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View Full Version : Clippers-Lakers (Why Both Teams Have Problems)



Guppyfighter
10-31-2013, 01:30 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vRumIDaCli8&feature=youtube_gdata_player

shep33
10-31-2013, 01:35 AM
The Lakers have problems because we're old, and don't have a top 5-10 NBA player on the court. It's a transition year, we'll have the positives and negatives, but every squad needs to revamp regardless of how successful they've been throughout history.

Guppyfighter
10-31-2013, 01:36 AM
The Lakers have problems because we're old, and don't have a top 5-10 NBA player on the court. It's a transition year, we'll have the positives and negatives, but every squad needs to revamp regardless of how successful they've been throughout history.

Wait till you see the part on Nick Young.

Clippersfan86
10-31-2013, 03:19 AM
Shocked Nick is already making breakdowns of two teams that have like 8 new players a piece and in the Clippers case an entirely new coaching staff+system. Even the Heat of 2010 who had better players started the season off rough under similar circumstances, so why wouldn't a team like the Clippers?

All he really highlighted was Blake's awkward post footwork and the nonstop defensive breakdowns of the team. One is a chemistry issue and another is a player not being a finished product issue. No need to keep beating these things to death. I would love Blake to already be refined and a complete player, trust me. But these things take time. I would also love if just from training camp and preseason our entirely new offense and defense was smooth, but that's not how it works.

Asik's better
10-31-2013, 04:07 AM
Honestly it's just 1 game, let's come back and see where the clippers are after at mid-season

Chronz
10-31-2013, 11:52 AM
I didn't realize how bad of a rebounding trio we have on the perimeter, puts more pressure on our bigs but Blake hasn't been rebounding well in awhile. I rarely question his effort but he looked pitiful on both ends last night. Its one thing not to know the system but to not get the fundamentals down is pretty worrisome. I agree with Simmons when he says this is probably his put up or shut up year, if we see no growth then I can see us moving him for Love (if Love expresses displeasure in Minny that is)

Clippersfan86
10-31-2013, 11:56 AM
I agree Blake's lack of effort sometimes is upsetting. He never stopped hustling as a rookie. Love for Griffin swap would benefit both teams if he doesn't make the jump.

Chronz
10-31-2013, 12:03 PM
Shocked Nick is already making breakdowns of two teams that have like 8 new players a piece and in the Clippers case an entirely new coaching staff+system. Even the Heat of 2010 who had better players started the season off rough under similar circumstances, so why wouldn't a team like the Clippers?
Yea its abit early for making these sort of breakdowns but just take it for what it is, 1 game breakdown. I dont know how often the Heat had many of these breakdowns but suffice it to say, their effort was better than ours. In their 8-8 start they played with the efficiency of a 60 win team IIRC, if we start 8-8 under similar circumstances I will be happy but we took the Lakers for granted last night.


All he really highlighted was Blake's awkward post footwork and the nonstop defensive breakdowns of the team.
He also highlighted Blake's tendency to pause when he should attack, his poor footwork on defense. **** we've been pining about for awhile.


One is a chemistry issue and another is a player not being a finished product issue. No need to keep beating these things to death.
Why not? So long as it remains true in the game he is breaking down, he should point it out. As I would expect him to point it out when Blake has a great game with great fundamentals.


I would love Blake to already be refined and a complete player, trust me. But these things take time. I would also love if just from training camp and preseason our entirely new offense and defense was smooth, but that's not how it works.
Not true, these things dont always take time, but yes we shouldn't rush to any conclusion this early. Its about how much time it takes that matters, this is Blakes 4th year now (with the added benefit of observing the game for a year), after an improved stroke last year, that hitch in his jumper is back. He didn't space the floor correctly and he didn't shrink it on the other end well enough. Hes always had awkward footwork, sometimes it looks beautiful but we should be seeing more fundamental moves by now.

Avenged
10-31-2013, 12:03 PM
He went all in on Young :laugh2:

Chronz
10-31-2013, 12:07 PM
Oh and Dudley was AWFUL. Really hope his intangible worth is still in tact, when it comes to guys who dont really put up stats but make their imprint on the instangibles/defensive end, its abit harder to realize when they decline.

Clippersfan86
10-31-2013, 12:10 PM
Yea its abit early for making these sort of breakdowns but just take it for what it is, 1 game breakdown. I dont know how often the Heat had many of these breakdowns but suffice it to say, their effort was better than ours. In their 8-8 start they played with the efficiency of a 60 win team IIRC, if we start 8-8 under similar circumstances I will be happy but we took the Lakers for granted last night.


