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spreadeagle
01-03-2014, 09:36 PM
Toronto has won 9 of its last 12 games — since the Rudy Gay trade they have been the third best team in the East.

The question in Toronto has to be whether to throw out the tanking and lottery plan along with that 2013 calendar. This is a team that should win the Atlantic, likely be the four seed at least in the East and they have a real shot at the second round of the playoffs. Is that the best course of action, or should they get worse now to get a lottery pick and be better later?

At the heart of that debate: Should the Raptors trade Kyle Lowry?

They are still talking about it, reports Ken Berger at CBSSports.com.

In addition to the Lakers, Knicks and Nets, the Timberwolves, Warriors and Celtics are among the teams that have inquired about a deal with the Raptors for Lowry, league sources say. Raptors GM Masai Ujiri has been encouraged by the team’s recent play, as Toronto has gone 9-3 since the trade with two of the losses coming against the Spurs But despite the Raptors’ fourth-place status in the pitiful East, Ujiri is determined to take the long-term view. With the deadline less than seven weeks away, Ujiri is said to have multiple deals he could do for Lowry that would involve receiving an expiring contract in return or slotting him into another team’s trade exception. Taking back future salary would come at a high price, i.e. a first-round pick.

This is the smart play by Ujiri — winning this Atlantic Division and reaching the second round is really fools gold. There are two good teams in the east (in reality there are two elite teams in the East) then the drop is steep. Winning now is not really building a team that will win in the East in a couple years.

If the Raptors can get a deal that helps them long term they should do it.

That said, advancing like that in the post season (and the playoff gate and other revenue it brings) is hard for ownership to turn down. In Toronto, they may not. http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/01/03/lakers-knicks-warriors-among-teams-asking-about-kyle-lowry-trade/



However, with Greivis Vasquez, on the roster and Lowry set to become a free agent at season end, there isn’t much reason for Toronto to keep their feisty point guard if they can improve for the future.

That’s likely why they’ve reportedly been in trade discussions with the Golden State Warriors for weeks regarding a potential trade centered around Lowry:

The Warriors have been shopping for a backup point guard and have been engaged for weeks with Toronto on Kyle Lowry, sources said.

For what it’s worth, Yahoo sports says Toronto isn’t completely unsold to the idea of trading Lowry, but has stopped ‘auctioning’ him off to teams with Toronto’s improved play.

Golden State meanwhile is in need of a backup point guard and few fit that role better than the tenacious Lowry.

The 27-year-old guard is averaging 15.6 points, 7.4 assists and 4 rebounds in 36 minutes. http://fansided.com/2014/01/03/nba-rumors-warriors-raptors-talking-kyle-lowry-trade/

John Walls Era
01-03-2014, 09:37 PM
Trade him. Raptors need to get Wiggins.

bucketss
01-03-2014, 09:40 PM
no.

bucketss
01-03-2014, 09:41 PM
why start tanking now, its too late, we in toronto have tasted winning, and we feel like we can make the playoffs now.

dalton749
01-03-2014, 09:43 PM
wiggins isnt happening. this team is competitive. if lowry agrees to stay you build around this core, the average age is 24. gotta trust masai can work with this group with a good cap situation and picks

lol, please
01-03-2014, 09:47 PM
Warriors.

spreadeagle
01-03-2014, 09:50 PM
why start tanking now, its too late, we in toronto have tasted winning, and we feel like we can make the playoffs now.

Agreed, unless its for a decent player n pick I wouldn't want to trade em, because its last year of his deal teams wont offer what he is worth on the court right now. Resign em. I wonder who Warriors would trade though....Id love to get Barnes some how. Lowry n Ross for Barnes a pick would be fair

jakedajewler
01-03-2014, 10:16 PM
Wouldn't a playoff appearance do wonders in developing the young players they currently have?

dalton749
01-03-2014, 10:18 PM
Agreed, unless its for a decent player n pick I wouldn't want to trade em, because its last year of his deal teams wont offer what he is worth on the court right now. Resign em. I wonder who Warriors would trade though....Id love to get Barnes some how. Lowry n Ross for Barnes a pick would be fair

trading ross at all would be stupid. barnes hasnt shown that he will be a better play than either of those two yet imo

RipCity32
01-03-2014, 10:19 PM
Everyone wants him now lol.

koreancabbage
01-03-2014, 10:19 PM
Trade him. Raptors need to get Wiggins.

they would need to trade both Lowry and Derozan for this team to really suck.

we're still a young team and maybe Wiggins takes a chance when he becomes a UFA to come to Toronto.

