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View Full Version : why does melo not share the blame for ny's struggles?



blahblahyoutoo
02-13-2014, 08:02 PM
http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=10451487

everyone says how he has no help.
well no **** sherlock, you forced half the starting lineup when you demanded that trade.

maybe if you had signed in the off season, the knicks would actually have assets to give you some needed help.
mosgov, chandler, gallo, 2 draft picks. even if you couldn't keep everyone, you could've flipped those for something.

you have no one to blame but yourself!

bholly
02-13-2014, 08:07 PM
Pretty sure he's taken a tonne of blame. Stephen A Smith saying something doesn't mean it's a popular view or correct or even that it makes sense.

JEDean89
02-13-2014, 09:21 PM
Melo's definitely to blame for the lack of team assets but his play has been the only reason they have 20 wins. the knicks are a very good team when felton scores in double digits and shoots over 40% from the field. their guard play is a disgrace to the sport.

NYJ - NYY
02-13-2014, 09:54 PM
Melo's definitely to blame for the lack of team assets but his play has been the only reason they have 20 wins. the knicks are a very good team when felton scores in double digits and shoots over 40% from the field. their guard play is a disgrace to the sport.

Agree on all accounts he plays his heart out and has no help and Felton is terrible like him
But terrible

elledaddy
02-13-2014, 10:01 PM
Whats your deal with the Knicks fam? You post in every knicks Game thread even though you are clearly not a Knicks fan. Now you bringing up players thats 2 years removed from this team. You mean to tell me that in your world, Melo doesnt get the blame for his teams not winning playoffs series or his team not making it to the Championship? Thats been the main knock on his entire career.

KnicksorBust
02-13-2014, 10:04 PM
He is averaging 27ppg-9rpg-3apg... gets to the foul line...hits 40% from 3...plays the low block... runs pick and rolls... he is doing everything he can. We have the worst backcourt in the NBA. Our coach is atrocious this season. There are so many bigger issues to blame.

blahblahyoutoo
02-13-2014, 10:07 PM
He is averaging 27ppg-9rpg-3apg... gets to the foul line...hits 40% from 3...plays the low block... runs pick and rolls... he is doing everything he can. We have the worst backcourt in the NBA. Our coach is atrocious this season. There are so many bigger issues to blame.

right. so you blame lack of help right?
guess why he has no help.

blahblahyoutoo
02-13-2014, 10:08 PM
Whats your deal with the Knicks fam? You post in every knicks Game thread even though you are clearly not a Knicks fan. Now you bringing up players thats 2 years removed from this team. You mean to tell me that in your world, Melo doesnt get the blame for his teams not winning playoffs series or his team not making it to the Championship? Thats been the main knock on his entire career.
melo raped my dog once.

Jamiecballer
02-13-2014, 10:10 PM
his play is almost identical to last year when they won 54 in almost every respect

:shrug: maybe it's not his fault?

NYJ - NYY
02-13-2014, 10:10 PM
He is averaging 27ppg-9rpg-3apg... gets to the foul line...hits 40% from 3...plays the low block... runs pick and rolls... he is doing everything he can. We have the worst backcourt in the NBA. Our coach is atrocious this season. There are so many bigger issues to blame.

right. so you blame lack of help right?
guess why he has no help.

You know the same team won 54 games last year? Went to game 6 with the pacers? Soooooo ... Now it's that team not shooting or showing up like last year not in melo

KnicksorBust
02-13-2014, 10:18 PM
He is averaging 27ppg-9rpg-3apg... gets to the foul line...hits 40% from 3...plays the low block... runs pick and rolls... he is doing everything he can. We have the worst backcourt in the NBA. Our coach is atrocious this season. There are so many bigger issues to blame.

right. so you blame lack of help right?
guess why he has no help.

Because Felton and JR have both regressed significantly? Shumpert has been wildly inconsistent? Chandler and Kmart (our best interior defenders) have dealt with injury issues? Our coach has made terrible decisions with adjustments and rotations? How can you possibly put any of that on him?

