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View Full Version : Kyrie Irving.... The Downfall of the Cavs Big 3?



Nikeman
11-07-2014, 05:37 PM
Watching a couple of the Cavs games this season, it just seems like Irving wants to play hero. There have been tons of possessions I see in which Kyrie dribbles up the court and throws up a shot without one pass.

Many possessions I have seen LeBron not touch the ball. For LeBron to be effective, he needs to have the ball in his hands to break down the defense. Kyrie Irving at this stage in his career is just not good enough to break down the defenses of NBA teams. There is no reason for the Cavs to be losing to the Jazz. If LeBron doesn't make that miraculous 3 and get fouled on a 3, the Cavs lose by 8+ points.

Kevin Love has seemed willing to adjust his game for the team needs, but Kyrie has not. If he keeps playing "hero ball" and shoots 20 shots a game without getting a single assist, this Cavs team will never win.

40% shooting from the field, along with 3.8 assists with 2.5 turnovers will not get the job done. Irving needs to realize that on this Cavs team, he is not the best player, hell not even the second best player and let LeBron handle the ball.

When the HEAT Big 3 formed, Wade and Bosh let LeBron handle the ball and thats why Miami was effective. If Kyrie doesn't learn this then the Cavs will not win and hell I could even see him getting traded.

savvy1803
11-07-2014, 05:43 PM
Watching a couple of the Cavs games this season, it just seems like Irving wants to play hero. There have been tons of possessions I see in which Kyrie dribbles up the court and throws up a shot without one pass.

Many possessions I have seen LeBron not touch the ball. For LeBron to be effective, he needs to have the ball in his hands to break down the defense. Kyrie Irving at this stage in his career is just not good enough to break down the defenses of NBA teams. There is no reason for the Cavs to be losing to the Jazz. If LeBron doesn't make that miraculous 3 and get fouled on a 3, the Cavs lose by 8+ points.

Kevin Love has seemed willing to adjust his game for the team needs, but Kyrie has not. If he keeps playing "hero ball" and shoots 20 shots a game without getting a single assist, this Cavs team will never win.

40% shooting from the field, along with 3.8 assists with 2.5 turnovers will not get the job done. Irving needs to realize that on this Cavs team, he is not the best player, hell not even the second best player and let LeBron handle the ball.

When the HEAT Big 3 formed, Wade and Bosh let LeBron handle the ball and thats why Miami was effective. If Kyrie doesn't learn this then the Cavs will not win and hell I could even see him getting traded.

It's sooo early though give it a little time .

Nikeman
11-07-2014, 05:46 PM
It's sooo early though give it a little time .

It is early man, 4 games in I agree. That being said, mentality takes years to change. 4 games of poor play should be enough for Irving to realize he needs to play smarter.

These aren't old Cavalier teams where he could do whatever he wanted.

Hell even Waitors seemed to realize this.

slaker619
11-07-2014, 05:52 PM
He needs to pass and stop acting like Westbrook

savvy1803
11-07-2014, 05:54 PM
It is early man, 4 games in I agree. That being said, mentality takes years to change. 4 games of poor play should be enough for Irving to realize he needs to play smarter.

These aren't old Cavalier teams where he could do whatever he wanted.

Hell even Waitors seemed to realize this.

I understand but Waiters is not a ball dominant point guard like Kyrie so it might take Kyrie a little longer to adjust , he is used to having the ball in his hands and will have to find more of a balance between pass and shoot , Lebron and Love will be instrumental in helping him find that balance .

Jeffy25
11-07-2014, 05:58 PM
Lebron's usage is down a little bit, but not a ton.

Kyrie has about the same usage

And Love's is obviously way down.

Jeffy25
11-07-2014, 05:59 PM
Love needs to be taking more shots than Kyrie though

Jeffy25
11-07-2014, 06:06 PM
It's sooo early though give it a little time .

While I agree it's really early, Nikeman's arguments are sound. It's based on what Kyrie has been doing. Things that won't lead to success for the team.

Rather that raw stats, but rather actions. The actions have to change.