RipCity32
01-03-2014, 10:22 PM
What's been the main injury that has plagued Lowry?

spreadeagle
01-03-2014, 10:29 PM
What's been the main injury that has plagued Lowry?

fatness

FriedTofuz
01-03-2014, 10:30 PM
Nets and knicks can **** themselves.
If Minny is willing to give up their 1st rounder, I'm sending lowry to Minny. Too bad the lakers dont have a pick to trade this year.

RipCity32
01-03-2014, 10:31 PM
Rubio for Lowry

FriedTofuz
01-03-2014, 10:31 PM
If James Dolan wants to trade Shumpert + THJR + 1st in 2018, then they can have him. If not, GTFO.
That's what happens with ego getting the better of you.
Minny or the celtics would be great trading partners if either gives up a 1st round pick.

FriedTofuz
01-03-2014, 10:33 PM
Trust me if Lowry is traded, it will disrupt the entire flow of the offense. Vasquez sucks, he dribbles way too much, is slow on defense, and chucks up a couple threes and horrible floaters every now and then. Dont like it. Derozan is playing well because of Lowry. THis team will suck again with Just derozan and ross and such.

ACanadian
01-03-2014, 10:35 PM
Lol, Dolan ****ed up again.

bucketss
01-03-2014, 10:36 PM
Trust me if Lowry is traded, it will disrupt the entire flow of the offense. Vasquez sucks, he dribbles way too much, is slow on defense, and chucks up a couple threes and horrible floaters every now and then. Dont like it. Derozan is playing well because of Lowry. THis team will suck again with Just derozan and ross and such.

no i will not TRUST you.

FriedTofuz
01-03-2014, 10:39 PM
no i will not TRUST you.

get over yourself fella. before I even clicked this thread and saw that you were the last post, I knew you were going to qoute me and post something meaningless and not defend an argument.

FriedTofuz
01-03-2014, 10:40 PM
Dolan just kills me. " we're not trading anyone this year"
"knicks are interested in lowry still"
lmfao what a loud of BS.

spreadeagle
01-03-2014, 10:43 PM
Dolan just kills me. " we're not trading anyone this year"
"knicks are interested in lowry still"
lmfao what a loud of BS.

his trade value skyrocketed after that vetoed Dolan trade, im really glad they passed.

FriedTofuz
01-03-2014, 10:50 PM
Dolan wont get lowry and he looks stupid for rejecting the trade. Lose-Lose

looka09
01-03-2014, 10:53 PM
his trade value skyrocketed after that vetoed Dolan trade, im really glad they passed.

What was the trade?

Shumpert for Lowry ?

Stunner
01-03-2014, 10:55 PM
Rubio for Lowry

I could see that , Lowry is better than him .

spreadeagle
01-03-2014, 10:59 PM
Felton MWP and one of Hardaway JR ,Shump or a future first. Trade was done but vetoed by Dolan last minute

Hawkeye15
01-03-2014, 11:00 PM
Nets and knicks can **** themselves.
If Minny is willing to give up their 1st rounder, I'm sending lowry to Minny. Too bad the lakers dont have a pick to trade this year.

they already traded it conditionally. But yeah, I would LOVE for the Wolves to get him.

Hawkeye15
01-03-2014, 11:01 PM
I could see that , Lowry is better than him .

not happening. Not that I think Rubio is the better player per say, just saying it won't happen.

lol, please
01-03-2014, 11:05 PM
Bazemore, Kuzmic, and Douglas for Lowry. Get it done.

FriedTofuz
01-03-2014, 11:07 PM
The vetoed trade was lowry for felton + THJR/Shumpert ( one of the two) and a 1st round pick (2018) but James dolan was afraid he'd get punked again since he's still sensitive and recovering from being bamboozled the first time by masai in the melo deal, so he elected not to do the trade.

Kushed
01-03-2014, 11:11 PM
Lowry starting with a Rubio/Barea backcourt coming off the bench would be fantastic.

Kushed
01-03-2014, 11:11 PM
Or Rubio stays as the starter and you bring Lowry off the bench. Either way, that would be huge.

FriedTofuz
01-03-2014, 11:12 PM
As long as minny is down to trade at least one first rounder, Id be happy to send him to Minny. Do they have cap space, is the other question.