He also highlighted Blake's tendency to pause when he should attack, his poor footwork on defense. **** we've been pining about for awhile.


Why not? So long as it remains true in the game he is breaking down, he should point it out. As I would expect him to point it out when Blake has a great game with great fundamentals.


Not true, these things dont always take time, but yes we shouldn't rush to any conclusion this early. Its about how much time it takes that matters, this is Blakes 4th year now (with the added benefit of observing the game for a year), after an improved stroke last year, that hitch in his jumper is back. He didn't space the floor correctly and he didn't shrink it on the other end well enough. Hes always had awkward footwork, sometimes it looks beautiful but we should be seeing more fundamental moves by now.

When I say beating the things to death I mean because he made a breakdown of us just like 5 days ago and nagged on Blake lol. Seems a bit soon for this again. Look I can observe as much Hakeem footage if I want but if I don't get out there and practice it, it won't do crap. Blake's spent 2 summers doing nothing but rehab for knee injuries/surgeries and one in the lockout where all he really did was work on his own (like most players) with pickup ball, weights etc.

Although I do admit given that this is the first summer he had to really work, I'm surprised he hasn't seemed to improve MORE. I mean why can Ibaka go out one summer and develop a great midrange shot but Blake can't? Both had no shot at all coming in. The only thing that really makes me mad in those videos about Blake is him relaxing on D and giving half *** effort help, especially when in the first few games of preseason he was so damn good defensively. It's not a lack of skill, it's a lack of toughness and effort. Also not a fan of him always in position to run back for the highlight dunk instead of getting the damn rebound/stop.

Dudley has been disappointing for sure. Redick on the other hand has been a great fit. We may need to start Barnes over Dudley once he gets back into shape.

Chronz
10-31-2013, 12:12 PM
I agree Blake's lack of effort sometimes is upsetting. He never stopped hustling as a rookie. Love for Griffin swap would benefit both teams if he doesn't make the jump.
Its the mental effort thats annoying. Hes still prioritizing leaking out over boxing out, thats not a Doc trait thats for sure. And when he got trapped, he didn't find the open man as well as I know he can. Just a flat out awful game, I dont like pinning a loss on a single player but we really couldn't afford his mental lapses.


The jump better come soon, at what point do you stop giving the "it takes time routine"?

PS I love how you send me footage of Coach Nick breaking down our preseason offense but bash him when the real game starts.

KnickaBocka.44
10-31-2013, 12:14 PM
He went all in on Young :laugh2:

Rightfully so. Nick Young is worthless. He's a less talented, less entertaining version of J.R. Smith.

Chronz
10-31-2013, 12:15 PM
When I say beating the things to death I mean because he made a breakdown of us just like 5 days ago and nagged on Blake lol. Seems a bit soon for this again. Look I can observe as much Hakeem footage if I want but if I don't get out there and practice it, it won't do crap. Blake's spent 2 summers doing nothing but rehab for knee injuries/surgeries and one in the lockout where all he really did was work on his own (like most players) with pickup ball, weights etc.
Sounds like a BS excuse, when Amare went down with injury he came back with a jumper. That was in a single offseason, but Blake cant fix the hitch in his shot or understand team defensive concepts because he cant practice? Is he so stupid that he cant break down film footage, I know you might not be able to but this is a PRO we are talking about, for our sake I hope hes not that stupid. Just a result of nerves, when things aren't going your way, you revert to bad habits. The entire team did that but none more appalling than Blake.

Clippersfan86
10-31-2013, 12:17 PM
Its the mental effort thats annoying. Hes still prioritizing leaking out over boxing out, thats not a Doc trait thats for sure. And when he got trapped, he didn't find the open man as well as I know he can. Just a flat out awful game, I dont like pinning a loss on a single player but we really couldn't afford his mental lapses.


The jump better come soon, at what point do you stop giving the "it takes time routine"?

PS I love how you send me footage of Coach Nick breaking down our preseason offense but bash him when the real game starts.

Well.... I didn't send it because I thought it was significant, just wanted to share if you missed it because I found it highly entertaining with the pimp/boxing theme lol. Also knew you'd find interest in the system changes. I'm not mad at Nick at all though, just surprised so soon he made one of us looking so terrible.

