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View Full Version : Wes Matthews: I'm the best two-way guard in the NBA



Corey
10-14-2014, 01:24 PM
Im never going to be the type that gets gaudy numbers to make an All-Defensive team, said Matthews before getting to his case.

Do I think Im All-Defense? Absolutely. I think Im the best two-way two-guard in the NBA. But I feel like we need to be a good defensive team within the scheme of the game. Were not out there gambling, trying to reach and get steals. That would put us in a bind if I dont get it, Matthews said.


Well?

goingfor28
10-14-2014, 01:28 PM
That's cute

hugepatsfan
10-14-2014, 01:35 PM
I don't think it's that ridiculous. I don't think too many of the guards who are as good as him on defense are as good as him on offense. And I don't think too many of the guards as good as him on offense are as good as him on defense.

Corey
10-14-2014, 01:41 PM
I don't think it's that ridiculous. I don't think too many of the guards who are as good as him on defense are as good as him on offense. And I don't think too many of the guards as good as him on offense are as good as him on defense.

I actually tend to agree.

JEDean89
10-14-2014, 01:45 PM
OP did a really bad job with the misleading thread title, typical. He said "I think I'm the best 2 way guard in the league" not "I'm the best 2 way guard in the league".

OP understand this, do not that do that. Every player in the league is like to think they they are the best or have the potential to be the best. It doesn't matter if it's true or not, it's what he has to believe to get the job done. Wes is one of the best 2 way guards in the league for sure. It is not crazy for him to believe that he is the best. These guys are all egomaniacs anyway, its just part of the game.

Chronz
10-14-2014, 01:50 PM
Klay is better on defense but Wes is much better on Offense. Afflalo has a case here as well. Hard to tell where the cut off line is but being a 2-way guy is abit overrated.

gatkins11
10-14-2014, 02:42 PM
I don't think it's that ridiculous. I don't think too many of the guards who are as good as him on defense are as good as him on offense. And I don't think too many of the guards as good as him on offense are as good as him on defense.

This.

Goose17
10-14-2014, 02:59 PM
Shots aimed at harden?

gwrighter
10-14-2014, 03:01 PM
Bledsoe and Westbrook are better two-way guards. Even though Klay Thompson is overrated he's also a better two way guard than Matthews. Also his defence wasn't great, it was good on a bad defensive team.

Kaner
10-14-2014, 03:30 PM
Bledsoe and Westbrook are better two-way guards. Even though Klay Thompson is overrated he's also a better two way guard than Matthews. Also his defence wasn't great, it was good on a bad defensive team.

Can add Chris Paul and probably Lowry and Conley. Paul George could play guard and he's unquestionably better on both ends.

Looking at just shooting guards though he has a real good case, Stephenson, Thompson, and Ginobili are probably the 3 others that come to mind.

valade16
10-14-2014, 03:44 PM
He very well could be in the sense that of all the offensive guards, he has the best defense and of all the best defensive guards, he has the best offense.

It's a cool distinction I guess however at a certain point extreme value on one side (like Harden on offense) outweighs positive value on both sides.

IndyRealist
10-14-2014, 03:47 PM
Can add Chris Paul and probably Lowry and Conley. Paul George could play guard and he's unquestionably better on both ends.

Looking at just shooting guards though he has a real good case, Stephenson, Thompson, and Ginobili are probably the 3 others that come to mind.

Yes but SG is just thin on talent in general. It'll be interesting to see if some of these rookies will make an impact on that.

Hotone1401
10-14-2014, 03:47 PM
Shots aimed at harden?

Bang bang.

Hawkeye15
10-14-2014, 03:48 PM
he might actually be right. But, I tend not to dwell on a players statement, like this.

beasted86
10-14-2014, 03:58 PM
False bravado... he knows he's lying.

flea
10-14-2014, 04:01 PM
Remember that time those Cavs/LeButt fans said Waiters is better than Matthews? Classic PSD moment.

Dade County
10-14-2014, 04:02 PM
Another SG wants a max deal... smh


But I do like his offensive game.

beasted86
10-14-2014, 04:02 PM
Without looking up the stats I'd bet at least 70% of his shots are assisted. Because you can stand in a corner and knock down shots doesn't make you one of the better offensive players in the league.

beasted86
10-14-2014, 04:09 PM
Haha, I looked it up out of curiosity, 73% of his shots are assisted.