Drummond#1
01-03-2014, 11:33 PM
The Raps have some of the best young talent in the league next to the Suns and GSW. Derozan, Lowry, Ross and JV. They should be looking to build around this group rather than trading them away. Casey is a good ****ing coach and he can develop this group. If anything they should be looking to move players like Novak, PPatt or Salmons for a defensive minded big. The only way the Raps will get better is via coaching and trades. Clearing cap room for FAs is counterproductive. What big Free Agents have signed in Toronto within the past decade? Landry Fields doesn't count.

RipCity32
01-03-2014, 11:52 PM
I think Raps should keep him. This kind of winning environment is really healthy for their young guys.

Tony_Starks
01-04-2014, 12:13 AM
No thank you, I'll wait on Farmar and Blake.

bucketss
01-04-2014, 12:16 AM
No thank you, I'll wait on Farmar and Blake.

:laugh:

deaner
01-04-2014, 12:28 AM
The Raps have some of the best young talent in the league next to the Suns and GSW. Derozan, Lowry, Ross and JV. They should be looking to build around this group rather than trading them away. Casey is a good ****ing coach and he can develop this group. If anything they should be looking to move players like Novak, PPatt or Salmons for a defensive minded big. The only way the Raps will get better is via coaching and trades. Clearing cap room for FAs is counterproductive. What big Free Agents have signed in Toronto within the past decade? Landry Fields doesn't count.

Casey for Monroe? haha

in looking at free agent signings in toronto you must remember this is a new regime. New Ownership that wants to spend smart dollars with little limit, new CEO in Tim Leiweke that is the best closer in the league, and Masai. Add Drake to the list depending on your position if he adds free agent value. Front office guys like Weltman and Webster are really adding value to our org too. But you are right, it will be a process in bringing in big fish.

Cal827
01-04-2014, 12:30 AM
LOL, Well dolan dun goofed

Now we require first rounders in 2018, 2020, and the right to swap in 2019 :laugh:

I think Minnesota would be a good pick overall (If Minnesota can get a PG who can shoot the ball fairly well, they should be a problem for everyone else lol), just would they be willing to shift out an unprotected first rounder in the near future. I can see Ujiri wanting a first around the time where K-Love can opt out, to try to maximize the value of the pick.

Drummond#1
01-04-2014, 01:17 AM
It will be interesting to see how this pans out for the Raps. You have a front office who wants to tank for Wiggins and a rightfully stubborn coach and hungry players who want to win now. Wiggins may get to the league and bomb like Beasley. Right now they have two proven borderline all star guards in DeMar and Lowry. The Raps would be very dumb to scrap everything this team has worked for and start rebuilding again this late in the process. They will either take what they have to the playoffs and hopefully build off of it next season or trade Lowry and possible Derozan and lose a good coach in the process.

Drummond#1
01-04-2014, 01:20 AM
Ujiri has proven to be a good GM in the past. But he might be overly aggressive. What are a stack of draft picks and money going to get you if you can't win and fill seats? If this goes down it will be at least another 3-4 years before the Raps are in the playoffs.

LanceUpperCut
01-04-2014, 01:27 AM
With or without Lowry were not getting Wiggins the East is just way to bad. I'd try my hardest to resign him.

Drummond#1
01-04-2014, 01:29 AM
How many rookies in recent history outside of Melo and Dwade have led their teams into the playoffs right away?

dtmagnet
01-04-2014, 01:57 AM
We're in 4th place finally above 500 and Raptors fans still want to trade him? This fanbase is ridiculous.

FriedTofuz
01-04-2014, 02:16 AM
Think long-term raptor fans, Longterm. I know the short-term is enticing, and it's the easiest option to make, but in the long-run, tanking for a pick would be better to acquire talent moving forward.

Raps18-19 Champ
01-04-2014, 02:23 AM
We're in 4th place finally above 500 and Raptors fans still want to trade him? This fanbase is ridiculous.

It's about aiming for higher than a 45 win 4th place team.

BHF
01-04-2014, 02:26 AM
Rubio for Lowry

We already have a Rubio on our team is name is Greivis Vasquez, a tall pg who is a good passer with great court vision he cant shoot and he cant score.

Jays Claw
01-04-2014, 02:32 AM
Tanking for Wiggins will set this team back another 3-4 years. Why not keep Lowry and see if he's willing to stay long term? If he decides to bolt, I'm pretty sure Masai Ujiri can find a replacement.

Raps18-19 Champ
01-04-2014, 02:33 AM
Rubio for Lowry

I'm a big Rubio supporter so I would take that. Think he can set up Valanciunas a lot.

