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View Full Version : Could LeBron Win Finals MVP If The Heat Lose?



JasonJohnHorn
06-12-2014, 11:39 PM
The Heat are down 3-1, a deficit not team has ever come back from in the finals. With two home games to close it out, this series may very well be over.

IF the Spurs to win, who would their MVP candidate be?

Leonard has played well the last couple of games, but his first two games weren't as impressive.


It seems like James has been the best player so far this series. Do you think that LBJ might come away with the award regardless of who wins the series?

Jerry West did it once....

EDIT: Note to everybody who didn't ACTUALLY read what I wrote. I am not saying LBJ SHOULD get the finals MVP, I'm asking what you think. You can call me crazy for asking the question if you like, but Jerry West did this once, and Shaq was close to doing it on 04. The Spurs have relied on a team effort. Leonard blew up the last two games, but had meager stats the first two games. Duncan has been their best player on the floor, but he hasn't been getting a lot of minutes, and Parker has been their most consistent, though he hasn't played at as high a level. So if you look at overall stats through the series, James has been the only player to play at a high level and put up solid stats every night. I won't argue with anybody who says Duncan should get the MVP if the Spurs win: he has been the most important player on the court for the Spurs and in turn the most valuable, BUT IF James does put up they best numbers throughout, SHOULD he be given consideration for the ward? Does losing matter if you play at a high enough level?

Putting this in context: LBJ is leading the series in scoring with almost 10 points more per game than the next highest player. He's shooting .600 from the floor, second in the series in rebounding, first in steals and is leading his team in points, rebounds, assists and steals. He's shooting over .600 from beyond the arc and has a TS OVER .600 on the series. Those are AMAZING stats.

Nikeman
06-12-2014, 11:40 PM
No, even as one of LeBron's biggest supporters, just no

Avenged
06-12-2014, 11:41 PM
No.

Purch
06-12-2014, 11:43 PM
Lmfaooo

JordansBulls
06-12-2014, 11:43 PM
If San Antonio wins Sunday or Tuesday hell no. Only shot he has is if the series went 7. Each game they have lost has been by 15+ points.

Raps18-19 Champ
06-12-2014, 11:45 PM
Nope. Should probably go to the player on the team with the win.

Unless he has an absolute series for the ages like 50 PPG or something and they still lose.

Even if Lebron isn't the reason they are losing though, has to go to someone like Parker or Duncan.

sportsfan222
06-12-2014, 11:45 PM
lebron james has been garbage this series with the exception of game 2.

put the numbers in context.

tonight for example, he was extremely passive in the 1st half, and he had an awesome 3rd qtr with the game out of hand to inflate his stats.

lebron james is an awesome player, and no on will argue that, but this series, im sorry, he has been anything but the best player in the series.

finals mvp will be leonard if spurs win it in 5, no doubt about it

koreancabbage
06-12-2014, 11:46 PM
If San Antonio wins tomorrow or Tuesday hell no. Only shot he has is if the series went 7.

essentially. Only if Lebron brings them to game 7 and he goes off the next two games. Its kinda evident with the roller coaster ride the last three years, that you cannot count on Wade or Bosh to show up in any game..... its kinda pathetic Wade and Bosh have disappeared.... Lebron is still Lebron albiet numbers down but for the Heat to win, Wade and Bosh need to show up.

W andB have not held up their end of the bargain.

koreancabbage
06-12-2014, 11:48 PM
lebron james has been garbage this series with the exception of game 2.

put the numbers in context.

tonight for example, he was extremely passive in the 1st half, and he had an awesome 3rd qtr with the game out of hand to inflate his stats.

lebron james is an awesome player, and no on will argue that, but this series, im sorry, he has been anything but the best player in the series.

finals mvp will be leonard if spurs win it in 5, no doubt about it

how is he inflating his stats in the 3rd quarter when there is still one quarter left to play? a team can still catch up... :facepalm:

todu82
06-12-2014, 11:48 PM
Option 2. Especially if the Heat lose in 5.

LAKobeBryant
06-12-2014, 11:49 PM
Maybe if the games were close you'd have a VALID argument but right now defiantly no.

Crackadalic
06-12-2014, 11:49 PM
No but it's not out of the realm. No one on either side doesn't even come close to his number and like the op said only jerry west has done it. The only argument is if the spurs finish this in 5

sportsfan222
06-12-2014, 11:51 PM
how is he inflating his stats in the 3rd quarter when there is still one quarter left to play? a team can still catch up... :facepalm:

my point was that the game was a 20 point plus lead, lebron james did not have the killer instinct that u see from superstars from the beginning of the game, and he had 1 awesome quarter when the heat were down by 19 entering.

james was not good tonight when it mattered, as no one on the heat was.

the title of the thread, u would think james has been incredible this series, but the reality is, game 1 we all know what happened with him cramping up and leaving in the 4th, game 2 he was awesome, but game 3 and 4 at home, they got blown out at home, james did not play that well.

sportsfan222
06-12-2014, 11:53 PM
No but it's not out of the realm. No one on either side doesn't even come close to his number and like the op said only jerry west has done it. The only argument is if the spurs finish this in 5kwai leonard is the clear mvp of this series, and has outplayed lebron in the series.

anyone who says otherwise has not been watching

sep11ie
06-12-2014, 11:53 PM
I don't see how a Finals MVP could/should EVER come from the losing team. Makes no damn sense.

ManRam
06-12-2014, 11:53 PM
He won't. I'm not sure if he "should" either. But he's the best player in the this series, for sure.

ManRam
06-12-2014, 11:54 PM
kwai leonard is the clear mvp of this series, and has outplayed lebron in the series.

anyone who says otherwise has not been watching

Game 3, sure. Games 1, 2 and 4? No way. Especially the first 2.

koreancabbage
06-12-2014, 11:54 PM
my point was that the game was a 20 point plus lead, lebron james did not have the killer instinct that u see from superstars from the beginning of the game, and he had 1 awesome quarter when the heat were down by 19 entering.

james was not good tonight when it mattered, as no one on the heat was.

the title of the thread, u would think james has been incredible this series, but the reality is, game 1 we all know what happened with him cramping up and leaving in the 4th, game 2 he was awesome, but game 3 and 4 at home, they got blown out at home, james did not play that well.

True. I agree with you James and crew have not played well at all and at their standards we are accustomed to you, even against last years' Spurs, they were better than what we are seeing.

but if they somehow got to game 7, the only player that could get them there, would be Lebron. and thus, fmvp award maybe.

sportsfan222
06-12-2014, 11:55 PM
He won't. I'm not sure if he "should" either. But he's the best player in the this series, for sure.

how has he been the best player in this series?

yes, obviously he is the best player in the series, because he is the best player in the nba, but he has not played the best out of anybody this series.

leonard has outplayed him this series

jerellh528
06-12-2014, 11:56 PM
Hahahahahahahah
Oh god, when will it stop?!
I've never seen another athlete swallowed as much as lbj in history

force_within
06-12-2014, 11:56 PM
is this motherf****** serious?

sportsfan222
06-12-2014, 11:57 PM
Game 3, sure. Games 1, 2 and 4? No way. Especially the first 2.

wait, r u seriously telling me after just watching the game, u think lebron played better than leonard tonight?

wow dude, stop looking at the box score, leonard was awesome all around, james did nothing aside from the 3rd qtr when the game was a 20 plus pt game, so basically garbage time when the spurs were not being as aggressive.

no one is saying leonard is better than james, but tonight leonard was the better player.

jerellh528
06-12-2014, 11:59 PM
wait, r u seriously telling me after just watching the game, u think lebron played better than leonard tonight?

wow dude, stop looking at the box score, leonard was awesome all around, james did nothing aside from the 3rd qtr when the game was a 20 plus pt game, so basically garbage time when the spurs were not being as aggressive.

no one is saying leonard is better than james, but tonight leonard was the better player.