I agree the clock is ticking for Blake. I usually give a player 4-5 years... and this is year 4 for Blake. So if he doesn't take the jump this year I'm going to become doubtful he ever will and if by next year he doesn't... I'll pretty much be on the trade him boat, despite how much I love the guy personally. We just can't wait 6 or 7 years for him to find the mental toughness and fire again that he had rookie year.

beliges
11-01-2013, 03:39 PM
Both teams have obvious problems. The Lakers' problem is a significant lack of talent. Besides Kobe and an older Pau, the Lakers are a D league team. The Clippers on the other hand, have tremendous talent, but they are a major liability down the stretch because of their lack of FT shooting. Down the stretch in a close playoff game, the Clippers will not succeed because they have nobody outside of CP3 to rely on. This is the reason they couldnt get passed the 1st round last season and probably will have the same problem this season. Clippers are built to succeed during the regular season, but they have major flaws that will prevent them from making it deep into the playoffs.

Clippersfan86
11-01-2013, 03:57 PM
Waiting for a video of the Warriors having major problems in which they gave up 126 points, which could have easily been 135 if not for a bunch of missed, late FT's. This is what I don't like about crap like this is a few teams are consistently only shown when successful and a only a few nitpicked consistently. When teams like Clippers/Lakers/Knicks/Heat play bad it's a huge world ending problem... but when less popular teams like the Grizzlies/Pacers/Spurs have bad games it's swept under the rug by analysts and sports shows.

Last year when we smoked the Spurs by 22 or w/e... not a peep was said. But when they destroyed us the game after ASW... the talk of how overrated we were and how superior the Spurs were was in full force. Now not saying those are or aren't true.. just saying the knee jerk stuff is frustrating if your team is on the **** list of everybody like my team is.

Goose17
11-01-2013, 04:00 PM
Waiting for a video of the Warriors having major problems in which they gave up 126 points, which could have easily been 135 if not for a bunch of missed, late FT's. This is what I don't like about crap like this is a few teams are consistently only shown when successful and a only a few nitpicked consistently. When teams like Clippers/Lakers/Knicks/Heat play bad it's a huge world ending problem... but when less popular teams like the Grizzlies/Pacers/Spurs have bad games it's swept under the rug by analysts and sports shows.

You're talking about one game. Good luck doing that again. Don't forget what happened last season.

Don't get too cocky too soon, there is such a thing as a bad winner.

And the Spurs are more popular than the Clippers ever have been and probably ever will be. They also get nit-picked mainly due to their age, but it doesn't happen as often because they consistently play great fundamental basketball.


Unfortunately your team plays in a massive market, so they're bound to get put in the spotlight more often.

Chronz
11-01-2013, 04:01 PM
Both teams have obvious problems. The Lakers' problem is a significant lack of talent. Besides Kobe and an older Pau, the Lakers are a D league team. The Clippers on the other hand, have tremendous talent, but they are a major liability down the stretch because of their lack of FT shooting. Down the stretch in a close playoff game, the Clippers will not succeed because they have nobody outside of CP3 to rely on. This is the reason they couldnt get passed the 1st round last season and probably will have the same problem this season. Clippers are built to succeed during the regular season, but they have major flaws that will prevent them from making it deep into the playoffs.

Nothing could be further from the truth, our lack of success last year had nothing to do with our offense and everything to do with our inability to defend the paint. Thats due to DJ's inconsistent defense and Blake either not being healthy enough or not being a good enough defender, prolly a mixture of both. The reason we beat the same team the year prior was because we were able to contain their bigs (thanks in large part to Reggie+Kmart) and they were too reliant on Gay.

Clippersfan86
11-01-2013, 04:02 PM
You're talking about one game. Good luck doing that again. Don't forget what happened last season, you guys won the first and lost the next three.

Don't get too cocky too soon, there is such a thing as a bad winner.

I'm not being cocky. I'm saying it's BS that media targets only a handful select teams.

Chronz
11-01-2013, 04:03 PM
You're talking about one game. Good luck doing that again. Don't forget what happened last season, you guys won the first and lost the next three.

Don't get too cocky too soon, there is such a thing as a bad winner.

Hes not taking a dig at your team but the Youtube personality known as Coach Nick.


BTW, I dont really care who wins season series, just that we are FINALLY healthy come playoff time. Im confident in our superiority against all but 1 team in the West.

Goose17
11-01-2013, 04:06 PM
Hes not taking a dig at your team but the Youtube personality known as Coach Nick.


BTW, I dont really care who wins season series, just that we are FINALLY healthy come playoff time. Im confident in our superiority against all but 1 team in the West.


I'm not being cocky. I'm saying it's BS that media targets only a handful select teams.