Jamiecballer
11-07-2014, 06:07 PM
There was never a big 3 here let's be real

jrodmesche
11-07-2014, 06:08 PM
I believe this Cav's team has some REAL talent, and if they could somehow put it all together than they definitely have the ability to win championships. With that said I think there going to have some REAL problems. When LeBron came to Miami to join Wade and the Heat, Wade had already been there and done that. Wade had already won a championship as the clear cut #1 option for the Heat and had no problem handing the torch to Lebron when it was needed. This Cav's team has not tasted success since LeBron was there last and now its a completely different group of players that are used to losing. LeBron now has to play the leader role all by himself which he has not yet proven he can do. on the Heat he had other veterans like Haslem and Wade to help him out with that. For the cave to reach there full potential Kyrie is going to have to do the same thing wade did and I'm not so sure thats possible.

Red_Pill
11-07-2014, 06:26 PM
He needs to pass and stop acting like Westbrook

Westbrook for his career is averaging 7 assists per game. Over 1+ than Irving for career. And Irving so far this season is at 3.8.

Basically, stop hating on Westbrook. He passes the ball.

Arch Stanton
11-07-2014, 06:43 PM
Watching a couple of the Cavs games this season, it just seems like Irving wants to play hero. There have been tons of possessions I see in which Kyrie dribbles up the court and throws up a shot without one pass.

Many possessions I have seen LeBron not touch the ball. For LeBron to be effective, he needs to have the ball in his hands to break down the defense. Kyrie Irving at this stage in his career is just not good enough to break down the defenses of NBA teams. There is no reason for the Cavs to be losing to the Jazz. If LeBron doesn't make that miraculous 3 and get fouled on a 3, the Cavs lose by 8+ points.

Kevin Love has seemed willing to adjust his game for the team needs, but Kyrie has not. If he keeps playing "hero ball" and shoots 20 shots a game without getting a single assist, this Cavs team will never win.

40% shooting from the field, along with 3.8 assists with 2.5 turnovers will not get the job done. Irving needs to realize that on this Cavs team, he is not the best player, hell not even the second best player and let LeBron handle the ball.

When the HEAT Big 3 formed, Wade and Bosh let LeBron handle the ball and thats why Miami was effective. If Kyrie doesn't learn this then the Cavs will not win and hell I could even see him getting traded.

First off, it's four games so pump the breaks. Second, I disagree in that Kyrie is not good enough to break down defenses, that's his greatest skill of which he is elite at. He thrives with one on one basketball. He needs to use this skill to create other opportunities for other players rather than just get off his shot.

kobe4thewinbang
11-07-2014, 06:45 PM
Kyrie is getting so good that he deserves his own team (e.g. Westbrook), but let's be honest--he's no LeBron James. The dude's gotta go. I would say for Rondo, but Rondo probably still hates any former Heat player.

L8kers4life
11-07-2014, 06:49 PM
Love needs to be taking more shots than Kyrie though

Agreed, I also feel like Irving's body language has been piss poor. Like, what is this dude so upset about, does he really need to shoot that much to be happy? Also I think they need to have Love get down low a bit more, he is roaming by the 3 point line far too much for someone who can get the offensive rebound as good as him.

Also the Cavs D, looks awful, that more than anything could prevent the Ring this year.

abe_froman
11-07-2014, 06:50 PM
i said the same thing in the last thread

L8kers4life
11-07-2014, 07:21 PM
There was never a big 3 here let's be real

It's a big 3, just a under developed one at that. You cant say it's not a big 3, they have the best PG, SF and PF in the East, that is a big 3, they just need to learn to play together.

JordansBulls
11-07-2014, 07:25 PM
This is Kyrie's team. He is the proven commodity for this franchise and won allstar game mvp last year. If Love nor Lebron want to cooperate then they can be traded.

SPURSFAN1
11-07-2014, 07:30 PM
This is Kyrie's team. He is the proven commodity for this franchise and won allstar game mvp last year. If Love nor Lebron want to cooperate then they can be traded.

People need to stop saying this. This is lebrons team. I don't even want to talk credentials here.

IndyRealist
11-07-2014, 07:31 PM
It's a big 3, just a under developed one at that. You cant say it's not a big 3, they have the best PG, SF and PF in the East, that is a big 3, they just need to learn to play together.

What makes him the best PG in the East, exactly? I'd toss it up between Lowry and Wall atm.

lamzoka
11-07-2014, 07:32 PM
They need to trade Irving for a J. Calderon type of PG. A deadly 3 pts shooter who doesn't play hero ball. Lebron doesn't need a ball dominant PG. He's a Point Foward himself. They don't need Irving. Both Kyrie and Love need to take a backsit and let a LeBron be the man for them to be successful.

