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RipCity32
01-07-2014, 01:54 AM
Just happend apparently

shep33
01-07-2014, 01:55 AM
Wow!

Chicago going into tank mode!

soundjunkies2
01-07-2014, 01:55 AM
Per Windhorst

JordansBulls
01-07-2014, 01:56 AM
Nice. We preparing to go for Melo.

JordansBulls
01-07-2014, 01:57 AM
Now that we traded Deng, I'm sure we are going for Melo now.

Im_in_Mia_bish
01-07-2014, 01:59 AM
lol

RipCity32
01-07-2014, 02:00 AM
Now that we traded Deng, I'm sure we are going for Melo now.

Looks that way

BirdIsTheWord
01-07-2014, 02:00 AM
Well that's unexpected.

BirdIsTheWord
01-07-2014, 02:01 AM
Brian Windhorst ‏@WindhorstESPN 21s
Bulls did well with picks, will get a 1st rounder the Cavs own from Sacramento, limited 1st swap rights from Cavs in 15, 2 2nd round picks.
.

ManRam
01-07-2014, 02:01 AM
Like it for both. Cleveland gets better. Chicago committs to blowing up.


3 PICKS!?!

Well, the 1st rounder is Sacto's which is top-10 protected throughout and if that never happens it becomes a second. And the other two are just 2nd rounders. So it's not a ton.

EDIT: I guess there's a right to swap, which makes it more interesting potentially.

shep33
01-07-2014, 02:02 AM
Now that we traded Deng, I'm sure we are going for Melo now.

They still need to get rid of more pieces, no?

Even if you amnesty Boozer, you have to take into account the Rose, Noah, and Gibson alone make up 40 mill

SouthSideRookie
01-07-2014, 02:03 AM
Now that we traded Deng, I'm sure we are going for Melo now.

I'd be stunned if Melo was willing to bank on Rose staying healthy or being close to the player he was.

shep33
01-07-2014, 02:03 AM
3 picks! Chicago wins big.

Good for the Cavs for this season, but you gotta think that Deng will still test free agency

jmoney85
01-07-2014, 02:03 AM
I don't know how i feel about this trade for the cavs.... they didn't seem very good so why not just tank it

soundjunkies2
01-07-2014, 02:03 AM
The Bulls will probably still make the playoffs.

unleashthebeast
01-07-2014, 02:04 AM
Deng is expiring correct? So this has minimal effect on Cleveland's pursuit of LeBron.


Good deal for the Cavs. Should boost them into playoff contention, they have a pretty solid starting 5 now.

Bulls definitely look like they are going for melo, should be interesting

R. Johnson#3
01-07-2014, 02:05 AM
The tank is rolling in Chicago. Will Deng re-sign with Cleveland? Maybe he could give them that boost?

hotdalton18
01-07-2014, 02:06 AM
Wow will the bulls waive him?

I was really hoping my heat could snatch him for cheap

RipCity32
01-07-2014, 02:06 AM
Why would Cavs give up that many picks for a guy who could leave.

RipCity32
01-07-2014, 02:07 AM
Wow will the bulls waive him?

I was really hoping my heat could snatch him for cheap

I think so, I doubt he ever plays with them.

shep33
01-07-2014, 02:07 AM
Deng is expiring correct? So this has minimal effect on Cleveland's pursuit of LeBron.


Good deal for the Cavs. Should boost them into playoff contention, they have a pretty solid starting 5 now.

Bulls definitely look like they are going for melo, should be interesting

Why on Earth would LeBron go back to Cleveland?

BirdIsTheWord
01-07-2014, 02:08 AM
Wow will the bulls waive him?

I was really hoping my heat could snatch him for cheap


Alex Kennedy ‏@AlexKennedyNBA 6m
If Bulls waive Bynum tomorrow, they'll pay him $6 mil and save money. If they don't waive him, his fully guaranteed contract is $12.25 mil.

.

shep33
01-07-2014, 02:08 AM
Why would Cavs give up that many picks for a guy who could leave.

They gave up a **** load. I like how it helps them win now, but Deng is 100% going to test free agency.

ManRam
01-07-2014, 02:09 AM
The Bulls aren't really getting anything here.

Good pick. Don't get caught up on that 3 number...it doesn't mean much here. They didn't pull a Knicks-for-Bargs here, at all.

unleashthebeast
01-07-2014, 02:10 AM
Why on Earth would LeBron go back to Cleveland?

I have no idea haha but that is obviously a story floating around is that they will target him in the offseason.

DreamShaker
01-07-2014, 02:10 AM
Cavs will actually be pretty good this year. They could trade Waiters for another piece and be the 3rd best team in the east, potentially (sadly).

I guess Bynum to the Clippers or Heat now.

Swift Game
01-07-2014, 02:11 AM
Read that the Bulls will get two 2nd rounders and a 1st rounder originally from the Kings.

They better sign him in the summer. Lol

ManRam
01-07-2014, 02:12 AM
They can swap 2015 first rounder. That's 1-14 protected though, so it won't matter.
They gave up the Kings HEAVILY protected 1st rounder. It will never be a top-10 pick relinquished. It even could end up just being another 2nd.
They gave up 2 second round picks. Very, very little value.


It's really not much, at all. If Deng re-signs it's a win.

DreamShaker
01-07-2014, 02:12 AM
The Bulls aren't really getting anything here.

Good pick. Don't get caught up on that 3 number...it doesn't mean much here. They didn't pull a Knicks-for-Bargs here, at all.

Could they get a solid player at 11 or 12 this year if the Kings are up there? Isn't top 10 protected? I haven't paid much attention to the guys outside of the top 7 or 8 in college (assuming everyone comes out, which is not a safe assumption).

shep33
01-07-2014, 02:12 AM
Yeah, interested to see where Drew winds up.


Melo to the Bulls?

MTL_123
01-07-2014, 02:14 AM
man i hope they waive Bynum i really want him on the heat

shep33
01-07-2014, 02:14 AM
They can swap 2015 first rounder. That's 1-14 protected though, so it won't matter.
They gave up the Kings HEAVILY protected 1st rounder. It will never be a top-10 pick relinquished. It even could end up just being another 2nd.
They gave up 2 second round picks. Very, very little value.


It's really not much, at all. If Deng re-signs it's a win.

Ah, that's not too bad then.

ManRam
01-07-2014, 02:15 AM
Could they get a solid player at 11 or 12 this year if the Kings are up there? Isn't top 10 protected? I haven't paid much attention to the guys outside of the top 7 or 8 in college (assuming everyone comes out, which is not a safe assumption).

The Kings aren't finishing outside the top-12 in the draft. And it's actually top-12 protected this year, and top-10 protected in 15, 16 and 17. After that, it's a second rounder.

That Kings pick isn't playing a role this year. The best the Bulls can hope for is an 11 overall pick sometime between 15-17.

WITZ
01-07-2014, 02:17 AM
Why would Cavs give up that many picks for a guy who could leave.

Two second rounders which the cavs have stock piled on the last 2 years and a 1st round pick from the kings that they are most likely never going to see since the kings suck and probably will for the next 2 years. Depending on the terms of swapping the picks as long as it is lottery protected imo its a solid deal on both ends.

shep33
01-07-2014, 02:18 AM
The Kings aren't finishing outside the top-12 in the draft. And it's actually top-12 protected this year, and top-10 protected in 15, 16 and 17. After that, it's a second rounder.

That Kings pick isn't playing a role this year. The best the Bulls can hope for is an 11 overall pick sometime between 15-17.

Still isn't too bad. I mean they weren't getting a lottery pick for Deng this year anyways

Swift Game
01-07-2014, 02:18 AM
They better sign him in the summer. Lol

MTL_123
01-07-2014, 02:18 AM
guess the bulls are gonna try and get melo now

shep33
01-07-2014, 02:20 AM
guess the bulls are gonna try and get melo now

Yup. Melo's got an interesting decision this summer.

MTL_123
01-07-2014, 02:21 AM
lol if melo leaves the knicks lmao after all the **** he did to get traded to the knicks lol "Im coming home"

ManRam
01-07-2014, 02:22 AM
I'm just glad the LAL trade didn't happen ;)


The only way I don't like this for Cleveland is that I still think they should be waiting one year to contend. You already have the 5th worst record, just embrace the tank. But I get it. It's been 3 full seasons now. The East is ****. This probably gets you in the playoffs assuming health. So since that's the direction they've obviously chosen, it's a good one. Bulls did what they had to do as well.

KingstonHawke
01-07-2014, 02:23 AM
They should just make it where you can't trade draft picks anymore. This whole gambling with protected picks is so dumb to me. It's the reason why bad teams stay bad. Look at the Nets. They traded picks to put their team together assuming they'd be good, and now, they could end up being horrible for the next decade.

Back to the Bulls though... love that they are committing to blow it up, as long as that is what they are actually doing. They need to trade Noah and amnesty Boozah (aint no one trading for that sucka).

MTL_123
01-07-2014, 02:23 AM
man im just hoping we get bynum now

WITZ
01-07-2014, 02:25 AM
They can swap 2015 first rounder. That's 1-14 protected though, so it won't matter.
They gave up the Kings HEAVILY protected 1st rounder. It will never be a top-10 pick relinquished. It even could end up just being another 2nd.
They gave up 2 second round picks. Very, very little value.


It's really not much, at all. If Deng re-signs it's a win.

Add in the fact that its not even their own 2nd round picks its the Portland picks which look to be slated in the last 10 picks of the draft it looks even better for the cavs.

MTL_123
01-07-2014, 02:25 AM
do the bulls still have to get rid of salary to get melo str8 up?

ManRam
01-07-2014, 02:25 AM
They should just make it where you can't trade draft picks anymore. This whole gambling with protected picks is so dumb to me. It's the reason why bad teams stay bad. Look at the Nets. They traded picks to put their team together assuming they'd be good, and now, they could end up being horrible for the next decade.

Nah.

No reason to protect huge markets from their own idiocy.

Rndy
01-07-2014, 02:27 AM
The Kings aren't finishing outside the top-12 in the draft. And it's actually top-12 protected this year, and top-10 protected in 15, 16 and 17. After that, it's a second rounder.

That Kings pick isn't playing a role this year. The best the Bulls can hope for is an 11 overall pick sometime between 15-17.

It's similar to the CHA pick and yes we know you don't think much of the future picks I've heard this story before :) But it's just more future assets for the Bulls who future looks pretty bright if they can have a good draft this year.

ManRam
01-07-2014, 02:28 AM
do the bulls still have to get rid of salary to get melo str8 up?

This doesn't help them at all, I believe, this offseason. It gets them under the tax this season, which will save them money by avoiding the repeat offender tax down the road, but this doesn't free up any 2014-15 salary at all. They still have Rose, Boozer, Deng and Gibson making almost $60M combined.

So yeah, I think they definitely have to get rid of salary. But that's just me taking a glance at it...I'm sure Bulls fans have put way more thought into it.

shep33
01-07-2014, 02:28 AM
Bill Simmons

If Bynum now signs with Heat and helps them this spring - imagine if Dan Gilbert inadvertently helped LeBron win another title?

Read more: http://hoopshype.com/twitter/media.html#ixzz2pgvTCtE3

RipCity32
01-07-2014, 02:29 AM
do the bulls still have to get rid of salary to get melo str8 up?

A lot of salary lol

shep33
01-07-2014, 02:29 AM
I'm just glad the LAL trade didn't happen ;)


The only way I don't like this for Cleveland is that I still think they should be waiting one year to contend. You already have the 5th worst record, just embrace the tank. But I get it. It's been 3 full seasons now. The East is ****. This probably gets you in the playoffs assuming health. So since that's the direction they've obviously chosen, it's a good one. Bulls did what they had to do as well.


Meh, they screwed up in the draft the past 3 years lol, might as well roll with a good player

Kyben36
01-07-2014, 02:29 AM
Now that we traded Deng, I'm sure we are going for Melo now.

Probably not, more like one of

wiggins
Parker
Exum
Embid
Smart
Lavine
Randall

Wait for 2015 for Love

shep33
01-07-2014, 02:30 AM
A lot of salary lol

I think they'd have to move Gibson or Noah, right?

Rose, Taj, Gibson alone is around 40 mill I think

Deception
01-07-2014, 02:31 AM
Bulls win this, Deng is going to get paid this summer, Cavs will either overpay for him or lose him along with that pick.

Tony_Starks
01-07-2014, 02:31 AM
The real question is where will Bynum end up. Clippers? MIA? Back to the Lakers?

