PDA

View Full Version : If you were casting and MVP ballot, would Noah be in your top five?



JasonJohnHorn
04-01-2014, 05:28 AM
There be be easily 10 players in the league who are better than Noah, or at the very least a half dozen, but if there a player more important to their team's success than Noah?

I think it is clear that LBJ and KD are one and two in the voting this year (regardless of what order you put them in), but when filling out the top 5 votes, I'm curious to see how voters handle Noah. He is such an important player on both ends of the court, anchoring the defense, especially with Deng gone, and making plays on offense for other guys with Rose gone. If Noah were out, I honestly see the Bull with-20 wins without Noah. I'm not sure I could say that about any other player being removed from the roster of any other team.


Would Noah be in your top five for your MVP ballot?

CheeznWingz
04-01-2014, 05:53 AM
Not ahead of either Lowry or DeRozan.

R. Johnson#3
04-01-2014, 06:35 AM
Not ahead of either Lowry or DeRozan.

I'd have him ahead of both of them. Noah would be 3rd on my ballot. I really hope he wins it but I doubt he will. The dude has dragged a team that pretty much has nothing into the playoffs. I don't wanna hear the whole "Oh the Bulls are in the East so it's easy for him" crap. Basketball is a team game and this guy lights a fire under his team and forces them to play better. He hustles on every play, is a great passer for a big man, can rebound very well, can finish when he's in the paint and is an absolutely great defender.

JasonJohnHorn
04-01-2014, 10:08 AM
I'd have him ahead of both of them. Noah would be 3rd on my ballot. I really hope he wins it but I doubt he will. The dude has dragged a team that pretty much has nothing into the playoffs. I don't wanna hear the whole "Oh the Bulls are in the East so it's easy for him" crap. Basketball is a team game and this guy lights a fire under his team and forces them to play better. He hustles on every play, is a great passer for a big man, can rebound very well, can finish when he's in the paint and is an absolutely great defender.

+1

Slug3
04-01-2014, 10:10 AM
I feel like I would go

KD
Lebron
Blake
Harden/Noah

So I think he would be right there.

nickdymez
04-01-2014, 01:15 PM
3rd on my list...

KD
Blake
Noah

torocan
04-01-2014, 01:25 PM
3-5 is really hard to say.

1. KD
2. Lebron
3 to 5? I think you could basically do a "pick em" depending on your tastes. Harden, Noah, Curry, Griffin and even LMA (though hard to MVP a losing team) would all not be crazy choices.

If I had a gun to my head, then it's probably...

3. Griffin - No CP3 and massively elevated game on both sides of the floor
4. Harden
5. Curry - Would be 4 but too inconsistent over 48 minutes
6. Noah

While Noah has been excellent, I just can't give him as much credit since he's playing in the East and his offensive game just isn't anywhere on the tier of the top 5.

And Paul George has completely played his way out of being anywhere near the top 5 in my mind. It's gotten to the point that it's hard to call it a slump any more and you have to start thinking it's a regression.

NoahH
04-01-2014, 01:25 PM
No doubt Noah would be top 5.

OKC
04-01-2014, 01:28 PM
KD
Lebron
Noah
Blake
Al Jefferson

not sure about what order

adidas2307
04-01-2014, 01:37 PM
NBA.com/Stats ‏@nbastats

@JoakimNoah had 120 assists in the month of March. The last center to have 115+ assists in a month was Wilt (155 in March 1968), per ELIAS

Say what you will about Noah's game as a whole, but that's pretty damn impressive.

mudvayne387
04-01-2014, 01:57 PM
IDK but if the Knicks somehow get in, I wouldn't put Noah ahead of Melo in the balloting...

KD
LBJ
Blake
Melo
Noah/Harden/Curry

JasonJohnHorn
04-01-2014, 08:42 PM
KD
Lebron
Noah
Blake
Al Jefferson

not sure about what order

I love your Al Jefferson pick! I get a lot of slack for my support of him, but I think he's improved as a player, and has been huge for this team. I mean, last year, they were one of the worst teams in the league, and this year, they may finish at .500. A pretty impressive turnaround.

