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View Full Version : Are the 1st round pick demands in the NBA now creating a dead trade deadline?



KniCks4LiFe
02-15-2014, 02:20 PM
Is it really the importance of want a 1st rd. pick? is that what's going on. Is that why teams are so gun shy?

A team like Dallas who goes under the cap in 2015, the West is a free for all.

A team like Golden State who's offense is suffering and has the $9M TPE can't get anything going in trade discussions

OKC who is actively armed w/ a$12M TPE and can't risk not having another option to help KD if Westbrook isn't 100%?

The Rockets, do they really believe they are winning the West as currently constructed?

Toronto what's the deal? are you in or just trolling the league w/ Massiah?

I know SAS will do something. But I'm just shocked how the Bulls will stand pat or a team like BOS is waiting to get into S&T scenerio w/ Rondo and have yet to really shop Bradley or Jeff Green. Don't even get me started on the NY teams.

I also look at a team like the Sixers, who have Young and Turner and Hawes, and again, they don't want to deal these kids b/c they can't get 1st rd picks for them?

So in short, are the draft pick demands the new kryptonite to the trade deadline deals? what's going on?

Goose17
02-15-2014, 02:25 PM
You're jumping the gun. Most big deals won't go down until a couple of days before the deadline.

Warriors "Can't get anything going in discussions" lol what? Golden State has been in talks with people all season long.

KniCks4LiFe
02-15-2014, 02:26 PM
You're jumping the gun. Most big deals won't go down until a couple of days before the deadline. "Can't get anything going in discussions" lol what?

And Golden State has been in talks with people all season long.

Like? I haven't seen it posted around here and heard on ESPN they haven't. I mean other than Jordan Crawford.

JEDean89
02-15-2014, 02:34 PM
there will be plenty of trades at the dealine, though yes, teams are overvalueing 1st round picks. the CBA has made them much more valuable, especially lottery picks.

KniCks4LiFe
02-15-2014, 02:39 PM
‏@mcten Feb 13
Mitch Kupchak on the upcoming NBA trade deadline: "Going into the weekend, it's pretty quiet right now."

I mean.

KniCks4LiFe
02-15-2014, 02:41 PM
there will be plenty of trades at the dealine, though yes, teams are overvalueing 1st round picks. the CBA has made them much more valuable, especially lottery picks.

Immensely. Teams that don't even know what they are going to do w/ those picks. I ****s w/ a team like PHX they know a pick isn't that much more valuable than the actual NBA player.

Cal827
02-15-2014, 02:54 PM
Is this really a surprise? I mean, with some of the potential players on the block, teams know once they are moved, that they will be going into a rebuild. Which is why teams are trying to get as many future picks as possible, to try and develop them under THEIR system. It's always like that.

For example, the Knicks offered up Shumpert, and World Peace for Lowry a few months ago (I believe). World Peace is just there for cap purposes, but then again, also extends another year of salary for Toronto to take on. Shumpert is young, but there are a couple issues. First of all, he's a SG or a SF if I'm not mistaken. On the Raptors, those two positions are pretty much covered by Derozan/Ross/Salmons. What he means to the Knicks is much more than what he would mean to the Raptors. He would have to not only break into the rotation under our coach, but learn the team's playbook. Acquiring him would also leave a massive hole at the 1 for us. Why not get a pick to fill that hole (or another one that might form) from the team who put them in the hole to begin with? Although, (from a neutral point of view), I think it would make sense for the Knicks to hold onto the picks that they have an build from within (especially with the risk of him leaving). Perhaps try and chase someone else who is more proven with the pick (Like Kevin Love)



I would say that the resistance to giving up first rounders is starting to create a dead trade deadline lol but I guess it's pretty much the same thing.

On your point from before, I think that Ujiri had decided to hold onto Lowry from anybody (of course unless some team offers something nuts). As a Raptor fan, I'm hoping that it doesn't backfire lol

ManRam
02-15-2014, 02:57 PM
I think it's gonna be another quiet deadline.


I do think there are more potential buyers than sellers in all honesty, I just think most those teams looking to improve also have an eye on the future. First round demands make it tough. The luxury tax makes it extra tough. A strong and deep draft makes it more tough. An eye on some potentially huge upcoming free agencies doesn't help either.

slaker619
02-15-2014, 03:02 PM
I don't think in factors in as much as you believe cause this draft looking pretty weak, I think teams are more beneficial trying to get a good trade

BoSox47
02-15-2014, 03:03 PM
Cant speak for many other teams about their "team trade dealine news" but for the celtics i know they are open to trading everyone and anyone. They just will be asking for someone to break the bank on rondo. Everyone knows that Rondo is coming off injury and everyone in Boston doesn't think he will be moved until the offseason around draft time(if he actually is traded). The Celtics have already traded away Courtney Lee and Jordan Crawford. Their current asking price for Bass, Bradley and Green are all first round picks(obviously will be later in the first round due to the buyers being all playoff teams).

Some think the Celtics asking price might be high as first rounders, but to put it into comparison, the Celtics got a first round draft pick for Jordan Crawford which is protected and could turn into two second rounders. However a late first round pick in my mind isnt too far out of the question. Jeff Greens contract being 2 more years after this season doesn't help his situation but its not entirely to bad considering he could be a good third option on a team and even a great fourth option if a team can afford him.

KniCks4LiFe
02-15-2014, 03:03 PM
I think it's gonna be another quiet deadline.


I do think there are more potential buyers than sellers in all honesty, I just think most those teams looking to improve also have an eye on the future. First round demands make it tough. The luxury tax makes it extra tough. A strong and deep draft makes it more tough. An eye on some potentially huge upcoming free agencies doesn't help either.