Like I say, it's to do with the market. You're in a massive market, LA. Then New York teams, Miami etc they're all going to get a lot of attention to because of where they're based.

Plus everyone is hyped because after years of the Lakers reigning supreme the little brother is surpassing them, everyone is watching. This is the pressure that comes with 1; Being labelled a contender and 2; Playing in Los Angeles.

Clippersfan86
11-01-2013, 04:07 PM
Hes not taking a dig at your team but the Youtube personality known as Coach Nick.


BTW, I dont really care who wins season series, just that we are FINALLY healthy come playoff time. Im confident in our superiority against all but 1 team in the West.

I've had a few 1 on 1 chats with Nick. Like him a lot personally and he's a great person, good sports guy. But he DOES have some strong bias against and for certain teams and players. My issue isn't just with Nick on this matter, I'm grouping him with TNT analysts, ESPN analysts etc. Hell right this second I'm listening to an interview where Bruce Bowen is saying Blake Griffin hasn't improved his skillset AT ALL. Uh the guy just fu**ing dropped 23/10/2 in 34 minutes, fouling out with 5 minutes left and all people want to talk about is how he supposedly hasn't improved one bit.

lol, please
11-01-2013, 04:55 PM
You're talking about one game. Good luck doing that again. Don't forget what happened last season, you guys won the first and lost the next three.

Don't get too cocky too soon, there is such a thing as a bad winner.

Hes not taking a dig at your team but the Youtube personality known as Coach Nick.


BTW, I dont really care who wins season series, just that we are FINALLY healthy come playoff time. Im confident in our superiority against all but 1 team in the West.which team in the west?

Chronz
11-01-2013, 05:38 PM
They underrate his improvements because they've been so gradual, Im learning to take it as media jargon more than actual analysis now. Because in the end, they have their points, remember when I asked if it would have been better to see Blake go from super sub, to starter, to all star to all-nba rather than be an immediate star, well I think for the media they would rather see the steady progression than the slow crawls into superstardom the kid is trying to make. And I question just how much certain analysts watch the NBA heavily, cant come to any decision on the kids off-season improvements this quickly.


I dont like how hes looked athletically tho, I really get the feeling hes pacing himself more. That or hes declining already.

Clippersfan86
11-01-2013, 05:46 PM
They underrate his improvements because they've been so gradual, Im learning to take it as media jargon more than actual analysis now. Because in the end, they have their points, remember when I asked if it would have been better to see Blake go from super sub, to starter, to all star to all-nba rather than be an immediate star, well I think for the media they would rather see the steady progression than the slow crawls into superstardom the kid is trying to make. And I question just how much certain analysts watch the NBA heavily, cant come to any decision on the kids off-season improvements this quickly.


I dont like how hes looked athletically tho, I really get the feeling hes pacing himself more. That or hes declining already.

This is all valid and I pretty much agree. We've talked about it before and definitely if Blake didn't come on so strong as a rookie and just had a gradual improvement year to year like say Paul George... he would be looked at much differently. I was close to Blake's dunks last night and his running in the open court and he definitely didn't look like he's lost anything athletically.

In the Lakers game it looked like maybe that was the case but you know how Blake is. He sulks mentally when things don't go his way and stops playing as hard. Stops running as hard, stops boxing out etc, stops jumping with so much energy. I think Doc will keep working on that and last night I loved the bounce back I saw from Blake from the embarrassing performance the night before.

Had he not fouled out last night with like 5 minutes left, just a minute or two after returning from a bench rest... I think he finishes with like 26/12/4 or something like that. He had 23/10/2 in just 34 minutes and that was with just 3 dunks, 1 jumper.. the rest post moves.

Chronz
11-01-2013, 05:53 PM
which team in the west?

the not-warriors


seriously tho - a healthy Spurs team

beliges
11-01-2013, 06:02 PM
Nothing could be further from the truth, our lack of success last year had nothing to do with our offense and everything to do with our inability to defend the paint. Thats due to DJ's inconsistent defense and Blake either not being healthy enough or not being a good enough defender, prolly a mixture of both. The reason we beat the same team the year prior was because we were able to contain their bigs (thanks in large part to Reggie+Kmart) and they were too reliant on Gay.

OK. We can disagree. I still see the Clippers as a flawed team not capable of winning a title without consistent low post scoring and FT shooting. That high paced, above the rim game will prove fatal once again in the playoffs. But obviously we are all entitled to our opinions. Besides CP3 the Clippers have nobody to rely on in a close game. And if Jordan and Griffin are playing down the stretch, they will be a major liability with their inability to knock down clutch FTs.

