PDA

View Full Version : Do people still think Mark Jackson was a good coach?



Chronz
11-03-2014, 02:35 PM
Been watching alot of GSW games and the difference in how they attack, even this early in the season, is abundantly clear. Now I know the limitations of small sample sizes but I think we can all agree that GS underachieved offensively last year, and if the early play is any indication of their systematic changes, then they will FINALLY be an elite offensive team under the Curry regime. My question is, can you still hold the opinion that MJ did a good job if Kerr does a MUCH better job? I always felt like Jackson was the guy holding them back.

Goose17
11-03-2014, 03:01 PM
Jackson was a below average offensive coach. A good defensive coach. And a players coach, not a GMs coach.

With a few more years experience and higher caliber assistants he could be a top 10-15 active coach.

Just my opinion.

D-Leethal
11-03-2014, 03:13 PM
Come on guy...


LOL. Anyone who thinks we know anything about anyone this early in, doesn't know the history of the game.

NYKnickFanatic
11-03-2014, 03:28 PM
So you're saying if Steve Kerr does a better job with the Warriors, Mark Jackson was a bad coach...?

curtcocaine
11-03-2014, 03:31 PM
This guy.

Ares
11-03-2014, 03:33 PM
Always thought he was an idiot but I never watched a Warrior game last year so I can't comment on his coaching.

Chronz
11-03-2014, 04:02 PM
Come on guy...
Reading is fun.


Now I know the limitations of small sample sizes but I think we can all agree that GS underachieved offensively last year, and if the early play is any indication of their systematic changes, then they will FINALLY be an elite offensive team under the Curry regime. My question is, can you still hold the opinion that MJ did a good job if Kerr does a MUCH better job? I always felt like Jackson was the guy holding them back.


We are ASSUMING this continues for the purposes of this thread, I fully understand how meaningless the sample size is, its why I mentioned that in the opening post.

FAIL.

Munkeysuit
11-03-2014, 04:03 PM
I honestly think he had them drooling over Iggy...and now in this new system, Iggy looks like he doesn't even know what he's doing.

Chronz
11-03-2014, 04:11 PM
So you're saying if Steve Kerr does a better job with the Warriors, Mark Jackson was a bad coach...?
Not just a good job, but a transformative job IMO.

Lets say Kerr is a good coach, simply good, not elite but good. Doesn't that make Jackson mediocre? This guy was getting COY praise from lots of people, for doing what? Being average? Underachieving given his talent?

KINGPIN 2-6
11-03-2014, 04:28 PM
Been watching alot of GSW games and the difference in how they attack, even this early in the season, is abundantly clear. Now I know the limitations of small sample sizes but I think we can all agree that GS underachieved offensively last year, and if the early play is any indication of their systematic changes, then they will FINALLY be an elite offensive team under the Curry regime. My question is, can you still hold the opinion that MJ did a good job if Kerr does a MUCH better job? I always felt like Jackson was the guy holding them back.

A lot??? 3 games into the season?

Mark Jackson did fine, injuries to Lee and Bogut in the playoffs is what held GS back

Goose17
11-03-2014, 04:35 PM
Let's also take into consideration that Alvin Gentry is ten times the assistant that any of Jacksons ever were, Ron Adams is also underrated by most "fans".

I think Jacksons biggest issue (aside from not being able to coach the offense to an average level), is his attitude towards other people aside from his players. I wonder how good he would have been (or still could be) if he himself was more "coachable", if he had assistants of the same caliber as Kerr does and had been more open minded to their attempts to pass on knowledge.

Coach Kerr's interpersonal skills certainly trump Jacksons, coaching ability is still up for debate. Let's wait and see how Kerr does over three years in comparison to Jackson.

I expect three playoff seasons, two of which have to be at least second round series if not deeper. The problem with a lot of people thinking/assuming Kerr is better already (no idea why they're doing that), is that he is now going to be held to a higher standard, which isn't really fair on him.

If you fire a coach who lead you to two playoff runs, one that pushed the Clippers to seven games and came down to the last 60 seconds, another that pushed the Spurs to six games in a tough second round match up. Then you better replace him with someone that can get you further.


I feel Jackson took us as far as he could, whether or not Kerr can take us further remains to be seen however.

Chronz
11-03-2014, 04:35 PM
A lot??? 3 games into the season?

Mark Jackson did fine, injuries to Lee and Bogut in the playoffs is what held GS back

Been watching their pre-season closely as well, there are alot of changes in their attack/rotations.

What held them back during the regular season tho? MJ's isos is what.

Bruno
11-03-2014, 04:39 PM
I think Kerr is better.

I don't think coach Jackson is professional enough to provide enough stability for a championship level team.

in his defense, missing bogut in the playoffs was huge. Kerr will have similar success, maybe one round deeper with nogut. I think GSW are a dark horse for the finals if their core is healthy in the post-season.

IKnowHoops
11-03-2014, 05:11 PM
I think Jackson was a good coach. Remember, Steph and Klay are improving every year, especially Klay. Some other young guys are improving too. The team is better this year than last year. So its a little unfair to dismiss that when comparing how teams produce when you expect Steph to be an MVP candidate this year and Klay to be a good margin better than last year.

That being said, Mark probably had some offensive deficiencies but I don't know enough about the team to comment really. All I know is they were a lot worse before he got there.

KINGPIN 2-6
11-03-2014, 05:34 PM
Been watching their pre-season closely as well, there are alot of changes in their attack/rotations.

What held them back during the regular season tho? MJ's isos is what.

I hear you but at the same time I think we can agree that the pre-season product usually differs vastly from the regular season product (rotations, sets, minutes, competition, etc)....I like what I see from Kerr and GS so far, BUT, I'm not prepared to put all the blame on MJ.

* On a side note, I don't think MJ is a "bad" coach, but if Kerr gets like 58-62 wins his 1st year, I would say MJ was just using the wrong plays with the wrong players. His system might have thrived elsewhere. There's a LONNNGGG season ahead of us. We shall see.

Chromehounds
11-03-2014, 05:51 PM
I think Jackson was a good coach. Remember, Steph and Klay are improving every year, especially Klay. Some other young guys are improving too. The team is better this year than last year. So its a little unfair to dismiss that when comparing how teams produce when you expect Steph to be an MVP candidate this year and Klay to be a good margin better than last year.

That being said, Mark probably had some offensive deficiencies but I don't know enough about the team to comment really. All I know is they were a lot worse before he got there.

So what are you saying? The W's have been winning because of the talented roster? :cool:

And BTW one minor correction, the W's have been a lot worse before Curry, Klay and Bogut showed up. ;)

JasonJohnHorn
11-03-2014, 05:53 PM
It seems like he knew how to get his players to be invested in the system, which is 9/10s of the battle. That last 10th can be the difference between contending and a first or second round exit.

Jackson underachieved last year, but overachieved the year before. But I think Klay is just coming into his own, that that is something Kerr has that Jackson didn't. And Curry has a level of play and confidence that he likely hasn't had before.

I think this team should have done better last year, and Kerr is doing great so far, but we'll see as the season goes along. Perhaps Kerr won't be as good a defensive coach, and that may hurt him down the stretch. Perhaps he'll be great.


All I know is I want to see these guys are their max potential. They got something special in GSWland.

Ezio
11-03-2014, 06:04 PM
Let's also take into consideration that Alvin Gentry is ten times the assistant that any of Jacksons ever were, Ron Adams is also underrated by most "fans".

