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View Full Version : Vogel "coaching for his job"



mjm07
04-23-2014, 12:22 PM
http://espn.go.com/nba/playoffs/2014/story/_/id/10827330/2014-nba-playoffs-frank-vogel-indiana-pacers-coaching-job

""Vogel, despite a 56-win season that secured the No. 1 seed in the Eastern Conference, is "coaching for his job" in the wake of a prolonged slide that has stretched into its third month. ""

I think he's safe b/c i believe they'll, at least, reach the ECF. Good coach, IMO. Bird definitely isn't happy.

thoughts....

NYJ - NYY
04-23-2014, 12:24 PM
As he should be... I like him but his team is in shambles... Yes they won but still look like a shell of their former selves

RipCity32
04-23-2014, 12:57 PM
Hopefully he gets fired and then the Pistons can somehow grab him.

D-Leethal
04-23-2014, 01:04 PM
The only reason expectations are so high for this team is because Vogel got them to play basketball WAY above their heads. Look at some of the guys who were in that rotation last year when they pushed Miami to the brink. Jeff Pendergraph? Sam Young?

Paul George got severely overrated based on the Pacers success. Roy Hibbert the same based on his epic playoff performances last year on the biggest stage. Were these guys ever considered franchise changing players before Vogel had them whooping ***? Vogel is going to be a victim of his own success - this team doesn't have the talent, playmakers or, requisite veteran leadership to be a 60 win perennial championship contender. Vogel had them looking like it for awhile though.

therealwd27
04-23-2014, 01:08 PM
The only reason expectations are so high for this team is because Vogel got them to play basketball WAY above their heads. Look at some of the guys who were in that rotation last year when they pushed Miami to the brink. Jeff Pendergraph? Sam Young?

Paul George got severely overrated based on the Pacers success. Roy Hibbert the same based on his epic playoff performances last year on the biggest stage. Were these guys ever considered franchise changing players before Vogel had them whooping ***? Vogel is going to be a victim of his own success - this team doesn't have the talent, playmakers of requisite veteran leadership to be a 60 win perennial contender. Vogel had them looking like it for awhile though.

This. Well said

JWorthy42
04-23-2014, 01:10 PM
Pacers: Exposed.

mjm07
04-23-2014, 01:18 PM
The only reason expectations are so high for this team is because Vogel got them to play basketball WAY above their heads. Look at some of the guys who were in that rotation last year when they pushed Miami to the brink. Jeff Pendergraph? Sam Young?

Paul George got severely overrated based on the Pacers success. Roy Hibbert the same based on his epic playoff performances last year on the biggest stage. Were these guys ever considered franchise changing players before Vogel had them whooping ***? Vogel is going to be a victim of his own success - this team doesn't have the talent, playmakers or, requisite veteran leadership to be a 60 win perennial championship contender. Vogel had them looking like it for awhile though.

Great post. Losing Granger was a bigger deal than I thought it would it. But thats on Bird. Players like PG and Stephenson have stepped up their games each year though under Vogel. I just don't see the confidence/bravado from earlier in the year. From coach down to the 15th man. But after last night they might've turned it around.

Goose17
04-23-2014, 01:27 PM
Great coach but the locker room appears to be in shambles.

I think you should look to move a few of the ego monsters on the roster before firing a high caliber coach. Truth is this could just be media B.S though.

IversonIsKrazy
04-23-2014, 03:01 PM
I don't think I can blame the turmoil of this team on Vogel. He did a great job, it's clearly locker room issues. Vogel has done an excellent job of making the most of what the team has to offer.

PacersForLife
04-23-2014, 03:01 PM
The only reason expectations are so high for this team is because Vogel got them to play basketball WAY above their heads. Look at some of the guys who were in that rotation last year when they pushed Miami to the brink. Jeff Pendergraph? Sam Young?

Paul George got severely overrated based on the Pacers success. Roy Hibbert the same based on his epic playoff performances last year on the biggest stage. Were these guys ever considered franchise changing players before Vogel had them whooping ***? Vogel is going to be a victim of his own success - this team doesn't have the talent, playmakers or, requisite veteran leadership to be a 60 win perennial championship contender. Vogel had them looking like it for awhile though.

We have a more talented bench on paper this year, so I don't really get your first point.

Paul George, to me, was never overrated. He had a great first half of the year and was in the MVP discussion and rightfully so. He fell off over time, and nobody could have really predicted that. If he kept up that production would you still be calling him overrated? He was getting talked up at THAT time, I don't think too many people are talking him up like that anymore.

