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View Full Version : Knicks Potential Trade: Amare Stoudemire, Iman Shumpert to Sixers?



Nikeman
07-07-2014, 01:59 PM
http://www.prosportsdaily.com/Headlines/ExternalArticle?articleId=311987

Looks like Phil Jackson may have some potential moves up his sleeve.

"The move would clear roughly $25 million in cap space for the Knicks, and would potentially allow them to chase another prime free agent. Although losing Shumpert would be a loss for the Knicks, it would likely be worth it to rid themselves of Stoudemire's contract."

I don't know how the Knicks are looking cap wise right now, but I am assuming if they got 25 mill off their cap space, they could have some pretty significant room to sign a quality player, and then with Bargani's 12 million coming off the books next summer, they could have a contender ready by 2015.

For the Sixers, I guess they take Amare' and his expiring contract in order to land a young quality piece in Shumpert, and if the Sixers may not be doing anything with their cap room, it may be worth it.

king4day
07-07-2014, 02:01 PM
I know I may be in the minority on this but if/when the Suns are out of the LeBron sweepstakes, I'd be interested in acquiring Amar'e. Take an asset too and maybe later move him elsewhere.

STAT would really help improve our team.

Chronz
07-07-2014, 02:03 PM
Cant see that happening. This team didn't even absorb Asik last year, then again, they are trying to suck.

Aust
07-07-2014, 02:06 PM
Sixers should get more than just those two for helping NY out.

Nikeman
07-07-2014, 02:07 PM
Cant see that happening. This team didn't even absorb Asik last year, then again, they are trying to suck.

Well, maybe they think Shumpert is worth it, and if the Sixers aren't gonna do anything in free agency and sit there with 30 mill in cap space, and next off-season they get it right back as Amare is an expiring.

Nikeman
07-07-2014, 02:08 PM
Hopefully a Knicks fan comes here soon and can state how much cap room the Knicks would have they were able to get rid of Amare and Shumpert.

PurpleLynch
07-07-2014, 02:08 PM
Shumpert could be a good player for Phila,but Amare's contract is too much imo. I wouldn't accept this trade,no matter who you send back.

hugepatsfan
07-07-2014, 02:09 PM
PHI does need to reach the floor but is Shumpert really worth taking on $25 million? I don't think so.

I want BOS to dump Brandon Bass on them. He has a $6.9 mil expiring deal. Like I said, PHI needs to reach the floor. Bass isn't going to ruin their tanking plans. He did a nice job as a vet presence for our young bigs last year and he'd do the same in PHI with theirs. He could be flipped at the deadline potentially too with his relatively modest expiring contract. We just don't have minutes for him at PF in BOS anymore which is wahy I want to dump him.

Bang Bros89
07-07-2014, 02:13 PM
Hopefully a Knicks fan comes here soon and can state how much cap room the Knicks would have they were able to get rid of Amare and Shumpert.

It wouldn't really create too much cap space, especially if we resign Melo. The benefit from this trade would be the TPE this trade creates, depending on what Philly makes us take back, the Knicks would have a substantial TPE, probably 20+ mil. Helps them with a potential sign and trade

amak316
07-07-2014, 02:14 PM
The Knicks this off-season have already gained draft picks in a trade, and now they may be freeing up cap space via salary dump? I feel like I've entered a bizarro world.

Bang Bros89
07-07-2014, 02:14 PM
PHI does need to reach the floor but is Shumpert really worth taking on $25 million? I don't think so.

I want BOS to dump Brandon Bass on them. He has a $6.9 mil expiring deal. Like I said, PHI needs to reach the floor. Bass isn't going to ruin their tanking plans. He did a nice job as a vet presence for our young bigs last year and he'd do the same in PHI with theirs. He could be flipped at the deadline potentially too with his relatively modest expiring contract. We just don't have minutes for him at PF in BOS anymore which is wahy I want to dump him.