IndyRealist
11-07-2014, 07:33 PM
There was never a big 3 here let's be real

Sure there is. Lebron, Love, and Varejao.

xbrackattackx
11-07-2014, 07:34 PM
I like Lebron and Love but for the life of me I can't like this kid. I haven't liked him ever something about him. But I would laugh if Cavs missed playoffs and got the first pick and chose Okafor.

Irving/Lebron
Waiters/Miller
Lebron/Marion
Love/TT
Okafor/Andy

SPURSFAN1
11-07-2014, 07:34 PM
Sure there is. Lebron, Love, and Varejao.

:laugh2:

lamzoka
11-07-2014, 07:34 PM
This is Kyrie's team. He is the proven commodity for this franchise and won allstar game mvp last year. If Love nor Lebron want to cooperate then they can be traded.

Who's crazy enough to trade for Lebron and Love? :rolleyes:

Dade County
11-07-2014, 07:42 PM
Cav's in the Final's... all of this is horse crap.

Lbj just wants control of the team, so he can decide if they win or lose on any given night. So he has to break his other star players down to do so; they'll go on a 20 game win streak and all will be forgotten.

Same thing he did in the HEAT vs Mav's Final's when Wade would have won the Final's MVP. Don't listen to the noise people, there is NO story here.

IndyRealist
11-07-2014, 07:43 PM
:laugh2:

I try.

SPURSFAN1
11-07-2014, 07:43 PM
all star mvp. :laugh:

numba1CHANGsta
11-07-2014, 07:48 PM
Irving either isn't ready to be a superstar or he won't ever be one. He's trying to be the "man" on the team by shooting and not passing even though he is a PG. This is why you can't build a Big 3 with a PG, unless you're Magic. This is what's going to happen, either Irving gets traded or he switches to the SG position.

Jamiecballer
11-07-2014, 08:44 PM
It's a big 3, just a under developed one at that. You cant say it's not a big 3, they have the best PG, SF and PF in the East, that is a big 3, they just need to learn to play together.
A big 3 is three superb players to me. They've got 2. A big three also IMO should be 3 guys who can thrive together. I've been skeptical of Irvings fit before they ever played together. Pippen Jordan Rodman. That's a big 3. Allen Garnett Pierce.

Nikeman
11-07-2014, 09:18 PM
They need to trade Irving for a J. Calderon type of PG. A deadly 3 pts shooter who doesn't play hero ball. Lebron doesn't need a ball dominant PG. He's a Point Foward himself. They don't need Irving. Both Kyrie and Love need to take a backsit and let a LeBron be the man for them to be successful.

I don't even think they'd want a PG like Rondo tbh, Rondo needs the ball in his hands at all times as well to be effective.

People are going to think I am crazy, but I think Chalmers next to LeBron was a good fit. Mario can shoot the 3, bring the ball up the court, and when he feels like it play good D without fouling.

LeBron is the PG. They just need a "PG" that can shoot 3s, play D, play off the ball and occasionally slash and finish.

Nikeman
11-07-2014, 09:20 PM
First off, it's four games so pump the breaks. Second, I disagree in that Kyrie is not good enough to break down defenses, that's his greatest skill of which he is elite at. He thrives with one on one basketball. He needs to use this skill to create other opportunities for other players rather than just get off his shot.

I am sorry, but I disagree 100%. If I am the opposing team, and Irving "plays hero ball", I call that a won possession.

You say he "thrives at one on one basketball". Last time I checked, the NBA is 5 vs 5 basketball. Not 1 v 1. Sure Irving can probably take most players at off the dribble, but he also has 7 footers waiting at the rim to contest his shot.

The amount of times I've seen Irving bring the ball up the court and take a shot without a single pass is borderline ridiculous. There are stretches of games he makes LeBron look like a spectator.

It honestly seems like Irving is playing for his own stats and in a way competing with LeBron for stats. Kevin Love has sacrificed his own game for the good of the team, Irving hasn't, he is still playing like he's the only one on the Cavs like his prior seasons.

Irving has all the talent in the world, but talent does not translate to mentally sound basketball and winning basketball.

JNA17
11-07-2014, 09:27 PM
Kyrie is getting so good that he deserves his own team (e.g. Westbrook), but let's be honest--he's no LeBron James. The dude's gotta go. I would say for Rondo, but Rondo probably still hates any former Heat player.

Trading Irving would be a big mistake.

