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sunsfan88
04-23-2014, 03:46 PM
During the first two games of their first round series, Kevin Durant is 9-for-25 (36 percent) while being guarded by Tony Allen and 10-for-18 (55.5 percent) against everyone else on the Memphis Grizzlies.

Allen missed 27 games this season while recovering from a knee issue and appears to be healthier and faster.

Allen is especially adept at avoiding screens to stick with Durant.
http://grantland.com/features/nba-playoffs-winners-and-losers-round-one-2014/

Westbrook is (rightfully) getting a lot of heat for shooting too much but not many is talking about Durant struggling to score against a guy who Durant has a MAJOR advantage against in terms of height, weight, length, athleticism and age in Tony Allen.

Allen's a great defender but this is the playoffs, and its the 1st round and your supposed to be the MVP, I think you ought to perform better especially on the home floor.

Patriot Pride
04-23-2014, 03:47 PM
Tony Allen is a great defender. Durant will go off eventually though.

SeoulBeatz
04-23-2014, 04:03 PM
Allen is a top-3 perimeter defender so it's not surprising he's been able to keep Durant in check for a little while, but like Patriot Pride said, Durant's gonna get his.

tredigs
04-23-2014, 04:06 PM
I'm not sure how closely you've watched the series, but similar to their strategy last year, Memphis is mass-guarding Durant and forcing everyone else to beat them. Specifically when Thabo and Perkins are on the court. But they're also willing to give Westbrook his shot and sometimes concede the open mid-range to Ibaka if it's between that or simply single teaming KD. Without Westbrook last year it worked; KD found them and they simply could not hit open shots. They know how to defend OKC (stop KD at all costs) and have the personnel to pull it off, which makes that matchup particularly tough for the Thunder. I think it goes 7.

Here's an example of "Tony Allen guarding Durant" that those #'s are coming from: http://https://twitter.com/SherwoodStrauss/status/458659351108931584/photo/1 (https://twitter.com/SherwoodStrauss)

Scroll to April 22nd for the picture.

YoungOne
04-23-2014, 04:20 PM
if there would be a hall of fame for defense, TA would be in no doubt

MrfadeawayJB
04-23-2014, 04:26 PM
Durant still thinking about being hounded last season on the playoffs. The grizz make it a team effort and can throw Allen, prince, and sometimes lee at durant

beyourself
04-23-2014, 04:33 PM
Everything you post about Durant is negative. Obvious agenda here.

Goose17
04-23-2014, 04:39 PM
Gotta love Allen.

mdm692
04-23-2014, 04:53 PM
He's been passive on the 4th as well.

Chronz
04-23-2014, 05:05 PM
I'm not sure how closely you've watched the series, but similar to their strategy last year, Memphis is mass-guarding Durant and forcing everyone else to beat them. Specifically when Thabo and Perkins are on the court. But they're also willing to give Westbrook his shot and sometimes concede the open mid-range to Ibaka if it's between that or simply single teaming KD. Without Westbrook last year it worked; KD found them and they simply could not hit open shots. They know how to defend OKC (stop KD at all costs) and have the personnel to pull it off, which makes that matchup particularly tough for the Thunder. I think it goes 7.

Here's an example of "Tony Allen guarding Durant" that those #'s are coming from: http://https://twitter.com/SherwoodStrauss/status/458659351108931584/photo/1
i cant see

tredigs
04-23-2014, 05:29 PM
i cant see

Weird, just scroll down to April 22nd for Strauss's picture post on it.

https://twitter.com/SherwoodStrauss

It's a pic of KD driving (at a random point midway through the third with >10 seconds on the shot clock) with Tony Allen on his side, and all 4 other Grizzlies leaving their men to collapse on him in the paint.

Actually amazing he's only averaged 1.6 turnovers through the first two and leads the playoffs in Offensive Rating + eFG% + TS% on 35/10/6. He's crushing them despite the team D.

IndyRealist
04-23-2014, 05:41 PM
I'm not sure how closely you've watched the series, but similar to their strategy last year, Memphis is mass-guarding Durant and forcing everyone else to beat them. Specifically when Thabo and Perkins are on the court. But they're also willing to give Westbrook his shot and sometimes concede the open mid-range to Ibaka if it's between that or simply single teaming KD. Without Westbrook last year it worked; KD found them and they simply could not hit open shots. They know how to defend OKC (stop KD at all costs) and have the personnel to pull it off, which makes that matchup particularly tough for the Thunder. I think it goes 7.

Here's an example of "Tony Allen guarding Durant" that those #'s are coming from: http://https://twitter.com/SherwoodStrauss/status/458659351108931584/photo/1
Thank you. It's amazing that the same people who say "basketball is a team game, you can't quantify it" are the same people who try to break down the game into a series of 1-on-1 matchups. The Grizz designed their entire scheme around stopping Durant. Saying one person, no matter his reputation, is responsible for it is silly.

Also, small sample sizes. Game 3 Durant could make an adjustment and drop 54 in 24 shots on Allen's head, and this micro analysis will look foolish.

sunsfan88
04-23-2014, 06:04 PM
Thank you. It's amazing that the same people who say "basketball is a team game, you can't quantify it" are the same people who try to break down the game into a series of 1-on-1 matchups. The Grizz designed their entire scheme around stopping Durant. Saying one person, no matter his reputation, is responsible for it is silly.

Also, small sample sizes. Game 3 Durant could make an adjustment and drop 54 in 24 shots on Allen's head, and this micro analysis will look foolish.
One game won't change everything.

Your crazy if you don't think Durant will rightfully get a majority of the criticism if Durant can't even get past the 1st round in his "MVP" season.

championships
04-23-2014, 06:06 PM
Not a huge surprise. Allen is a helluva defender.

tredigs
04-23-2014, 06:46 PM
One game won't change everything.

Your crazy if you don't think Durant will rightfully get a majority of the criticism if Durant can't even get past the 1st round in his "MVP" season.

He's talking about the 38% of "Tony Allen" (See: Memphis Grizzlies) guarding KD. It's 25 shots, that can change drastically in a quarter.

OKC likely wins the series because KD is just that, but it's a very tough round one. They're not playing the Hawks... or even the Pacers over here.

JordansBulls
04-23-2014, 06:48 PM
He has no effect on KD.

sunsfan88
04-23-2014, 07:22 PM
He's talking about the 38% of "Tony Allen" (See: Memphis Grizzlies) guarding KD. It's 25 shots, that can change drastically in a quarter.

OKC likely wins the series because KD is just that, but it's a very tough round one. They're not playing the Hawks... or even the Pacers over here.
I expect Durant to get it going, no doubt. But his struggles against Allen, imo can't be overlooked.

That said, Durant probably drops 40 next game.

NBA_Starter
04-23-2014, 07:25 PM
He is still no Corey Brewer but that is impressive.

Chronz
04-23-2014, 07:40 PM
He has no effect on KD.

but I thought you always credited the man defender? At least when its Kobe/Bron u do

John Walls Era
04-23-2014, 08:06 PM
Tony isn't a scrub... this is not surprising.

mzgrizz
04-23-2014, 08:53 PM
Tony is an allout defender who gets deflections , keeps playing through botched plays, never gives up when he's in the game, dogs his man....TA didn't earn the full 36% nor did KD NOT get his.....what's 36 points? But there is no doubt in my mind that KD is always aware that TA is in the game and locked in on him. Great job, Tony !! Heard OKC was lamenting they didn't try and get him on his last contract extension....I imagine so.

Blitzbolt
04-23-2014, 10:55 PM
Nothing is easy or will be easy for KD sure he might score 50 next game but the Grizz will make him earn it and by the 4th KD is gonna be out of gas.

And that's a big reason why Westbrook is shooting so much he is just open is that simple.

JordansBulls
04-23-2014, 11:11 PM
but I thought you always credited the man defender? At least when its Kobe/Bron u do

How so?

FlashBolt
04-24-2014, 01:32 AM
Durant is unguardable. You can make it hard on him but when he misses, it's more-so his own wrongdoing. Tony Allen would be a great defender against against SG/PG/some SF but Durant/James/Melo and a bit more are a bit too big for him. With that being said, Durant is averaging 35,10,6 for the playoffs thus far. Not Aldridge status but that's pretty damn good.

Gibby
04-24-2014, 02:03 AM
I like the Grizz game plan on making everyone else beat them. Its going to get tougher for Durant on the road. I still think OKC will win because I think Grizz will wear down because of this intensity. The Grizz will make that much harder which will benefit whoever OKC faces next.

slashsnake
04-24-2014, 03:36 AM
He reminds me a bit of Bruce Bowen, when he used to take on a much bigger Carmelo and other SF's in the game and do well against them. He isn't going to block his shot, but he will make sure Durant doesn't get good looks...

Not quite like when Lebron held Rose his MVP season to 6.3% from the floor when he was guarding him in that playoff series (to be fair Lebron mostly only covered Rose at the end of games, but Chicago just died at the close of games when Lebron did switch over), but Tony is a great defender. Nice to see him taking such a tough draw.

Lion
04-24-2014, 08:13 AM
Simply because Durant chokes in the playoffs.

mngopher35
04-24-2014, 11:01 AM
Simply because Durant chokes in the playoffs.

and so it begins...

P.S. No he doesn't.

sunsfan88
04-25-2014, 05:26 AM
and so it begins...

P.S. No he doesn't.

If LeBron got so much heat for his struggles in the post season, why doesn't Durant?

Durant's had far better rosters in OKC than LeBron ever had in Cleveland.

Lion
04-25-2014, 05:56 AM
and so it begins...

P.S. No he doesn't.Actually he does chokes again.. didn't you watch the game?

Hawkeye15
04-25-2014, 06:01 AM
Tony Allen?

No

The entire Grizz team is going at Durant everytime he puts the ball on the ground, and loading up on him off the ball. It's up to his teammates at this point to make some plays now and then. All superstars need some help if the other team loads up on them heavy.

DitchDat
04-25-2014, 06:53 AM
TA is a beast.. I still hate that he isn't in Boston anymore

Hardaway Here
04-25-2014, 07:12 AM
Durant is not playing well point blank period. Some people are just seeing how many pts he scored and think he is having a good game. 30 pts in the last one on horrible efficiency and not a single 3 was made. Grizz D has really made him work for everything. The Thunder make themselves so easy to defend when only Durant and Westbrook are scoring

Yanks All Day
04-25-2014, 08:44 AM
Not to take anything away from Memphis, because they are playing an amazing series, but this is more of a product of Oklahoma City only having 2 scorers who can consistently create their own shots. Perkins is usually an offensive liability, Ibaka can't create, Sefalosa and Jackson are inconsistent, and Fisher has a good game once a series. Otherwise, the Thunder's offense is Durant and Westbrook jacking up shots and the team banking on them each scoring 25+ on over 50% shooting. If one has a bad game, the other has to carry the entire load, especially against Memphis. Tony Allen has to be the toughest defender in basketball, and he's clearly frustrating Durant. Memphis doesn't mind KD scoring 30 points on 27 shots. If you take one of OKC's scorers away, I'm not sure this team is built to win a championship.

IndyRealist
04-25-2014, 08:53 AM
Not to take anything away from Memphis, because they are playing an amazing series, but this is more of a product of Oklahoma City only having 2 scorers who can consistently create their own shots. Perkins is usually an offensive liability, Ibaka can't create, Sefalosa and Jackson are inconsistent, and Fisher has a good game once a series. Otherwise, the Thunder's offense is Durant and Westbrook jacking up shots and the team banking on them each scoring 25+ on over 50% shooting. If one has a bad game, the other has to carry the entire load, especially against Memphis. Tony Allen has to be the toughest defender in basketball, and he's clearly frustrating Durant. Memphis doesn't mind KD scoring 30 points on 27 shots. If you take one of OKC's scorers away, I'm not sure this team is built to win a championship.
Actually, it's a product of the Thunder RELYING on two players to create their own shots, instead of using ball movement or a post presence to create shots. It's easy to stifle the offense when you know only two people are ever going to handle the ball or take the shots.

3RDASYSTEM
04-25-2014, 09:24 AM
Tony Allen is a great defender. Durant will go off eventually though.

Exactly, after yrs of watching past unstoppable players get self checked every now and then is just the nature of actually playing

its happen to me at the gym/park many a times back when I went at it like crazy hooping damn near daily

it was days I was on being switch guarded/helped and couldn't miss and at same time days I couldn't hit because of diff. defenders and I couldn't get a read on'em because I had 4 diff. players who had switched on me because I was knifing the lane and shooting the lights

KD will be fine when he figures out that he needs to either take ALLEN free throw level ala DIRK use to do BOWEN/others undersized, then feed off that by scoring at will or drawing double and making proper play but when you are as good as KD and think no man on earth can stop you then you take shots that are not of the norm, plus you face the same guy over and over so its basically if you are on or not because though ALLEN is a elite defender it wont and never will stop an elite unstoppable scoring machine on individual level, never have and never will over the long haul or short haul

3RDASYSTEM
04-25-2014, 09:30 AM
Tony Allen?

No

The entire Grizz team is going at Durant everytime he puts the ball on the ground, and loading up on him off the ball. It's up to his teammates at this point to make some plays now and then. All superstars need some help if the other team loads up on them heavy.

Now do you understand how IVERSON felt all those yrs in philly?

do you now understand that the IVERSON rules will destroy your fantasy 50-40-90 efficiency pct? of course all superstars need help it just didn't start in the KD era or BRON era, but I understand they are so efficient, wait what is KD pct in this series again because when I stopped watching the game that 10-26fg sure in the hell use to look a lot like IVERSON box score, but that's having mckie and snow as a sidekick

I cant believe im basically watching IVERSON all over again how this guy is being defended(even more so last yr series), a FOOTER version at that

Sly Guy
04-25-2014, 09:53 AM
Durant is not playing well point blank period. Some people are just seeing how many pts he scored and think he is having a good game. 30 pts in the last one on horrible efficiency and not a single 3 was made. Grizz D has really made him work for everything. The Thunder make themselves so easy to defend when only Durant and Westbrook are scoring

I agree with you here. I think the word is out on OKC, stop Durant, stop Westbook, and you stop the Thunder. Not that doing both of those things are an easy task, but you're right, the Thunder are not hugely dynamic at the offensive end.