He's not a good offensive player, simply a good shooter who matches that system to get open looks.

Showtime Steve
10-14-2014, 04:09 PM
He commits a lot of dumb fouls. He isn't the best, but he is up there in terms of two way. But wes knows his pecking order, Aldridge, lillard, batum, him. Klay and steph have the greenest light I've ever seen. Klay is a smarter defender.

gwrighter
10-14-2014, 04:11 PM
Without looking up the stats I'd bet at least 70% of his shots are assisted. Because you can stand in a corner and knock down shots doesn't make you one of the better offensive players in the league.

73% of his shots. It's fun playing next to two all-stars, Chandler Parsons would probably agree.

beasted86
10-14-2014, 04:16 PM
And Klay Thompson that people are mentioning here is 75%.

I knew that both of those guys were overrated offensively, but it's nice to see it quantified.

If we are rating these mostly catch and shoot players, I'd take Affallo before Klay and Matthews anyway on both ends for that matter.

beasted86
10-14-2014, 04:23 PM
73% of his shots. It's fun playing next to two all-stars, Chandler Parsons would probably agree.

I'm not trying to fault him for playing his role to a high level, but my point is you can't basically be a catch and shoot player who doesn't have to ever create anything and say you are one of the best.

If he is one of the better offensive players, he's yet to prove it.

On topic of best two way 2 guards its likely Stephenson, Wade, and Joe Johnson and the rest fall behind.

Goose17
10-14-2014, 04:27 PM
LOL JOE JOHNSON AND WADE HAHAHA HAHAHA HAA. .. come on cuh (I say in my best smoove voice)

Hold up I need to check what year it is. I could have sworn it was 2014... Dwyane Wade lmfao. Wow. My homer sense is tingling.

valade16
10-14-2014, 04:35 PM
And Klay Thompson that people are mentioning here is 75%.

I knew that both of those guys were overrated offensively, but it's nice to see it quantified.

If we are rating these mostly catch and shoot players, I'd take Affallo before Klay and Matthews anyway on both ends for that matter.

What % of plays are Wade, Joe Johnson, Stephenson, and Affalo assisted on?

Goose17
10-14-2014, 04:38 PM
Also doesn't Kevin Love have 70+ % of his shots assisted on? Considering he doesn't play a lick of defense. Does that mean by your standards that he's overrated and not that good offensively? Just a spot up 4 who rebounds?

:)

beasted86
10-14-2014, 04:39 PM
What % of plays are Wade, Joe Johnson, Stephenson, and Affalo assisted on?
It's all on 82games.com

It's hard for me to check on my phone

Goose17
10-14-2014, 04:40 PM
What about Bosh? 84% of his shots were assisted on.

beasted86
10-14-2014, 04:42 PM
Also doesn't Kevin Love have 70+ % of his shots assisted on? Considering he doesn't play a lick of defense. Does that mean by your standards that he's overrated and not that good offensively? Just a spot up 4 who rebounds?

:)

Yes, but big men can't exactly dribble the ball up the floor and pass it to themselves on the post. It's expected for a PF or C to have higher than most guards.

But, again, without looking at the stats, I'd bet Tyson Chandler isn't even at 75% assisted shots. At such a high rate, there is not any debate as to whether Thompson is simply a catch and shoot player. Go ahead and hate me and troll laugh for telling the truth.

beasted86
10-14-2014, 04:54 PM
Two way player is doing it all. Points should be high, assists per position should be high, rebounds per position should be high, overall offense and defense IQ and impact should be high.

If you are rating a player who simply catches and shoots high, might as well rate a player who only gets steals as high defensive also. You can't be good at just one facet of offense or one facet of defense and be considered one of the better in the whole category. My point was Matthews is mostly one dimensional... just my opinion and I provided some factual data to back my point. I'm not going to get in an argument with a troll about the topic.

Just post your opinion and a few facts to back it if it's contrasting to mine and keep it moving. It's not that serious, duke.