KnicksorBust
02-13-2014, 10:18 PM
his play is almost identical to last year when they won 54 in almost every respect

:shrug: maybe it's not his fault?

Smart guy.

TorontoHuskies
02-13-2014, 10:19 PM
He shouldn't share it he should take it because he's the problem.

blahblahyoutoo
02-13-2014, 11:57 PM
Because Felton and JR have both regressed significantly? Shumpert has been wildly inconsistent? Chandler and Kmart (our best interior defenders) have dealt with injury issues? Our coach has made terrible decisions with adjustments and rotations? How can you possibly put any of that on him?

so... they've regressed to their mean?
or do you really think they're contending with shumper, JR and felton? that's the group you want to go up against MIA and IND with?
or wilson chandler and gallo, or perhaps a couple of other nice pieces you could've gotten for them and the picks?

Melo got the team/city he wanted by forcing pieces out, got the coach he wanted by forcing the other one out. this situation is his doing, but knicks fans give him a pass.

Jamiecballer
02-14-2014, 12:15 AM
so... they've regressed to their mean?
or do you really think they're contending with shumper, JR and felton? that's the group you want to go up against MIA and IND with?
or wilson chandler and gallo, or perhaps a couple of other nice pieces you could've gotten for them and the picks?

Melo got the team/city he wanted by forcing pieces out, got the coach he wanted by forcing the other one out. this situation is his doing, but knicks fans give him a pass.

Melo is responsible for their ceiling, not their terrible season. it really shouldn't be hard to have a winning record with Melo on the roster, regardless of whether you think he's selfish or inefficient. and yet there they are, welllll below .500

LanceUpperCut
02-14-2014, 12:22 AM
I wouldn't blame Melo for the trade blame Masai Ujiri for getting the best of Donnie Walsh.

This is the problem with the superstars they want a 1/3 of the payroll and then wonder why theirs no help. Duncan was smart he spreads the wealth and his team is consistent winner for his whole career, LBJ took less to create a winner. Melo's a great scorer but doesn't seem to understand the team concept that the true stars have and that's why he will never lead a team to a title.

KniCks4LiFe
02-14-2014, 12:29 AM
Melo is responsible for their ceiling, not their terrible season. it really shouldn't be hard to have a winning record with Melo on the roster, regardless of whether you think he's selfish or inefficient. and yet there they are, welllll below .500

Thank you. And again as much as I am w/ trading Melo I do not fully blame him. But again another anti-Melo thread. Deron Williams aka Casper gets away w/ murder in NYC.

Tony_Starks
02-14-2014, 12:53 AM
Playing with Felton, Bargs, and JR? Dude should be in the MVP discussion....

JEDean89
02-14-2014, 12:57 AM
right. so you blame lack of help right?
guess why he has no help.

while melo is definitely largely to blame for the lack of help, you are short sited in your understanding. gallo is out for the year, chandler has missed more games than he's played since being traded and Mozgov is meh, ok not great. Chandler and Mozzy are not helping the abysmal guard play that has plagued this season. Maybe they could have traded them for a better PG, but Amare's far more to blame than Melo, at least Melo is tradeable.

TorontoHuskies
02-14-2014, 01:23 AM
I wouldn't blame Melo for the trade blame Masai Ujiri for getting the best of Donnie Walsh.

This is the problem with the superstars they want a 1/3 of the payroll and then wonder why theirs no help. Duncan was smart he spreads the wealth and his team is consistent winner for his whole career, LBJ took less to create a winner. Melo's a great scorer but doesn't seem to understand the team concept that the true stars have and that's why he will never lead a team to a title.

Ujiri removes more cancer than a dermatologist ...Bargs out, Gay out, Melo out

amak316
02-14-2014, 01:54 AM
Funny that PG is their biggest hole but Melo drove Lin out because he wasn't willing to share his spotlight.