Manram is terrible now, he used to be a decent poster but his love for lbj consumed him like all the others.

Crackadalic
06-12-2014, 11:59 PM
kwai leonard is the clear mvp of this series, and has outplayed lebron in the series.

anyone who says otherwise has not been watching

I'm on the Lenord bandwagon but let's not forget how he was average first two games. Lenord has taking over last two games. Number aside Leonard has been the better defender so that case can be made for my boy

beliges
06-13-2014, 12:01 AM
He won't. I'm not sure if he "should" either. But he's the best player in the this series, for sure.

He's the best player in this series? LOL. Are you our if your mind? Have we been watching the same series? No way dude if lebron is the best player out there Miami wins. He was the best in Game 2. But Leonard has been out playing him. Huge disappointment from LeBron so far.

king4day
06-13-2014, 12:02 AM
I would give it to Leonard right now. He's done it on offense and defense. Diaw is a close second.

sportsfan222
06-13-2014, 12:02 AM
True. I agree with you James and crew have not played well at all and at their standards we are accustomed to you, even against last years' Spurs, they were better than what we are seeing.

but if they somehow got to game 7, the only player that could get them there, would be Lebron. and thus, fmvp award maybe.if this series gets to a game 7, and the heat win, then yes, james will almost certainly be mvp.

with that being said, the odds of a game 7 right now are minuscule.

its one thing to lose, but the heat just came home where they had been dominant the entire playoffs, and not only did they lose 2 games, but they were embarrassed. these games were not even competitive from early on in both games.

the heat seem to have quit, and this can be the end of the big 3 in miami.

the east will only get better next year, chicago will be better, wizards r on the rise, raptors r an up and coming team, pacers r still solid despite what happened, the top 3 picks in the draft are all from the east, so those teams can be a bit better, especially the cavs who already have talent to begin with.

the heat ruling the east is over imo.

sportsfan222
06-13-2014, 12:03 AM
Manram is terrible now, he used to be a decent poster but his love for lbj consumed him like all the others.

must be, only a lebron homer can say he has been the better player.

ManRam
06-13-2014, 12:03 AM
wait, r u seriously telling me after just watching the game, u think lebron played better than leonard tonight?

wow dude, stop looking at the box score, leonard was awesome all around, james did nothing aside from the 3rd qtr when the game was a 20 plus pt game, so basically garbage time when the spurs were not being as aggressive.

no one is saying leonard is better than james, but tonight leonard was the better player.

It was certainly close. He was clearly trying to get his teammates going early on. It failed. But that 3rd quarter, when they needed a run, he went NOVA. The way the Spurs are playing right now...IDK, it's just gotta be such a joy to be a part of that. When everyone's clicking things just start coming so much more easily to players. When things aren't, and a team is struggling, it's much harder to get it going and carry that momentum forward.


But games 1 and 2 are the difference makers. Even if Kawhi was better tonight, and it's close...Kawhi was a NON FACTOR in either of those first two games. Can't overlook that, at all. He really had two completely non-impacting games.

sportsfan222
06-13-2014, 12:05 AM
I'm on the Lenord bandwagon but let's not forget how he was average first two games. Lenord has taking over last two games. Number aside Leonard has been the better defender so that case can be made for my boy

true, leonard was only avg the 1st 2 games, but the past 2 games, on the road, he has been incredible.

james is held to higher standards, but as the best player in the world, his performance aside from game 2 has been disappointing to say the least.

if james had been good, the heat would not have gotten blown out back to back games at home.

sportsfan222
06-13-2014, 12:07 AM
It was certainly close. He was clearly trying to get his teammates going early on. It failed. But that 3rd quarter, when they needed a run, he went NOVA. The way the Spurs are playing right now...IDK, it's just gotta be such a joy to be a part of that. When everyone's clicking things just start coming so much more easily to players. When things aren't, and a team is struggling, it's much harder to get it going and carry that momentum forward.


But games 1 and 2 are the difference makers. Even if Kawhi was better tonight, and it's close...Kawhi was a NON FACTOR in either of those first two games. Can't overlook that, at all. He really had two completely non-impacting games.

game 2 he was poor, game 1 he was avg, but the past 2 games hes been the best player in the series by a landslide.

the heat would not be down 3-1 and getting blown out at home if james was playing like he is capable of doing.

jerellh528
06-13-2014, 12:07 AM
Lebron has had 1 great game, 2 mediocre games and tonight's "garbage time" game. How is that enough to win fmvp? Especially on the losin squad? You're crazy op

beliges
06-13-2014, 12:09 AM
Lebron has had 1 great game, 2 mediocre games and tonight's "garbage time" game. How is that enough to win fmvp? Especially on the losin squad? You're crazy op
LeBron been outplayed so far by Leonard. That's all there's to it.

kingkenny01
06-13-2014, 12:09 AM
Lebron has been the best player in this series but that's just is unfair to the spurs, the spurs earned it and deserved it I hope it's old tim Duncan that wins the finals MVP he is the leader of this team

BobbyHillSwag
06-13-2014, 12:11 AM
Lebron hasn't played well enough to win finals Nov with a loss

ManRam
06-13-2014, 12:12 AM
game 2 he was poor, game 1 he was avg, but the past 2 games hes been the best player in the series by a landslide.

the heat would not be down 3-1 and getting blown out at home if james was playing like he is capable of doing.

That's fine. I don't think LeBron will or should win it. But I do think over the span of all 4 games he's been the better player. Maybe not by much, but those first two games from Kawhi seal it. It's kinda a moot point, tho. LeBron won't win it unless the Heat make the comeback. Which they won't...because they aren't the better team.

kingkenny01
06-13-2014, 12:12 AM
LeBron been outplayed so far by Leonard. That's all there's to it.

Lebron in this series has averaged more points, rebounds, assists, shot a higher field goal percentage and three percentage. No not true at all

FOXHOUND
06-13-2014, 12:15 AM
Have to vote no, and this is really premature. Also he hasn't been as good as his numbers say.

Game 1 he left with an injury at a crucial time and they ended up losing with that being a large factor. Hard to give him too much credit with the circumstances playing out like they did.

Game 2 he was outstanding.

Game 3 he wasn't as good as his numbers say. 9-14 yes, but overall didn't make an impact in the second half what so ever and the team got destroyed.

Game 4 he was the exact opposite of game 3. Poor first half play while the team got destroyed and then had a monster 3rd quarter. I give him credit, that kind of quarter could have been a catalyst to get them back in the game, but it ultimately didn't and it was too little, too late for LeBron.

So as of now, as pretty as his FG% is, he really hasn't played THAT good. Certainly not good enough to even entertain a question like this, as you can say Duncan, Leonard or Parker deserve it for SA before LeBron. If someone is going to win Finals MVP on the losing team it's going to have to fit at least three criteria,

1) It has to, HAS TO go to game 7. No question.
2) That game 7 has to be a tough game that ends at the finish.
3) He has to play by far better than anyone on the other team throughout the series, not even close.