To your point about George and Hibbert not being franchise changers before Vogel: It would be kinda hard considering we had a coach who would not play his young guys. I believe George was in his rookie year when Vogel took over, so it kinda makes sense that he wasn't a franchise guy. The same coach was trying to make Hibbert a skinny center who could run the floor and that's simply not who Hibbert is. Don't get me wrong, I think Vogel had a lot to do with their development, but it's not like these guys were destined to be scrubs or something.

As long as we don't end the playoffs on an embarrassing note, I think Vogel's job is safe.

GiantsSwaGG
04-23-2014, 03:46 PM
We have a more talented bench on paper this year, so I don't really get your first point.

Paul George, to me, was never overrated. He had a great first half of the year and was in the MVP discussion and rightfully so. He fell off over time, and nobody could have really predicted that. If he kept up that production would you still be calling him overrated? He was getting talked up at THAT time, I don't think too many people are talking him up like that anymore.

To your point about George and Hibbert not being franchise changers before Vogel: It would be kinda hard considering we had a coach who would not play his young guys. I believe George was in his rookie year when Vogel took over, so it kinda makes sense that he wasn't a franchise guy. The same coach was trying to make Hibbert a skinny center who could run the floor and that's simply not who Hibbert is. Don't get me wrong, I think Vogel had a lot to do with their development, but it's not like these guys were destined to be scrubs or something.

As long as we don't end the playoffs on an embarrassing note, I think Vogel's job is safe.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BjW1sFmCIAAxxKM.jpg

After these pics, George never been the same!

todu82
04-23-2014, 03:48 PM
I think if they lose in Rd. 1 or Rd. 2 Vogel will be fired. His job should be safe though if they make the East finals.

hoosiercubsfan
04-23-2014, 04:00 PM
http://espn.go.com/nba/playoffs/2014/story/_/id/10827330/2014-nba-playoffs-frank-vogel-indiana-pacers-coaching-job

""Vogel, despite a 56-win season that secured the No. 1 seed in the Eastern Conference, is "coaching for his job" in the wake of a prolonged slide that has stretched into its third month. ""

I think he's safe b/c i believe they'll, at least, reach the ECF. Good coach, IMO. Bird definitely isn't happy.

thoughts....

To be honest at first I thought this would be the case. But after listening to some of the differing opinions on local radio I don't buy into this. The only way Vogel is shown the door is if they somehow choose Lance over Vogel if Lance makes it known that he can't get along with him. That is the only way one of the local guys said they see Vogel being shown the door. Because Lance is Larry's guy. Bird thinks he has a great chance of being the best guy on the roster.

I think the team you saw last night in the second half finally started to show their pride. That (hopefully) they are getting sick and tired of getting beaten by clearly inferior competition. Problem is which team shows up tomorrow night remains to be seen. If they show up and smack the Hawks around again then it will be a bit safer to say they are back.

sunsfan88
04-23-2014, 04:24 PM
I think overpaying Hibbert started their downfall.

Deception
04-23-2014, 04:42 PM
Pistons will gladly take him. I think bringing in Bynum and Turner was their biggest issue, Granger was a great locker room presence and that speaks wonders, so game statistics don't mean anything.

Minimal
04-23-2014, 04:53 PM
The only reason expectations are so high for this team is because Vogel got them to play basketball WAY above their heads. Look at some of the guys who were in that rotation last year when they pushed Miami to the brink. Jeff Pendergraph? Sam Young?

Paul George got severely overrated based on the Pacers success. Roy Hibbert the same based on his epic playoff performances last year on the biggest stage. Were these guys ever considered franchise changing players before Vogel had them whooping ***? Vogel is going to be a victim of his own success - this team doesn't have the talent, playmakers or, requisite veteran leadership to be a 60 win perennial championship contender. Vogel had them looking like it for awhile though.
You what mate? Pacers have no talent? Pacers is one of the most stacked teams in the NBA. Paul George, David West, Roy Hibbert. Thats 3 All-stars. Lance perenial all star, sligthly overrated, but Andre Iguodala type player. Luis Scola is basically a mini Pau Gasol. Evan Turner just averaged 17/6/4 this year. George Hill is a solid point guard. And they had Granger before.
Just 3 months ago everyone was saying how stacked Pacers are and with every trade they made, they became even more stacked. Now you say they have no talent?

IndyRealist
04-23-2014, 05:33 PM
You what mate? Pacers have no talent? Pacers is one of the most stacked teams in the NBA. Paul George, David West, Roy Hibbert. Thats 3 All-stars. Lance perenial all star, sligthly overrated, but Andre Iguodala type player. Luis Scola is basically a mini Pau Gasol. Evan Turner just averaged 17/6/4 this year. George Hill is a solid point guard. And they had Granger before.
Just 3 months ago everyone was saying how stacked Pacers are and with every trade they made, they became even more stacked. Now you say they have no talent?
This is why you never cite per game averages.