Taking Amar'e's contract for one year isn't that much. Get an asset, buy him out. They aren't using their cap otherwise.

nickdymez
07-07-2014, 02:17 PM
Taking on stats contract for one year isn't a big deal at all

xxplayerxx23
07-07-2014, 02:25 PM
Knicks also in discussions to get rid of bargs. If they did both they would have like at least 15 mill besides melo I believe.

MagicBucsSox
07-07-2014, 02:26 PM
Lmao yet they'll praise Sam Hinkie. Better ways to meet the floor

scissors
07-07-2014, 02:34 PM
Taking on stats contract for one year isn't a big deal at all

To your competitive goals - no

To your pocket book - yes

scissors
07-07-2014, 02:35 PM
Knicks also in discussions to get rid of bargs. If they did both they would have like at least 15 mill besides melo I believe.

Plus TPEs for Amare (25mil), barg (12mil), and Shump (~4mil?). All can be used to acquire players in S&T.

They could theoretically get Bosh and Deng with those TPEs

BKLYNpigeon
07-07-2014, 02:36 PM
Sixers can always trade Shumpert, He's worth a 1st round pick.

nickdymez
07-07-2014, 02:38 PM
To your competitive goals - no

To your pocket book - yes
What competitive goals? You think the sixers are contenders this upcoming season?

scissors
07-07-2014, 02:41 PM
What competitive goals? You think the sixers are contenders this upcoming season?

Yeah. like "no" as in "not a big deal"

You are misunderstanding. I am saying that sure, the trade helps them competitively as it doens't hurt to absorb Amare for a year when they aren't planning on signing anybody anyway and they get a good player for the future in Shumpert.

But it does hurt your pocketbook.

Context bro.

nickdymez
07-07-2014, 02:44 PM
Yeah. like "no" as in "not a big deal"

You are misunderstanding. I am saying that sure, the trade helps them competitively as it doens't hurt to absorb Amare for a year when they aren't planning on signing anybody anyway and they get a good player for the future in Shumpert.

But it does hurt your pocketbook.

Context bro.
Oh ok. I really didn't care about their pocket books and I'm sure they really don't to much either. But I see where you're comin from

xxplayerxx23
07-07-2014, 02:48 PM
Plus TPEs for Amare (25mil), barg (12mil), and Shump (~4mil?). All can be used to acquire players in S&T.

They could theoretically get Bosh and Deng with those TPEs

That would be interesting. It things happen we could see a good team

lvlheaded
07-07-2014, 02:52 PM
The way it was explained to me, if the Knicks dump Amare and Bargs, give up Shump, and renounce the rights to their FA's besides Melo (KMart, Murry, Tyler, Cole Aldrich) it would put them in the vicinity of 40 mil to work with.

That would be HUGE for Phil

scissors
07-07-2014, 03:00 PM
The way it was explained to me, if the Knicks dump Amare and Bargs, give up Shump, and renounce the rights to their FA's besides Melo (KMart, Murry, Tyler, Cole Aldrich) it would put them in the vicinity of 40 mil to work with.

That would be HUGE for Phil

That doesn't make sense because I'm assuming Melo's cap hold is like 25 million. They would have 16 million on the books still. That puts their cap number at 41. The cap is like 63.

So they would have 22 million cap space + plus those three TPEs which can each be used after cap is reached.

Burkey3472
07-07-2014, 03:02 PM
I doubt the Sixers help the Knicks out and take on that salary just to add Shumpert. Shumpert just isn't worth that.

bleedprple&gold
07-07-2014, 03:04 PM
Why doesnt Philly go after some real free agents with all that cap space instead of taking someone else's garbage? Seems to be a real big mystery why they suck so bad.

KnicksYanks
07-07-2014, 03:05 PM
Why doesnt Philly go after some real free agents with all that cap space instead of taking someone else's garbage? Seems to be a real big mystery why they suck so bad.
They wanna suck no big time free agent is going. They tank and get a top pick.