Not that it matters but it seems like Dolan decided to give Melo whatever team he wanted and the end result was a heap of garbage. Now Melo is ready to book it next year after setting NY back another dozen years or so, it's a shame because NY fans are great and they deserved better.

blahblahyoutoo
02-14-2014, 10:08 AM
Melo is responsible for their ceiling, not their terrible season. it really shouldn't be hard to have a winning record with Melo on the roster, regardless of whether you think he's selfish or inefficient. and yet there they are, welllll below .500

you fail to see the point. it's not about his skills. it's about how he has no help because he had them all traded away.

Jamiecballer
02-14-2014, 10:15 AM
you fail to see the point. it's not about his skills. it's about how he has no help because he had them all traded away.

no, i see your point.

but he's got enough talent on this years team to be a solid team, and the thread title was why does melo not share the blame for ny's struggles. i assumed you were referring to how terrible they are this year.

bagwell368
02-14-2014, 10:31 AM
Melo is Melo. He can score, he's an OK rebounder; he can't/won pass or play D, so there is only so far he can take a team. I have noticed he seems to shoot well early in games and badly in the 4th quarter, and he's playing a ton of minutes. Simple solution, play him 5 minutes less a game and build a roster with talent and diversity.

therealwd27
02-14-2014, 10:31 AM
He is averaging 27ppg-9rpg-3apg... gets to the foul line...hits 40% from 3...plays the low block... runs pick and rolls... he is doing everything he can. We have the worst backcourt in the NBA. Our coach is atrocious this season. There are so many bigger issues to blame.

Pretty much This. And I hate the Knicks lol but a lot of this is on Woodson and his man crush for Ray Felton

Yankeefan213
02-14-2014, 10:43 AM
Melo is Melo. He can score, he's an OK rebounder; he can't/won pass or play D, so there is only so far he can take a team. I have noticed he seems to shoot well early in games and badly in the 4th quarter, and he's playing a ton of minutes. Simple solution, play him 5 minutes less a game and build a roster with talent and diversity.

His rebounding is above average IMO. He averages 8.6 per game. And when he gets doubled he passes out of it almost every single time, nobody ever makes the shot though. *cough* Felton, *cough* JR, *cough* Shumpert.

Ill21
02-14-2014, 10:49 AM
He is averaging 27ppg-9rpg-3apg... gets to the foul line...hits 40% from 3...plays the low block... runs pick and rolls... he is doing everything he can. We have the worst backcourt in the NBA. Our coach is atrocious this season. There are so many bigger issues to blame.

Yup, Melo is doing everything he possibly can to help this team win. It just does not help when your starting PG is the worst PG in the NBA. Your starting SG is a 36 year old back up PG. Your SF is one of the biggest head cases in the NBA. Oh and Tyson Chandler in the most inept offensive center in the NBA, only way he can score is on ally-oops. You would think after being in the league for nearly 10 years he would have developed some sort of post game.

The knicks ****ed everything up after they got Melo, starting with wasting their amnesty on Billups.

Ill21
02-14-2014, 10:53 AM
you fail to see the point. it's not about his skills. it's about how he has no help because he had them all traded away.

Chandler is a decent role player, has regressed since he left the Knicks.
Gallo has all-star potential but he has not stayed heathy since he left
Felton unfortunately found his way back with the knicks
Mozgov is a good back up
The 2014 pick is now the most valuable asset the knicks traded but there was no way to determine that when the trade was made. Wiggins and parker were Freshman in High School.

bucketss
02-14-2014, 10:57 AM
they should have traded for lowry, they were scared masai would have embarrassed them , i guess masai gets the last laugh again :)

D-Leethal
02-14-2014, 11:20 AM
Melo is having arguably the best season of his career, he has upped his game, he is producing what is expected of him AND THAN SOME.