I think Jacksons biggest issue (aside from not being able to coach the offense to an average level), is his attitude towards other people aside from his players. I wonder how good he would have been (or still could be) if he himself was more "coachable", if he had assistants of the same caliber as Kerr does and had been more open minded to their attempts to pass on knowledge.

Coach Kerr's interpersonal skills certainly trump Jacksons, coaching ability is still up for debate. Let's wait and see how Kerr does over three years in comparison to Jackson.

I expect three playoff seasons, two of which have to be at least second round series if not deeper. The problem with a lot of people thinking/assuming Kerr is better already (no idea why they're doing that), is that he is now going to be held to a higher standard, which isn't really fair on him.

If you fire a coach who lead you to two playoff runs, one that pushed the Clippers to seven games and came down to the last 60 seconds, another that pushed the Spurs to six games in a tough second round match up. Then you better replace him with someone that can get you further.


I feel Jackson took us as far as he could, whether or not Kerr can take us further remains to be seen however.

I miss this guy sitting on the Bulls bench :sigh:

Chromehounds
11-03-2014, 06:16 PM
Been watching alot of GSW games and the difference in how they attack, even this early in the season, is abundantly clear. Now I know the limitations of small sample sizes but I think we can all agree that GS underachieved offensively last year, and if the early play is any indication of their systematic changes, then they will FINALLY be an elite offensive team under the Curry regime. My question is, can you still hold the opinion that MJ did a good job if Kerr does a MUCH better job? I always felt like Jackson was the guy holding them back.

True this is an extremely small sample size, we'll have to wait for additional data points. With that said, it does give me hope that this "Kerr" guy is attempting to put a system in place. An organization has to start somewhere, a structured organization with talents can become a fearsome franchise.
Back to Jackson, it is known now that Jackson was clueless on the offense. After he was fired, a few reports were leaked on his approach to the game. Lack of game planning, zero to no real practice; it was like frat house party during their practices according to one of the reports. IMO Jackson didn't lead the W's to two playoffs, it's more like Curry, Klay and Bogut did the heavy lifting. Heck, Keith Smart could have achieved the same accolades.
Regarding Kerr, I'll hold judgement until further into the season, or maybe after the season, after all it's his first year at coaching. And I understand he inherited a talented roster, unfair or not he will be held to a different standard.

Crackadalic
11-03-2014, 06:28 PM
GS look like title contenders under Kerr

Curry for MVP

Jackson's issue was he was just a good motivator and nothing more.

JEDean89
11-03-2014, 09:32 PM
Not only is 3 games a small sample size, but their opponents have a combined record of 3 wins 7 losses. That being said, Kerr is the one that got away for us Knicks fans. He had years of seasoning and a more expansive repetoire of apprenticeships than Fisher. He imo, was the perfect coach to take Phil's system and update it to the modern game. Kerr is gonna improve the Warriors no doubt. I didn't really like Jackson, not just because I'm a Denver fan but because of his demeanor as a player and a coach. I think the Warriors made a bold and excellent move. We will see how much this team improves under him, but when they get to revamp the roster with tons of cap space and build fresh around Klay and Curry, then they can become the true contenders. Lee and Bogut just aren't gonna get it done in the West, look at the frontcourts.

sf-fanatic
11-03-2014, 11:06 PM
I think Jackson had a similar problem as Harbaugh with the 49ers. He is EXTREMELY hard to work with if you arent a player. Unlike Harbaugh, Jackson loves the praise from the media as you can tell the assistant coaches that got praise, he didn't get along with or were pushed aside. How do you coach a team and alienate an assistant coach and not talk to him for months ? That being said he got the players to buy into his "system" or lack of but the players certainly responded well to his coaching.

tredigs
11-03-2014, 11:18 PM
Klay and Curry attack now, and Curry gets a ton of looks off the ball. Once the bench (particularly Livingston) gets some time to gel together and D. Lee comes back, they should produce very well on that end. The best part of the team is their D, though. Barbosa has a 96 D Rating right now... which ranks last on the team. They're just locked in on that end more than I've seen before.

But yeah, no team in the NBA made less passes than the Warriors last season. Seeing their ball movement this season is night and day.

TrueFan420
11-03-2014, 11:59 PM
Let's also take into consideration that Alvin Gentry is ten times the assistant that any of Jacksons ever were, Ron Adams is also underrated by most "fans".

I think Jacksons biggest issue (aside from not being able to coach the offense to an average level), is his attitude towards other people aside from his players. I wonder how good he would have been (or still could be) if he himself was more "coachable", if he had assistants of the same caliber as Kerr does and had been more open minded to their attempts to pass on knowledge.

Coach Kerr's interpersonal skills certainly trump Jacksons, coaching ability is still up for debate. Let's wait and see how Kerr does over three years in comparison to Jackson.

I expect three playoff seasons, two of which have to be at least second round series if not deeper. The problem with a lot of people thinking/assuming Kerr is better already (no idea why they're doing that), is that he is now going to be held to a higher standard, which isn't really fair on him.

If you fire a coach who lead you to two playoff runs, one that pushed the Clippers to seven games and came down to the last 60 seconds, another that pushed the Spurs to six games in a tough second round match up. Then you better replace him with someone that can get you further.


I feel Jackson took us as far as he could, whether or not Kerr can take us further remains to be seen however.

Not true Malone was a great assistant and considered a fantastic defensive mind. Jackson didn't have the personality that could handle other very good coaches speaking their mind to him about his game plan. Yes Malone was offered a head coaching job but he wasn't replaced and many speculated it was because of his personality. Especially after the whole ordeal with the white mamba came out.

moshy2
11-04-2014, 12:28 AM
It's funny to think that the Warriors used to be a team that could score but needed coaching on the defensive end. Now we have the defense, just need the right system and coaching on offense. I think Jackson was a big part in changing that philosophy, which is why I'm happy he was our coach. However, there's too much talent on offense to struggle as much as we did at times last season and it was clear we couldn't go much farther with that system. Insert Kerr. I think we'll see progression in our offense this year like we've seen in the 3 games thus far. The question was can we keep the same level of defense that Jackson had us playing at last year, and thus far, it's looked rock solid especially inside. I do credit Jackson a lot for changing our philosophy and that's why I think he's a good coach just needs some fine tuning

Meaze_Gibson
11-04-2014, 12:32 AM
Under Jackson, Curry evolved into an elite pg, Klay turned into a multidimensional scorer and above average defender and the Warriors became a formidable nba opponent. Without the injuries to Bogut, I think they would have beat Clips. Through player development, record strength, and playoff success alone, Jackson is a good coach. Kerr is can still be a good coach as well but instead of player development, his strength maybe structure.

However, I am very skeptical of this Kerr offense. I feel that it is too guard heavy and wont work in the playoffs.

Goose17
11-04-2014, 03:53 AM
Not true Malone was a great assistant and considered a fantastic defensive mind. Jackson didn't have the personality that could handle other very good coaches speaking their mind to him about his game plan. Yes Malone was offered a head coaching job but he wasn't replaced and many speculated it was because of his personality. Especially after the whole ordeal with the white mamba came out.

I was talking about offensively. Jacksons offense was pretty awful but hi defense was solid.

If he had a guy like Gentry I would be interested to see what would have happened.

And I already said Jacksons interpersonal skills and lack of ability to be "coached" were an issue dint I? Or did you not bother reading my entire post? Why repeat something I already said as if its a rebuttle :/

And yeah, Malone is a great coach. I liked him. Defensive mastermind.

Kings were 23rd in the league last year for defensive efficiency according to Hollinger. Warriors were 3rd.

Talent or coaching?

