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View Full Version : Did Houston Make a Mistake?



Wade n Fade
07-19-2014, 10:24 AM
Now that Houston lost out on Melo, Lebron, etc, did they make a mistake or two? They could've entered the Kevin Love sweepstakes by letting go of Terrence Jones, Omer Asik, Chandler Parsons, picks, and some other young assets. They should've gone after Pau Gasol too since he could've given them a 4 even though the D'antoni system didn't work in LA. Ariza was a decent signing, but they stood pat for too long and missed out on some of the marquee guys.

goingfor28
07-19-2014, 10:26 AM
Yes
They lost parsons, asik, lin, 1st rd pick, and only added ariza
Fail

Htownballa1622
07-19-2014, 11:17 AM
Yes
They lost parsons, asik, lin, 1st rd pick, and only added ariza
Fail

You keep saying this and u totally ignore the potential lottery pick from the asik trade.

you fail....over and over again. I've seen you write this exact thing multiple times.

Time to hop off?

tr3ymill3r
07-19-2014, 11:23 AM
Ariza was better than Parsons last year and is better defensively than Parsons. I believe that Chandler has actually reached his ceiling and with his back spasms I don't think he has as long of a career as most. He's already lost some explosiveness from his rookie year and keep in mind he was a 4 year player at Florida, so he's older than what some remember or think. Parsons, Lin and Asik are all good players but none of them have earned the $15 million that they will receive this season.

Daryl Morey has set himself up for when a superstar pitches a fit either in a month or during the season and the Rockets will be able to absorb his contract.

Lin wore out his welcome with all of his stupid play, I really have to question if he actually attended classes at Harvard. He jumps to pass with no idea what to do far too often for someone who is supposed to be that smart.

Of the 3, Asik might be missed the most because you cannot teach height or find guys that don't mind doing the dirty work. Ariza will replace Parsons. Canaan will replace Lin. Even though Joey Dorsey is supposed to be an improved defender with his time overseas, I don't think he will be able to match what Asik did. The Rockets also picked up a pick from New Orleans that could be a decent pick from 4-16.

valade16
07-19-2014, 11:28 AM
You keep saying this and u totally ignore the potential lottery pick from the asik trade.

you fail....over and over again. I've seen you write this exact thing multiple times.

Time to hop off?

9 teams had a worse record than NO last season and NO added Asik. It could be a lottery pick, but it likely won't be a great pick.

Sugar coating it can only go so far.

valade16
07-19-2014, 11:31 AM
Ariza was better than Parsons last year and is better defensively than Parsons. I believe that Chandler has actually reached his ceiling and with his back spasms I don't think he has as long of a career as most. He's already lost some explosiveness from his rookie year and keep in mind he was a 4 year player at Florida, so he's older than what some remember or think.

Rockets fans:

One month ago: Parsons is way better than Ariza. He's you g and has potential.

Two weeks ago: Parson did better overall last season but Ariza plays better defense which is what we need anyway.

Today: Ariza is better than Parsons. In fact, Parsons is overrated and has injury concerns.

I can't wait to see how much worse Parsons gets in the next 2 weeks...

Htownballa1622
07-19-2014, 11:33 AM
9 teams had a worse record than NO last season and NO added Asik. It could be a lottery pick, but it likely won't be a great pick.

Sugar coating it can only go so far.

I'm not sure if u noticed but I said POTENTIAL lottery pick. That pick will be between 4-19 .

goingfor28
07-19-2014, 11:40 AM
You keep saying this and u totally ignore the potential lottery pick from the asik trade.

you fail....over and over again. I've seen you write this exact thing multiple times.

Time to hop off?
Ok so
Lose asik, lin, parsons,1st rd pick for ariza and MAYBE a lotto pick. And if it is, a late one.
Still fail

valade16
07-19-2014, 11:41 AM
I'm not sure if u noticed but I said POTENTIAL lottery pick. That pick will be between 4-19 .

It would take a very fortuitous set of circumstances for Houston to have the pick be Top 5. I'd plan on 10-15 were I you.

Htownballa1622
07-19-2014, 11:45 AM
Ok so
Lose asik, lin, parsons,1st rd pick for ariza and MAYBE a lotto pick. And if it is, a late one.
Still fail

Lin's time was done. Asik was lost but he wasn't staying past next year anyway. Get a pick for him.

Parsons chased money. Lateral move by getting ariza.

So essentially we traded lin and a pick to gain flexibility to upgrade roster. Not the best offseason but certainly not a fail since offseason isn't over.

hugepatsfan
07-19-2014, 11:45 AM
They made a mistake declining Parsons' option. At the time we all heard that it was about the right to match rather than let him go to UFA the next year. It made sense, but if they didn't actually want to use that right to match there was no point. They should have known he would have gotten overpaid like he did because that's what happens in FA. I guess their theory was that they would have matched if they got Bosh/Lebron/Melo. Still. that was banking too hard on landing a star that I don't think they were ever a lock to get. Poorly calculated risk IMO. I will say, however, that not giving Parsons $15 mil was a fine move. I don't fault them for that. They just didn't need to put themselves in the spot where they had to pay him that yet.

The Asik trade was great. Yeah they'll lose something but they got a solid pick back. Long term it was the right move. Howard and Harden are young enough where they don't need to be strictly win now. The Lin deal looks questionable but they can still make some more moves so we can't totally judge. They have remaining cap space and a trade exception from the deal. But Lin, while not great, was their 4th best scorer and one of their top 3 playmakers. They also lost Parsons (3rd scorer, also in top 3 playmakers). Ariza doesn't fill either of those skills. So the Rockets fans pretending like Lin is no loss are ridiculous. He was overpaid for what he brought but he brought something that they got no proven replacement for. Again though, they have cap space and maybe Cannan is good. It would have beeb nice if they held off on this deal until they knew they needed the cap space so they didn't have to give up their pick. However, the Lakers could have said if you don't do it now we're gonna spend our cap on someone else. I imagine HOU put off pulling the trigger as long as they could.

So in conclusion I don't think HOU had a very good offseason but it wasn't a complete disaster and train wreck like some are making it out to be. They still have a lot of flexibility for this offseason and next. With Harden and Howard still being young they don't have to go all in every year.

Htownballa1622
07-19-2014, 11:46 AM
It would take a very fortuitous set of circumstances for Houston to have the pick be Top 5. I'd plan on 10-15 were I you.

I understand what you're saying but what I'm saying is that we got something back that could be valuable for essentially an expiring contract that would've walked anyway.

houstonfan
07-19-2014, 11:51 AM
Ariza was better than Parsons last year and is better defensively than Parsons. I believe that Chandler has actually reached his ceiling and with his back spasms I don't think he has as long of a career as most. He's already lost some explosiveness from his rookie year and keep in mind he was a 4 year player at Florida, so he's older than what some remember or think. Parsons, Lin and Asik are all good players but none of them have earned the $15 million that they will receive this season.

Daryl Morey has set himself up for when a superstar pitches a fit either in a month or during the season and the Rockets will be able to absorb his contract.

Lin wore out his welcome with all of his stupid play, I really have to question if he actually attended classes at Harvard. He jumps to pass with no idea what to do far too often for someone who is supposed to be that smart.

Of the 3, Asik might be missed the most because you cannot teach height or find guys that don't mind doing the dirty work. Ariza will replace Parsons. Canaan will replace Lin. Even though Joey Dorsey is supposed to be an improved defender with his time overseas, I don't think he will be able to match what Asik did. The Rockets also picked up a pick from New Orleans that could be a decent pick from 4-16.

Ya i hear thats the toughest class they teach at Harvard: "Not jumping to pass". Not sure what that has to do with him attending classes lol. Im by no means a huge Lin supporter but to say Canaan can just jump in in his first year and give us 13 and 5 off the bench may be a bit premature. I sure hope Im wrong but alot of teams would gladly take Lins numbers for a 6th man, where in Houston he was the most hated player on the team. The Rockets will be fine as long as Harden has a good postseason, which based off his last 3 playoffs isnt very likely.

valade16
07-19-2014, 11:53 AM
I understand what you're saying but what I'm saying is that we got something back that could be valuable for essentially an expiring contract that would've walked anyway.

I agree there. The Asik trade was a good trade from a basketball organization standpoint but it has, at least for next season, made the product on the floor worse.

nycericanguy
07-19-2014, 11:57 AM
Replacing Parsons, Asik, Lin with Ariza is a tough sell. They lost a lot of depth. I don't know why HOU fans hate Lin so much, he gave them an efficient 13-14ppg off the bench and when Harden was out he was an efficient 20+ppg scorer... and Asik gave them 6 & 8 in just 20mpg, one of the better backups in the league.

And Ariza is nowhere near the player Parsons is... HOU had Ariza for one year and immediately traded him in 2010. In fact this is Ariza's 6th team in the last 6 years. He had a very solid year, second time he's done that in a contract year... but he is what he is... an average player at best offensively, and a decent defender.

NFLNBA
07-19-2014, 12:26 PM
Houston got a lot worse IMO. Asik and Lin both very good players who could start on most other teams. Then throw in the 1st rounder they lost. They had great intentions with getting Melo or Bosh who im still shocked chose the Heat because Bosh in Houston WITH Ariza would have been special. Anyway the FO was doing work but got screwed in the end unluckily.

IndyRealist
07-19-2014, 12:32 PM
If they made a mistake, it was going after Melo at all. That's likely what soured Parsons on Houston. Go after Bosh and tell Chandler, "Look, we need the cap space to upgrade PF. We're going to get you paid, just be patient and don't sign an offer sheet." Going after another SF would sour me on Houston, too.

rockets-fan
07-19-2014, 12:34 PM
Yes, they did, move on. They are still a very good team.

Verbal Christ
07-19-2014, 12:36 PM
Rockets fans:

One month ago: Parsons is way better than Ariza. He's you g and has potential.

Two weeks ago: Parson did better overall last season but Ariza plays better defense which is what we need anyway.

Today: Ariza is better than Parsons. In fact, Parsons is overrated and has injury concerns.

I can't wait to see how much worse Parsons gets in the next 2 weeks...

Ignorant poster:

You're late to the party. 2 months ago Parsons was dominated by Nic Batum. Lillard splashed the series winner on his mug. Remember that? Of course not.

1 month ago Parsons was making 900 K and team could have picked up yet another option to make him a good value player. However, Houston allowed him to test the market. Who would have guessed guys like Gordon Hayward and Parsons would get maxed out?

Two weeks ago Ariza and Parsons had comparable stats.

Today Ariza and Parsons still have comparable stas. Ariza gets 8 Million per. Can you do math?

Everyone keeps banking on Parsons becoming some sort of superstar player, hell he's even on record saying he's on the same level as Melo and Bosh and those likes. Take it from a guy who's watched him since he had a grotesque skin infection on his face as a rookie up until he became this limelight loving socialite ... he's no star.