So really at this point even if it did go to 7 it's been four games and he hasn't played far better than any top Spur, so I don't see how this question can even begin to be brought up.

Example, let's look at the one and only case, Jerry West.

1) Game 7? Check.
2) Close game? Check, 108-106 victory for the Celtics.
3) Play far better than anyone else? West averaged 37.9 PPG, 7.4 AST and 4.7 REB while shooting .490 from the field and .839 from the line. Havlicek had a great series himself, 28.3 PPG, 4.4 AST and 11.0 REB while shooting .457 from the field and .847 from the line.

So yeah... no chance LeBron matches a feat like West's.

sportsfan222
06-13-2014, 12:16 AM
Lebron in this series has averaged more points, rebounds, assists, shot a higher field goal percentage and three percentage. No not true at all

watch the series,

if lebron had played as well as his numbers indicate, the heat would not have lost by 19 plus in back to back games at home, and be down 3-1.

tonight for example, lebron has 28 pts, so someone who just looked at the boxscore would say awesome game.

however, anyone who watched the game realizes that james had 1 good statistical quarter when the game was way out of hand.

he did nothing in the 1st half, and barely played the 4th.

DallasTrilla23
06-13-2014, 12:17 AM
He doesn't deserve it and I don't think he would want it if he lost the series. Idk how Jerry West accepted it after he lost to the Celtics lol

Tim Duncan is probably going to get it but I think Boris Diaw should get it

beliges
06-13-2014, 12:17 AM
Lebron in this series has averaged more points, rebounds, assists, shot a higher field goal percentage and three percentage. No not true at all

Sorry bro but LeBronS been outplayed so far. He's had one lebron type game and his team.won. if lebron plays like the best ply er in the game the heat would win. Enough with the excuses. First he didn't have teammates. Now that he has HOFers aeound him, he still doesn't have teammates. This is why putting lebron in the top 5, mt. Rushmore type rhetoric was non sense. But the series isn't over.

Tony_Starks
06-13-2014, 12:18 AM
Is this a joke?

SPURSFAN1
06-13-2014, 12:20 AM
best player on the winning team gets it. dattzzz ittt. this is my candidate for top 5 worst threads of the year.

kingkenny01
06-13-2014, 12:32 AM
Sorry bro but LeBronS been outplayed so far. He's had one lebron type game and his team.won. if lebron plays like the best ply er in the game the heat would win. Enough with the excuses. First he didn't have teammates. Now that he has HOFers aeound him, he still doesn't have teammates. This is why putting lebron in the top 5, mt. Rushmore type rhetoric was non sense. But the series isn't over.

No one on lebron's team scored more than 12 points so yea I don't think he is getting the help he needs, wade would get back on defense along with other heat members, I've watched the games lebron outplayed Leonard games 1,2 without a doubt, Leonard was better game three, game four was a push in my mind. Lebron isn't perfect doesn't deserve to win the championship but it isn't all his fault basketball is team sport there are five guys on the floor

Deem_NY
06-13-2014, 12:33 AM
Kawhi by far this thread isn't a serous question right?

TheMightyHumph
06-13-2014, 12:36 AM
I don't see how a Finals MVP could/should EVER come from the losing team. Makes no damn sense.

Did you watch the 1969 Finals?

FOXHOUND
06-13-2014, 12:39 AM
No one on lebron's team scored more than 12 points so yea I don't think he is getting the help he needs, wade would get back on defense along with other heat members, I've watched the games lebron outplayed Leonard games 1,2 without a doubt, Leonard was better game three, game four was a push in my mind. Lebron isn't perfect doesn't deserve to win the championship but it isn't all his fault basketball is team sport there are five guys on the floor

Right, but what happened to LeBron's passing impact? 28 points, 8 rebounds and 2 assists is a nice line, but somehow when LeBron does it it's on his teammates and when others have done it over the years, let's just say Carmelo Anthony for example ;), they get crucified for not doing enough.

Coming into this game Wade was averaging 18.3 PPG on a .537/.250/.857 line (1-4 from 3), Bosh 15.0 PPG on an insane .654/.714/.857 line (5-7 from 3). As far as second and third options go that's as efficient as it's ever going to get, so games 1-3 it certainly wasn't a lack of support. Yes, Mario Chalmers has sucked but if you're relying that heavily on Mario Chalmers that's problem number one. It's not like the Lakers ever lost a series because of the play of Derek Fisher, it comes down to the All-Stars on top to set the tone and create the situations for players like Chalmers to thrive.

numba1CHANGsta
06-13-2014, 12:43 AM
Only the logo of the NBA could lose the NBA Finals and still win the Finals MVP. LeBron will get nothing :)

jerellh528
06-13-2014, 12:45 AM
Right, but what happened to LeBron's passing impact? 28 points, 8 rebounds and 2 assists is a nice line, but somehow when LeBron does it it's on his teammates and when others have done it over the years, let's just say Carmelo Anthony for example ;), they get crucified for not doing enough.

Coming into this game Wade was averaging 18.3 PPG on a .537/.250/.857 line (1-4 from 3), Bosh 15.0 PPG on an insane .654/.714/.857 line (5-7 from 3). As far as second and third options go that's as efficient as it's ever going to get, so games 1-3 it certainly wasn't a lack of support. Yes, Mario Chalmers has sucked but if you're relying that heavily on Mario Chalmers that's problem number one. It's not like the Lakers ever lost a series because of the play of Derek Fisher, it comes down to the All-Stars on top to set the tone and create the situations for players like Chalmers to thrive.

Very true

QueensG_718
06-13-2014, 12:47 AM
Hell to the no

Hawkeye15
06-13-2014, 01:16 AM
despite LeBron being the best player in these finals so far, his numbers aren't good enough to win Finals MVP, unless he goes nova, and they lose in 7, and the Spurs continue with the ultimate team effort. Even then, about a 5% chance of it happening.

Hawkeye15
06-13-2014, 01:17 AM
Right, but what happened to LeBron's passing impact? 28 points, 8 rebounds and 2 assists is a nice line, but somehow when LeBron does it it's on his teammates and when others have done it over the years, let's just say Carmelo Anthony for example ;), they get crucified for not doing enough.

Coming into this game Wade was averaging 18.3 PPG on a .537/.250/.857 line (1-4 from 3), Bosh 15.0 PPG on an insane .654/.714/.857 line (5-7 from 3). As far as second and third options go that's as efficient as it's ever going to get, so games 1-3 it certainly wasn't a lack of support. Yes, Mario Chalmers has sucked but if you're relying that heavily on Mario Chalmers that's problem number one. It's not like the Lakers ever lost a series because of the play of Derek Fisher, it comes down to the All-Stars on top to set the tone and create the situations for players like Chalmers to thrive.

have you been watching? The rest of his team can't hit a shot to save their lives. The Spurs are also a great run out team.

Tony_Starks
06-13-2014, 01:18 AM
Right, but what happened to LeBron's passing impact? 28 points, 8 rebounds and 2 assists is a nice line, but somehow when LeBron does it it's on his teammates and when others have done it over the years, let's just say Carmelo Anthony for example ;), they get crucified for not doing enough.

