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View Full Version : Best Runs by "Secondary Options" (Where do Wade's 2 fit?)



Chronz
10-26-2013, 08:02 AM
The Wade thread got me thinking about his place in history and just how much his recently acquired rings are really worth. Hes generally had enough in the tank to summon a few great games in nearly every series, and hes definitely come up big when it counts, but this past year the Heat killed it when he was on the bench and in the end, all champions can claim to coming up big when necessary, its the total package that matters most.


With that in mind, what are best seasons from #2's, how many would you rank ahead of Wade?

Lets say you could nominate a single season per player, how would you rank them?

#1 Kobe - 2001 : Nothing you can say, we start this list from here.

Pippen, Drexler, D-Rob, Manu, TP, Shaq, Pierce, Pau and Chandler/JET, Chauncey/Ben.

Those are basically our premier sidekicks from the most recent championship squads.

PurpleLynch
10-26-2013, 08:07 AM
Pau Gasol in the back to back championships. He was outstanding in those championships,so a high position.
But at 2# I'd put Pippen.
SO:
1-Kobe
2-Pippen
3-Parker
4-Gasol
5-Shaq
6-Chandler
7-Big Ben
8-D-Rob
9-Pierce
10-Manu

PurpleLynch
10-26-2013, 08:16 AM
I didn't put Billups in the #2s because for me it was the "man" for Detroit.

kdspurman
10-26-2013, 10:21 AM
Pau Gasol in the back to back championships. He was outstanding in those championships,so a high position.
But at 2# I'd put Pippen.
SO:
1-Kobe
2-Pippen
3-Parker
4-Gasol
5-Shaq
6-Chandler
7-Big Ben
8-D-Rob
9-Pierce
10-Manu

Maybe it's just me, but I don't think Manu belongs @ 10. In 05, he was really good, against a very good defense in Detroit.

Hellcrooner
10-26-2013, 10:46 AM
The Wade thread got me thinking about his place in history and just how much his recently acquired rings are really worth. Hes generally had enough in the tank to summon a few great games in nearly every series, and hes definitely come up big when it counts, but this past year the Heat killed it when he was on the bench and in the end, all champions can claim to coming up big when necessary, its the total package that matters most.


With that in mind, what are best seasons from #2's, how many would you rank ahead of Wade?

Lets say you could nominate a single season per player, how would you rank them?

#1 Kobe - 2001 : Nothing you can say, we start this list from here.

Pippen, Drexler, D-Rob, Manu, TP, Shaq, Pierce, Pau and Chandler/JET, Chauncey/Ben.

Those are basically our premier sidekicks from the most recent championship squads.

My ***.

1979-80

Second option Magic Johnson.

Nothing more to say.

ManRam
10-26-2013, 11:10 AM
My ***.

1979-80

Second option Magic Johnson.

Nothing more to say.

Read the last sentence of his post.


I like this thread. I'll sit down a little later and bang out a list. Methinks Wade will be very low. The fun thing is, even as subpar as he's been in the playoffs, Chris Bosh hasn't mustered enough either year to do better. Both really have come up short.

But hey, RINGZ! Amirite?!

PhillyFaninLA
10-26-2013, 11:20 AM
So you start a thread and say your opinion does not matter because this is #1 so lets start there.....so you ask for us to contribute but are telling is our opinions don't matter because this is #1...this is why I don't like so many Laker fans and how you make me hate a team I would probably be neutral about otherwise.

Hellcrooner
10-26-2013, 11:51 AM
Read the last sentence of his post.


I like this thread. I'll sit down a little later and bang out a list. Methinks Wade will be very low. The fun thing is, even as subpar as he's been in the playoffs, Chris Bosh hasn't mustered enough either year to do better. Both really have come up short.

But hey, RINGZ! Amirite?!
Then whats pippen doing on the list.

Bruno
10-26-2013, 03:36 PM
My ***.

1979-80

Second option Magic Johnson.

Nothing more to say.

Wrong. 2001 Kobe takes 1980 Magic, and the difference isn't marginal. Both in regular season statistical production and in post-season statistical production. The only difference is that Magic walked away with a finals MVP and Kobe didn't.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&p1=bryanko01&y1=2001&p2=johnsma02&y2=1980

The 2001 Lakers posted the greatest post-season run in NBA history. Kobe lead that team in post-season win-shares. Magic numbers from '80 don't rival Kobes from '01. And who was the better defender? 2001 Kobe by far.