Very solid player no doubt, but a star you see flashes and sustained abilities. Parsons thrived because of the attention on Harden and Howard. When he becomes the focus of a D he doesn't know what to do.

Watch some tape. Or maybe you have your crystal ball too like everyone else and 'just knows' that Parsons is on his way to stardom. LOL

Verbal Christ
07-19-2014, 12:39 PM
Houston got a lot worse IMO. Asik and Lin both very good players who could start on most other teams. Then throw in the 1st rounder they lost. They had great intentions with getting Melo or Bosh who im still shocked chose the Heat because Bosh in Houston WITH Ariza would have been special. Anyway the FO was doing work but got screwed in the end unluckily.


LOL Cocaine is a hell of a drug. This guy watched no Rocket games last year.

jerellh528
07-19-2014, 12:40 PM
That pick the lakers got from them looks a whole lot better now, in fact if either Howard or harden misses major time to injury, it could be a lotto pick.

kozelkid
07-19-2014, 12:42 PM
Rockets fans:

One month ago: Parsons is way better than Ariza. He's you g and has potential.

Two weeks ago: Parson did better overall last season but Ariza plays better defense which is what we need anyway.

Today: Ariza is better than Parsons. In fact, Parsons is overrated and has injury concerns.

I can't wait to see how much worse Parsons gets in the next 2 weeks...
Lol, spot on.

Aust
07-19-2014, 12:58 PM
That pick the lakers got from them looks a whole lot better now, in fact if either Howard or harden misses major time to injury, it could be a lotto pick.

Isn't it top 10 protected though? I wouldn't want them to miss too much time :)

Greg.
07-19-2014, 01:08 PM
Saying Ln could start for most other teams is one of the most ******** things I've seen on this site. That said, the Lin trade was what I would regret most. He was a solid bench piece (which we don't have at all now) and lost our pick. Not picking up Parsons option was a mistake in hindsight but Ariza will give more production per dollar. Parsons is definitely better but not $7m better. Losing Asik hurts for a year but long term it doesn't really matter since he was gone anyway. And whoever suggested we should've gone after Pau still thinks this is 2011 I suppose. The biggest mistake now is that Morey for some reason thinks he's only allowed to sign guys that have played for us before. Look for us to re-add Aaron Brooks, Von Wafer, Brian Cook and Jermaine Taylor for more "depth"

sep11ie
07-19-2014, 01:13 PM
Wow, another super original Houston thread filed by moronic posts by idiot posters.

jerellh528
07-19-2014, 01:18 PM
Isn't it top 10 protected though? I wouldn't want them to miss too much time :)

I don't think it is, I could be wrong though but I though only the second rounder we got had protections around it.

valade16
07-19-2014, 01:18 PM
Ignorant poster:

You're late to the party. 2 months ago Parsons was dominated by Nic Batum. Lillard splashed the series winner on his mug. Remember that? Of course not.

1 month ago Parsons was making 900 K and team could have picked up yet another option to make him a good value player. However, Houston allowed him to test the market. Who would have guessed guys like Gordon Hayward and Parsons would get maxed out?

Two weeks ago Ariza and Parsons had comparable stats.

Today Ariza and Parsons still have comparable stas. Ariza gets 8 Million per. Can you do math?

Everyone keeps banking on Parsons becoming some sort of superstar player, hell he's even on record saying he's on the same level as Melo and Bosh and those likes. Take it from a guy who's watched him since he had a grotesque skin infection on his face as a rookie up until he became this limelight loving socialite ... he's no star.

Very solid player no doubt, but a star you see flashes and sustained abilities. Parsons thrived because of the attention on Harden and Howard. When he becomes the focus of a D he doesn't know what to do.

Watch some tape. Or maybe you have your crystal ball too like everyone else and 'just knows' that Parsons is on his way to stardom. LOL

1. I'm a Blazers fan and I'm laughing at the revisionist history that said Batum dominated Parsons all series. Parsons had stretches where he was keeping the Rockets alive. He certainly wasn't dominated by Batum.

2. Who would have guessed guys lile Haywood and Parsons would get overpaid in FA? Oh, only EVERYONE...

3. Ariza and Parsons last year had comparable stats, difference is Parsons was in his 3rd year and still improving while Ariza was in his contract year and the only other year he ever did close to that good was 2009... Another contract year.


4. I, nor anyone else here, has ever said Parsons will become some superstar. We have however noticed Rockets fans slowly go from thinking he's a good young player who is still improving to now an older player who has peaked and has possible injury concerns.

By the way, if everyone else has some crystal ball that makes them think differently than you the problem is likely with you and not everyone else who is in agreement.

goingfor28
07-19-2014, 01:24 PM
Wow, another super original Houston thread filed by moronic posts by idiot posters.
Right. Anyone who doesn't think the Rockets will go 98-0 including playoffs is an idiot

Wade n Fade
07-19-2014, 01:32 PM
I am not responsible for what others say, but I feel sorry for Houston. I feel like they needed to make a big splash to form a trio anyways. Bosh was the guy, but he stayed for a max in Miami. Morrey is still a good GM anyways. I feel like the Rockets are a piece away from being finals contenders. Right now, good team in the West. If they can get Rondo, they're finals contenders.

sixer04fan
07-19-2014, 01:35 PM
They gave themselves the best opportunity to land a Lebron, Melo, or Bosh. It didn't work out, but the NBA is all about putting yourself in the right position and then needing to get a little bit lucky for things to go your way.

They did not make a mistake. They executed a bold plan but it just didn't work out this time around.

Hellcrooner
07-19-2014, 01:50 PM
deppends on 2015 offseason.
If they strike out they ****ed up.

goku
07-19-2014, 01:55 PM
we lost Asik who pouted most of the season and sat out and lost Lin who wasn't even consistent just last year people were saying how bad and inconsistent lin was now he is a good player ????? lol ill give u asik being a good player but he didn't even play that many games last year and Parsons was swapped out for Ariza where we lost a lil bit offensively from what parsons give you we gained defensively from what Ariza gives you

i read somewhere that Parsons would have left anyway had we opt'd in to his contract based off the fact that he would be only getting paid 1 mil and would have felt disrespected Parsons got paid which is what he wanted in yall act like Lin and Asik we starters on the Rockets Bench production can be replaced from what we lost with those 2

jaydubb
07-19-2014, 02:01 PM
I think the rockets have been one of the biggest losers this off season so far to be honest.. Lost parsons Lin asik a 1st and 2nd and only added ariza so far.. We will see what they do with all that money (can't do any worse then lakers) but right now it's a downgrade imo.

Sactown
07-19-2014, 02:02 PM
If Houston manages to grab one of the superstars in free agency, we would all be hailing Morey as one of the greatest GMs in history, and if Dallas didn't offer Parsons the max they'd have a roster like

Beverly
Harden
Parsons
Bosh
Dwight.

.. reality is, the west is incredibly tough, and you have to make moves to set yourself up as a contender or you'll be stuck in the 8 legged race...

Can't blame Houston for what they did, even if it didn't pan out it was still the best move on the table

hugepatsfan
07-19-2014, 02:11 PM
They gave themselves the best opportunity to land a Lebron, Melo, or Bosh. It didn't work out, but the NBA is all about putting yourself in the right position and then needing to get a little bit lucky for things to go your way.

They did not make a mistake. They executed a bold plan but it just didn't work out this time around.

They didn't need to decline Parsons' option to do that though. In fact, if I'm not mistaken, declining the option actually cost them an extra half a mil or so in cap space.

No one is criticizing the Asik trade. It was a good move for the franchise. However, it does leave a void at backup C for next year and no one is going to be as good as Asik. He had no long term future with the franchise and was way overpaid for what he brought to them but that doesn't change the fact that they've downgraded at the backup C spot.

The Lin deal isn't really bad. I do think Rockets fans are underestimating what he brought though. They're letting how overpaid he was distort their opinions of him. He's a solid scorer off the bench. He's vastly overpaid for that role but it doesn't change the fact that losing him weakens their team. Especially when the things he brought - scoring and playmaking at the PG spot (he's much better than Beverly at those things) - they also lost in the move from Parsons to Asik. I see people keep saying how they had enough scoring and needed Ariza's defense but that ignored the fact that they lost their best 2 secondary scoring options.

On paper the Rockets are clearly weaker compared to last year and Rockets fans are in denial about that. I think any outside fans are overstating how much worse but Rockets fans are ignorantly ignoring that they are worse to some extent.

Greg.
07-19-2014, 02:40 PM
They didn't need to decline Parsons' option to do that though. In fact, if I'm not mistaken, declining the option actually cost them an extra half a mil or so in cap space.

No one is criticizing the Asik trade. It was a good move for the franchise. However, it does leave a void at backup C for next year and no one is going to be as good as Asik. He had no long term future with the franchise and was way overpaid for what he brought to them but that doesn't change the fact that they've downgraded at the backup C spot.

The Lin deal isn't really bad. I do think Rockets fans are underestimating what he brought though. They're letting how overpaid he was distort their opinions of him. He's a solid scorer off the bench. He's vastly overpaid for that role but it doesn't change the fact that losing him weakens their team. Especially when the things he brought - scoring and playmaking at the PG spot (he's much better than Beverly at those things) - they also lost in the move from Parsons to Asik. I see people keep saying how they had enough scoring and needed Ariza's defense but that ignored the fact that they lost their best 2 secondary scoring options.

On paper the Rockets are clearly weaker compared to last year and Rockets fans are in denial about that. I think any outside fans are overstating how much worse but Rockets fans are ignorantly ignoring that they are worse to some extent.

I don't think I've ever agreed with a post this long so much. The only thing I want to ad about Parsons is that I would assume they declined the option so that at the very least they could control whether or not they kept him (unlike next year). I've also seen the argument that we could've kept him and traded him later but the teams with available stars never seemed to be interested in a package around Parsons anyway

Jenceman
07-19-2014, 02:52 PM
Well a first round exit team got worse
Sent from my PM23300 using Tapatalk

Corey
07-19-2014, 03:02 PM
I'd rather have Parsons than Ariza.

I'd rather have Asik and Lin than a POTENTIAL lottery pick.

Yeah, they probably took a step back. They needed to make a move to propel them ahead of SAS, OKC, GWS, LAC, POR, and they didn't. Meanwhile, Dallas made strong moves, Sacramento and Phoenix are a year stronger, The Pelicans and Grizz are going to challenge.

Houston could be on the outside looking in if Howard doesnt have a monster season.

TheMightyHumph
07-19-2014, 03:03 PM
They gave themselves the best opportunity to land a Lebron, Melo, or Bosh. It didn't work out, but the NBA is all about putting yourself in the right position and then needing to get a little bit lucky for things to go your way.

