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View Full Version : ELI5: Why do teams want to pair up LBJ and Melo?



JasonJohnHorn
06-30-2014, 08:39 AM
There were rumours during the playoffs that Miami was hoping to bring in Melo in the offseason to pair with James. More recently, rumours have come out that LAL and PHO want to do the same. I just don't see this as a good pairing myself, but I'm open to being convinced.


What I see is two small forwards who can both play some power forward but likely won't provide the kind of rebounding one needs from a power forward. I also see two guys who need the ball in order to be effective, and two guys who like to go iso at the elbow/corner of the key. I just seems like there would be some crowding.

I might be being unfair to Melo, but to me he's like a poor man's LBJ: lower percentages, inferior defence, and he can't pass (though he may be a better rebounder depending on what season you are looking at).

I think a pairing like LBJ and Love (who can rebound like a champ, pass, and has some serious range) would be ideal (even if Love isn't a defensive juggernaut). Or even a pairing like LBJ and a prime Gasol, who could pass and rebound as well.


It just seems that pairing to SFs (even if they can both play power forward) isn't an ideal pairing.

This aside, if I were LBJ or a front office, I would be trying to pair LBJ with somebody young than him, like Harden, not somebody older than him, which would give me a shorter window.

Does anybody on PSD see how the two would actually have an incredible chemistry?


Is this something that would just blow teams out of the water? Or GMs hoping to put together two bigs names with no thought to chemistry?


Thoughts?

IndyRealist
06-30-2014, 09:11 AM
Miami has gotten by for a long time without much in the way of rebounding, Melo may be an upgrade playing PF full time. He's also more of a natural stretch 4 than Bosh is, who really had to adapt to the role he has.

There is the thought that Melo's primary weakness is that he takes a lot of bad shots, but paired next to Lebron he's alleviated from forcing those shots so his efficiency would skyrocket. I don't buy it, I think he wants to take bad shots because a) they get him on sportscenter, b) he saw MJ take them, and c) he thinks he's good at them.

But mostly, it's because people think having more scorers is always better no matter what. That's how Isaiah built his Knicks teams, how Dumars built the post-Billups Pistons, etc. Those teams were disasters, but if anyone can facilitate it, it'd be Lebron.

D-Leethal
06-30-2014, 09:17 AM
Miami has gotten by for a long time without much in the way of rebounding, Melo may be an upgrade playing PF full time. He's also more of a natural stretch 4 than Bosh is, who really had to adapt to the role he has.

There is the thought that Melo's primary weakness is that he takes a lot of bad shots, but paired next to Lebron he's alleviated from forcing those shots so his efficiency would skyrocket. I don't buy it, I think he wants to take bad shots because a) they get him on sportscenter, b) he saw MJ take them, and c) he thinks he's good at them.

But mostly, it's because people think having more scorers is always better no matter what. That's how Isaiah built his Knicks teams, how Dumars built the post-Billups Pistons, etc. Those teams were disasters, but if anyone can facilitate it, it'd be Lebron.

Its not about having "more scorers", its about having an elite scorer played with an elite playmaker, who are both interchangeable at the 3/4 and have been playing with or against each other since HS.

Melo and LeBron were two of the best rebounding PFs in the league this year, so I think the rebounding at the forward spots would be A OK. This isn't the era of the Charles Oakley 4 man, its the era of the Chris Bosh 4 man.

D-Leethal
06-30-2014, 09:25 AM
And for someone who seems to pride themselves on being unbiased and giving quality insight, the whole "I think he takes them cause a), b), c)" is pretty much nonsense Indy. I think you know that though.

You'd be taking your share of bad shots and late clock miracles if you had Ray Felton trying to distribute the offense and Mike Woodson designing absolutely nothing that involved catches on the move for easier baskets (which Phil acknowledged as the toughest thing Melo had to deal with last season).

IndyRealist
06-30-2014, 09:26 AM
Its not about having "more scorers", its about having an elite scorer played with an elite playmaker, who are both interchangeable at the 3/4 and have been playing with or against each other since HS.