MTL_123
01-07-2014, 02:33 AM
the real question is where will bynum end up. Clippers? Mia? Back to the lakers?

miami!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

RipCity32
01-07-2014, 02:33 AM
The real question is where will Bynum end up. Clippers? MIA? Back to the Lakers?

He's taking his talents in the bedroom to South Beach!! Hide your wife now Spo!!

ManRam
01-07-2014, 02:34 AM
It's similar to the CHA pick and yes we know you don't think much of the future picks I've heard this story before :) But it's just more future assets for the Bulls who future looks pretty bright if they can have a good draft this year.

:love:

It's valuable, just not as valuable as "The horrifically and consistently awful Bobcat's FIRST ROUND PICK" like it's sometimes hyped to be. It looks better to me now than it did 2 years ago...because 2 years ago it was a gamble. That's why the value of it I always felt was overrated. Now? They might get late lottery pick this year. That's pretty nice. But it always was a gamble, and that's why the value was iffy at times. But it's still a first rounder...so yeah, value.

This one actually seems a bit worse. Still an asset, still worth trading an expiring for. Like I said, both teams did well.

ManRam
01-07-2014, 02:35 AM
Meh, they screwed up in the draft the past 3 years lol, might as well roll with a good player

If you get a top-5 pick this year and **** it up!?!?!


But yeah, they were gifted the easy choice of Kyrie...but really blew the shot of something great afterwards. You're right...they might as well just go for it now. Those drafts haven't treated them well

ManRam
01-07-2014, 02:37 AM
It's similar to the CHA pick and yes we know you don't think much of the future picks I've heard this story before :) But it's just more future assets for the Bulls who future looks pretty bright if they can have a good draft this year.

I will say this...

I was probably most certainly wrong about Mirotic's value!

bholly
01-07-2014, 02:38 AM
Wow. Works well enough for both teams, I guess.

ManRam
01-07-2014, 02:38 AM
Was this mentioned?


@WojYahooNBA: Luol Deng rejected a 3 year, $30 million extension with Bulls last week! Turned out to be prelude to trade.

shep33
01-07-2014, 02:38 AM
If you get a top-5 pick this year and **** it up!?!?!


But yeah, they were gifted the easy choice of Kyrie...but really blew the shot of something great afterwards. You're right...they might as well just go for it now. Those drafts haven't treated them well

I agree with you, top 5 is impossible to mess up, but they need to get some wins in order to keep Kyrie there.

They absolutely failed in not getting something better than Thompson, Waiters, Zeller, and Bennett

shep33
01-07-2014, 02:39 AM
Was this mentioned?

Yeah, this is interesting. I have a feeling the Cavs are going to overpay big time for him.

ManRam
01-07-2014, 02:40 AM
Wow. Works well enough for both teams - I'm guessing the only people really upset are the Knicks FO and fans, and rightly so - could be very scary news for them.

Looks even worse considering how much more they gave up to get a far lesser player than Deng this offseason ;)

KniCks4LiFe
01-07-2014, 02:40 AM
What a ****ing deal. The Bulls just schooled the East w/ that move. 3 big potential prospects in this year's draft and they clear cap to sign a big money guy? Melo? Bron? Bosh? That's how you GM.

Rndy
01-07-2014, 02:42 AM
:love:

It's valuable, just not as valuable as "The horrifically and consistently awful Bobcat's FIRST ROUND PICK" like it's sometimes hyped to be. It looks better to me now than it did 2 years ago...because 2 years ago it was a gamble. That's why the value of it I always felt was overrated. Now? They might get late lottery pick this year. That's pretty nice. But it always was a gamble, and that's why the value was iffy at times. But it's still a first rounder...so yeah, value.

This one actually seems a bit worse. Still an asset, still worth trading an expiring for. Like I said, both teams did well.

There is no such thing as a gamble in a free first round pick for Tyrus Thomas it never mattered where it was it could have been used years ago as a 20's something pick and I wouldn't have been upset. But the more time goes by the more value it gets. We should get it this year 11-13 I'd guess but if not it get unprotected pretty damn soon.

ManRam
01-07-2014, 02:42 AM
What a ****ing deal. The Bulls just schooled the East w/ that move. 3 big potential prospects in this year's draft and they clear cap to sign a big money guy? Melo? Bron? Bosh?

They didn't free up any 2014-15 cap. I don't believe it helps them really at all free up money to sign either of those three. Deng was an expiring. Helps with the tax, but not the cap.

bholly
01-07-2014, 02:42 AM
Looks even worse considering how much more they gave up to get a far lesser player than Deng this offseason ;)

Haha, yeah. It's hard to picture a deal that doesn't make the Bargs trade just looks worse and worse.

But now that I thought about it, I'm not sure they should be anymore scared than before - it's not like it opens up cap space for the Bulls or anything, and if anything I'd think it makes it less likely they trade for him in-season now (right?). So I guess it's not adding much to how scared they should be - but they should already be plenty scared anyway.

shep33
01-07-2014, 02:43 AM
Melo to the Bulls seems legit now. I know Rose may not be the same player, but that's still a viable option... I mean playing for Thibs alone would be worth it.

Try to lure in Pau as well...they could have something nice

shep33
01-07-2014, 02:44 AM
They didn't free up any 2014-15 cap. I don't believe it helps them really at all free up money to sign either of those three. Deng was an expiring. Helps with the tax, but not the cap.

Yup. They still need to move someone, perhaps Gibson, to clear room for Melo. Trading Gibson would be easy though.

WITZ
01-07-2014, 02:45 AM
The protection on that Kings pick Sheeeeeeeeeeet :laugh2:

"Sacramento's 1st round pick to Cleveland protected for selections 1-12 in 2014, 1-10 in 2015, 1-10 in 2016 or 1-10 in 2017; if Sacramento has not conveyed a 1st round pick to Cleveland by 2017, then Sacramento will instead convey its 2017 2nd round pick to Cleveland protected for selections 56-60 (if this pick falls within its protected range and is therefore not conveyed, then Sacramento's obligation to Cleveland will be extinguished) [Cleveland-Sacramento, 6/30/2011] "

Rndy
01-07-2014, 02:46 AM
Was this mentioned?

In Bulls forum it was and thank god I've wanted Deng gone for awhile now. He's held Jimmy Butler back this year when Deng is around Butler looks up to the guy so much he tries to get Deng shots and doesn't worry about himself, it allows Tony Snell another nice prospect to get PT, And really helps us in this years draft where we can likely have a lottery pick + CHA 11-13. This move also pretty much guaranteed us the money to bring Mirotic over if he agrees to come over.

KniCks4LiFe
01-07-2014, 02:46 AM
They didn't free up any 2014-15 cap. I don't believe it helps them really at all free up money to sign either of those three. Deng was an expiring. Helps with the tax, but not the cap.

they are going to amnesty Boozer too.

ManRam
01-07-2014, 02:46 AM
There is no such thing as a gamble in a free first round pick for Tyrus Thomas it never mattered where it was it could have been used years ago as a 20's something pick and I wouldn't have been upset. But the more time goes by the more value it gets. We should get it this year 11-13 I'd guess but if not it get unprotected pretty damn soon.

No. I never said it was a bad trade for Chicago :laugh: I'm talking about referring to it as an asset. Because all this talk came up around Dwight Howard trade time and Bulls fans proposing trades for him with it playing a big role. My opinion on the pick's value at the time differed wildly compared to most Bulls fans. It's been brought up consistently ever since. I think in the end we might have both been on the extreme side of the spectrum valuing, or in my case devaluing, it. It's a bit of an unknown/gamble for any team to trade for now. 11-13 is pretty darn good for Tyrus Thomas, a steal even...but it wasn't a great trade chip for Dwight Howard, for example.

ManRam
01-07-2014, 02:47 AM
they are going to amnesty Boozer too.

Yeah, forgot about that. This has to assure that it happens. Still don't think it clears them to max-level cap space. May be wrong.

Rndy
01-07-2014, 02:47 AM
The protection on that Kings pick Sheeeeeeeeeeet :laugh2:

"Sacramento's 1st round pick to Cleveland protected for selections 1-12 in 2014, 1-10 in 2015, 1-10 in 2016 or 1-10 in 2017; if Sacramento has not conveyed a 1st round pick to Cleveland by 2017, then Sacramento will instead convey its 2017 2nd round pick to Cleveland protected for selections 56-60 (if this pick falls within its protected range and is therefore not conveyed, then Sacramento's obligation to Cleveland will be extinguished) [Cleveland-Sacramento, 6/30/2011] "


Doesn't matter right to swap with CLE in 2015 is all I heard.

310Casper
01-07-2014, 02:48 AM
Cavs gave up wayyyyyy too much for a 40 game rental of Deng :laugh:

COOLbeans
01-07-2014, 02:49 AM
I don't know how i feel about this trade for the cavs.... they didn't seem very good so why not just tank it

Competitive spirit?

smiddy012
01-07-2014, 02:50 AM
God I hope to god we don't go after Melo...

This is simply the Bulls getting what they can for Deng, he was already going to test FA, and the Bulls weren't going to re-sign for anywhere near what he wants.

This is more about trading for assets than clearing space, Deng and Booz have been as good as gone for a while now.

310Casper
01-07-2014, 02:50 AM
I don't see Melo wanting to play in Chicago. Then you throw in the fact that DRose may never be DRose again...

WITZ
01-07-2014, 02:51 AM
Doesn't matter right to swap with CLE in 2015 is all I heard.

Lottery Protect Swap... if Deng decides to leave the Cavs will most likely suck again and Bulls don't get the pick.

RipCity32
01-07-2014, 02:53 AM
Cavs got raped in this deal. They had a legit shot at a big player in this loaded draft. Sacramento could easily go on a run and finish outside of the worse ten if not this year than next. Also I highly doubt Deng stays and if he does Hes going to get a big overpay.

shep33
01-07-2014, 02:54 AM
Reports saying Deng wants 15-16 mill a year.

He'll get it... Josh Smith got his.

RipCity32
01-07-2014, 02:57 AM
Deng wants 15-16 mill a year.

He'll get it... Josh Smith got his.

If Dumars had another 15 mil to spend then Deng probably would get it.

shep33
01-07-2014, 02:58 AM
If Dumars had another 15 mil to spend then Deng probably would get it.

:laugh:

effen5
01-07-2014, 03:00 AM
If Dumars had another 15 mil to spend then Deng probably would get it.

:laugh:

Rndy
01-07-2014, 03:00 AM
Lottery Protect Swap... if Deng decides to leave the Cavs will most likely suck again and Bulls don't get the pick.

I'm aware I just don't see this as a problem Bulls will either get a 1st pick or something else from it before even next year. This FO is about as good as it gets when it comes to loading up on assets and doing the right thing with those assets.

Considering they were willing to just let him walk this is pretty nice saves a lot of cash. Allows the guys who need to develop the opportunity to develop, go into this draft with 2 first rounder, really helps our chances with Mirotic good things are coming for the Bulls.

KingstonHawke
01-07-2014, 03:01 AM
If I was the Bulls GM, I truly think I could have them contending in only a year or two with some luck. And this trade is exactly the first move I'd of made. After that...

1. Trade Noah and Gibson for an expiring and a pick. The Suns would be a perfect partner. They have Okafor who's giving you nothing this year, and then his $14 comes off the books. And since they are playing way better than expected, I think they would love to add a talent like Noah.

2. Amnesty Boozer. Even if someone was dumb enough to want him, I don't want any money coming back. The cap room is way more valuable.

3. Sign Melo and Gasol as free agents. I did the math, they would have enough money to sign both unless someone overpaid Gasol grossly. Assuming he's worth at the VERY most $10 per.

The Bulls are almost .400 right now. Without Deng, Noah, Gibson, and Boozer... you could be looking at the worse team in the league, literally. No amount of coaching could save a team with Butler as it's best player. That's a top 3 pick right there. With the way Embiid is rocketing up the charts, it's realistic that they could land Parker.

The Bobcats and Kings selections (top 10 and 12 protected) would have a better chance of transferring this year because as they Bulls go down, everyone else goes up. If they just get one of these picks, that's an additional lottery pick in a loaded draft. Guys like Aaron Gordan, and Dario Saric will be around.