They did not make a mistake. They executed a bold plan but it just didn't work out this time around.

To me, their mistake was letting Parsons become a RFA if they weren't going to match ANY offer-sheet.

Corey
07-19-2014, 03:15 PM
To me, their mistake was letting Parsons become a RFA if they weren't going to match ANY offer-sheet.
Yep. They could have had him for the QO, and ran it back with the same team or made a few smaller moves with the Asik+Lin trades.

Would Parsons have hit FA next offseason? Sure. But they lost him for nothing anyways, so why not get another year of him cheap?

They dun goofed.

SILVER SEAVER
07-19-2014, 03:28 PM
Could'a......Should'a.....Would'a. Welcome to disappointing summers in the NBA. As a Bulls fan we are used to them but we had a real solid one this summer. No Melo hogging the ball and cap space and instead we got a solid human being in Gasol with championship experience a great skillset for a seven footer, brought over our draft night acquisition who is versatile in Mirotic, drafted McBuckets, brought back Captain Kirk for leadership and sign Brooks for depth. Solid offseason Bulls Nation.

Saddletramp
07-19-2014, 03:39 PM
I'd rather have Parsons than Ariza.

For half the price, I'd rather have Ariza. Basically, if Morey would have resigned Parsons to that deal, The Rockets would have been done spending money for, oh, for about three years. They struck out with Bosh and with Carmelo so they wanted to add pieces to help (instead of land a third superstar, which there were none left by the time the Parsons deal had to be matched) and they couldn't do that if they re-signed Parsons to $15 million a year.

Basically, matching Parsons was the last monetary step they could make for 3 years without trading Harden, Howard or Parsons (and his contract wasn't easy to move) so Morey tipped his hat to Cuban and admitted defeat this time.



They didn't need to decline Parsons' option to do that though. In fact, if I'm not mistaken, declining the option actually cost them an extra half a mil or so in cap space.

I agree with just about everything else you said in this thread, but this point is a little less clear. Obviously hindsight is 20/20 but like I said before and numerous times over the past week if you don't get that extra star, you don't match Parsons. You're done when you match Parsons. Now there's talk that Parsons agent demanded that Morey make Parsons a restricted free agent to let the market decide his cost a year early and presumably to match and keep Parsons in the fold for years to play with Howard and Harden (this has been denied by Parsons but who knows, Parsons and Howard have the same agent and are good buddies-Parsons was one of the main guys bringing in Howard in the first place). Two problems happened with that and both are on Parsons. First, Parsons regressed a bit defensively last year and he had a few health concerns. I don't think he's proved that he's able to be that third guy alongside Howard and Harden. Fourth guy? Sure, even at $15 per; but not as the third guy. Secondly, Parsons went out and signed the very minute that he could a totally ludicrous contract offer sheet with the Mavs. I don't think it's any surprise that he signed for the max, but the player option and it only being three years, he played his hand too early. This gave the Rockets time enough to get turned down by Carmelo and Bosh but no time to flesh out the rest of the roster. Again, like I said before, Cuban used Parsons in his battle with Morey and Parsons was basically sweet talked into stabbing the Rockets in the back (that's a little dramatic, but hey, Mr. They Had A Third Star Right Here! acted a little dramatic himself last weekend with what he said).

Like I said multiple times over the past week: only time will tell. In a better system with Dirk, Parsons might light it up and be worth every penny that he just sign for but with the Rockets and what they are doing (and this is the main point of the whole situation) it would not have been a smart move to pay Parsons $15 million year and be cap tied to what they had the year before minus Asik and Lin.

Oh, and some people are saying Lin was terrible last year. He wasn't terrible, he's just not a guy that's worth 8 million in cap space and 15 million in money. That money would be better spent elsewhere. Asik was but he wanted to be a starter and getting grumpy Gus out of there for a protected first rounder was a smart move.

AddiX
07-19-2014, 03:43 PM
My biggest problem w what hou did was allowing parsons to hit free agency.

What contract # were they willing to meet? Why did they even think he wouldn't get offered a big deal with all these teams with extra cap space?

That was a huge screw up IMO. Could of held parsons for chump change, lost him for nothing instead

P&GRealist
07-19-2014, 05:07 PM
You keep saying this and u totally ignore the potential lottery pick from the asik trade.

you fail....over and over again. I've seen you write this exact thing multiple times.

Time to hop off?

Is that lottery pick gonna help u win the chip within the next 2-3 yrs?...



NOPE!



You got had a horrible offseason. I will not be surprised when The White Howard starts throwing around his annual tantrums.

Aust
07-19-2014, 05:12 PM
Could'a......Should'a.....Would'a. Welcome to disappointing summers in the NBA. As a Bulls fan we are used to them but we had a real solid one this summer. No Melo hogging the ball and cap space and instead we got a solid human being in Gasol with championship experience a great skillset for a seven footer, brought over our draft night acquisition who is versatile in Mirotic, drafted McBuckets, brought back Captain Kirk for leadership and sign Brooks for depth. Solid offseason Bulls Nation.

Not a Bulls thread.


Is that lottery pick gonna help u win the chip within the next 2-3 yrs?...



NOPE!



You got had a horrible offseason. I will not be surprised when The White Howard starts throwing around his annual tantrums.

How do you know that? They could draft a stud that helps them contend immediately and in the future.

houstonfan
07-19-2014, 05:40 PM
Ignorant poster:

You're late to the party. 2 months ago Parsons was dominated by Nic Batum. Lillard splashed the series winner on his mug. Remember that? Of course not.

1 month ago Parsons was making 900 K and team could have picked up yet another option to make him a good value player. However, Houston allowed him to test the market. Who would have guessed guys like Gordon Hayward and Parsons would get maxed out?

Two weeks ago Ariza and Parsons had comparable stats.

Today Ariza and Parsons still have comparable stas. Ariza gets 8 Million per. Can you do math?

Everyone keeps banking on Parsons becoming some sort of superstar player, hell he's even on record saying he's on the same level as Melo and Bosh and those likes. Take it from a guy who's watched him since he had a grotesque skin infection on his face as a rookie up until he became this limelight loving socialite ... he's no star.

Very solid player no doubt, but a star you see flashes and sustained abilities. Parsons thrived because of the attention on Harden and Howard. When he becomes the focus of a D he doesn't know what to do.

Watch some tape. Or maybe you have your crystal ball too like everyone else and 'just knows' that Parsons is on his way to stardom. LOL

Parsons was no where close to dominated by Batum in the series... And the Lillard shot wasnt Parsons fault.

astonmartin10
07-19-2014, 05:41 PM
Houston will bounce back. They still have a solid team but not a contending team just yet. Look at the last 10 years. To be at where they are now is incredible. Morey never rebuilt this team when they lost their two stars in TMAC and Yao.

Corey
07-19-2014, 07:11 PM
For half the price, I'd rather have Ariza.

Half the price? They could have had Parsons for pennies for another year.

Corey
07-19-2014, 07:14 PM
Not a Bulls thread.



How do you know that? They could draft a stud that helps them contend immediately and in the future.

And they could also draft someone who never sees the floor or turns out to bust.

So what's the point of factoring in something that is likely to be a minor impact?

Ariza's Better
07-19-2014, 07:44 PM
Do we really need another Rockets thread? We have a Morey and parsons thread already talking about this.

Saddletramp
07-19-2014, 07:49 PM
Half the price? They could have had Parsons for pennies for another year.

Stop cherry picking from the post. Go re-read it. All of it. You'll have your answer.

SILVER SEAVER
07-19-2014, 08:10 PM
They had a bad offseason. Signing Ariza saved it from being an abomination for a team that looked like a solid destination for the top two free agents this summer. The silver lining is they got rid of two expiring contracts that looked unmovable but like was mentioned in a previous post there is nobody now to backup Howard if he goes down with an injury.

Htownballa1622
07-19-2014, 08:16 PM
Is that lottery pick gonna help u win the chip within the next 2-3 yrs?...



NOPE!



You got had a horrible offseason. I will not be surprised when The White Howard starts throwing around his annual tantrums.

It could help facilitate a bigger trade which we could land someone that can help.

I'm just saying. We didn't lose asik for Nothing.

Corey
07-19-2014, 09:13 PM
Stop cherry picking from the post. Go re-read it. All of it. You'll have your answer.

Cherry picking? The first point you attempted to dispute was comparing Parsons at his Dallas price tag and Ariza at his Houston price tag.

They could have had Parsons back for 965k. They could have run it back with Asik, Parsons, Lin, Casspi on the roster and adding Johnson and Capela.

Running it back with the same roster would be better than what they did. Continuity is so underrated in the NBA.

Another year of development for Beverly, Parsons, Daniels, Moteijunas, Jones, Lin on top of more comfort with the remaining veterans...They would have improved just by sticking together.

Morey came out looking like a fool.

Aust
07-19-2014, 09:24 PM
And they could also draft someone who never sees the floor or turns out to bust.

So what's the point of factoring in something that is likely to be a minor impact?

The point is you don't know so you shouldn't just write something off.

NBA_Starter
07-19-2014, 09:58 PM
It is fair to say Houston made a lot of mistakes in this free agency period.

Saddletramp
07-19-2014, 10:08 PM
Cherry picking? The first point you attempted to dispute was comparing Parsons at his Dallas price tag and Ariza at his Houston price tag.

You just quoted my first sentence and tossed the rest of my statements aside. Picking the first cherry is still cherry picking. Let me help you out and bold the other relevant parts:


For half the price, I'd rather have Ariza. Basically, if Morey would have resigned Parsons to that deal, The Rockets would have been done spending money for, oh, for about three years. They struck out with Bosh and with Carmelo so they wanted to add pieces to help (instead of land a third superstar, which there were none left by the time the Parsons deal had to be matched) and they couldn't do that if they re-signed Parsons to $15 million a year.

Basically, matching Parsons was the last monetary step they could make for 3 years without trading Harden, Howard or Parsons (and his contract wasn't easy to move) so Morey tipped his hat to Cuban and admitted defeat this time.