Clippersfan86
11-01-2013, 06:04 PM
OK. We can disagree. I still see the Clippers as a flawed team not capable of winning a title without consistent low post scoring and FT shooting. That high paced, above the rim game will prove fatal once again in the playoffs. But obviously we are all entitled to our opinions. Besides CP3 the Clippers have nobody to rely on in a close game. And if Jordan and Griffin are playing down the stretch, they will be a major liability with their inability to knock down clutch FTs.

How does 2nd ranked in 2 point scoring efficiency and 5th ranked at points in the paint sound for low post scoring? Or the number 2 which is where Blake ranked last year in points in the paint per game, behind only Lebron. Stop the ESPN/TNT BS analysis and start watching games. Like Chronz said our struggles have NOTHING to do with offense and everything to do with defense. What you don't understand is that we have had the 4th ranked offense two years in a row with Vinny as a coach and pretty much zero ball movement.

Scoring in the paint was more of a statistical strength than our 3 point shooting.

beliges
11-01-2013, 06:10 PM
How does 2nd ranked in 2 point scoring efficiency and 5th ranked at points in the paint sound for low post scoring? Or the number 2 which is where Blake ranked last year in points in the paint per game, behind only Lebron. Stop the ESPN/TNT BS analysis and start watching games. Like Chronz said our struggles have NOTHING to do with offense and everything to do with defense. What you don't understand is that we have had the 4th ranked offense two years in a row with Vinny as a coach and pretty much zero ball movement.

Scoring in the paint was more of a statistical strength than our 3 point shooting.

I understand its your team and you will be defensive about it. I'm not here to create conflict. Neither Griffin nor Jordan are serious threats offensively down low. If you think otherwise then you are simply blinded by your own bias. They are not the type of player that you throw the ball to in the post and expect to make plays down the stretch. Not a chance. There's a reason the Clippers couldnt make it passed the 1st round last year.

Clippersfan86
11-01-2013, 06:18 PM
I understand its your team and you will be defensive about it. I'm not here to create conflict. Neither Griffin nor Jordan are serious threats offensively down low. If you think otherwise then you are simply blinded by your own bias. They are not the type of player that you throw the ball to in the post and expect to make plays down the stretch. Not a chance. There's a reason the Clippers couldnt make it passed the 1st round last year.

I'm blinded by bias even though I give you the numbers? Blake has ranked 2nd, 1st and 3rd in points in the paint in his three years. By all accounts that's a VERY good low post scoring threat. See for yourself.


http://www.teamrankings.com/nba/stat


Use this website. The Clippers are a top 5 frontcourt on both ends statistically if you look through all of the categories. Blake Griffin isn't clutch yet and may never be... but to say you can't give him the ball and get buckets is dumb. Before this year the team has always ignored Blake in the 4th quarter favoring CP3+vets like Billups and Butler, so it's dumb to analyze how Blake is late games in the post, when he's not getting the ball.

The reason the Clippers didn't make it passed the first round as Chronz said was the defense. Which stemmed from injuries and ****** coaching/schemes. Although Memphis had 56 wins and was a great team, so it's dumb not to give them any credit.

Chronz
11-01-2013, 06:18 PM
OK. We can disagree. I still see the Clippers as a flawed team not capable of winning a title without consistent low post scoring and FT shooting. That high paced, above the rim game will prove fatal once again in the playoffs. But obviously we are all entitled to our opinions. Besides CP3 the Clippers have nobody to rely on in a close game. And if Jordan and Griffin are playing down the stretch, they will be a major liability with their inability to knock down clutch FTs.
I dont know if they are contenders or not, I just know the reason you gave for citing our demise against the very same team I've already seen our team beat in a series were wrong. I know why my team won and lost against the same foe and it had nothing to do with our offense as our offense was elite.

If the biggest problem you have as a contender is the free throw shooting of your bigs, then you are in great shape. What is of FAR greater significance is how your team can DEFEND for the ENTIRETY of the game. Sadly, thats where the Clippers have the greatest fluctuation and thus its biggest question mark.

Clippersfan86
11-01-2013, 06:20 PM
I dont know if they are contenders or not, I just know the reason you gave for citing our demise against the very same team I've already seen our team beat in a series were wrong. I know why my team won and lost against the same foe and it had nothing to do with our offense as our offense was elite.