TheNumber37
07-07-2014, 03:16 PM
If they do this, they get Gasol and Deng Or Ariza now... then Marc Gasol next year

BSplaya2121
07-07-2014, 03:16 PM
That doesn't make sense because I'm assuming Melo's cap hold is like 25 million. They would have 16 million on the books still. That puts their cap number at 41. The cap is like 63.

So they would have 22 million cap space + plus those three TPEs which can each be used after cap is reached.

I think that they were stating 40 mil without Melo resigning. I mean its an incredible long shot to get rid of both of those contracts, they would have to trade some assets along with them (why shump would be in the amare deal) and outside of shump/larkin/THjr/early there really isnt that much as far as assets to give away due to the Knicks having 0 draft picks to trade until 3040. Plus we have to remember, im sure there are plenty of teams that wouldnt want to help the knicks cap situation but who knows!

SMH!
07-07-2014, 03:16 PM
Lmao yet they'll praise Sam Hinkie. Better ways to meet the floor

you love hating the sixers, keep it going! We love our future ;)

Rockice_8
07-07-2014, 03:19 PM
This deal would free up money but not nearly enough to land an impact player.

bleedprple&gold
07-07-2014, 03:19 PM
Why doesnt Philly go after some real free agents with all that cap space instead of taking someone else's garbage? Seems to be a real big mystery why they suck so bad.
They wanna suck no big time free agent is going. They tank and get a top pick.

They have a solid young core. Add a couple of vets and that team can compete in the sorry east. They don't need to tank again next year. Unless they are planning for Embiid to sit out the year and they go all in next year.

Dark Donnie
07-07-2014, 03:20 PM
Why doesnt Philly go after some real free agents with all that cap space instead of taking someone else's garbage? Seems to be a real big mystery why they suck so bad.

They'd rather build through the draft then sign retreads...it's not realistic to think they could land a Melo, LBJ, Bosh etc.

KnicksorBust
07-07-2014, 04:49 PM
If the Knicks can dump STAT and Shumpert then I would become a lot more confident that Melo is returning. I feel like deals like this don't get rumored first, they just come out of nowhere and are done... Oh to be wrong this time... :pray:

IDunknown
07-07-2014, 05:56 PM
I doubt the Sixers help the Knicks out and take on that salary just to add Shumpert. Shumpert just isn't worth that.


Why doesnt Philly go after some real free agents with all that cap space instead of taking someone else's garbage? Seems to be a real big mystery why they suck so bad.


They wanna suck no big time free agent is going. They tank and get a top pick.

They need to add salary to meet the salary requirement, and they're tanking again. They get another young player and Amar'e's contract is expiring.

Kashmir13579
07-07-2014, 05:57 PM
The fact were hearing about it means it won't happen.

omdigga
07-07-2014, 06:07 PM
The fact were hearing about it means it won't happen.

this.

Burkey3472
07-07-2014, 06:12 PM
They need to add salary to meet the salary requirement, and they're tanking again. They get another young player and Amar'e's contract is expiring.

They can stay under the salary floor and pay the penalty which is just to pay the salary cap floor. If it wasn't a division rival it would be a smart move but they would be helping the Knicks potentially land another good player which certainly doesn't make it worth it at all.

east fb knicks
07-07-2014, 06:55 PM
it's not happening imo I don't see philly helping out ny

Kyben36
07-07-2014, 07:04 PM
http://www.prosportsdaily.com/Headlines/ExternalArticle?articleId=311987

Looks like Phil Jackson may have some potential moves up his sleeve.

"The move would clear roughly $25 million in cap space for the Knicks, and would potentially allow them to chase another prime free agent. Although losing Shumpert would be a loss for the Knicks, it would likely be worth it to rid themselves of Stoudemire's contract."

I don't know how the Knicks are looking cap wise right now, but I am assuming if they got 25 mill off their cap space, they could have some pretty significant room to sign a quality player, and then with Bargani's 12 million coming off the books next summer, they could have a contender ready by 2015.