TrueFan420
11-04-2014, 11:41 AM
I was talking about offensively. Jacksons offense was pretty awful but hi defense was solid.

If he had a guy like Gentry I would be interested to see what would have happened.

And I already said Jacksons interpersonal skills and lack of ability to be "coached" were an issue dint I? Or did you not bother reading my entire post? Why repeat something I already said as if its a rebuttle :/

And yeah, Malone is a great coach. I liked him. Defensive mastermind.

Kings were 23rd in the league last year for defensive efficiency according to Hollinger. Warriors were 3rd.

Talent or coaching?

One you didnt specify offensive you just said assistant. Two I felt like reenforcing it even tho you are in agreement (it was more for the reg NBA fans that don't know as much about our in working). Three it's always been a combination of talent and coaching. I'm still in shock at what he's done with Rudy Gay.

arlubas
11-04-2014, 01:57 PM
Haven't watched any GSW games this season to compare but I can say with certainty that Mark Jackson held them back on offense, given the firepower they have on their squad. On the other hand he managed to turn a notoriously bad defensive roster into a good one, so he gets my props on that department.

Chromehounds
11-04-2014, 02:05 PM
I think Jackson had a similar problem as Harbaugh with the 49ers. He is EXTREMELY hard to work with if you arent a player. Unlike Harbaugh, Jackson loves the praise from the media as you can tell the assistant coaches that got praise, he didn't get along with or were pushed aside. How do you coach a team and alienate an assistant coach and not talk to him for months ? That being said he got the players to buy into his "system" or lack of but the players certainly responded well to his coaching.

Jackson is no where near Harbaugh's level lets get that out of the way, but with that I agree with your singularity statement "a similar problem" they both are "hard to work with".

Goose17
11-04-2014, 02:21 PM
One you didnt specify offensive you just said assistant.

I thought it was obvious because we were discussing his offensive flaws. I find it interesting that when Jackson was coach Malone and the other assistants got a lot of the credit but Kerr is automatically being hailed as an offensive genius despite the fact his assistants are well proven coaches within their own right, especially Gentry in terms of offense.

Either way it doesn't matter, we've cleared it up now.

Chromehounds
11-04-2014, 02:36 PM
Under Jackson, Curry evolved into an elite pg, Klay turned into a multidimensional scorer and above average defender and the Warriors became a formidable nba opponent. Without the injuries to Bogut, I think they would have beat Clips. Through player development, record strength, and playoff success alone, Jackson is a good coach. Kerr is can still be a good coach as well but instead of player development, his strength maybe structure.

However, I am very skeptical of this Kerr offense. I feel that it is too guard heavy and wont work in the playoffs.

I'm not sure what team you've been watching but saying Jackson molded Curry into an elite PG and transformed Klay into a multidimensional player is ludicrous. Klay has always been quick for his size, with a quick release and accurate shots. Same goes for Curry with his shooting and the addition of clever ball handling/ passing. For the past two years we've seen and hear people complaining that Curry should stop with his carelessness passing the wound-up passes, not a peep from Jackson. Then Klay getting stuck on the 3pt line with Jackson encouragement to keep shooting. Remember the "Thanks God for the Green Light" comment?
Under a few weeks with Kerr, Klay is attacking the basket like he's MJ himself (Jordan that is). OK might be pushing it there with the comparison, but it's a noticeable change in Klay demeanor.
So please, Jackson was more likely responsible for stunting the W's growth than anything else. However not all are negative I do give Jackson credit on his first year with the W's, some will role their eyes here, but I do believe Jackson talked them kids up in his first year and made them believe in themselves. Us against the world cliche, but then again cliches can only go so far.

TrueFan420
11-04-2014, 02:38 PM
I thought it was obvious because we were discussing his offensive flaws. I find it interesting that when Jackson was coach Malone and the other assistants got a lot of the credit but Kerr is automatically being hailed as an offensive genius despite the fact his assistants are well proven coaches within their own right, especially Gentry in terms of offense.

Either way it doesn't matter, we've cleared it up now.

I think Jackson got a lot of credit by the media at first as well. It wasn't till down the line where they started question his abilities as a coach. As for Kerr you're right amongst the media and outsiders but I think most warrior fans recognize the help he's recieving. And the smarter ones are holding judgement till down the road. Even tho he does appear to have started off convincingly well. Credit can't properly be doled out till we see a larger body of work.

They are also contrasting coaches, one offensive the other defensive. How Kerr does on defense to Jackson on offense will be interesting for me to see.

Also remember Kerr hired gentry to coach the Suns because they see eye to eye on the offensive side of the ball. Whether or not Gentry is the driving force at the moment behind the technical stuff is irrelevant to me if Kerr can learn it and improve it before Gentry leaves to be a head coach again. What I'm interested to see is what he takes from Adams as a coach and if he can build upon it as they are different in their approaches.

TrueFan420
11-04-2014, 02:46 PM
I'm not sure what team you've been watching but saying Jackson molded Curry into an elite PG and transformed Klay into a multidimensional player is ludicrous. Klay has always been quick for his size, with a quick release and accurate shots. Same goes for Curry with his shooting and the addition of clever ball handling/ passing. For the past two years we've seen and hear people complaining that Curry should stop with his carelessness passing the wound-up passes, not a peep from Jackson. Then Klay getting stuck on the 3pt line with Jackson encouragement to keep shooting. Remember the "Thanks God for the Green Light" comment?
Under a few weeks with Kerr, Klay is attacking the basket like he's MJ himself (Jordan that is). OK might be pushing it there with the comparison, but it's a noticeable change in Klay demeanor.
So please, Jackson was more likely responsible for stunting the W's growth than anything else. However not all are negative I do give Jackson credit on his first year with the W's, some will role their eyes here, but I do believe Jackson talked them kids up in his first year and made them believe in themselves. Us against the world cliche, but then again cliches can only go so far.

There's no question the fact that he lacked enginuity on the offensive side of the game. But I won't completely throw him under the bus or credit him for the growth or stunted growth of curry/klay. Same goes for Kerr or any coach outside of the absolute elite pop. Curry and Klay were going to improve and have improved each and every year whether it shows in their statistics or not. its more for role players where you see a coaching having a massive impact.

BKLYNpigeon
11-04-2014, 03:14 PM
just look at it this way. If Mark Jackson was that good of a coach, why didn't het get any offers this summer for a coaching position?

TrueFan420
11-04-2014, 03:32 PM
just look at it this way. If Mark Jackson was that good of a coach, why didn't het get any offers this summer for a coaching position?

While that is a valid point it's not completely fair. He was specifically after the new york job and that wasn't happening as long as phill was there for a couple of reason. I see him taking a job next year but I doubt it's with a contender like he wants.

Goose17
11-04-2014, 03:40 PM
If he was that bad would he have kept his job for three years?

TrueFan420
11-04-2014, 04:08 PM
If he was that bad would he have kept his job for three years?

Agreed. He wasn't great but he wasn't rubbish. He was solid just not the type of coach (at least in my mind) that will ever be good enough to lead a team to the finals. He did well in the transitioning years but at the next level didn't stack up. Honestly same could be said for Scott Brooks and how OKC hasn't fired him is beyond me.

Goose17
11-04-2014, 04:15 PM
Agreed. He wasn't great but he wasn't rubbish. He was solid just not the type of coach (at least in my mind) that will ever be good enough to lead a team to the finals. He did well in the transitioning years but at the next level didn't stack up. Honestly same could be said for Scott Brooks and how OKC hasn't fired him is beyond me.