Irving is 22 years old on a nice contract and is becoming a big time player in the league despite his faults. Trading him for Rondo who is much older, on a one year contract, and doesn't exactly solve all of the Cavs's problems would be the REAL downfall of the Cavs.

Let's humor the idea that the Cavs actually do trade Irving for Rondo, than what? Cavs still have a problem with front court defense and Rondo sure as hell can't fix that, they will still have a lot of chemistry issues to work with with now a whole new point guard in the mix, and your new big 3 could only play one year together.

Kevin Love: one year left on contract
Rajon Rondo: one year left on contract
Lebron James: two years left on contract

So instead of having only one player to worry about extending a contract with (Love), you now have two (Rondo), and Cleveland, let's face it, is a dump. No star player is going to sign there even with Lebron there. It never happened before pre-2010 and it won't happen with Lebron there now. The only way the Cavs can get better is through drafting and trades. And trading Irving at his nice contract and age is not how the Cavs get better both short and long term.

And worst of all, if the Cavs don't do well this year, Love could very well be gone, Rondo could be gone (humoring the idea that Irving is traded for Rondo), and then one year left of convincing Lebron to stay with the team...AGAIN! (No matter how unlikely it sounds, it's still a possibility if worst comes to worse)

I think the best thing to do is wait. New coach, a lot of new players, it's going to take time. Panicing and trading guys is not the answer unless you get obvious better talent. If the Spurs last year have taught us anything, it's keeping your talent.

Nikeman
11-07-2014, 09:30 PM
Trading Irving would be a big mistake.

Irving is 22 years old on a nice contract and is becoming a big time player in the league despite his faults. Trading him for Rondo who is much older, on a one year contract, and doesn't exactly solve all of the Cavs's problems would be the REAL downfall of the Cavs.

Let's humor the idea that the Cavs actually do trade Irving for Rondo, than what? Cavs still have a problem with front court defense and Rondo sure as hell can't fix that, they will still have a lot of chemistry issues to work with with now a whole new point guard in the mix, and your new big 3 could only play one year together.

Kevin Love: one year left on contract
Rajon Rondo: one year left on contract
Lebron James: two years left on contract

So instead of having only one player to worry about extending a contract with (Love), you now have two (Rondo), and Cleveland, let's face it, is a dump. No star player is going to sign there even with Lebron there. It never happened before pre-2010 and it won't happen with Lebron there now. The only way the Cavs can get better is through drafting and trades. And trading Irving at his nice contract and age is not how the Cavs get better both short and long term.

And worst of all, if the Cavs don't do well this year, Love could very well be gone, Rondo could be gone (humoring the idea that Irving is traded for Rondo), and then one year left of convincing Lebron to stay with the team...AGAIN! (No matter how unlikely it sounds, it's still a possibility if worst comes to worse)

I think the best thing to do is wait. New coach, a lot of new players, it's going to take time. Panicing and trading guys is not the answer unless you get obvious better talent. If the Spurs last year have taught us anything, it's keeping your talent.

First of all, define "nice contract"? Irving is on a max contract making 18+ mill, that is not a team friendly, nice contract.

Secondly, while your scenario is valid, there is no WAY that the Cavs trade Irving for Rondo without having a commitment from Rondo to re-sign.

Finally, while Love has the option to leave, I remember hearing they had some under the table deal in place to sign him to a max deal. The Cavs don't let Wiggins go without that commitment from Love.

Jeffy25
11-07-2014, 09:32 PM
This is Kyrie's team. He is the proven commodity for this franchise and won allstar game mvp last year. If Love nor Lebron want to cooperate then they can be traded.

No, this is LeBron's team, that is obvious.

JNA17
11-07-2014, 09:36 PM
First of all, define "nice contract"? Irving is on a max contract making 18+ mill, that is not a team friendly, nice contract.

Secondly, while your scenario is valid, there is no WAY that the Cavs trade Irving for Rondo without having a commitment from Rondo to re-sign.

Finally, while Love has the option to leave, I remember hearing they had some under the table deal in place to sign him to a max deal. The Cavs don't let Wiggins go without that commitment from Love.

Nice as in Irving actually be worth his money unlike most players in the league making just as much. Also Irving is still making $7 mill from his rookie contract this year and his new contract starts next year. I say with Irving's production for the past couple of years, Cavs have gotten quite the pick up.

Yeah, just like Love is committed to resigning with the Cavs and has signed a new 4/5 year extension now right?