PowerHouse
01-04-2014, 02:33 AM
If Kendall Marshall keeps going off for 20 pts 15 assists and 6 rebounds Lakers will pull their names out of the Lowry sweepstakes quickly.

spreadeagle
01-04-2014, 03:01 AM
If Kendall Marshall keeps going off for 20 pts 15 assists and 6 rebounds Lakers will pull their names out of the Lowry sweepstakes quickly.

He wont..but its crazy how fast teams are completely giving up on lotto picks now, Trob Marshall D Williams among others...some of these dudes will put it together n makes some GM's look dumb for trading them so quick

FriedTofuz
01-04-2014, 03:09 AM
Wiggins will be an immediate impact. He'll be NBA Ready, not 4 years away. Perhaps 1-2

RipCity32
01-04-2014, 03:12 AM
Wiggins will be an immediate impact. He'll be NBA Ready, not 4 years away. Perhaps 1-2

I haven't really watched him but his stats so far don't really look like anything amazing.

FriedTofuz
01-04-2014, 03:15 AM
I haven't really watched him but his stats so far don't really look like anything amazing.

college stats are different my friend.

shep33
01-04-2014, 03:20 AM
We can't offer anything anyways lol

coolmo
01-04-2014, 09:37 AM
If ujiri trade lowry, that means lowry must gave hints to ujiri that he will not resign in toronto.

Sly Guy
01-04-2014, 10:14 AM
I think Raps should keep him. This kind of winning environment is really healthy for their young guys.

I agree with you. Our team looks pretty fierce right now the way they're playing, and the chip they have on their shoulders going into every game. Lowry is a decent bet to resign with us anyway, the league is PG rich, and most teams have their starter already set. For the first time in his career, Lowry is a definitive #1 guy on the team, saying the right 'team' oriented things in the locker room, and his team is thriving because of it. He's in line for a pretty good payday, but I think it's about 65-35 on our chances to resign him in the offseason if that's what we want.

And part of this chippiness we're seeing out of the raps I think is due to all the tanking talk. Our guys have pride, our guys are tired of losing, and they're playing like they have something to prove, it's a really beautiful thing to watch right now. We all called the raptor's roster the best support cast for an absentee superstar, well it turns out this supporting cast might be better than we thought.

It's also getting too late to think about tanking with so many team out there trying to bottom out. It's a shame, because this team is literally one great 3-man away from being a really scary team, and a Canadian is projected to go top-3 in this draft, but we're too good to get him.

Masai may not be done dealing, but at this point I don't see him making any moves unless something really blows him away. That knicks deal is dead, it'll be harder to trade lowry as he's likely only a half-year rental to whoever he goes to. And that reported Ross for Aflalo rumour is not gonna happen either as I don't see us making a move for a veteran in a year where we're not expected to contend for a title. So yeah, I see us standing pat at the deadline now and re-evaluating at season's end.

then again, our next two games are Miami and Indiana....I'm sure Miami's heard of our recent success and won't take us lightly. And you can bet Indy's circled the game on their calendars after losing the last one. So we're probably coming down to earth in the next couple games.

dtmagnet
01-04-2014, 12:00 PM
It's about aiming for higher than a 45 win 4th place team.

I just don't believe that trading Lowry will make us pick much higher, so why drop such a talented player just to get a late lottery pick.

xxplayerxx23
01-04-2014, 12:08 PM
Um. Raps aren't a contending team Lowry is a FA ofcourse you try and trade him. You have such young talent, Ross, Val, Amir. If you can get a top 3 draft pick this year you will take a huge step
Foward. Wiggins/Parker/randle with val and Ross could be a huge future for the raps this team
Is going nowhere even with there good play of late.

thekmp211
01-04-2014, 01:28 PM
warriors looking for their next jarett jack. still don't know why the knicks aren't all over this. toronto would be wise to keep him, he's still relatively young and with the amount of talent at the position should be able to be had at a relatively cheap price.

i agree with others saying it's too late for the raps to tank, and if that's what Ujiri really wanted to do he would have cleaned house a lot earlier.

thekmp211
01-04-2014, 01:30 PM
I'm a big Rubio supporter so I would take that. Think he can set up Valanciunas a lot.

this one actually might make the most sense for both teams.

ghettosean
01-04-2014, 01:31 PM
It's about aiming for higher than a 45 win 4th place team.

I just don't believe that trading Lowry will make us pick much higher, so why drop such a talented player just to get a late lottery pick.