So what teams are locking their selves into in the east is tanking for picks and selling ifs to a fan base. I don't just mean the middle of the pact teams. I mean the teams that clearly are using the picks and trying to bring up kids to excuse mediocre play. Or the bad GMs that really don't know how to use a pick to make a playoff run adding a potential 2nd or 3rd option player.

KniCks4LiFe
02-15-2014, 03:09 PM
Cant speak for many other teams about their "team trade dealine news" but for the celtics i know they are open to trading everyone and anyone. They just will be asking for someone to break the bank on rondo. Everyone knows that Rondo is coming off injury and everyone in Boston doesn't think he will be moved until the offseason around draft time(if he actually is traded). The Celtics have already traded away Courtney Lee and Jordan Crawford. Their current asking price for Bass, Bradley and Green are all first round picks(obviously will be later in the first round due to the buyers being all playoff teams).

Yeh I think draft day they deal him [Rondo]. But I just think you find more desperate teams now.


Some think the Celtics asking price might be high as first rounders, but to put it into comparison, the Celtics got a first round draft pick for Jordan Crawford which is protected and could turn into two second rounders. However a late first round pick in my mind isnt too far out of the question. Jeff Greens contract being 2 more years after this season doesn't help his situation but its not entirely to bad considering he could be a good third option on a team and even a great fourth option if a team can afford him.

Jeff Green could help some teams. But I do see why BOS doesn't sell this early w/ his contract. But I mean teams like the east 3-11, what is the deal?

BoSox47
02-15-2014, 03:14 PM
Yeh I think draft day they deal him [Rondo]. But I just think you find more desperate teams now.



Jeff Green could help some teams. But I do see why BOS doesn't sell this early w/ his contract. But I mean teams like the east 3-11, what is the deal?

Im not sure what the deal is with that. The celtics arent going to be a contender for a few years, ive been thinking maybe they are waiting a year or so to deal him. They have 2 draft picks this year and two next year both in the first round. Possibly based of a pure value stand point the Celtics might be thinking they can hold onto him and deal him next year when they can get more back for him with less years on his contract. Less of a commitment for others teams with an extra season off his contract next year, also being a team thats in a rebuilding phase, it really doesnt matter if they keep him and hope his value rises rather then just selling out quickly.

Could also be teams dont want to commit to Jeff Green that long though not sure. He can definitely be a good piece to a contender considering they have the cap space but honestly 3 years(two years at end of this season) at 8 million a year is not bad in my mind for jeff green. Just the length might make people think twice

KniCks4LiFe
02-15-2014, 03:21 PM
Im not sure what the deal is with that. The celtics arent going to be a contender for a few years, ive been thinking maybe they are waiting a year or so to deal him. They have 2 draft picks this year and two next year both in the first round. Possibly based of a pure value stand point the Celtics might be thinking they can hold onto him and deal him next year when they can get more back for him with less years on his contract. Less of a commitment for others teams with an extra season off his contract next year, also being a team thats in a rebuilding phase, it really doesnt matter if they keep him and hope his value rises rather then just selling out quickly.

Could also be teams dont want to commit to Jeff Green that long though not sure. He can definitely be a good piece to a contender considering they have the cap space but honestly 3 years(two years at end of this season) at 8 million a year is not bad in my mind for jeff green. Just the length might make people think twice

You know what I'm learning the past 5-6 yrs. for the NBA? A lot of GMs just suck. And are using the picks as an excuse.

Look at Derrick Rose, I feel sorry for this brotha. For the last 5 yrs. he's been busting his *** off, and the last 2 yrs. rushing back to play w/ Carlos Boozer?

Or look at Kyrie Irving, lets not get started w/ this Cavs management.

The Wiz, John Wall, Brad Beal and who? Ariza?

In the West there are fewer examples of this, but it's just been bugging me.

Rndy
02-15-2014, 03:23 PM
We'll have to see how the deadline goes but most teams want first round picks in everything now with the stupid cap restrictions first round picks have more value than ever.

KniCks4LiFe
02-15-2014, 03:26 PM
We'll have to see how the deadline goes but most teams want first round picks in everything now with the stupid cap restrictions first round picks have more value than ever.

We're slowly going to get to the point that they will add 3 yr. opt. outs to an NBA prospect. B/c this is just promoting tanking and making picks more valuable than actually building a team.

mdm692
02-15-2014, 03:26 PM
Immensely. Teams that don't even know what they are going to do w/ those picks. I ****s w/ a team like PHX they know a pick isn't that much more valuable than the actual NBA player.

Exactly. BUT just because it's not much mre valuable that doesn't mean we're going to give them away. For instance the Lakers. Let me just clarify that I think it's bs and that probably won't happen but the rumor has LA wanted the Washington pick(15-20 range) along with another late 1st and Okafor for a 3 month rental of Gasol. I REPEAT ITS JUST A RUMOR but if it's actually true and FO are demanding picks like in the Gasol case then this trade deadline will be pretty boring.

Goose17
02-15-2014, 03:29 PM
Like? I haven't seen it posted around here and heard on ESPN they haven't. I mean other than Jordan Crawford.

Lacob stated that they've been getting calls from teams about Klay all season. But they're not looking to trade him or Barnes unless it's for someone elite.

For other deals, looking for bench help they've most recently discussed Kirk Hinrich and Gary Neal and there was a rumour about Brandon Bass.