Hawkeye15
04-25-2014, 10:03 AM
Now do you understand how IVERSON felt all those yrs in philly?

do you now understand that the IVERSON rules will destroy your fantasy 50-40-90 efficiency pct? of course all superstars need help it just didn't start in the KD era or BRON era, but I understand they are so efficient, wait what is KD pct in this series again because when I stopped watching the game that 10-26fg sure in the hell use to look a lot like IVERSON box score, but that's having mckie and snow as a sidekick

I cant believe im basically watching IVERSON all over again how this guy is being defended(even more so last yr series), a FOOTER version at that

and you still don't understand that without Philly's defense, those teams were first round knockouts every single time.

HouRealCoach
04-25-2014, 11:08 AM
Top 3 perimeter defender of all time

Chronz
04-25-2014, 01:57 PM
I get the whole team defense thing, Gasol is a great anchor and Conley can pressure the ball handlers but Tony Allen's D has been something to watch this series. Hes truly making a difference. I still cant believe how great CP3 played last year against such a stifling defense. They couldn't sick TA on CP3 tho, he was too busy locking up Crawford and CP3 was struggling with their SF more anyways.

sammyvine
04-25-2014, 05:36 PM
I get the whole team defense thing, Gasol is a great anchor and Conley can pressure the ball handlers but Tony Allen's D has been something to watch this series. Hes truly making a difference. I still cant believe how great CP3 played last year against such a stifling defense. They couldn't sick TA on CP3 tho, he was too busy locking up Crawford and CP3 was struggling with their SF more anyways.
shame he got bounced out in the 1st round like always

D-Leethal
04-25-2014, 06:13 PM
Now do you understand how IVERSON felt all those yrs in philly?

do you now understand that the IVERSON rules will destroy your fantasy 50-40-90 efficiency pct? of course all superstars need help it just didn't start in the KD era or BRON era, but I understand they are so efficient, wait what is KD pct in this series again because when I stopped watching the game that 10-26fg sure in the hell use to look a lot like IVERSON box score, but that's having mckie and snow as a sidekick

I cant believe im basically watching IVERSON all over again how this guy is being defended(even more so last yr series), a FOOTER version at that

Agreed. Can't have it both ways. Iverson can't be a culprit and Durant currently a victim.

Chronz
04-26-2014, 12:06 AM
shame he got bounced out in the 1st round like always

Well yea, considering winning and losing is about what you do on BOTH ends. Offensively, CP3 led his team brilliantly, all things considered. Too bad he cant anchor the paint against the behemoths.

magic0320
04-26-2014, 01:27 AM
TA is amazing defender. i remember 2010 finals against kobe he was beast on his d

More-Than-Most
04-27-2014, 12:03 AM
Sorry but the dude has been meh all series.

Ebbs
04-27-2014, 12:05 AM
Yup

More-Than-Most
04-27-2014, 12:05 AM
they could still win this but is this who people think is best in the world? Come on

goingfor28
04-27-2014, 12:07 AM
Yes he is. Chucking and choking.

Shammyguy3
04-27-2014, 01:08 AM
he had a bad game tonight, so what? Entering tonight's game he was posting a 111 oRtg on a 33.9usg%. He's not performing as we expected, but he absolutely isn't choking, not at all

bucketss
04-27-2014, 01:11 AM
he will get it together.

LAKobeBryant
04-27-2014, 01:19 AM
would his playoff performance affect him from getting MVP???

dhopisthename
04-27-2014, 01:21 AM
would his playoff performance affect him from getting MVP???

no mvp voting has already happened

JordansBulls
04-27-2014, 01:22 AM
would his playoff performance affect him from getting MVP???

He ain't playing in the East. Hell Memphis might be better than any East team.

stawka
04-27-2014, 01:32 AM
Inb4tredigs!!!

sep11ie
04-27-2014, 01:32 AM
You do know that Tony Allen guy is a pretty Ok defender, right Yosef?

More-Than-Most
04-27-2014, 01:33 AM
He ain't playing in the East. Hell Memphis might be better than any East team.

thunder are suppose to be worlds better than Memphis as well. Sure as hell doesnt look like it. Its all about matchups... Nets/pacers/bulls could knock out west teams if they played them. Its hard to gauge.

*Superman*
04-27-2014, 01:34 AM
KD gonna enjoy himself some Reggie Jackson D tonight.

More-Than-Most
04-27-2014, 01:35 AM
You do know that Tony Allen guy is a pretty Ok defender, right Yosef?

he is... But he was also getting stuffed by prince too

freejimmer
04-27-2014, 01:36 AM
Oh, please. Allen is the best wing defender in the NBA. Durant isn't playing the CHARLOTTE BOBCATS for crying outloud. Memphis is a damn good team and not some eastern conference CREAM PUFF.

Durant IS the best player in the world.

naps
04-27-2014, 01:38 AM
KD's historical choke job will go unnoticed because he has saviors on his team.

BALLER R
04-27-2014, 01:40 AM
I think OKC is too much of a Jump shooting team. And honestly If Miami was in the West they would have a difficult time making the Finals. The Grizzlies could make the Finals if they were in the East.

sunsfan88
04-27-2014, 01:42 AM
That 36% had to have dropped a ton after today.

beyourself
04-27-2014, 02:12 AM
Define choking. If it means his jumpers aren't falling at a normal rate and Tony Allen is giving him fits then yes he's choking.

How do you define choking?

More-Than-Most
04-27-2014, 02:33 AM
Define choking. If it means his jumpers aren't falling at a normal rate and Tony Allen is giving him fits then yes he's choking.

How do you define choking?

I define choking as one of the best players in the world getting carried by his teammates to help save him from a 1 and done against a team they are suppose to be much better than.

beyourself
04-27-2014, 02:36 AM
I define choking as one of the best players in the world getting carried by his teammates to help save him from a 1 and done against a team they are suppose to be much better than.

Do you realize that the reason they are supposed to be much better than the Grizzlies is because of Durant's usual play?

numba1CHANGsta
04-27-2014, 02:43 AM
Give credit to the Grizzles tho, this team has proved to be a hassle for top teams in the playoffs. But the Thunder just don't have any scorers other than Durant and Westbrook.

wizardsfan3
04-27-2014, 02:44 AM
Define choking. If it means his jumpers aren't falling at a normal rate and Tony Allen is giving him fits then yes he's choking.

How do you define choking?

I define choking as one of the best players in the world getting carried by his teammates to help save him from a 1 and done against a team they are suppose to be much better than.

Do you know no one wanted to play Memphis in the playoffs..?

wizardsfan3
04-27-2014, 02:44 AM
And wasn't KD averaging like 33 or so this series before today's game?

EL_MACHETE
04-27-2014, 02:56 AM
Y'all always gotta start some lame *** threads, Get off Okc's dick!

Memphis is a great team and plays with a lot of heart. I give them my respect.

Chronz
04-27-2014, 03:13 AM
Its not choking when the defense is really, really good.

IKnowHoops
04-27-2014, 03:19 AM
And wasn't KD averaging like 33 or so this series before today's game?

On like 33%. Thats why there loosing, he keeps shooting and the ball isn't going in. He needs to start making guys around him better. Thats the thing about Pure Scorer's, they rely so much on scoring that when there shot isn't falling, they just try and shoot themselves out of there slump to there teams detriment. Did you see Harden's 13/37. Yeah he's a better scorer than Bron. LOLOL Please.

IKnowHoops
04-27-2014, 03:22 AM
Its the way you gotta play KD. Conversely the way to play Bron is the exact opposite. You play off Bron and give him the shot. You hound KD cause he will still take contested jumpers, he won't really go to the hole that much.

IKnowHoops
04-27-2014, 03:23 AM
I'd love to see a Miami vs Memphis finals. Bron would eat them alive.

Sadds The Gr8
04-27-2014, 03:27 AM
Tony Allen is queefing on him

jerellh528
04-27-2014, 03:29 AM
Y'all always gotta start some lame *** threads, Get off Okc's dick!

Memphis is a great team and plays with a lot of heart. I give them my respect.

Mtm is just worried that kd took the torch from bron, so him and a handful of others like to point out any small thing wrong with kd. It's pure insecurity.
Kd isn't choking before tonight he's averaging 33 points and 9 and a half rbs per game. He's historically a good playoff performer and has no reason to choke. It's not like he's 2-18 or anything like that. Credit needs to be given to memphis, they are playing great team defense on him and have two of the leagues best defenders in Marc and tony Allen. That's what sucks about playing in the west, the competition level is so much higher than the east.

IKnowHoops
04-27-2014, 03:49 AM
Mtm is just worried that kd took the torch from bron, so him and a handful of others like to point out any small thing wrong with kd. It's pure insecurity.
Kd isn't choking before tonight he's averaging 33 points and 9 and a half rbs per game. He's historically a good playoff performer and has no reason to choke. It's not like he's 2-18 or anything like that. Credit needs to be given to memphis, they are playing great team defense on him and have two of the leagues best defenders in Marc and tony Allen. That's what sucks about playing in the west, the competition level is so much higher than the east.

But he's shooting at a very bad FG%. He's basically shooting his team out of the game. If there backup pg didn't go off today they would of lost. Forget Bron, KD is on my all-time starting 5, but he's not playing well. He is not playing like the Durant that won MVP. You can't win games shooting that bad all the way up to 33 points a game. I expect him to do better though, if I didn't he would not be in my all time starting 5.

Is loosing in the first round while playing like garbage for the supposed best player in the league little now? If they loose and his play continues it might go down in history as worse than Lebron's Dallas performance. I say might, Im not sure which one will be worse. Brons was bad cause it was the finals, and it looked like he was either scared or quit. KD's will be bad cause he couldn't even get out of the first round, and though he doesn't look scared, or like he's quitting, he's going as hard as he possibly can and is just flat out unable.

JC_
04-27-2014, 03:56 AM
He's not choking. Like everyone is saying, Allen is just a better defender than Durant is a scorer.

JC_
04-27-2014, 03:58 AM
Give credit to the Grizzles tho, this team has proved to be a hassle for top teams in the playoffs. But the Thunder just don't have any scorers other than Durant and Westbrook.

I'm guessing you didn't watch the game.

stawka
04-27-2014, 04:06 AM
Durant is a great player, and a great scorer. Scorers go through funks, but that's the difference between KD and LeBron. He keeps shooting even while shooting like ****. Clearly TA is destroying him on that end, but KD will just keep settling for **** shots

Good for Memphis, but I wouldn't completely call it choking... Yet!

YoungOne
04-27-2014, 04:23 AM
he wants to feel like russell westbrook

ILLUSIONIST^248
04-27-2014, 05:44 AM
would his playoff performance affect him from getting MVP???

He ain't playing in the East. Hell Memphis might be better than any East team.

Bingo, the west is a dog fight all play offs, while the heat are playing hop scotch.

Lion
04-27-2014, 07:04 AM
Told you guys, Durant chokes.. It's just TA, what if he had to against George, Butler and Lenard on a series.

Goose17
04-27-2014, 07:24 AM
Avon Barksdale doesn't choke.

archdevil84
04-27-2014, 07:31 AM
Oh, please. Allen is the best wing defender in the NBA. Durant isn't playing the CHARLOTTE BOBCATS for crying outloud. Memphis is a damn good team and not some eastern conference CREAM PUFF.

Durant IS the best player in the world.

Bobcats are a pretty good defensive team. Also MKG is one of their best defenders. So its not like lebron doesnt have to do anything compared to durant

archdevil84
04-27-2014, 07:41 AM
also: KD isnt choking but westbrook is. KD just doesnt realy has his shooting touch now, once he gets that back i believe he wil get back to scoring 30+ a night on around 50-45%. Westbrook however, is throwing up brick after brick and wants to be the hero for OKC SO bad it but the only thing he does is CHOKE

mdm692
04-27-2014, 07:58 AM
Bobcats are a pretty good defensive team. Also MKG is one of their best defenders. So its not like lebron doesnt have to do anything compared to durant
MKG is nowhere near Tony Allen just stop. And even though the6 are pretty darn good defensively the bobcats could be a lot better on offense. Also Al is on one ****ing leg.

koreancabbage
04-27-2014, 09:34 AM
Told you guys, Durant chokes.. It's just TA, what if he had to against George, Butler and Lenard on a series.

TA> than any of those guys realistically. He's a way more physical player than any of the players above.

Sly Guy
04-27-2014, 09:51 AM
He ain't playing in the East. Hell Memphis might be better than any East team.

I wouldn't go that far, but memphis sure would give miami a scare.

ManRam
04-27-2014, 09:57 AM
Hats off to Memphis' defense, but KD has been pretty bad this series.

Cano4prez
04-27-2014, 10:12 AM
reggie jackson saved his season

Crackadalic
04-27-2014, 10:18 AM
Memphis is better then 4-8 and is only the 7 seed with Marc missing time and coaching changes

Memphis is a damn good team and they make it tough on everybody. This is the same core players that knock out the spurs in the first round few years back

Okc still wins in 7 and only because they have home court

ManRam
04-27-2014, 10:19 AM
MKG is nowhere near Tony Allen just stop. And even though the6 are pretty darn good defensively the bobcats could be a lot better on offense. Also Al is on one ****ing leg.

He's not, you're right. And they don't have the second level defender like Memphis has with Gasol either. But MKG is a very strong individual defender. Not quite as good as TA, and he doesn't have the backstop either.


But, even as good as TA is, I'm stunned with how well he's doing considering the height disadvantage. Courtney for that matter too. TA is 6-4 with a 6-9 wingspan. Lee's always been listed at 6-5 but that's not true. Dude is shorter than Kobe and looked no taller than Rafer Alston back in the day. KD is a legit 6-9, probably over 6-10 in shoes with a 7-5 wingspan. He should just rise over these two like he does almost everyone. He just hasn't been able to sink the shots. It's quite remarkable.

naps
04-27-2014, 10:50 AM
Mtm is just worried that kd took the torch from bron, so him and a handful of others like to point out any small thing wrong with kd

LOL nobody took the torch from LeBron. Kobephiles are hilarious. Why are only kobephiles so quick to declare someone else as the best? Insecurity much? Well, Kobe doesn't sniff the air of the same planet as LeBron or Durant does. He belongs in the Iverson, TMac planet with luck. So just stop.

blahblahyoutoo
04-27-2014, 10:55 AM
so the best scorer in the world is having a fit with a good defender on him?
i'm sure that's a factor, but I'd say he's going through a mini-slump that he'll pull out of. or I could be wrong and they could be knocked out early, again.

beyourself
04-27-2014, 10:56 AM
He's not, you're right. And they don't have the second level defender like Memphis has with Gasol either. But MKG is a very strong individual defender. Not quite as good as TA, and he doesn't have the backstop either.