Well we know MU ain't no sucker if he trades Lowry i have faith it will be a good deal. Let's not forget we gave Vasquez as well which i think is more the PG of the future for this team. Val and Ross are still developing so trading lowry and getting more young talent is really the way to go. We could keep our fourth spot and watch the east turn back to normal then we can just stay stuck in the middle of the standings and get knocked out of the 1st or 2nd round each year but I'm not really down for that.

We got to think long term and not just look at what we did this year in the pitiful east. I'm happy we beat indy a few nights ago but we ain't beating them or the heat in a best of 7.

ghettosean
01-04-2014, 01:34 PM
warriors looking for their next jarett jack. still don't know why the knicks aren't all over this. toronto would be wise to keep him, he's still relatively young and with the amount of talent at the position should be able to be had at a relatively cheap price.

i agree with others saying it's too late for the raps to tank, and if that's what Ujiri really wanted to do he would have cleaned house a lot earlier.

He tried but Dolan vetoed the deal to ship Lowry out to NYK. Something I'm sure Dolan now regrets.

FlakeyFool
01-04-2014, 01:43 PM
I just don't believe that trading Lowry will make us pick much higher, so why drop such a talented player just to get a late lottery pick.

Hes going to test the market in the summer

zn23
01-04-2014, 01:56 PM
Tanking right now would be the absolute worst idea. If they wanted to tank they should have kept Rudy Gay. It's too late now.


why start tanking now, its too late, we in toronto have tasted winning, and we feel like we can make the playoffs now.

I agree with this. The Raps fans haven't been able to enjoy the playoffs for 6 years now, if they tank they'll have to rebuild and possibly wait 3 more years. It's just not fair to the fans.

Also there is no guarantee that the draft picks will take them anywhere.

Plus it's too late to tank. They have 16 wins right now.


Think long-term raptor fans, Longterm. I know the short-term is enticing, and it's the easiest option to make, but in the long-run, tanking for a pick would be better to acquire talent moving forward.

Terrible idea. The East is so bad right now, The Raps would have to win like 6 more games MAX, from now until the end of the season. They would have to win around 22 games to get one of those top 5 picks. Tanking for a mid round pick is beyond stupid. They have 16 wins. Even if they tried to lose, they can't.

Plus they have a good team right now. Lowry, Derozan, Ross Valanciunas, that's a solid core for the future. Mainly Ross and Lowry.

Red_Pill
01-04-2014, 02:20 PM
God, I hope Minnesota can get Lowry. Would be perfect as our sixth man. He could be the leader off the bench that we desperately need. Flip better do everything he can. We NEED scoring off the bench.

canzano55
01-04-2014, 02:47 PM
I strongly doubt it happens - but just out of interest what would Minny fans consider to be a fair offer for Lowry?

GSRaider
01-04-2014, 03:03 PM
Warriors need to improve their bench… Lowry would be a great addition… Raps are most likely looking for young talent and/or draft picks...

Raptor fans… Would you deal Lowry for Nedovick (rookie pg), Kuzmic (rookie 7 footer), Bazemore (24, amazing athlete, good defender and expiring contract) and O'neal (expiring contract)?

canzano55
01-04-2014, 03:16 PM
nullNaw I'd want Barnes but I'd give you our pick as well to make it fair.

Max.This
01-04-2014, 03:31 PM
kendall marshall looked good in his first game so you can prob take the lakers off the list. Trading him to the warriors to be a 6th man for the remainder of the season could be good, but would lowry resign knowing he won't start? A player of his caliber should be starting on most teams , and i wouldnt be surprised if he thinks so as well. Timberwolves look like a good destination because they can trade picks and rubio has really been underachieving

Kushed
01-04-2014, 03:44 PM
I strongly doubt it happens - but just out of interest what would Minny fans consider to be a fair offer for Lowry?

A first or JJ barea

JiffyMix88
01-04-2014, 03:58 PM
is there anyway they can trade Casey so JV can get more playing time ****ing guys a joke.

FriedTofuz
01-04-2014, 04:01 PM
Tanking right now would be the absolute worst idea. If they wanted to tank they should have kept Rudy Gay. It's too late now.



I agree with this. The Raps fans haven't been able to enjoy the playoffs for 6 years now, if they tank they'll have to rebuild and possibly wait 3 more years. It's just not fair to the fans.

Also there is no guarantee that the draft picks will take them anywhere.

Plus it's too late to tank. They have 16 wins right now.