Your roster could look like:

PG: Rose ($18), Teague ($1)
SG: Butler ($1), Snell ($2)
SF: Parker ($4), anything you can get for Dunleavy ($1)
PF: Anthony ($20), Mirotic ($1)
C: Gasol ($10), someone ($1)

That's an instant contender. Not sure how many Knicks games people are watching, but Melo is a monster at PF. They wouldn't be as good on the defensive end as Bulls teams usually are, but on offense they'd be unstoppable when healthy. And versatile enough to handle injuries.

shep33
01-07-2014, 03:02 AM
The Bulls are gonna go hard after Melo. They can have a nice squad if Mirotic comes over.

Rose
Butler
Melo
(Need a pf cause they either have to trade Gibson or Noah to make room for Melo I think)
Noah

KniCks4LiFe
01-07-2014, 03:02 AM
Yeah, forgot about that. This has to assure that it happens. Still don't think it clears them to max-level cap space. May be wrong.

$29M off the cap. The NBA cap is $58, that would put Chicago around $50-52M

Rndy
01-07-2014, 03:07 AM
The Bulls are gonna go hard after Melo. They can have a nice squad if Mirotic comes over.

Rose
Butler
Melo
(Need a pf cause they either have to trade Gibson or Noah to make room for Melo I think)
Noah


I don't believe Melo has ever been in their plans and yes they would have to lose Gibson and probably Dunleavy as well. In my opinion they are setting themselves up for a run at Love or LA. Will probably make depth moves in the off season 1 year deals here and there have a bunch of nice young assets from the draft and Mirotic and in 2015 go hard.

Rndy
01-07-2014, 03:10 AM
I think you're looking at the deal all wrong. As long as the Bulls commit to blowing up the team, they are sitting very pretty. (and by blowing up I mean you give Noah away for a pick and an expiring, and just amnesty Boozer)

1. They just saved around $15 mil.

2. Their original slot could end up in the 6-10 range.

3. The chance that the Bobcats get out of the bottom 10 increases. If that happens the Bulls get their 11-20 slotted selection.

4. Sac just got Gay. I know most people don't think much of him. But as a secondary scoring option he could boost the kings out of the bottom 12 sending their pick to the Bulls.

5. When the Cavs lose Deng to free agency, and the Bulls get Rose back, the Bulls will get to swap picks with the Cavs in 2015. The Cavs are a Kyrie injury away from being the worse team in the league. Although I don't expect that to happen, swapping from the mid 20s into the lottery is great.

Noah isn't going anywhere. Rose-Noah-Butler-Mirotic are the core here adding 2 first rounders if CHA can help out a bit, Snell nice role player, DJ Augustin has done very well, They have put themselves in a great spot.


Noah is about as important player as you can have he literally makes Thibs defense what it is the amount of ground he covers and what he does for them offensively without even being a threat to score he's as much part of this core as anyone on this team.

ManRam
01-07-2014, 03:12 AM
I think you're looking at the deal all wrong. As long as the Bulls commit to blowing up the team, they are sitting very pretty. (and by blowing up I mean you give Noah away for a pick and an expiring, and just amnesty Boozer)

1. They just saved around $15 mil.

2. Their original slot could end up in the 6-10 range.

3. The chance that the Bobcats get out of the bottom 10 increases. If that happens the Bulls get their 11-20 slotted selection.

4. Sac just got Gay. I know most people don't think much of him. But as a secondary scoring option he could boost the kings out of the bottom 12 sending their pick to the Bulls.

5. When the Cavs lose Deng to free agency, and the Bulls get Rose back, the Bulls will get to swap picks with the Cavs in 2015. The Cavs are a Kyrie injury away from being the worse team in the league. Although I don't expect that to happen, swapping from the mid 20s into the lottery is great.

I've said I love it for Chicago. I'm only explaining why I don't think Cleveland gave up too much, considering their desires to make the playoffs now. I don't like it because a top-5 pick this year is better than a first round exit, but if that's what they want so be it.

It does help the tax situation and it does help them get worse which in part helps insure Charlotte will be one team closer to being out of the bottom 10. I don't think Gay is getting the Kings to the last lottery slot. That means they're the 9th/10th seed out West. Doubt it. Maybe, but doubt it.

You're 5th point is wrong. The right to swap is top-15 protected. If the Cavs are a lottery team in 2015 Chicago can't swap with them.

beasted86
01-07-2014, 03:14 AM
What a ****ing deal. The Bulls just schooled the East w/ that move. 3 big potential prospects in this year's draft and they clear cap to sign a big money guy? Melo? Bron? Bosh? That's how you GM.

Bulls will have roughly $7M in cap space once they amnesty Boozer and sign their draft picks.

mjt20mik
01-07-2014, 03:15 AM
raptors as suitors for deng after this year?

beasted86
01-07-2014, 03:19 AM
Noah isn't going anywhere. Rose-Noah-Butler-Mirotic are the core here adding 2 first rounders if CHA can help out a bit, Snell nice role player, DJ Augustin has done very well, They have put themselves in a great spot.


Noah is about as important player as you can have he literally makes Thibs defense what it is the amount of ground he covers and what he does for them offensively without even being a threat to score he's as much part of this core as anyone on this team.

Great spot? They will be a weaker team than they were 2010-2012 even if Rose bounces back to MVP form.

KniCks4LiFe
01-07-2014, 03:19 AM
Bulls will have roughly $7M in cap space once they amnesty Boozer and sign their draft picks.

And when they deal Noah for an expiring?

Rndy
01-07-2014, 03:19 AM
I've said I love it for Chicago. I'm only explaining why I don't think Cleveland gave up too much, considering their desires to make the playoffs now. I don't like it because a top-5 pick this year is better than a first round exit, but if that's what they want so be it.

It does help the tax situation and it does help them get worse which in part helps insure Charlotte will be one team closer to being out of the bottom 10. I don't think Gay is getting the Kings to the last lottery slot. That means they're the 9th/10th seed out West. Doubt it. Maybe, but doubt it.

You're 5th point is wrong. The right to swap is top-15 protected. If the Cavs are a lottery team in 2015 Chicago can't swap with them.

I don't even think this pick makes it to 2015 I can see it + some of the other assets they got to move up a few spots on the CHA pick if they get it. Add another core type player and the other team moves down a few spots but gets enough assets to make the risk worth it.

effen5
01-07-2014, 03:20 AM
And when they deal Noah for an expiring?

Thats not happening.

Rndy
01-07-2014, 03:20 AM
Great spot? They will be a weaker team than they were 2010-2012 even if Rose bounces back to MVP form.

Was wondering when you'd come in and act like your usual clown self welcome friend! I'm sure this is the FO plan all along get worse! Hit it on the head always nice to have such an intelligent debate with you.

sunsfan88
01-07-2014, 03:21 AM
He wants more than $10M/yr...dayum. And he's gonna be 30 years old next season. Plus he's injury prone and has ton of miles on him.

Hmm...

smiddy012
01-07-2014, 03:21 AM
And when they deal Noah for an expiring?

Bulls have already proven they're not willing to let go of Noah to sign Melo... If that's what you're implying.

beasted86
01-07-2014, 03:22 AM
And when they deal Noah for an expiring?

When they deal Noah for an expiring, no superstar would want to sign with a scrub team lacking support. They need both Rose and Noah at the least to intrigue free agents.

smiddy012
01-07-2014, 03:23 AM
He wants more than $10M/yr...dayum. And he's gonna be 30 years old next season. Plus he's injury prone and has ton of miles on him.

Hmm...

And he's playing the best basketball of his career...

Hmm... :facepalm:

shep33
01-07-2014, 03:23 AM
I don't believe Melo has ever been in their plans and yes they would have to lose Gibson and probably Dunleavy as well. In my opinion they are setting themselves up for a run at Love or LA. Will probably make depth moves in the off season 1 year deals here and there have a bunch of nice young assets from the draft and Mirotic and in 2015 go hard.

The only reason why I think they should make a run at him is for the following reason... and I'm not trying to start a fight because I'm a fan of D-rose.

Say Rose hurts his knee again next year, or say he's not even close to being the same player he once was. I'm not sure why someone like Love would join up with Rose who would be making 20 and 21 mill for 2015 and 2016. The same dilemma rises in 2015, you need to get rid of Noah and Gibson or Butler. Remember Butler has a qualifying offer after next year. Add in that Rose + Love would be eating up 40-42 mil of the cap. We also haven't brought up Mirotic's contract, nor the potential rookies the Bulls would be drafting.

The reason why I bring Melo us is because there have been reports of him wanting to play for Thibs.

If your the Bulls I say go for it. We don't know what Rose will look like, and if he in fact is never the same due to his knee injuries, then his contract is kind of difficult to build a contender around due to the new CBA

beasted86
01-07-2014, 03:26 AM
Was wondering when you'd come in and act like your usual clown self welcome friend! I'm sure this is the FO plan all along get worse! Hit it on the head always nice to have such an intelligent debate with you.

Be mad if you want, its the truth.

MVP Rose vs ? Rose
Deng vs. Butler
Mirotic vs. Boozer

Those are the core pieces. Barring drafting an all-star outside of the top 10, I can't see how anyone with a brain says the Bulls will be a better team. All this past summer you guys were lying to yourselves and all of us arguing up and down how the Bulls had a better supporting cast than ever. You just continue to lie to yourself, only hurts your own credibility in debates.

Rndy
01-07-2014, 03:26 AM
And he's playing the best basketball of his career...

Hmm... :facepalm:

Not really... He's having the best once since he injured his wrist not really saying much. His numbers only look better because his USG% is the highest it's ever been. He's finally realized he can't shoot anymore changed his game. But I'm thankful he didn't sign that contract with the Bulls I would have been pretty pissed to have him 3 more years. What he should do is just get surgery now and hopefully become the player he used to be.

KniCks4LiFe
01-07-2014, 03:28 AM
Thats not happening.

either that or Taj and Dunleavy if you can find the contract or contracts for them. I'd think a team like Brooklyn or Washington who have players on their last yr. Those are what Chicago would have to be looking for. Or Gasol.

Rndy
01-07-2014, 03:29 AM
Be mad if you want, its the truth.

MVP Rose vs ? Rose
Deng vs. Butler
Mirotic vs. Boozer

Those are the core pieces. Barring drafting an all-star outside of the top 10, I can't see how anyone with a brain says the Bulls will be a better team. All this past summer you guys were lying to yourselves and all of us arguing up and down how the Bulls had a better supporting cast than ever. You just continue to lie to yourself, only hurts your own credibility in debates.

Something I've never understood about you is you seem to talk about something you literally have done no research on it's like you logged on and said yep my time to troll! Bulls are getting younger clearing space allowing their guys to develop getting a lottery pick in a great draft and another pick just outside the lottery. Going into 2015 in a deep FA class they are going to have a ton of cap space and assets they will be able to do almost anything they want. I'm in no way saying next year they are better than 2010 future generally doesn't only mean the first year of your rebuild.

Bulls are getting younger, more athletic, and hopefully fixing only having 1 play maker. If they can add a Marcus Smart type player and another good player in this draft they are well on there way to become a serious threat. They will have cap space and assets to go after a guy like Kevin Love which I've felt for along time is their end game.

smiddy012
01-07-2014, 03:31 AM
Not really... He's having the best once since he injured his wrist not really saying much. His numbers only look better because his USG% is the highest it's ever been. He's finally realized he can't shoot anymore changed his game. But I'm thankful he didn't sign that contract with the Bulls I would have been pretty pissed to have him 3 more years. What he should do is just get surgery now and hopefully become the player he used to be.

Deng's been our #1 option for the majority of the season.. When has he been the number 1 before? Where are your stats for that bra?

Get real, I've been watching Deng his whole career.

Edit: And if you wouldn't re-sign Deng at 10mil per you're a rather ignorant fan tbh. Now I know to disregard everything you say.

beasted86
01-07-2014, 03:35 AM
Something I've never understood about you is you seem to talk about something you literally have done no research on it's like you logged on and said yep my time to troll! Bulls are getting younger clearing space allowing their guys to develop getting a lottery pick in a great draft and another pick just outside the lottery. Going into 2015 in a deep FA class they are going to have a ton of cap space and assets they will be able to do almost anything they want. I'm in no way saying next year they are better than 2010 future generally doesn't only mean the first year of your rebuild.

Well the post didn't clarify that. The post said great spot as though they have all this talent and will be better than ever. They will be in the first year of a rebuild that will take at least 3 years. You talked about 2015 but the Bulls won't have any cap space then.

http://data.shamsports.com/content/pages/data/salaries/bulls.jsp

Bulls have $42M commited in 2015/16 just between Rose, Noah, and Gibson. Between the draft picks, and other signings (Butler, others?) between then and now that isn't enough to sign an all-star... No hate, baiting, or wishful thinking. The salary cap is generally around $58-59M. They just won't have the money unless they trade away one of those 3.

effen5
01-07-2014, 03:38 AM
either that or Taj and Dunleavy if you can find the contract or contracts for them. I'd think a team like Brooklyn or Washington who have players on their last yr. Those are what Chicago would have to be looking for. Or Gasol.