But, even as good as TA is, I'm stunned with how well he's doing considering the height disadvantage. Courtney for that matter too. TA is 6-4 with a 6-9 wingspan. Lee's always been listed at 6-5 but that's not true. Dude is shorter than Kobe and looked no taller than Rafer Alston back in the day. KD is a legit 6-9, probably over 6-10 in shoes with a 7-5 wingspan. He should just rise over these two like he does almost everyone. He just hasn't been able to sink the shots. It's quite remarkable.

Gasp..... you mean it's shocking that a player's jumper has been off? Like that has never happened before in the NBA.

2-ONE-5
04-27-2014, 10:56 AM
how about giving Tony Allen some credit?

2-ONE-5
04-27-2014, 10:57 AM
thunder are suppose to be worlds better than Memphis as well. Sure as hell doesnt look like it. Its all about matchups... Nets/pacers/bulls could knock out west teams if they played them. Its hard to gauge.

no this is ridiculous to think to say the least.

ManRam
04-27-2014, 11:02 AM
Gasp..... you mean it's shocking that a player's jumper has been off? Like that has never happened before in the NBA.

Exactly. I think we've always been far to eager to label people "chokers". Everyone's gonna have some bad games. Everyone. Sometimes it happens at inopportune times. If it's a star, especially a polarizing one, people are going to go crazy about it. KD hasn't dealt with that craziness yet, but it's coming.

Hawkize31
04-27-2014, 11:03 AM
So, to summarize this thread:

When Durant plays poorly in a playoff series - nah, he fine, the defense is really tough, the conference is tough., etc...

When Lebron struggles in a playoff series - LeChoke, not 1 not 2 not 3, he's invisible, etc...

Got it.

beyourself
04-27-2014, 11:08 AM
So, to summarize this thread:

When Durant plays poorly in a playoff series - nah, he fine, the defense is really tough, the conference is tough., etc...

When Lebron struggles in a playoff series - LeChoke, not 1 not 2 not 3, he's invisible, etc...

Got it.

1. People don't like LeBron so they're eager to take shots (thats weak)
2. People like KD
3. People perceived LeBron's failures as mental breakdowns rather than just flat out poor play like KD is showing right now.

Goose17
04-27-2014, 11:29 AM
So, to summarize this thread:

When Durant plays poorly in a playoff series - nah, he fine, the defense is really tough, the conference is tough., etc...

When Lebron struggles in a playoff series - LeChoke, not 1 not 2 not 3, he's invisible, etc...

Got it.

This^

I find it hilarious, everyone knows damn well if Lebron put these numbers up against ANYONE you would all be talking crap about him and how he is choking. Just another example of KD getting a pass where Lebron wouldn't and yet people want to compare him to LBJ? Get outta here.

AddiX
04-27-2014, 11:59 AM
The west is soft and these teams arent playoff built.

Portland and Memphis are the only two teams built for slower grittier half court play. The rest of the west just runs up and down and chucks, it's why there all having so much trouble to establish any consistency and why why Portland and Memphis are the two most consistent teams in the west right now.

You can barely tell the difference between teams like Dallas, hou, San an, OKC, Warriors, Minny, etc etc, whoever hits the 3 ball better, wins.

kozelkid
04-27-2014, 11:59 AM
MTM and his agendas. :laugh2:

SlimKid
04-27-2014, 12:16 PM
So, to summarize this thread:

When Durant plays poorly in a playoff series - nah, he fine, the defense is really tough, the conference is tough., etc...

When Lebron struggles in a playoff series - LeChoke, not 1 not 2 not 3, he's invisible, etc...

Got it.

Nail on the head

Chronz
04-27-2014, 12:28 PM
I'd love to see a Miami vs Memphis finals. Bron would eat them alive.

Dont they have a losing record vs Memphis over the Big 3 era

jerellh528
04-27-2014, 12:36 PM
So, to summarize this thread:

When Durant plays poorly in a playoff series - nah, he fine, the defense is really tough, the conference is tough., etc...

When Lebron struggles in a playoff series - LeChoke, not 1 not 2 not 3, he's invisible, etc...

Got it.

Nah the difference is kd is going down swinging. Bron's chokes were him going 2-18, 3-14, quitting, and not taking a single shot in 4qtrs. Kd is actually playing like he normally does, difference is his shots aren't falling at the same rate at normal.

beyourself
04-27-2014, 12:46 PM
Nah the difference is kd is going down swinging. Bron's chokes were him going 2-18, 3-14, quitting, and not taking a single shot in 4qtrs. Kd is actually playing like he normally does, difference is his shots aren't falling at the same rate at normal.

I actually think these people enjoy watching or hoping that their least favorite players fail more than actually enjoying the games. It's kind of pathetic, instead of enjoying the games that's what they're doing.

And I agree with you about the shots not falling. It's not choking, he's not a mentally weak player.

KobeOwnSU
04-27-2014, 12:55 PM
Durant isn't choking, he is slumping. Choking is when you are playing at your normal rate and a big moment occurs and you become something worse then normal. Slumping is when you have been making the same shots your entire career and then all of a sudden it stops going in. Th later explains Durant in this series. I would still take Durant over LeBron right now to start a team.

RCarlson85
04-27-2014, 01:25 PM
He ain't playing in the East. Hell Memphis might be better than any East team.

Haha, good one. They're certainly better than the Bulls, that's for sure.

Minimal
04-27-2014, 01:45 PM
I don't know if its choking, but he is playing terrible. Reggie Jackson saved his season last game.

ILLUSIONIST^248
04-27-2014, 01:55 PM
I don't know if its choking, but he is playing terrible. Reggie Jackson saved his season last game.

Do you remember when big daddy Ray saved lebrons legacy in game six?

LakersIn5
04-27-2014, 02:00 PM
Its not choking when the defense is really, really good.

then based on that kobe didnt choke in 04 against detroit and lebron didnt choke against the sputs in 07 and mavs in 2011.

Fnom11
04-27-2014, 02:10 PM
This^

I find it hilarious, everyone knows damn well if Lebron put these numbers up against ANYONE you would all be talking crap about him and how he is choking. Just another example of KD getting a pass where Lebron wouldn't and yet people want to compare him to LBJ? Get outta here.

It essentially just proves that Lebron is easily the superior player.

Minimal
04-27-2014, 02:18 PM
Do you remember when big daddy Ray saved lebrons legacy in game six?
Big daddy Ray wouldn't be in the finals if not for LeBron, and his 3 wouldn't mean much if LeBron didn't hit the 3 before that, heck Bron almost single handedly brought them to that position in the 4th quarter. Heat were down 10 at the start of 4th quarter. He scored 16 points in 4th, finished with 32 points, 11 assists and 10 rebounds in the game.

Crackadalic
04-27-2014, 02:20 PM
This is why people say melo has a more diverse offensive game even though Durant is the most efficient and worlds better

When your jumper isn't falling you do other things. He should be posting up every chance he gets and doesn't

mzgrizz
04-27-2014, 02:22 PM
Dont they have a losing record vs Memphis over the Big 3 era

The Memphis Grizzlies are 13-12 against the Heat since they moved to Memphis, but have the best record against the Heat than any other West Conference team since LeBron joined Miami. Can't find the last 7 years stats but we certainly match up in regular season. Prob not so much in a Finals series though.
Found it. Grizz are 8-5 with Heat since 2007.

ILLUSIONIST^248
04-27-2014, 02:25 PM
Do you remember when big daddy Ray saved lebrons legacy in game six?
Big daddy Ray wouldn't be in the finals if not for LeBron, and his 3 wouldn't mean much if LeBron didn't hit the 3 before that, heck Bron almost single handedly brought them to that position in the 4th quarter. Heat were down 10 at the start of 4th quarter. He scored 16 points in 4th, finished with 32 points, 11 assists and 10 rebounds in the game.

The greatest shot in nba history doesn't mean much? Lol!

Lebron missed the biggest shot of his career, then papa ray had to show him what a clutch shot actually was.

b@llhog24
04-27-2014, 02:27 PM
he had a bad game tonight, so what? Entering tonight's game he was posting a 111 oRtg on a 33.9usg%. He's not performing as we expected, but he absolutely isn't choking, not at all

Currently his normally God-like ts is below .50, ws/48 is below .140. 31.7 usg rate with an ortg of 103 which isn't bad but he's not playing up to his normal standards.

That said, it's only been 4 games and playoffs are a bit of a crap shoot. If they get passed Memphis he'll probably torch whoever is guarding him in the next series and then "Kevin Durant just did this arbitrary feat that has been accomplish in 'x' amount of time."

bucketss
04-27-2014, 02:30 PM
Do you remember when big daddy Ray saved lebrons legacy in game six?

remember when big daddy fisher,artest, and the refs saved kobe in the 2010 finals when he shot 6-24?

ManRam
04-27-2014, 02:30 PM
Do you remember when big daddy Ray saved lebrons legacy in game six?

Like, Robert Horry and Derek Fisher never hit huge shots to eak out a big win for LAL. :laugh:



I do have a question though: when do Kobe fans start turning on KD? I mean, LeBron's so hated by y'all because he's a threat. KD has to be perceived as one too, no? I mean, he's already eliciting comments like "greatest scorer since MJ" from a lot of people.

bucketss
04-27-2014, 02:32 PM
The greatest shot in nba history doesn't mean much? Lol!

Lebron missed the biggest shot of his career, then papa ray had to show him what a clutch shot actually was.

biggest shot of his career was that dagger he hit in game 7 u mad? :)

Hawkeye15
04-27-2014, 02:35 PM
Nah the difference is kd is going down swinging. Bron's chokes were him going 2-18, 3-14, quitting, and not taking a single shot in 4qtrs. Kd is actually playing like he normally does, difference is his shots aren't falling at the same rate at normal.

you are isolating 2 games out of well over 100, and ignoring the sheer dominance from LeBron throughout his playoff runs.

Btw, during that series he "quit", can you please post his series numbers?

Hawkeye15
04-27-2014, 02:37 PM
fair or not, Durant will never get the same criticism of LeBron for not winning. Oh well..

JordansBulls
04-27-2014, 02:40 PM
Mtm is just worried that kd took the torch from bron, so him and a handful of others like to point out any small thing wrong with kd. It's pure insecurity.
Kd isn't choking before tonight he's averaging 33 points and 9 and a half rbs per game. He's historically a good playoff performer and has no reason to choke. It's not like he's 2-18 or anything like that. Credit needs to be given to memphis, they are playing great team defense on him and have two of the leagues best defenders in Marc and tony Allen. That's what sucks about playing in the west, the competition level is so much higher than the east.

Good post. Durant led the league in PER, WS, WS/PER 48 minutes and Scoring.

bucketss
04-27-2014, 02:41 PM
fair or not, Durant will never get the same criticism of LeBron for not winning. Oh well..

once people start to realize that he is probably better than kobe ever was, the criticism will start, at least by laker fans.

Hardaway Here
04-27-2014, 02:42 PM
Nah the difference is kd is going down swinging. Bron's chokes were him going 2-18, 3-14, quitting, and not taking a single shot in 4qtrs. Kd is actually playing like he normally does, difference is his shots aren't falling at the same rate at normal.

Playing like he normally does? Did you watch that game last night he was deferring to Reggie Jackson multiple times. I don't even care for LeBron but the hypocrisy is just ridiculous. KD is going to get crowned as the new MVP and people still don't want to criticize when he doesn't come out like he is supposed to.

bucketss
04-27-2014, 02:47 PM
Mtm is just worried that kd took the torch from bron, so him and a handful of others like to point out any small thing wrong with kd. It's pure insecurity.
Kd isn't choking before tonight he's averaging 33 points and 9 and a half rbs per game. He's historically a good playoff performer and has no reason to choke. It's not like he's 2-18 or anything like that. Credit needs to be given to memphis, they are playing great team defense on him and have two of the leagues best defenders in Marc and tony Allen. That's what sucks about playing in the west, the competition level is so much higher than the east.

i actually accepted kd is probably the best player in the world, but you calling out peoples insecurities is hilarious LOL because lets be honest only reason you're defending him is because you went to some how put down lebron. and you're right, at least hes not 2-18, or 6-24 in the most important game of his life, its just the first round after all, and the series is tied.

Crackadalic
04-27-2014, 03:02 PM
fair or not, Durant will never get the same criticism of LeBron for not winning. Oh well..

Durant is humble and quiet

Lebron is humble to a certain extent but shows a lot of cockiness and arrogance and rightfully so which rubs people the wrong way

ManRam
04-27-2014, 03:06 PM
Durant is humble and quiet

Lebron is humble to a certain extent but shows a lot of cockiness and arrogance and rightfully so which rubs people the wrong way

And why exactly should that matter when we're criticizing/discussing basketball-related manners?

I mean, I get that people can't separate emotions from things, but why should we pretend like emotionally-charged criticism, to the point of double standards, is something we should be OK with?

Hardaway Here
04-27-2014, 03:09 PM
Durant is humble and quiet

Lebron is humble to a certain extent but shows a lot of cockiness and arrogance and rightfully so which rubs people the wrong way

Magic, Bird, Jordan, Kobe, Iverson, these guys showed plenty of arrogance and cockiness. None of them have ever been hated like LBJ. I don't see Melo acting arrogant or cocky and he still gets plenty of criticism so thats just a bailout argument for Durant

b@llhog24
04-27-2014, 04:06 PM
Magic, Bird, Jordan, Kobe, Iverson, these guys showed plenty of arrogance and cockiness. None of them have ever been hated like LBJ. I don't see Melo acting arrogant or cocky and he still gets plenty of criticism so thats just a bailout argument for Durant

Melo IS cocky.

ILLUSIONIST^248
04-27-2014, 04:32 PM
Do you remember when big daddy Ray saved lebrons legacy in game six?

remember when big daddy fisher,artest, and the refs saved kobe in the 2010 finals when he shot 6-24? is that the game where he scored 10 points in the 4th, had 15 rebounds, and has lock down defense?