Coming into this game Wade was averaging 18.3 PPG on a .537/.250/.857 line (1-4 from 3), Bosh 15.0 PPG on an insane .654/.714/.857 line (5-7 from 3). As far as second and third options go that's as efficient as it's ever going to get, so games 1-3 it certainly wasn't a lack of support. Yes, Mario Chalmers has sucked but if you're relying that heavily on Mario Chalmers that's problem number one. It's not like the Lakers ever lost a series because of the play of Derek Fisher, it comes down to the All-Stars on top to set the tone and create the situations for players like Chalmers to thrive.

Bingo

FOXHOUND
06-13-2014, 01:35 AM
have you been watching? The rest of his team can't hit a shot to save their lives. The Spurs are also a great run out team.

That happens with every team. Hell, how many open shots were the Spurs missing when Miami came back in the third of game 3? Maybe if he set up players for better shots instead of relying so heavily on drive and kick outs they would be finishing better?

The team was shooting .505 from the field and .435 from 3 entering tonight, the only players shooting bad being Chalmers (.250/.200) and Cole (.267/.167). But you know what, Chalmers took 12 shots in games 1-3, and Cole just 15. Wade took 39 FGA at .538, Bosh took 26 FGA at .654 and 5-7 from 3 (.714), Lewis 26 FGA at .538 and 9-18 from 3 (.500). and Allen 27 FGA at .481 and 6-15 from 3 (.400). LeBron averaged 4.3 AST in games 1-3.

So what is it? That's some of the most absurd shooting from supporting cast as you're going to see, so how many shots are they really missing here? Sounds like more LeBron excuses to me. The amount of touches Bosh as lost from games 1 and 2 to games 3 and 4 is a joke, only this can't possibly have anything to do with primary ball handler LeBron.

It's sad how even with this team the responses from many are ultimately amounting that he doesn't have enough help, but people are scared of flat out saying because deep down they know it's ridiculous.

kblo247
06-13-2014, 01:39 AM
have you been watching? The rest of his team can't hit a shot to save their lives. The Spurs are also a great run out team.

Fair criticism, Phil's teams weren't great 3pt hitters like Brons Miami team, but Kobe at the top of the floor for a pick and roll more often than not results in a Shaq, Pau, odom, Bynum, fox, Ariza dunk or layup. Same way Scottie running the team would get Horace or Kukoc a 15 footer.

When Bron drives and plays pick and roll you know its going out to the 3 pt line. He needs to get bosh or wade or hell even Chalmers a damn lay in IMO to change how they are guarded

FOXHOUND
06-13-2014, 01:43 AM
Fair criticism, Phil's teams weren't great 3pt hitters like Brons Miami team, but Kobe at the top of the floor for a pick and roll more often than not results in a Shaq, Pau, odom, Bynum, fox, Ariza dunk or layup. Same way Scottie running the team would get Horace or Kukoc a 15 footer.

When Bron drives and plays pick and roll you know its going out to the 3 pt line. He needs to get bosh or wade or hell even Chalmers a damn lay in IMO to change how they are guarded

Absolutely.

Hawkeye15
06-13-2014, 01:45 AM
That happens with every team. Hell, how many open shots were the Spurs missing when Miami came back in the third of game 3? Maybe if he set up players for better shots instead of relying so heavily on drive and kick outs they would be finishing better?

The team was shooting .505 from the field and .435 from 3 entering tonight, the only players shooting bad being Chalmers (.250/.200) and Cole (.267/.167). But you know what, Chalmers took 12 shots in games 1-3, and Cole just 15. Wade took 39 FGA at .538, Bosh took 26 FGA at .654 and 5-7 from 3 (.714), Lewis 26 FGA at .538 and 9-18 from 3 (.500). and Allen 27 FGA at .481 and 6-15 from 3 (.400). LeBron averaged 4.3 AST in games 1-3.

So what is it? That's some of the most absurd shooting from supporting cast as you're going to see, so how many shots are they really missing here? Sounds like more LeBron excuses to me. The amount of touches Bosh as lost from games 1 and 2 to games 3 and 4 is a joke, only this can't possibly have anything to do with primary ball handler LeBron.

It's sad how even with this team the responses from many are ultimately amounting that he doesn't have enough help, but people are scared of flat out saying because deep down they know it's ridiculous.

Spurs aren't missing a lot dude. They are simply running the most efficient offense possible, and limiting Miami's role players to nothing.

Hawkeye15
06-13-2014, 01:46 AM
Fair criticism, Phil's teams weren't great 3pt hitters like Brons Miami team, but Kobe at the top of the floor for a pick and roll more often than not results in a Shaq, Pau, odom, Bynum, fox, Ariza dunk or layup. Same way Scottie running the team would get Horace or Kukoc a 15 footer.

When Bron drives and plays pick and roll you know its going out to the 3 pt line. He needs to get bosh or wade or hell even Chalmers a damn lay in IMO to change how they are guarded

Phil's teams also had a better supporting cast at the time. This is not 2008 Wade, and Bosh, while efficient, is being killed on the other end. The Spurs are on fire. Simply of fire.

FOXHOUND
06-13-2014, 01:52 AM
Spurs aren't missing a lot dude. They are simply running the most efficient offense possible, and limiting Miami's role players to nothing.

I said the 3rd quarter of game 3, and yeah they were missing open 3's that quarter. They have been even more efficient than Miami, which was my point. Even after a 71 point half they came out and couldn't knock down their open looks, as in it happens to every team.

Miami is also shooting lights out for the series by normal standards. Coming into today Lewis and Allen were both averaging double digits on great efficiency, I don't see how that's nothing. Chalmers, Cole and Birdman haven't done much scoring, but Birdman never does, Cole is not a big piece and Chalmers isn't exactly Kevin Johnson.

Speaking of defense, where has LeBron's defensive impact been this series? Can see why he dropped down to 2nd Team All-Defense this year.

FOXHOUND
06-13-2014, 01:56 AM
Phil's teams also had a better supporting cast at the time. This is not 2008 Wade, and Bosh, while efficient, is being killed on the other end. The Spurs are on fire. Simply of fire.

Oh come on with this lol, Miami is stacked.

In the 2010 Finals only two Lakers other than Kobe averaged double figures. Gasol at 18.6 PPG on .478 and Artest at 10.6 at .361. That's it. Wade was pure crap today, but again games 1-3 he was at 18.3 at 54%. Bosh 15 at 65%. Lewis 12.7 at 54%. Allen 12 at 48%. How is that NOT support?

abe_froman
06-13-2014, 01:59 AM
Kawhi by far this thread isn't a serous question right?

i dunno about that.for as great as kawhi was tonight and through the series ,timmy has quietly had himself a nice little series

FOXHOUND
06-13-2014, 01:59 AM
If you want to talk 2009 vs Orlando,

Gasol 18.6 at 60% - MUCH better
Odom 13.4 at 54% - oh right, he WAS there in 2010 lmao
Ariza 11.0 at 35% - ehhh
Fisher 11.0 at 50% - nice

So yeah, his support in 2009 was much better than 2010 (still far worse than LeBron has this year) but you know what? Kobe averaged 7.4 AST in the 2009 Finals so... again what is LeBron's excuse? The 4 shots a game Chalmers is taking is bringing him down or what?

Hawkeye15
06-13-2014, 02:00 AM
Oh come on with this lol, Miami is stacked.