JasonJohnHorn
04-01-2014, 08:44 PM
IDK but if the Knicks somehow get in, I wouldn't put Noah ahead of Melo in the balloting...

KD
LBJ
Blake
Melo
Noah/Harden/Curry

Melo? Really? The Knicks are a lottery team. Without Melo they are a lottery team.
The Bulls are going to have homecourt in the first round. Without Noah they'd be in the lottery.


That is a HUGE difference.

The rest of your list is **** on a ritz.

ztilzer31
04-01-2014, 09:00 PM
I'd have him at 4.

Glad to see Noah get some due credit finally from fans. Guys been overlooked for a long time.

FriedTofuz
04-01-2014, 09:25 PM
noah is the best passing bigman in the nba. sorry demarcus.

chi-townlove1
04-01-2014, 09:46 PM
God I love the praise he's finally starting to receive. Loved him since day 1. Remarkable player and extremely smart. I would have him in top 3. Maybe even ahead of Lebron..

FriedTofuz
04-01-2014, 11:16 PM
God I love the praise he's finally starting to receive. Loved him since day 1. Remarkable player and extremely smart. I would have him in top 3. Maybe even ahead of Lebron..

See this is the problem, when a player on your team plays very well, people become irrational with their opinions and even think he's better than an MVP candidate over the past years.. dude come on.. :facepalm2:

stawka
04-01-2014, 11:27 PM
Short answer is yes

Long answer is **** yes

1 - KD
2 - LeBron
3 - Blake
4 - Noah
5 - Harden

mightybosstone
04-01-2014, 11:27 PM
I'd have to really think about, but ultimately I'd say yes. He's not one of the five most talented players in the NBA. Hell, I don't even think you could make a decent case for top 10. But the guy just makes up for it with grit, tenacity and high basketball IQ. He's an amazing help defender, a feisty rebounder and an unbelievably skilled passer for a man his size. He's 2nd in the league in DWS, 12th in the league in WS/48 and I haven't looked, but it's safe to say he's the only guy in the league averaging 12/12/5/2 right now. You take him off that Bulls team, and I think they'd be lucky to have 25 wins right now, much less be fighting for HCA in the first round of the playoffs.

I'd probably rank my top 10 MVP candidates as such:
1. Kevin Durant
2. Lebron James
3. Blake Griffin
4. James Harden (bit of a homer pick, but there's a legit case there)
5. Joakim Noah
6. Stephen Curry
7. Goran Dragic
8. Kevin Love
9. Kyle Lowry
10. Paul George/Al Jefferson/LaMarcus Aldridge

Pierzynski4Prez
04-02-2014, 12:04 AM
If he could just score a bit more, he'd be a lock for 3rd or 4th I think.

Crackadalic
04-02-2014, 12:07 AM
For the season no doubt

FriedTofuz
04-02-2014, 02:46 AM
THis is unbelievable. Here's my list.

Durant
Lebron
Paul
Griffin
Harden
Dragic
Curry


are all a higher MVP candidate than Noah. I respect noah, I think he's definitely the MVP of the bulls right now, but no way is he ranked top 5...

effen5
04-02-2014, 02:51 AM
THis is unbelievable. Here's my list.

Durant
Lebron
Paul
Griffin
Harden
Dragic
Curry


are all a higher MVP candidate than Noah. I respect noah, I think he's definitely the MVP of the bulls right now, but no way is he ranked top 5...

So you have Paul and Griffin...both on the same team, harden who plays with Dwight, and then Dragicthen Curry. Who exactly does Noah play with on the Bulls...?

FriedTofuz
04-02-2014, 02:54 AM
So you have Paul and Griffin...both on the same team, harden who plays with Dwight, and then Dragicthen Curry. Who exactly does Noah play with on the Bulls...?

thibs. THibs would make any team a playoff team. just like pops;.