There isn't a single player on the Nets I would want on this team to be honest. Well except for PP's expiring.

Rndy
01-07-2014, 03:39 AM
Deng's been our #1 option for the majority of the season.. When has he been the number 1 before? Where are your stats for that bra?

Get real, I've been watching Deng his whole career.

Edit: And if you wouldn't re-sign Deng at 10mil per you're a rather ignorant person tbh. Now I know to disregard everything you say.

You might want to rewatch that tape then BRA. Deng has never once been the number 1 option on the Bulls not even this year. But You watched him you know BRA!

And no I wouldn't want him back because Deng isn't getting any better he's stunting the growth of player too similar to him in Snell and Butler who are doing it at a fraction of the cost. This team needs to get younger and not hold on to guys who can't even spread the floor anymore. I wish Deng all the best I'm still pissed about him not getting his surgery but he did what he had to do and Bulls did what they had to do. I feel much better now that he's gone.

KniCks4LiFe
01-07-2014, 03:41 AM
There isn't a single player on the Nets I would want on this team to be honest. Well except for PP's expiring.

Those are the types of "contracts" you'd need to look for.

dominater6192
01-07-2014, 03:42 AM
I agree with you, top 5 is impossible to mess up, but they need to get some wins in order to keep Kyrie there.

They absolutely failed in not getting something better than Thompson, Waiters, Zeller, and Bennett
Bennett sucks

Rndy
01-07-2014, 03:43 AM
Well the post didn't clarify that. The post said great spot as though they have all this talent and will be better than ever. They will be in the first year of a rebuild that will take at least 3 years. You talked about 2015 but the Bulls won't have any cap space then.

http://data.shamsports.com/content/pages/data/salaries/bulls.jsp

Bulls have $42M commited in 2015/16 just between Rose, Noah, and Gibson. Between the draft picks, and other signings (Butler, others?) between then and now that isn't enough to sign an all-star... No hate, baiting, or wishful thinking. The salary cap is generally around $58-59M. They just won't have the money unless they trade away one of those 3.

Not expecting Gibson to be around I'm just going off what has been talked about from Chicago sources for awhile now. Bulls FO is pretty good at their job I'm not too worried. This is Miamis time right now Chicago had their opportunity and were smart enough to realize they lost their chance due to injuries and didn't dig themselves a hole like most teams would. Future is looking pretty bright from this side of the fence you'll feel the HEAT MY FRIEND! Your team is getting :oldguy: :laugh: just messing I look forward to being in contention again soon.

ManRam
01-07-2014, 03:48 AM
Edit: And if you wouldn't re-sign Deng at 10mil per you're a rather ignorant fan tbh. Now I know to disregard everything you say.

Deng's worth 3 years 10 million per, and probably even more. But not to the Bulls. Re-signing him to that, or anything more even, just sets them up for the same old, same old for the near future. Keeping the same exact core just ensures that they never surpass the ceiling they reached a few years ago. Keeping that exact same core together for all that money isn't worth it.

Saying they should re-sign him basically is saying that you love 4 seeds and not having a true shot at contending for the foreseeable future. That's the worst place to be.

Shammyguy3
01-07-2014, 03:48 AM
Rndy, Deng absolutely has been our #1 option this season. When he's playing, he's the #1 option as he plays the most minutes and although he's slightly behind Boozer in usage rate he's right behind him. Deng sets the offense up better than he ever has either, so in my mind he's definitely the #1 guy

beasted86
01-07-2014, 03:49 AM
Not expecting Gibson to be around I'm just going off what has been talked about from Chicago sources for awhile now. Bulls FO is pretty good at their job I'm not too worried. This is Miamis time right now Chicago had their opportunity and were smart enough to realize they lost their chance due to injuries and didn't dig themselves a hole like most teams would. Future is looking pretty bright from this side of the fence you'll feel the HEAT MY FRIEND! Your team is getting :oldguy: :laugh: just messing I look forward to being in contention again soon.

Regardless of anything else, so long as the HEAT have Micky Arison and Pat Riley, my team will always have the upper hand on the Bulls. I don't know if I could be a fan of a team owned by that cheapskate Reinsdorf that stays allergic to going into the luxury tax despite the market to sustain it.

Last question: The other outlying problem I do see is Thibs. Do you think he stays around for the rebuild?

I guess I am done "trolling" now. :o

KniCks4LiFe
01-07-2014, 03:50 AM
Rndy, Deng absolutely has been our #1 option this season. When he's playing, he's the #1 option as he plays the most minutes and although he's slightly behind Boozer in usage rate he's right behind him. Deng sets the offense up better than he ever has either, so in my mind he's definitely the #1 guy

can Jimmy be potentially better?

effen5
01-07-2014, 03:52 AM
can Jimmy be potentially better?

Defensively, Jimmy is on par with Deng if not better already.

Rndy
01-07-2014, 03:53 AM
can Jimmy be potentially better?

In my opinion yes I don't think he'll ever be the pure shooter Deng used to be but he's much more explosive athlete who will add more dimension to this team. Snell is the one who reminds me of Deng.

KniCks4LiFe
01-07-2014, 03:54 AM
In my opinion yes I don't think he'll ever be the pure shooter Deng used to be but he's much more explosive athlete who will add more dimension to this team. Snell is the one who reminds me of Deng.

Then that's why he's expendable for picks and cap space.

Rndy
01-07-2014, 03:55 AM
Regardless of anything else, so long as the HEAT have Micky Arison and Pat Riley, my team will always have the upper hand on the Bulls. I don't know if I could be a fan of a team owned by that cheapskate Reinsdorf that stays allergic to going into the luxury tax despite the market to sustain it.

Last question: The other outlying problem I do see is Thibs. Do you think he stays around for the rebuild?

I guess I am done "trolling" now. :o

I don't see how Thibs can even see a rebuild. Rose got hurt Bulls tried to compete this year. Next year if things play out right this year will have a nice core for Thibs to coach a core that could be around for awhile. I'm not sure why he'd want to pass it up and exactly where he'd see as a better option.

beasted86
01-07-2014, 03:55 AM
In my opinion yes I don't think he'll ever be the pure shooter Deng used to be but he's much more explosive athlete who will add more dimension to this team. Snell is the one who reminds me of Deng.

Double edged sword with Butler. If he develops to be as good as Deng, great to have that type of player in a younger form, but bad for the 2015 cap outlook. Might ship out Gibson's $8.5M only to sign Butler to just as much or more.

Rndy
01-07-2014, 03:58 AM
Then that's why he's expendable for picks and cap space.

Yep some people just can't let that go though I don't see why anyone wanted him around when we could become a better team without him shortly. You have 3 players with similar skill sets and you want to hold on to one who lost his ability to shoot, isn't getting any younger, has a **** ton of miles on his body some people forget Deng joined the Bulls at the age of 19. The guy has so many minutes on his body the last 3 years. It's time to get younger and more athletic. In a perfect world you can afford to bring in another star with all these young assets and keep this core together but there is this thing called a cap and Dengs time was up.

Rndy
01-07-2014, 04:01 AM
Double edged sword with Butler. If he develops to be as good as Deng, great to have that type of player in a younger form, but bad for the 2015 cap outlook. Might ship out Gibson's $8.5M only to sign Butler to just as much or more.

If he gets better there isn't a double edged sword we got a legit core player. 2015 isn't all about signing the best FA it's also being able to do trades with the assets we have. Not everything is revolving around the Bulls clearing all their cap space to sign a guy. Kevin Love could very well be traded here. Bulls could very well create their own stars with these 2 first round picks this year + Mirotic. Hell the amount of late round picks they have turned into good rotation players Butler was a 30th pick in the draft and looks like a completely different player than the guy who couldn't shoot.

If the Bulls can create their own players that is every franchises dream instead of giving guys huge money in FA you can pay your own and sign role players where you see fit. That is literally the best thing that could happen. I'm not sure if you've ever seen guys like Smart and Mirotic play but I sure wouldn't be surprised if they were all star players not one bit.

KniCks4LiFe
01-07-2014, 04:01 AM
Yep some people just can't let that go though I don't see why anyone wanted him around when we could become a better team without him shortly. You have 3 players with similar skill sets and you want to hold on to one who lost his ability to shoot, isn't getting any younger, has a **** ton of miles on his body some people forget Deng joined the Bulls at the age of 19. The guy has so many minutes on his body the last 3 years. It's time to get younger and more athletic. In a perfect world you can afford to bring in another star with all these young assets and keep this core together but there is this thing called a cap and Dengs time was up.

I got to say your GM is thinking well. The Bulls are in great hands. And this is a bigger reason why Gibson has to be traded. To free up money to sign those kids if they do develop into just that.

Shammyguy3
01-07-2014, 04:02 AM
can Jimmy be potentially better?

Absolutely. I've been arguing since last April i believe that Butler had already surpassed the injury-ridden Deng. Butler's a better on-ball defender than Deng, can guard all 1-3 positions with ease (and I mean ease, he's the best on-ball defender and chasing guys around picks that I have ever seen). He's a much better three point shooter and is one of the best in the business in getting to the charity stripe.

Butler is better in transition for that reason and is a much better ball-handler.

Rndy
01-07-2014, 04:08 AM
Rndy, Deng absolutely has been our #1 option this season. When he's playing, he's the #1 option as he plays the most minutes and although he's slightly behind Boozer in usage rate he's right behind him. Deng sets the offense up better than he ever has either, so in my mind he's definitely the #1 guy

Well we can't agree on everything that is fine but every single stat has Boozer as our number 1 guy this year. If Deng isn't on the floor that isn't an excuse that is him not being the number 1 guy. I'm not saying he wouldn't have been but he isn't.

It doesn't matter anyway Deng is gone and guys that deserve opportunities to take his spot are finally going to get them. I won't miss that dribbling I'll tell you that.

sunsfan88
01-07-2014, 04:11 AM
And he's playing the best basketball of his career...

Hmm... :facepalm:

And he's stat padding on a bad team...

Hmm...

Rndy
01-07-2014, 04:12 AM
And he's stat padding on a bad team...

Hmm...

Bra he watched him his whole career he knows what is up back down or you're in for it! jk Fact is Deng is playing for a deal and played like it all of a sudden like the past he stopped settling for the shots that weren't going in and finally started getting dirty inside. I don't see that as a coincidence I see a smart guy trying to get his potential last pay day and good for him I hope he gets it because he's taken a beating the last 4 years in minutes. Hopefully he gets paid before his body falls apart even more and thank god we're not the ones doing it.

sunsfan88
01-07-2014, 04:12 AM
I'm excited to watch Jimmy Butler play now.

Shammyguy3
01-07-2014, 04:14 AM
Well we can't agree on everything that is fine but every single stat has Boozer as our number 1 guy this year. If Deng isn't on the floor that isn't an excuse that is him not being the number 1 guy. I'm not saying he wouldn't have been but he isn't.

It doesn't matter anyway Deng is gone and guys that deserve opportunities to take his spot are finally going to get them. I won't miss that dribbling I'll tell you that.

Every single stat states that Boozer is the #1 guy? Outside of usg%, what stats are you mentioning?

shep33
01-07-2014, 04:16 AM
I still say they have to go after Melo this summer. 2015 for Love is a long shot.

Rndy
01-07-2014, 04:21 AM
Every single stat states that Boozer is the #1 guy? Outside of usg%, what stats are you mentioning?

More FGA, more mintues, more FGM Deng got hurt I'm not punishing Boozer for that Boozer has been the number 1 guy on this team. If Deng didn't get hurt he might have more shots the way he was playing for a contract but he didn't I'm going off the stats not the context behind them. But I'm sure you can't let this go so lets keep talking about a guy who isn't here anymore and wasn't the number 1 guy :p

Rose could come back right now and be the number 1 guy but that doesn't mean he was the number 1 guy that is all I'm trying to get here. I don't have a strong argument but I do have one. And I'm holding onto it :laugh:

uprightciti
01-07-2014, 04:21 AM
waive bynum for cap space
amnesty boozer
got picks
healthy rose?
Butler, Noah, Taj, Rose, Melo....****

uprightciti
01-07-2014, 04:23 AM
if dolan smells that melo wants out then he will just trade his *** no problem

dudes a loser if he stays cuz he "is not a winner" and "cant win a championship" and "is not a superstar" but if he signs with the bulls then hahaha MELO IS DA MAN!