Chronz
10-14-2014, 05:23 PM
Without looking up the stats I'd bet at least 70% of his shots are assisted. Because you can stand in a corner and knock down shots doesn't make you one of the better offensive players in the league.
Yeah but you have to designate 2-way players some how, its not by being elite on both ends but by being efficient or effective at both. Klay isn't efficient offensively but he scores at decent clip, is a stellar M2M defender and improving as a team defender. James Harden is obviously a better overall player than these 2 but hes 1 dimensional. Which is why I always disagreed with the notion that defense is half the game, at least with regards to perimeter players. Harden can be a complete liability defensively and still be more valuable than these "2-way" guys.



Mathews isn't the defender that Klay is but hes heady offensively and has developed some go to post moves. Even tho I agree with you that hes not elite, I think you undersell him abit, he created some offense out of the post when necessary and filled his role as an outlet when asked to defer, thats a plus offensive player on one of the best offensive teams in the league. That said, you go on to mention the system he played in and I happen to think it was one of the most harmonious environments for a guy like Mathews could dream of. I felt the same way about Klay in GS only it was held back by their former coach. But there is something to be said for "system players", they can give your team the needed diversity to maximize your best players, sometimes thats the best support a star can have.

FlashBolt
10-14-2014, 05:37 PM
It's one thing to be confident but another to be an idiot...

Crackadalic
10-14-2014, 05:39 PM
I disagree but I do like his game tho

KNICKS R BACK
10-14-2014, 05:56 PM
Listen, Wes Matthews is a solid 2 way player. He is obviously not the best 2 way guard in the league. When you make outlandish statements like this you are going to be ridiculed. Is it wrong for him to feel that way? Absolutely not, he should feel that way, but there was a better way he could have worded this so as not to come off as being unrealistic.

Goose17
10-14-2014, 06:31 PM
Yes, but big men can't exactly dribble the ball up the floor and pass it to themselves on the post. It's expected for a PF or C to have higher than most guards.

But, again, without looking at the stats, I'd bet Tyson Chandler isn't even at 75% assisted shots. At such a high rate, there is not any debate as to whether Thompson is simply a catch and shoot player. Go ahead and hate me and troll laugh for telling the truth.

I wasn't talking about the post. I was talking about jump shots.

Goose17
10-14-2014, 06:33 PM
Yes, but big men can't exactly dribble the ball up the floor and pass it to themselves on the post. It's expected for a PF or C to have higher than most guards.

But, again, without looking at the stats, I'd bet Tyson Chandler isn't even at 75% assisted shots. At such a high rate, there is not any debate as to whether Thompson is simply a catch and shoot player. Go ahead and hate me and troll laugh for telling the truth.

And Thompson? What's he got to do with it? We're talking about Wes and your delusional homerism saying Wade is one of the best 2 way guards in the league. Did you just time travel here or something? Are you from the past?

And Joe Johnson!!! Hahahahahaha

Goose17
10-14-2014, 06:35 PM
When you make outlandish statements like this you are going to be ridiculed.

Like JR saying he's the best shooter in the game?

They have to say these things. Nobody should take it serious or ridicule them for it. They're just doing what they're supposed to do.

Corey
10-14-2014, 07:31 PM
OP did a really bad job with the misleading thread title, typical. He said "I think I'm the best 2 way guard in the league" not "I'm the best 2 way guard in the league".

OP understand this, do not that do that. Every player in the league is like to think they they are the best or have the potential to be the best. It doesn't matter if it's true or not, it's what he has to believe to get the job done. Wes is one of the best 2 way guards in the league for sure. It is not crazy for him to believe that he is the best. These guys are all egomaniacs anyway, its just part of the game.

:yawn:

Unnecessary criticism.

goingfor28
10-14-2014, 08:55 PM
Why was the lebron thread closed but this joke stays open?

likemystylez
10-14-2014, 09:50 PM
Like JR saying he's the best shooter in the game?

They have to say these things. Nobody should take it serious or ridicule them for it. They're just doing what they're supposed to do.

ehhhh- well i think there is more truth to this one than JR saying hes the best shooter....I dont agree with Mathews, but I have no problem with him believing that... hes definitely up there as a two way player at the sg spot

Seizabmc
10-14-2014, 10:11 PM
Shump has been making a statement for himself thus far in the preseason.

Already a top defender
And now stepping it up big Time on the offensive end as well.

Seizabmc
10-14-2014, 10:12 PM
Just like steph saying he's the best in the game.
Or harden saying the same.