I agree with just about everything else you said in this thread, but this point is a little less clear. Obviously hindsight is 20/20 but like I said before and numerous times over the past week if you don't get that extra star, you don't match Parsons. You're done when you match Parsons. Now there's talk that Parsons agent demanded that Morey make Parsons a restricted free agent to let the market decide his cost a year early and presumably to match and keep Parsons in the fold for years to play with Howard and Harden (this has been denied by Parsons but who knows, Parsons and Howard have the same agent and are good buddies-Parsons was one of the main guys bringing in Howard in the first place). Two problems happened with that and both are on Parsons. First, Parsons regressed a bit defensively last year and he had a few health concerns. I don't think he's proved that he's able to be that third guy alongside Howard and Harden. Fourth guy? Sure, even at $15 per; but not as the third guy. Secondly, Parsons went out and signed the very minute that he could a totally ludicrous contract offer sheet with the Mavs. I don't think it's any surprise that he signed for the max, but the player option and it only being three years, he played his hand too early. This gave the Rockets time enough to get turned down by Carmelo and Bosh but no time to flesh out the rest of the roster. Again, like I said before, Cuban used Parsons in his battle with Morey and Parsons was basically sweet talked into stabbing the Rockets in the back (that's a little dramatic, but hey, Mr. They Had A Third Star Right Here! acted a little dramatic himself last weekend with what he said).

Like I said multiple times over the past week: only time will tell. In a better system with Dirk, Parsons might light it up and be worth every penny that he just sign for but with the Rockets and what they are doing (and this is the main point of the whole situation) it would not have been a smart move to pay Parsons $15 million year and be cap tied to what they had the year before minus Asik and Lin.

Oh, and some people are saying Lin was terrible last year. He wasn't terrible, he's just not a guy that's worth 8 million in cap space and 15 million in money. That money would be better spent elsewhere. Asik was but he wanted to be a starter and getting grumpy Gus out of there for a protected first rounder was a smart move.



You went on to say:

They could have had Parsons back for 965k. They could have run it back with Asik, Parsons, Lin, Casspi on the roster and adding Johnson and Capela.

Running it back with the same roster would be better than what they did. Continuity is so underrated in the NBA.

Another year of development for Beverly, Parsons, Daniels, Moteijunas, Jones, Lin on top of more comfort with the remaining veterans...They would have improved just by sticking together.
Lin was gone at the end of next year at the latest. Morey tried to upgrade the team from guys that played pretty bad last year in Francisco Garcia and Casspi. He was ready to move on. I think most Rockets fans were, too.




Morey came out looking like a fool.

He made some bold moves and whiffed. Bi hardly call him a fool for that.

NBA_Starter
07-19-2014, 10:11 PM
I would easily have rather had Parsons.

goingfor28
07-19-2014, 10:30 PM
Morey is a genius. Stop making fun!

NBA_Starter
07-19-2014, 10:40 PM
So many Rockets threads..

Saddletramp
07-19-2014, 10:44 PM
I would easily have rather had Parsons.

I'm pretty sure most people, including myself, do. But, For half the price, I'd rather have Ariza. Basically, if Morey would have resigned Parsons to that deal, The Rockets would have been done spending money for, oh, for about three years. They struck out with Bosh and with Carmelo so they wanted to add pieces to help (instead of land a third superstar, which there were none left by the time the Parsons deal had to be matched) and they couldn't do that if they re-signed Parsons to $15 million a year.

Basically, matching Parsons was the last monetary step they could make for 3 years without trading Harden, Howard or Parsons (and his contract wasn't easy to move) so Morey tipped his hat to Cuban and admitted defeat this time. Obviously hindsight is 20/20 but like I said before and numerous times over the past week if you don't get that extra star, you don't match Parsons. You're done when you match Parsons. Now there's talk that Parsons agent demanded that Morey make Parsons a restricted free agent to let the market decide his cost a year early and presumably to match and keep Parsons in the fold for years to play with Howard and Harden (this has been denied by Parsons but who knows, Parsons and Howard have the same agent and are good buddies-Parsons was one of the main guys bringing in Howard in the first place). Two problems happened with that and both are on Parsons. First, Parsons regressed a bit defensively last year and he had a few health concerns. I don't think he's proved that he's able to be that third guy alongside Howard and Harden. Fourth guy? Sure, even at $15 per; but not as the third guy. Secondly, Parsons went out and signed the very minute that he could a totally ludicrous contract offer sheet with the Mavs. I don't think it's any surprise that he signed for the max, but the player option and it only being three years, he played his hand too early. This gave the Rockets time enough to get turned down by Carmelo and Bosh but no time to flesh out the rest of the roster. Again, like I said before, Cuban used Parsons in his battle with Morey and Parsons was basically sweet talked into stabbing the Rockets in the back (that's a little dramatic, but hey, Mr. They Had A Third Star Right Here! acted a little dramatic himself last weekend with what he said).

Like I said multiple times over the past week: only time will tell. In a better system with Dirk, Parsons might light it up and be worth every penny that he just sign for but with the Rockets and what they are doing (and this is the main point of the whole situation) it would not have been a smart move to pay Parsons $15 million year and be cap tied to what they had the year before minus Asik and Lin.

Saddletramp
07-19-2014, 10:49 PM
So many Rockets threads..

So many Rockets trolls and haters.

brandt
07-19-2014, 11:20 PM
Ok so
Lose asik, lin, parsons,1st rd pick for ariza and MAYBE a lotto pick. And if it is, a late one.
Still fail

Asik was an average backup. Houston will get somebody better for him when they get an almost guaranteed lottery pick. Lin played way below how he was expected to play especially for what he was getting paid, and he bombed in the playoffs. Chandler Parsons is overrated, overpaid and he failed to show up in the playoffs too, which is a huge reason why they were even knocked out of the first round. They needed someone like Ariza for their God awful defense and at least they got HIM. Yes, they definitely could have done better but they have NEVER had a great offseason anyway, so it shouldn't be a huge surprise. Lin was the only mistake because they could have gotten at least something for him, but he took a gamble. That's what GM's that want to win do.

ILLUSIONIST^248
07-19-2014, 11:24 PM
Yes
They lost parsons, asik, lin, 1st rd pick, and only added ariza
Fail

This sums it up pretty nicely.

Sactown
07-19-2014, 11:56 PM
This sums it up pretty nicely.
Nor really though

They dumped Asik a disgruntled backup expiring C for a 1st rounder

Moved Lins bad contract and a 1st rounder ( worse than the one they gained)

Bad part was losing Parsons, but you have to make these types of moves to land a potential superstar, granted they should of kept the extension and worked out an extension after the off season but hindsight is 20/20

Ariza isn't a great replacement but definitely serviceable

So ultimately they dumped two unwanted contracts and moved up in the draft

But, the swapped Parsons for Ariza

FlashBolt
07-20-2014, 12:13 AM
Houston didn't even want to play Lin. They wanted Beverley out there. As for Parsons, you'd be a fool to not take Ariza for half the price.. Parsons is not worth $15 million and anyone out there who thinks otherwise is just a Rockets hater. Ariza also plays better defense. Not saying he's better than Parsons but for half the price, he's a better contract. Asik was useless. Let's be honest.. Neither of them liked each other. Also, they might have given up a 1st round pick but Lin's contract was a joke and rightfully so, they got rid of him. Harden+Howard are going to have a tougher time but I expect Howard to step it up offensively. Still a playoff team IMO.

DemarDerozan
07-20-2014, 12:54 AM
They gave up Parsons who is 25 and might be a top five SF this year for Ariza who is in his prime and already inferior to Parsons.

What really happened is Morey gambled on Melo or Bosh signing with Houston and struck out. He not only struck out but lost arguably his second best player next to Harden.

He should be fired if the Rockets don't get past the first round this year.

DemarDerozan
07-20-2014, 12:59 AM
Houston didn't even want to play Lin. They wanted Beverley out there. As for Parsons, you'd be a fool to not take Ariza for half the price.. Parsons is not worth $15 million and anyone out there who thinks otherwise is just a Rockets hater. Ariza also plays better defense. Not saying he's better than Parsons but for half the price, he's a better contract. Asik was useless. Let's be honest.. Neither of them liked each other. Also, they might have given up a 1st round pick but Lin's contract was a joke and rightfully so, they got rid of him. Harden+Howard are going to have a tougher time but I expect Howard to step it up offensively. Still a playoff team IMO.

Howard is past his prime and will be at the Amare level within two seasons. He had his chance and blew it. He's not even a top 3 Center.

The only player I feel bad for is Harden. He left OKC to be the man on a playoff team. And Morey has gambled away the players that Harden grew with in favor of Dwight and the prospect of other superstars.

Not a Houston hater. But Morey really set this team back. They entered the offseason looking for upgrades in the PF and PG position... But lost their up and coming SF instead. They will be lucky to be an 8 seed.

RaiderLakersA's
07-20-2014, 01:03 AM
Yes, they did, move on. They are still a very good team.

This. Plus, I like the addition of Ariza. That's the one guy that the Lakers should have not let go.

Mr.B
07-20-2014, 01:13 AM
Ignorant poster:

You're late to the party. 2 months ago Parsons was dominated by Nic Batum. Lillard splashed the series winner on his mug. Remember that? Of course not.

1 month ago Parsons was making 900 K and team could have picked up yet another option to make him a good value player. However, Houston allowed him to test the market. Who would have guessed guys like Gordon Hayward and Parsons would get maxed out?

Two weeks ago Ariza and Parsons had comparable stats.

Today Ariza and Parsons still have comparable stas. Ariza gets 8 Million per. Can you do math?

Everyone keeps banking on Parsons becoming some sort of superstar player, hell he's even on record saying he's on the same level as Melo and Bosh and those likes. Take it from a guy who's watched him since he had a grotesque skin infection on his face as a rookie up until he became this limelight loving socialite ... he's no star.

Very solid player no doubt, but a star you see flashes and sustained abilities. Parsons thrived because of the attention on Harden and Howard. When he becomes the focus of a D he doesn't know what to do.

Watch some tape. Or maybe you have your crystal ball too like everyone else and 'just knows' that Parsons is on his way to stardom. LOL
Parsons has never said he's as good as Melo or Bosh. And Cuban, Nelson, or Carlisle have never said they expect Parsons to be a superstar. You're taking a few posters thoughts and projecting them on to the Mavs organization which is not fair or true. The Mavs obviously really wanted Parsons and knew they had to overpay to get him (since he was restricted). The fact is he's a young potential star (not superstar). He also wasn't the only one on that Rockets team that got lit up by Portland. Howard got handled pretty good by Aldridge and Harden got lit up by Lillard. The Rockets problem is not talent, their problem is coaching and lack of of a true PG.

DemarDerozan
07-20-2014, 01:19 AM
Parsons has never said he's as good as Melo or Bosh. And Cuban, Nelson, or Carlisle have never said they expect Parsons to be a superstar. You're taking a few posters thoughts and projecting them on to the Mavs organization which is not fair or true. The Mavs obviously really wanted Parsons and knew they had to overpay to get him (since he was restricted). The fact is he's a young potential star (not superstar). He also wasn't the only one on that Rockets team that got lit up by Portland. Howard got handled pretty good by Aldridge and Harden got lit up by Lillard. The Rockets problem is not talent, their problem is coaching and lack of of a true PG.

