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Mile High Champ
06-30-2014, 12:29 AM
Hey guys, It is that time of year again! Once again we kick of the PSD NBA Off-Season Player Rankings. This is the 7th year I have done this on PSD and it typically always makes for good deabte and often initates terrific discussion. Consider that when these polls first began, the likes of Baron Davis and Devin Harris were cracking these polls. Which player will you rank high this year that may get some raised eyebrows as the years pass by? Only time will tell. Please keep things civil and discuss who you feel is most fitting and deserving of being voted in each poll.

A lot has changed since last season. Tim Duncan and the San Antonio Spurs are NBA champions for the 5th time after getting some revenge for their finals loss last season to the Heat. We could be looking at the end of the big 3 era.

Let start the discussion since lots has changed since the start of last season. Please TRY AND VOTE FOR THE BEST PLAYER AND DON'T BE A HOMER. I will leave the poll open for one day and than we can carry on to the next best player at that position. I will add more players after each round. I have also included the results of those last 6 years so everyone can see how much things have changed...Enjoy.

For a player to be eligible for this years poll, they must of played in a minimum of 10 games.

REMEMBER this is based on who is the best player, not the player who has the potential to be the best. Though we do recognize that some voters will vote based soley on potential and others by last years numbers.

1) Chris Paul
2) Russel Westbrook
3) Stephen Curry
4)
5)
6)
7)
8)
9)
10)




2013 Off-Season PSD PG Rankings
1) Chris Paul
2) Tony Parker
3) Russel Westbrook
4) Stephen Curry
5) Kyrie Irving
6) Deron Williams
7) Rajon Rondo
8) Mike Conley
9) John Wall
10) Ty Lawson

2012 Off-Season PSD PG Rankings
1) Chris Paul
2) Derrick Rose
3) Russell Westbrook
4) Deron Williams
5) Rajon Rondo
6) Tony Parker
7) Steve Nash
8) Kyrie Irving
9) Kyle Lowry
10) Ty Lawson

2011 Off-Season PSD PG Rankings
1) Chris Paul
2) Derrick Rose
3) Deron Williams
4) Russell Westbrook
5) Steve Nash
6) Rajon Rondo
7) Tony Parker
8) Jason Kidd
9) Chauncey Billups
10) Stephen Curry

2010 Off-Season PSD PG Rankings
1) Deron Williams
2) Chris Paul
3) Steve Nash
4) Rajon Rondo
5) Derrick Rose
6) Chauncey Billups
7) Russel Westbrook
8) Tony Parker
9) Jason Kidd
10) Tyreke Evans

2009 Off-Season PSD PG Rankings
1) Chris Paul
2) Deron Williams
3) Chauncey Billups
4) Tony Parker
5) Steve Nash
6) Derrick Rose
7) Devin Harris
8) Rajon Rondo
9) Jose Calderon
10) Jason Kidd

2008 Off-Season PSD PG Rankings
1) Chris Paul
2) Steve Nash
3) Deron Williams
4) Baron Davis
5) Tony Parker
6) Jason Kidd
7) Chauncey Billups
8) Gilbert Arenas
9) Jose Calderon
10) Andre Miller

Mile High Champ
06-30-2014, 12:32 AM
Mods please sticky.

FlashBolt
06-30-2014, 01:33 AM
Parker by a landslide.

tredigs
06-30-2014, 02:03 AM
Why TP by a landslide? He had a pedestrian regular season and was worse in the playoffs.

Lowry, Conley, Lillard, Wall... all of these guys could make a case over TP as individual talents. Bledsoe and Dragic were probably better than him while they were on the court this year too. Parker's still a very good PG, but he definitely had a down year, and going on 32 it might be a sign of what's to come. I'm fine with the lifetime achievement nod here, but he was in no way on a different level (at least, not in a good way) then some of the other names on the board.

bgdreton
06-30-2014, 03:38 AM
Why TP by a landslide? He had a pedestrian regular season and was worse in the playoffs.

Lowry, Conley, Lillard, Wall... all of these guys could make a case over TP as individual talents. Bledsoe and Dragic were probably better than him while they were on the court this year too. Parker's still a very good PG, but he definitely had a down year, and going on 32 it might be a sign of what's to come. I'm fine with the lifetime achievement nod here, but he was in no way on a different level (at least, not in a good way) then some of the other names on the board.

This is where it gets tough... My heart says TP as in toilet paper lol JK I couldn't help myself anyway but my mind says otherwise imma hold my vote for a bit.

Bruno
06-30-2014, 03:39 AM
contract year Lowry had the best campaign out of any remaining option. is he better then the next handful of guys? based off last season alone I'd have to give it to him.

Lawson should be an option.

Oefarmy2005
06-30-2014, 11:08 AM
Honestly, I like Parker, but I think Wall, Llilard or Irving will be better this upcoming season.

ManRam
06-30-2014, 11:51 AM
Honestly, I like Parker, but I think Wall, Llilard or Irving will be better this upcoming season.