Terrible idea. The East is so bad right now, The Raps would have to win like 6 more games MAX, from now until the end of the season. They would have to win around 22 games to get one of those top 5 picks. Tanking for a mid round pick is beyond stupid. They have 16 wins. Even if they tried to lose, they can't.

Plus they have a good team right now. Lowry, Derozan, Ross Valanciunas, that's a solid core for the future. Mainly Ross and Lowry.

Do you play basketball? you're underestimating how great of an impact a PG has. Lowry is making everyone better, without him, everyone would suck slighly more. Ross hasnt demonstrated he's a solid part of the core for the future yet. he's all 3 and D, just like dorrell wright, he needs to open up his game more, get to the free throw line withhis athleticism, as well as his midrang game and passing. New york and the nets will bounce back. you can have a top 10 pick team and still land a 3rd pick.

FriedTofuz
01-04-2014, 04:02 PM
val is underutilized, he plays like a garbage man except he has more offensive game than that, so they need to get him more touches.

shep33
01-04-2014, 04:02 PM
Yeah it's too hard to tank out east, the raps have a legit shot at the 3 seed.

Raps18-19 Champ
01-04-2014, 04:03 PM
I just don't believe that trading Lowry will make us pick much higher, so why drop such a talented player just to get a late lottery pick.

Had we traded him earlier and avoided all these wins, we would probably we worse off. He is the best player on this team and is the heart of the Raptors. If he is gone, then we would not be a .500 team. We are like 6 games out of 14th seed in the East (and like 3 games out back when we traded Gay) so that is a very small gap to make it there. Of course the longer you wait, the more difficult it is to get a higher pick.

You can get young players, cap relief (package him with a larger contract like Fields), or future draft picks if you trade Lowry. Getting a chance to keep your own draft pick while tanking is good enough as it is for a rebuilding team but to get more rebuilding pieces is just added incentive.

FriedTofuz
01-04-2014, 04:05 PM
I'm still thinking the NBA will gift the raptors into the top 3 lottery even if they have a late lottery pick because of the 2016 ASG being in toronto, Drake teaming up with TOronto as their global ambassador, and because wiggins is a toronto native. It could very well happen. It happened with derrick rose in chicago, an LBJ even though cleveland really sucked at that time.

JiffyMix88
01-04-2014, 04:07 PM
but can they trade casey though? Val is more valuable than Casey....

KnicksorBust
01-04-2014, 04:13 PM
I still think the Knicks should offer their first round pick. They still have time to make the playoffs and try and go on a run. Tanking is useless for the Knicks.

If I'm the Raptors, now I try and use my new found leverage (Lowry looks great) and dump a contract as well. Get an asset and dump a contract.

bucketss
01-04-2014, 04:42 PM
Well we know MU ain't no sucker if he trades Lowry i have faith it will be a good deal. Let's not forget we gave Vasquez as well which i think is more the PG of the future for this team. Val and Ross are still developing so trading lowry and getting more young talent is really the way to go. We could keep our fourth spot and watch the east turn back to normal then we can just stay stuck in the middle of the standings and get knocked out of the 1st or 2nd round each year but I'm not really down for that.

We got to think long term and not just look at what we did this year in the pitiful east. I'm happy we beat indy a few nights ago but we ain't beating them or the heat in a best of 7.

vasquez is horrible, pg of the future? our future doesn't look very promising with him at the helm.

bucketss
01-04-2014, 04:43 PM
wiggins is raw, we gotta wait till 3 years for him to be elite,which is still not promised...

bucketss
01-04-2014, 04:46 PM
Tanking right now would be the absolute worst idea. If they wanted to tank they should have kept Rudy Gay. It's too late now.



I agree with this. The Raps fans haven't been able to enjoy the playoffs for 6 years now, if they tank they'll have to rebuild and possibly wait 3 more years. It's just not fair to the fans.

Also there is no guarantee that the draft picks will take them anywhere.

Plus it's too late to tank. They have 16 wins right now.



Terrible idea. The East is so bad right now, The Raps would have to win like 6 more games MAX, from now until the end of the season. They would have to win around 22 games to get one of those top 5 picks. Tanking for a mid round pick is beyond stupid. They have 16 wins. Even if they tried to lose, they can't.

Plus they have a good team right now. Lowry, Derozan, Ross Valanciunas, that's a solid core for the future. Mainly Ross and Lowry.

exactly these guys are acting like if lowry is gone we will turn into the bobcats that year they won 7 games, they would need to trade derozan and amir johnson as well. and even still we're still better than the bobcats from a few years ago.