It's a joke!!
Sometimes you gotta just laugh!

BALLER R
10-15-2014, 06:07 AM
Because a high percent of a players shot were assisted that means they aren't really good offensive players? This is another one of those situations where stats can be misleading.

Corey
10-15-2014, 10:48 AM
Because a high percent of a players shot were assisted that means they aren't really good offensive players? This is another one of those situations where stats can be misleading.

I agree. I'd almost rather them have a high AST rate on scores because that means they dont need the ball in their hands in order to be a successful offensive player. Especially at the 2/3 where you'd rather have the ball in your PG's hands.

hugepatsfan
10-15-2014, 11:27 AM
I don't think assist rate on scores in and of itself is either good or bad. Creating your own shot is valuable and so is scoring as an off the ball player. Someone that can only score off the ball is probably better within a team offense than someone who can only score off his own but on the flip side if you don't have anyone that can create their own shot then it's probably going to be hard to run your offense.

Tony_Starks
10-15-2014, 11:40 AM
Klay is better on defense but Wes is much better on Offense. Afflalo has a case here as well. Hard to tell where the cut off line is but being a 2-way guy is abit overrated.

I actually roll with Afflalo as well. Glad you brought him up because he's really slept on.

But Matthews is up there. I love how he doesn't try to do too much. Serious defense, hit the open shot.

aLau10
10-15-2014, 11:51 AM
Wes matt is nice, but I'd say its debatable with him, Klay, AA, Lance

I'd actually don't think Beal, Derozan, Ellis are bad defenders either, and if their offensive compensates for the slight drop in defense I think they can be considered?

And are we assuming Kobe is no more elite? no defense and offense? Because I feel like Kobe is still pretty good.

IKnowHoops
10-15-2014, 11:59 AM
Haha, I looked it up out of curiosity, 73% of his shots are assisted.

He's not a good offensive player, simply a good shooter who matches that system to get open looks.

And this is what I thought about Kyle Korver as well. It looks to me the Korver is around 94% of his shots being assisted if I read that right. That means you cannot create at all.

MrfadeawayJB
10-15-2014, 12:04 PM
Afflalo

Jamiecballer
10-15-2014, 12:04 PM
And this is what I thought about Kyle Korver as well. It looks to me the Korver is around 94% of his shots being assisted if I read that right. That means you cannot create at all.
You need balance within your offense. If everybody could create for themselves your offense would not be good because everybody would be trying to get their own. This is essentially what happens with all-star teams.

Sadds The Gr8
10-15-2014, 12:09 PM
Klay is better on defense but Wes is much better on Offense. Afflalo has a case here as well. Hard to tell where the cut off line is but being a 2-way guy is abit overrated.
Is Klay better on defense? Watching them I would assume Wes is but I don't know the defensive metrics between them. Wes' tenacity on D always stood out to me ever since he was on Utah, and he put harden on lock in the playoffs. I obviously don't watch every game they play but Wes just stands out to me more. I'll take your word for it tho if the metrics say Klay is better

Confusious
10-15-2014, 03:28 PM
Im never going to be the type that gets gaudy numbers to make an All-Defensive team
Do I think Im All-Defense? Absolutely. I think Im the best two-way two-guard in the NBA.

Well, the best "two-way" two guard in the NBA should be able to get "gaudy" numbers, so he kind of just backhanded himself with his own comments.

DallasTrilla23
10-15-2014, 04:25 PM
Why do these dudes keep disrespecting my big dawg Kobe like that?

He leaves for a couple of months and now everyone is trying to take over his house?

hugepatsfan
10-15-2014, 05:24 PM
Why do these dudes keep disrespecting my big dawg Kobe like that?

He leaves for a couple of months and now everyone is trying to take over his house?

Kobe's "house" as the best 2 way guard had been taken over by Wade a while ago.

ewing
10-16-2014, 08:06 PM
all of a sudden everyone loves Affalo

xbrackattackx
10-16-2014, 09:20 PM
all of a sudden everyone loves Affalo

Forget Affalo give me a different nugget! Gallo!!

ewing
10-16-2014, 09:24 PM
Forget Affalo give me a different nugget! Gallo!!


have always been a fan of both. Gallo will be big this year if he can stay healthy