****in stupid people man...

KniCks4LiFe
01-07-2014, 04:25 AM
if dolan smells that melo wants out then he will just trade his *** no problem

dudes a loser if he stays cuz he "is not a winner" and "cant win a championship" and "is not a superstar" but if he signs with the bulls then hahaha MELO IS DA MAN!

****in stupid people man...

Dolan isn't smart.

AMC31
01-07-2014, 04:27 AM
The Sacramento 1st will only be an actual 1st round pick if the Kings make it out of the Top-10 of the lottery. If the Kings continue to be in the lottery, the pick will be a 2017 2nd round pick.

The 2015 1st swap ability is lottery protected, so if the Cavs happen to have a higher pick than the Bulls in the 15-30 range then hooray for Chicago.

The 2nd Round picks are from Portland in 2015 and 2016.

Hope that clears that up, they did not give up "too much."

Rndy
01-07-2014, 04:31 AM
I'm just thankful and not trying to rub in NY fans faces I'm just thankful we have a FO that knows when and when not to do something. NY made unnecessary gambles for guys that aren't really star players. They have 1 guy like the Bulls but sacrificed their entire future which the Bulls never did as much as sometimes fans wanted them to. They held on to all their assets the Mirotics, CHA bobcats pick, all their picks, and they have a light at the end of the tunnel and it's not that long of a road compared to NY and especially BRK.

Rndy
01-07-2014, 04:32 AM
The Sacramento 1st will only be an actual 1st round pick if the Kings make it out of the Top-10 of the lottery. If the Kings continue to be in the lottery, the pick will be a 2017 2nd round pick.

The 2015 1st swap ability is lottery protected, so if the Cavs happen to have a higher pick than the Bulls in the 15-30 range then hooray for Chicago.

The 2nd Round picks are from Portland in 2015 and 2016.

Hope that clears that up, they did not give up "too much."

I'm not sure any Bulls fan has really said that we're just happy to clear the space and get future assets I wouldn't be shocked if the Bulls don't own really any of that come draft time. I fully expected us to just take the 14 mil expiring and they did so much more than that. I'm rooting for CLE to keep Deng and I think they have a good chance unless LAL come a calling. But Kyrie, Deng, Waiters, and their other role players should be good enough to make that draft pick trade happen whether the Bulls own it or another team does.

KingstonHawke
01-07-2014, 04:33 AM
Noah isn't going anywhere. Rose-Noah-Butler-Mirotic are the core here adding 2 first rounders if CHA can help out a bit, Snell nice role player, DJ Augustin has done very well, They have put themselves in a great spot.


Noah is about as important player as you can have he literally makes Thibs defense what it is the amount of ground he covers and what he does for them offensively without even being a threat to score he's as much part of this core as anyone on this team.

Would you rather have Noah, or Parker and $7mil to put towards free agency? Also... being worse increases the chances of getting those picks from Charlotte and Sac.

KingstonHawke
01-07-2014, 04:35 AM
I've said I love it for Chicago. I'm only explaining why I don't think Cleveland gave up too much, considering their desires to make the playoffs now. I don't like it because a top-5 pick this year is better than a first round exit, but if that's what they want so be it.

It does help the tax situation and it does help them get worse which in part helps insure Charlotte will be one team closer to being out of the bottom 10. I don't think Gay is getting the Kings to the last lottery slot. That means they're the 9th/10th seed out West. Doubt it. Maybe, but doubt it.

You're 5th point is wrong. The right to swap is top-15 protected. If the Cavs are a lottery team in 2015 Chicago can't swap with them.

My bad... didn't realize I sent this. I rewrote the whole thing after re-reading your post (realized the swap was lottery protected) so it wasn't directed at you and was more so just about what my plans for the team would be.

Edit: actually, I think PSD is messing up. I just looked back at my post and I don't see what you quoted, I see the rewrite. I'm tempted to screenshot it.

P.s. I normally respond off the top of my head, read it back, and then think of something way better (and accurate) to say lol.

shep33
01-07-2014, 04:40 AM
if dolan smells that melo wants out then he will just trade his *** no problem

dudes a loser if he stays cuz he "is not a winner" and "cant win a championship" and "is not a superstar" but if he signs with the bulls then hahaha MELO IS DA MAN!

****in stupid people man...


I honestly don't think Dolan will ever trade Melo. If the Bulls expect Rose to come fully healthy, they should go after Melo.

sunsfan88
01-07-2014, 04:59 AM
Deng wants $14M/season.

Rndy
01-07-2014, 05:32 AM
Would you rather have Noah, or Parker and $7mil to put towards free agency? Also... being worse increases the chances of getting those picks from Charlotte and Sac.

Why would I have to pick between the two? Noah literally makes every ones job so much easier the passes he makes to Guards no big man in the NBA can do what he does Gasol is close damn good as well I just think Noah is the best passing big right now.

I'd probably take Parker but I wouldn't trade Noah because you couldn't guarantee me getting Parker so what is the point in even bringing it up?

-Kobe24-TJ19-
01-07-2014, 05:50 AM
deng better than Gasol lulz

IKnowHoops
01-07-2014, 05:59 AM
can Jimmy be potentially better?

Jimmy has the potential to be better. His 3 ball is cash a lot of the time. He is faster, jumps higher and is an overall better athlete. Deng just has experience on him but give Jimmy a year of starting and the following year he will have surpassed Deng as an overall player. I like Jimmy. I can hear Jimmy.

c.c.
01-07-2014, 06:02 AM
A trade between two teams in the same division

Rndy
01-07-2014, 06:03 AM
deng better than Gasol lulz

for some teams yeah having an all star wing defender does have a ton of value.

Denver-boy
01-07-2014, 06:10 AM
Bynum-Boozer-Noah to NY for Melo and Amare lol new york could get out of cap trouble of amare contract, get noah, save a **** load of cap for lebron or kyrie, or ? by cutting boozer and bynum

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=lyldvk9

its works

Rndy
01-07-2014, 06:12 AM
Bynum-Boozer-Noah to NY for Melo and Amare lol new york could get out of cap trouble of amare contract, get noah, save a **** load of cap for lebron or kyrie, or ?


Bulls would never do that lol. They are trying to get out of lux tax not take on one of the worst contracts in basketball. Noah isn't going anywhere and I don't think Melo is in the Bulls plans at least not that way.

IKnowHoops
01-07-2014, 06:16 AM
I'm just thankful and not trying to rub in NY fans faces I'm just thankful we have a FO that knows when and when not to do something. NY made unnecessary gambles for guys that aren't really star players. They have 1 guy like the Bulls but sacrificed their entire future which the Bulls never did as much as sometimes fans wanted them to. They held on to all their assets the Mirotics, CHA bobcats pick, all their picks, and they have a light at the end of the tunnel and it's not that long of a road compared to NY and especially BRK.

Unfortunately for every team in the east, Miami and Indiana are so far ahead of them. Its sad that they were the second best team in east 2 years ago, and for the foreseeable future, your goal is to be better than the Nets and Knicks and you basically have to keep the Heat and Pacers names out of your mouth.

-Kobe24-TJ19-
01-07-2014, 06:17 AM
for some teams yeah having an all star wing defender does have a ton of value.

cavs need offense, kyrie needs help

Rndy
01-07-2014, 06:20 AM
Unfortunately for every team in the east, Miami and Indiana are so far ahead of them. Its sad that they were the second best team in east 2 years ago, and for the foreseeable future, your goal is to be better than the Nets and Knicks and you basically have to keep the Heat and Pacers names out of your mouth.

Bulls aren't worried about any team they are rebuilding not really sure what you're getting it. Perhaps you misunderstood my post not sure.. I was just saying I'm happy we're not in the holes other teams are and we have the assets to get on the right track pretty quickly with a young team with a possibility to add another star finally in the next 2 years. We had some bad contracts we're finally getting away from I don't expect to compete with Miami or Indy or any team until we get the pieces we need in fact the more teams that beat us the better.

Rndy
01-07-2014, 06:22 AM
cavs need offense, kyrie needs help

Cavs need defense first one of their biggest weaknesses is perimeter defense it just got a lot better. This makes them a much better team than Gasol would have. If they can keep Deng they will be in a much better spot than they were. Can't say I blame them picking Deng over Gasol I'm sure most teams would have done the same if they lacked the perimeter defense CLE has. Mike Brown is a defensive coach and his young players will be able to learn a lot playing with Deng. Gasol isn't putting them over the top any more than Deng but at least their core players are going to improve in their biggest weaknesses. Not to mention Gasol being 31 and having easily the worst year he's ever had how could you be surprised they went with the better player?

Funny part of all this is even the Lakers would rather have Deng than Gasol at this point.

Chronz
01-07-2014, 06:46 AM
I'm just thankful and not trying to rub in NY fans faces I'm just thankful we have a FO that knows when and when not to do something. NY made unnecessary gambles for guys that aren't really star players. They have 1 guy like the Bulls but sacrificed their entire future which the Bulls never did as much as sometimes fans wanted them to. They held on to all their assets the Mirotics, CHA bobcats pick, all their picks, and they have a light at the end of the tunnel and it's not that long of a road compared to NY and especially BRK.

Bulls are just hesitant, remember when they could have traded for KG or Pau but refused to.

PraiseJesus
01-07-2014, 06:48 AM
bulls and cavs are both tanking

Rndy
01-07-2014, 07:05 AM
Bulls are just hesitant, remember when they could have traded for KG or Pau but refused to.

Yeah but I understood why they didn't they had opportunities since 2010 to give up assets and they never did they should have and got lucky because unless they see in the future they could have never known how how many injuries we've had in the playoffs even starting in 2010 with Noah and Boozer.

Not sure how everything is going to work out but It should be interesting a lot of assets hopefully they get some breaks along the way. Would be a good time to start looking to unload some guys like MDJ and Hinrich if you're going to trade Deng you might as well become as bad as possible and at least try and get Smart or Exum.

rhymeratic
01-07-2014, 07:27 AM
LOL Melo is not going to Chicago. Pipe dream. Doesn't mean that Chicago isn't getting a top flight player, it just won't be Melo.

Rndy
01-07-2014, 07:49 AM
LOL Melo is not going to Chicago. Pipe dream. Doesn't mean that Chicago isn't getting a top flight player, it just won't be Melo.

Only because we don't want him! :moon:

GiantsSwaGG
01-07-2014, 08:00 AM
Yes... Noah, Hinrich, two 1st and two 2nds get it done!!!

Rndy
01-07-2014, 08:05 AM
Yes... Noah, Hinrich, two 1st and two 2nds get it done!!!

:laugh: good luck with that one! They turned down Denver for a whole lot less. Only way I can kind of see Melo coming over is if they just sign and trade him in the off season and give the Knicks Gibson other than that Melo isn't coming over and I really don't think he's part of their plan.

Bulls number 1 target right now is getting Mirotic over after that it really only leaves money for a few depth signings.

DitchDat
01-07-2014, 08:09 AM
The Bulls did good. And I like that the Cavs get a veteran SF.

Jarvo
01-07-2014, 08:17 AM
Bynum will be a better fit on The Spurs IF we have the cap space he needs a Coach like Pop to get this mind right.

Knicks21
01-07-2014, 10:10 AM
I'm just thankful and not trying to rub in NY fans faces I'm just thankful we have a FO that knows when and when not to do something. NY made unnecessary gambles for guys that aren't really star players. They have 1 guy like the Bulls but sacrificed their entire future which the Bulls never did as much as sometimes fans wanted them to. They held on to all their assets the Mirotics, CHA bobcats pick, all their picks, and they have a light at the end of the tunnel and it's not that long of a road compared to NY and especially BRK.

Its a game of chance.

Yes we struck out with Melo and Amare. And the Bulls had a home run getting the No. 1 pick in 08'.

Im not worried, this time next year we have a mass amount of expiring contracts and only 1 pick owed.

Pierzynski4Prez
01-07-2014, 10:19 AM
I'm actually hoping the Bulls can turn Bynum around and convince him to play. He likely is the best player the bulls will acquire for a while, that is if his head is right.

Go this year and next year with a frontcourt of Noah/Bynum/Taj/Boozer. Move Butler back to SF, and use the draft to fill the SG role next to rose.