For the Sixers, I guess they take Amare' and his expiring contract in order to land a young quality piece in Shumpert, and if the Sixers may not be doing anything with their cap room, it may be worth it.

nope, they are so far over cap that they would still have little room to bring anyone in. at all.

scissors
07-07-2014, 08:01 PM
They can stay under the salary floor and pay the penalty which is just to pay the salary cap floor. If it wasn't a division rival it would be a smart move but they would be helping the Knicks potentially land another good player which certainly doesn't make it worth it at all.

Even better yet, I think they only have to split the difference between their salary and the floor.

scissors
07-07-2014, 08:05 PM
nope, they are so far over cap that they would still have little room to bring anyone in. at all.

Yeah but they would get 23million dollar TPE for Amare that they can use in a S&T

dodgersuck
07-07-2014, 08:06 PM
I would love this for the Sixers. Pair Shump with MCW and then wait for the front court to get healthy and Saric to immigrate from the motherland. We desperately need a shooter in Philly

smood999
07-07-2014, 08:19 PM
Parting the Red Sea would probably be an easier endeavor, but if Jackson were able to move both Bargnani and Stoudemire without taking back and salaries and opted to walk away from Jeremy Tyler, Lamar Odom, Shannon Brown, Toure’ Murry, Kenyon Martin and Cole Aldrich — all of whom are either free agents or subjected to team options — the Knicks could find themselves somewhere in the neighborhood of $40 million under the NBA’s projected 2014-15 salary cap of $63 million.

http://theknicksblog.com/knicks/source-with-eye-toward-cap-space-jackson-shopping-bargnani-shumpert-and-stoudemire/#more-55072

Obviously, they'd have to resign Melo with that money...but getting Chandler, Amare, and Bargani off the books this season pretty much fast forwards them to next offseason. It would just be a 6 million dollar difference from next offseason as the only 2 left to come off the books would be Dalembert and Ellington. So yes the Knicks would have significant cap room...close to 20 mil to spend on players other than Melo plus all the exceptions.

xxplayerxx23
07-07-2014, 10:23 PM
Parting the Red Sea would probably be an easier endeavor, but if Jackson were able to move both Bargnani and Stoudemire without taking back and salaries and opted to walk away from Jeremy Tyler, Lamar Odom, Shannon Brown, Toure’ Murry, Kenyon Martin and Cole Aldrich — all of whom are either free agents or subjected to team options — the Knicks could find themselves somewhere in the neighborhood of $40 million under the NBA’s projected 2014-15 salary cap of $63 million.


http://theknicksblog.com/knicks/source-with-eye-toward-cap-space-jackson-shopping-bargnani-shumpert-and-stoudemire/#more-55072

Obviously, they'd have to resign Melo with that money...but getting Chandler, Amare, and Bargani off the books this season pretty much fast forwards them to next offseason. It would just be a 6 million dollar difference from next offseason as the only 2 left to come off the books would be Dalembert and Ellington. So yes the Knicks would have significant cap room...close to 20 mil to spend on players other than Melo plus all the exceptions.

So Knicks would have 20 mill to spend after resigning melo? And then if we did this trade we would also have a 23 mill trade execption we could then sign and trade for FA ontop of the 20 extra million we have to spend? If so that would be huge getting rid of bargs without including Tim would be tough hope he can get it done

PraiseJesus
07-07-2014, 10:34 PM
I hear the Jaws music playing

NYJ - NYY
07-07-2014, 11:30 PM
Wildness!!! Gett'erdoneeeeee

Chronz
07-08-2014, 01:31 PM
Well, maybe they think Shumpert is worth it, and if the Sixers aren't gonna do anything in free agency and sit there with 30 mill in cap space, and next off-season they get it right back as Amare is an expiring.