Yeah. I think individual play next season could have Parker down towards 8 or 9 honestly. Even this year, he wasn't actually the 4th best PG if we're looking at individual play. He just had a tremendous amount of team success and those other intangible things. But it was his worst year in quite some time (maybe 2010). I think Lowry clearly had a better individual season, for example, but I don't mind the Spurs' team success giving Parker the nod. Conley, Lillard, Irving (especially since TP doesn't play defense either), Wall and Lawson were right there too. I think very little, if anything, separates them except for the fact that Parker is a veteran and a "winner".

I'm not sure who I vote for here. Kinda wanna go Lowry. But it doesn't matter since TP is running away with it.

jimm120
06-30-2014, 12:35 PM
Lowery, imo, is gonna be high....but he's one of those 1 or 2 year things.

He'll be ok for maybe 1 or 2 more years but he won't reach these hieghts again.

FlashBolt
06-30-2014, 01:18 PM
Why TP by a landslide? He had a pedestrian regular season and was worse in the playoffs.

Lowry, Conley, Lillard, Wall... all of these guys could make a case over TP as individual talents. Bledsoe and Dragic were probably better than him while they were on the court this year too. Parker's still a very good PG, but he definitely had a down year, and going on 32 it might be a sign of what's to come. I'm fine with the lifetime achievement nod here, but he was in no way on a different level (at least, not in a good way) then some of the other names on the board.

Are we really counting the playoffs when in fact Lowry had a horrible playoffs, Wall was horrible as well, Dragic/Bledsoe didn't even make the playoffs? Why judge TP for doing bad in the playoffs (He didn't do bad, just not as many opportunities considering Spurs just destroyed Miami with anyone on the court), but we give everyone else a pass? Only Lillard had a better playoff performance - and there is no reason to believe he was better than TP in the regular season.

Minimal
06-30-2014, 01:45 PM
hard to decide between wall and parker, but im going with wall here

IgglesFanInCO
06-30-2014, 02:17 PM
Damn when is Ty gonna get his due, not even on the list? hell its a toss up between him and lowry for me after tony parker and maybe Wall

Obviously im biased but still, he deserves way more credit than he gets

Crackadalic
06-30-2014, 02:38 PM
Are we really counting the playoffs when in fact Lowry had a horrible playoffs, Wall was horrible as well, Dragic/Bledsoe didn't even make the playoffs? Why judge TP for doing bad in the playoffs (He didn't do bad, just not as many opportunities considering Spurs just destroyed Miami with anyone on the court), but we give everyone else a pass? Only Lillard had a better playoff performance - and there is no reason to believe he was better than TP in the regular season.

Tony Parker wasn't better then any of those guys during the regular season and was good enough in the playoffs.

XpLiCiTT
07-01-2014, 02:58 AM
Next round should definitely be interesting with Wall/Lilliard/Rondo/Kyrie

thenaj17
07-01-2014, 08:55 AM
Why TP by a landslide? He had a pedestrian regular season and was worse in the playoffs.

Lowry, Conley, Lillard, Wall... all of these guys could make a case over TP as individual talents. Bledsoe and Dragic were probably better than him while they were on the court this year too. Parker's still a very good PG, but he definitely had a down year, and going on 32 it might be a sign of what's to come. I'm fine with the lifetime achievement nod here, but he was in no way on a different level (at least, not in a good way) then some of the other names on the board.

Bigger stats does not mean better player

XpLiCiTT
07-01-2014, 10:47 AM
It's sad that people on here don't realize how good Tony Parker is. They're looking at per game stats and don't take into account Pop plays him less minutes than all these other guys. Look at his per 36 minute stats, or per 48, not per game..and I bet he has better stats than all these other guys.

ManningToTyree
07-01-2014, 11:14 AM
Parker

tredigs
07-01-2014, 02:38 PM
It's sad that people on here don't realize how good Tony Parker is. They're looking at per game stats and don't take into account Pop plays him less minutes than all these other guys. Look at his per 36 minute stats, or per 48, not per game..and I bet he has better stats than all these other guys.
It's sad that you can't look at this yourself while accounting for efficiency and his porous defense and see that it is by and large not true.

Tony's very good, it just happens to be a stacked position and he had a down year. His PER dropped from 23.0 to 18.9, WS/48 from .206 to .141, TS% from 59% to 55.5%, Offensive Rating from 116 to 110, etc. None of those are MPG dependent, and you could easily argue they should have risen with the extra rest he was afforded this season. He was also not top 10 for PG's in WAR or RPM.

Top 5 is a generous ranking for Parker after the season he had, let alone a blowout at 4.

Signed,

Huge Parker Fan.

XpLiCiTT
07-01-2014, 02:57 PM
It's sad that you can't look at this yourself while accounting for efficiency and his porous defense and see that it is by and large not true.