Rose/Augustin/Hinrich
Bulls Pick/Snell
Butler/Cats Pick/Dunleavy
Boozer/Taj
Noah/Bynum

I would much rather do this than just hand Bynum over to Miami for nothing.

akagiredsuns
01-07-2014, 10:43 AM
deng likely ends up with a max as laker next season. kobe has been coveting this guy for years and wanting him to come on board. its why kobe blocked the trade to the bulls years back. bulls will waive bynum before 4pm today and avoid paying him the $12M he's owed. i dont see deng long term with the cavs. this is also a salary dump for CLE too. bulls getting 3 picks from this was great. if the bulls have to get melo, i rather have lebron, ill be sad to see butler go. but snell is a good backup. this should also mean that the hype known as mirotic will be here next season. i swear this guy better be everything ive been hearing everyone say about him. though if boozer gets amnestied bulls have to go after a solid PF

rose
mirotic
melo?
noah
PF

nycericanguy
01-07-2014, 10:44 AM
Why would Cavs give up that many picks for a guy who could leave.

PSD over values the hell out of draft picks, two of the picks were 2nd rounder, most 2nd rounders won't even make an NBA team.

What they really gave up was a 1st from SAC... i'd say that's a fair price for Deng.

Just like when the Knicks traded for Bargs and people kept screaming they gave up 3 picks...lol... not all picks are created equal guys.

2nd rounders can be bought every year for little cash... and a late 2nd rounder you can usually get the same guy undrafted.

JasonJohnHorn
01-07-2014, 10:46 AM
I can't believe that they gave Deng away for what essentially amounts to 3 2nd round picks since they plan on waiving Bynum.

The Kings are top 12 protected this year, and top 10 protected next year. If the Kings finish in the bottom 10 both season, which is more than possible, the pick turns into a second rounder.


For Deng? That guy is amazing!

nycericanguy
01-07-2014, 10:47 AM
The Bulls aren't really getting anything here.

Good pick. Don't get caught up on that 3 number...it doesn't mean much here. They didn't pull a Knicks-for-Bargs here, at all.

You mean where NY gave up OKC's 2nd rounder which was top 55 protected meaning TOR will likely not see it?

Or the 2016 1st rounder that DEN has swap rights on anyway so it's very very likely a late 1st?

The 2017 2nd rounder is the only unprotected pick, but really how much is a 2nd rounder 4 years away worth?

quade36
01-07-2014, 10:57 AM
rose
mirotic
melo?
noah
PF

Mirotic will be their PF, they'll need a SG

Pierzynski4Prez
01-07-2014, 10:59 AM
I can't believe that they gave Deng away for what essentially amounts to 3 2nd round picks since they plan on waiving Bynum.

The Kings are top 12 protected this year, and top 10 protected next year. If the Kings finish in the bottom 10 both season, which is more than possible, the pick turns into a second rounder.

For Deng? That guy is amazing!

Just as easily they are not in the top 10 as they are in the top 10. People talk about how good this draft is this year, well guess who's at the top. Not saying its definite, but to write it off is foolish.

Swashcuff
01-07-2014, 11:01 AM
Mirotic will be their PF, they'll need a SG

It wasn't too long ago that Butler was being called the best perimeter defender in the NBA and the "LeBron Stopper" by Bulls fans. Why would they need an SG?

DRose01
01-07-2014, 11:03 AM
Chicago Bulls sources assure that this isn't likely their final trade this year. [More trades could follow for Chicago] (Source: Sam Amico)

ugottabjoshinme
01-07-2014, 11:04 AM
I can't believe that they gave Deng away for what essentially amounts to 3 2nd round picks since they plan on waiving Bynum.

The Kings are top 12 protected this year, and top 10 protected next year. If the Kings finish in the bottom 10 both season, which is more than possible, the pick turns into a second rounder.


For Deng? That guy is amazing!

But Deng turned down the maximum extension the Bulls were willing to give. So they Bulls would let him walk anyway.


It wasn't too long ago that Butler was being called the best perimeter defender in the NBA and the "LeBron Stopper" by Bulls fans. Why would they need an SG?

I think Bultler is a better fit at SF. They need a SF or SG as Butler can play either.

Pierzynski4Prez
01-07-2014, 11:05 AM
It wasn't too long ago that Butler was being called the best perimeter defender in the NBA and the "LeBron Stopper" by Bulls fans. Why would they need an SG?

Because with no Deng he moves back to his original position likely, thus re-creating the black hole at SG that the Bulls haven't been able to fix in quite a while.

koreancabbage
01-07-2014, 11:06 AM
PSD over values the hell out of draft picks, two of the picks were 2nd rounder, most 2nd rounders won't even make an NBA team.

What they really gave up was a 1st from SAC... i'd say that's a fair price for Deng.

Just like when the Knicks traded for Bargs and people kept screaming they gave up 3 picks...lol... not all picks are created equal guys.

2nd rounders can be bought every year for little cash... and a late 2nd rounder you can usually get the same guy undrafted.

They are created equally. but it really depends on your scouting department. If you think you can grab impact players or have a history of getting impact players, you can go the cheap route by acquiring 2nd rounders.

plus, Bargnani was traded for picks but the Raptors could have amnestied him instead if they didn't trade him by a certain date. Instead of the trying the luck of contending with 29 other teams, Knicks desperately sought a trade out for a player that does more damage to your own team on the court than he does against the other team. Raptors made the Knicks worse by trading Bargnani to them. Thats why it was such a big deal with the Bargnani trade - that the Raps got picks for him.

in the end, you're just trying accumulate draft picks. 2nd rounders are the cheaper way to go an acquire young and cheap talent. Talent levels have been rising every year and now, not only Americans are in the draft but many players from different countries, that are just as talented as Americans in some instances. Acquiring future 2nd rounders can let teams get equal-skilled players in the mid to late first round in the second round. You're wrong for looking at the picks being equal to non-drafted players and not even mentioning 2nd rounders being close to or equal to first rounders as well (sometimes even better than first rounders)

Rockice_8
01-07-2014, 11:13 AM
They still need to get rid of more pieces, no?

Even if you amnesty Boozer, you have to take into account the Rose, Noah, and Gibson alone make up 40 mill

Correct.

Taking everything into account they have around 50M committed next year which includes the 5 cap holds. They need to dump Gibson and Dunleavy for minimal return salary (or an expiring) and then they'd be in position to make a run at a max guy. Both should have value so it's possible.

EL_MACHETE
01-07-2014, 11:19 AM
Chicago Bulls sources assure that this isn't likely their final trade this year. [More trades could follow for Chicago] (Source: Sam Amico)


Well if Chicago wants picks Okc haves two 1st rounders..?..


Okc trades Sefo, Perkins, two 1st rounders(Okc & Mavs), 2nd rounder for Noah


It works out salary match

Pierzynski4Prez
01-07-2014, 11:22 AM
Well if Chicago wants picks Okc haves two 1st rounders..?..


Okc trades Sefo, Perkins, two 1st rounders(Okc & Mavs), 2nd rounder for Noah


It works out salary match

Except the Bulls would never trade Noah for that.

EL_MACHETE
01-07-2014, 11:32 AM
Except the Bulls would never trade Noah for that.

Bulls get three picks in this deep draft to help with future. It would also help them tank up to get into the lottery to draft Parker

koreancabbage
01-07-2014, 11:37 AM
In the end, for Cleveland, one of the worst managed teams in the NBA, with the plethora of luck, they have had in terms of picks and talent they could have had, I don't see anyone that resembles a star would go there until management is changed.

I don't think the owner/management had any right to be mad at Lebron leaving lol Imagine if Lebron was still in Cleveland, he would probably still be ringless.

Stunner
01-07-2014, 11:44 AM
Noah is going nowhere stop asking , OKC can have Booz and Kirk for Perkins , a 1st and another player .

NYJ - NYY
01-07-2014, 12:04 PM
Noah is going nowhere stop asking , OKC can have Booz and Kirk for Perkins , a 1st and another player .

Gotta love the gm of the bulls posting on PSD

Stunner
01-07-2014, 12:28 PM
Gotta love the gm of the bulls posting on PSD

No it's basically common sense , what do the bulls gain by trading a top 7 Center ? Booz and Kirk for Perkins , those 1st and a filler is a great pull for them . Gain a low post scorer and another needed PG .

Chronz
01-07-2014, 12:34 PM
Yea its pretty obvious Noah isn't going anywhere. Hes one of their core players moving forward.

NYJ - NYY
01-07-2014, 12:34 PM
Gotta love the gm of the bulls posting on PSD

No it's basically common sense , what do the bulls gain by trading a top 7 Center ? Booz and Kirk for Perkins , those 1st and a filler is a great pull for them . Gain a low post scorer and another needed PG .

They get an extra two picks in a stacked draft as well as cap relief to chase a star (s)

Edit: not saying it's going to happen at all nor am I familiar with the bulls franchise in this way but just saying what could happen

kingsdelez24
01-07-2014, 01:05 PM
I can see Chicago using one of these picks to package with Boozer for a potential Gasol trade

quade36
01-07-2014, 01:07 PM
Noah isn't going anywhere because he is on a team friendly contract (never making more than 13.5 mil a year). They'd trade Gibson well before they trade Noah.

EL_MACHETE
01-07-2014, 01:07 PM
They get an extra two picks in a stacked draft as well as cap relief to chase a star (s)



This

Sly Guy
01-07-2014, 01:13 PM
wow, rape for the bulls. I really don't understand why the cavs would give up picks trying to get rid of him when they just could dumped him before next week without any issue. Especially when Deng is an expiring and not expected to resign.

That being said, if the idea is for the bulls to create a core of bynum, rose, and melo, I still don't see it working out for them. I really do believe bynum will have a difficult time dealing with thibs, rose is an injury question mark [I still really hope to see him come back 100%], and I'm not a believer in melo's ability as a championship caliber leader/player. I might be wrong on melo, maybe he needs to be less of a focal point to be successful, but right now, all I have are doubts

Arch Stanton
01-07-2014, 01:32 PM
wow, rape for the bulls. I really don't understand why the cavs would give up picks trying to get rid of him when they just could dumped him before next week without any issue. Especially when Deng is an expiring and not expected to resign.

That being said, if the idea is for the bulls to create a core of bynum, rose, and melo, I still don't see it working out for them. I really do believe bynum will have a difficult time dealing with thibs, rose is an injury question mark [I still really hope to see him come back 100%], and I'm not a believer in melo's ability as a championship caliber leader/player. I might be wrong on melo, maybe he needs to be less of a focal point to be successful, but right now, all I have are doubts

How is this a rape for the Bulls? The draft picks are essentially second rounders. I think this trade helps the Cavs now, but I'm concerned about sustained success for the franchise. The Cavs need an all-star to go with Irving and this is the draft to grab one if they can.

sager729
01-07-2014, 01:36 PM
To get 3 picks of any kind and to rid them self of a lot of salary is a very good trade for the Bulls for an expiring who is expected to test the market.

Pierzynski4Prez
01-07-2014, 01:43 PM
To get 3 picks of any kind and to rid them self of a lot of salary is a very good trade for the Bulls for an expiring who is expected to test the market.

We do lose Deng's Bird rights. Now he's 100% gone as we can't even really offer him anything in the offseason, where as if we kept him, the option to agree to a contract was going to be there. But you have to think our FO realized there was no chance they'd agree to something with him, so they did this.

Rndy
01-07-2014, 02:02 PM
This

This what? They are in a worse spot getting rid of Noah because of what he brings to a team there is only a few guy who can fill the space he does for Thibs defense. They would never get enough value to make it worth it. Now if a team offered young players + picks + a good young Center sure but that isn't happening and the garbage deals being offered for Noah is common sense he's part of their future.


It's not like the Bulls are in a 10 year build window plan where everyone needs to go. By trades you're talking Dunleavy, Gibson, and Hinrich guys who our great bench peices for a team who feel in the case of Hinrich a perimeter physical defender who has shown to contain star type talents like Wade and D will in playoff situations. Or if a team needs a 3 point specialist who adds a lot of things size from the wing, great passing, and just a high iq player. And an elite defensive PF who is no longer a black hole on offense and he's improved on FT. Those are the type of players I can see being traded. I doubt we'd get much for any of them possibly young rotation players for Gibson and Dunleavy or a late round pick. But those are 3 guys that can really add something to a team with playoff hopes. Not getting rid of your core Center which we'd never get equal value for.

nycericanguy
01-07-2014, 02:02 PM
How is this a rape for the Bulls? The draft picks are essentially second rounders. I think this trade helps the Cavs now, but I'm concerned about sustained success for the franchise. The Cavs need an all-star to go with Irving and this is the draft to grab one if they can.