ILLUSIONIST^248
04-27-2014, 04:34 PM
Do you remember when big daddy Ray saved lebrons legacy in game six?

Like, Robert Horry and Derek Fisher never hit huge shots to eak out a big win for LAL. :laugh:



I do have a question though: when do Kobe fans start turning on KD? I mean, LeBron's so hated by y'all because he's a threat. KD has to be perceived as one too, no? I mean, he's already eliciting comments like "greatest scorer since MJ" from a lot of people.

Durants the man. I wouldn't doubt it if he tops Kobe. He's a real competitor, he stayed with his team and will go all out for them to win a ring. He didn't run to another mans team like some other phony players.

bucketss
04-27-2014, 04:40 PM
is that the game where he scored 10 points in the 4th, had 15 rebounds, and has lock down defense?

ref assisted defence, ref assisted points, he only grabbed boards cause he sucked at everything else.

ManRam
04-27-2014, 04:41 PM
Durants the man. I wouldn't doubt it if he tops Kobe. He's a real competitor, he stayed with his team and will go all out for them to win a ring. He didn't run to another mans team like some other phony players.

What do you mean "he stayed with his team"? LeBron was still on the Cavs at this point in his career.


Can you just come clean and admit you're not a Kobe fan, rather, just the world's greatest troll already?!

bucketss
04-27-2014, 04:42 PM
Durants the man. I wouldn't doubt it if he tops Kobe. He's a real competitor, he stayed with his team and will go all out for them to win a ring. He didn't run to another mans team like some other phony players.

you don't need to doubt it, he already proved hes a better individual player than kobe ever was, but he has to get the accolades - he already tied him on mvp's - he just needs a shaq he can ride to championships with.

ILLUSIONIST^248
04-27-2014, 04:44 PM
is that the game where he scored 10 points in the 4th, had 15 rebounds, and has lock down defense?

ref assisted defence, ref assisted points, he only grabbed boards cause he sucked at everything else.

Lol, so the refs cheated hub? Haha. Buckets and his conspiracy theories.

ILLUSIONIST^248
04-27-2014, 04:47 PM
Durants the man. I wouldn't doubt it if he tops Kobe. He's a real competitor, he stayed with his team and will go all out for them to win a ring. He didn't run to another mans team like some other phony players.

you don't need to doubt it, he already proved hes a better individual player than kobe ever was, but he has to get the accolades - he already tied him on mvp's - he just needs a shaq he can ride to championships with. Or he can join Chris Paul and Blake like Lebron did. Some people want to win ships the real way.

mngopher35
04-27-2014, 04:54 PM
is that the game where he scored 10 points in the 4th, had 15 rebounds, and has lock down defense?

Yup.

Just like the game you mentioned for Lebron is the same one where he had a triple double and 16 points 2 assists (both 3 pointers) in the 4th quarter. Then he scored and assisted on all 6 points the heat scored in ot before the final ray allen ft's. So while Lebron had a great game to keep his team in it and needed one shot from Ray Allen, Kobe needed his entire team to pick up the slack with a poor overall offensive performance.

Also here is what each player did in the 4th quarter of those series (along with a couple teammates):

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/plus/shot_finder.cgi?request=1&player_id=&match=single&year_id=2010&is_playoffs=Y&team_id=LAL&opp_id=BOS&game_num_min=0&game_num_max=99&game_month=&game_location=&game_result=&shot_pts=&is_make=&shot_type=&shot_distance_min=&shot_distance_max=&q4=Y&q5=Y&time_remain_minutes=12&time_remain_seconds=0&time_remain_comp=le&margin_min=&margin_max=&c1stat=fga&c1comp=ge&c1val=5&c2stat=&c2comp=ge&c2val=&c3stat=&c3comp=ge&c3val=&order_by=fg

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/plus/shot_finder.cgi?request=1&player_id=&match=single&year_id=2013&is_playoffs=Y&team_id=MIA&opp_id=SAS&game_num_min=0&game_num_max=99&game_month=&game_location=&game_result=&shot_pts=&is_make=&shot_type=&shot_distance_min=&shot_distance_max=&q4=Y&q5=Y&time_remain_minutes=12&time_remain_seconds=0&time_remain_comp=le&margin_min=&margin_max=&c1stat=fga&c1comp=ge&c1val=5&c2stat=&c2comp=ge&c2val=&c3stat=&c3comp=ge&c3val=&order_by=fg

bucketss
04-27-2014, 04:55 PM
Or he can join Chris Paul and Blake like Lebron did. Some people want to win ships the real way.

if only he was lucky enough to get a prime shaq as soon as his career started, - he'd have three or four rings by now i guess not every player is as lucky, or as big of douchebag to threaten teams on draft day.

Chronz
04-27-2014, 05:02 PM
then based on that kobe didnt choke in 04 against detroit and lebron didnt choke against the sputs in 07 and mavs in 2011.
Depends on what you hold against them.

Chronz
04-27-2014, 05:07 PM
Good post. Durant led the league in PER, WS, WS/PER 48 minutes and Scoring.Good point

Durant led the league in PER, WS, WS/PER 48 minutes and Scoring.

Whats WS/PER 48 again?

bucketss
04-27-2014, 05:15 PM
Good point

Durant led the league in PER, WS, WS/PER 48 minutes and Scoring.

Whats WS/PER 48 again?

Lol

More-Than-Most
04-27-2014, 05:17 PM
Yup.

Just like the game you mentioned for Lebron is the same one where he had a triple double and 16 points 2 assists (both 3 pointers) in the 4th quarter. Then he scored and assisted on all 6 points the heat scored in ot before the final ray allen ft's. So while Lebron had a great game to keep his team in it and needed one shot from Ray Allen, Kobe needed his entire team to pick up the slack with a poor overall offensive performance.

Also here is what each player did in the 4th quarter of those series (along with a couple teammates):

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/plus/shot_finder.cgi?request=1&player_id=&match=single&year_id=2010&is_playoffs=Y&team_id=LAL&opp_id=BOS&game_num_min=0&game_num_max=99&game_month=&game_location=&game_result=&shot_pts=&is_make=&shot_type=&shot_distance_min=&shot_distance_max=&q4=Y&q5=Y&time_remain_minutes=12&time_remain_seconds=0&time_remain_comp=le&margin_min=&margin_max=&c1stat=fga&c1comp=ge&c1val=5&c2stat=&c2comp=ge&c2val=&c3stat=&c3comp=ge&c3val=&order_by=fg

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/plus/shot_finder.cgi?request=1&player_id=&match=single&year_id=2013&is_playoffs=Y&team_id=MIA&opp_id=SAS&game_num_min=0&game_num_max=99&game_month=&game_location=&game_result=&shot_pts=&is_make=&shot_type=&shot_distance_min=&shot_distance_max=&q4=Y&q5=Y&time_remain_minutes=12&time_remain_seconds=0&time_remain_comp=le&margin_min=&margin_max=&c1stat=fga&c1comp=ge&c1val=5&c2stat=&c2comp=ge&c2val=&c3stat=&c3comp=ge&c3val=&order_by=fg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0JxP8B8DL1g

beyourself
04-27-2014, 05:29 PM
And why exactly should that matter when we're criticizing/discussing basketball-related manners?

I mean, I get that people can't separate emotions from things, but why should we pretend like emotionally-charged criticism, to the point of double standards, is something we should be OK with?

Like I said before. In high school and college nice guys finish last. In the real world (professional environment) guys who act like douches will get screwed in the end.

beyourself
04-27-2014, 05:34 PM
you don't need to doubt it, he already proved hes a better individual player than kobe ever was, but he has to get the accolades - he already tied him on mvp's - he just needs a shaq he can ride to championships with.

They're are both great players. Maybe this guy loves Durant and Kobe. You can enjoy watching more than 1 basketball player. It's not an impossible concept.

Hawkeye15
04-27-2014, 05:36 PM
Durant is humble and quiet

Lebron is humble to a certain extent but shows a lot of cockiness and arrogance and rightfully so which rubs people the wrong way

why should that matter when criticizing the games best players, who have chip help?

The real reason, is that LeBron was followed around like a puppy by age 15, and the media has been shoving him down our throats for 12 years. Durant is looked at as an innocent superstar who is just stumbling into his greatness or something.

Durant's play need to be criticized in this series, period. If he gets knocked out, and LeBron goes on another great playoff run, the 7th time in his career, are people really still clamoring that Durant was better this year?

The media shoving LeBron down our throats is why people hated him.

ManRam
04-27-2014, 05:42 PM
Like I said before. In high school and college nice guys finish last. In the real world (professional environment) guys who act like douches will get screwed in the end.

Like MJ? Like Kobe? Like LeBron? Like Shaq? Like most every other star ever?

Sorry, can't agree with this.

beyourself
04-27-2014, 05:48 PM
Like MJ? Like Kobe? Like LeBron? Like Shaq? Like most every other star ever?

Sorry, can't agree with this.

I disagree. Michael Jordan has this perception of being a real jerk. He wasn't, he was excessively competetive, but everybody loved to be around the guy. You should read Phil Jackson's book where he details this. Everybody loved Shaq.

Kobe had horrible social skills according to Jackson, but he wasn't a douchey guy.

Hawkeye15
04-27-2014, 05:50 PM
I disagree. Michael Jordan has this perception of being a real jerk. He wasn't, he was excessively competetive, but everybody loved to be around the guy. You should read Phil Jackson's book where he details this. Everybody loved Shaq.

Kobe had horrible social skills according to Jackson, but he wasn't a douchey guy.

and you have read so many reports about LeBron's teammates/coaches hating him? They love him dude.

Hawkeye15
04-27-2014, 05:51 PM
Jordan was a flat out jerk to his teammates btw, and Kobe has always been an isolationist that has had a hard time interacting with teammates. You said you read Phil's book, it was in there.

ManRam
04-27-2014, 05:59 PM
I disagree. Michael Jordan has this perception of being a real jerk. He wasn't, he was excessively competetive, but everybody loved to be around the guy. You should read Phil Jackson's book where he details this. Everybody loved Shaq.

Kobe had horrible social skills according to Jackson, but he wasn't a douchey guy.

OK. This is clearly a pointless discussion :laugh:

MJ has a long rap sheet of things that would make LeBron look like a saint. Kobe too. Do some googling!


Perhaps I'm not being rational here, but I'm sure as **** convinced you aren't either.

IKnowHoops
04-27-2014, 06:32 PM
I disagree. Michael Jordan has this perception of being a real jerk. He wasn't, he was excessively competetive, but everybody loved to be around the guy. You should read Phil Jackson's book where he details this. Everybody loved Shaq.

Kobe had horrible social skills according to Jackson, but he wasn't a douchey guy.

Everyone love Lebron, his teammates, coaches, they all love him, you hate him but you don't count bro.

TylerSL
04-27-2014, 07:39 PM
Funny how all the Lebron haters stop posting when they have been proven wrong.......

RulerSlick
04-27-2014, 08:01 PM
Magic, Bird, Jordan, Kobe, Iverson, these guys showed plenty of arrogance and cockiness. None of them have ever been hated like LBJ.

Is this post serious? Kobe is one of the most hated athletes in American sports lol

RulerSlick
04-27-2014, 08:04 PM
Durant is getting the clamps put on him lol

tredigs
04-27-2014, 08:14 PM
Man, if he's choking on 29/10/5 + 1.3stl/2.3 blk while leading the post-season in Defensive Win Shares, is Westbrook pronounced dead at this point? His efficiency is taking a hit - especially last game - and he needs to step it up, but it's just a very tough matchup for him/them as we've talked about. The efficiency #'s aren't going to be pretty when you're going up against an elite team D with a proven track record of relative success against OKC.

I think he's taken 2 or 3 too many threes each game, but it's tough with how much they're clogging the paint on his drives. I'm hoping the supporting cast can continue to step up for them like they did last game, much more entertaining team for me to watch than Memphis.

Hawkeye15
04-27-2014, 08:19 PM
Is this post serious? Kobe is one of the most hated athletes in American sports lol

Kobe's level of hate is pathetic to what LeBron has gone through. A-Rod, Tiger type stuff.

KobeOwnSU
04-27-2014, 08:27 PM
Kobe iz ze gr8st no questions asked...cah, cah, cah, cah

KobeOwnSU
04-27-2014, 08:30 PM
Kobe's level of hate is pathetic to what LeBron has gone through. A-Rod, Tiger type stuff.

idk. The hate was pretty strong after he raped, er, had consensual penis insertion with that skank in Colorado.

Hawkeye15
04-27-2014, 08:43 PM
idk. The hate was pretty strong after he raped, er, had consensual penis insertion with that skank in Colorado.

absolutely nothing compared to LeBron hate from the decision until he won a chip. Not even in the same stratosphere.

Look, LeBron was pushed on us starting in 2001, as a kid. By the time he hit the league, espn was shoving him so hard down our throats, people got sick of it, rightly so. He didn't take long to totally dominate the league, and it became about him winning, and unfortunately for him, he was on a team that was not going to provide him the help to do that. During which time, Kobe was enjoying his post Shaq success, and there was an underlying belief that LeBron was already better. So it drove fans nuts, having to read all day long about LeBron, having to listen to every game and hear his name, blah, blah, blah.

I get why LeBron got some hate. I never expected it to get to A-Rod level, because A-Rod is a douchebag. LeBron is not. I figured it would top out. It's literally the reason I started wanting him to win chips and kill it. Still is. It would be such a shame if people didn't realize we are watching a top 3-4 player ever in his prime right now.

Hardaway Here
04-27-2014, 08:53 PM
Is this post serious? Kobe is one of the most hated athletes in American sports lol
Looks like you lack reading comprehension I said none of them have ever been hated like LBJ has

KobeOwnSU
04-27-2014, 08:53 PM
absolutely nothing compared to LeBron hate from the decision until he won a chip. Not even in the same stratosphere.

Look, LeBron was pushed on us starting in 2001, as a kid. By the time he hit the league, espn was shoving him so hard down our throats, people got sick of it, rightly so. He didn't take long to totally dominate the league, and it became about him winning, and unfortunately for him, he was on a team that was not going to provide him the help to do that. During which time, Kobe was enjoying his post Shaq success, and there was an underlying belief that LeBron was already better. So it drove fans nuts, having to read all day long about LeBron, having to listen to every game and hear his name, blah, blah, blah.