KniCks4LiFe
02-15-2014, 03:29 PM
Exactly. BUT just because it's not much mre valuable that doesn't mean we're going to give them away. For instance the Lakers. Let me just clarify that I think it's bs and that probably won't happen but the rumor has LA wanted the Washington pick(15-20 range) along with another late 1st and Okafor for a 3 month rental of Gasol. I REPEAT ITS JUST A RUMOR but if it's actually true and FO are demanding picks like in the Gasol case then this trade deadline will be pretty boring.

That's ridiculous! You see what I mean? they already have a lotto pick, WTH?


Lacob stated that they've been getting calls from teams about Klay all season. But they're not looking to trade him or Barnes unless it's for someone elite.

For other deals, looking for bench help they've most recently discussed Kirk Hinrich and Gary Neal and there was a rumour about Brandon Bass.

Thanks, it's the first time I hear about these deals.

BoSox47
02-15-2014, 03:31 PM
We'll have to see how the deadline goes but most teams want first round picks in everything now with the stupid cap restrictions first round picks have more value than ever.

How many teams have good players that come out in the 22-30 range and are huge parts of their team for years to come? not many. The only reason i want the celtics to get another first rounder or two over the next couple drafts is to package them to a team so that they can move up in the draft a spot or two and get their guy. Players in the later part of the draft are ussually decent role plays or good bench players. While those are always welcome i would think a team would pick up the likes of a Jeff Green or an Avery Bradly(one of the better on ball defenders in the league).

I mean i know contracts are a factor and matching up salaries, but Brandon Bass, Jeff Green and Avery Bradly could all be very good additions to many teams, especially true contenders. If your team is going to finish with a 22-30 would you not think about taking on one of those guys yourself?

astrosmaniac
02-15-2014, 03:31 PM
You know what I'm learning the past 5-6 yrs. for the NBA? A lot of GMs just suck. And are using the picks as an excuse.

Look at Derrick Rose, I feel sorry for this brotha. For the last 5 yrs. he's been busting his *** off, and the last 2 yrs. rushing back to play w/ Carlos Boozer?

Or look at Kyrie Irving, lets not get started w/ this Cavs management.

The Wiz, John Wall, Brad Beal and who? Ariza?

In the West there are fewer examples of this, but it's just been bugging me.
I mean the last time we saw a healthy Rose for a full season they had the best record in the east. They built a really good team that revolved around 1 guy. That guy then got hurt. So I don't blame the bulls management (except for having to abide by a fairly cheap owner's wishes).

Shammyguy3
02-15-2014, 03:31 PM
We're slowly going to get to the point that they will add 3 yr. opt. outs to an NBA prospect. B/c this is just promoting tanking and making picks more valuable than actually building a team.

This would never happen. And the whole "promoting tanking" thing is ridiculous as well. Bad teams will lose games because they are BAD and traded their better players for something of more use for a rebuilding team.

People must understand that tanking doesn't exist in the light they think. Proper rebuilding is all of a sudden "tanking" and is associated with a negative feeling.

-Kobe24-TJ19-
02-15-2014, 03:32 PM
That's ridiculous! You see what I mean? they already have a lotto pick, WTH?



Thanks, it's the first time I hear about these deals.

we aint trading for the sake of it like knicks

P&GRealist
02-15-2014, 03:34 PM
Biggest trade that will go down would be some random *** thing like Matthew Dellavedova to the Bucks for a future 2nd round pick and cash considerations.


Gotta love the NBA!

mdm692
02-15-2014, 03:40 PM
we aint trading for the sake of it like knicks

That ain't trading for the sake of it lol. LA raped Memphis on the Gasol trade and now LA is trying to rape Phx in a Gasol trade lol. Personally I think they're just trying to recover one of those 2 wasted picks that turned into Nash.

SeoulBeatz
02-15-2014, 03:43 PM
I also look at a team like the Sixers, who have Young and Turner and Hawes, and again, they don't want to deal these kids b/c they can't get 1st rd picks for them?



Well in the Sixers case, why would they want anything besides picks? They will have the most cap space in the league, they are the 2nd worst team in the NBA. They have no reason to acquire vets or bad contracts unless there's a pick tied to them. It would be beyond stupid for the Sixers to try to trade for a player who would improve this team THIS season.

And since other teams in the league value their 1sts in this draft extremely high, it's not very likely to snag one for Spence, Thad or E.T, hence the stalemate.

KniCks4LiFe
02-15-2014, 03:52 PM
we aint trading for the sake of it like knicks

what does that have to do w/ anything? I mean Gasol either walks for free as a end of the line vet, it's not like WAS is disrespecting the Lakers. A pick for Gasol and expirings are more than enough.

LJEATON26
02-16-2014, 10:20 AM
Okc is rumored to be looking for a two way wing. I would be okay with avery bradley, afflalo or korver but I doubt presti will part with jackson, lamb and pj3.

Goose17
02-16-2014, 10:33 AM
Okc is rumored to be looking for a two way wing. I would be okay with avery bradley, afflalo or korver but I doubt presti will part with jackson, lamb and pj3.

Deng.

LOL. Imagine having Deng coming off the bench for OKC.

Goose17
02-16-2014, 10:33 AM
Maybe a three team trade, grab yourself P.J Tucker and get Deng to Phoenix?

BoSox47
02-16-2014, 11:03 AM
Okc is rumored to be looking for a two way wing. I would be okay with avery bradley, afflalo or korver but I doubt presti will part with jackson, lamb and pj3.

Dont see atlanta giving up korver and afflalo will command a decent return. Bradley would cost OKC their first round pick. Bradley definitely being the cheapest/most easily obtainable.