He does fill a positional need, sorta, but hes not a very good player and I cant see them taking on the salary for a prospect like him. They didn't even want Asik back then but again, maybe that has more to do with them not wanting to improve.

The Bandit
07-08-2014, 01:51 PM
The Sixers are not about to help the Knicks build a super team just for Shump. Hinkie isn't a fool.

hugepatsfan
07-08-2014, 01:59 PM
If I'm Philly I'd take back Amare and Bargs if it meant getting THJ back. Not Shumpert. 1.) He isn't very good. 2.) His game isn't a good fit at all next to MCW.

I don't think the Knicks would be able to make a "superteam" with the cap space. I don't think Lebron would go there. It would allow them to sign enough role players though where Melo wouldn't feel like he was throwing away a season by staying in NY.

joeyc77
07-08-2014, 01:59 PM
Lmao yet they'll praise Sam Hinkie. Better ways to meet the floor

Such as what, signing Channing Frye for $8m a year? Yeah, no thanks. We've tried mediocrity for years and it sucks.

rhd420
07-08-2014, 02:44 PM
If I'm Philly I'd take back Amare and Bargs if it meant getting THJ back. Not Shumpert. 1.) He isn't very good. 2.) His game isn't a good fit at all next to MCW.

I don't think the Knicks would be able to make a "superteam" with the cap space. I don't think Lebron would go there. It would allow them to sign enough role players though where Melo wouldn't feel like he was throwing away a season by staying in NY.

wow, talk about helping out the Knicks ... in terms of just cap space, heck I remember when they took on a crappy contract for Tmac and then turned it into Carmelo.

If Phil and the Knicks pull this off, it might be a quicker turn around than expected ... addition by subtraction comes to mind and they should send a gift basket to Philly if it does happen

Rockice_8
07-08-2014, 04:20 PM
The Knicks were the ones who reached out not the other way around meaning this is not anywhere near getting done and probably not at all. Doubt Philly is interested in Shump since he's only got 1 more season on his rookie deal and they'd have to pay him to keep him.

This is a bogus story at it's finest.

Nikeman
07-08-2014, 04:25 PM
So here is what makes this interesting,

I read an article and NBA teams are REQUIRED to operate at 90% of their salary cap. Considering the 76ers are at half, maybe they do this trade to take Amare' and get Shumpert as an asset, but they get their cap flexibility back next summer which is probably what they want.

Nikeman
07-08-2014, 04:27 PM
"In order to shore up their roster for the next season every team needs to meet two minimums. The first is that they need to have 13 players on the roster. The second is that they need to reach 90% of the upcoming year's Salary Cap value by the end of the season. The cap is set at $63.2 million, and 90% of that is $56.9 million."

Surprised nobody in this forum knew this factoid. So essentially, Philadelphia HAS to do something to take up their cap space, and this makes sense. Amare can come in and play for Embiid who is out for the season, and then next off-season, the Sixers have Amare off their books and all their cap space back for the next off-season.

Philly gets an asset, meets NBA requirements, and gains all their flexibility back next off-season

bringbackfredex
07-08-2014, 04:34 PM
Wildness!!! Gett'erdoneeeeee

Not happening just for Shump, although he would be a nice bench player to have. Anything involving the Sixers taking on that amount of cap (especially from a rival team) will 100% involve some sort of 1st round pick.

hugepatsfan
07-08-2014, 04:43 PM
Who would New York even sign with that cap space? I don't think Lebron would go there. Bosh has a better option in HOU if he wants to leave. I imagine they'd be able to land Pau considering his relationship with Phil and the fact that he supposedly likes the idea of playing with Melo. Lance Stephenson would be an intersting fit there. Marvin Williams would be a nice fit there too IMO. He could play SF when Melo is either on the bench or playing the 4. But I just don't see any great options for them to use their cap space on.