I think the SAC pick could turn into a mid 1st rounder in 2016 or 17, but I'm surprised the Bulls didn't get any player at all back for Deng. Rose can't be happy... but you have to think CHI has something else up their sleeve before the deadline.

Chronz
01-07-2014, 02:22 PM
They get an extra two picks in a stacked draft as well as cap relief to chase a star (s)

Edit: not saying it's going to happen at all nor am I familiar with the bulls franchise in this way but just saying what could happen

Those picks aren't likely to net a player of Noah's caliber or are they pretty good picks?

I dont think the Bulls have given up on Rose, its one thing to toss a wing(Deng) away when hes about to be 30 when you already have a potential replacement (Butler) on board, but you cant toss away Centers (valuable position) at the prime of their careers, you just dont get that lucky with picks to do so.

Rndy
01-07-2014, 02:24 PM
I think the SAC pick could turn into a mid 1st rounder in 2016 or 17, but I'm surprised the Bulls didn't get any player at all back for Deng. Rose can't be happy... but you have to think CHI has something else up their sleeve before the deadline.

Unless they got a nice young core rotation type player there was no reason to try and get anyone back. Teams aren't giving away young cost friendly players anymore with this CBA. The big thing was getting an expiring deal and they did even better than that not only did they get an expiring they got an expiring right now getting out of the lux tax.

I wouldn't be surprised if they took all those picks and tried to move up a few spots in the draft say if they have CHA pick at 13-15 and moved up a few spots where a team might see that as not hurting themselves very much and getting a possible first round pick down the road. But getting out of Lux tax this season was their number 1 goal and nobody was giving them a better deal than this.

Chronz
01-07-2014, 02:25 PM
I think the SAC pick could turn into a mid 1st rounder in 2016 or 17, but I'm surprised the Bulls didn't get any player at all back for Deng. Rose can't be happy... but you have to think CHI has something else up their sleeve before the deadline.
Rose wont be happy and I doubt he will see the big picture by the deadline. We'll see but the only thing left for the Bulls to do is jettison Booz and Hinrich.

Rndy
01-07-2014, 02:27 PM
Those picks aren't likely to net a player of Noah's caliber or are they pretty good picks?

I dont think the Bulls have given up on Rose, its one thing to toss a wing(Deng) away when hes about to be 30 when you already have a potential replacement (Butler) on board, but you cant toss away Centers (valuable position) at the prime of their careers, you just dont get that lucky with picks to do so.

ding ding ding not to mention there aren't Centers in their prime with that skill set floating around for people to get. You could take your chances in a draft that literally has 2 Centers but that is a big risk. Now if a team offered a good young Center right now there are a few in this league, a first rounder, and another young asset I'd probably do that but obviously it wouldn't work because the team would have to be bad to make the pick worth it and if their bad they want their young assets not Noah.

I'm glad you're apart of PSD because logic is hard to find sometimes here.

Rndy
01-07-2014, 02:30 PM
Rose wont be happy and I doubt he will see the big picture by the deadline. We'll see but the only thing left for the Bulls to do is jettison Booz and Hinrich.

Apparently they talked to Rose before this trade. Listen Rose wants to win I don't believe for a second he thought those guys were good enough. Now Rose did exactly what he should have done he said earlier he wants those guys here what else is he supposed to say? Can you imagine how bad Rose would get killed if he didn't defend the guys who defended him last year? Those guys could have easily thrown Rose under the bus and they didn't Rose did exactly what a human being with any morals would do.

ManRam
01-07-2014, 02:39 PM
I'd be interested to see what the Bulls could fetch for Noah if they put him on the market...but I doubt they'd find fair value. While big men are certainly quite valuable, I'm just not so certain how many teams out there would give up what it would take right now considering the league's current climate. Noah's not a throwaway piece, even in a rebuild of whatever size this rebuild will be. He' signed to a reasonable contract and players of his caliber aren't going to just stumble back in the Bulls lap. You don't move impact big men signed to fair contracts.

Rndy
01-07-2014, 02:47 PM
I'd be interested to see what the Bulls could fetch for Noah if they put him on the market...but I doubt they'd find fair value. While big men are certainly quite valuable, I'm just not so certain how many teams out there would give up what it would take right now considering the league's current climate. Noah's not a throwaway piece, even in a rebuild of whatever size this rebuild will be. He' signed to a reasonable contract and players of his caliber aren't going to just stumble back in the Bulls lap. You don't move impact big men signed to fair contracts.

Yep hey if some bad team wants to come along and offer their good young Center about 2-3 come to mind, a first round pick, and another young asset or future first I'd do it but no bad team is trading their future for Noah he's easily more valuable to the Bulls than about any team in the NBA. What we would get is championship contender teams wanting Noah offering high draft picks and guys who were drafted towards the end of the draft. I just don't see the Value in that. People saying trade him for picks aren't really putting any context into their thoughts. Bad teams aren't giving up their future and good teams don't have the assets.

I do see Gibson, Dunleavy, and Hinrich getting some attention towards the deadline though all 3 add a dimension that championship teams have.

Pacerlive
01-07-2014, 02:50 PM
A lot of unknowns for the Bulls right now. You got basically Noah, Taj, Rose as the core and wishful thinking for Butler (to become a second option on the wing), Snell, and Mirotic to become the backup pf to challenge Taj for the starting spot.

So the future picks have to be on a Center and a scoring wing to take the pressure off of Rose. You will have money to sign one good/great player and 2 solid first round picks that you can't miss on. My guess it will be Evan Turner and not Melo.

Rndy
01-07-2014, 03:11 PM
A lot of unknowns for the Bulls right now. You got basically Noah, Taj, Rose as the core and wishful thinking for Butler (to become a second option on the wing), Snell, and Mirotic to become the backup pf to challenge Taj for the starting spot.

So the future picks have to be on a Center and a scoring wing to take the pressure off of Rose. You will have money to sign one good/great player and 2 solid first round picks that you can't miss on. My guess it will be Evan Turner and not Melo.

In my opinion the Bulls make no big signings in FA will be some some deals 1 year maybe 2 if they like a guy at a certain price but I think their end game is 2015 AA, LA, Love, and Gordon are the guys I see them being interested in. Melo I don't really see it just isn't the right time unfortunately and Turner meh I'd rather wait a year than make him a big part of this team. The only guy I could see them saying screw 2015 is Hayward outside of him I believe they are going to be patient and weigh their options.

Shammyguy3
01-07-2014, 04:09 PM
A lot of unknowns for the Bulls right now. You got basically Noah, Taj, Rose as the core and wishful thinking for Butler (to become a second option on the wing), Snell, and Mirotic to become the backup pf to challenge Taj for the starting spot.

So the future picks have to be on a Center and a scoring wing to take the pressure off of Rose. You will have money to sign one good/great player and 2 solid first round picks that you can't miss on. My guess it will be Evan Turner and not Melo.

I don't know if two players in the league hate each other more than Rose and Turner. For that, along with Turner not being that good and crazy inefficient, this won't happen

EL_MACHETE
01-07-2014, 04:38 PM
Hmmm...
I guess we'll have to wait and see

beasted86
01-07-2014, 04:41 PM
If he gets better there isn't a double edged sword we got a legit core player. 2015 isn't all about signing the best FA it's also being able to do trades with the assets we have. Not everything is revolving around the Bulls clearing all their cap space to sign a guy. Kevin Love could very well be traded here. Bulls could very well create their own stars with these 2 first round picks this year + Mirotic. Hell the amount of late round picks they have turned into good rotation players Butler was a 30th pick in the draft and looks like a completely different player than the guy who couldn't shoot.

If the Bulls can create their own players that is every franchises dream instead of giving guys huge money in FA you can pay your own and sign role players where you see fit. That is literally the best thing that could happen. I'm not sure if you've ever seen guys like Smart and Mirotic play but I sure wouldn't be surprised if they were all star players not one bit.

Butler still can't shoot.

beasted86
01-07-2014, 04:43 PM
A lot of unknowns for the Bulls right now. You got basically Noah, Taj, Rose as the core and wishful thinking for Butler (to become a second option on the wing), Snell, and Mirotic to become the backup pf to challenge Taj for the starting spot.

So the future picks have to be on a Center and a scoring wing to take the pressure off of Rose. You will have money to sign one good/great player and 2 solid first round picks that you can't miss on. My guess it will be Evan Turner and not Melo.

If the Bulls keep Rose, Taj, and Noah, they won't have the cap space to sign Turner, let alone Melo.

smiddy012
01-07-2014, 04:51 PM
Those picks aren't likely to net a player of Noah's caliber or are they pretty good picks?

I dont think the Bulls have given up on Rose, its one thing to toss a wing(Deng) away when hes about to be 30 when you already have a potential replacement (Butler) on board, but you cant toss away Centers (valuable position) at the prime of their careers, you just dont get that lucky with picks to do so.

Yezzir!

benny01
01-07-2014, 05:00 PM
It wouldn't be Turner would have to be Melo, and then I think they can get it done and keep Rose,Butler,Noah, and maybe Snell. Mirotic would have to sign MLE and the rest of the team would have to be roster fillers. No depth. No picks. Melo might still have to opt out and take small pay cut.

beasted86
01-07-2014, 05:09 PM
It wouldn't be Turner would have to be Melo, and then I think they can get it done and keep Rose,Butler,Noah, and maybe Snell. Mirotic would have to sign MLE and the rest of the team would have to be roster fillers. No depth. No picks

PG: Rose / Augustin
SG: Butler / Snell
SF: Anthony / Dunleavy
PF: Mirotic / Draft
C:: Noah / Draft

Not bad if Rose gets back to 90% of his old self and Thibs can reinvent Melo defensively. Not a threat to go far, but at least with that core, Anthony at 30 would the oldest starter. But if they miss on Anthony and Rose doesn't bounce back, its more than likely back to the lottery. The hard sell is convincing Anthony to join a team that isn't such a sure thing on paper.

72 Wins
01-07-2014, 05:14 PM
Doesn't anyone know that Rose and Turner pretty much hate each other?

nycericanguy
01-07-2014, 05:22 PM
It wouldn't be Turner would have to be Melo, and then I think they can get it done and keep Rose,Butler,Noah, and maybe Snell. Mirotic would have to sign MLE and the rest of the team would have to be roster fillers. No depth. No picks. Melo might still have to opt out and take small pay cut.

Melo would have to take a huge paycut... and CHI GM just said Mirotic coming next year is going to be very difficult... apparently his EURO team is trying to sign him to an extension?

nastynice
01-07-2014, 05:24 PM
The Bulls will probably still make the playoffs.

my grandma can still make the playoffs in the east

MassoDio
01-07-2014, 05:27 PM
I don't think Bulls have any interest in Melo. And for those of you suggesting Noah trades, just stop, the Bulls aren't trading him.

I don't see Turner as an option. (He isn't very good, and the Rose/Turner hatred)

I see the Bulls holding off until 2015 while looking to trade Gibson/Dunleavy/Hinirch.

The only two guys I could see the Bulls going after this off-season are Gordon Hayward or Lance Stephenson.

This was a good deal for the Bulls. It wasn't a trade that blows anyone away, but it was a good trade. They got SOMETHING for a guy they had no plans of signing for the money he wanted. They keep themselves from paying the luxury tax this season, which keeps them away from the repeater tax next year if they get that high in salaries again via trades and signings. Smart move by the Bulls.

benny01
01-07-2014, 05:44 PM
Melo would have to take a huge paycut... and CHI GM just said Mirotic coming next year is going to be very difficult... apparently his EURO team is trying to sign him to an extension?
He wouldn't have to except they could only keep rose, butler, noah, and maybe snell. Mirotic would have to sign for the MLE, which I think he won't. and they couldn't sign any draft picks. they would have to sell/trade picks. Don't think it will happen, was only saying how it could. I don't see Noah and Rose as options to leave. Noah, because you won't get the value back from the contract and Rose because if he doesn't return to form his deal is horrific

blahblahyoutoo
01-07-2014, 05:45 PM
is deng african or american?
his name sounds pretty african, but i've never heard him interviewed.

AddiX
01-07-2014, 05:46 PM
Melo already is dealing with amare and his injuries, I cant imagine him or anyone else for that matter giving a crap that rose is in Chicago.

You guys really aren't being realistic about his injuries.

72 Wins
01-07-2014, 05:48 PM
is deng african or american?
his name sounds pretty african, but i've never heard him interviewed.