Tony_Starks
04-02-2014, 02:56 AM
KD
Blake
Lebron
Noah
Aldridge

Chrisclover
04-02-2014, 03:03 AM
4th. behind Durant, LBJ, Griffin. He is a surprise in a sense that the Bulls were thought to give up the season after the injury of Rose. But Noah steps up and take them to 4th in the East. If they are in the cutthroat West, they would likely be out of the playoffs. Given this, he is just 4th or 5th.

effen5
04-02-2014, 03:06 AM
thibs. THibs would make any team a playoff team. just like pops;.

Again, while Thibs (imo should be COY) is coaching this team, Noah still has to perform and he has.

sunsfan88
04-02-2014, 03:11 AM
Definitely.

ztilzer31
04-02-2014, 03:18 AM
God I love the praise he's finally starting to receive. Loved him since day 1. Remarkable player and extremely smart. I would have him in top 3. Maybe even ahead of Lebron..


I'd understand if they were the 2 seed getting 55 wins, but hold the phone bro. If LBJ was on that team instead of Noah there easily at least the 2.

I understand because it's your team, but he's just not at THAT level.

abe_froman
04-02-2014, 03:20 AM
thibs. THibs would make any team a playoff team. just like pops;.

really? lucas-neal-bennett-udoh-scare ,would be a playoff team? thibs is a great coach,arguably the best right now,but coaches are nothing without the talent

ztilzer31
04-02-2014, 03:26 AM
thibs. THibs would make any team a playoff team. just like pops;.

That's weird lol. Because if they were in the Western Conference they wouldn't be in the playoffs...

Doc Rivers is pretty good coach too you know :).

ztilzer31
04-02-2014, 03:29 AM
People totally sleeping on Duncan :(.

SPURSFAN1
04-02-2014, 03:31 AM
Top 5? Good thing april fools is over.

ztilzer31
04-02-2014, 03:33 AM
Top 5? Good thing april fools is over.

Hater alert.

chi-townlove1
04-02-2014, 11:20 AM
God I love the praise he's finally starting to receive. Loved him since day 1. Remarkable player and extremely smart. I would have him in top 3. Maybe even ahead of Lebron..

See this is the problem, when a player on your team plays very well, people become irrational with their opinions and even think he's better than an MVP candidate over the past years.. dude come on.. :facepalm2:


That's not irrational. You get your panties in a bunch because god forbid someone plays better than "the king". Never said Noah is a better player. But I truly believe Noah is more valuable to the bulls than Lebron is to the heat. That sir, is far from irrational.

celtNYpatsHeels
04-02-2014, 11:28 AM
Here is a Bulls hater opinion.

Yes hes top 5

Durant
Lebron
Griffin
Harden
Noah.

Noah edges out Paul George

72 Wins
04-02-2014, 12:04 PM
^ At this rate, Paul George will be lucky if he's in the top 10.

Agree.. Noah is in my top 5 for sure. Either 4 or 5 following:

Durant
Lebron
Griffin

85BearsDefense
04-02-2014, 12:05 PM
See this is the problem, when a player on your team plays very well, people become irrational with their opinions and even think he's better than an MVP candidate over the past years.. dude come on.. :facepalm2:

See you don't understand what MVP actually means. It is not the best player in the game, if it was it would be Lebrons award every year. The term MVP stands for Most Valuable Player.

If you took Lebron off of Miami, Miami finishes with a top 3 seed in the East at worst.

Take Noah off of Chicago and Chicago likely misses the playoffs.

In terms of pure value purposes Noah outweighs Lebron in terms of his value on this Bulls team. Its pretty simple.

missionh1llpart
04-02-2014, 12:19 PM
Nah, I thought Noah was overrated and factually inaccurate.

FriedTofuz
04-02-2014, 12:40 PM
See you don't understand what MVP actually means. It is not the best player in the game, if it was it would be Lebrons award every year. The term MVP stands for Most Valuable Player.

If you took Lebron off of Miami, Miami finishes with a top 3 seed in the East at worst.

Take Noah off of Chicago and Chicago likely misses the playoffs.

In terms of pure value purposes Noah outweighs Lebron in terms of his value on this Bulls team. Its pretty simple.

Put lebron back on the cavs, and they from a lottery team to the 2nd seed. Put Noah on the cavs and they might just make the playoffs.