LJEATON26
02-16-2014, 11:29 AM
Dont see atlanta giving up korver and afflalo will command a decent return. Bradley would cost OKC their first round pick. Bradley definitely being the cheapest/most easily obtainable.

I would be okay with a sefolosha and first for bradley. Thing I didn't know about the Hawks is if they are going to be buyers or sellers at the deadline. Earlier in the season I could see them buying but with their recent struggles since horford went down I could see them staying neutral or even being sellers and trying to move towards the lottery.

Goose17
02-16-2014, 11:36 AM
I would be okay with a sefolosha and first for bradley. Thing I didn't know about the Hawks is if they are going to be buyers or sellers at the deadline. Earlier in the season I could see them buying but with their recent struggles since horford went down I could see them staying neutral or even being
sellers and trying to move towards the lottery.

I doubt Atlanta makes any moves.

OKC could pull in some decent talent if they involved a third team. Depends on how much of a "two way" player they're looking for. Are they just wanting a defender that can score a little better than Thabo? Or are they looking for a guy who scores well and holds his own defensively but isn't that great?

What about C.J Miles?

Vinylman
02-16-2014, 12:38 PM
That ain't trading for the sake of it lol. LA raped Memphis on the Gasol trade and now LA is trying to rape Phx in a Gasol trade lol. Personally I think they're just trying to recover one of those 2 wasted picks that turned into Nash.

mitch has always overvalued his players... lakers will take cap relief and one first rounder at the end of the day. If we get better that is great...

What i actually think they are trying to do is put a deal together where they get a first and trade enough players to get under the LT threshold...

LJEATON26
02-16-2014, 01:00 PM
I doubt Atlanta makes any moves.

OKC could pull in some decent talent if they involved a third team. Depends on how much of a "two way" player they're looking for. Are they just wanting a defender that can score a little better than Thabo? Or are they looking for a guy who scores well and holds his own defensively but isn't that great?

What about C.J Miles?

I've looked at miles but I doubt presti would give up a first for a 4 month rental. Same with trevor ariza. Presti places a ton of value in his picks and young prospects.

Vinylman
02-16-2014, 01:06 PM
I've looked at miles but I doubt presti would give up a first for a 4 month rental. Same with trevor ariza. Presti places a ton of value in his picks and young prospects.

Does OKC have a large TPE left or is the martin one for $6.5 million it?

I was just wondering if there was a way to get Gasol to OKC while getting them to take nash's deal :)

BoSox47
02-16-2014, 01:24 PM
I would be okay with a sefolosha and first for bradley. Thing I didn't know about the Hawks is if they are going to be buyers or sellers at the deadline. Earlier in the season I could see them buying but with their recent struggles since horford went down I could see them staying neutral or even being sellers and trying to move towards the lottery.

Yes true, atlanta is a wild card in that aspect. I also agree Sefolosha and a first for bradley could get the deal done. Would be interesting to see if that gets rumored at all actually.

ManRam
02-16-2014, 01:41 PM
Does OKC have a large TPE left or is the martin one for $6.5 million it?

I was just wondering if there was a way to get Gasol to OKC while getting them to take nash's deal :)

I know there are reports that they're dangling that TPE, but they're only $2.5M under the luxury tax threshold and they've shown in the past a complete and utter refusal to go over it. I'd bet a huge amount of money that they wouldn't even consider taking on Nash's contract. They're very fiscally aware, not reckless.

I don't think there's any reason to assume they'll blow over the tax threshold. I think when lobbing trade idea around it's worth keeping in mind too

Vinylman
02-16-2014, 02:00 PM
I know there are reports that they're dangling that TPE, but they're only $2.5M under the luxury tax threshold and they've shown in the past a complete and utter refusal to go over it. I'd bet a huge amount of money that they wouldn't even consider taking on Nash's contract. They're very fiscally aware, not reckless.

I don't think there's any reason to assume they'll blow over the tax threshold. I think when lobbing trade idea around it's worth keeping in mind too


I hear ya on the LT Threshold. But do you think they would blow through it one year to get a Pau type rental?

It is obvious this is Nash's last year which should make it only a 1 year gamble plus Pau is expiring and it could put them in a good position to sign him cheaply this summer if they win it all... The Lakers would have to take someone like porkins back in a gasol deal but that would be pretty easy imo for them since they will need a center anyway. It is probably moot anyway since OKC doesn't have a big enough TPE to take on Nash.

I know it is a long shot but i would love to see gasol go to OKC some how.

KniCks4LiFe
02-16-2014, 02:17 PM
Okc is rumored to be looking for a two way wing. I would be okay with avery bradley, afflalo or korver but I doubt presti will part with jackson, lamb and pj3.

hmm.. doubt we see a 2 way but I can see a CJ Miles who's stuck in CLE.

wizardsfan3
02-16-2014, 02:22 PM
You know what I'm learning the past 5-6 yrs. for the NBA? A lot of GMs just suck. And are using the picks as an excuse.

Look at Derrick Rose, I feel sorry for this brotha. For the last 5 yrs. he's been busting his *** off, and the last 2 yrs. rushing back to play w/ Carlos Boozer?

Or look at Kyrie Irving, lets not get started w/ this Cavs management.

The Wiz, John Wall, Brad Beal and who? Ariza?

In the West there are fewer examples of this, but it's just been bugging me.

You must not watch many Wizards games if you don't think Ariza is a big factor on that team.

KniCks4LiFe
02-16-2014, 02:30 PM
You must not watch many Wizards games if you don't think Ariza is a big factor on that team.

I didn't say he was.