Melo and LeBron were two of the best rebounding PFs in the league this year, so I think the rebounding at the forward spot would be A OK. This isn't the era of the Charles Oakley 4 man, its the era of the Chris Bosh 4 man.

You realize you basically agreed with everything I said?

Jamiecballer
06-30-2014, 09:30 AM
Miami has gotten by for a long time without much in the way of rebounding, Melo may be an upgrade playing PF full time. He's also more of a natural stretch 4 than Bosh is, who really had to adapt to the role he has.

There is the thought that Melo's primary weakness is that he takes a lot of bad shots, but paired next to Lebron he's alleviated from forcing those shots so his efficiency would skyrocket. I don't buy it, I think he wants to take bad shots because a) they get him on sportscenter, b) he saw MJ take them, and c) he thinks he's good at them.

But mostly, it's because people think having more scorers is always better no matter what. That's how Isaiah built his Knicks teams, how Dumars built the post-Billups Pistons, etc. Those teams were disasters, but if anyone can facilitate it, it'd be Lebron.
Your comments on Melo are spot on. Players tend to play the way they play because its all they know how to do.

Blaming it on circumstance (which many fans do) shows a real lack of insight into human behaviour.

prodigy
06-30-2014, 09:34 AM
I think pairing all these stars is horrible for the leauge. There's really no competitive balance in basketball. Every year there's only 2 maybe 3 teams that have a shot. Its sad. If melo went to heat I'm done with basketball. I love the game but it would just be a waste of my time.

IndyRealist
06-30-2014, 09:34 AM
And for someone who seems to pride themselves on being unbiased and giving quality insight, the whole "I think he takes them cause a), b), c)" is pretty much nonsense Indy. I think you know that though.

You'd be taking your share of bad shots and late clock miracles if you had Ray Felton trying to distribute the offense and Mike Woodson designing absolutely nothing that involved catches on the move for easier baskets (which Phil acknowledged as the toughest thing Melo had to deal with last season).

See this we disagree on. Melo played the same way in George Karl's free flowing, open court offense. He CHOSE to iso at the elbow and stagnate the offense. Because he believes in Heroball. Karl gave an interview where he said he basically challenged Melo to get more rebounds and assists instead of just chucking shots. Now, he's gotten a lot better in the past 2 years, and he didn't have much to work with lately, but nothing indicates that this is a trend and not an abberation. As you said, his team sucks right now, so it's not a good time to evaluate. Looking at prior years, he's the poster boy for heroball.

Dade County
06-30-2014, 12:18 PM
There were rumours during the playoffs that Miami was hoping to bring in Melo in the offseason to pair with James. More recently, rumours have come out that LAL and PHO want to do the same. I just don't see this as a good pairing myself, but I'm open to being convinced.


What I see is two small forwards who can both play some power forward but likely won't provide the kind of rebounding one needs from a power forward. I also see two guys who need the ball in order to be effective, and two guys who like to go iso at the elbow/corner of the key. I just seems like there would be some crowding.

I might be being unfair to Melo, but to me he's like a poor man's LBJ: lower percentages, inferior defence, and he can't pass (though he may be a better rebounder depending on what season you are looking at).

I think a pairing like LBJ and Love (who can rebound like a champ, pass, and has some serious range) would be ideal (even if Love isn't a defensive juggernaut). Or even a pairing like LBJ and a prime Gasol, who could pass and rebound as well.


It just seems that pairing to SFs (even if they can both play power forward) isn't an ideal pairing.

This aside, if I were LBJ or a front office, I would be trying to pair LBJ with somebody young than him, like Harden, not somebody older than him, which would give me a shorter window.

Does anybody on PSD see how the two would actually have an incredible chemistry?


Is this something that would just blow teams out of the water? Or GMs hoping to put together two bigs names with no thought to chemistry?


Thoughts?

Lbj at the point and Melo at one of the forward positions.

Lbj
sg
Melo
pf
C

So in other words

Lbj
Wade
Melo
Bosh
C

:laugh2: lol

kdspurman
06-30-2014, 12:32 PM
I don't know if on Miami they would be a good fit together. I guess it depends on the team.