Yeah I pretty much agree with all of that. Well, everything about Jackson anyway. Not sure what to make of Brooks.

sf-fanatic
11-04-2014, 05:29 PM
If he was that bad would he have kept his job for three years?

To be fair it would be crazy for management to fire Jackson (a rookie coach with hype) after 1 year. 3 years seems like the standard length for a new coach to see if it's going to work or not. If Jackson is fired after 1 year, young coaches won't want to work for the Warriors. Sometimes it takes over 1 year to establish and system and 2-3 years to build the team and bring in your own players.

Goose17
11-04-2014, 05:33 PM
To be fair it would be crazy for management to fire Jackson (a rookie coach with hype) after 1 year. 3 years seems like the standard length for a new coach to see if it's going to work or not. If Jackson is fired after 1 year, young coaches won't want to work for the Warriors. Sometimes it takes over 1 year to establish and system and 2-3 years to build the team and bring in your own players.

Rookie coaches and veteran coaches have been fired quicker than three years. He must have been doing something right in their eyes.

xxplayerxx23
11-04-2014, 06:00 PM
Jackson seemed to run mostly ISO offense. I think he was a good defensive coach and a motivator but his offensive scheme or lack of one was the downfall. Don't think he was to good of a coach tbh

nastynice
11-05-2014, 09:36 PM
I got love for Jackson, cuz he was the HNIC when the dubs came back to relevance. But, one problem with him is, there was always these HUGE stretches of offensive ineptitude during all our games. It would usually be in the 3rd quarter. I don't know what the numbers were, but I'm sure all dubs fans know exactly what I'm talking about. It would just be the ugliest offense ever, iso ball with everyone standing around and just throwing up a hail mary shot with 5 sec left on the shot clock.

likemystylez
11-29-2014, 12:40 PM
I'm not sure what team you've been watching but saying Jackson molded Curry into an elite PG and transformed Klay into a multidimensional player is ludicrous. Klay has always been quick for his size, with a quick release and accurate shots. Same goes for Curry with his shooting and the addition of clever ball handling/ passing. For the past two years we've seen and hear people complaining that Curry should stop with his carelessness passing the wound-up passes, not a peep from Jackson. Then Klay getting stuck on the 3pt line with Jackson encouragement to keep shooting. Remember the "Thanks God for the Green Light" comment?
Under a few weeks with Kerr, Klay is attacking the basket like he's MJ himself (Jordan that is). OK might be pushing it there with the comparison, but it's a noticeable change in Klay demeanor.
So please, Jackson was more likely responsible for stunting the W's growth than anything else. However not all are negative I do give Jackson credit on his first year with the W's, some will role their eyes here, but I do believe Jackson talked them kids up in his first year and made them believe in themselves. Us against the world cliche, but then again cliches can only go so far.

This post is becoming painfully clear as the season unfolds. Jackson was holding this level of talent back. The fact that jackson won more games than the warriors had won for the 20 yrs before he got there- was not a testament to jacksons ability to coach- it had a lot more to do with the massive upgrade in talent over previous years. (I mean a few yrs earlier- they had 6 of their 8 rotation players fresh out of the d league)- jackson on the other hand had 6 players who have been to all star games in his rotation.... yeah he should be winning a lot more games

likemystylez
11-29-2014, 12:42 PM
I got love for Jackson, cuz he was the HNIC when the dubs came back to relevance. But, one problem with him is, there was always these HUGE stretches of offensive ineptitude during all our games. It would usually be in the 3rd quarter. I don't know what the numbers were, but I'm sure all dubs fans know exactly what I'm talking about. It would just be the ugliest offense ever, iso ball with everyone standing around and just throwing up a hail mary shot with 5 sec left on the shot clock.

if the other team blitzed curry- they significantly increased their chances of winning and even after it happening repeatedly- jackson didnt even try to make adjustments... it was like he just expected curry to eventually start making those tough 30 foot shots regularly. Some games it worked because curry is THAT good and their defense was solid- but there is soooo much offensive talent on that team- theres really no good reason to ever settle for a bad shot against ANY defense

likemystylez
11-29-2014, 12:46 PM
Rookie coaches and veteran coaches have been fired quicker than three years. He must have been doing something right in their eyes.

ownership assembled a team talented enough to be a top 4 team in the west (thats evident this year and the west is even tougher)- also the warriors are without david lee.

Jackson elected to lose games to inferior opponents- lakers, Knicks, Cavs twice, bobcats twice, denver, t wolves etc. (a lot of those were home games).

Kerr has gotten the message from management that winning at a high rate is whats expected of him. The fact that jackson put a goal of JUST 50 wins for a team capable of winning 60- makes me think he did not get the message from management.

DoMeFavors
11-29-2014, 12:51 PM
horrible coach I mean absolutely horrible coach, but did have a confidence about himself and a trust from his players who seemed to really like and respect him. So you cant take that away from him. But all around Mark was a bad coach and that was proven.

likemystylez
11-29-2014, 12:56 PM
horrible coach I mean absolutely horrible coach, but did have a confidence about himself and a trust from his players who seemed to really like and respect him. So you cant take that away from him. But all around Mark was a bad coach and that was proven.

its being proven every game- its early in the young season- but steve kerr has won every single game that mark jackson lost last year so far. The thunder game, and both of the bobcats games were losses under mark jackson... that and steve kerr is doing it without david lee.

In addition to just the wins and losses- the warriors have won all but 2 or 3 of their games by double digits and basically sat the starters most of the second half- jackson use to play down to inferrior opponents and make every game a tough game by not making adjustments- sometimes they squeaked by and won and other times they lost to garbage teams. Kerr appears as though he just wants to kill the other teams hope of winning early and just coast through the second half- its just easier on everybody that way

TrueFan420
11-29-2014, 03:15 PM
Jackson elected to lose games to inferior opponents- lakers, Knicks, Cavs twice, bobcats twice, denver, t wolves etc. (a lot of those were home games).

It's comments like these that make you come off as foolish. Maybe a little harsh but I'm tired and can't think of a better synonym. And as a warrior poster who's seen enough of you posts I know you're not dumb but you keep repeating this non sense that Jackson elected to lose those games. He didn't choose to lose those games. He didn't go into it them saying lets lose this game. I might have been critical of Jackson but that's just outlandish. His ineptitude to draw up an offensive scheme, lack of adjustments, and over reliance on the individual talents of the players instead of the scheme, well there wasn't much of a scheme in his case, cost us those games. He was overrated by many but you got to stop saying he elected to lose games. They weren't a choice they were just his short comings as a coach.

D-Leethal
11-29-2014, 03:16 PM
His old school approach and stubbornness to forcefeed a structured half court system on a roster suited for wide open high powered attack was not right for the roster but I'm not convinced he is a bad coach. Coaches aren't one-size-fits-all. I think his approach would work very well with a team like Chicago or Memphis.

curtcocaine
11-29-2014, 03:52 PM
Stylez is just a Jackson hater. /thread are be prepared for this to get bumped up 1 a month by this dude......

likemystylez
11-29-2014, 05:21 PM
It's comments like these that make you come off as foolish. Maybe a little harsh but I'm tired and can't think of a better synonym. And as a warrior poster who's seen enough of you posts I know you're not dumb but you keep repeating this non sense that Jackson elected to lose those games. He didn't choose to lose those games. He didn't go into it them saying lets lose this game. I might have been critical of Jackson but that's just outlandish. His ineptitude to draw up an offensive scheme, lack of adjustments, and over reliance on the individual talents of the players instead of the scheme, well there wasn't much of a scheme in his case, cost us those games. He was overrated by many but you got to stop saying he elected to lose games. They weren't a choice they were just his short comings as a coach.

he went into a season aiming to win 50 games with a team capable of winning north of 60. It would be like me coaching the dream team against a bunch of jr high girls- i would basically have to try to lose (or elect to lose) to not beat them. Its actually difficult for a team as talented as the warriors to lose to last years laker team without kobe bryant.

