/3 of a teams cap room.

Hawkeye15
11-17-2014, 03:20 PM
well, Duncan isn't a douche, correct, but he also didn't play with a douche, like Kobe did (Shaq wanted huge money). Playing alongside Kobe isn't for everyone. I don't know if he could have been drafted into a better situation for him personally. Kobe also has to remember that when the Shaq thing blew up, there was obviously going to be a period of rebuild, of which he had no patience for, and when Buss was gone, his stupid kids screwed everything up.

Front office, as well as Duncan isn't a douche, and his star help are neither. Kobe is a douche, and his star help was as well. It's a big combination of things, and the big 3 in SA all took pay cuts, nobody in LA takes a pay cut. But hey, I am sure he will take his 5 rings at the end of the day, and be able to swallow the fact that he will end his career in the toilet, team wise.

Bruno
11-17-2014, 03:46 PM
well, Duncan isn't a douche, correct, but he also didn't play with a douche, like Kobe did (Shaq wanted huge money). Playing alongside Kobe isn't for everyone. I don't know if he could have been drafted into a better situation for him personally. Kobe also has to remember that when the Shaq thing blew up, there was obviously going to be a period of rebuild, of which he had no patience for, and when Buss was gone, his stupid kids screwed everything up.

Front office, as well as Duncan isn't a douche, and his star help are neither. Kobe is a douche, and his star help was as well. It's a big combination of things, and the big 3 in SA all took pay cuts, nobody in LA takes a pay cut. But hey, I am sure he will take his 5 rings at the end of the day, and be able to swallow the fact that he will end his career in the toilet, team wise.

that's another reason why Pau was so special. besides the obvious reasons.

they were on year 3.5 of the rebuild before the Pau trade. I think Kobe was patient enough and to this day Im grateful that he put pressure on management. the Lakers in this market with a in-prime Kobe shouldn't have taken 3.5 years before making a significant move. They lost Shaq in summer 2004, and didn't get Pau until February 2008. he was promised a contender, and they were taking too long. they almost wasted his prime. pau saves. Bynum was also in year three and ready to make a leap, which he did before the injury.

AIRMAR72
11-17-2014, 05:04 PM
He won a championship '99 alongside top 10 player during that time and top 20 player in history. The Admiral anchored Spurs' defense in '99. Duncan had the best back court in the NBA in 05-07. Duncan also had the MOST STACKED team in the league '13 season and '14 season. Don't bring up '03 season. They beat bunch of weak teams. Shaq -Kobe were fueding. Shaq was also playing hurt

There's not a player in history who is more lucky . you reaching too for when did Tim Duncan had a stack team the admiral was already in the stage of almost finish and you have the nerve to say Timmy played on stack teams nobody wanted Manu he wasnt proven coach pop gamble on the other D league guys it was GREAT coaching and TEAM chemistry

Hawkeye15
11-17-2014, 05:50 PM
you reaching too for when did Tim Duncan had a stack team the admiral was already in the stage of almost finish and you have the nerve to say Timmy played on stack teams nobody wanted Manu he wasnt proven coach pop gamble on the other D league guys it was GREAT coaching and TEAM chemistry

a bunch of teams wanted Manu, they just weren't going to use a pick on a guy who couldn't come over for a few years...

Chrisclover
11-17-2014, 09:28 PM
Likewise, Allen Iverson begrudges Kobe his rings. Both are ball-dominant but AI was not fortunate enough to have capable teammates.

Chrisclover
11-17-2014, 09:39 PM
This coming from a guy who wouldn't take a pay cut. This coming from a guy who ran both Shaq and Dwight Howard out of town.

Watch and Learn Kobe...
Kobe is much luckier than Duncan. Duncan earns his achievements with his patience, humility, among others. But Kobe wouldn't have won so much had he not have the FO and teammates to back him up. A lone wolf can not win. See Allen Iverson.
Admittedly, both Kobe and Duncan have good teammates but if people take the personalities into account, Kobe is no doubt luckier because though being a poison, he has 5 rings. And he is a hypocrite who keeps saying that he would trust his teammates and give them opportunities and room to develop.

Hawkeye15
11-18-2014, 02:51 PM
Likewise, Allen Iverson begrudges Kobe his rings. Both are ball-dominant but AI was not fortunate enough to have capable teammates.

nor be anywhere near as good as Kobe...

Chronz
11-18-2014, 03:02 PM
that's another reason why Pau was so special. besides the obvious reasons.

they were on year 3.5 of the rebuild before the Pau trade. I think Kobe was patient enough and to this day Im grateful that he put pressure on management. the Lakers in this market with a in-prime Kobe shouldn't have taken 3.5 years before making a significant move. They lost Shaq in summer 2004, and didn't get Pau until February 2008. he was promised a contender, and they were taking too long. they almost wasted his prime. pau saves. Bynum was also in year three and ready to make a leap, which he did before the injury.
Kobe was asking out after 3 meager seasons, after already being surrounded by HOF'ers and winning several chips. For comparison, Tmac gave Orlando 4 years of his body before putting pressure on management and getting traded by the Hockey GM as a result. This with him having health concerns and being given very little by management. Maybe we just have different standards of patience but Kobe is definitely on the low side in any similar comp.

Ive asked you before, but what exactly is it you think Kobe did? Put pressure? He was asking for the likes of Kidd and Jermaine Oneal when the Lakers were refusing to trade Bynum, Kobe eventually admitted he was wrong for it. Its not like the Lakers were content by mediocrity (They werent being run by DTS ffs) they were just biding their time for the no brainer deal, which would have been for KG had he not been scared off by Kobe's antics. The moves Kobe wanted were wrong, it was right of them to ignore his pleas and make the best deal when it came around. That had nothing to do with his "pressure" and everything to do with the CBA and timing.

I dont know how could not see a rebuild coming, does he not know how the CBA works? What exactly were the Lakers suppose to do with zero assets, players who didn't want to return if Shaq wasn't there and Brian Grants crippling 3 year deal. They made some moves to appease Phil that wound up hurting them IMO. They just got a lucky deal that angered the league.