There is no "under the table" deal. Until Love signs in the dotted line, there is no extension, and still only has one year left with the Cavs. People should have learned that by now with guys like Elton Brand and Dwight Howard.

HoopsDrive
11-07-2014, 09:41 PM
I don't see how Rondo and LeBron would be a good fit. Rondo can't shoot and LeBron needs the rock to be effective. If you have LeBron, he's your PG except on defense, and you want to have a PG that can spot up and shoot the ball well when LeBron breaks the defense down. On paper, LeBron and Kyrie is solid but Kyrie needs a reality check so he stops playing hero ball.

LeBron and Curry is the perfect match but that's not happening.

JNA17
11-07-2014, 09:44 PM
I don't see how Rondo and LeBron would be a good fit. Rondo can't shoot and LeBron needs the rock to be effective. If you have LeBron, he's your PG except on defense, and you want to have a PG that can spot up and shoot the ball well when LeBron breaks the defense down. On paper, LeBron and Kyrie is solid but Kyrie needs a reality check so he stops playing hero ball.

LeBron and Curry is the perfect match but that's not happening.

Curry and Lebron would definitely be the best combo but no way the Warriors do that as you said.

Arch Stanton
11-07-2014, 11:03 PM
I am sorry, but I disagree 100%. If I am the opposing team, and Irving "plays hero ball", I call that a won possession.

You say he "thrives at one on one basketball". Last time I checked, the NBA is 5 vs 5 basketball. Not 1 v 1. Sure Irving can probably take most players at off the dribble, but he also has 7 footers waiting at the rim to contest his shot.

The amount of times I've seen Irving bring the ball up the court and take a shot without a single pass is borderline ridiculous. There are stretches of games he makes LeBron look like a spectator.

It honestly seems like Irving is playing for his own stats and in a way competing with LeBron for stats. Kevin Love has sacrificed his own game for the good of the team, Irving hasn't, he is still playing like he's the only one on the Cavs like his prior seasons.

Irving has all the talent in the world, but talent does not translate to mentally sound basketball and winning basketball.

That's not my point, I'm refutting your notion that he is not good enough to break down defenses. Just because he has a history of playing "hero ball" doesn't mean he can't take his man off the dribble or adapt his game going forward. Like I said, it's only four games in. Miami started slow in 2010 as they adjusted to each other. It may take longer with this team, but I think they can certainly find the chemistry that they need to be successful.

amos1er
11-07-2014, 11:03 PM
Hope he doesn't jack up more shots than both Lebron and Love again. My fantasy team can't take any more of this guy and his antics. I need Love to score more damn it!!!

ohreally
11-08-2014, 12:07 AM
Well, it always seemed to me that Kyrie was overrated, but he did well in international play. Just funny how quickly people change their tune. LeBron's usage isn't that far off from what it was with Miami, and his assists are down too.

In Irving's defense, scoring is his game, and he hasn't come into his own yet. And now people are saying he has to sacrifice what he is. Which would really be sacrificing his future. I can fully understand why such a young highly touted player would resist becoming a third wheel relying on the weaker part of his game.

koreancabbage
11-08-2014, 12:16 PM
Irving is getting more and more overrated. This exposure he is getting is finally making people realize how overrated he is.

I thought he had potential but if you can't make a jumpshot in the NBA, you gotta do other things like rebound, defend, pass. He can't do any of that right now.

there was potential for a big 3. But its more of a big 2.

Love and Lebron. and a bunch of good role players.

Meaze_Gibson
11-08-2014, 04:24 PM
How is it that Kyrie plays a playmaker role exceptionally well in fiba games, with other stars, and does not play well with Bron?

LOL Kyrie has passed the ball more than Bron this year. Its on NBA.com go look it up. He is top 20 in passes but yet he is the reason Cavs are losing. Its not because Love cannot guard anyone nor attempt to show help defense. Its not because Bron refuses to take advantage of his strength and post up rather than fade to the perimeter. Also Bron is playing poor defense this year but let us ignore that too.

They are all playing bad yet Kyrie ends up with the blame. The cavaliers lost the first game cause of bron. the second game because of Love/Kyrie. The Jazz game because of Love being outplayed by Derrick Favors but yet its Kyrie fault? I would say i can't wait till he leaves but then the "no help" excuse will arise. Can't win for losing with Lebron I tell you.