If he really wanted to win- he would have made adjustments or brought in assistants who could develop a game plan to get even a decent amount out of the talent he had. He was too proud and he put his ego over the team winning games- so yes he elected to lose because hed rather throw away a dozen easy wins or so than have people think he needed help

likemystylez
11-29-2014, 05:22 PM
His old school approach and stubbornness to forcefeed a structured half court system on a roster suited for wide open high powered attack was not right for the roster but I'm not convinced he is a bad coach. Coaches aren't one-size-fits-all. I think his approach would work very well with a team like Chicago or Memphis.

I think even those teams moved the ball more than the warriors- jackson never made any adjustments to his game plan or his rotation or anything

Chronz
11-30-2014, 04:28 AM
His old school approach and stubbornness to forcefeed a structured half court system on a roster suited for wide open high powered attack was not right for the roster but I'm not convinced he is a bad coach. Coaches aren't one-size-fits-all. I think his approach would work very well with a team like Chicago or Memphis.

Any coach replacing Thibs is likely a downgrade tho. And Im pretty sure Memphis thrived because they ditched the old school approach.

jp611
11-30-2014, 05:46 AM
Mark Jackson would be the worst coach for the Bulls.

We already have the 2nd best coach in the NBA... My God I would probably pull a Confusious and become a Cavs fan if Mark Jackson was our coach.

SF8
11-30-2014, 05:49 AM
I still think he's a good coach.

I think he could have been even better if he had assistant head coach experience before becoming a HC (I feel the same way about Kidd and Fisher).

tredigs
11-30-2014, 06:38 AM
When a team with capable+ passers at every position has the least passes per game in the NBA, and nothing changes post ASB, it's a pretty good sign you're a horrible head coach. Mark Jackson was/is a joke. You're a ****ing clown who would lose your *** in NBA bets if you disagree with that.

likemystylez
11-30-2014, 12:48 PM
When a team with capable+ passers at every position has the least passes per game in the NBA, and nothing changes post ASB, it's a pretty good sign you're a horrible head coach. Mark Jackson was/is a joke. You're a ****ing clown who would lose your *** in NBA bets if you disagree with that.

:clap: finally someone with their eyes open. I understand the guy is popular and he has people who would like to see him succeed. I'm not saying the guy should be put to death- but he is not a good nba head coach.

ohreally
11-30-2014, 02:44 PM
I don't see all that many Warriors games, but it seems a bit early to be making judgments. The Warriors scedule has been very easy so far. They played the Clippers when the Clips weren't playing well, Houston without Howard. They really haven't been tested, and it's a lot easier to beat the team's you should beat when you're not playing anyone much who you could call a crap shoot. Way, way too early.

likemystylez
11-30-2014, 04:32 PM
I don't see all that many Warriors games, but it seems a bit early to be making judgments. The Warriors scedule has been very easy so far. They played the Clippers when the Clips weren't playing well, Houston without Howard. They really haven't been tested, and it's a lot easier to beat the team's you should beat when you're not playing anyone much who you could call a crap shoot. Way, way too early.

their strength in schedule is like 9th in the league- whats more impressive though is their margins. They are controlling the games they should. Also- you talk about clippers not playing well and houston playing without howard- the warriors have been playing all year learning a brand new system on offense, and without their starting all star power forward.


last year mark jacksons adjustments and schemes constantly got them playing down to opponents.

TrueFan420
11-30-2014, 05:37 PM
I don't see all that many Warriors games, but it seems a bit early to be making judgments. The Warriors scedule has been very easy so far. They played the Clippers when the Clips weren't playing well, Houston without Howard. They really haven't been tested, and it's a lot easier to beat the team's you should beat when you're not playing anyone much who you could call a crap shoot. Way, way too early.

If you watched all their games last year and all this year you would clearly see the difference. Kerr has been fantastic and while he has great assistants its a testiment to him that he's smart enough to lean on their experience and not push them out like Jackson.

east fb knicks
11-30-2014, 05:44 PM
Alvin gentry is really making the dubs better kerr is ok but lmao marc jax won 50 games back to back lets wait and see what happens later it's to early now the dubs always do good in the reg season lets see if kerr can get them past the 2nd rd ntm the thunder are missing kd and westy with westy back expect teams like the grizz and dubs to come down to earth kd will aslo be coming back shortly

likemystylez
11-30-2014, 05:51 PM
Alvin gentry is really making the dubs better kerr is ok but lmao marc jax won 50 games back to back lets wait and see what happens later it's to early now the dubs always do good in the reg season lets see if kerr can get them past the 2nd rd ntm the thunder are missing kd and westy with westy back expect teams like the grizz and dubs to come down to earth kd will aslo be coming back shortly

he won 50 games with a roster built to win north of 60- his coaching also costed the warriors atleast 9 or 10 easy wins.

If mark jackson kept the team the warriors were running out there in 2010 with 6 d league players in the rotation- and he turned that into a 50 win team... yeah thatd be impressive. Last year jackson had a rotation that had 6 current or former all stars (Thats 3 times as many as the clippers) who he lost to in the playoffs.

No way does kerr lose to the clippers with the current roster

east fb knicks
11-30-2014, 05:59 PM
he won 50 games with a roster built to win north of 60- his coaching also costed the warriors atleast 9 or 10 easy wins.

If mark jackson kept the team the warriors were running out there in 2010 with 6 d league players in the rotation- and he turned that into a 50 win team... yeah thatd be impressive. Last year jackson had a rotation that had 6 current or former all stars (Thats 3 times as many as the clippers) who he lost to in the playoffs.

No way does kerr lose to the clippers with the current roster
yeah but he barely lost to the clips and spurs lets see if kerr can get out of the first rd before we crown him thanx

bogut also got hurt before the playoffs and d lee the year before

TrueFan420
11-30-2014, 06:01 PM
Alvin gentry is really making the dubs better kerr is ok but lmao marc jax won 50 games back to back lets wait and see what happens later it's to early now the dubs always do good in the reg season lets see if kerr can get them past the 2nd rd ntm the thunder are missing kd and westy with westy back expect teams like the grizz and dubs to come down to earth kd will aslo be coming back shortly

Gentry as well as Adams are both playing a part in our teams success but Kerr is the HC and smart enough to not let his ego chase them out like Jackson did. Remember he had Malone. We won't know enough about Kerr as a coach until a few years down road.

As for us always doing good in the reg season... Didn't know two years where we were a low seed fighting till the end (albeit in a tough west) was always doing well.

As for the playoffs, yea I can't wait to see what happens.

To your comment about west/KD coming back bring us and the griz back to earth I doubt it. That's one team we play 4 times (warriors have already played them once) even if we lose the next 3 that's not gonna be the difference if we keep putting the rest of the league on notice. However, having said that I fully expect the Spurs to creep up to first place at some point.

TrueFan420
11-30-2014, 06:03 PM
yeah but he barely lost to the clips and spurs lets see if kerr can get out of the first rd before we crown him thanx

bogut also got hurt before the playoffs and d lee the year before

Both big losses no doubt. But he didn't adjust at all. He needed curry and Klay to both get hot and the rest of the team to play great d for us to do well. Kerr's offense moves the ball and makes it easier for others to get easy shots when those two aren't going off. As well as still playing very good d.

east fb knicks
11-30-2014, 06:17 PM
Gentry as well as Adams are both playing a part in our teams success but Kerr is the HC and smart enough to not let his ego chase them out like Jackson did. Remember he had Malone. We won't know enough about Kerr as a coach until a few years down road.