KINGOFSPORTS
07-08-2014, 04:46 PM
Knicks need to make this happen

joeyc77
07-08-2014, 05:12 PM
"In order to shore up their roster for the next season every team needs to meet two minimums. The first is that they need to have 13 players on the roster. The second is that they need to reach 90% of the upcoming year's Salary Cap value by the end of the season. The cap is set at $63.2 million, and 90% of that is $56.9 million."

Surprised nobody in this forum knew this factoid. So essentially, Philadelphia HAS to do something to take up their cap space, and this makes sense. Amare can come in and play for Embiid who is out for the season, and then next off-season, the Sixers have Amare off their books and all their cap space back for the next off-season.

Philly gets an asset, meets NBA requirements, and gains all their flexibility back next off-season

No. The Sixers were not at the cap floor last year either. They don't HAVE to do anything.

All it means is that if they don't reach the cap floor, they have to divide the difference of that money to players on their current roster.

It only makes sense if the Sixers feel the compensation is worth the contract. It depends on how they feel about Shumpert.

As a Sixers fan, I prefer they work out a deal for Lin or with another team with actual assets. I just don't see Shumpert bring enough. Last season, Utah received two 1sts and two 2nds to take back Biedrins and Jefferson so GS could sign Iggy. I would imagine they want similar compensation, especially considering they are helping a division rival.

bucketss
07-08-2014, 05:16 PM
Shumpert could be a good player for Phila,but Amare's contract is too much imo. I wouldn't accept this trade,no matter who you send back.

huge expiring contract, could be useful in trades.

KnicksorBust
07-08-2014, 05:22 PM
Who would New York even sign with that cap space? I don't think Lebron would go there. Bosh has a better option in HOU if he wants to leave. I imagine they'd be able to land Pau considering his relationship with Phil and the fact that he supposedly likes the idea of playing with Melo. Lance Stephenson would be an intersting fit there. Marvin Williams would be a nice fit there too IMO. He could play SF when Melo is either on the bench or playing the 4. But I just don't see any great options for them to use their cap space on.

With Melo's cap hold, Bargnani, Calderon, JR Smith, etc. we'd still only have enough for a MLE player. Theoretically we get Melo to re-sign, do the deal, and then use that money to talk Pau Gasol into coming to NY.

PG - Calderon
SG - Tim Hardaway Jr.
SF - JR Smith
PF - Melo
C - Gasol

Feels like a pipe dream to me. I don't see the Sixers biting, I don't see Gasol taking less to play in NY, and I'm not even sure Melo is coming back... Glad I took the time to explain it though. :laugh:

sixer04fan
07-08-2014, 05:37 PM
Why does no one know the actual cap floor rule? The Sixers don't have to reach the "cap floor." They didn't last year either. The only thing that happens when you don't reach the floor is you have to pay the remainder out to the players on your roster, so everyone gets a bonus so to speak. That's what we did last season. Adding Amare doesn't help us or hurt us in meeting those requirements.

Here's why this doesn't make a ton of sense. The Knicks can't trade their 1st round pick until the 2017 season, since you can't trade away future picks in consecutive years, and the Knicks don't have a 2016 pick at the moment (via the Melo and Bargnani trades - http://www.prosportstransactions.com/basketball/DraftTrades/Years/2016.htm). You have to keep at least a 1st round pick every other season. Like, you can't trade away your 2015, 2016, 2017, 2018 picks in a trade for obvious competitive/fairness reasons.

Even ignoring the fact that the Sixers wouldn't want to take on Amare's contract just for the sake of paying him $24 million this year, why would they take him on as a player? All that does is hinder the development of our youth movement. Are the Sixers that enamored with Iman Shumpert to take Amare with him if the next draft pick they can get isn't until 2017?

Simply put. Why would the Sixers bail out the Knicks for a draft pick that's 3 years away?

The Houston deal makes so much more sense for the Sixers, if Houston needs it. If they sign Bosh, they need to deal Lin. The Sixers can take on Lin no problemo, and Houston has much better assets to give to the Sixers for that, such as draft picks and good young players like Capela or Jones.