LJEATON26
02-16-2014, 02:32 PM
Thunder won't go over the luxury tax this season at all. They know they will be over it next season so they will try to avoid the repeater tax.

ManRam
02-16-2014, 02:35 PM
I hear ya on the LT Threshold. But do you think they would blow through it one year to get a Pau type rental?

It is obvious this is Nash's last year which should make it only a 1 year gamble plus Pau is expiring and it could put them in a good position to sign him cheaply this summer if they win it all... The Lakers would have to take someone like porkins back in a gasol deal but that would be pretty easy imo for them since they will need a center anyway. It is probably moot anyway since OKC doesn't have a big enough TPE to take on Nash.

I know it is a long shot but i would love to see gasol go to OKC some how.

No.

Unless their ownership has a sudden and drastic change of heart that convinces them that they can afford to do something most every other team in the league is terrified to do.

It's not happening. The repeater tax is too brutal for a team so cash conscious.

The Lakers being 100% against taking on contracts past this year means it's an impossible trade.

Vinylman
02-16-2014, 04:54 PM
No.

Unless their ownership has a sudden and drastic change of heart that convinces them that they can afford to do something most every other team in the league is terrified to do.

It's not happening. The repeater tax is too brutal for a team so cash conscious.

The Lakers being 100% against taking on contracts past this year means it's an impossible trade.

gotcha... i didn't realize how much they had under contract for next year... they might even have to amnesty porkins... still would like to see pau on that team

Kyben36
02-16-2014, 05:13 PM
yes, this draft has so much hype people just wont give up picks.

theducksmuggler
02-16-2014, 05:23 PM
Ill just take one please for either Evan Turner, Spencer Hawes, or Thad Young...thats all i ask!

Goose17
02-16-2014, 05:31 PM
Ill just take one please for either Evan Turner, Spencer Hawes, or Thad Young...thats all i ask!

I see no reason you guys shouldn't be able to sign and trade Hawes for a first round pick and a player or two. It probably won't be a lotto pick though, or maybe a late lotto pick at best.

Turner and Thad... will be interesting to see what happens. Personally I would like to see Thad in Phoenix but the Suns fans don't seem to like that idea lol.

jsthornton7
02-16-2014, 05:52 PM
I think 1st round picks can be overrated in the hands of a team that already has a young core. One thing that GMs might not be realizing is how easy it was last offseason to sign quality role players to cheap short term contracts.

Another reason is that teams with multiple picks moving forward probably want to keep the option of trading their picks to move up in the draft and get a much higher ranked player. in this supposedly great 2014 draft.

Goose17
02-16-2014, 06:01 PM
I don't understand why teams are so reluctant to move their picks for proven talent. They must know something I don't, I feel this draft class is being overrated somewhat.

KniCks4LiFe
02-16-2014, 06:06 PM
I don't understand why teams are so reluctant to move their picks for proven talent. They must know something I don't, I feel this draft class is being overrated somewhat.

it's top maybe 18 deep, but not pass that. I mean you got to be 100% w/ your scouting to get something after 14.

KniCks4LiFe
02-16-2014, 06:07 PM
A guy I'm shocked not to hear a trade proposal for is Derrick Williams in SAC. I mean the guy is starting to become productive and a damn good defender.

MagicBucsSox
02-16-2014, 06:12 PM
Okc is rumored to be looking for a two way wing. I would be okay with avery bradley, afflalo or korver but I doubt presti will part with jackson, lamb and pj3.

Lol none of those guys are 2 way but Affalo

KniCks4LiFe
02-16-2014, 06:27 PM
Lol none of those guys are 2 way but Affalo

Affalo? for those guys? I can see Lamb. Well if I'm OKC I want Affalo but if I'm ORL I want a pick too and an TPE for 2015.

So a Jeremy Lamb/pick, they'd need a 3rd team, and the TPE would have to be used. It's difficult to call. But I can see Affalo being moved there if the pieces are right.

KniCks4LiFe
02-16-2014, 06:44 PM
how much is the repeater tax the Lakers have to pay if they don't deal Gasol?

jsthornton7
02-16-2014, 07:00 PM
how much is the repeater tax the Lakers have to pay if they don't deal Gasol?


Here is part of an interview w/ Kupchak on NBA.com

Q: On the luxury tax and if it has any implications on the team making moves around the deadline this year:
Kupchak: It’s not a big concern at all. It’s not a big concern at all.

Q: On the repeater tax and how much that affects decisions:
Kupchak: We have to be out of it two years (out of five) and if we were out of it this year, that would be one year, but it’s going to be very difficult to be a repeater in the next two years by virtue of all the free agents we have. If you’re in the repeater tax by $30 million, you get killed. If you’re in the repeater tax by $1.5 million or $2 million, it’s really inconsequential. So yes, you try to manage your payroll so you’re not in the tax and you don’t really need to know that there’s a repeater tax looming, but at the end of the day, it depends on the team you have, how well you’re playing, if you’re winning and if you’re going to pay a tax, how much of a tax is it and is it worth it? We’ve paid a tax many years here and it’s been worth it.

ManRam
02-16-2014, 07:07 PM
how much is the repeater tax the Lakers have to pay if they don't deal Gasol?

As long as they aren't over the threshold next year, which seems very likely considering how many FAs they have, it's not gonna really cripple them all that much. Their tax bill won't be as much this year as last year, and if they stay under next year than they'll survive.

Trading Pau is FAR from a necessity. And considering he's an expiring there is in some ways good incentive for the Lakers just to keep him and let him expire rather than bring on any contracts for 2014-15.