As for us always doing good in the reg season... Didn't know two years where we were a low seed fighting till the end (albeit in a tough west) was always doing well.

As for the playoffs, yea I can't wait to see what happens.

To your comment about west/KD coming back bring us and the griz back to earth I doubt it. That's one team we play 4 times (warriors have already played them once) even if we lose the next 3 that's not gonna be the difference if we keep putting the rest of the league on notice. However, having said that I fully expect the Spurs to creep up to first place at some point.
my point is eventually the thunder will creep into the top 3 along with the spurs like you said too making it even tougher for the west did you see westy play against my knicks I thought he'd be rusty dam was I wrong:speechless:

east fb knicks
11-30-2014, 06:21 PM
Both big losses no doubt. But he didn't adjust at all. He needed curry and Klay to both get hot and the rest of the team to play great d for us to do well. Kerr's offense moves the ball and makes it easier for others to get easy shots when those two aren't going off. As well as still playing very good d.
adjust lmao they barely lost both series without key players didn't both series get to game 7 marc jax is a good coach some one will give him the opportunity and he will prove himself again I do agree he has ego problems which is his only fault if he would have let his assistants help him on offense he'd be a better coach but he was a rookie coach and did great for playing in the tough west people forget the dubs were a joke before marc got there

TrueFan420
11-30-2014, 06:22 PM
my point is eventually the thunder will creep into the top 3 along with the spurs like you said too making it even tougher for the west did you see westy play against my knicks I thought he'd be rusty dam was I wrong:speechless:

No offense but it was against the Knicks I don't put too much into it. If he keeps it up which isn't out the question good for him and the thunder but they got a whole lot of ground to cover and I just don't see my warriors or the griz slipping that much that the thunder can catch them.

TrueFan420
11-30-2014, 06:29 PM
adjust lmao they barely lost both series without key players didn't both series get to game 7 marc jax is a good coach some one will give him the opportunity and he will prove himself again I do agree he has ego problems which is his only fault if he would have let his assistants help him on offense he'd be a better coach but he was a rookie coach and did great for playing in the tough west people forget the dubs were a joke before marc got there

Spurs were 6. And yes both times missing a key player. But his ISO ball was horrible. We were also very bad his first year when we had very little talent playing. Then our GM assembled a very complete and balanced team and we took off. Yes every coach needs talent but the difference between a good and bad coach is what they do with it. He didn't get the best out of the talent he was given. Kerr is (including getting the best out of his staff). And we're also playing without our All - Star PF that I think will help take this team to another level with his skill set being talior made for this offense. He'll look how well Moe Spieghts is playing. Lee's got that face up game as well as a better post game, passer, pick and roll/pop and rebounder.

east fb knicks
11-30-2014, 06:35 PM
Spurs were 6. And yes both times missing a key player. But his ISO ball was horrible. We were also very bad his first year when we had very little talent playing. Then our GM assembled a very complete and balanced team and we took off. Yes every coach needs talent but the difference between a good and bad coach is what they do with it. He didn't get the best out of the talent he was given. Kerr is (including getting the best out of his staff). And we're also playing without our All - Star PF that I think will help take this team to another level with his skill set being talior made for this offense. He'll look how well Moe Spieghts is playing. Lee's got that face up game as well as a better post game, passer, pick and roll/pop and rebounder.
if green is starting and you guys have the best record in the nba why not just keep him there I don't see lee making much of a difference in kerrs offense

I agree his offense was pretty bad but still to take those top teams to game 6 and 7 is huge imo marc was better suited for the playoffs all im saying is lets see what they do in the first rd first before we say kerr is better

east fb knicks
11-30-2014, 06:38 PM
No offense but it was against the Knicks I don't put too much into it. If he keeps it up which isn't out the question good for him and the thunder but they got a whole lot of ground to cover and I just don't see my warriors or the griz slipping that much that the thunder can catch them.

the thunder won 60 games back to back your nuts if you don't think they can't put together a 10 game winning streak especially when the mvp gets back it's not a point of you guys or the grizz slipping it's the spurs or thunder catching up

TrueFan420
11-30-2014, 06:43 PM
if green is starting and you guys have the best record in the nba why not just keep him there I don't see lee making much of a difference in kerrs offense

I agree his offense was pretty bad but still to take those top teams to game 6 and 7 is huge imo marc was better suited for the playoffs all im saying is lets see what they do in the first rd first before we say kerr is better

This has been a very big topic of debate in the warriors thread. I see a situational starter between the two. But could potentially be down to just add Lee to the bench as an offensive punch and spark with the second unit. We can run the ball thru him in the high post and he'd kill back up bigs. But him in Kerr's offense would be killer. Lee is extremely talented on that end.

As for waiting to see till after the playoffs, yea I agree to an extent. We need to see how that plays out. However, as someone that watches almost all their games. It's night and day.

FriedTofuz
11-30-2014, 06:44 PM
No offense but it was against the Knicks I don't put too much into it. If he keeps it up which isn't out the question good for him and the thunder but they got a whole lot of ground to cover and I just don't see my warriors or the griz slipping that much that the thunder can catch them.

The knicks are a good team, what are you talking about? :confused:
They're just injured and fisher is figuring it out still

TrueFan420
11-30-2014, 06:45 PM
the thunder won 60 games back to back your nuts if you don't think they can't put together a 10 game winning streak especially when the mvp gets back it's not a point of you guys or the grizz slipping it's the spurs or thunder catching up

I get that but for them to catch up they'd need to win at a very high clip and have us lose. If both teams keep their pace it's impossible for them to catch up. Spurs aren't that far out. Thunder have a lot of ground to make up.

Goose17
11-30-2014, 06:46 PM
last year mark jacksons adjustments and schemes constantly got them playing down to opponents.

Not going to discuss Jackson with you ever again because your bias is clear for everyone to see.

But I will say this, his lack of adjustments and crappy offensive sets had nothing to do with them playing down to opponents. That is 100% on the players and their ****** attitude, buying into their own hype.




Stylez is just a Jackson hater. /thread are be prepared for this to get bumped up 1 a month by this dude......

Truth^

TrueFan420
11-30-2014, 06:47 PM
The knicks are a good team, what are you talking about? :confused:
They're just injured and fisher is figuring it out still
Hahah when my phone jumped to this comment it didn't show who posted it and I had to scroll up to see if it was a Knicks fan or sarcasm. Clearly the latter.

TrueFan420
11-30-2014, 07:02 PM
But I will say this, his lack of adjustments and crappy offensive sets had nothing to do with them playing down to opponents. That is 100% on the players and their ****** attitude, buying into their own hype.



That's not true at all. Yes blame goes to both the players and the coach but to say it's not on jackson at all is just flat out wrong. When your only offensive plan is for curry, klay and Lee to be hot and beat their man your gonna be in trouble. Especially when you instruct one of them, klay, to just sit on the 3 pt line and shoot whenever he touches the ball.

That means if one or two have an off night were in trouble. All the team had to do was focus on curry and klay would struggle to get his open looks and Lee can't carry the team by himself.

That's got nothing to do with buying into their own hype. But let's say it is. Jackson was the one hyping their heads up saying I want you to ISO and beat everyone this way.