Now, lets go down the list:

Felton - huge drop off from last year, worst starter in the NBA
Shumpert - huge drop off from his late season play last year, one of the worst starters in the NBA
Smith - huge drop off from last year, started playing better about a week ago
Tyson - huge regression once again, not a difference maker on D at all this year
Amare - scores the ball efficiently, doesn't do anything to contribute to Ws, makes every 5 man combination he plays with worse

Its not too hard to see why Melo doesn't get the blame. Even Doug Collins has said this season Melo is playing harder than he's ever played in his career, he's taken these losses to heart and while he might not always play smart, nobody can question his effort this year. Melo doesn't share the blame because he doesn't deserve the blame, not this year. He's doing everything we can possibly expect out of him.

Goose17
02-14-2014, 11:23 AM
Melo to is a massive part of the reason that they suck.

Knicks need to trade him asap. Make sure you get something back before he just walks away and leaves you with nothing.

D-Leethal
02-14-2014, 11:29 AM
Melo to is a massive part of the reason that they suck.

Add some color to that nonsense or GTFO.

letsgoo
02-14-2014, 11:42 AM
It's because nobody thinks he's relevant in the NBA.

letsgoo
02-14-2014, 11:42 AM
Nobody thinks he'll ever be relevant when they watch his game.

FYL_McVeezy
02-14-2014, 11:45 AM
http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=10451487

everyone says how he has no help.
well no **** sherlock, you forced half the starting lineup when you demanded that trade.

maybe if you had signed in the off season, the knicks would actually have assets to give you some needed help.
mosgov, chandler, gallo, 2 draft picks. even if you couldn't keep everyone, you could've flipped those for something.

you have no one to blame but yourself!

Who's not blaming Melo for this ********?

He's been playing great the last 2 seasons....making great strides in his overall game...but the fact remains that he forced the Knicks to gut the team to obtain him so that he could sign his extension before the lockout(so he could get more money.)

For that reason, I really don't feel bad for him. Part of this is his fault.....

letsgoo
02-14-2014, 11:49 AM
I think he does share the blame though. Nobody really considers him a top player.

tr3ymill3r
02-14-2014, 12:00 PM
http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=10451487

everyone says how he has no help.
well no **** sherlock, you forced half the starting lineup when you demanded that trade.

maybe if you had signed in the off season, the knicks would actually have assets to give you some needed help.
mosgov, chandler, gallo, 2 draft picks. even if you couldn't keep everyone, you could've flipped those for something.

you have no one to blame but yourself!

The Knicks didn't have to trade for him. They chose to trade for him while everyone said just wait til the off season. It wasn't as if the Knicks were ever at any point in position to win a championship by adding Melo at that point in the season. Knicks failed Melo more than Melo has failed the Knicks.

85BearsDefense
02-14-2014, 12:32 PM
What superstar outside Lebron would find success on that team? Serious question. Outside of Chandler and Shump who plays defense?

nycericanguy
02-14-2014, 12:47 PM
Melo has done nothing but win his entire career, even going back to Syracuse. This is looking like it will be his first losing season ever though unless they can turn it around.

Felton has always sucked, but now he's added injury issues and is having his worst season ever...

Really outside of Melo there isn't a single player on their roster even playing to their career averages, let alone having a good season.

Last year Felton was at least average, Shump & JR were decent, and Chandler was better and played more.

But the real elephant in the room is this, Amare has been healthy this year, and that's not a good thing for NY. He's a guy NY is basically forced to play due to his stature and salary. but the truth is the 8-9 points he gives NY comes at the expense of everything else in his game being a negative at this point.

The knicks are 8-5 this year when Amare doesn't play, WITH Amare they are 12-27. Coincidence?

Well lets go back 3 years,

WITH Amare 50-65

Without Amare 60-25

Basically the KNicks have been one of the best teams in the NBA when Amare doesn't play... and a lottery team when he does.

Amare has 15 assists all year... he does nothing but score... he's the real ball stopper on NY... he's gotten slower and worse on defense and he clogs the lanes. He takes away minutes from high energy guys like Tyler that actually help NY win. I love the guy, but I said before the season if he was healthy it might hurt more than help.