If the biggest problem you have as a contender is the free throw shooting of your bigs, then you are in great shape. What is of FAR greater significance is how your team can DEFEND for the ENTIRETY of the game. Sadly, thats where the Clippers have the greatest fluctuation and thus its biggest question mark.

Surprised you didn't call him out for the cliche "fast paced" team BS lol. How many times does this sh** need to be dispelled? We were like 26th and then 17th in pace the two years under CP3 I believe.

beliges
11-02-2013, 02:41 AM
I understand its your team and you will be defensive about it. I'm not here to create conflict. Neither Griffin nor Jordan are serious threats offensively down low. If you think otherwise then you are simply blinded by your own bias. They are not the type of player that you throw the ball to in the post and expect to make plays down the stretch. Not a chance. There's a reason the Clippers couldnt make it passed the 1st round last year.

I'm blinded by bias even though I give you the numbers? Blake has ranked 2nd, 1st and 3rd in points in the paint in his three years. By all accounts that's a VERY good low post scoring threat. See for yourself.


http://www.teamrankings.com/nba/stat


Use this website. The Clippers are a top 5 frontcourt on both ends statistically if you look through all of the categories. Blake Griffin isn't clutch yet and may never be... but to say you can't give him the ball and get buckets is dumb. Before this year the team has always ignored Blake in the 4th quarter favoring CP3+vets like Billups and Butler, so it's dumb to analyze how Blake is late games in the post, when he's not getting the ball.

The reason the Clippers didn't make it passed the first round as Chronz said was the defense. Which stemmed from injuries and ****** coaching/schemes. Although Memphis had 56 wins and was a great team, so it's dumb not to give them any credit.

Points in the paint do not equate to a go to post player. Dwight scores a crap load of points in the paint and he's a terrible offensive player. It's comical for you to make the argument that griffin and jordan are good post up players. As I said I understand you're a fan but you need to be objective for a minute. Clippers aren't going anywhere until they get a consistent post up player and they get guys that can knick down Fts. This ia the reason they couldn't get passed the 1st round last season and these problems haven't been resolved yet this season. But hey, blake is ranked 2nd in points in the paint right? LOL. sorry to break it to you but blake is not a reliable scorer and therein lies your problem because you're #2 option is unreliable at best.

Clippersfan86
11-02-2013, 10:31 AM
I think a good post player is an efficient threat down low who gets buckets. I don't care if the post game itself is pretty or not. What do you care about, Flash or production?

mightybosstone
11-02-2013, 10:54 AM
I clicked on the video, but when I saw it was 11 minutes long, I immediately turned it off. I don't need some random guy I've never heard of to tell me the problems with an NBA team on paper. But the bottom line is that this Lakers team's problems outweigh any positives and the Clippers positives outweigh any problems.

At best, the Lakers will be a fast-paced offense which could maybe squeak out a 7-8 seed if Kobe comes back in time to impose his will. More than likely, though, I think they'll miss out on the playoffs entirely and be lucky to win 40 games. The guys who are getting substantial minutes on their squad wouldn't get close to those minutes on 70-80 percent of the other teams in the league. When Shawne Williams is starting and you're counting on Xavier Henry to be your savior, you're gonna have a bad time.

On the flipside, I really think the sky is the limit for the Clippers. As Simmons and Chronz have said, this is the put up or shut up season for Blake. And I don't see any significant improvements in this game, but I do see enough improvement around him on this roster to see the Clippers as significant contenders this season. In the two games I've watched them, Jordan seems to be the one making the improvements, and I've been very impressed with his defense at times. Throw that in with what seems to be a much more well designed offense under Doc and a very deep team with elite shooters, and this Clippers team could very well be the Western Conference representative in the Finals. They were my pick, at least.

Goose17
11-02-2013, 11:08 AM
If Blake can get a foot in the paint before catching he's pretty dangerous.

His problem comes from not being able to back down effectively from further out or face up and take a jump shot. Not consistently anyway.

Just my two cents^

Goose17
11-02-2013, 11:10 AM
the not-warriors


seriously tho - a healthy Spurs team

It's funny because I feel the only true threat to a conference finals appearance for us is a healthy Spurs team as well.

WARRIORS@GR
11-02-2013, 11:13 AM
I haven't watched the Lakers much,but i guess their problem is that they are starting scrubs like Blake,Wes Johnson and Williams.
For the Clippers,I watched 2 of their 3 games.Their biggest possible problem is Blake remaining atrocious on defense,and DJ not being able to stay in the game,and i mean physically and mentally.
If cp3 and DJ keep playing like that,and Blake somehow improves his defense,look out.