IBleedPurple
11-08-2014, 08:26 PM
He needs to pass and stop acting like WestbrookThis. Everyone knows his abilities, but with LBJ and Love coming to your team, you have to adjust.

Kyben36
11-08-2014, 08:49 PM
I think the major issue has been defense, Kyrie is terrible defensivly, Waiters is not any better, and Love is not an anchor, V is the only guy who seems to try (outside of lebron) and he still isnt that good. definitly not good enough to make up for all their mistakes. i also think that Waiters and Iriving are going to be problems in the locker room. but thats just me

Jeffy25
11-09-2014, 03:56 AM
Every time that Love has taken as many shots as Kyrie, the Cavs have won.

kozelkid
11-09-2014, 05:49 AM
Cav's in the Final's... all of this is horse crap.

Lbj just wants control of the team, so he can decide if they win or lose on any given night. So he has to break his other star players down to do so; they'll go on a 20 game win streak and all will be forgotten.

Same thing he did in the HEAT vs Mav's Final's when Wade would have won the Final's MVP. Don't listen to the noise people, there is NO story here.
Take off the tin hat. It's suppressing all the blood flow to your brain.

archdevil84
11-09-2014, 09:54 AM
Kyrie just has to fit in the role that wade took with lebron. Going back in handling the ball and becoming more of bal player with a high FG% like wade did

IndyRealist
11-09-2014, 10:55 AM
Kyrie just has to fit in the role that wade took with lebron. Going back in handling the ball and becoming more of bal player with a high FG% like wade did

Thing is, Wade has always been a high FG% guy, even when injured. Irving never has.

koreancabbage
11-09-2014, 11:06 AM
he is the Chris Bosh of this team lol.

cept, he wasn't a very efficient scorer (and thats what he does best) and he hasn't learned to play nice or count on others as he's always been the 'best' player on his teams thus far in the NBA. With an influx of talent and set roles on this team now, Irving is struggling to adjust to his new role.

benny01
11-09-2014, 04:29 PM
Wade and Bosh are better basketball players than Irving and Love. Stats be damned, Bosh and Wade are smarter, more dynamic/versatile, and more skilled than Irving and Love.

Love is not a very well rounded player, but gets absurd amounts of credit with stat geeks because he's efficient and shoots and boards at a high rate. He's the perfect example of a case where stats lie. The things he does well look really good on a piece of paper, and the things he does poorly don't really show up statistically.

Irving is just doing what he does. He's young and he needs to learn how to play with talent around him. I don't get the hero ball knock though, that's a trait that any Lebron-led team needs to have to win big games. Take it with a grain of salt, but somebody has to have the courage and confidence to put shots up when none are available, someone has to put themselves out there in big moments, which isn't really Bron's thing. Irving does need to be more efficient and look to get guys involved more early though.
That being said, when we get 30 games into the season this isn't gonna be a -500 team anyway. Even if they are terrible to their standards, the Cavs are a second round exit at worst. The whole things kinda mute.

sheesh
11-09-2014, 08:12 PM
I don't really believe in "star" point guards. Give me a Parker or Paul who are more concerned with running their offense than being the man.

Tony_Starks
11-09-2014, 08:39 PM
Kyrie is the new Bosh or Wade even. All he needs to know is when Cleveland folds it's going to be all his fault.

koreancabbage
11-09-2014, 08:46 PM
Kyrie is the new Bosh or Wade even. All he needs to know is when Cleveland folds it's going to be all his fault.

except he wasn't an established star before, like Wade or Bosh.

Tony_Starks
11-09-2014, 09:04 PM
except he wasn't an established star before, like Wade or Bosh.

I don't know about that. He was a star in the eyes of many. Allstar, MVP on team USA this summer, easily top 10 pg in the game....etc

koreancabbage
11-09-2014, 09:09 PM
I don't know about that. He was a star in the eyes of many. Allstar, MVP on team USA this summer, easily top 10 pg in the game....etc

not in the NBA. best player on bad team syndrone.

he still has a lot of ways to go to being an established star. He has the attitude, potential, and flashy game that a lot of fans like

but he hasn't established himself as a NBA player, especially when he is playing with a lot more talent nowadays.

Cavalife
11-10-2014, 01:18 PM
It's crazy to think Irving's going to be the reason this team doesn't succeed. Does anyone remember when James was in Miami? Those guys were killed and so many reasons as to why they weren't succeeding early on. Then when it got playoff time, they unfortunately went to the Finals, but fortunately the Cavs drafted Kyrie that year, so I'm all good. This team needs to get used to each other and learn how to play like champions before they can become champions.