KniCks4LiFe
02-14-2014, 12:57 PM
Wait it's Stat's fault now? Com'on now. LOLS

Crackadalic
02-14-2014, 12:59 PM
Wait it's Stat's fault now? Com'on now. LOLS

Damn I'm loving some walmart cake

Sactown
02-14-2014, 01:13 PM
Honestly to me, it's just another example of the separation between the Elite players and the star players

Not to bash Melo but he is what he is , a great scorer who rebounds well for his position.. he isn't always going to be efficient but he will get his.

But saying he's doing what he did last year is just more proof that when players go down he is still going to do what he does.. he isn't going to take on the responsibility of getting more assists are grabbing more boards or defending at a higher level .. that's why he's just a star player and not one of the elite

KniCks4LiFe
02-14-2014, 01:19 PM
Damn I'm loving some walmart cake

everyone needs a walmart cake in their life. :laugh2:

2-ONE-5
02-14-2014, 01:30 PM
ball stoppers dont win

desertlakeshow
02-14-2014, 01:36 PM
GM's build teams, both good and bad.

It is not the players responsibility to take pay cuts or less than optimum contracts to aid a GM to attract more and better talent.

I am not a Knicks fan or a Melo fan, but I see no problem here.

2-ONE-5
02-14-2014, 02:37 PM
GM's build teams, both good and bad.

It is not the players responsibility to take pay cuts or less than optimum contracts to aid a GM to attract more and better talent.

I am not a Knicks fan or a Melo fan, but I see no problem here.

they might not be resonsilbe to take a pay cut but look at Miami and OKC their best players took pay cuts to help ensure the best roster they can get.

Chronz
02-14-2014, 02:53 PM
Because only Melo fans think that consistently making the playoffs/winning is a testament to an individual player. When in reality, Melo is playing some of the best ball of his career and yet will win less than he did as a Rookie, should go to show how much of a team game this is.

nycericanguy
02-14-2014, 03:03 PM
Honestly to me, it's just another example of the separation between the Elite players and the star players

Not to bash Melo but he is what he is , a great scorer who rebounds well for his position.. he isn't always going to be efficient but he will get his.

But saying he's doing what he did last year is just more proof that when players go down he is still going to do what he does.. he isn't going to take on the responsibility of getting more assists are grabbing more boards or defending at a higher level .. that's why he's just a star player and not one of the elite

except he has?

I don't think people outside of NY realize just how bad everyone outside of Melo has played this year.

You can make a case for THJR as the 2nd best player on this team and that's saying something in itself.

Beltrans Mole
02-14-2014, 03:20 PM
except he has?

I don't think people outside of NY realize just how bad everyone outside of Melo has played this year.

You can make a case for THJR as the 2nd best player on this team and that's saying something in itself.

Felton needs to go. Chandler has regressed SIGNIFICANTLY this season (something no one seems to bring up). JR Smith and Shumpert have been arguably the two most inconsistent players in the NBA so far this season...mostly bad, not good.

There are a lot of problems with the Knicks, and I don't see how Melo should be blamed for most of them. Unfortunately this team isn't built well around him...they need a quick, slashing PG who can move the ball around. Woodson also needs to go, the guy is clueless at times. I'd keep Melo, THJ, Tyler and Prigs and dump everyone else honestly.

Hawkeye15
02-14-2014, 03:25 PM
he takes plenty of blame. That being said, he is playing very well, the Knicks just have issues in numerous other areas. They have no guard play, killed by injuries up front, and a poor coach.

Hawkeye15
02-14-2014, 03:27 PM
Felton needs to go. Chandler has regressed SIGNIFICANTLY this season (something no one seems to bring up). JR Smith and Shumpert have been arguably the two most inconsistent players in the NBA so far this season...mostly bad, not good.

There are a lot of problems with the Knicks, and I don't see how Melo should be blamed for most of them. Unfortunately this team isn't built well around him...they need a quick, slashing PG who can move the ball around. Woodson also needs to go, the guy is clueless at times. I'd keep Melo, THJ, Tyler and Prigs and dump everyone else honestly.