I get why LeBron got some hate. I never expected it to get to A-Rod level, because A-Rod is a douchebag. LeBron is not. I figured it would top out. It's literally the reason I started wanting him to win chips and kill it. Still is. It would be such a shame if people didn't realize we are watching a top 3-4 player ever in his prime right now.

I realize how great he is. That doesn't mean I cant hate the guy. And I don't hate him because he is better then Kobe. His face annoys me.

RulerSlick
04-27-2014, 09:16 PM
Looks like you lack reading comprehension I said none of them have ever been hated like LBJ has

I comprehended everything you posted. Lebron only had real hate for like 1 1/2 to 2 NBA seasons which was the time between leaving the Cavs and his first NBA title. Lebron hasn't been on the most hated athletes list since his 2nd year in MIami. Kobe was on there THIS PAST SEASON. lebron has haters but he's generaly not hated like Kobe or Arod is.


Kobe Bryant, World Peace among top 10 disliked athletes


"Los Angeles Lakers Kobe Bryant and Metta World Peace made the list of the top 10 most-disliked athletes in the world, according to the N-score measure taken yearly by Nielsen and E-Poll, via Forbes.com. The poll is limited to active athletes.

MWP came in with just 21 percent of the public's support, landing sixth on the list. Bryant came in with 27 percent, at No. 10. They are the only two NBA players on the list, which is headlined by Manti Te'o and Lance Armstrong, along with such athletes as Tiger Woods, Michael Vick, Kurt Busch, and Bears quarterback Jay Cutler.

Notably absent from the list?

LeBron James.

James spent the past two years on the list after "The Decision," but after his public image makeover, which featured a new publicist, an NBA title run, and an Olympic gold medal, it would appear the public has forgiven him for his numerous PR gaffes. Winning helps, as well.

You wonder if MWP's status on the list is influenced by the vicious elbow he laid on James Harden last season. World Peace was suspended one game his week for a jab to Brandon Knight in Detroit. "

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on-basketball/21655652/kobe-bryant-metta-world-peace-among-top-ten-most-disliked-athletes-in-poll



http://i.imgur.com/kT5nfak.png

http://www.forbes.com/pictures/eddf45jmfd/kobe-bryant-4/

KobeOwnSU
04-27-2014, 09:57 PM
I comprehended everything you posted. Lebron only had real hate for like 1 1/2 to 2 NBA seasons which was the time between leaving the Cavs and his first NBA title. Lebron hasn't been on the most hated athletes list since his 2nd year in MIami. Kobe was on there THIS PAST SEASON. lebron has haters but he's generaly not hated like Kobe or Arod is.


Kobe Bryant, World Peace among top 10 disliked athletes


"Los Angeles Lakers Kobe Bryant and Metta World Peace made the list of the top 10 most-disliked athletes in the world, according to the N-score measure taken yearly by Nielsen and E-Poll, via Forbes.com. The poll is limited to active athletes.

MWP came in with just 21 percent of the public's support, landing sixth on the list. Bryant came in with 27 percent, at No. 10. They are the only two NBA players on the list, which is headlined by Manti Te'o and Lance Armstrong, along with such athletes as Tiger Woods, Michael Vick, Kurt Busch, and Bears quarterback Jay Cutler.

Notably absent from the list?

LeBron James.

James spent the past two years on the list after "The Decision," but after his public image makeover, which featured a new publicist, an NBA title run, and an Olympic gold medal, it would appear the public has forgiven him for his numerous PR gaffes. Winning helps, as well.

You wonder if MWP's status on the list is influenced by the vicious elbow he laid on James Harden last season. World Peace was suspended one game his week for a jab to Brandon Knight in Detroit. "

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on-basketball/21655652/kobe-bryant-metta-world-peace-among-top-ten-most-disliked-athletes-in-poll



http://i.imgur.com/kT5nfak.png

http://www.forbes.com/pictures/eddf45jmfd/kobe-bryant-4/

You shouldn't have posted truth. The NBA forum doesn't do well with truth.

3RDASYSTEM
04-27-2014, 10:19 PM
Sorry but the dude has been meh all series.

add him to the list of of other past player playoff performances

and why don't you do me a favor and start the list and we'll add on to it if needed

it happens every now or two, a good team/individual player will rattle a scorer/elite player so now its up to coaching staff to put that player in position to get looks, he needs to study L BROWN/CARLISLE and see how they do it, its really simple

its funny how he is the same player regardless if he win nba mvp and still struggle this series(and rest of playoffs if they survive this rd), hes still durantula, 4x scoring champ

3RDASYSTEM
04-27-2014, 10:29 PM
I comprehended everything you posted. Lebron only had real hate for like 1 1/2 to 2 NBA seasons which was the time between leaving the Cavs and his first NBA title. Lebron hasn't been on the most hated athletes list since his 2nd year in MIami. Kobe was on there THIS PAST SEASON. lebron has haters but he's generaly not hated like Kobe or Arod is.


Kobe Bryant, World Peace among top 10 disliked athletes


"Los Angeles Lakers Kobe Bryant and Metta World Peace made the list of the top 10 most-disliked athletes in the world, according to the N-score measure taken yearly by Nielsen and E-Poll, via Forbes.com. The poll is limited to active athletes.

MWP came in with just 21 percent of the public's support, landing sixth on the list. Bryant came in with 27 percent, at No. 10. They are the only two NBA players on the list, which is headlined by Manti Te'o and Lance Armstrong, along with such athletes as Tiger Woods, Michael Vick, Kurt Busch, and Bears quarterback Jay Cutler.

Notably absent from the list?

LeBron James.

James spent the past two years on the list after "The Decision," but after his public image makeover, which featured a new publicist, an NBA title run, and an Olympic gold medal, it would appear the public has forgiven him for his numerous PR gaffes. Winning helps, as well.

You wonder if MWP's status on the list is influenced by the vicious elbow he laid on James Harden last season. World Peace was suspended one game his week for a jab to Brandon Knight in Detroit. "

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on-basketball/21655652/kobe-bryant-metta-world-peace-among-top-ten-most-disliked-athletes-in-poll



http://i.imgur.com/kT5nfak.png

http://www.forbes.com/pictures/eddf45jmfd/kobe-bryant-4/

VICK killed animals(mother nature), basically they are equal to us 'being'/mankind since we are freaks of the same nature

ARTEST is perceived thug/crazy guy especially for that infamous brawl in Motown

bean Bryant was accused of raping a woman so you know how that will forever be hate, and he paid her off at that

BRON left his franchise on national tv so that is of the norm in todays society so he will be forgiven more quickly and easily, as for the others its accepted not on the surface, fighting and raping women are not GODLY at all

the so called hate was fueled from cavs/gilbert from the decision and him not winning a ring and being better individually than most in the league day 1

3RDASYSTEM
04-27-2014, 10:39 PM
thunder are suppose to be worlds better than Memphis as well. Sure as hell doesnt look like it. Its all about matchups... Nets/pacers/bulls could knock out west teams if they played them. Its hard to gauge.

its all about matchups and they match up pretty well for most part

KD vs RANDOLPH
GASOL vs IBAKA
RUSS vs CONLEY

bench vs bench

now who makes the most plays on offense and defense as a total? that's who wins
you mention matchups like its rocket science, it usually comes down to a big 3 vs the other and bench play comes in play, like who will make more plays out of the secondary tier like JACKSON/BUTLER vs LEE/PRINCE/ALLEN, that's the matchups you should be talking about

all teams matchup when the ball tips, some are just superior than others and usually the superior team wins regardless of matchups because you cant matchup to the best equally but you can compete and try, see the past runner up champs from past 20yrs, and watch how injuries gave the other team the edge because they were pretty well matched up, superstar player wise that is(big 3 vs big 3), regardless of talent level every team has one by default

Minimal
04-28-2014, 01:29 AM
Man, if he's choking on 29/10/5 + 1.3stl/2.3 blk while leading the post-season in Defensive Win Shares, is Westbrook pronounced dead at this point? His efficiency is taking a hit - especially last game - and he needs to step it up, but it's just a very tough matchup for him/them as we've talked about. The efficiency #'s aren't going to be pretty when you're going up against an elite team D with a proven track record of relative success against OKC.

I think he's taken 2 or 3 too many threes each game, but it's tough with how much they're clogging the paint on his drives. I'm hoping the supporting cast can continue to step up for them like they did last game, much more entertaining team for me to watch than Memphis.
OMG, he is playing terrible and what does defensive win shares got to do with anything? He is playing 47 minutes a game! His Drtg is 99, Brons is 96. His per 36 are 22/8/3.5 on 40% shooting, he is playing bad and no defense should stop him from scoring when he is the best scorer in the game.

FlashBolt
04-28-2014, 01:40 AM
Kobe: Demanded trade, no harm done.

LeBron: Signs with Miami after his contract ended, chaos.

Kobe: 6/24, no one said a thing about choking.

LeBron: 6/24, Cavs getting blown out by at least 20.

Kobe: Treats teammates like crap, isolated himself. Odom had Phil's black card for a Lakers night out and Kobe sat by himself while everyone else enjoyed their time together.

LeBron: People take less money. By less, millions. Just so they can play with LeBron.

Kobe: Makes 1/4 clutch shots, he's clutch.

LeBron: Misses 1 shot and he's a choke.

Everything about Kobe is well documented. LeBron's 1 year of hate far surpasses anything Kobe ever went through. Now, Durant will go through the same thing LeBron went through except I can't give him a pass. I would only imagine how great Cleveland would've been had they traded rosters with the current OKC.

tredigs
04-28-2014, 01:48 AM
OMG, he is playing terrible and what does defensive win shares got to do with anything? He is playing 47 minutes a game! His Drtg is 99, Brons is 96. His per 36 are 22/8/3.5 on 40% shooting, he is playing bad and no defense should stop him from scoring when he is the best scorer in the game.

Playing 47 mpg against that D is a detriment to %'s, not a bonus. I agree he should be better, but I also realize just how tough Memphis swarms KD and they have the right personnel to do it. It's a very, very tough 1st round matchup. They're better than every team in the East Miami will face.

tredigs
04-28-2014, 01:49 AM
Kobe: Demanded trade, no harm done.

LeBron: Signs with Miami after his contract ended, chaos.

Kobe: 6/24, no one said a thing about choking.

LeBron: 6/24, Cavs getting blown out by at least 20.

Kobe: Treats teammates like crap, isolated himself. Odom had Phil's black card for a Lakers night out and Kobe sat by himself while everyone else enjoyed their time together.

LeBron: People take less money. By less, millions. Just so they can play with LeBron.

Kobe: Makes 1/4 clutch shots, he's clutch.

LeBron: Misses 1 shot and he's a choke.

Everything about Kobe is well documented. LeBron's 1 year of hate far surpasses anything Kobe ever went through. Now, Durant will go through the same thing LeBron went through except I can't give him a pass. I would only imagine how great Cleveland would've been had they traded rosters with the current OKC.

I love how irrational both sides are. This debate will never end, because you're not having a debate.

Crackadalic
04-28-2014, 03:12 AM
And why exactly should that matter when we're criticizing/discussing basketball-related manners?

I mean, I get that people can't separate emotions from things, but why should we pretend like emotionally-charged criticism, to the point of double standards, is something we should be OK with?


Magic, Bird, Jordan, Kobe, Iverson, these guys showed plenty of arrogance and cockiness. None of them have ever been hated like LBJ. I don't see Melo acting arrogant or cocky and he still gets plenty of criticism so thats just a bailout argument for Durant

I don't agree with it. I'm iust stating the obvious perception that's out there. Durant should be criticize but let's be honest. He's a good kid so not a lot of people is going to get on his *** for it

tredigs
04-28-2014, 03:15 AM
Did OKC already lose this series? Maybe we should let it play out, first?

Crackadalic
04-28-2014, 03:16 AM
why should that matter when criticizing the games best players, who have chip help?

The real reason, is that LeBron was followed around like a puppy by age 15, and the media has been shoving him down our throats for 12 years. Durant is looked at as an innocent superstar who is just stumbling into his greatness or something.

Durant's play need to be criticized in this series, period. If he gets knocked out, and LeBron goes on another great playoff run, the 7th time in his career, are people really still clamoring that Durant was better this year?

The media shoving LeBron down our throats is why people hated him.

Like I said in my previous post. Those are not my views that's the perception you get from general people. I never see espn **** on the guy at all.

Anyone else will get the beat down to no end

RulerSlick
04-28-2014, 06:04 AM
You shouldn't have posted truth. The NBA forum doesn't do well with truth.

:D


So may people don't get the difference between having "haters" and being "hated". Any and all great/popular people have fans that are balanced out by haters. "Haters" are basically salty, envious and jealous types. This is what Lebron has. Being "hated" is something totally different. It's more personal. This is what the likes of Kobe, Michael Vick, Tiger woods, lance Armstrong face along with having "haters" lol. If you're considered "great" or you're popular and you don't have "haters", then somethings up.

RulerSlick
04-28-2014, 06:18 AM
I don't agree with it. I'm iust stating the obvious perception that's out there. Durant should be criticize but let's be honest. He's a good kid so not a lot of people is going to get on his *** for it

The reason is that Durant is boring and not an emotion triggering player/figure. It's somewhat of that Tim Duncan factor. Kevin Durant is only popular in Oklahoma based on this study..

http://i.imgur.com/iVIJeyv.png

http://www.besttickets.com/blog/most-popular-athletes/



Athletes rank right among the biggest musicians and movie stars when it comes to fame. Michael Jordan, perhaps the greatest NBA player of all time, is one of the most recognizable figures on the face of the earth. With that in mind, which players are the most popular? Using Google search volume data from the last 12 months (April 2013 – April 2014), the chart above illustrates the most searched-for athletes in each of the 50 States.

LeBron James dominates the competition, showing up as the most searched athlete in 23/50 states. Next in line is Peyton Manning who claims seven states, then Adrian Peterson and Tom Brady who tie for 3rd with four states. Andrew Wiggins (two states) and Johnny Manziel (one state) are the only athletes to win at least one state despite technically not having made the transition to professional sports yet. Tiger Woods (one state) is the only athlete on the map who doesn’t play one of the “Big Four” North American sports. Below, the top ten most popular athletes overall.