The Bynum trade made a ton of sense because they could have let him go and could have gotten out of the tax this year and again be in decent shape to avoid it next year. They'd be able to spend as much as they want the following years to an extent. Trading Gasol for guaranteed contracts this year doesn't help them much financially. Maybe they get a few million dollars less coming back at them, but that's not enough to get under the tax and they're not cash-strapped.

Staying out of the tax 2 years out of 5 is huge. They could have done the Bynum trade and gotten out of it this year and probably next year, but they didn't. So, since there's no possible trade like that available now, there's no reason to desperately shop him.


The repeater tax is still a little confusing, but that's what I've gathered lately.

jsthornton7
02-16-2014, 07:23 PM
As long as they aren't over the threshold next year, which seems very likely considering how many FAs they have, it's not gonna really cripple them all that much. Their tax bill won't be as much this year as last year, and if they stay under next year than they'll survive.

Trading Pau is FAR from a necessity. And considering he's an expiring there is in some ways good incentive for the Lakers just to keep him and let him expire rather than bring on any contracts for 2014-15.

The Bynum trade made a ton of sense because they could have let him go and could have gotten out of the tax this year and again be in decent shape to avoid it next year. They'd be able to spend as much as they want the following years to an extent. Trading Gasol for guaranteed contracts this year doesn't help them much financially. Maybe they get a few million dollars less coming back at them, but that's not enough to get under the tax and they're not cash-strapped.

Staying out of the tax 2 years out of 5 is huge. They could have done the Bynum trade and gotten out of it this year and probably next year, but they didn't. So, since there's no possible trade like that available now, there's no reason to desperately shop him.


The repeater tax is still a little confusing, but that's what I've gathered lately.

Basically, we are around 7m over the tax threshold. So some combo of trading Blake + Kaman, Blake + Hill, or Hill + Kaman can get us under the line for this season.

A Pau for Okafor trade would still require the Lakers to make another deal to get under, but as stated above, it's not necessary for LAL to trade Pau to get under.

Vinylman
02-16-2014, 09:25 PM
Basically, we are around 7m over the tax threshold. So some combo of trading Blake + Kaman, Blake + Hill, or Hill + Kaman can get us under the line for this season.

A Pau for Okafor trade would still require the Lakers to make another deal to get under, but as stated above, it's not necessary for LAL to trade Pau to get under.


PHoenix is under both the cap and the LT threshold... blake and pau for okafor gets it done pretty much... remember... not all the salaries count against the LT threshold (ie vet mins, etc..)

not to mention guys like kaman can be bought out

mgsports
02-16-2014, 09:54 PM
So could Okafor. Just one Trade make more to follow. Bucks have Players to move so do Bobcats and so on. Glen Davis maybe for Frye if the Magic can get a starting PF in same deal if it's a 3 way.

jsthornton7
02-16-2014, 10:10 PM
PHoenix is under both the cap and the LT threshold... blake and pau for okafor gets it done pretty much... remember... not all the salaries count against the LT threshold (ie vet mins, etc..)

not to mention guys like kaman can be bought out

A Blake + Pau for Okafor deal wouldn't work. The most the Lakers could add in a deal for Okafor would be around 500k.

I do think that Steve Blake and Chris Kaman have value around the league. Plenty of teams are looking for low post scoring and I know that a few teams need a PG and are looking at Luke Ridnour, who has a similar salary and isn't as good IMO.

Drummond#1
02-16-2014, 11:00 PM
For the players that are on the block I think this is what teams could realistically get:

Irving (lottery pick this year and two future first rounders)
Tristan Thompson (mid first rounder think Bobcats or Mavs pick)
Dion Waiters (mid first rounder)
Shumpert (2 second rounders)
Bradley (2 second rounders)
Jeff Green (1 first rounder + second rounders)
Moose Monroe (lottery pick or two future first rounders)
Lowry (lottery pick and future first)
Pau Gasol (expiring contract and a couple second rounders)
KLove (it would have to be more than a top pick and future picks)

I think that is still overpaying for Kyrie but some idiot GM would probably over trade for him.

mgsports
02-17-2014, 09:37 AM
No way Love or Lowry are being Trade. Minnesota has others to Trade. Raptors aren't in any talks right know. We might see a couple of Blockbusters just so ESPN/NBATV and Message Boards have something to talk about because a small Trade doesn't need it's own Thread.

Vinylman
02-17-2014, 10:23 AM
A Blake + Pau for Okafor deal wouldn't work. The most the Lakers could add in a deal for Okafor would be around 500k.

I do think that Steve Blake and Chris Kaman have value around the league. Plenty of teams are looking for low post scoring and I know that a few teams need a PG and are looking at Luke Ridnour, who has a similar salary and isn't as good IMO.

two separate trades probably work since we will have to throw in the cash to pay blakes remaining salary...

Can we still send cash under the new CBA for matching? If not we could include a second rounder and have phoenix send us a second rounder in the Pau deal which would basically wash.

KniCks4LiFe
02-17-2014, 01:24 PM
Trade talk at All-Star weekend has been "as slow as it's been in a long time," said one executive who has not received a single phone call. A lot of teams have made it known which players they are open to moving, but the problem is finding trade partners. Very few teams are willing to part with premium draft picks or take on future salary, which are the two key drivers for trades. - CBSSports.com

These teams don't get it. It's not about just picks man. The draft is still a shot in the barrel and players like Thaddeus Young, Evan Turner, Aaron Affalo and a few more, they are actual NBA seasoned players that could help a franchise go somewhere.