FriedTofuz
04-02-2014, 12:46 PM
See the problem with this thread and the definition of MVP is why people are sounded a tad irrational

MVP is defined as the most valuable player in the league. No, not just to their team, and no, not who just has the best numbers. Noah is indeed valuable to his team, take him off his team and they bulls will miss the playoffs, take lebron off the heat and they'll just drop a seed or two. THat however, doesnt mean Lebron isnt valuable, it simply means that there are other factors which make a team better ( like the heat having wade and bosh)

So you cant isolate someone for MVP based on their impact to their team. IF you put lebron on any team in the nba, they become a contender. If you put Noah on any team in the league, it will improve their team, but not to the point where they are a contender. Lebron is universal no matter where he goes, noah is not. I'm not discrediting noah's play he has been playing tremendous. He's dropping more Dimes than D-rose would have over the last 20 games and his scoring numbers have been up. That doesnt mean he's a top 5 MVP candidate.

85BearsDefense
04-02-2014, 12:54 PM
Put lebron back on the cavs, and they from a lottery team to the 2nd seed. Put Noah on the cavs and they might just make the playoffs.

You don't know that.

In terms of value in today's NBA so Noah on the Bulls and Lebron on the Heat you can easily argue that Noah is more valuable to the Bulls than Lebron is to Miami.

slashsnake
04-02-2014, 03:12 PM
MVP is a tough one. It isn't just individual stats but also team success.

In the East you get a lot of easy teams to beat up on. Chicago being 12-17 vs. the West this year really has me wondering if that team is good enough to call a quality team worthy of having an MVP on it. Based on their record vs. that conference they'd be around .500 as a western conference team or right there with Minnesota who I think would be able to say is nothing without Love.

Look at those two on/off the court. Chicago is MUCH better with Noah. +140 when he is out there, -64 when he is on the bench. that is a big switch. But for Love it is like +400 and -200. That is insane, and they are giving up now, so I think it comes back down a little on that disparity, but wow. When he is on the floor his team is outscoring opponents at the same rate as Miami with Lebron. Just when he goes to the bench, they are putrid.

So the teams are pretty close to me. Not to say I have a problem with Noah top 5. But I don't think his teams performance merits him being up there with guys like Lebron and Durant this year. Just like Love's teams performance doesn't merit him winning the award. I'd call what Aldridge, Curry and Randolph have done for their teams records closer to Noah than James/Durant.

Asik's better
04-02-2014, 04:43 PM
Yep top 5.
Durant
James
Noah
Griffin
Toss up between harden, curry and Aldridge

Shammyguy3
04-02-2014, 05:28 PM
Nah, I thought Noah was overrated and factually inaccurate.

what does this even mean

chi-townlove1
04-02-2014, 05:43 PM
^ he's trying to be funny and refer to the new movie Noah, which wasn't as good as I hope for it to be.

FriedTofuz
04-02-2014, 06:26 PM
You don't know that.

In terms of value in today's NBA so Noah on the Bulls and Lebron on the Heat you can easily argue that Noah is more valuable to the Bulls than Lebron is to Miami.
That isnt what MVP is. MVP is regarded league wide, not just for your team. Leading your team is important but to be the LEAGUE MVP you have to be the best in the LEAGUE, not your team.


ANd yes I do know that, in fact everyone has known that. Lebron led the cavs to seasons with 60 wins, took him off the cavs and they were the worst team in the league. Noah would not have the same effect. When D-rose was out last year, Noah was leading the bulls along with robinson and THibs coaching, but no way would his impact on any team be considered MVP league-wide.