Honestly I'm not a Mavs or Rockets fan but I think Parsons (at age 25-29) will be >>> Melo or Bosh (at age 30-34).

Plus the Mavs have a top coach and Dirk/Monta/Chandler have the veteran experience to mentor Parsons and make the Mavs a top 3 team in the West (if they weren't already.)

Mr.B
07-20-2014, 01:39 AM
Honestly I'm not a Mavs or Rockets fan but I think Parsons (at age 25-29) will be >>> Melo or Bosh (at age 30-34).

Plus the Mavs have a top coach and Dirk/Monta/Chandler have the veteran experience to mentor Parsons and make the Mavs a top 3 team in the East (if they weren't already.)
I am a Mavs fan and would LOVE it if that were to happen but those are pretty lofty expectations. I honestly see Parsons getting to the level of a 20/5/5 player. That's a good borderline all-star player in the West. Keep in mind he's a forward and would have to beat out a ton of forwards to reach all star level. He'll be a very nice complement to Dirk and Monte. Most logical Mavs fans that really follow the team see Parsons the same way. None of us are expecting Parson to be some kind of superstar, just a very good cog in Carlisle's system that can help get them in position to win another title. He will help take some of the scoring burden off of Dirk and Monte and Carlisle should be able to help him become a better defensive player.

DemarDerozan
07-20-2014, 04:13 AM
Mavs will be a top 3 team in the *West.

nycericanguy
07-20-2014, 10:52 AM
I am a Mavs fan and would LOVE it if that were to happen but those are pretty lofty expectations. I honestly see Parsons getting to the level of a 20/5/5 player. That's a good borderline all-star player in the West. Keep in mind he's a forward and would have to beat out a ton of forwards to reach all star level. He'll be a very nice complement to Dirk and Monte. Most logical Mavs fans that really follow the team see Parsons the same way. None of us are expecting Parson to be some kind of superstar, just a very good cog in Carlisle's system that can help get them in position to win another title. He will help take some of the scoring burden off of Dirk and Monte and Carlisle should be able to help him become a better defensive player.

borderline all star?...lol. those are HOF numbers! How many players in history have consistently put up 20/5/5... how many players did it last year? LBJ & Durant I believe were the only two.

eternal slumber
07-20-2014, 12:45 PM
i remember when majority of PSD said that Lin and Asik contracts can't be moved but Morey was able to move them even get a nice asset from the Asik deal.

Asik didn't want to be a back up center to Howard and Lin even though put up some nice number, he was very inconsistent and his game didn't jived with HArden

they opted out on Parsons deal because they want to lock him up, remember if Bosh signed with Houston, they would have matched that offer from Dallas.

if Houston matched that offer from Dallas without Bosh, they'll would tied up so much money without any flexibility and in a way remained the same team.

Morey took a gamble and it didn't pan out, such, that's how gamble works.

if Bosh signed here, we will be talking about the best starting line up in the league for a couple of years with some depth.

did the off season ended already? if anyone expect that this will be the team rolling into the season, they are wrong.

we still have some cap space and some nice piece available on the market, just don't under estimate Morey, he'll make this team much better before the start of the season.

Chronz
07-20-2014, 01:07 PM
They gave up Parsons who is 25 and might be a top five SF this year for Ariza who is in his prime and already inferior to Parsons.

What really happened is Morey gambled on Melo or Bosh signing with Houston and struck out. He not only struck out but lost arguably his second best player next to Harden.

He should be fired if the Rockets don't get past the first round this year.

Wait, did you just say Harden and Parsons were arguably their 2 best players? LMFAO. Parsons was a clear 3rd guy and Harden's propensity for disappearing in the playoffs should DQ him in a conversation vs Dwight. Morey's gambling was done with his owners permission and he wouldn't get fired for not hitting the jackpot, hes built up far too much equity with Les for such a shortsighted firing.

Tony_Starks
07-20-2014, 01:07 PM
Yawn. When has such a mediocre team garnered this much attention?

Chronz
07-20-2014, 01:10 PM
Yawn. When has such a mediocre team garnered this much attention?
The Lakers, the last few years.

Tony_Starks
07-20-2014, 01:30 PM
The Lakers, the last few years.

Really? Lakers are 4 years removed from their latest of many rings. The last time the Rockets were contenders OJ was in the Broncho on the freeway.

And this isn't a Laker thread btw, keep the trolling to a minimum. Thanks.

DemarDerozan
07-20-2014, 01:40 PM
Wait, did you just say Harden and Parsons were arguably their 2 best players? LMFAO. Parsons was a clear 3rd guy and Harden's propensity for disappearing in the playoffs should DQ him in a conversation vs Dwight. Morey's gambling was done with his owners permission and he wouldn't get fired for not hitting the jackpot, hes built up far too much equity with Les for such a shortsighted firing.

The Rockets would not make the playoffs without Harden. And IMO Parsons is as valuable as a declining Dwight. In 2012-13 with Parsons, Lin and Asik the Rockets season had the same ultimate outcome as 2013-14.

2012-13 without Dwight- 45-37 and lose 4-2 to OKC in the first round
2013-14 adding Dwight- 54-28 and lose 4-2 to Portland in the first round

Now they have lost three key players and a draft pick for Ariza. Welcome back to the lottery Houston. And good bye Morey after next season. Maybe they will do Harden a favor and trade him back to OKC. Worked for Afflalo and Tyson Chandler.

SPURSFAN1
07-20-2014, 01:48 PM
The Rockets would not make the playoffs without Harden. And IMO Parsons is as valuable as a declining Dwight. In 2012-13 with Parsons, Lin and Asik the Rockets season had the same ultimate outcome as 2013-14.

2012-13 without Dwight- 45-37 and lose 4-2 to OKC in the first round
2013-14 adding Dwight- 54-28 and lose 4-2 to Portland in the first round

Now they have lost three key players and a draft pick for Ariza. Welcome back to the lottery Houston. And good bye Morey after next season. Maybe they will do Harden a favor and trade him back to OKC. Worked for Afflalo and Tyson Chandler.

Dwight and Harden are houston's best players. This isn't even debatable.

Chronz
07-20-2014, 01:48 PM
Really? Lakers are 4 years removed from their latest of many rings.
We're tlaking about a mediocre team tho. Which the Lakers were/are


The last time the Rockets were contenders OJ was in the Broncho on the freeway.
I disagree but you're entitled to your opinion.


And this isn't a Laker thread btw, keep the trolling to a minimum. Thanks.
Huh? YOU asked a question, I gave you my answer. Thats the opposite of trolling but looking for ulterior motives is the biggest white flag possible so congrats on that.

DemarDerozan
07-20-2014, 01:49 PM
In the past three years the Rockets have lost:

Goran Dragic
Kyle Lowry
Chandler Parsons
Omer Asik
Jeremy Lin
Terrence Ross
and
Luis Scola


All because they were posturing for superstars

I'm done taking about this mediocre team and their ****** GM

Verbal Christ
07-20-2014, 01:57 PM
In the past three years the Rockets have lost:

Goran Dragic
Kyle Lowry
Chandler Parsons
Omer Asik
Jeremy Lin
Terrence Ross
and
Luis Scola

All because they were posturing for superstars

I'm done taking about this mediocre team and their ****** GM

You're the one making absurd comments about the team. Just admit you're mad and don't even know why. Declining Dwight? Yea look up his playoff stats. Posturing for stars? Harden and Howard landed in the last 2 years. Always in the hunt to have the ability to upgrade the roster. All those guys you have listed off are very good players right according to you and your list, who was the GM that found that talent?

If you're tired about talking about the Rockets then shut up and quit posting ridiuculous crap, unless you like most everyone else here just like to throw up bullshiit and see what sticks. NIce try.

Chronz
07-20-2014, 02:01 PM
The Rockets would not make the playoffs without Harden.
Even if I believed you (and admitted that they would have a shot without Dwight but WITH Asik) that would not make one player better than the other, it would mean he has a greater replacement value to his team. I remember back when Yao was the Rockets best player but the team was rudderless without Tmac. They both played important roles, one was more valuable, the other more productive, but had the Rockets not had Dikembe as their backup (as opposed to Yao working with the likes of Luther Head replacing Tmac) then Yao would be bother their MVP and Production King.

In this case, Dwight has both over Parsons and Im not sold on Harden being more important either, particularly given his seemingly annual ghost playoff play. Any sort of objective proof would help here. ANYTHING at all really. Since the subjective awards/accolades/acclaim doesn't vibe with reality, some sort of objective measure would help your case greatly.


And IMO Parsons is as valuable as a declining Dwight.
Declining Dwight doesn't negate an All-NBA appearance and vastly superior production.


In 2012-13 with Parsons, Lin and Asik the Rockets season had the same ultimate outcome as 2013-14.
Doesn't mean they werent a far better team. Back in CP3's first year with the Clips, we made it the 2nd round, then we lost in the first round and we again lost in the 2nd round this year, only a fool would think the team slipped or even remained stagnant.


2012-13 without Dwight- 45-37 and lose 4-2 to OKC in the first round
2013-14 adding Dwight- 54-28 and lose 4-2 to Portland in the first round
Dealing in absolutes without considering the context isn't my type of analysis. Fact remains, the Rockets IMPROVED. Im not gonna let an arbitrary standard that doesn't consider the competition or margin of victory (in this case a depleted Thunder vs a fully healthy Portland team) prevent me from acknowledging the FACT that the team improved.


Now they have lost three key players and a draft pick for Ariza. Welcome back to the lottery Houston. And good bye Morey after next season. Maybe they will do Harden a favor and trade him back to OKC. Worked for Afflalo and Tyson Chandler.
That you consider a guy like Asik (who never bought into the team concept, played sparingly and was often a detriment as a result) a "Key Player", tells me all I need to know. And Lin was a pivotal BENCH piece, I honestly dont know how much that hurts, I suppose its possible they go back down abit but that depends on how Beverly responds and just how stacked the West is. When OKC lost James Harden, they didn't drop off the way you're predicting from Lin's absence.

But plz do elaborate on how its "worked" out for the players you mentioned.

DemarDerozan
07-20-2014, 02:01 PM
You're the one making absurd comments about the team. Just admit you're mad and don't even know why. Declining Dwight? Yea look up his playoff stats. Posturing for stars? Harden and Howard landed in the last 2 years. Always in the hunt to have the ability to upgrade the roster. All those guys you have listed off are very good players right according to you and your list, who was the GM that found that talent?

If you're tired about talking about the Rockets then shut up and quit posting ridiuculous crap, unless you like most everyone else here just like to throw up bullshiit and see what sticks. NIce try.

I take Parsons and any other two players on that list over Dwight and Ariza. And I'm not mad I just think that Houston blew a good opportunity.

Tony_Starks
07-20-2014, 02:06 PM
We're tlaking about a mediocre team tho. Which the Lakers were/are


I disagree but you're entitled to your opinion.