Swashcuff
11-02-2013, 11:14 AM
I think a good post player is an efficient threat down low who gets buckets. I don't care if the post game itself is pretty or not. What do you care about, Flash or production?

I have been watching their vids for quite some time especially those in which he breaks down and he does have a great deal of knowledge as I have learned a bit from him but IMO he is guilty of over analyzing on more occasions than not. I mean seriously using film from one game to state why these teams would have problems? Firstly 90% of what he spoke of could have been said just by looking at these teams on paper and having an elementary understand of the players and the system in which they play in. Its one game and though his analysis is sound its way too small of a sample size to come to any accurate conclusion of a player's or a team's play over the course of a season.

Swashcuff
11-02-2013, 11:16 AM
I haven't watched the Lakers much,but i guess their problem is that they are starting scrubs like Blake,Wes Johnson and Williams.
For the Clippers,I watched 2 of their 3 games.Their biggest possible problem is Blake remaining atrocious on defense,and DJ not being able to stay in the game,and i mean physically and mentally.
If cp3 and DJ keep playing like that,and Blake somehow improves his defense,look out.

Need to get your eyes checked a bit bro. Blake has looked pretty solid defensively for the better part of the last to seasons. He has made some costly gambles this season (I watched two Clippers games myself) and has looked lost at times on rotations but his man D has been extremely impressive and much improved from the player he once was.

WARRIORS@GR
11-02-2013, 11:24 AM
Need to get your eyes checked a bit bro. Blake has looked pretty solid defensively for the better part of the last to seasons. He has made some costly gambles this season (I watched two Clippers games myself) and has looked lost at times on rotations but his man D has been extremely impressive and much improved from the player he once was.He was looking completely lost against Lee,it seemed to me he wasn't even trying.
I feel he really needs to improve.The WC is full of good offensive bigs,Duncan(ok,more of a center) Lee,Zbo,Love,Pau,Kendrick Perkins,etc

Swashcuff
11-02-2013, 11:32 AM
He was looking completely lost against Lee,it seemed to me he wasn't even trying.
I feel he really needs to improve.The WC is full of good offensive bigs,Duncan(ok,more of a center) Lee,Zbo,Love,Pau,Kendrick Perkins,etc

Lol at Kendrick I know you were trying to be funny lol.

I certainly saw him trying against Lee but with the pace of that game getting any sort of defensive positioning against a player like Lee was difficult. No one looked good defensively that game inside for either team.

Clippersfan86
11-02-2013, 11:40 AM
If Blake can get a foot in the paint before catching he's pretty dangerous.

His problem comes from not being able to back down effectively from further out or face up and take a jump shot. Not consistently anyway.

Just my two cents^

And you would be right. But people make the mistake of thinking that if you have a flaw= you suck. Blake for example... his post game can be very awkward and unorthodox sometimes.... which nobody likes BUT if he's scoring consistently and efficiently with it.. would it be accurate to say "Blake sucks as a post player"? That's my bone to pick here.

Clippersfan86
11-02-2013, 11:42 AM
Need to get your eyes checked a bit bro. Blake has looked pretty solid defensively for the better part of the last to seasons. He has made some costly gambles this season (I watched two Clippers games myself) and has looked lost at times on rotations but his man D has been extremely impressive and much improved from the player he once was.

Hey we agree again. You're spot on with this. Blake has developed and improved massively on man D and rotating. His defensive weakness is still at the rim but he's got back to back two block games now, let's see if he learns to use his athleticism for some blocks going forward. Blake's quickness and athleticism allow him to play a KG type role (Though NOWHERE near as good) on defense where he can be aggressive helping on PNR's and be switched onto a guard and still get a stop.

Clippersfan86
11-02-2013, 11:43 AM
He was looking completely lost against Lee,it seemed to me he wasn't even trying.
I feel he really needs to improve.The WC is full of good offensive bigs,Duncan(ok,more of a center) Lee,Zbo,Love,Pau,Kendrick Perkins,etc

As Swash said it was a Run N Gun type game, neither team played much D... don't use that as the sample.

Swashcuff
11-02-2013, 11:45 AM
And you would be right. But people make the mistake of thinking that if you have a flaw= you suck. Blake for example... his post game can be very awkward and unorthodox sometimes.... which nobody likes BUT if he's scoring consistently and efficiently with it.. would it be accurate to say "Blake sucks as a post player"? That's my bone to pick here.