Ball movement changes the mentality. And has helped us put games away early. So while it's not all on jackson he definitely deserves a share of the blame for us playig down to other teams.

Goose17
11-30-2014, 07:25 PM
Honestly TF, I'm sorry it was you who bit on that, but whatever, the message will still get across... hopefully.

So, here we go;


to say it's not on jackson at all is just flat out wrong.

And yet you didn't call out Stylez for saying it's all on Jackson, did you just not read the replies in the thread before posting or were you showing your own bias as well? Hmm... I wonder.



Especially when you instruct one of them, klay, to just sit on the 3 pt line and shoot whenever he touches the ball.


Where is the evidence that he categorically told Klay to sit at the 3 point line all game? Please provide evidence if you're going to make such a claim. You're assuming Klay's lack of aggressiveness was due to Jackson and not his own lack of confidence at the rim (or over confidence as a shooter), you are pinning Klay's lack of aggressiveness COMPLETELY on Jackson and giving Klay a pass for his own flaws in his own game. How is that any different from someone giving the players the blame and giving Jackson a pass like you just criticised me of doing? It's not. But in your mind it is. This is the problem with the Jackson "haters" as they are being referred to. Jackson is to blame for everything, the players for nothing. It's pathetic and incredibly narrow minded.




Ball movement changes the mentality. And has helped us put games away early. So while it's not all on jackson he definitely deserves a share of the blame for us playig down to other teams.

Of course he deserves part of the blame, he was supposed to be motivational, if that's your "thing" as a coach you better motivate your team to beat opponents that are well below your level. However, in case you didn't notice, I only said that to set the trap. Because predictably, Jackson "haters" would call me out for it, and then try to prove that it WAS his fault while simultaneously contradicting themselves with their B.S like "both sides share the blame"... "Klay not being aggressive enough is completely Jacksons fault".

The haterade people are sipping on is insane. It's beyond insane. Go see my post in the thread Stylez made about Jackson V Kerr in the Warriors section for more information, I'm not discussing Jackson further other than to say laying the blame on him for the Warriors playing down to opponents is absolutely moronic at best, there's only so much a coach can do, the rest is on the team, and if they go in thinking they're untouchable and get burned because of it, so be it. That's on them. And if the coach doesn't chew them out for it and address it properly, that's on him.

TrueFan420
11-30-2014, 07:36 PM
Honestly TF, I'm sorry it was you who bit on that, but whatever, the message will still get across... hopefully.

So, here we go;



And yet you didn't call out Stylez for saying it's all on Jackson, did you just not read the replies in the thread before posting or were you showing your own bias as well? Hmm... I wonder.




Where is the evidence that he categorically told Klay to sit at the 3 point line all game? Please provide evidence if you're going to make such a claim. You're assuming Klay's lack of aggressiveness was due to Jackson and not his own lack of confidence at the rim (or over confidence as a shooter), you are pinning Klay's lack of aggressiveness COMPLETELY on Jackson and giving Klay a pass for his own flaws in his own game. How is that any different from someone giving the players the blame and giving Jackson a pass like you just criticised me of doing? It's not. But in your mind it is. This is the problem with the Jackson "haters" as they are being referred to. Jackson is to blame for everything, the players for nothing. It's pathetic and incredibly narrow minded.




Of course he deserves part of the blame, he was supposed to be motivational, if that's your "thing" as a coach you better motivate your team to beat opponents that are well below your level. However, in case you didn't notice, I only said that to set the trap. Because predictably, Jackson "haters" would call me out for it, and then try to prove that it WAS his fault while simultaneously contradicting themselves with their B.S like "both sides share the blame"... "Klay not being aggressive enough is completely Jacksons fault".

The haterade people are sipping on is insane. It's beyond insane. Go see my post in the thread Stylez made about Jackson V Kerr in the Warriors section for more information, I'm not discussing Jackson further other than to say laying the blame on him for the Warriors playing down to opponents is absolutely moronic at best, there's only so much a coach can do, the rest is on the team, and if they go in thinking they're untouchable and get burned because of it, so be it. That's on them. And if the coach doesn't chew them out for it and address it properly, that's on him.

Go back thru here and see where I called him out for saying jackson elected to lose games. I tend to let stylez stuff slide more often than not because it's pointless to argue with him after a while.

Comments like coach gave me the green light to shoot. Instead of saying coach wants me to attack the basket when my shots not falling to get me going. Is where I base that. But fair enough there's not enough evidence other than the comments as none of us were there. We can only base it on what we saw. So it was partially on klay. But I vaguely remember him saying his dad told him to attack the basket more when his shot isn't falling. But ok not enough evidence.

You've read enough of my comments in our thread to know while I didn't like Jackson I was fair in my assessments. Even when I wanted to replace him it was only for a better option. And wasn't too happy about getting another first year head coach but was also willing to be open and give him a chance just as I gave jackson. So don't lump me in as just another hater.

Vinylman
11-30-2014, 08:39 PM
Gentry is coaching the team and the wounded warriors are healthy

give it another month when the inevitable injuries will occur

likemystylez
11-30-2014, 08:44 PM
Gentry is coaching the team and the wounded warriors are healthy

give it another month when the inevitable injuries will occur

umm they have played all year with out david lee, and gentry has a say on what they do because kerr empowers his assistants

likemystylez
11-30-2014, 08:55 PM
Goose- there are a lot of things kerr is doing differently along the way to prevent those "lapses of effort"

1) He is moving the ball, you can hear him on the sideline yelling keep moving the ball. He is keeping everyone involved which should help the over all effort level

2) This isnt specifically related to effort- but Kerr will hold players accountable to the press and isnt afraid to call them out. Jackson on the other hand constantly gave them a free pass for screwing up things they shouldnt be screwing up. Jackson would constantly say "trials and tribulations.. bla bla bla" or "this is a process"- basically giving them a pass. Earlier in the year, Kerr saw like 2 or 3 games where they had some stupid turnovers that shouldnt happen. Even when the warriors won- kerr called out his team for the stupid turnovers and was not ok with it moving forward. he made it very clear that it wasnt acceptable. As a team their turnovers have gone wayyyyy down the last 9 or 10 games. Thats a completely different way than jackson ever would have handled it.

Jackson was more interested in being their best friend and their cult leader than building a contending team. he wanted to build this whole "us against the universe" thing- and he was afraid of getting in his star players face.

One time last yr- jackson said something like "I think the guys in suits want it more than the guys ont he floor"- and that was the most impressive thing i remember about jackson.


At the end of the day, the fact that a 50 win coach didnt even get any interviews over the offseason- WELL i THINK THAT FACT PROVES MY POINT MORE THAN ANYTHING I COULD SAY.

likemystylez
11-30-2014, 09:01 PM
Stylez is just a Jackson hater. /thread are be prepared for this to get bumped up 1 a month by this dude......

I guess every GM in the league, every college athletic director, and every owner of every international team are all jackson haters as well. he wasnt even considered for another coaching job (after a 50 win season)... hmmm? thats odd isnt it?

ohreally
11-30-2014, 11:52 PM
If you watched all their games last year and all this year you would clearly see the difference. Kerr has been fantastic and while he has great assistants its a testiment to him that he's smart enough to lean on their experience and not push them out like Jackson.