Huh? YOU asked a question, I gave you my answer. Thats the opposite of trolling but looking for ulterior motives is the biggest white flag possible so congrats on that.

Serious question: are you seriously under the impression Houston is a contender or do you just defend them because Morey is part of the spreadsheet posse? I ask because I've also seen you defend the Grizzlies moves as well as Phillys, also prominent analytics driven teams. I don't think it's a coincidence.....

Verbal Christ
07-20-2014, 02:08 PM
I take Parsons and any other two players on that list over Dwight and Ariza. And I'm not mad I just think that Houston blew a good opportunity.


Of course you would because you smoke monkey nuts of crack. You've made yourself look like a damn fool and I've said all I needed to as well as other posters to expose you for another hater posting subjective nonsense that is as close to fraudulent as you can get. What opportunity was blown exactly? To overpay for Parsons and hamstring the team financially in order to field the same team that lost last year? Yea that makes a lot of sense. Carry on.

Chronz
07-20-2014, 02:11 PM
In the past three years the Rockets have lost:

Goran Dragic
Kyle Lowry
1 of them had to go so lets not double count here. That he chose Lin was a move done before Harden ever showed up, he had different motives then.


Chandler Parsons
Omer Asik
He also got Parsons as a 2nd round pick for YEARS at a discount rate. Asik gave them 1 quality year and he ditched him before having to pay superstar money for him.


Jeremy Lin
Same thing as above, they got some value out of him and dumped him right before the time to pay up came.


Terrence Ross
and
Luis Scola
Not seeing whats so special here, considering they added Dwight+Harden in the ensuing aftermath.


All because they were posturing for superstars
Which they landed.


I'm done taking about this mediocre team and their ****** GM
Heres hoping you are, you clearly know very little about them. :cheers:

Shlumpledink
07-20-2014, 02:58 PM
Ariza is not better than Parsons, only at playing the passing lanes, but to a lot of people on this board I guess that means better at defense.

Chronz
07-20-2014, 03:40 PM
Serious question: are you seriously under the impression Houston is a contender or do you just defend them because Morey is part of the spreadsheet posse? I ask because I've also seen you defend the Grizzlies moves as well as Phillys, also prominent analytics driven teams. I don't think it's a coincidence.....
Now you're trolling like a pro. As for your question that revolves around the giant question mark I have on Harden. If he stops going ghost come playoffs, then yeah, they are legit. You've seen me defend alot of teams, that the "analytic driven" moves (which are becoming more and more frequent) are the ones you think I defend probably isn't a coincidence, but Im not seeing how thats a negative if true.

Tony_Starks
07-20-2014, 05:01 PM
Now you're trolling like a pro. As for your question that revolves around the giant question mark I have on Harden. If he stops going ghost come playoffs, then yeah, they are legit. You've seen me defend alot of teams, that the "analytic driven" moves (which are becoming more and more frequent) are the ones you think I defend probably isn't a coincidence, but Im not seeing how thats a negative if true.

Who said its negative? I'm just stating the obvious, you blatantly defend the moves of teams that are known to rely heavily on analytics. Which is why I take all of your observations with a grain of advances stat salt.

Thank you for entertaining my obvious troll question, the privilege is all mine....

alexander_37
07-20-2014, 05:06 PM
9 teams had a worse record than NO last season and NO added Asik. It could be a lottery pick, but it likely won't be a great pick.

Sugar coating it can only go so far.

Asik literally did nothing last year, we gained a pick and cap

Ariza to Parsons is a lateral cost cutting move.

Lin is pretty replaceable honestly he was just a spot up shooter by the end of the season. Cost cutting.

Harden, Jones, Beverly, and a few others are young and improving. The Rockets are getting better and have cap space to spare.

Yes it's kind of a cop out but everyone other than and maybe even Dwight is getting better with time. People forget James Harden is only 24. Tell me the last time a star player stopped improving at 24 years old.

Chronz
07-20-2014, 05:46 PM
Who said its negative? I'm just stating the obvious, you blatantly defend the moves of teams that are known to rely heavily on analytics. Which is why I take all of your observations with a grain of advances stat salt.

Thank you for entertaining my obvious troll question, the privilege is all mine....
Lol, why would i be more likely to defend moves with less objectivity to them?

P&GRealist
07-20-2014, 06:01 PM
Asik literally did nothing last year, we gained a pick and cap

Ariza to Parsons is a lateral cost cutting move.

Lin is pretty replaceable honestly he was just a spot up shooter by the end of the season. Cost cutting.

Harden, Jones, Beverly, and a few others are young and improving. The Rockets are getting better and have cap space to spare.

Yes it's kind of a cop out but everyone other than and maybe even Dwight is getting better with time. People forget James Harden is only 24. Tell me the last time a star player stopped improving at 24 years old.

Ariza is a contract yr guy. He did the same thing in 08-09 in the Lakers championship yr and didn't play up to par until 13-14, his next contract yr.

You'll have good moments from Trevor, but don't expect the high level of play like last yr.

alexander_37
07-20-2014, 06:45 PM
Ariza is a contract yr guy. He did the same thing in 08-09 in the Lakers championship yr and didn't play up to par until 13-14, his next contract yr.

You'll have good moments from Trevor, but don't expect the high level of play like last yr.

All they are looking IMO is a spot up shooter, defender, a few boards , and some nice dunks.

Chandler had a more diverse skill set like passing, ball handling ( Ariza is a god awful ball handler), and overall glue guy.

Bruno
07-20-2014, 07:21 PM
they got a bit smart.

they got worse. i like ariza but they may have had the worst off season in the NBA

ILLUSIONIST^248
07-20-2014, 07:32 PM
This sums it up pretty nicely.
Nor really though

They dumped Asik a disgruntled backup expiring C for a 1st rounder

Moved Lins bad contract and a 1st rounder ( worse than the one they gained)

Bad part was losing Parsons, but you have to make these types of moves to land a potential superstar, granted they should of kept the extension and worked out an extension after the off season but hindsight is 20/20

Ariza isn't a great replacement but definitely serviceable

So ultimately they dumped two unwanted contracts and moved up in the draft

But, the swapped Parsons for Ariza


The bottom line is they lost good players and only got one back. No matter how you slice it they got worse.

Tony_Starks
07-20-2014, 08:35 PM
The bottom line is they lost good players and only got one back. No matter how you slice it they got worse.

Pretty much. People have all these excuses, explanations, and justifications but it isn't rocket science. They lost some pieces to the puzzle, and Harden + Howard have already shown they're not enough to contend.

alexander_37
07-20-2014, 08:44 PM
Pretty much. People have all these excuses, explanations, and justifications but it isn't rocket science. They lost some pieces to the puzzle, and Harden + Howard have already shown they're not enough to contend.

Dude Harden is 24 how can you write him off as not good enough when he probably won't peak for at least 2 years, he will get better.

Iron24th
07-20-2014, 08:46 PM
I agree with people saying they lost a step in this offseason.

They were 4th last year, they'll probably be 5-7th seed this season.

Sactown
07-20-2014, 09:09 PM
The bottom line is they lost good players and only got one back. No matter how you slice it they got worse.

They absolutely got worse, but it was a move they had to make to land another star...

They struck out, but that happens sometime.. you have to remain aggressive

mjt20mik
07-20-2014, 09:12 PM
I like the Ariza pickup, but they lost so much depth this offseason.

Verbal Christ
07-20-2014, 10:03 PM
Pretty much. People have all these excuses, explanations, and justifications but it isn't rocket science. They lost some pieces to the puzzle, and Harden + Howard have already shown they're not enough to contend.

So you're going to make a sweeping statement like that after Howard/Harden's first year playing together? LOL Why cover up your obvious despise with such an ignorant comment? Did the Heat win the ring their first year together? If this had been their 3rd or 4th year playing together then your comment may hold a little bit more water, but as constructed its a sieve and It would be easier if you just flat out said you hate the Rockets, Houston as a city etc... etc.... people like you who somehow try to validate their distaste for this franchise by subjective statements are foolish.

Tony_Starks
07-20-2014, 10:14 PM
Dude Harden is 24 how can you write him off as not good enough when he probably won't peak for at least 2 years, he will get better.

Offensively he may get more defined perhaps. Defensively he is a liability and it's pretty rare that defenders that bad change. Unless maybe he gets a coach that called him out on it and challenged him....

Tony_Starks
07-20-2014, 10:19 PM
So you're going to make a sweeping statement like that after Howard/Harden's first year playing together? LOL Why cover up your obvious despise with such an ignorant comment? Did the Heat win the ring their first year together? If this had been their 3rd or 4th year playing together then your comment may hold a little bit more water, but as constructed its a sieve and It would be easier if you just flat out said you hate the Rockets, Houston as a city etc... etc.... people like you who somehow try to validate their distaste for this franchise by subjective statements are foolish.


Despise? Ignorant? Hate? Foolish? Distaste? Dude chill out and have a beer, or go watch a chick flick or something because you sound real emotional.


Nobody "despises" mediocre teams. That would be like me having "distaste" for the Atlanta Hawks. When a team screws up they get called on it just like everyone else so please stop the bloodclot crying.....

Verbal Christ
07-22-2014, 01:16 PM
Despise? Ignorant? Hate? Foolish? Distaste? Dude chill out and have a beer, or go watch a chick flick or something because you sound real emotional.


Nobody "despises" mediocre teams. That would be like me having "distaste" for the Atlanta Hawks. When a team screws up they get called on it just like everyone else so please stop the bloodclot crying.....

pfffff then stop speaking on them. Every other day there is a bash H'town thread and you sure go out of your way to jab and mock. Your funny. Get over Dwight already dude, its been a year.

The Houston Rockets .... the most polarizing "mediocre" team of all time LMAO

jimm120
07-22-2014, 01:33 PM
LOST:
Lin
Asik
Parsons
1st rounder

GAINED:
1st rounder (higher than the one they gave up)
Ariza


While they did two good things, the team is definitely weaker.

They better hope that higher pick which will probably fall around #8-#15 turns out to be a worthwhile player and that they can sign another top guy next season.

They got weaker in the short term but still have a chance to be strong in the long end of things.

And they got eliminated in the 1st round too...

IgglesFanInCO
07-22-2014, 02:08 PM
pfffff then stop speaking on them. Every other day there is a bash H'town thread and you sure go out of your way to jab and mock. Your funny. Get over Dwight already dude, its been a year.

The Houston Rockets .... the most polarizing "mediocre" team of all time LMAO

When fans go out of their way to unjustifiably and annoyingly hype their team to a near unheard of extent, they get the same annoying-ness right back at them when things don't go their way, just look at the Lakers. Its just how it is, if you want to get upset at anyone get upset at many of your fellow Rocket fans for acting like pompous children for the past year.