Basketball is a sport that so many people get confused with the aesthetics and think if it looks good then its good. For example Kevin Martin's shot. He's one of the best shooters in the game and if you're teaching a kid to ball KMart is the last player you'd want him to look at. As important as proper form IS what's more important is that you're comfortable in what you're doing and that you are being effective with it. If Blake/Howard's post game looks horrible and they are able to convert at a high rate then they are set. If it looks good and they're no where near being effective then they have a problem. What's for you is for you. Every player is different.

Clippersfan86
11-02-2013, 11:54 AM
Basketball is a sport that so many people get confused with the aesthetics and think if it looks good then its good. For example Kevin Martin's shot. He's one of the best shooters in the game and if you're teaching a kid to ball KMart is the last player you'd want him to look at. As important as proper form IS what's more important is that you're comfortable in what you're doing and that you are being effective with it. If Blake/Howard's post game looks horrible and they are able to convert at a high rate then they are set. If it looks good and they're no where near being effective then they have a problem. What's for you is for you. Every player is different.

Great post, 100 percent agree. Trust me I wish Blake's post moves looked as smooth as Hakeem or McHale... instead of jumping off the wrong foot or making less efficient moves.... but at the end of the day I care most about if he's converting.

Chronz
11-02-2013, 12:28 PM
our defense is still MIA

Clippersfan86
11-02-2013, 12:36 PM
our defense is still MIA

Agree... although given the opponents it's not surprising. Game 1 we face a Lakers team fired up like it was game 7 of the finals and literally EVERYBODY was raining shots on us contested or not. Game 2 we faced the Warriors, maybe the most explosive offense in the league. Then game 3 we faced the Kings who were a top notch offense last year (12th ranked for season, 3rd after ASW) and look much improved this year.

It doesn't get easier next game either when we face the Rockets. Just saying when you face a bunch of great offensive teams and explosive scoring teams it's hard to learn a new system. I think around 10-15 games in the defense should start settling in.

JLynn943
11-02-2013, 01:08 PM
our defense is still MIA

They did well against pretty much everybody except Cousins and Thomas. Overall, I thought the Clippers defense was pretty good last night. Part of that may have been that the Kings offense is still finding itself in this new system right now though.

Clippersfan86
11-02-2013, 01:11 PM
They did well against pretty much everybody except Cousins and Thomas. Overall, I thought the Clippers defense was pretty good last night. Part of that may have been that the Kings offense is still finding itself in this new system right now though.

Yea also the D only went to sh** when our bench came in. Kings were shooting 39 percent before the mid 3rd quarter when Isiah went ******* on Darren Collison (when CP3 went to bench).

JLynn943
11-02-2013, 01:16 PM
Yea also the D only went to sh** when our bench came in. Kings were shooting 39 percent before the mid 3rd quarter when Isiah went ******* on Darren Collison (when CP3 went to bench).

Yeah, before Isaiah came in, the Kings offense wasn't getting anything done. He did it to everybody last night though. He played a lot against CP3 and was still getting it done, but Isaiah is a pretty unique player that the Clippers aren't going to have to deal with much, so I wouldn't worry much about it.

Otherwise, it was hard to tell how much of the Kings struggles were them forcing things and how much was the Clippers defense, but the Clippers defense was at the very least solid. They did a good job of crowding the paint to make things difficult on Cousins and our other players who kept going at the basket. They definitely left the perimeter open more than we took advantage of though.

Clippersfan86
11-02-2013, 01:19 PM
Yeah, before Isaiah came in, the Kings offense wasn't getting anything done. He did it to everybody last night though. He played a lot against CP3 and was still getting it done, but Isaiah is a pretty unique player that the Clippers aren't going to have to deal with much, so I wouldn't worry much about it.

Otherwise, it was hard to tell how much of the Kings struggles were them forcing things and how much was the Clippers defense, but the Clippers defense was at the very least solid. They did a good job of crowding the paint to make things difficult on Cousins and our other players who kept going at the basket. They definitely left the perimeter open more than we took advantage of though.

Yea Thomas is good period, just saying he had particular success against Collison. I believe he only scored 10 of his 29 on CP3 and a couple of those buckets were actually on our bigmen who failed on help D when he blew by CP3. He's fast as hell and his first step is nasty!

Did you notice Blake's defense on Cousins in the 4th quarter? DJ had trouble with Cousin's strength but Griffin did a much better job holding position against Cousins and even stripped him going up a couple times.

todu82
11-02-2013, 01:41 PM
Yeah, the Clippers have picked it up the last 2 games after a loss in Game 1. As to the Lakers I think they're in for a long playoff-missing season.