Simply put, Durant evokes no real emotion to anyone outside of his hardcore fans which is why he has no real "haters" or pressure right now.



lebron evokes emotion and he also dwarfs Durant in popularity, hence fans and haters alike lol

What I Learned From A Year Of Watching SportsCenter






Which names is SportsCenter writing over and over again in its Trapper Keeper?

As Sanchez's inexplicable prominence suggests, the great SportsCenter engine runs not just on money and major sports to which ESPN happens to hold broadcast rights, but also on celebrity. Watch the show at the right time of year, and you might come away thinking that there are only a half-dozen or so athletes in the entire world.

To put in perspective just how fixed SportsCenter gets on the anointed, consider that Tim Tebow got 17 percent more mentions than successful professional quarterbacks Drew Brees and Aaron Rodgers put together. Then consider that he wasn't, unbelievably enough, even one of SportsCenter's five most fussed-over athletes.

http://i.imgur.com/TtnkWXT.png


As you can see, if you want the all-powerful SportsCenter to aid your personal #branding campaign, it helps to either play basketball or line up under center. Of the 20 most-mentioned athletes, in fact, 11 play in the NBA and seven were quarterbacks (assuming Tebow counts as one). Golf and baseball each claimed one spot. No one else, from Serena Williams to Lionel Messi, rated at all.



CUMULATIVE STATISTICS (2012)


Total time: 23,052.75 minutes
Time (minus commercials): 17,361.25
NFL: 4,046.25 (23.3%)
NBA: 3,330.5 minutes (19.2%)
MLB: 2,916.5 (16.8%)
SportsCenter staples**: 2,289 (13.2%)
College football: 1,329.75 (7.7%)
College basketball: 1,181.25 (6.8%)
Golf: 580.75 (3.3%)
NHL: 459.5 (2.7%)
NASCAR: 362.25 (2.1%)
Other***: 315 (1.8%)
Soccer: 217.75 (1.3%)
Olympics: 166.5 (.9%)
Tennis: 166.25 (.9%)

MOST-COVERED TEAMS BY SPORT (2012)

Miami Heat (NBA): 962.75 minutes (5.5%)
New York Yankees (MLB): 410.25 (2.4%)
New York Giants (NFL): 362.75 (2.1%)
Alabama Crimson Tide (college football): 208.75 (1.2%)
Kentucky Wildcats (college basketball): 155.25 (0.9%)
Pittsburgh Penguins (NHL): 56.5 (0.3%)

MOST-MENTIONED SPORTS FIGURES (2012)


1) LeBron James: 1,930 mentions
2) Kobe Bryant: 1,345
3) Peyton Manning: 1,218
4) Dwyane Wade: 1,167
5) Kevin Durant: 1,109
6) Tiger Woods: 1,011
7) Tim Tebow: 976
8) Tom Brady: 894
9) Jeremy Lin: 871
10) Derrick Rose: 830
11) Carmelo Anthony: 804
12) Dwight Howard: 752
13) Eli Manning: 621
14) Russell Westbrook: 578
15) Rajon Rondo: 568
16) Robert Griffin III: 567
17) Josh Hamilton: 460
18) Blake Griffin: 457
19) Drew Brees: 433
20) Aaron Rodgers: 401

* This analysis had to exclude teams without unique names—e.g., the Jets, who play both hockey and football. I also left out the 2012 playoff champions and runners-up in any sport, because they attract tons of attention regardless of their regular-season performance.

** Includes things like the "Top 10," "Encore," "What 2 Watch 4," etc.

*** Sports included cycling, lacrosse, Little League baseball, college hockey, arena football, softball, extreme sports, drag racing, Formula One, and IndyCar.

Graphics by Reuben Fischer-Baum and David Roher.

http://deadspin.com/what-i-learned-from-a-year-of-watching-sportscenter-5979510



http://i.imgur.com/rQCXLmr.png

http://i.imgur.com/Q4uJZoM.jpg

When you're on top like Lebron, you'll have haters and pressure, simply put. When you're not an emotion evoking player like Durant, noone really cares about you.

nickdymez
04-28-2014, 08:45 AM
Bobcats are a pretty good defensive team. Also MKG is one of their best defenders. So its not like lebron doesnt have to do anything compared to durant

It's starting to get pathetic now

KnicksorBust
04-28-2014, 10:12 AM
If only he had a point guard to help him get going.

Crackadalic
04-28-2014, 11:07 AM
Like a poster said KD has been good for so long he gets immune from the media backlash because he has a Tim Duncan personality and doesn't go out his way to have to ego dominated personalities like other stars

RulerSlick
04-28-2014, 12:29 PM
Like a poster said KD has been good for so long he gets immune from the media backlash because he has a Tim Duncan personality and doesn't go out his way to have to ego dominated personalities like other stars

I wouldn't compare KD's "being good so long" to Duncans considering KD has no real accomplishments but KD does have that "boring, I don't care what he does either way" factor that Duncan has. This is why Duncan hardley catches flack for not winning back to backs. In many ways Durant is like Derrick Rose more than he's Duncan.

Chronz
04-28-2014, 01:03 PM
add him to the list of of other past player playoff performances

and why don't you do me a favor and start the list and we'll add on to it if needed

it happens every now or two, a good team/individual player will rattle a scorer/elite player so now its up to coaching staff to put that player in position to get looks, he needs to study L BROWN/CARLISLE and see how they do it, its really simple

its funny how he is the same player regardless if he win nba mvp and still struggle this series(and rest of playoffs if they survive this rd), hes still durantula, 4x scoring champ

When this happen to MJ?

Hawkeye15
04-28-2014, 02:05 PM
The reason is that Durant is boring and not an emotion triggering player/figure. It's somewhat of that Tim Duncan factor. Kevin Durant is only popular in Oklahoma based on this study..

http://i.imgur.com/iVIJeyv.png

http://www.besttickets.com/blog/most-popular-athletes/




Simply put, Durant evokes no real emotion to anyone outside of his hardcore fans which is why he has no real "haters" or pressure right now.



lebron evokes emotion and he also dwarfs Durant in popularity, hence fans and haters alike lol

What I Learned From A Year Of Watching SportsCenter





http://i.imgur.com/rQCXLmr.png

http://i.imgur.com/Q4uJZoM.jpg

When you're on top like Lebron, you'll have haters and pressure, simply put. When you're not an emotion evoking player like Durant, noone really cares about you.

you absolutely nailed it on why LeBron has so many haters.

beyourself
04-28-2014, 04:31 PM
you absolutely nailed it on why LeBron has so many haters.

I'm going with the decision on National TV.

Hawkeye15
04-28-2014, 06:19 PM
I'm going with the decision on National TV.

whatever you like, I am just saying the biggest reason most don't like him is that he has been forcefed to us as the next GOAT since age 15. That put a lot of people off, including me to some degree. But once the hatred got to A-Rod level, which I never understood, I started rooting for him to win. Still am..

RulerSlick
04-28-2014, 06:44 PM
I'm going with the decision on National TV.

Lebron had "haters" before that but that's was triggered his "Kobe level hate", (remember being hated is different from having haters) for almost 1 1/2 to 2 seasons. Lebron no longer has or gets that Kobe/Arod type hate. Now he just has envious and salty "haters" lol. Alot of his his haters on the net are really salty Kobe fans and a smaller mix of Melo and Drose fans. The Kobe jockers are now riding Durant in a desperate attempt to talk down Lebron because that's all they have left to grasp for lol. Kobe's washed up and done now so he can no longer challenge lebron.

Hawkeye15
04-28-2014, 08:55 PM
Lebron had "haters" before that but that's was triggered his "Kobe level hate", (remember being hated is different from having haters) for almost 1 1/2 to 2 seasons. Lebron no longer has or gets that Kobe/Arod type hate. Now he just has envious and salty "haters" lol. Alot of his his haters on the net are really salty Kobe fans and a smaller mix of Melo and Drose fans. The Kobe jockers are now riding Durant in a desperate attempt to talk down Lebron because that's all they have left to grasp for lol. Kobe's washed up and done now so he can no longer challenge lebron.

to be fair, Kobe never experienced A-Rod or LeBron hate level. Not even close. That is what happens when you win 3 chips for the most popular team in your sport by age 25.

beyourself
04-28-2014, 09:11 PM
whatever you like, I am just saying the biggest reason most don't like him is that he has been forcefed to us as the next GOAT since age 15. That put a lot of people off, including me to some degree. But once the hatred got to A-Rod level, which I never understood, I started rooting for him to win. Still am..

I should have clarified. The Nationally Broadcasted telecast of the decision is what made me not like him.

Hawkeye15
04-28-2014, 09:19 PM
I should have clarified. The Nationally Broadcasted telecast of the decision is what made me not like him.

No, I get that. I was shocked at the time, only because I figured he wouldn't do the huge show thing unless he was going back to Cleveland. But I will never look at him negatively for actually leaving Cleveland, and he has since admitted the way he handled it, he would change, and was doing it to raise money for the Boys and Girls Club. But yeah, I can understand someone not liking that move. But hate him for that alone? Seems a bit of a stretch.

slashsnake
04-29-2014, 02:26 AM
When this happen to MJ?

Some of those piston series for sure... 89 I think it was when he was almost averaging a triple double against the Knicks in the series before... Then came Detroit. Scoring down by 20%, shooting percentage down by 10%. 5-15 for 23 points in game 4, 4-8 for 18 points in game 5, and 8 turnovers in game 6, and they lost three straight. The next year he dropped a couple of duds there too... 88 he scored 29, 24, 23, and 25 in his four losses to Detroit. Right after averaging 45 a game vs. Cleveland the series before.

Granted then came the threepeats and all was forgotten, just like Durants season this year if he wins a few championships in a row.

effen5
04-29-2014, 02:37 AM
Some of those piston series for sure... 89 I think it was when he was almost averaging a triple double against the Knicks in the series before... Then came Detroit. Scoring down by 20%, shooting percentage down by 10%. 5-15 for 23 points in game 4, 4-8 for 18 points in game 5, and 8 turnovers in game 6, and they lost three straight. The next year he dropped a couple of duds there too... 88 he scored 29, 24, 23, and 25 in his four losses to Detroit. Right after averaging 45 a game vs. Cleveland the series before.

Granted then came the threepeats and all was forgotten, just like Durants season this year if he wins a few championships in a row.

I get what you're saying about Jordan but come on....nobody could average the numbers Jordan put up against that Detroit team.

effen5
04-29-2014, 02:38 AM
whatever you like, I am just saying the biggest reason most don't like him is that he has been forcefed to us as the next GOAT since age 15. That put a lot of people off, including me to some degree. But once the hatred got to A-Rod level, which I never understood, I started rooting for him to win. Still am..

Absolutely the truth right there.

slashsnake
04-29-2014, 05:22 AM
to be fair, Kobe never experienced A-Rod or LeBron hate level. Not even close. That is what happens when you win 3 chips for the most popular team in your sport by age 25.

Not really... Kobe got to get there being the #2, future face of the franchise. You love the #2 guy, respect him, or don't really care because you hate the #1 guy. Your hate goes for the big guy, the face of the franchise... Shaq in those first three rings. People hated Jordan killing their teams in the 90's... but Pippen, you either liked him or respected him, but you didn't really hate him. Same with Wade now with Lebron. Same with Jason Terry. Same with Harden in OKC. People loved him there and saved the hate for Durant /Westbrook who were vying for the #1. Now that Harden is #1, you see the negatives... People hated Magic, but Worthy was ok. People hated Bird, but Parish was ok. People hated Shaq, but Penny was ok. People disliked Pierce and Garnett, but the future in Rondo was ok.



What happened though when it finally became Kobe's team? Then he was the face to hate, if they loved him with 3 rings, why hate him with 5? Because now he's the face.

sammyvine
04-29-2014, 05:36 AM
I wouldn't compare KD's "being good so long" to Duncans considering KD has no real accomplishments but KD does have that "boring, I don't care what he does either way" factor that Duncan has. This is why Duncan hardley catches flack for not winning back to backs. In many ways Durant is like Derrick Rose more than he's Duncan.

i dont understand why fans get into athletes personalities so much. I mean why do we care what they are like!

Munkeysuit
04-29-2014, 05:44 AM
Let him earn his props...I am sure he will come around soon, but I never give anyone credit until it's rightfully earned. Lebron is still the MVP of the league and by far it's best player...Durant has certain luxuries Lebron doesn't and I am sure it works the other way around as well, but Durant was never ready for this...there are only a few that will admit that.

slashsnake
04-29-2014, 05:46 AM
I get what you're saying about Jordan but come on....nobody could average the numbers Jordan put up against that Detroit team.

Besides guys like Bird, Clyde Drexler, Kevin McHale, and Jeff Malone.

Jordan 27 points on 48% shooting one series (45 a game and 57% shooting the series before)...

Bird had a 27-10-8 series against them on 49% shooting. Drexler had a pretty good finals against them. 26 points 8 boards 6 assists on 54% shooting... McHale had a great series against them, 27 and 7 against Detroit on 56% shooting. Jeff Malone put up 26 a game on 51% shooting on them in a playoff series. Sure they made a lot of guys struggle, but Jordan really fell off and not everyone did when facing the Bad Boys.. And granted it was in the earlier years, but Dominique averaged 34 a game vs. a Daly coached, Thomas, Lambieer, Johnson, Mahorn, and Dumars led Detroit team in the playoffs.

Jordan went from 35 a game in the season down to 27 a game... He went from superhuman to Drexler/McHale/Malone type scoring against Detroit. Durant has gone from 32 a game to 28.5 a game. Sure, Memphis is no late 80's Detroit. Durant isn't Jordan.

But yes, Jordan had a fall off that was even bigger than Durants, twice as big of a fall off actually. Jordan's scoring fell by 30% in a series. Durants has fallen by 12%. And yes, I remember those series... he looked bad in them for long stretches and entire games.

FraziersKnicks
04-30-2014, 12:12 AM
Another 40% shooting performance, 6 turnovers, missed the game tying free throw and then the potential game winner.

Tony Allen wasn't defending that free throw... :shrug:

sturm
04-30-2014, 12:23 AM
yeah he is clearly chocking.