Houston was my second favorite team in the league just a short while ago, and now there are few teams I hate more. And it is almost entirely because of the PSD Rockets fanbase lately.

Your team gambled and lost, no they didnt completely lose every move, but overall they had a bad offseason, its not the end of the world, just deal with it and get over it.

I'm not condoning the Rocket bashing behavior lately either, thats been stupid as all holy hell, but you have to see the obvious reason behind it right? People arent attacking your team unprovoked, thats for sure.

I feel bad for the really awesome Houston fans that have to deal with this backlash

P&GRealist
07-29-2014, 12:21 PM
LOST:
Lin
Asik
Parsons
1st rounder

GAINED:
1st rounder (higher than the one they gave up)
Ariza


While they did two good things, the team is definitely weaker.

They better hope that higher pick which will probably fall around #8-#15 turns out to be a worthwhile player and that they can sign another top guy next season.

They got weaker in the short term but still have a chance to be strong in the long end of things.

And they got eliminated in the 1st round too...

Thus has been my feeling. They've lost way more than they've gained.

GREATNESS ONE
07-29-2014, 12:22 PM
:sad2: close this thread too


Llullz

pebloemer
07-29-2014, 12:44 PM
It wasn't a particularly glamorous off-season for them, but it is too early to call it a disaster. With the exception of the Miami Heat, teams aren't built in a single off-season. Morey took calculated risks in an effort to elevate the core of his team to the point where they could contend for a title. The risks didn't pan out, but he still maintains the flexibility to bring assets through trade exceptions and cap space. They are still a really strong team.

Htownballa1622
07-29-2014, 01:29 PM
Thus has been my feeling. They've lost way more than they've gained.

Surprise, surprise.

You bump this thread as well. SMH

goingfor28
07-29-2014, 01:35 PM
Should prob close this too since it isn't sucking houston dick. Only houston love threads are allowed now. No posting anything negative even if it's true

Hawkeye15
07-29-2014, 01:41 PM
Houston has had a bad offseason, but they can't knee jerk it and do something stupid now. Just keep yourselves positioned for the trade deadline or next summer. D12/Harden are still plenty young enough for Morey not to panic.

SlimKid
07-29-2014, 01:42 PM
PSD, where criticism is construed as "hate"

Goose17
07-29-2014, 02:11 PM
Feel free to make threads about Phoenix players getting DUIs or whatever else... but if you make a thread about Dwight dry humping 15 year olds girls or the abundance of children he has with different women, expect to be banned.

SPURSFAN1
07-29-2014, 02:12 PM
Feel free to make threads about Phoenix players getting DUIs or whatever else... but if you make a thread about Dwight dry humping 15 year olds girls or the abundance of children he has with different women, expect to be banned.

Dwight was dry himping 15 year olds? I don't even know what to say. :laugh:

Goose17
07-29-2014, 02:22 PM
Dwight was dry himping 15 year olds? I don't even know what to say. :laugh:

lol, I don't know, he was involved in some nonsense about two teenage girls around 15/16 not too long ago, didn't pay much attention to it, the scandals and tabloid B.S is usually just that, B.S...

Point still stands though, the stuff with Houston fans was going a bit far and was was excessive, but an outright ban on discussing those topics feels short sighted at best. If we can't have criticism aimed at Houston players we shouldn't be allowed to have criticism aimed at any player on any team just in case it's perceived as hate. That would leave us with little to discuss though...

So... how's the weather out in San Antonio?

mightybosstone
07-29-2014, 02:27 PM
lol, I don't know, he was involved in some nonsense about two teenage girls around 15/16 not too long ago, didn't pay much attention to it, the scandals and tabloid B.S is usually just that, B.S...

Point still stands though, the stuff with Houston fans was going a bit far and was was excessive, but an outright ban on discussing those topics feels short sighted at best. If we can't have criticism aimed at Houston players we shouldn't be allowed to have criticism aimed at any player on any team just in case it's perceived as hate. That would leave us with little to discuss though...

So... how's the weather out in San Antonio?

This isn't a freedom of speech issue. It's a baiting issue. Threads are specifically being made with the purpose of baiting Rockets fans, and it's getting out of hand. How many Rockets threads have been created in the general NBA forum in the last 2-3 weeks? 15? 20? And how many of them had obvious slants against the Rockets? Probably all of them.

Besides, I don't know what you're complaining about. Posters like Thuglife and P&Grealist will just go out of their way to turn non-Rockets threads into Rockets hate threads. If you want to spend all of your time on the NBA forum ripping on Rockets players, I assure you that you'll still have an outlet to do so. At least this way there will be more diversification of threads for you to do it in.

SMH!
07-29-2014, 02:32 PM
horrible offseason for houston

Goose17
07-29-2014, 02:33 PM
This isn't a freedom of speech issue. It's a baiting issue. Threads are specifically being made with the purpose of baiting Rockets fans, and it's getting out of hand.

Agreed, it's getting out of hand. But it IS a freedom of speech issue. How many people are making those bait threads? One guy? Two guys? Three guys? Then you infract/ban those guys, you don't enforce some daft rule where nobody is allowed to discuss Houston in a negative way at all, ever.





Besides, I don't know what you're complaining about.

I'm complaining about one teams fan base getting preferential treatment because they probably spammed the report button and whined until they got their way.

Sorry, but how can you tell an entire forum never to criticise anything any player on a specific team does or says. Either you extend that courtesy to every team or you don't have that rule in place at all.

It's ludicrous. If a specific person is baiting, report them, get their account banned or suspended or whatever. Don't prohibit an entire forum from discussing a single team just in case it offends MBT and FOB. Sorry, I don't agree with that at all.

The hate got out of hand, but it was only two or three people, not the entire forum.

NYKnickFanatic
07-29-2014, 02:37 PM
It's so funny seeing all these Houston fans crying. I have seen quite a few of them bash the Knicks/Melo but you can not say anything bad about Dwight, Harden or the Rockets, or they go crying to SI.

:laugh2:

NYKnickFanatic
07-29-2014, 02:40 PM
Agreed, it's getting out of hand. But it IS a freedom of speech issue. How many people are making those bait threads? One guy? Two guys? Three guys? Then you infract/ban those guys, you don't enforce some daft rule where nobody is allowed to discuss Houston in a negative way at all, ever.





I'm complaining about one teams fan base getting preferential treatment because they probably spammed the report button and whined until they got their way.

Sorry, but how can you tell an entire forum never to criticise anything any player on a specific team does or says. Either you extend that courtesy to every team or you don't have that rule in place at all.

It's ludicrous. If a specific person is baiting, report them, get their account banned or suspended or whatever. Don't prohibit an entire forum from discussing a single team just in case it offends MBT and FOB. Sorry, I don't agree with that at all.

The hate got out of hand, but it was only two or three people, not the entire forum.

http://www.nkayesel.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/the-rock-slow-clap.gif

mightybosstone
07-29-2014, 02:43 PM
Agreed, it's getting out of hand. But it IS a freedom of speech issue. How many people are making those bait threads? One guy? Two guys? Three guys? Then you infract/ban those guys, you don't enforce some daft rule where nobody is allowed to discuss Houston in a negative way at all, ever.
I doubt very seriously this rule will be in effect forever. But how many threads do we honestly need to discuss how much people hate the Rockets right now? Is there a thread you'd really like to create that specifically targets the Rockets in a negative way that could honestly be constructive at this point?

Besides, the mods aren't completely jerks. If you really, really need to create a thread that is of a different topic, isn't baiting and specifically targets Houston, then PM the mods and ask what they think. You're the one making it a freedom of speech issue, not the mods.


I'm complaining about one teams fan base getting preferential treatment because they probably spammed the report button and whined until they got their way.

Sorry, but how can you tell an entire forum never to criticise anything any player on a specific team does or says. Either you extend that courtesy to every team or you don't have that rule in place at all.

It's ludicrous. If a specific person is baiting, report them, get their account banned or suspended or whatever. Don't prohibit an entire forum from discussing a single team just in case it offends MBT and FOB. Sorry, I don't agree with that at all.

The hate got out of hand, but it was only two or three people, not the entire forum.
Personally, I agree that the punishment should have been directed at specific posters instead of the entirety of PSD. But I can understand why they went that route. It's much harder to monitor a handful of posters then to just make a blanket rule that impacts everybody.

And so what if we reported these threads to the mods? Should we not have the ability to do that if we feel like threads are being created specifically for the purpose of baiting our fan base? There are only so many tools we posters have at our disposal. If it were up to me, I'd say we should just let all threads be allowed and let the bickering commence regardless of the language or how heated arguments get. But the last two times I didn't report baiting and I got into arguments, I got banned. I'd rather not get banned. :shrug:

mightybosstone
07-29-2014, 02:44 PM
It's so funny seeing all these Houston fans crying. I have seen quite a few of them bash the Knicks/Melo but you can not say anything bad about Dwight, Harden or the Rockets, or they go crying to SI.

:laugh2:

When was the last time you saw a Melo or a Knicks hate thread? There have probably been 20-25 Rockets hate threads since that last happened, and that's a pretty conservative estimation.

LongIslandIcedZ
07-29-2014, 02:51 PM
It's so funny seeing all these Houston fans crying. I have seen quite a few of them bash the Knicks/Melo but you can not say anything bad about Dwight, Harden or the Rockets, or they go crying to SI.

:laugh2:

When was the last time you saw a Melo or a Knicks hate thread? There have probably been 20-25 Rockets hate threads since that last happened, and that's a pretty conservative estimation.

You've never seen a thread dissolve into a Knicks/Lakers hate thread? I have a hard tim believing that.

NYKnickFanatic
07-29-2014, 02:52 PM
When was the last time you saw a Melo or a Knicks hate thread? There have probably been 20-25 Rockets hate threads since that last happened, and that's a pretty conservative estimation.

There has been a good amount over the season. Every team gets their shine, now it's the Rockets turn.

So weather the storm and quit crying about it.

mightybosstone
07-29-2014, 02:54 PM
You've never seen a thread dissolve into a Knicks/Lakers hate thread? I have a hard tim believing that.

There's a huge difference between a general thread eventually breaking down into specific arguments for/against certain players/teams and the creation of threads specifically for/against certain players/teams. You can't prevent the former, as conversation has a will of its own and flows organically. But it's totally unnecessary for there to be a half a dozen threads on the front page devoted to bashing a specific team and their fan base.

mightybosstone
07-29-2014, 02:57 PM
There has been a good amount over the season. Every team gets their shine, now it's the Rockets turn.

So weather the storm and quit crying about it.