In the 2010 Finals only two Lakers other than Kobe averaged double figures. Gasol at 18.6 PPG on .478 and Artest at 10.6 at .361. That's it. Wade was pure crap today, but again games 1-3 he was at 18.3 at 54%. Bosh 15 at 65%. Lewis 12.7 at 54%. Allen 12 at 48%. How is that NOT support?

They are stacked? Cool

To answer the thread question, yet again, while LeBron has been the best individual player in the series, the Heat's complete inability to stop the Spurs from scoring at ease is why they are down 3-1. No, he will not win MVP. But to act like LeBron's supporting cast is playing amazing when they are giving up layups and open jumpers like they are being paid to do so is just being a biased person who wants LeBron to lose for their own self being.

The Spurs offense is destroying them. LeBron can't guard everyone. The Heat are giving up penetration, and wide open looks from all over the floor.

Hawkeye15
06-13-2014, 02:01 AM
If you want to talk 2009 vs Orlando,

Gasol 18.6 at 60% - MUCH better
Odom 13.4 at 54% - oh right, he WAS there in 2010 lmao
Ariza 11.0 at 35% - ehhh
Fisher 11.0 at 50% - nice

So yeah, his support in 2009 was much better than 2010 (still far worse than LeBron has this year) but you know what? Kobe averaged 7.4 AST in the 2009 Finals so... again what is LeBron's excuse? The 4 shots a game Chalmers is taking is bringing him down or what?

factor in that the Spurs are exponentially a better team than the Magic maybe haha?

Or do you like no context?

Shlumpledink
06-13-2014, 02:02 AM
Voters like to think about it as little as possible and go with the grain. Lebron won't win it, even though he is the best player in the series having the best series. Voters will pick someone from SAS. It might even be Duncan because he is the most popular Spur

beliges
06-13-2014, 02:02 AM
Spurs aren't missing a lot dude. They are simply running the most efficient offense possible, and limiting Miami's role players to nothing.

That's when a player that is considered by many to be one of the greatests of all time needs to.actually play like one. Lebron has been anything but great in this series outside of game 2. Enough with the excuses. Carry your team and live up to all the praise.

MickeyMgl
06-13-2014, 02:05 AM
I didn't vote because I don't agree with either option. No, Lebron shouldn't win the MVP for this series if the Heat lose, but I am not against a Finals MVP from the losing team UNDER THE RIGHT CIRCUMSTANCES.

These don't fulfill any of those circumstances. Blowout losses. Possibly a short series. At least one good candidate from the Spurs (Leonard). Etc.

FOXHOUND
06-13-2014, 02:06 AM
They are stacked? Cool

To answer the thread question, yet again, while LeBron has been the best individual player in the series, the Heat's complete inability to stop the Spurs from scoring at ease is why they are down 3-1. No, he will not win MVP. But to act like LeBron's supporting cast is playing amazing when they are giving up layups and open jumpers like they are being paid to do so is just being a biased person who wants LeBron to lose for their own self being.

The Spurs offense is destroying them. LeBron can't guard everyone. The Heat are giving up penetration, and wide open looks from all over the floor.

Yes, how many teams can bring in a guy like Lewis off the reserves bench and have him making an impact like this in the Finals? They've done it the other years with Mike Miller. How many teams have three legit All-Stars? Are the Spurs deeper? Yes, but how much of these players excelling is the Spurs system vs their raw ability?

If you want to argue from a coaching/system standpoint that the Spurs are better then yeah, nobody is better than Pop. The Heat's pace and space system and depth is normally a huge advantage and in this series they are on the short end in both. However from a pure talent standpoint Miami is no worse, if not better.

jerellh528
06-13-2014, 02:07 AM
I said the 3rd quarter of game 3, and yeah they were missing open 3's that quarter. They have been even more efficient than Miami, which was my point. Even after a 71 point half they came out and couldn't knock down their open looks, as in it happens to every team.

Miami is also shooting lights out for the series by normal standards. Coming into today Lewis and Allen were both averaging double digits on great efficiency, I don't see how that's nothing. Chalmers, Cole and Birdman haven't done much scoring, but Birdman never does, Cole is not a big piece and Chalmers isn't exactly Kevin Johnson.

Speaking of defense, where has LeBron's defensive impact been this series? Can see why he dropped down to 2nd Team All-Defense this year.

Good points

goingfor28
06-13-2014, 02:07 AM
No
Diaw or Kawhi

steelcityroller
06-13-2014, 02:08 AM
If Leonard plays the same the rest of the way out and the Spurs win he deserves it. He stepped up BIG TIME these last 2 games on both ends of the court.

NoahH
06-13-2014, 02:08 AM
Only if the series went 7 games

FOXHOUND
06-13-2014, 02:09 AM
factor in that the Spurs are exponentially a better team than the Magic maybe haha?

Or do you like no context?

Right, so Wade, Bosh, Lewis and Allen still outproducing them vs a much better team is supposed to show how much worse that supporting cast is, then?

Hawkeye15
06-13-2014, 02:11 AM
That's when a player that is considered by many to be one of the greatests of all time needs to.actually play one. Lebron has been anything but great in this series outside of game 2. Enough with the excuses. Carry your team and live up to all the praise.

LeBron has been awesome. His teams defense has not. The Spurs are running a clinic, something we have rarely seen at this stage.

Hawkeye15
06-13-2014, 02:12 AM
Right, so Wade, Bosh, Lewis and Allen still outproducing them vs a much better team is supposed to show how much worse that supporting cast is, then?

right, so the Magic that the Lakers beat would have won a single game against this Spurs team?

The Spurs would have ripped them by 20 every game in the finals, easily. The Spurs are playing out of their minds.

kblo247
06-13-2014, 02:14 AM
Phil's teams also had a better supporting cast at the time. This is not 2008 Wade, and Bosh, while efficient, is being killed on the other end. The Spurs are on fire. Simply of fire.

The third best guy on the team that killed sa for Phil were Fisher, Fisher, Malone, and Odom. I mean in no way should they be considered better than Bosh or Wade depending on who you think is the second guy.

The biggest difference is Kobe cut SA like butter on the block, off the dribble, with pick and roll, and him getting his didn't result in you standing around and watching. He could get his while being the primary ball handler and getting Shaq his 30 and fish his double digits or hitting Pau up for 20 and Odom for 15.

He could go off the bell, make the cut, spot up, post and seal his guy, and not just operate when he wasn't dribbling. I think you can admit by now Lebron makes you watch him and chuck a 3. Like it or not, Kobe integrated Paus game without a camp and in the middle of a road trip. Lebrun turned 20 and 10 Bosh who could play into a glorified Robert Horry or Big Z who gets the hell out the way and spots up. They have no inside game not because they aren't talented enough to score Inside, but because bron ain't adapted and held back some of his individual comfort to incorporate bigs.

Some 2pt fg attempts would open things up but that would mean bron not doing that 4 corner draw and kick **** he loves which gives him Oscar numbers ... they are playing the draw and kick, so get your guys some damn lay ins, dunks, and midst. Or heaven forbid, give Bosh the fn ball down low and make some playaction away from the ball like Kobe or MJ could and did for Phil all the time

FOXHOUND
06-13-2014, 02:16 AM
i dunno about that.for as great as kawhi was tonight and through the series ,timmy has quietly had himself a nice little series

Parker has quietly had a very nice series as well. Entered tonight leading the team in scoring and assists (18.3 and 6.3) while shooting .500/.556/.714. Tonight added another 19 on 8-15 shooting. He could be in line for Finals MVP #2, and still wouldn't get the proper respect as an elite PG lol.