Who is taking that fat *** Felton and his 2 remaining years after this one?

Chandler hasn't been healthy at all, and yeah, even when he has played has looked old.

The nice surprise has been that Hardaway Jr looks like he will be a pretty good player. You at least have him for super cheap another few years.

lamzoka
02-14-2014, 03:49 PM
Whats your deal with the Knicks fam? You post in every knicks Game thread even though you are clearly not a Knicks fan. Now you bringing up players thats 2 years removed from this team. You mean to tell me that in your world, Melo doesnt get the blame for his teams not winning playoffs series or his team not making it to the Championship? Thats been the main knock on his entire career.

There is something about the OP and the Knicks bro. He's always on Knicks forums, replying to evey knicks related thread.

blahblahyoutoo
02-14-2014, 03:56 PM
Who's not blaming Melo for this ********?

He's been playing great the last 2 seasons....making great strides in his overall game...but the fact remains that he forced the Knicks to gut the team to obtain him so that he could sign his extension before the lockout(so he could get more money.)

For that reason, I really don't feel bad for him. Part of this is his fault.....

finally someone that gets it.
everyone is posting statistics, how much effort he's putting forth, how much he's improved. that's not the point.
what everyone forgets is how much the knicks gave up to acquire him, when all he had to do is sign in the off season with all the pieces intact.

NYJ - NYY
02-14-2014, 04:03 PM
Who's not blaming Melo for this ********?

He's been playing great the last 2 seasons....making great strides in his overall game...but the fact remains that he forced the Knicks to gut the team to obtain him so that he could sign his extension before the lockout(so he could get more money.)

For that reason, I really don't feel bad for him. Part of this is his fault.....

finally someone that gets it.
everyone is posting statistics, how much effort he's putting forth, how much he's improved. that's not the point.
what everyone forgets is how much the knicks gave up to acquire him, when all he had to do is sign in the off season with all the pieces intact.

And you have failed to respond to the fact that this team for the greater part of it was the team that won 54 games last year and everyone's production is down besides melo who is the only reason our beat team has 20 wins to begin with

Beltrans Mole
02-14-2014, 04:17 PM
finally someone that gets it.
everyone is posting statistics, how much effort he's putting forth, how much he's improved. that's not the point.
what everyone forgets is how much the knicks gave up to acquire him, when all he had to do is sign in the off season with all the pieces intact.

This is a bait thread. It's fine, we get it. You're a Miami Heat fan and feel on top of the world. Congrats bro!

blahblahyoutoo
02-14-2014, 04:51 PM
And you have failed to respond to the fact that this team for the greater part of it was the team that won 54 games last year and everyone's production is down besides melo who is the only reason our beat team has 20 wins to begin with

production is down because they're having an off year, or because they've finally fallen back down to earth and aren't hitting 3's like most of PSD predicted?

regardless, you think even last year's felton, JR and shumper are championship contending players?
that you would rather choose them over wilson and gallo and that 1st round pick, or whoever else you could've acquired by trading these assets?

KnicksorBust
02-14-2014, 10:28 PM
JR Smith + Raymond Felton + Amar'e Stoudemire + Andrea Bargnani have played a total of 161 games and produced 5.3 win shares.

Carmelo Anthony has played 49 games and produced 6.9 win shares.

FYI the under-performing jokes of players make a total of roughly $43 million. You can blame Melo for losing Gallo, Chandler, etc. but to be honest are those players really making a difference anyway? You can't blame Melo for the Knicks FO letting Lin and starting Felton. Re-signing a chucker/headcase like JR Smith. Trading for an overpaid bum like Bargnani. Passing on a trade for Kyle Lowry that would at least have us in the playoffs right now. Those are all real things that have nothing to do with the fact that we traded Gallinari and Mozgov for Melo. The whole premise of your thread (they traded away too much) makes such little sense to me when with those players we'd be even worse this year and the players that are really hurting us were not impacted at all by the trade.

Jamiecballer
02-14-2014, 10:33 PM
and that's how you hand someone their ***