Bruno
10-26-2013, 06:12 PM
Dwyane Wade 2013
Dwyane Wade 2012
Tyson Chandler 2011
Pau Gasol 2010
Pau Gasol 2009
Paul Pierce 2008
Tony Parker 2007
Shaq O'neal 2006
Manu Ginboli 2005
Chauncey Billups 2004
David Robinson 2003
Kobe Bryant 2002
Kobe Bryant 2001
Kobe Bryant 2000
David Robinson 1999
Scottie Pippen 1998
Scottie Pippen 1997
Scottie Pippen 1996
Clyde Drexler 1995.
Robert Horry 1994
Scottie Pippen 1993
Scottie Pippen 1992
Scottie Pippen 1991
Joe Dumars 1990
Joe Dumars 1989
James Worthy 1988
James Worthy 1987
Kevin McHale 1986
KAJ- 1985
Kevin McHale 1984
Dr. J 1983
KAJ 1982
Cedric Maxwell 1981
Magic Johnson 1980

you'd be hard pressed to find five worse 'second option' playoff performances than Wades from 2013 dating back to 1980. thats my list of options, I'd need more time than I have right now to rank them.

Fun trivia- how many of these 'second options' walked away with finals MVP? do you know the answer without googling?

Bruno
10-26-2013, 06:21 PM
Kobe 2001, Manu 2005, David Robison 1999*, Pau Gasol 2010, Magic Johnson 1980, Pippen 1991, Pippen 1996, KAJ 1985 Pau 2009, and McHale 1986 are the top ten second options playoff runs since 1980 imo. I think Kobe and Manu had the clear cut #1 and #2 performances statistically speaking, although I'd need more time to accurately rank the other eight.

amos1er
10-26-2013, 06:37 PM
Dwyane Wade 2013
Dwyane Wade 2012
Tyson Chandler 2011
Pau Gasol 2010
Pau Gasol 2009
Paul Pierce 2008
Tony Parker 2007
Shaq O'neal 2006
Manu Ginboli 2005
Chauncey Billups 2004
David Robinson 2003
Kobe Bryant 2002
Kobe Bryant 2001
Kobe Bryant 2000
David Robinson 1999
Scottie Pippen 1998
Scottie Pippen 1997
Scottie Pippen 1996
Clyde Drexler 1995.
Robert Horry 1994
Scottie Pippen 1993
Scottie Pippen 1992
Scottie Pippen 1991
Joe Dumars 1990
Joe Dumars 1989
James Worthy 1988
James Worthy 1987
Kevin McHale 1986
KAJ- 1985
Kevin McHale 1984
Dr. J 1983
KAJ 1982
Cedric Maxwell 1981
Magic Johnson 1980

you'd be hard pressed to find five worse 'second option' playoff performances than Wades from 2013 dating back to 1980. thats my list of options, I'd need more time than I have right now to rank them.

Fun trivia- how many of these 'second options' walked away with finals MVP? do you know the answer without googling?

Tony Parker 2007
Magic Johnson 1980
Cedric Maxwell 1981
Kareem 1985
Billups 2004
Paul Pierce 2008 (though debatable if he was a second option)
Joe Dumars 1989

Could also say Wade 2006 as he was the second option throughout except for the finals.

amos1er
10-26-2013, 06:45 PM
1. Kobe 2001
2. Magic 1980
3. Kobe 2002
4. Kobe 2000
5. Wade 2012
6. Pippen 1991
7. Pippen 1996
8. Robinson 1999
9. Ginobili 2005
10. Worthy 1988
11. Parker 2007
12. Gasol 2010
13. Kareem 1985
14. McHale 1986
15. Gasol 2009

Chronz
10-26-2013, 06:58 PM
Yeah secondary option is a misnomer, I meant more as in secondary star.

4milesperday
10-26-2013, 07:19 PM
Did Ahmadinejad start this tread? Why should anyone comment if you don't think their opinions matter?

Bruno
10-26-2013, 07:29 PM
Did Ahmadinejad start this tread? Why should anyone comment if you don't think their opinions matter?

pressent an argument for any second option having a better playoff run than Kobe did in 2001. then we can have a discussion.

b@llhog24
10-26-2013, 07:31 PM
McHale should be higher on these lists.

Chronz
10-26-2013, 09:07 PM
I forgot to stipulate that I was only talking about the most recent teams but feel free to go as far back as you want. And people stop complaining, stand up for your beliefs rather than cry that you dont have a say when you obviously do.