Leonard, Duncan and Parker are playing very well, as of now looks between those three.

FOXHOUND
06-13-2014, 02:18 AM
right, so the Magic that the Lakers beat would have won a single game against this Spurs team?

The Spurs would have ripped them by 20 every game in the finals, easily. The Spurs are playing out of their minds.

When did I say that? Remember, this started about LeBron's passing impact, which has not been up to par and would be a huge help. This Spurs team is obviously way more talented than those 2009/10 Lakers, but then again so is Miami.

jerellh528
06-13-2014, 02:22 AM
LeBron has been awesome. His teams defense has not. The Spurs are running a clinic, something we have rarely seen at this stage.

This post gave me cancer. Seriously? Be honest are you watching this series at all? Or peeking at the box score? Which isn't even great minus that one game. Also, you say his teams defense like he's been playing good defense when that hasn't been the case. Even die hard Miami fans would admit he hasn't been able to stop a thing this series. So put the bron goggles down and quit lying to yourself. We a know you love Lebron, but awesome is the last thing he has been. If he was even playing better than regular season Lebron, you could say awesome and I'd be cool with it. But he's been pretty average actually, definitely not NBA's best player type of play, that's for sure.

FOXHOUND
06-13-2014, 02:22 AM
The third best guy on the team that killed sa for Phil were Fisher, Fisher, Malone, and Odom. I mean in no way should they be considered better than Bosh or Wade depending on who you think is the second guy.

The biggest difference is Kobe cut SA like butter on the block, off the dribble, with pick and roll, and him getting his didn't result in you standing around and watching. He could get his while being the primary ball handler and getting Shaq his 30 and fish his double digits or hitting Pau up for 20 and Odom for 15.

He could go off the bell, make the cut, spot up, post and seal his guy, and not just operate when he wasn't dribbling. I think you can admit by now Lebron makes you watch him and chuck a 3. Like it or not, Kobe integrated Paus game without a camp and in the middle of a road trip. Lebrun turned 20 and 10 Bosh who could play into a glorified Robert Horry or Big Z who gets the hell out the way and spots up. They have no inside game not because they aren't talented enough to score Inside, but because bron ain't adapted and held back some of his individual comfort to incorporate bigs.

Some 2pt fg attempts would open things up but that would mean bron not doing that 4 corner draw and kick **** he loves which gives him Oscar numbers ... they are playing the draw and kick, so get your guys some damn lay ins, dunks, and midst. Or heaven forbid, give Bosh the fn ball down low and make some playaction away from the ball like Kobe or MJ could and did for Phil all the time

Good breakdown, sir. :clap:

jerellh528
06-13-2014, 02:24 AM
The third best guy on the team that killed sa for Phil were Fisher, Fisher, Malone, and Odom. I mean in no way should they be considered better than Bosh or Wade depending on who you think is the second guy.

The biggest difference is Kobe cut SA like butter on the block, off the dribble, with pick and roll, and him getting his didn't result in you standing around and watching. He could get his while being the primary ball handler and getting Shaq his 30 and fish his double digits or hitting Pau up for 20 and Odom for 15.

He could go off the bell, make the cut, spot up, post and seal his guy, and not just operate when he wasn't dribbling. I think you can admit by now Lebron makes you watch him and chuck a 3. Like it or not, Kobe integrated Paus game without a camp and in the middle of a road trip. Lebrun turned 20 and 10 Bosh who could play into a glorified Robert Horry or Big Z who gets the hell out the way and spots up. They have no inside game not because they aren't talented enough to score Inside, but because bron ain't adapted and held back some of his individual comfort to incorporate bigs.

Some 2pt fg attempts would open things up but that would mean bron not doing that 4 corner draw and kick **** he loves which gives him Oscar numbers ... they are playing the draw and kick, so get your guys some damn lay ins, dunks, and midst. Or heaven forbid, give Bosh the fn ball down low and make some playaction away from the ball like Kobe or MJ could and did for Phil all the time

Well said kblo.

PowerHouse
06-13-2014, 02:28 AM
Maybe if this series were to go 7 but its ridiculously lop-sided for the Spurs.

Bostonjorge
06-13-2014, 02:31 AM
Leonard is the MVP. 2 huge games that end up in blowouts.

He had 20 points and 14 Rebs leading the team in both with James guarding him. Then on D took James out the game early. Held James to 2 assist.

Chrisclover
06-13-2014, 04:09 AM
It has to be Duncan. And the ESPN has stories to write. Blah Blah Blah. ...

Bruno
06-13-2014, 04:33 AM
LBJ is averaging 3.75 assists per game for the finals. whats up with that?

kblo247
06-13-2014, 04:56 AM
Good breakdown, sir. :clap:


Well said kblo.

What's getting me is Hawkeye should see the benefit of the lay up, dunk, or mid. The spurs are driving and kicking it out the 3 yes, but they also swing it right back when they run at a shooter to draw, Manu, or parker, which then gets Leonard, Duncan, and Splitter a dunk or lay up. The spurs are a prime example of what a two can do for you, just look at game 3 when they had a cold spell, they got bunnies but Lebron just doesn't do that for his teammates ever on a historical basis.

We laker fans can remember years and years. Yes Kobe hit fish and rob for a lot of big 3s, but I remember the first Kobe to Pau vs NJ like yesterday. Kobe broke them down, spun, and hit Pau in the chest and he dunked it. Theres the finals commerical where everyone relives Kobe to Shaq vs Portland etc. That's the biggest difference between Kobe and Lebron, lobes never needed to be surrounded by shooters, he's always had one or two who will hit, but bron basically turns 4 guys into shooters where Kobe makes at least 2-3 of his guys finishers for spoon feeds he will throw smack dab in their lap.

Even in the bulls games you can flash back if you have the tapes to pippin using his ability to break guys down to get mj a dunk or easy one

WingbowlMVP
06-13-2014, 05:45 AM
Ron Hextall (Flyers Goalie) won finals MVP when he lost to the Oilers in the 1980's but he had one of the greatest goal tending performances ever to do it.

Lebron has been good in this series but not one of the greatest performances ever, I think you need that and game 7 to be able to lose and win the MVP so I don't see it.

JasonJohnHorn
06-13-2014, 07:50 AM
Maybe if the games were close you'd have a VALID argument but right now defiantly no.

I'm not making the argument, just asking the question.

It's like the 04 Finals.... Kobe and Shaq may have both had better games that series than anybody on the Pistons, but does the finals MVP need with win the series to get the award? I'm not saying yes or no, just asking what everybody thinks. Shaq was head and shoulders better than any player that series..... I would have given MVP to Chauncey, Rip or Ben over Kobe, and I would have been upset as a Pistons fan to see Shaq get if the Pistons won, but at the same time, he was beasting that series.

Tony_Starks
06-13-2014, 04:37 PM
Lebron has been incredibly average this series by "best player on the planet" standards. His fourth quarters have been like the Dallas Finals all over again. Even yesterday he had a decent stat line in the end but he only had 9 points in the first half when the game was getting out of hand, 3 points of which coming on a lucky 3 right before the half ended. He went on a run in the third but the game was already over, it was essentially garbage time.