SportsFanatic10
11-10-2014, 01:27 PM
irving has to adjust, and i think he will, just needs time.

ewing
11-10-2014, 01:42 PM
I don't really believe in "star" point guards. Give me a Parker or Paul who are more concerned with running their offense than being the man.

those guys are stars.

ewing
11-10-2014, 01:44 PM
I don't know about that. He was a star in the eyes of many. Allstar, MVP on team USA this summer, easily top 10 pg in the game....etc


yeah, the tide as really turned on this guy. I never thought he was that good but man did people talk him up during the off season on here

Stinkyoutsider
11-10-2014, 02:05 PM
I think Lebron and Irving are looking similar to Wade and James when Wade gave Lebron the keys to the team and told him to lead. Lebron wants Irving to take those same steps and lead this team but Irving is ready for it yet. Instead, Irving is still playing his game which he had to play last year (shoot first point guard).

We'll have a better idea whether Kyrie can handle the role that Lebron wants him to take on after this first season together. Especially when it comes to the playoffs.

I had a feeling that Love would become a Bosh-type 3rd option and he's doing this so far (strictly a jumpshooter on offense). Coach Blatt needs to continue to work the strategy of the team to get Love more touches in the post.

Lebron will feel the pressure late this regular season and in the playoffs. He's a champion now so he understands how fast a window for opportunity closes shut. If Irving doesn't take the leadership role, I believe Lebron will take over completely. The goal for James is to win by any means necessary in the end...

Lil Rhody
11-10-2014, 02:18 PM
Trade him for rondo straight up hahaha

AIRMAR72
11-10-2014, 05:38 PM
He needs to pass and stop acting like Westbrook and Kobe Bryant and carmelo

Hawkeye15
11-10-2014, 06:53 PM
yeah, the tide as really turned on this guy. I never thought he was that good but man did people talk him up during the off season on here

eh, a lot of people also said he was not a star. He makes Harden look good on defense, and was a straight up, me 1st, 2nd, and 3rd player so far. Irving is nice, but I think he has huge need for growth before he is a star player.

Jeffy25
11-10-2014, 08:39 PM
Kyrie just keeps on shooting........and they are losing


Will he learn to stop chucking so much?

The big 3 are currently 3 out of 12 so far tonight

FlashBolt
11-10-2014, 10:43 PM
This is not fair. Kyrie is still learning the system and trying to become the 2nd option for LeBron. If I remember correctly, Miami had huge issues their first season. People need to be patient. It's almost as if Spurs lost Duncan and Parker and had their roster half replaced.. you can't tell me they wouldn't have some issues.

ewing
11-10-2014, 10:46 PM
This is not fair. Kyrie is still learning the system and trying to become the 2nd option for LeBron. If I remember correctly, Miami had huge issues their first season. People need to be patient. It's almost as if Spurs lost Duncan and Parker and had their roster half replaced.. you can't tell me they wouldn't have some issues.

the cavs will be a hell of an offensive team. I don't see how that couldn't be but it is fun to see them struggle

FlashBolt
11-10-2014, 10:53 PM
the cavs will be a hell of an offensive team. I don't see how that couldn't be but it is fun to see them struggle

It is fun to see how they adjust thus far but they will be SCARY if they can figure out their formula. I actually think Waiters should be traded for a defender or someone like Ray Allen who can shoot and defend from anywhere. Waiters defense is surprisingly really good because he's so dedicated to the game, but he's just too much of an offensive liability for this team. He would excel in the Lakers, IMO. Cleveland should have traded Waiters for Shumpert when they had the opportunity.

Yanks All Day
11-10-2014, 11:13 PM
Kyrie Irving will be the reason why the Big 3 will be so successful. He's one of the top 6-7 guys in the whole league who can take over games single handedly. Cleveland is basically an entirely new team playing under an NBA rookie coach. It'll take time to gel, just like it took Miami time. But they're too talented not to succeed. It's just a learning curve. Once the Cavs figure out their roles and get the formula down, they're going to be scary good.

JordansBulls
11-10-2014, 11:20 PM
except he wasn't an established star before, like Wade or Bosh.

He is, he won allstar game mvp. Lebron joined forces with guys who did that the season after winning allstar game mvp.