I've been on these forums for more than seven years and I can't recall a single time where the Knicks ever got this much hate and had this many derogatory threads in this short period of time. The Lakers and Heat? Sure. But not the Knicks. If anything, most of the hate after Melo came to New York came from threads created by Knicks fans to tout how good their team was going to be.

Goose17
07-29-2014, 02:58 PM
And so what if we reported these threads to the mods? Should we not have the ability to do that if we feel like threads are being created specifically for the purpose of baiting our fan base? There are only so many tools we posters have at our disposal. If it were up to me, I'd say we should just let all threads be allowed and let the bickering commence regardless of the language or how heated arguments get. But the last two times I didn't report baiting and I got into arguments, I got banned. I'd rather not get banned. :shrug:

No, you SHOULD report the threads, but the punishment should be reserved for those responsible for the baiting/trolling, not some massive ban hammer across the entire forum.

It sets a dangerous precedent. What if the Dubs finish dead last next season and people make threads about how much Kerr sucks as a coach, how they should have kept Jackson, how Curry can't play defense, how Bogut is overrated and can't stay healthy, blah blah blah... whatever. Do I then get to have the entire forum banned from discussing my team?

Surely I do, otherwise it's favoritism.

It just seems like a strange way of handling it. Houstons lackluster offseason should be up for discussion, their Ariza/Parsons switch should be up for discussion, the way Harden and Dwight handled Parsons leaving should be up for discussion. It's all relevant.

goingfor28
07-29-2014, 02:58 PM
horrible offseason for houston
Ban!

Saddletramp
07-29-2014, 02:58 PM
I've never reported anybody for anything yet when I've called out some terrible posters making idiotic baiting threads/posts I got some demerits and I even got banned a few days for arguing with that ice c guy who was clearly someone's troll account that probably still posts here (the ice c account is still banned so I'm guessing the mods caught on).

If there's an actual story then post it. If you want to create another "Did Houston make a mistake" or "Lookit Harden's D!" then get the **** out of here and just type your thoughts in a current thread.

Seriously, I don't go trolling other fan bases or talk **** about other players constantly just to be a jerk. I don't know why that gets some of you guys off. Go get high or go get laid, even if that means you have to pay for a hooker.

L8kers4life
07-29-2014, 03:08 PM
I doubt very seriously this rule will be in effect forever. But how many threads do we honestly need to discuss how much people hate the Rockets right now? Is there a thread you'd really like to create that specifically targets the Rockets in a negative way that could honestly be constructive at this point?

Besides, the mods aren't completely jerks. If you really, really need to create a thread that is of a different topic, isn't baiting and specifically targets Houston, then PM the mods and ask what they think. You're the one making it a freedom of speech issue, not the mods.


Personally, I agree that the punishment should have been directed at specific posters instead of the entirety of PSD. But I can understand why they went that route. It's much harder to monitor a handful of posters then to just make a blanket rule that impacts everybody.

And so what if we reported these threads to the mods? Should we not have the ability to do that if we feel like threads are being created specifically for the purpose of baiting our fan base? There are only so many tools we posters have at our disposal. If it were up to me, I'd say we should just let all threads be allowed and let the bickering commence regardless of the language or how heated arguments get. But the last two times I didn't report baiting and I got into arguments, I got banned. I'd rather not get banned. :shrug:

Come on Bro, you participate in every Lakers hate thread, what are you complaining about.?

mightybosstone
07-29-2014, 03:19 PM
Come on Bro, you participate in every Lakers hate thread, what are you complaining about.?

I've participated in my fair share of Kobe hate over the years, but how many actual threads have I created for the sole purpose of Laker bashing? I can only recall one, and that was more of an essay explaining a perspective after they started off the season slow with Kobe and Dwight than it was a thread created for the sole purpose of bashing the Lakers.

And I'm not one who can't handle criticism as long as its warranted and its grounded in some kind of fact. But how many threads have been created in the last few weeks just to rip on Houston, its players or random things that have been said by them in the media? It's getting out of hand, and there's hardly any real basketball discussion whatsoever.

If you want to start a thread talking about the winners and losers of the offseason and Houston happens to be on your list, that's fine. If you want to start a thread comparing the best players at their positions and you don't think Harden is the best SG in the league, I'm cool with that. But don't just start threads for the sole purpose of bashing Houston's offseason and its players.

goingfor28
07-29-2014, 03:29 PM
We should have to PM a mod to ask if it's OK to say something anti houston? That just sounds like a butt hurt fan. Nobody said they suck, just that they didn't have a good offseason. Lighten up :laugh2:

ThuglifeJ
07-29-2014, 08:43 PM
horrible offseason for houston
Ban!

Why? Its his opinion. And a popular one at that

goingfor28
07-29-2014, 09:07 PM
Why? Its his opinion. And a popular one at that
Bc anything said from here on our that is anti rockets is to be infracted! Rightfully so!

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?t=872163

THE MTL
07-29-2014, 11:49 PM
I surprised no one said this bit here's some new insight in the Rockets pursuit of chris bosh.

Chris bosh was misused in miami as a 3rd option to the point where he was a basic stretch 4. What was his numbers? 16ppg 6.6rpg 1 apg and what was Parsons stats as a 3rd option 16ppg 5.5rpg 4apg.

I'm not saying that Parsons is better than Bosh but in the 3rd option role he is much better equipped and offers a team more than what Bosh can do at that role. And their defense is comparable so that argument is thrown out.

I think it's funny that rockets threw the max at chris bosh when he would still be nothing more than the third option behind Harden and Howard.

So for 15 million per year I would take the younger Parsons as opposed to Chris bosh at 22 million per year (4yr/88mil).

Vinny642
07-29-2014, 11:54 PM
That pick they got will be around 12-20, That and Ariza doesnt make up for losing their pick, Lin, Asik, and Parsons

Saddletramp
07-30-2014, 01:31 AM
I surprised no one said this bit here's some new insight in the Rockets pursuit of chris bosh.

Chris bosh was misused in miami as a 3rd option to the point where he was a basic stretch 4. What was his numbers? 16ppg 6.6rpg 1 apg and what was Parsons stats as a 3rd option 16ppg 5.5rpg 4apg.

I'm not saying that Parsons is better than Bosh but in the 3rd option role he is much better equipped and offers a team more than what Bosh can do at that role. And their defense is comparable so that argument is thrown out.

I think it's funny that rockets threw the max at chris bosh when he would still be nothing more than the third option behind Harden and Howard.

So for 15 million per year I would take the younger Parsons as opposed to Chris bosh at 22 million per year (4yr/88mil).


The reason that hasn't been mentioned is that if Houston would have signed Bosh (to a max of 16-18M, I forgot how much the Rockets were allowed to officially max offer), they would have signed Parsons, too. This was the plan as soon as LeBron left and until Riley offered the max Miami could offer.

Saddletramp
07-30-2014, 01:45 AM
That pick they got will be around 12-20, That and Ariza doesnt make up for losing their pick, Lin, Asik, and Parsons. That remains to be seen. Asik's grumbly attitude had to go (he's great; love the guy, but if you can get arguably the best at his position, you jump on it even if it rattles your current starter), Lin didn't play up to his contract and wasn't worth the $15M owed to him (let alone the $8.3M cap hit) and they needed room and were ready to move on. And Ariza was a nice consolation prize for the price when it was evident that Parsons wouldn't return.

The Rockets couldn't win with PSD. If they would've stayed pat and re-signed Parsons and kept Lin/Asik, they would've been made fun of for not making the team better after a first round exit. They move some guys that *had* to be moved and don't get one of the big names so they refrain from putting all their eggs (remaining cap room) in the Parsons basket then they get picked on for giving up Parsons for nothing. They grabbed Ariza for below market value, retain cap space and still have their exceptions (including Lin's $8.3M trade exception) and they get F's for not vaulting out ahead of the three super teams ahead of them. GS, Portland, Memphis and Phoenix didn't do much to strengthen their teams and the Pelicans are still maybe a year or move away and the Mavs additions have question marks.

I wish it were late October already.

ThuglifeJ
07-30-2014, 02:07 AM
False. If the rockets had gotten Bosh and resigned Parsons and/or kept their depth we all would have been insanely jealous and worried. Nice try though

Saddletramp
07-30-2014, 02:26 AM
Ahhhh, you caught me. I forgot to put the part in there about after they whiffed on Carmelo/Bosh they couldn't win with PSD posters.

Best post you've ever made, Thug.

Actually, I did:

The Rockets couldn't win with PSD. If they would've stayed pat and re-signed Parsons and kept Lin/Asik, they would've been made fun of for not making the team better after a first round exit. They move some guys that *had* to be moved and don't get one of the big names so they refrain from putting all their eggs (remaining cap room) in the Parsons basket then they get picked on for giving up Parsons for nothing. They grabbed Ariza for below market value, retain cap space and still have their exceptions (including Lin's $8.3M trade exception) and they get F's for not vaulting out ahead of the three super teams ahead of them. GS, Portland, Memphis and Phoenix didn't do much to strengthen their teams and the Pelicans are still maybe a year or move away and the Mavs additions have question marks.

I wish it were late October already.

I see what you're saying, though. If all of Morey's plans came together, everyone would be shitpissing their pants. I guess that potential britcher breach is now causing all the trolling.

ThuglifeJ
07-30-2014, 10:08 AM
So? Having good plans doesn't mean jack or make you a good gm if they don't fall through. I'm sure the Suns were happy to talk with Lebron and ppl would shitpiss there pants if they got him..so? It didn't happen . Neither did bosh to Hou.


You guys should really dig deep and understand why so many ppl don't like the rockets.. It does have to do with the posters too, not just the team.

And not liking or thinking a team got worse IS NOT TROLLING. This attitude is what got us this dam embarrassing sticky thread

Saddletramp
07-30-2014, 03:33 PM
So? Having good plans doesn't mean jack or make you a good gm if they don't fall through. I'm sure the Suns were happy to talk with Lebron and ppl would shitpiss there pants if they got him..so? It didn't happen . Neither did bosh to Hou.


You guys should really dig deep and understand why so many ppl don't like the rockets.. It does have to do with the posters too, not just the team.

Right. If no Rockets posters posted in the main forum, I guarantee most of the Rockets hate threads wouldn't occur. This is because most of those threads/posts are posted for the sole purpose of trolling and baiting Rockets fans. How on earth do you not admit this? I would say it's like talking to a brick wall but a brick wall doesn't respond with mostly trolly posts.


And not liking or thinking a team got worse IS NOT TROLLING. This attitude is what got us this dam embarrassing sticky thread

It is when it's nonstop ****ing stop. Honestly, how many Rockets hate threads have there been lately? Some have been legit conversations. Some haven't.

You know what? I don't think you have the common sense to understand so I don't think it's in my best interest to keep explaining this to you.

Cromedome
07-30-2014, 03:54 PM
In before ban.