Not to mention his plus minus was horrible last game but coincidentally the advanced stat geeks are completely ignoring that one.

bucketss
06-13-2014, 04:50 PM
Lebron has been incredibly average this series by "best player on the planet" standards. His fourth quarters have been like the Dallas Finals all over again. Even yesterday he had a decent stat line in the end but he only had 9 points in the first half when the game was getting out of hand, 3 points of which coming on a lucky 3 right before the half ended. He went on a run in the third but the game was already over, it was essentially garbage time.

Not to mention his plus minus was horrible last game but coincidentally the advanced stat geeks are completely ignoring that one.

see this is really confusing lol, you guys rarely look into things before making a post. lets break it down for you when you talk about fourth quarter scoring.


game 1: he had a cramp in the 4th which took him out
game 2: he had 8 points
game 3: game was way over before the 4th
game 4: game again was out of reach and he played like a few minutes in the 4th

i really can't fathom how someone can even begin to compare it to the dallas series.

jerellh528
06-13-2014, 05:02 PM
see this is really confusing lol, you guys rarely look into things before making a post. lets break it down for you when you talk about fourth quarter scoring.


game 1: he had a cramp in the 4th which took him out
game 2: he had 8 points
game 3: game was way over before the 4th
game 4: game again was out of reach and he played like a few minutes in the 4th

i really can't fathom how someone can even begin to compare it to the dallas series.

Doesn't it irritate how people use stats as the end all with no real context or unbiased?

Tony_Starks
06-13-2014, 05:08 PM
see this is really confusing lol, you guys rarely look into things before making a post. lets break it down for you when you talk about fourth quarter scoring.


game 1: he had a cramp in the 4th which took him out
game 2: he had 8 points
game 3: game was way over before the 4th
game 4: game again was out of reach and he played like a few minutes in the 4th

i really can't fathom how someone can even begin to compare it to the dallas series.

Are you serious? Game 3 the Heat actually cut the lead to 7 toward the end of the 3rd. A Bellinelli 3 put it at 10 points, that's is FAR from being "way over."

Game 4 was a wrap by halftime but how do you justify 9 points in the first half of a do or die game by the best player in the game?

I get that you want to defend your boy but come on man at least watch the games. Lebron has had 1 dominant game this series, even the most hard core Lebron fan wouldn't deny that.

FOXHOUND
06-13-2014, 05:09 PM
see this is really confusing lol, you guys rarely look into things before making a post. lets break it down for you when you talk about fourth quarter scoring.


game 1: he had a cramp in the 4th which took him out
game 2: he had 8 points
game 3: game was way over before the 4th
game 4: game again was out of reach and he played like a few minutes in the 4th

i really can't fathom how someone can even begin to compare it to the dallas series.

I get your point but game 3 was not over long before the 4th, unless you're forgetting the fact that Miami cut it to a 7 point game in the third quarter. LeBron had just 4 points in he 3rd and 4th alike in game 3, he didn't have a good second half period.

SPURSFAN1
06-13-2014, 05:17 PM
Never met so many Lebron slurpers. If his superstar team loses, he ain't getting FMVP. No need to think too hard. dats it mayne!

bucketss
06-13-2014, 05:25 PM
Are you serious? Game 3 the Heat actually cut the lead to 7 toward the end of the 3rd. A Bellinelli 3 put it at 10 points, that's is FAR from being "way over."

Game 4 was a wrap by halftime but how do you justify 9 points in the first half of a do or die game by the best player in the game?

I get that you want to defend your boy but come on man at least watch the games. Lebron has had 1 dominant game this series, even the most hard core Lebron fan wouldn't deny that.

they cut it to 11 in which the 4th the spurs quickly destroyed them in the 4th. you comparing it to that dallas series is hilarious. momentum killing plays including ray allens charge is what put that game away, miami never gathered any rhythm

also he got off slow in the 1st half, but he erupted in the 3rd, where were his team mates?they score only 2 points? missing open threes, layups etc.

btw i thought we were talking about 4th quarter scoring?

Jtirado16
06-13-2014, 05:26 PM
Ur kidding..

IversonIsKrazy
06-13-2014, 05:35 PM
If LeBron goes GOD mode and forces G7, sure. If SPurs close this out in 5 or 6, then no. The real debate is who SO FAR has been the MVP? Diaw prlly impacts the game the most, but in no way is he an MVP. I'd give the nod to Timmy

bucketss
06-13-2014, 05:51 PM
I get your point but game 3 was not over long before the 4th, unless you're forgetting the fact that Miami cut it to a 7 point game in the third quarter. LeBron had just 4 points in he 3rd and 4th alike in game 3, he didn't have a good second half period.

4 points and remember the 4 steal, also consider how many REAL minutes miami started unraveling around the time parkers three and that ray allen offensive chaarge

Tony_Starks
06-13-2014, 06:03 PM
Lebron James currently has more turnovers this series than assist.

I rest my case, get Kawhi Leonard's trophy ready.

L8kers4life
06-13-2014, 06:31 PM
I swear, you can not tell a Lebron fan he is struggling, they make every excuse to why he is not.

Tony_Starks
06-13-2014, 06:37 PM
I swear, you can not tell a Lebron fan he is struggling, they make every excuse to why he is not.


As long as I've watched basketball I swear I've never seen a star player get all the praise when his team wins, and absolutely none of the blame when they lose.

tr3ymill3r
06-13-2014, 07:08 PM
Nope Leonard and Boris would get it before him at this point.

bucketss
06-13-2014, 07:14 PM
Lebron James currently has more turnovers this series than assist.

I rest my case, get Kawhi Leonard's trophy ready.

now lets talk about his 27 ppg on 60%, his 2.5 steals, his 7.3 rbs. and they fact hes been the best player in this series.

abe_froman
06-13-2014, 07:15 PM
As long as I've watched basketball I swear I've never seen a star player get all the praise when his team wins, and absolutely none of the blame when they lose.
kobe bryant not ring a bell or ya? ,hell even mj,melo,wade(when he was on the main star),ect. and basically every other superstar that has a large,fanatical following are treated like that

bucketss
06-13-2014, 07:17 PM
As long as I've watched basketball I swear I've never seen a star player get all the praise when his team wins, and absolutely none of the blame when they lose.

who got the praise when kobe shot 6-26 in game 7 ?

btw lebron has been absolutely the most scrutinised player in league histroy, past two years its been "lock out season" and "they got lucky" OLOL where u been hiding?

SPURSFAN1
06-13-2014, 07:18 PM
now lets talk about his 27 ppg on 60%, his 2.5 steals, his 7.3 rbs. and they fact hes been the best player in this series.

How about he play some ****ing defense first?

Tony_Starks
06-13-2014, 07:30 PM
who got the praise when kobe shot 6-26 in game 7 ?

btw lebron has been absolutely the most scrutinised player in league histroy, past two years its been "lock out season" and "they got lucky" OLOL where u been hiding?