FriedTofuz
01-04-2014, 04:56 PM
sometimes I wonder if people who are nba fans actually play the game and know how it works, because clearly, a lot seem like they are just blinded by stats and wahtever they read, but have not played the game.

FriedTofuz
01-04-2014, 04:57 PM
wiggins is raw, we gotta wait till 3 years for him to be elite,which is still not promised...

I didnt know you were a scout or a fortune teller.

FriedTofuz
01-04-2014, 04:58 PM
I still think the Knicks should offer their first round pick. They still have time to make the playoffs and try and go on a run. Tanking is useless for the Knicks.

If I'm the Raptors, now I try and use my new found leverage (Lowry looks great) and dump a contract as well. Get an asset and dump a contract.

Maybe dump fields or novak with lowry

bucketss
01-04-2014, 05:00 PM
Maybe dump fields or novak with lowry

it took rose till his 3rd year to be able to be among the elites , you think wiggins is further along?

FriedTofuz
01-04-2014, 05:06 PM
it took rose till his 3rd year to be able to be among the elites , you think wiggins is further along?

definitely, Rose wasnt a potential MVP-caliber player coming out of memphis. Also, the raptors have multiple pieces on this roaster which is why they'd still be in the playoffs next year and continue to get better, that is something I can live with, even if it takes wiggins a few years to get it together.

bucketss
01-04-2014, 05:09 PM
definitely, Rose wasnt a potential MVP-caliber player coming out of memphis. Also, the raptors have multiple pieces on this roaster which is why they'd still be in the playoffs next year and continue to get better, that is something I can live with, even if it takes wiggins a few years to get it together.

you remove lowry and what are the pieces? whos gonna run point? vasquez? dude can't even dribble properly....

ByShine
01-04-2014, 06:12 PM
It's about aiming for higher than a 45 win 4th place team.


Seasons not even over yet you can't make that claim. You can move lowry after this season. Why move now when raps started winning? We're not getting wiggins anyway

xxplayerxx23
01-04-2014, 06:22 PM
Seasons not even over yet you can't make that claim. You can move lowry after this season. Why move now when raps started winning? We're not getting wiggins anyway

He's a FA he's going to the highest bidder

ByShine
01-04-2014, 06:27 PM
What if its the raps

mike_noodles
01-04-2014, 06:34 PM
you remove lowry and what are the pieces? whos gonna run point? vasquez? dude can't even dribble properly....

He picks up his dribble on the perimeter more than any guard I've ever seen.

goalie
01-04-2014, 07:09 PM
They are in a great position going forward. They should trade Lowry for assets but keep Jonas, Derozan and Ross to build around and try to win now as well.

thekmp211
01-04-2014, 09:06 PM
He tried but Dolan vetoed the deal to ship Lowry out to NYK. Something I'm sure Dolan now regrets.

who knows what that buffoon is thinking about besides his next hit single.

Raps18-19 Champ
01-05-2014, 03:56 AM
Seasons not even over yet you can't make that claim. You can move lowry after this season. Why move now when raps started winning? We're not getting wiggins anyway

Lowry is expiring and he's getting paid like $10 mil a year. No one said anything about Wiggins.

FriedTofuz
01-05-2014, 04:15 AM
you remove lowry and what are the pieces? whos gonna run point? vasquez? dude can't even dribble properly....

exactly my point, this team will crumble LOL. #tankNation.

IversonIsKrazy
01-05-2014, 07:26 PM
Its January now. Id say just stick with the team now. If we tank, and DONT get top 3, just another throw away season that will encourage DeRozanto leave when hes a UFA

KnicksorBust
01-05-2014, 07:41 PM
Its January now. Id say just stick with the team now. If we tank, and DONT get top 3, just another throw away season that will encourage DeRozanto leave when hes a UFA

So you would turn down a 1st for Lowry now?

ThaDubs
01-05-2014, 08:00 PM
We are the hottest team in the NBA right now but I still think our historically bad bench needs at least one have way decent guy. Raps get Barnes.

SluggeR
01-05-2014, 08:31 PM
Is making the playoffs in the awful eastern conference, worth not putting your team in a position to land the biggest thing out of Canada since Drake? People need to stop being caught up in the moment and think about the big picture..

bucketss
01-05-2014, 08:53 PM
We are the hottest team in the NBA right now but I still think our historically bad bench needs at least one have way decent guy. Raps get Barnes.

barnes? i thought he was untouchable.