JasonJohnHorn
02-17-2014, 01:30 PM
I think in the two weeks prior to the All-Star game there is an unwritten rule not to do any trades, just because you could end up moving a West All-Star to the East or vice versa.

that said, yes, first-rounders used to be dumped in a heartbeat for a quality starter, but now teams seem to really value them.


I'm not sure why. I would take a guy I KNOW to be a quality starter over a pick beyond to-7 unless I knew there were 10+ All-Stars in the draft (which NEVER happens).

I think seeing teams like Brooklyn and NY and LAL trade off first round picks and seeing it come back to bite them in the @$$ has caused a lot of teams to move away from that, but at the same times, these teams gave up multiple first rounders, not one. One seems reasonable for a guy like Turner or Hawes to be honest, so long as it is top-5 protected.

KniCks4LiFe
02-17-2014, 01:36 PM
I think in the two weeks prior to the All-Star game there is an unwritten rule not to do any trades, just because you could end up moving a West All-Star to the East or vice versa.

that said, yes, first-rounders used to be dumped in a heartbeat for a quality starter, but now teams seem to really value them.


I'm not sure why. I would take a guy I KNOW to be a quality starter over a pick beyond to-7 unless I knew there were 10+ All-Stars in the draft (which NEVER happens).

I think seeing teams like Brooklyn and NY and LAL trade off first round picks and seeing it come back to bite them in the @$$ has caused a lot of teams to move away from that, but at the same times, these teams gave up multiple first rounders, not one. One seems reasonable for a guy like Turner or Hawes to be honest, so long as it is top-5 protected.

And that's the problem. I mean ok we get it NY ****ed up. LAL ****ed up. Their GMs ****ed up, so now this league is becoming a copy cat league. A first rd. pick is what's stopping teams from acquiring a Thaddeus Young? a well developed NBA starter? these picks are "ifs" "IFS!" this is showing me how bad the NBA front offices actually are.

What team has made starters out of the most of their 1st rd picks? in the NBA? I bet these GM don't know. I'm not saying don't be careful w/ them or don't protect them, but don't overrate them either.

astrosmaniac
02-17-2014, 05:00 PM
I think the thought is that these GMs have confidence in their ability to draft a productive rotation member for their team with a first round pick (whether that confidence is warranted or not). If the pick works, then they have 4 years of cheap control. If it doesn't, it's 2 years of cheap, roster minimum salary. They are betting on getting the next chandler parsons, carl landry, or chase budinger if it's a late first (just some examples from my favorite team). Those types of players all cost around MLE or more type money.

Obviously if you're in the lotto you are looking for a starter/star guy.

albertajaysfan
02-17-2014, 05:15 PM
A Blake + Pau for Okafor deal wouldn't work. The most the Lakers could add in a deal for Okafor would be around 500k.

I do think that Steve Blake and Chris Kaman have value around the league. Plenty of teams are looking for low post scoring and I know that a few teams need a PG and are looking at Luke Ridnour, who has a similar salary and isn't as good IMO.

I thought Phoenix have roughly 8mil in cap space though?

That would mean the trade would work. I have no idea why Phoenix would do it but I am pretty sure the trade works from a financial standpoint.

ManRam
02-17-2014, 05:19 PM
I think seeing teams like Brooklyn and NY and LAL trade off first round picks and seeing it come back to bite them in the @$$ has caused a lot of teams to move away from that, but at the same times, these teams gave up multiple first rounders, not one. One seems reasonable for a guy like Turner or Hawes to be honest, so long as it is top-5 protected.

You can add Denver trading Afflalo and a 1st essentially for Iggy to that. They could potentially have had two lottery picks this year. That's the rental thing gone pretty bad.

TrueFan420
02-17-2014, 07:31 PM
A Blake + Pau for Okafor deal wouldn't work. The most the Lakers could add in a deal for Okafor would be around 500k.

I do think that Steve Blake and Chris Kaman have value around the league. Plenty of teams are looking for low post scoring and I know that a few teams need a PG and are looking at Luke Ridnour, who has a similar salary and isn't as good IMO.

You think your front office would do Blake for the warriors 4 million trade exception from Rush. You get instant savings and we get our backup pg that can run a unit.

TrueFan420
02-17-2014, 07:33 PM
These teams don't get it. It's not about just picks man. The draft is still a shot in the barrel and players like Thaddeus Young, Evan Turner, Aaron Affalo and a few more, they are actual NBA seasoned players that could help a franchise go somewhere.

Thing is those 3 players are all gonna want to be paid. If the deal is too pricey they might prefer to gamble if their team isn't read just yet.

Vinylman
02-18-2014, 08:47 AM
You think your front office would do Blake for the warriors 4 million trade exception from Rush. You get instant savings and we get our backup pg that can run a unit.

Depends on other deals but if it is one of multiple pieces to get them under the LT I would say yes...

probably cost you a second rounder though

TrueFan420
02-18-2014, 02:00 PM
Depends on other deals but if it is one of multiple pieces to get them under the LT I would say yes...

probably cost you a second rounder though
Yea I figured it would most likely be a deal after gasol has been moved and adding a second rounder is fine by me. I think the move would really help the warriors second unit.

Tony_Starks
02-18-2014, 07:08 PM
I think it'll be relatively little action. It's not just people stockpiling picks but the new CBA really restricitve for trades. Most of the teams that don't have a shot want to just get under the cap and tank....

NBA_Starter
02-18-2014, 10:59 PM
I think it is because I know I wouldn't want my team to trade any firsts.

jsthornton7
02-19-2014, 05:08 AM
two separate trades probably work since we will have to throw in the cash to pay blakes remaining salary...

Can we still send cash under the new CBA for matching? If not we could include a second rounder and have phoenix send us a second rounder in the Pau deal which would basically wash.