Tony's very good, it just happens to be a stacked position and he had a down year. His PER dropped from 23.0 to 18.9, WS/48 from .206 to .141, TS% from 59% to 55.5%, Offensive Rating from 116 to 110, etc. None of those are MPG dependent, and you could easily argue they should have risen with the extra rest he was afforded this season. He was also not top 10 for PG's in WAR or RPM.

Top 5 is a generous ranking for Parker after the season he had, let alone a blowout at 4.

Signed,

Huge Parker Fan.



I am aware he had a down year. I am also aware he is very good and plays at a stacked position, thanks for stating the obvious though.

I didn't even vote for him I voted for John Wall. Just kind of looked at it a different way and didn't base everything off of stats. I can understand why he would be rated #4 here, but don't necessarily agree with it. Moving forward he is going to be on the decline, and I agree -- I don't really see why this is such a landslide either.

tredigs
07-01-2014, 03:05 PM
I am aware he had a down year. I am also aware he is very good and plays at a stacked position, thanks for stating the obvious though.

I didn't even vote for him I voted for John Wall. Just kind of looked at it a different way and didn't base everything off of stats. I can understand why he would be rated #4 here, but don't necessarily agree with it. Moving forward he is going to be on the decline, and I agree -- I don't really see why this is such a landslide either.

Gotchya, interesting post on your part in that case. Regardless, my point was that you were wrong.

XpLiCiTT
07-01-2014, 03:19 PM
Gotchya, interesting post on your part in that case. Regardless, my point was that you were wrong.

What exactly was I wrong about? All I was saying was a lot of people think Parker is worse than he actually is because they look at per game stats, which rely on minutes. I never argued that he had a down year, I agreed with you. So I don't really know what I said that was so crazy, think it was just a misunderstanding.

FlashBolt
07-01-2014, 03:34 PM
Since Tredigs likes going by numbers, doesn't that mean LeBron is the second best player by his argument via WS/PER/etc? Clearly numbers aren't everything. Wall, Lowry, and Lillard are still young and inexperienced on the high level. I trust Parker more than any of those guys in a late game situation or in a huge game. He makes smart plays and the right plays. And Wall barely beats Parker in PER while Parker is better than him TS% and WS. I don't see how you can make an argument of Wall over Parker. Then, you talk about playoffs in which only Lillard was more outstanding than Parker.

Kashmir13579
07-02-2014, 01:57 AM
Parker should have went two or three.

Kashmir13579
07-02-2014, 02:02 AM
Since Tredigs likes going by numbers, doesn't that mean LeBron is the second best player by his argument via WS/PER/etc? Clearly numbers aren't everything. Wall, Lowry, and Lillard are still young and inexperienced on the high level. I trust Parker more than any of those guys in a late game situation or in a huge game. He makes smart plays and the right plays. And Wall barely beats Parker in PER while Parker is better than him TS% and WS. I don't see how you can make an argument of Wall over Parker. Then, you talk about playoffs in which only Lillard was more outstanding than Parker. i find discussing "hoops" with tredigs to be about as interesting as reading a phone book. Maybe, less so.. At least you can laugh at the funny names you come across in the white pages.

tredigs
07-02-2014, 03:09 AM
Since Tredigs likes going by numbers, doesn't that mean LeBron is the second best player by his argument via WS/PER/etc? Clearly numbers aren't everything. Wall, Lowry, and Lillard are still young and inexperienced on the high level. I trust Parker more than any of those guys in a late game situation or in a huge game. He makes smart plays and the right plays. And Wall barely beats Parker in PER while Parker is better than him TS% and WS. I don't see how you can make an argument of Wall over Parker. Then, you talk about playoffs in which only Lillard was more outstanding than Parker.

I can go by a lot of things, and yeah, Lebron was absolutely outclassed by KD during the regular season this year. I don't think the MVP vote was off. Do you?

And in the post season, was Lebron better than KD? Sure was. Did the #'s agree? Sure did.

Minimal
07-02-2014, 01:18 PM
It's sad that people on here don't realize how good Tony Parker is. They're looking at per game stats and don't take into account Pop plays him less minutes than all these other guys. Look at his per 36 minute stats, or per 48, not per game..and I bet he has better stats than all these other guys.
oh yeah, then beasley is a top 4 small forward in your books, right? there is a reason why he plays much less minutes and the less minutes the player plays, the better his per36 stats will look. the fact is, he didn't play those additional 6-7 minutes, and thats why i voted wall over parker, besides the only stats parker has over wall in per36 are ppg and fg%, which would go down if he played more minutes

XpLiCiTT
07-02-2014, 01:28 PM
oh yeah, then beasley is a top 4 small forward in your books, right?

Um…….what?



there is a reason why he plays much less minutes and the less minutes the player plays, the better his per36 stats will look. the fact is, he didn't play those additional 6-7 minutes

Yeah, and the more minutes the player plays, the better his per game stats will look. What are you getting at?


and thats why i voted wall over parker, besides the only stats parker has over wall in per36 are ppg and fg%, which would go down if he played more minutes

I voted for Wall too……..

Greet
07-06-2014, 10:53 AM
MHC, where ya at doood!