Born in Africa, family immigrated to the UK (political asylum), and then to the US as a teenager.

blahblahyoutoo
01-07-2014, 05:48 PM
Bulls win this, Deng is going to get paid this summer, Cavs will either overpay for him or lose him along with that pick.

why? deng is worth nothing. look no further than how he's NOT carrying the bulls anywhere without rose.

blahblahyoutoo
01-07-2014, 05:50 PM
The real question is where will Bynum end up. Clippers? MIA? Back to the Lakers?

pretty clear he's going to MIA.

blahblahyoutoo
01-07-2014, 05:54 PM
That's an instant contender. Not sure how many Knicks games people are watching, but Melo is a monster at PF. They wouldn't be as good on the defensive end as Bulls teams usually are, but on offense they'd be unstoppable when healthy. And versatile enough to handle injuries.

yeah, a monster jump shooting PF. that's all he does nowadays.

redsoxknicks
01-07-2014, 06:18 PM
yeah, a monster jump shooting PF. that's all he does nowadays.

I know in general the Knicks and Melo are not well-regarded, but his 9 rpg says he does a bit more than shoot.

Muttman73
01-07-2014, 06:20 PM
Bottom line ... Deng is a good, not great player. With him the Bulls still came up short in 2011. He got greedy, however many millions he has made in his 9+ years in Chicago was not enough for him to settle for $30M more.
The Bulls aren't winning anything this year or next ... they got some draft picks that could be very useful. The NBA is a crooked, rigged league (see Finals 2012) for proof ... it wouldn't amaze me if somehow the Bulls snuck into the top 3 picks and grabbed a running mate for D Rose, weirder **** has happened.
Stern is retiring soon, has absolutely nothing to lose and he loves the big market cities.

Rndy
01-07-2014, 06:30 PM
Butler still can't shoot.

Have anything to support that other than a few games you may catch? Butler is streaky but he can shoot. I guarantee now that Deng is gone Butler becomes a good shooter again he plays so bad with Deng.

If you see Butler stats with and without Deng it's comical. When Deng is in the game Butler plays like he has no idea what his role is without Deng he just plays and is an actual option on offense instead of being Dengs spot up ball boy.

blahblahyoutoo
01-07-2014, 06:32 PM
I know in general the Knicks and Melo are not well-regarded, but his 9 rpg says he does a bit more than shoot.

i'm talking about offense.
pump fake, two dribbles left towards baseline, jump shot.

ManRam
01-07-2014, 06:42 PM
Have anything to support that other than a few games you may catch? Butler is streaky but he can shoot. I guarantee now that Deng is gone Butler becomes a good shooter again he plays so bad with Deng.

I've never been too high on Butler's scoring potential, but his shot definitely is OK. Though, the last game I watched of his was vs. Dallas and he bricked deep shot after deep shot. He's gotta finish at the rim better too...very average in that regard. And since he's good at getting there it's kinda important.


I think Jimmy's individual offensive progression now that he basically is the lead perimeter scoring option is what matters most the rest of the year for the Bulls. Team success isn't the priority, individual progression should be. Should be fun to see how he does in a role that's probably a bit more demanding than it otherwise should be.

Stunner
01-07-2014, 06:45 PM
why? deng is worth nothing. look no further than how he's NOT carrying the bulls anywhere without rose.

I'd Iggy can get paid so can Deng

Derick713
01-07-2014, 06:46 PM
I think the Bulls should now trade Carlos Boozer for Ben Gordon's expiring contract.

Stunner
01-07-2014, 06:47 PM
I've never been too high on Butler's scoring potential, but his shot definitely is OK. Though, the last game I watched of his was vs. Dallas and he bricked deep shot after deep shot. He's gotta finish at the rim better too...very average in that regard. And since he's good at getting there it's kinda important.


I think Jimmy's individual offensive progression now that he basically is the lead perimeter scoring option is what matters most the rest of the year for the Bulls. Team success isn't the priority, individual progression should be. Should be fun to see how he does in a role that's probably a bit more demanding than it otherwise should be.

Jimmy can be a 16 or 18 ppg scorer I think , he gets to the ft line at a good rate , not to mention he's a strong offensive rebounder .

Stunner
01-07-2014, 06:49 PM
I think the Bulls should now trade Carlos Boozer for Ben Gordon's expiring contract.

I would trade Booz for Gordon and Zeller if possible and To Pho for Meka and the Pacers pick

beasted86
01-07-2014, 06:49 PM
Have anything to support that other than a few games you may catch? Butler is streaky but he can shoot. I guarantee now that Deng is gone Butler becomes a good shooter again he plays so bad with Deng.

Ok, to be politically correct, Butler's shooting stats say he's a bad shooter. 39% from the field, 33% from 3... total eFG is 46%. That's pretty dismal. To top it off he's assisted on 73% of his field goals. He's also shooting more FGs per game and per36 than he ever has. I don't think shooting more or having less guys taking pressure off him to get open shots is the answer.

I'm also pretty sure Deng was with the Bulls last year. He played 75 games after all and led the team in minutes played, so he saw a lot of floor time next to Butler.

Rndy
01-07-2014, 06:50 PM
I've never been too high on Butler's scoring potential, but his shot definitely is OK. Though, the last game I watched of his was vs. Dallas and he bricked deep shot after deep shot. He's gotta finish at the rim better too...very average in that regard. And since he's good at getting there it's kinda important.


I think Jimmy's individual offensive progression now that he basically is the lead perimeter scoring option is what matters most the rest of the year for the Bulls. Team success isn't the priority, individual progression should be. Should be fun to see how he does in a role that's probably a bit more demanding than it otherwise should be.

Butler gets to the line pretty well and he's just a streaky shooter I'm pretty confident by the end of the year his numbers will continue to improve from last year. He just needs to become more assertive and this is his chance he's probably the number 1 or 2 option on this team now.

Rndy
01-07-2014, 06:52 PM
Ok, to be politically correct, Butler's shooting stats say he's a bad shooter. 39% from the field, 33% from 3... total eFG is 46%. That's pretty dismal. To top it off he's assisted on 73% of his field goals. He's also shooting more FGs per game and per36 than he ever has. I don't think shooting more or having less guys taking pressure off him to get open shots is the answer.

I'm also pretty sure Deng was with the Bulls last year. He played 75 games after all.

LOL and when did people notice Butler? When did Butler start becoming a threat offensively? Oh when Deng was out to end the year. Not sure why you always try to tell me what my players do without looking into context. I don't go around telling you about Heat players.



Jimmy Butler Per 36 without Deng 51% at the field 46 from 3's Per 36 with Deng 43 from field and 33 from 3

I'm telling you he's a different player when Deng isn't around In my opinion he feels much more comfortable at SF he's got some complex with Deng he's looking to get Deng a shot before himself it's very annoying and one of the many reasons I wanted Deng gone.

beasted86
01-07-2014, 06:59 PM
LOL and when did people notice Butler? When did Butler start becoming a threat offensively? Oh when Deng was out to end the year. Not sure why you always try to tell me what my players do without looking into context. I don't go around telling you about Heat players.



Jimmy Butler Per 36 without Deng 51% at the field 46 from 3's Per 36 with Deng 43 from field and 33 from 3

I'm telling you he's a different player when Deng isn't around In my opinion he feels much more comfortable at SF he's got some complex with Deng he's looking to get Deng a shot before himself it's very annoying and one of the many reasons I wanted Deng gone.

Maybe, maybe not about the SF, but my point is the track record speaks for itself. You don't get to use a miniscule sample to justify your agenda with cheese holes in the logic. The large sum of 80+ games show that he mostly played with Deng, and only played 10-15 games without him playoffs and regular season combined.

TrueFan420
01-07-2014, 07:06 PM
I'd Iggy can get paid so can Deng

Iggy is also a much better player

shep33
01-07-2014, 07:07 PM
Iggy is also a much better player

No he isn't. I like Iggy, but to say he's "much better" than Deng is crazy

bholly
01-07-2014, 07:28 PM
I don't really buy the "we won't go after Melo, because we'd prefer the 2015 guys" argument from CHI fans. I think they'll decide whether or not they want Melo without regard to that, and then if they want him then they'll go for him. Really hard to see them turning down a max level guy they want just for a chance at getting someone else the next year. They'd have to be extremely confident of getting one of the 2015 targets, and I don't see why they would be.
Of course if they just genuinely don't want Melo then they won't go for him, but I don't think they'll pass him up because of 2015. Not least of all because by that point they're going to have to pay Butler and a few more rookie scale guys, too, so their already tight cap window is closing.

ManRam
01-07-2014, 07:33 PM
Jimmy Butler Per 36 without Deng 51% at the field 46 from 3's Per 36 with Deng 43 from field and 33 from 3.

That's interesting.

Over the course of the remainder of the season with Deng gone, the burden shifts greatly to him. Usually an increase in scoring burden doesn't correspond with an increase in efficiency. For whatever reason he didn't thrive playing next to Deng, but we'll see. He hasn't been off to the best start, so it's hard to imagine he plays worse...but I'm not so convinced that this makes him better/more apt to thrive.

We'll figure more out about him, for sure. Only time will tell. You probably know better than I. It's probably the thing to most watch for...at least I will be.

MassoDio
01-07-2014, 07:41 PM
I don't really buy the "we won't go after Melo, because we'd prefer the 2015 guys" argument from CHI fans. I think they'll decide whether or not they want Melo without regard to that, and then if they want him then they'll go for him. Really hard to see them turning down a max level guy they want just for a chance at getting someone else the next year. They'd have to be extremely confident of getting one of the 2015 targets, and I don't see why they would be.
Of course if they just genuinely don't want Melo then they won't go for him, but I don't think they'll pass him up because of 2015. Not least of all because by that point they're going to have to pay Butler and a few more rookie scale guys, too, so their already tight cap window is closing.

I can only speak for what I meant when I said "I don't think they will go after Melo and wait for 2015". I did not mean they are waiting for 2015 because of the players in 2015. I don't think they will go after Melo because I don't feel they have any interest in him. I could be wrong, but that is my feeling. As far as waiting until 2015, I only meant that I don't think, outside of the two guys I listed (Stephenson and Hayward) there are any big name guys that they are interested in, or can afford. And I don't think they are going to just go trade everyone to be a player in the 2014 FA, unless they really feel strongly about a guy, and think they can get him. I don't think Melo is that guy.

TrueFan420
01-07-2014, 08:06 PM
No he isn't. I like Iggy, but to say he's "much better" than Deng is crazy

Much might have been a little bit of an exaggeration but he is superior in many areas including what they're both known for... defense

ramsizzle
01-07-2014, 08:10 PM
Much might have been a little bit of an exaggeration but he is superior in many areas including what they're both known for... defense

Luol deng is 2 years younger and most of their advanced metrics are nearly identical... your opinion is a fallacy.

Shammyguy3
01-07-2014, 08:12 PM
Butler still can't shoot.

Career 35.2% from deep
Career 48.6efg%

That's plenty acceptable to me. And the point about Butler playing better without Deng on the court is emphatically correct.


I've never been too high on Butler's scoring potential, but his shot definitely is OK. Though, the last game I watched of his was vs. Dallas and he bricked deep shot after deep shot. He's gotta finish at the rim better too...very average in that regard. And since he's good at getting there it's kinda important.


I think Jimmy's individual offensive progression now that he basically is the lead perimeter scoring option is what matters most the rest of the year for the Bulls. Team success isn't the priority, individual progression should be. Should be fun to see how he does in a role that's probably a bit more demanding than it otherwise should be.

Average fg% at the rim last year was 64.7%
Butler shot 68.2% at the rim last year.
Comparison's sake, Paul George was 63.6% last year.

Just a one-season sample size where he only played 26mpg, but Butler's really good at getting to the rim and he's at worst above-average in capitalizing. He's magnificent at getting to the line (.597 FTr this year, career .514 FTr).

Rndy
01-07-2014, 08:34 PM
It's not like anyone here is calling Butler a star player I think he'll make some all star appearances in his career though. Butler is a good wing player who will play all team defense, get to the line, easy fast break points, and help on on the boards. I find his game similar to Wade I doubt he'll ever achieve what Wade has but they are from a similar mold. Not every play has to be a superstar Beasted.

NBA_Starter
01-07-2014, 11:28 PM
Cleveland is going to be dangerous with Deng!

Deception
01-07-2014, 11:44 PM
Cleveland is going to be dangerous with Deng!

Doubtful.

THE MTL
01-08-2014, 12:12 AM
I love the protection the Cavs put on those picks. I wish the Knicks took a page out of that book.