According to the new CBA up to $3.2M (2013-2014) in cash can be sent or received; however cash cannot be used to match salaries.

jsthornton7
02-19-2014, 05:11 AM
I thought Phoenix have roughly 8mil in cap space though?

That would mean the trade would work. I have no idea why Phoenix would do it but I am pretty sure the trade works from a financial standpoint.

I think PHX has about $5M in cap space. A straight up trade of Pau for Okafor works, but if LAL were to add any player with a salary over about $500K in addition to Pau, it doesn't work financially.

I.E. The only player LAL could add would be Ryan Kelly.

jsthornton7
02-19-2014, 05:13 AM
You think your front office would do Blake for the warriors 4 million trade exception from Rush. You get instant savings and we get our backup pg that can run a unit.

I think Blake would be an amazing fit in GS and I would love to see Blake contribute on a team that has a shot at the finals. GS would probably have to give up a second rounder tho.

P&GRealist
02-19-2014, 05:23 AM
I think Blake would be an amazing fit in GS and I would love to see Blake contribute on a team that has a shot at the finals. GS would probably have to give up a second rounder tho.

The Warriors really miss the veteran guard Jarrett Jack off their bench. A guy like Blake would help fill that void. That's a no brainier trade in my eyes for the Warriors if they wanna go anywhere in the playoffs. Having a guy who can run the offense, hit the 3, and work hard on defense and give it his all will help the Warriors in the long run.

My dream is Pau to PHX for Okafor and a first. Blake to the Warriors for the second rounder. Hill to the Nets for a second rounder. And Kaman to the Cavs for a second rounder.

If the Lakers can come away with 1 first rounder, 3 second rounders, getting under the luxury tax and cap relief for the future, they will be the biggest winners of this yrs trade deadline.

TrueFan420
02-19-2014, 05:26 AM
I think Blake would be an amazing fit in GS and I would love to see Blake contribute on a team that has a shot at the finals. GS would probably have to give up a second rounder tho.
Would have no problem adding a second rounder

jsthornton7
02-19-2014, 05:27 AM
The Warriors really miss the veteran guard Jarrett Jack off their bench. A guy like Blake would help fill that void. That's a no brainier trade in my eyes for the Warriors if they wanna go anywhere in the playoffs. Having a guy who can run the offense, hit the 3, and work hard on defense and give it his all will help the Warriors in the long run.

My dream is Pau to PHX for Okafor and a first. Blake to the Warriors for the second rounder. Hill to the Nets for a second rounder. And Kaman to the Cavs for a second rounder.

If the Lakers can come away with 1 first rounder, 3 second rounders, getting under the luxury tax and cap relief for the future, they will be the biggest winners of this yrs trade deadline.

I agree, that would be a nice haul for players that are going to leave anyways. 36 hours left before we find out :)

TrueFan420
02-19-2014, 05:28 AM
The Warriors really miss the veteran guard Jarrett Jack off their bench. A guy like Blake would help fill that void. That's a no brainier trade in my eyes for the Warriors if they wanna go anywhere in the playoffs. Having a guy who can run the offense, hit the 3, and work hard on defense and give it his all will help the Warriors in the long run.

My dream is Pau to PHX for Okafor and a first. Blake to the Warriors for the second rounder. Hill to the Nets for a second rounder. And Kaman to the Cavs for a second rounder.

If the Lakers can come away with 1 first rounder, 3 second rounders, getting under the luxury tax and cap relief for the future, they will be the biggest winners of this yrs trade deadline.
Forget sending hill to the nets for a second rounder send him to the Warriors with Blake and will send you two seconds and the TPE.

jsthornton7
02-19-2014, 05:29 AM
Would have no problem adding a second rounder

To be honest, I'm surprised Blake's name isn't mentioned more often in trade rumors. I think it might be concerns about his elbow.

jsthornton7
02-19-2014, 05:31 AM
Forget sending hill to the nets for a second rounder send him to the Warriors with Blake and will send you two seconds and the TPE.

I don't think the Nets can afford to pay $17M for Hill. What picks does GS have available?

EDIT: Looks like GS has traded their 2nd round pick in 2014, 2015, 2016, 2017, 2018 and 1st round picks in 2014, 2017. I don't think a deal can be done with GS.

P&GRealist
02-19-2014, 05:34 AM
I agree, that would be a nice haul for players that are going to leave anyways. 36 hours left before we find out :)

Watch the Lakers idiotically give up their lotto pick to get someone like Luol Deng or something LOL.

jsthornton7
02-19-2014, 05:39 AM
Watch the Lakers idiotically give up their lotto pick to get someone like Luol Deng or something LOL.

Watch CLE blow the pick LOL

P&GRealist
02-19-2014, 06:13 AM
Watch CLE blow the pick LOL

Dan LOLbert

TrueFan420
02-19-2014, 02:04 PM
I don't think the Nets can afford to pay $17M for Hill. What picks does GS have available?

EDIT: Looks like GS has traded their 2nd round pick in 2014, 2015, 2016, 2017, 2018 and 1st round picks in 2014, 2017. I don't think a deal can be done with GS.
We can always buy a pick but I didn't realize we didn't have that many second unavailable

jsthornton7
02-19-2014, 03:16 PM
Not looking likely we trade Pau. Jordan Hill is reportedly of interest to several teams, including PHX.

AIMelo=KillaDUO
02-19-2014, 03:35 PM
Problly, but atleast they're not wasting anybodies time. By going over trades that teams have no interest in.

By making their minimum expectations public, will show who really bout that life.