You mean the game 7 when he had like 10 points in the fourth and like 15 boards? Yeah, I believe he does get credit for that, nice try though.

bucketss
06-13-2014, 07:36 PM
You mean the game 7 when he had like 10 points in the fourth and like 15 boards? Yeah, I believe he does get credit for that, nice try though.

he had a horrible game regardless , like you said about lebron why is the supposed best player in the league having such a **** first half? lol only difference is in this situations is kobes teamates stepped up

Tony_Starks
06-13-2014, 07:43 PM
he had a horrible game regardless , like you said about lebron why is the supposed best player in the league having such a **** first half? lol only difference is in this situations is kobes teamates stepped up

Correction, he had a horrible SHOOTING game, but still found other ways to contribute and win. Sort of like if Lebron would have found a way to win by stepping up on D, crashing boards more, getting more than 3 assist, turning it over less, getting to the line more.....etc.

I'll leave you be my good man. I respect your opinion but seriously don't think you're very knowledgable about basketball. You seem more inclined to defend Lebron come hell or high water, and sneak diss Kobe while so doing even though this topic has nothing to do with him.

kdspurman
06-13-2014, 07:44 PM
No chance. If the spurs manage to win, it will be between Duncan/Leonard.

bucketss
06-13-2014, 07:52 PM
Correction, he had a horrible SHOOTING game, but still found other ways to contribute and win. Sort of like if Lebron would have found a way to win by stepping up on D, crashing boards more, getting more than 3 assist, turning it over less, getting to the line more.....etc.

I'll leave you be my good man. I respect your opinion but seriously don't think you're very knowledgable about basketball. You seem more inclined to defend Lebron come hell or high water, and sneak diss Kobe while so doing even though this topic has nothing to so with him.

i don't know basketball when you compared lebrons 4th quarters to that of 2011's completely forgetting the cramp in game one, and the game being over already in game 4. i will give you game 3 even though i think the game got out of hand too fast anyways in that 4th,. he did have 4 steals in that quarter so again he was active but momentum killing plays put the nail in the coffin early.

TheSportMessiah
06-13-2014, 08:00 PM
This is a joke...the question is how many LeBron threads can there be!?

YoungOne
06-13-2014, 08:23 PM
the bigger question is who's the spurs mvp thus far?

DemarDerozan
06-14-2014, 02:17 AM
Kawhi has been lights out the last two games. But Timmy breaking the records he has and just being consistent may get him the award. Depends on who has the best game five when the Spurs close it out Sunday.

Oh... And regarding the initial question in this order:

1. Nope
2. Lmfao
3. Hell no
4. At least we now know who the real Heat fans are compared to the Lebronosexuals.

zn23
06-14-2014, 05:20 PM
I wish they would consider doing this because LeBron has been by far the best player in the playoffs and the finals.

bluefire7002
06-14-2014, 05:32 PM
I wish they would consider doing this because LeBron has been by far the best player in the playoffs and the finals.

Leonard has been the best player the past two games, thats half the series.

flea
06-14-2014, 05:42 PM
Is this thread for real? Because this is why the NBA forum has a terrible reputation. The Heat get handed 2 of the most lopsided losses in Finals history, while at home, but someone out there wants to give Lebron the MVP for that accomplishment?

In no way has Lebron been the best in the series. Best on the Heat? Sure, obviously. But his decline in defense that was evident in the regular season is becoming a worry in the postseason now. He's just not quick enough anymore to defend guards - even in bursts. He's never been a great defender, but rather just one that is effective in his role and remains hidden most of the other time so he can conserve his energy for offense. But he's looking more like a tweener forward now - not quite quick enough to effectively defend a guy like Kawhi for a whole game, and not skilled enough to do much of anything in the post.

As a result, he's gambled a lot more in these playoffs. That's fine when it works, because that's what Miami's defense is predicated on, but it's not working. There's a lot of credit to the Spurs execution for that, but it's not like the Heat are playing decent defense. They look awful for the last 2 games, and they weren't all that great in the first two games either.

Duncan has been the best so far, followed closely by Leonard. The Spurs defensive advantage is basically due almost entirely to the two of them in the series, and they both have been big parts of the obscene offensive clinic that has been put on because they have been the 2 best finishers for the Spurs (and please, don't try to tell me a very limited Parker has been a better finisher than either of them because he had one good scoring game).

Teeboy1487
06-14-2014, 05:47 PM
Hell to the no.

tredigs
06-14-2014, 05:57 PM
Let's not forget that before game 3, one of the talking points of the series was just how irrelevant Kawhi had been with open on-air discussions on whether he had regressed/what was wrong with him. So to say he is the clear cut FMVP right now is a bit odd considering that was half the series to this point. But, if he has another game that is good or better with the Spurs winning, he will get it.

Lebron has 0 chance of a FMVP if the Heat lose. They just got crushed on their home floor with the opposing SF doing the lions share of the damage.

bluefire7002
06-14-2014, 06:13 PM
Let's not forget that before game 3, one of the talking points of the series was just how irrelevant Kawhi had been with open on-air discussions on whether he had regressed/what was wrong with him. So to say he is the clear cut FMVP right now is a bit odd considering that was half the series to this point. But, if he has another game that is good or better with the Spurs winning, he will get it.

Lebron has 0 chance of a FMVP if the Heat lose. They just got crushed on their home floor with the opposing SF doing the lions share of the damage.

I don't think Leonard is a favorite at all... Just said he has been the past two games. That's what's interesting with the spurs. They have all been playing great, that there is no clear cut favorite. Duncan, Parker, Leonard, Ginobili, even Diaw has been consistently good.

tredigs
06-14-2014, 06:29 PM
I don't think Leonard is a favorite at all... Just said he has been the past two games. That's what's interesting with the spurs. They have all been playing great, that there is no clear cut favorite. Duncan, Parker, Leonard, Ginobili, even Diaw has been consistently good.

He seems to be the consensus favorite though, and actually I'd say that's correct seeing as he has had the most standout/impactful games for them, even if he did pretty much dud the first two (helps that this is a "what have you done for me lately" world and the latter games were the great ones for him). Duncan and maybe Ginobili or TP could also get it if they have a blowup performance(s) in the final game(s).

SPURSFAN1
06-14-2014, 08:33 PM
He seems to be the consensus favorite though, and actually I'd say that's correct seeing as he has had the most standout/impactful games for them, even if he did pretty much dud the first two (helps that this is a "what have you done for me lately" world and the latter games were the great ones for him). Duncan and maybe Ginobili or TP could also get it if they have a blowup performance(s) in the final game(s).

Duncan is winning this if they win. Not a lifetime achievement award like many people say. He is getting 16 and 11 while anchoring the rim defense. He is getting it. Plus he can carry just like in overtime game 6 vs the thunder. He is the best player on the floor for the spurs.

NYKNYGNYY
06-14-2014, 08:43 PM
Gotta be kawai ... Wouldn't be surprised if they throw it to Duncan tho

JasonJohnHorn
06-15-2014, 01:13 AM
Lebron has had 1 great game, 2 mediocre games and tonight's "garbage time" game. How is that enough to win fmvp? Especially on the losin squad? You're crazy op

I'm asking a question, not making an argument How does that make me 'crazy'?

It is a valid question. If a player on the losing team has a better series than anybody on the winning team, should be considered for the MVP award? If your answer is no that is a reasonable stance. I'm just curious how people feel. West won it once when his team lost, and it hasn't happened since. I'm wondering how people would feel about that.

As to the 'garbage' minutes... the third quarter wasn't 'garbage minutes'. The Heat were trying to get back onto the series. And when you are playing in the NBA finals, the level of game on the court is such that anybody who is scoring 25+ while shooting over .500 is having a note worthy performance.