Chronz
10-27-2013, 02:35 AM
Pau Gasol in the back to back championships. He was outstanding in those championships,so a high position.
But at 2# I'd put Pippen.
SO:
1-Kobe
2-Pippen
3-Parker
4-Gasol
5-Shaq
6-Chandler
7-Big Ben
8-D-Rob
9-Pierce
10-Manu
Not A bad list, respect

Chronz
10-27-2013, 02:38 AM
My ***.

1979-80

Second option Magic Johnson.

Nothing more to say.

Wrong. 2001 Kobe takes 1980 Magic, and the difference isn't marginal. Both in regular season statistical production and in post-season statistical production. The only difference is that Magic walked away with a finals MVP and Kobe didn't.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&p1=bryanko01&y1=2001&p2=johnsma02&y2=1980

The 2001 Lakers posted the greatest post-season run in NBA history. Kobe lead that team in post-season win-shares. Magic numbers from '80 don't rival Kobes from '01. And who was the better defender? 2001 Kobe by far.agreed
Marketing played a bigger role in Magics MVP so we shouldn't punish Kareem

Chronz
10-27-2013, 02:39 AM
Kobe 2001, Manu 2005, David Robison 1999*, Pau Gasol 2010, Magic Johnson 1980, Pippen 1991, Pippen 1996, KAJ 1985 Pau 2009, and McHale 1986 are the top ten second options playoff runs since 1980 imo. I think Kobe and Manu had the clear cut #1 and #2 performances statistically speaking, although I'd need more time to accurately rank the other eight.
Why Manu?

rhino17
10-27-2013, 02:50 AM
Scottie Pippen 1996
Clyde Drexler 1995.
Robert Horry 1994
Scottie Pippen 1993

Robert Harry was nowhere close to the #2 option

rhino17
10-27-2013, 02:51 AM
Pau Gasol in the back to back championships. He was outstanding in those championships,so a high position.
But at 2# I'd put Pippen.
SO:
1-Kobe
2-Pippen
3-Parker
4-Gasol
5-Shaq
6-Chandler
7-Big Ben
8-D-Rob
9-Pierce
10-Manu
I like this

But how was pierce a #2? Who was 1?

Chronz
10-27-2013, 03:46 AM
I like this

But how was pierce a #2? Who was 1?

KG was clearly his teams best player

PurpleLynch
10-27-2013, 08:51 AM
I like this

But how was pierce a #2? Who was 1?

Kg was the man in Boston. Physically,mentally and overall performance by Kg were the key to their version of Big Three. And the results showed in 2008.

PurpleLynch
10-27-2013, 08:55 AM
Not A bad list, respect

Maybe,but probably,I put Chandler in a higher spot than he derserves. I guess you can switch at 6# Manu or Pierce. I'd take Manu,because it was extremely efficient against the Pistons,something like 506% fg and and an excellent three point %.

jerellh528
10-27-2013, 01:18 PM
This would be a good candidate for the comparisons forum.

Lakersfan2483
10-27-2013, 04:19 PM
So you start a thread and say your opinion does not matter because this is #1 so lets start there.....so you ask for us to contribute but are telling is our opinions don't matter because this is #1...this is why I don't like so many Laker fans and how you make me hate a team I would probably be neutral about otherwise.

Since when has Chronz been a Laker fan? He's a Clippers' fan.

Chronz
10-27-2013, 04:45 PM
1. Kobe 2001
2. Magic 1980
3. Kobe 2002
4. Kobe 2000
5. Wade 2012
6. Pippen 1991
7. Pippen 1996
8. Robinson 1999
9. Ginobili 2005
10. Worthy 1988
11. Parker 2007
12. Gasol 2010
13. Kareem 1985
14. McHale 1986
15. Gasol 2009
I know I didn't really ask for a time frame so I wasn't expecting their names but how do you feel about West's and Oscar's championship? Would they shoot to the top?

Not surprised to see the Kobe love, can I ask what makes 2000 stand out above other championship runs?

Chronz
10-27-2013, 05:20 PM
This is a hard list to come up with when you delve beyond the 80's, Top3 would be KB-01, KM-86 and Magic, and yes I would definitely have McHale ahead of Rookie Magic. After those 3, I know Pippen in 91, 92 deserves strong consideration, certainly ahead of at least 1 of Kobe's chips. I underrate the quality of Wade's 12 run tho, he had many more strong moments than he did this past year, but I dont know if hes ahead of Pau, Worthy or Erving.

I guess Im the only non impressed by Tony's Finals MVP run, I wouldn't even put that ahead of Manu's run 2 years prior.