My point is more that the schedule has been weak. So they've felt no real pressure yet. And though they have been missing Lee so far, and I like Lee a lot, for the first 14 games last year Bogut missed 8 and he was in and out of the lineup. It's a whole lot easier to look good when you're playing nearly all inferior teams and catching good teams in bad stretches or with key players out. If you're playing tougher teams you're more likely to relax with the weaker ones, and wind up losing. I just think you're jumping to conclusions very early here. Let the schedule get harder and let's see how it goes.

cssdmark
12-01-2014, 12:25 AM
The question is if Kerr took over Golden State when Mark Jackson did would Golden State be this good now or did Kerr take over a team already primed and ready.

TrueFan420
12-01-2014, 12:51 AM
The question is if Kerr took over Golden State when Mark Jackson did would Golden State be this good now or did Kerr take over a team already primed and ready.

Assuming they make the same moves... He'd probably struggle the first too but I think he'd have done better the next two. As well as I don't think he'd proclaim that we'd make the playoffs his first year. But we still need to see how he does in the playoffs.

Vinylman
12-01-2014, 12:54 PM
umm they have played all year with out david lee, and gentry has a say on what they do because kerr empowers his assistants

obviously I am talking about steph and bogshiit

likemystylez
12-02-2014, 12:07 AM
obviously I am talking about steph and bogshiit

steph missed 4 games last yr- bogut missed 8- they had enough depth- to survive that

likemystylez
12-02-2014, 12:12 AM
My point is more that the schedule has been weak. So they've felt no real pressure yet. And though they have been missing Lee so far, and I like Lee a lot, for the first 14 games last year Bogut missed 8 and he was in and out of the lineup. It's a whole lot easier to look good when you're playing nearly all inferior teams and catching good teams in bad stretches or with key players out. If you're playing tougher teams you're more likely to relax with the weaker ones, and wind up losing. I just think you're jumping to conclusions very early here. Let the schedule get harder and let's see how it goes.

see the issue wasnt really that they couldnt play with the better teams last yr (except san antonio- isolation ball just cant compete with that squad.)- the bigger issue was how the warriors did against teams they should have had no problem with.

Lakers
twolves
bobcats (twice)
Cavs (twice)
denver missing 4/5 of their starting line up
New york
and then there were like 7 or 8 others against teams like boston, NJ, and atlanta that were wayyyy close than they should have been because isolation ball kept inferrior teams in the game.

Kerr is winning games they should win and they are winning them with the best margin in the league- a sign of a legitimately strong team

Vinylman
12-02-2014, 01:08 PM
steph missed 4 games last yr- bogut missed 8- they had enough depth- to survive that

sorry about that ... I didn't realize the NBA had gone to a 75 game schedule because that would be the only way that bogut missed 8 games... of course he missed 15 in the regular season but only 7 in the playoffs... I guess 22 missed games is the new 8... thanks

likemystylez
12-02-2014, 01:13 PM
sorry about that ... I didn't realize the NBA had gone to a 75 game schedule because that would be the only way that bogut missed 8 games... of course he missed 15 in the regular season but only 7 in the playoffs... I guess 22 missed games is the new 8... thanks

they were not losing games to the cavs, lakers, knicks, and bobcats because they didnt have the available talent to win the games- they lost about 10-12 games just because jackson didnt have a solid game plan, and was not able to make adjustments whent he other team decided that blitzing curry would hurt their chances of winning playing isolation basketball.

The warriors cheerleading squad should have no problem beating most of these teams

Vinylman
12-02-2014, 01:32 PM
they were not losing games to the cavs, lakers, knicks, and bobcats because they didnt have the available talent to win the games- they lost about 10-12 games just because jackson didnt have a solid game plan, and was not able to make adjustments whent he other team decided that blitzing curry would hurt their chances of winning playing isolation basketball.

The warriors cheerleading squad should have no problem beating most of these teams

keep telling yourself that later in the year when the injuries pile up...

I guess you are one of those that thinks bogut would not have mattered in the playoffs.... good to know

likemystylez
12-02-2014, 06:20 PM
keep telling yourself that later in the year when the injuries pile up...

I guess you are one of those that thinks bogut would not have mattered in the playoffs.... good to know

I watch every single warriors game.

lets put it this way- if that team without bogut could find a wway to go head to head with the clippers.

that team had the talent to beat teams like the knicks, hornets, cavs, and lakers at home. The effort wasnt there on a nightly basis- and mark jackson repeatedly gave the players an out saying "its a process" and "trials and tribulations are a transportation to bla bla bla."

It isnt a process to coach this roster to a home win over the cavs- I belive they had the talent to do it right then.

Also bogut might have helped in the playoffs (although even with bogut warriors were 2-2 against the clippers in the season)- what would have helped more is a game plan to generate quality shots and shift the clippers defense (chris paul was playing with a severely strained hamstring) make him chase the ball from side to side.

Im confused- are you arguing that jackson was a great coach with a great scheme who was limited just by a few injuries?

do you really believe that the isolation ball was the best way to get the most out of the best passing line up in the league?

Vinylman
12-02-2014, 06:32 PM
I watch every single warriors game.

lets put it this way- if that team without bogut could find a wway to go head to head with the clippers.

that team had the talent to beat teams like the knicks, hornets, cavs, and lakers at home. The effort wasnt there on a nightly basis- and mark jackson repeatedly gave the players an out saying "its a process" and "trials and tribulations are a transportation to bla bla bla."

It isnt a process to coach this roster to a home win over the cavs- I belive they had the talent to do it right then.

Also bogut might have helped in the playoffs (although even with bogut warriors were 2-2 against the clippers in the season)- what would have helped more is a game plan to generate quality shots and shift the clippers defense (chris paul was playing with a severely strained hamstring) make him chase the ball from side to side.

Im confused- are you arguing that jackson was a great coach with a great scheme who was limited just by a few injuries?

do you really believe that the isolation ball was the best way to get the most out of the best passing line up in the league?

no i am not arguing any of that... not that i think he was as bad as you describe ... it is early in the season and this warrior team is much deeper than last year and have played together an additional year...

do i think the warriors will experience a result different than last year? maybe... they MIGHT get out of the first round... but i wouldn't hold my breath

likemystylez
12-02-2014, 07:26 PM
they basically have the same core as they did last yr. they added livingston and b rush- but their top 7 or 8 guys are all the same....you act like they made roster moves like the cavs did.... mark jackson had the talent base on his team to go 14-2 as well

blahblahyoutoo
12-03-2014, 01:01 AM
overrated coaches.

doc rivers, mark jackson, phil jackson, byron scott, scott brooks.

lol, please
12-03-2014, 02:13 AM
It seems like he knew how to get his players to be invested in the system, which is 9/10s of the battle. That last 10th can be the difference between contending and a first or second round exit.

Jackson underachieved last year, but overachieved the year before. But I think Klay is just coming into his own, that that is something Kerr has that Jackson didn't. And Curry has a level of play and confidence that he likely hasn't had before.

I think this team should have done better last year, and Kerr is doing great so far, but we'll see as the season goes along. Perhaps Kerr won't be as good a defensive coach, and that may hurt him down the stretch. Perhaps he'll be great.


All I know is I want to see these guys are their max potential. They got something special in GSWland.

I agree with what you said, and for the last part, I hope you are right. :)

DoMeFavors
12-03-2014, 02:25 AM
Steve Kerr knows what he is doing he was a GM for the PHX Suns who played that up tempo style the Warriors should have played last year. He has is close to his assistant coaches and they help him out like Gentry who knows the offense he likes. Mark was clashing with owners, management, assistant coaches. Steve Kerr has impressed a lot and is already one of the top coaches in the league.

DoMeFavors
12-03-2014, 02:26 AM
overrated coaches.

doc rivers, mark jackson, phil jackson, byron scott, scott brooks.
Doc isn't overrated at all.