Duncan = Donkey
04-30-2014, 12:25 AM
yep

P&GRealist
04-30-2014, 12:25 AM
These playoffs have shown that Harden and Durant both ain't **** without their 10-15+ FTAs per game.

P&GRealist
04-30-2014, 12:25 AM
Another 40% shooting performance, 6 turnovers, missed the game tying free throw and then the potential game winner.

Tony Allen wasn't defending that free throw... :shrug:

Next thing he'll say is Joey Crawford is in his head. :rolleyes:

Hawkeye15
04-30-2014, 12:27 AM
nah, he is the best player in the world, remember? If the Thunder lose in round 1, or don't win it all, it sure isn't going to be Durant's fault. That accusation only can be pointed at LeBron, remember everyone?

cmellofan15
04-30-2014, 12:29 AM
hey guys I sarcastically called it in that thread about people choking in the playoffs. props.

bucketss
04-30-2014, 12:30 AM
im not putting too much weight on it, but good god! if this was lebron all hell would break loose.

ManRam
04-30-2014, 12:31 AM
I don't think he's choking...I just think the Lil B curse is that real

P&GRealist
04-30-2014, 12:32 AM
nah, he is the best player in the world, remember? If the Thunder lose in round 1, or don't win it all, it sure isn't going to be Durant's fault. That accusation only can be pointed at LeBron, remember everyone?

Emotional today aren't we? :laugh2:

JordansBulls
04-30-2014, 12:32 AM
Besides guys like Bird, Clyde Drexler, Kevin McHale, and Jeff Malone.

Jordan 27 points on 48% shooting one series (45 a game and 57% shooting the series before)...

Bird had a 27-10-8 series against them on 49% shooting. Drexler had a pretty good finals against them. 26 points 8 boards 6 assists on 54% shooting... McHale had a great series against them, 27 and 7 against Detroit on 56% shooting. Jeff Malone put up 26 a game on 51% shooting on them in a playoff series. Sure they made a lot of guys struggle, but Jordan really fell off and not everyone did when facing the Bad Boys.. And granted it was in the earlier years, but Dominique averaged 34 a game vs. a Daly coached, Thomas, Lambieer, Johnson, Mahorn, and Dumars led Detroit team in the playoffs.

Jordan went from 35 a game in the season down to 27 a game... He went from superhuman to Drexler/McHale/Malone type scoring against Detroit. Durant has gone from 32 a game to 28.5 a game. Sure, Memphis is no late 80's Detroit. Durant isn't Jordan.

But yes, Jordan had a fall off that was even bigger than Durants, twice as big of a fall off actually. Jordan's scoring fell by 30% in a series. Durants has fallen by 12%. And yes, I remember those series... he looked bad in them for long stretches and entire games.

Jordan didn't lose with HCA and nor was the favorite not even close, He shot 49% and the team as a whole shot 44%, also the same year Bird lost with HCA to Detroit and only averaged 20 ppg on 35% FG. Hell Washington had Bernard King, Moses Malone and Jeff Malone, plenty of scoring options.

More-Than-Most
04-30-2014, 12:33 AM
im not putting too much weight on it, but good god! if this was lebron all hell would break loose.

Would love to see Durant play with the attention and scrutiny lebron gets. Lebron is durants meal ticket... As long as Lebron is in the league he will sponge all the hate and durant will keep skating by like Melo. Durant is great but he gets all credit and no blame.

JordansBulls
04-30-2014, 12:33 AM
If OKC loses this it would be the 3rd year in a row he lost with HCA. But that would be the same as Lebron as well who lost with it three years in a row as well from 2009 to 2011.

Yanks All Day
04-30-2014, 12:35 AM
The only thing I have really seen is that Durant needs to add significant muscle this off-season. Tony Allen is abusing him physically and denying him the ball way too easily for the 6'10, best scorer in the league.

It's a combination of both in this case. To say KD is choking is disrespectful to Tony Allen, who is playing an amazing series and is one of (if not the) best on-ball defenders in the league. Still, 10-24, 5-21, 10-27, and 12-28 in the last 4 games is unacceptable. No one should be able to take the best scorer in the game down like that consistently. Tony Allen is playing great defense, but I think Durant is also psyched out. He's missing open shots and taking even worse ones. In the last 3 games, he's had more turnovers than assists. Flat out, he's getting punked in this series.

I hope we can put the "Durant is better than LeBron" talk to bed now. Besides the fact that KD is only better than LeBron at shooting, and has drawn about even on defense, LeBron doesn't get completely taken out of series in all facets of the game. Even when the Spurs gave LBJ trouble, he eventually figured them out offensively and still made plays for others when he wasn't scoring. Durant has gotten leaps and bounds better, but he doesn't do that kinda stuff all the time.

JC_
04-30-2014, 12:35 AM
I think that everytime Durant goes to shoot, he's thinking about the curse and how it's going to affect the shot.

bucketss
04-30-2014, 12:36 AM
If OKC loses this it would be the 3rd year in a row he lost with HCA. But that would be the same as Lebron as well who lost with it three years in a row as well from 2009 to 2011.

but this is a first round against an 7th seed, plus they got nba champion derke fisher :D with another all star in westbrook. :D :D :D

Jtirado16
04-30-2014, 12:36 AM
Wait till the series is over.

cmellofan15
04-30-2014, 12:36 AM
nah, he is the best player in the world, remember? If the Thunder lose in round 1, or don't win it all, it sure isn't going to be Durant's fault. That accusation only can be pointed at LeBron, remember everyone?

I feel a "Congrats on being the best player in the world" thread deserves a bump.


If OKC loses this it would be the 3rd year in a row he lost with HCA. But that would be the same as Lebron as well who lost with it three years in a row as well from 2009 to 2011.

but wait, there's more!

JordansBulls
04-30-2014, 12:37 AM
The only thing I have really seen is that Durant needs to add significant muscle this off-season. Tony Allen is abusing him physically and denying him the ball way too easily for the 6'10, best scorer in the league.

It's a combination of both in this case. To say KD is choking is disrespectful to Tony Allen, who is playing an amazing series and is one of (if not the) best on-ball defenders in the league. Still, 10-24, 5-21, 10-27, and 12-28 in the last 4 games is unacceptable. No one should be able to take the best scorer in the game down like that consistently. Tony Allen is playing great defense, but I think Durant is also psyched out. He's missing open shots and taking even worse ones. In the last 3 games, he's had more turnovers than assists. Flat out, he's getting punked in this series.

I hope we can put the "Durant is better than LeBron" talk to bed now. Besides the fact that KD is only better than LeBron at shooting, and has drawn about even on defense, LeBron doesn't get completely taken out of series in all facets of the game. Even when the Spurs gave LBJ trouble, he eventually figured them out offensively and still made plays for others when he wasn't scoring. Durant has gotten leaps and bounds better, but he doesn't do that kinda stuff all the time.
Can't really say that as in the East alone the past two years Lebron and Miami were taken 7 games to teams that didn't even win 50 games and one year was down 3-2 as well. This year the conference is a joke.

therealwd27
04-30-2014, 12:39 AM
This^

I find it hilarious, everyone knows damn well if Lebron put these numbers up against ANYONE you would all be talking crap about him and how he is choking. Just another example of KD getting a pass where Lebron wouldn't and yet people want to compare him to LBJ? Get outta here.

This x2

All bias LeBron haters and Kobe lovers.

FraziersKnicks
04-30-2014, 12:40 AM
Can't really say that as in the East alone the past two years Lebron and Miami were taken 7 games to teams that didn't even win 50 games and one year was down 3-2 as well. This year the conference is a joke.

Who's won the NBA title the last two years though? Does it really matter that they got taken to some game 7's if they pulled it out and still finished champions... Of course not.

FlashBolt
04-30-2014, 12:42 AM
Can't really say that as in the East alone the past two years Lebron and Miami were taken 7 games to teams that didn't even win 50 games and one year was down 3-2 as well. This year the conference is a joke.

Nice double standard. First, it's LeBron went to join two other superstars. Hence, by your logic, this makes it "easy." When they get taken to game 7's, you say they aren't as good? Lol. How is someone as biased as you ever a mod? You're a horrific poster losing credibility because you cringe at the thought of LeBron winning. Durant is choking. He missed a free throw to tie the game and he's made far tougher shots than the one's he missed in this series. Lemme guess, Joey Crawford is the reason why Durant missed? JordansBulls, you are the most biased fan outside of Illustionist and Amoser. You use double standards for LeBron but when we're talking about any other player, you're quick to dismiss their inept ability to win.

therealwd27
04-30-2014, 12:43 AM
Can't really say that as in the East alone the past two years Lebron and Miami were taken 7 games to teams that didn't even win 50 games and one year was down 3-2 as well. This year the conference is a joke.

Damn the hate is real. All about match ups. You, Amoser, Illusionist, FreeJimmer all deserve to live the rest of your lives together in a basement apartment.

FlashBolt
04-30-2014, 12:45 AM
If this was LeBron, there would be 50 pages in this thread already. Durant is getting passes.

JordansBulls
04-30-2014, 12:46 AM
Nice double standard. First, it's LeBron went to join two other superstars. Hence, by your logic, this makes it "easy." When they get taken to game 7's, you say they aren't as good? Lol. How is someone as biased as you ever a mod? You're a horrific poster losing credibility because you cringe at the thought of LeBron winning. Durant is choking. He missed a free throw to tie the game and he's made far tougher shots than the one's he missed in this series. Lemme guess, Joey Crawford is the reason why Durant missed? JordansBulls, you are the most biased fan outside of Illustionist and Amoser. You use double standards for LeBron but when we're talking about any other player, you're quick to dismiss their inept ability to win.

I used no double standards and you should talk, you just became a fan of the team when they started winning. Also one guy joined forces with a guy who won a title as the man in his city and also was the cause of a franchise not winning a title. While the other guy has a guy who thinks he is the man taking all the shots on the squad. Is Durant choking yes he is, but so is his co star who is taking more shots than him.

http://www.nba.com/bulls/news/smith_james_100709.html



Going to Miami, it isn’t going to be LeBron’s team. It is Wade’s team because he’s been there and has won a championship there. So the obvious point was that this would not be LeBron’s championship if he gets one or more, that he needed to go get help from a champion and another star.

P&GRealist
04-30-2014, 12:47 AM
I think fans of other teams are waiting for KD to bolt to their teams next summer, thus they're not bashing him. :laugh2:

Yanks All Day
04-30-2014, 12:48 AM
Can't really say that as in the East alone the past two years Lebron and Miami were taken 7 games to teams that didn't even win 50 games and one year was down 3-2 as well. This year the conference is a joke.

Last year's Pacers and 2012's Celtics were very good basketball teams. Extremely tough defensively and a bunch of good scorers. They would have competed with any team in the league. Certainly not easy series for any team in the league. Not to mention they beat the Spurs last year (who probably would have destroyed any other team not named the Heat) and demolished the Thunder the year before to win the title. The Heat have beaten very, very good teams over the last few years. Just because they were taken to Game 7 3 times doesn't mean that's a bad thing. It actually means they won huge games against tough opponents.

As much as people don't want to believe it, we haven't seen anything like that from Durant yet.

FraziersKnicks
04-30-2014, 12:49 AM
I understand Memphis are playing great team defense and Tony Allen is playing some of the most impressive one on one defense I've seen in a long time, but KD averaged 31/6/5 on 52% shooting against this Memphis team in 4 games in the regular season.

I know the playoffs are a lot more intense and the defenses get tighter but KD should be raising his game in the playoffs aptly. Seems like the pressure of the situation is getting to him a bit. Especially after an MVP season. Every time LeBron's won MVP it kinda takes the pressure off KD to perform as well in the playoffs, but he's got to back up his regular season MVP and it doesn't look like he's doing it at the moment.

JordansBulls
04-30-2014, 12:50 AM
Last year's Pacers and 2012's Celtics were very good basketball teams. Extremely tough defensively and a bunch of good scorers. They would have competed with any team in the league. Certainly not easy series for any team in the league. Not to mention they beat the Spurs last year (who probably would have destroyed any other team not named the Heat) and demolished the Thunder the year before to win the title. The Heat have beaten very, very good teams over the last few years. Just because they were taken to Game 7 3 times doesn't mean that's a bad thing. It actually means they won huge games against tough opponents.
Noticed I mentioned they were taken 7 games against teams that did not win 50 games in the season. I didn't bring up SA, I brought up Boston/Indy as neither won 50 games, so going 7 against those teams is underachieving especially when neither of those teams had a dominant big in his prime.

*Superman*
04-30-2014, 12:52 AM
Miss one crucial freethrow. https://cdn2.iconfinder.com/data/icons/3_Minicons-Free-_Pack/43/check_mark.png

FraziersKnicks
04-30-2014, 12:53 AM
I used no double standards and you should talk, you just became a fan of the team when they started winning. Also one guy joined forces with a guy who won a title as the man in his city and also was the cause of a franchise not winning a title. While the other guy has a guy who thinks he is the man taking all the shots on the squad. Is Durant choking yes he is, but so is his co star who is taking more shots than him.

http://www.nba.com/bulls/news/smith_james_100709.html

:laugh2: an article by the ever homerific Sam Smith bitter LeBron didn't choose the Bulls.

Yes, after winning two titles and two finals MVP's both of those championships aren't LeBron's..... They're Wade's.

FraziersKnicks
04-30-2014, 12:54 AM
Noticed I mentioned they were taken 7 games against teams that did not win 50 games in the season. I didn't bring up SA, I brought up Boston/Indy as neither won 50 games, so going 7 against those teams is underachieving especially when neither of those teams had a dominant big in his prime.

And winning the NBA championship at the end of it all is also underachieving because they didn't sweep every series and win the playoffs 16-0? Give it a rest.

cmellofan15
04-30-2014, 12:55 AM
I used no double standards and you should talk, you just became a fan of the team when they started winning. Also one guy joined forces with a guy who won a title as the man in his city and also was the cause of a franchise not winning a title. While the other guy has a guy who thinks he is the man taking all the shots on the squad. Is Durant choking yes he is, but so is his co star who is taking more shots than him.

http://www.nba.com/bulls/news/smith_james_100709.html

could have stopped right there. Despite any poor play or lack of play by Wade (which is pretty common nowadays), the apparent "captain of the team" in your eyes, LeBron has gotten it done. Best player in the league stuff right there.