Stick to the facts, I'm getting tired explaining the same thing over and over again.

abe_froman
04-02-2014, 06:46 PM
That isnt what MVP is. MVP is regarded league wide, not just for your team. Leading your team is important but to be the LEAGUE MVP you have to be the best in the LEAGUE, not your team.
.
no ,it isnt.go look at all mvp winners ,it doesnt always go to best in the league(at no time was rose,ai,nash,barkley,ect. the best in the league)


not saying noah should get it,kd has it locked up(deservedly so),but just that your assertion is wrong

Shammyguy3
04-02-2014, 07:41 PM
what abe said

Noah deserves recognition, but if you have him not in your top 5 i won't hate it because of performances from (excluding the obvious Durant, Lebron, Griffin, Harden, Curry, etc) players like Lowry or Dragic or Marc Gasol as well. But Noah's in my top-5 without question

Grizzly Adams
04-02-2014, 08:32 PM
Absolutely. It is becoming cliche when discussing the intangibles that Noah brings, but it still doesn't make them any less existent. He has established himself in all areas of the game to become the undisputed leader of the team. He has welcomed the challenge of being depleted on paper without Rose or Deng, and has been making everyone around him playing better and with more passion. The emotion, desire, and hustle he displays on the court is infectious. These factors make him stand out from the rest of the league. His numbers aren't as high as other candidates and there are other great team leaders, but I still have him in my top 5 as of now.

rhino17
04-03-2014, 11:30 AM
Definitely top 5

4/5 along with harden is where I would put him, top 3 are obvious

85BearsDefense
04-04-2014, 10:55 AM
That isnt what MVP is. MVP is regarded league wide, not just for your team. Leading your team is important but to be the LEAGUE MVP you have to be the best in the LEAGUE, not your team.


ANd yes I do know that, in fact everyone has known that. Lebron led the cavs to seasons with 60 wins, took him off the cavs and they were the worst team in the league. Noah would not have the same effect. When D-rose was out last year, Noah was leading the bulls along with robinson and THibs coaching, but no way would his impact on any team be considered MVP league-wide.

Stick to the facts, I'm getting tired explaining the same thing over and over again.


See this is wrong, MVP is not regarded as the best player. You're telling me that Rose was better than Lebron? Karl Malone better than Jordan in 98? Please. MVP is Most VALUABLE Player. VALUABLE, you have to understand what that means. The Bulls are a 3 seed, take Noah off, maybe an 8 seed, maybe miss the playoffs. Take Lebron off Miami and the Heat are still a top 3 seed at worse. You take Noah off this Bulls team and they win 20 games max. I'm tempted to say less, they would be significantly worse.

D-Leethal
04-04-2014, 11:38 AM
Yes - and I'm not sure there are 10 dudes more impactful than him in the NBA if that's what you mean by "better".

pacofunk64
04-04-2014, 12:08 PM
They really need to change the wording of the award. It's hard to argue that anyone is more valuable that Noah. I think the Thunder would still be really good. The Heat would drop but not as much as what i think the Bulls would without Noah. This roster without Noah and Rose would win 23 games.

slashsnake
04-04-2014, 12:51 PM
See this is wrong, MVP is not regarded as the best player. You're telling me that Rose was better than Lebron? Karl Malone better than Jordan in 98? Please. MVP is Most VALUABLE Player. VALUABLE, you have to understand what that means. The Bulls are a 3 seed, take Noah off, maybe an 8 seed, maybe miss the playoffs. Take Lebron off Miami and the Heat are still a top 3 seed at worse. You take Noah off this Bulls team and they win 20 games max. I'm tempted to say less, they would be significantly worse.

Put the Bulls in the west and they miss the post-season with or without him. Put the Heat in the west and with Lebron, they make the post-season but miss it without him. The heat are a great team with Lebron, not without him. The bulls aren't a great team with or without Noah. I think the Timberwolves could be worse than the 76ers without Love and would be a top 4-5 seed in the East if they played there just like Chicago. Doesn't mean Love is my MVP.


I think for MVP I will take the great playing player making his team great in Lebron or Durant, over the very good playing player making his team good like Noah. Sorry but it is.


And I am not sure your definition is right. The league awards the Podloff trophy to the "best performing player of the season". Not to the most valuable to one of the 32 NBA teams, but the most valued to the league.

Stinkyoutsider
04-04-2014, 12:53 PM
I would put Noah in the top 5 this year. He's so important for our team. Especially with Boozer's decline, Rose being out, and Deng being gone.