Heediot
01-05-2014, 09:07 PM
Keep Lowry unless you have the clear cut upper hand in the deal. Raptors have leverage on any trade discussions since the team and Lowry are playing well.

FriedTofuz
01-05-2014, 09:39 PM
If derozan had a 3PT and defense like ross, he'd be 25/5/5 player easily.

COOLbeans
01-05-2014, 10:54 PM
barnes? i thought he was untouchable.

He doesn't speak for all Warriors fans trust me. Why would we trade Barnes for a backup PG?

Sly Guy
01-06-2014, 12:32 AM
He doesn't speak for all Warriors fans trust me. Why would we trade Barnes for a backup PG?

lowry is no backup.

And besides, you won't want him anyway. The asking price is steep, and if he is playing a 6th man on your team, he won't be happy and will walk at season's end, making that asking price all the steeper. As much as I'd love for the raps to deal with you [you'd have some nice pieces I'd like to pick], it wouldn't be in your best interest to do so.

COOLbeans
01-06-2014, 12:39 AM
No slight against Lowry but he's a backup on the Warriors

Red_Pill
01-06-2014, 12:41 AM
No slight against Lowry but he's a backup on the Warriors

That's like saying he's a backup on the Thunder or Clippers. Obviously.

Warriors have an elite PG. It's obvious he'd be a backup.

bucketss
01-06-2014, 01:12 AM
No slight against Lowry but he's a backup on the Warriors

so are most pg's in the league.

bucketss
01-06-2014, 01:13 AM
He doesn't speak for all Warriors fans trust me. Why would we trade Barnes for a backup PG?

Lol almost got excited. : p

PowerHouse
01-06-2014, 01:39 AM
He wont..

Really? I admit the scoring dropped a little but 9 pts 17 assists 6 rebounds and 2 steals looks like another Rondo-esque line to me.

ghettosean
01-06-2014, 09:12 AM
Well we know MU ain't no sucker if he trades Lowry i have faith it will be a good deal. Let's not forget we gave Vasquez as well which i think is more the PG of the future for this team. Val and Ross are still developing so trading lowry and getting more young talent is really the way to go. We could keep our fourth spot and watch the east turn back to normal then we can just stay stuck in the middle of the standings and get knocked out of the 1st or 2nd round each year but I'm not really down for that.

We got to think long term and not just look at what we did this year in the pitiful east. I'm happy we beat indy a few nights ago but we ain't beating them or the heat in a best of 7.

vasquez is horrible, pg of the future? our future doesn't look very promising with him at the helm.

I agree but it took Calderon a while to figure things out he could always get the team involved easy like Vasquez bit could hit a shot to save his life for a few years... I even remember Calderon missing open lay ups. I expect the same growth problems with his country man he just needs some consistent minutes.

I still want to ship lowry out for picks or youth unless MU knows we can keep him. He's playing too good to let him walk for nothing.

ThaDubs
01-06-2014, 11:06 AM
barnes? i thought he was untouchable.

Was joking.

cdnsportsfan
01-06-2014, 12:29 PM
We're in 4th place finally above 500 and Raptors fans still want to trade him? This fanbase is ridiculous.

As a Raptors fan I say move him ONLY IF the deal is right, don't move him for the sake of making a move and definitely not to tank. I feel most people in TO have moved past the tank talk and are enjoying watching a young, exciting team play. But this team still needs more work before they actually become a good team, so if a really great deal comes along to help the future of the team I support Masai making a move. Even without Lowry, given the state of the East Toronto could probably still sneak in to the playoffs at this point anyways (and hey if they take back a salary that helps them at the 3, may even help out this team!).

The big question for me is whether Lowry plans to stay in Toronto or test free agency in the offseason. He's putting together a fantastic contract year, no doubt he'll draw plenty of interest. The Raps are also doing well this year but still they're young and have spots to fill moving forward. If they can get another first rounder to help round out their young core it might be worth giving it a shot.

But once again, only if the deal is right, if they decide to move him the Raps can't get fleeced here simply because Lowry's trade value it at a very high point right now. That may not be a problem though, as Masai seems to be the one who fleeces :cool:

colinskik
01-06-2014, 12:46 PM
No slight against Lowry but he's a backup on the Warriors

Which is why it makes no sense to trade for him. He's not going to resign with the W's to be a backup.

lol, please
01-06-2014, 09:57 PM
Which is why it makes no sense to trade for him. He's not going to resign with the W's to be a backup.

Why not? I'm sure he would rather win a 'ship as a backup on an elite team than start on a team not in immediate contention.