And don't even get me started on the idiotic notion that these are "Wade's Rings". There is an apparent best player on this team and then there's another guy dragging along until he can show a quick flash of skill.

Big Zo
04-30-2014, 12:57 AM
Noticed I mentioned they were taken 7 games against teams that did not win 50 games in the season. I didn't bring up SA, I brought up Boston/Indy as neither won 50 games, so going 7 against those teams is underachieving especially when neither of those teams had a dominant big in his prime.

Will Derrick Rose play more than 10 games in the next 2 years?

FlashBolt
04-30-2014, 12:57 AM
I used no double standards and you should talk, you just became a fan of the team when they started winning. Also one guy joined forces with a guy who won a title as the man in his city and also was the cause of a franchise not winning a title. While the other guy has a guy who thinks he is the man taking all the shots on the squad. Is Durant choking yes he is, but so is his co star who is taking more shots than him.

http://www.nba.com/bulls/news/smith_james_100709.html

1) You used double standards because you constantly say LeBron created a superteam but if that's true, they would be strolling through the playoffs every time. Yet, you say they were taken to game 7's which means that the playoffs is much tougher than what you would deem "strolling."

2) Since when did join date represent when you became a fan? By your logic, you only became a Bulls fan in 2006.

3) Uhm, one guy left a team that was not interested in bringing in complimentary pieces to win a title. The other guy played with two top 10 players at one point; Westbrook and Harden, and also a very good shotblocker in Ibaka.

4) It's very clear you have no actual input. Everything you spew is indirectly targeted at LeBron despite this not even being the subject of LeBron. It's about KD being inefficient this game. You just admitted he's choking. He's the leader. He should be the one demanding the ball and speaking up. Russell Westbrook missing shots doesn't cause Durant to miss.

Admit it. You take shots at LeBron because you would love nothing more than anyone other than LeBron to win the championship.

FlashBolt
04-30-2014, 01:00 AM
Noticed I mentioned they were taken 7 games against teams that did not win 50 games in the season. I didn't bring up SA, I brought up Boston/Indy as neither won 50 games, so going 7 against those teams is underachieving especially when neither of those teams had a dominant big in his prime.

You don't even make sense! He's signifying that Spurs were beaten as well so regardless of how many game 7's they went through, they still got past the Spurs - who would have most likely taken down OKC in 5-6. Oh yeah, they SWEPT the Grizzlies.

IKnowHoops
04-30-2014, 01:03 AM
Nice double standard. First, it's LeBron went to join two other superstars. Hence, by your logic, this makes it "easy." When they get taken to game 7's, you say they aren't as good? Lol. How is someone as biased as you ever a mod? You're a horrific poster losing credibility because you cringe at the thought of LeBron winning. Durant is choking. He missed a free throw to tie the game and he's made far tougher shots than the one's he missed in this series. Lemme guess, Joey Crawford is the reason why Durant missed? JordansBulls, you are the most biased fan outside of Illustionist and Amoser. You use double standards for LeBron but when we're talking about any other player, you're quick to dismiss their inept ability to win.

Wait a minute, this guy is a Mod. Dang that made my day. I thought it was funny when I got banned but now I feel great about it. They let anybody be a Mod on here. And now I also see why Hawk isn't one anymore. He must of been too logical.

P.S. I'm sure there are a few good Mods though.

therealwd27
04-30-2014, 01:04 AM
You don't even make sense! He's signifying that Spurs were beaten as well so regardless of how many game 7's they went through, they still got past the Spurs - who would have most likely taken down OKC in 5-6. Oh yeah, they SWEPT the Grizzlies.

Don't waste your time. JordansBulls is clearly delusional. Guy knows nothing

JordansBulls
04-30-2014, 01:06 AM
1) You used double standards because you constantly say LeBron created a superteam but if that's true, they would be strolling through the playoffs every time. Yet, you say they were taken to game 7's which means that the playoffs is much tougher than what you would deem "strolling."

2) Since when did join date represent when you became a fan? By your logic, you only became a Bulls fan in 2006.

3) Uhm, one guy left a team that was not interested in bringing in complimentary pieces to win a title. The other guy played with two top 10 players at one point; Westbrook and Harden, and also a very good shotblocker in Ibaka.

4) It's very clear you have no actual input. Everything you spew is indirectly targeted at LeBron despite this not even being the subject of LeBron. It's about KD being inefficient this game. You just admitted he's choking. He's the leader. He should be the one demanding the ball and speaking up. Russell Westbrook missing shots doesn't cause Durant to miss.

Admit it. You take shots at LeBron because you would love nothing more than anyone other than LeBron to win the championship.

1. They don't because the players don't get better with Lebron around, they get worse which is why Wade and Bosh's numbers go down despite being #2 and #4 in PER before joining forces

2. Nope not applicable, Forums weren't around until between 2002-2004, and I was here when my team was not contending, you showed up only when a team had been winning.

3. They did bring in pieces, remember a 3x finals mvp winner in Shaq and Ben Wallace both of which were on the team and Shaq outplayed LBJ in pivotal game 5 of the series vs Boston.

4. No it is not, I said Durant was choking I did not deny that, I even said if he lost it would be the 3rd year in a row he lost with HCA, but I also mentioned that using the East vs West is totally different as one has continuous comp and one has no comp.

I love Lebron and want him to succeed, despite what others may think. I don't wish bad against anyone.

IKnowHoops
04-30-2014, 01:06 AM
miss one crucial freethrow. https://cdn2.iconfinder.com/data/icons/3_minicons-free-_pack/43/check_mark.png

lol

FlashBolt
04-30-2014, 01:21 AM
1. They don't because the players don't get better with Lebron around, they get worse which is why Wade and Bosh's numbers go down despite being #2 and #4 in PER before joining forces

2. Nope not applicable, Forums weren't around until between 2002-2004, and I was here when my team was not contending, you showed up only when a team had been winning.

3. They did bring in pieces, remember a 3x finals mvp winner in Shaq and Ben Wallace both of which were on the team and Shaq outplayed LBJ in pivotal game 5 of the series vs Boston.

4. No it is not, I said Durant was choking I did not deny that, I even said if he lost it would be the 3rd year in a row he lost with HCA, but I also mentioned that using the East vs West is totally different as one has continuous comp and one has no comp.

I love Lebron and want him to succeed, despite what others may think. I don't wish bad against anyone.

1) If LeBron made people worse, how did he take that scrub Cleveland team to 66 wins? Who else at that point could have taken that team to 66 wins? Mind you, Ray Allen, Haslem, Mike Miller, and Shane Battier all took much less money to play with LeBron. Their PER being down is obvious.. Do you even know how PER is calculated? I'm not even going to explain this. Blake Griffin's PER was 23.4 two years ago and it's at 23.9 this year. He's a much better player this year than two years ago. By your logic, Blake is a slightly improved player.

2) If forums weren't around till 2002-2004, that means you had a good 2-4 years to be a member. I discovered PSD much later than most but that's your proof of who you're a fan of? That's the same argument as you hating immigrants when you're one yourself. Everyone was/becomes a member with 0 posts.

3) Not even going to consider this an acceptable answer.

4) No comp but they took Miami to game 7's like you YOURSELF stated? Please, what is your argument? Are you lost?

cmellofan15
04-30-2014, 01:27 AM
why can't you admit that Durant is choking and leave it at that? why does what he is doing have to be compared with what Lebron has done?

and if you're comparing the two why not keep everything consistent. the dumb nicknames, concerns that he'll never win a ring, questioning his "clutch gene", blame him for everything that he may or may not be in control of. Only seems fair. But then again LeBron wasn't shooting thirty something percent every night...

FlashBolt
04-30-2014, 01:31 AM
why can't you admit that Durant is choking and leave it at that? why does what he is doing have to be compared with what Lebron has done?

and if you're comparing the two why not keep everything consistent. the dumb nicknames, concerns that he'll never win a ring, questioning his "clutch gene", blame him for everything that he may or may not be in control of. Only seems fair. But then again LeBron wasn't shooting thirty something percent every night...

Exactly. He has no answer to KD's inefficient series and strictly blames the conference as to why LeBron has had more success. KD is shooting 32% for Christ's sake. Not saying he's not great but no matter how good your defense is, KD shouldn't be shooting 32%. This is the guy who is the greatest scorer IMO and most unguardable player since he's quick, slim, and can shoot/handle the ball.

naps
04-30-2014, 02:24 AM
LOL everyone is falling for JB's trolling. If you have been on this forum long enough you should know JB is not typing these posts, he's just copy-pasting from his old posts. He has done this exact same trolling on LeBron ever since LeBron ditched his Bulls in 2010. JB is a clever troll though, he does it without insults and him being a long time MOD on this forum helps too.

AIverson
04-30-2014, 02:28 AM
He's not even choking, he's having a bad series and is getting shut down.

slashsnake
04-30-2014, 02:41 AM
Exactly. He has no answer to KD's inefficient series and strictly blames the conference as to why LeBron has had more success. KD is shooting 32% for Christ's sake. Not saying he's not great but no matter how good your defense is, KD shouldn't be shooting 32%. This is the guy who is the greatest scorer IMO and most unguardable player since he's quick, slim, and can shoot/handle the ball.

Good point... This one isn't about Bron. And that argument doesn't work when you look at what Lebron has done vs. the west.

Durant is just having an awful shooting series. He looks like he is trying to do too much and those contested shots which usually almost look like a waste of time against him aren't falling.

QueensG_718
04-30-2014, 02:52 AM
Its a wrap for little Scottie brooks if they end up losing this series

Im_in_Mia_bish
04-30-2014, 03:21 AM
Wasn't the bobcats a top 10 defensive team in the nba?
Nice to see all the ones jumping on Durants bandwagon refuse to get off while lebron is not only playing better, but playing in another dimension right now.

UTTER domination on every stat (advanced stats also) while playing phenomenal defense and rebounding better.

It's night and day if you compare playoffs lebron to regular season lebron.

Just a reminder that the best player in the nba still plays for the east.

Meanwhile, Durant is playing disgustingly inefficient. With a mind blowing 20 PER, before tonight's game.

Hopefully he finally gets the criticism he deserves.
He can get the MVP as a consolation prize tho if his team gets bounced.

Im_in_Mia_bish
04-30-2014, 03:23 AM
Good point... This one isn't about Bron. And that argument doesn't work when you look at what Lebron has done vs. the west.

Durant is just having an awful shooting series. He looks like he is trying to do too much and those contested shots which usually almost look like a waste of time against him aren't falling.

His assist numbers are down as well. He is trying to do way too much instead of letting the game come to him.

Meanwhile, lebron has shifted to another gear.

slashsnake
04-30-2014, 03:24 AM
1. They don't because the players don't get better with Lebron around, they get worse which is why Wade and Bosh's numbers go down despite being #2 and #4 in PER before joining forces

2. Nope not applicable, Forums weren't around until between 2002-2004, and I was here when my team was not contending, you showed up only when a team had been winning.

3. They did bring in pieces, remember a 3x finals mvp winner in Shaq and Ben Wallace both of which were on the team and Shaq outplayed LBJ in pivotal game 5 of the series vs Boston.

4. No it is not, I said Durant was choking I did not deny that, I even said if he lost it would be the 3rd year in a row he lost with HCA, but I also mentioned that using the East vs West is totally different as one has continuous comp and one has no comp.

I love Lebron and want him to succeed, despite what others may think. I don't wish bad against anyone.

1. Really... Scottie Pippen was by far at his best when Jordan stepped away. BJ Armstrong and Horace Grant too.. You want to talk about a fall off... check out Ron Harper with Jordan. So is that a negative? Of course not. Wade clearly isn't the same player he was a few years ago and that has nothing to do with Lebron. Bosh closing in on 30 doesn't look like prime Bosh either, but I doubt he's shooting that percentage leading a team on his own.

2. You were here when your team wasn't contending... like when they had Ben Wallace as a piece? Lucky they dumped that contract after his knees were no longer able to let him play. What suckers did they get to bite on that deal?

3. Shaq? 11 point 5.5 board playoff performer, 40 games from retirement taking 20 mil of your cap space Shaq is your best proof of pieces to build a long term contender? And you have to point to the one game when during a blowout, he was able to outplay lebron out of how many that year? His best impact couldn't even keep that game close. I'd personally consider game 6... the one where Shaq got outplayed by Kendrick perkins more pivotal with the season on the line there.

And Ben Wallace? The guy who was making the Chicago Ben Wallace look like a star at that point. His 2 points 4 boards and half a block in the playoffs for Cleveland while he was there is your great example of bringing in pieces to build on? He was such a big part, the team they traded him to bought out his deal and let him walk immediately.

Lakers made a move to add a piece that same month and brought in Pau Gasol to pair with Kobe.

The Mavericks made a move that month to add a piece that day and brought in Kidd and Marion to pair with Dirk

And the Cavs made their move for Ben Wallace.



I think you are making a point here with those two as your "pieces", but it isn't the one you want to make. two players for 34 million. More than Blake and CP3, more than Harden and Griffin. More than the raptors... well as much as their starting lineup, more than the spurs big 3. More than Randolph and Gasol. That is what they got out of it. Two ancient guys who couldn't play consistently with a future only looking down.

Im_in_Mia_bish
04-30-2014, 03:28 AM
He's not even choking, he's having a bad series and is getting shut down.

I'm guessing that missed ft was a result of him getting "shut down" as well right?

QueensG_718
04-30-2014, 03:29 AM
Westbrook came back into the lineup and ****ed everything up like always. Durant was beating before westbrick came back from injury. No coincidence there...all that said he still shouldn't get a pass for playing this poorly. Like someone said earlier without the 10 to 15fts a game durant is not durant

Im_in_Mia_bish
04-30-2014, 03:33 AM
Westbrook came back into the lineup and ****ed everything up like always. Durant was beating before westbrick came back from injury. No coincidence there...all that said he still shouldn't get a pass for playing this poorly. Like someone said earlier without the 10 to 15fts a game durant is not durant

IMO, without the touch fouls, Durant is not Durant.
So far he's averaging 8 FTA, 2 less than his season average.

And with the refs "letting them play" or not calling the cheap fouls that were called during the reg season, we are clearly seeing Durant play well.. Like Durant.