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View Full Version : How much value do head to head stats hold when comparing 2 greats?



el hidalgo
08-10-2013, 06:24 PM
Pretty much what the title says. How much value do head 2 head stats have when you are comparing 2 great players. Larry Bird vs Magic johnson for example. Here are kobe and lebrons head to head stats

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=jamesle01&p2=bryanko01

Do these provide any sway when comparing 2 players?

Supreme LA
08-10-2013, 06:34 PM
It's kind of hard to say with meaningless regular season games. Both teams are from opposing conferences who hardly play each other to become familiar with one another. It's also hard to compare when both players play different positions, are at different stages of their careers, and have different roles for their teams. But everybody will have an opinion, and seeing as how this is PSD, Lebron is GOD and Kobe is a overrated scrub?

Tony_Starks
08-10-2013, 06:50 PM
Only relevant if they're from the same or very close drafts/ same postion. Like Kobe vs Ray Allen. But comparing say Kevin Loves vs Dirks doesn't make much sense to me..

Minimal
08-10-2013, 06:54 PM
Regular season games doesn't prove much. And its a team game, not 1 player against another type game. If they played the same positions, this might have been of some kind of value, showing which player limits the other more, but as they are playing different positions, this doesn't prove much.

Ebbs
08-10-2013, 06:59 PM
It's like a tie breaker type factor.

ClearSoulForce
08-10-2013, 07:04 PM
Only relevant if they're from the same or very close drafts/ same postion. Like Kobe vs Ray Allen. But comparing say Kevin Loves vs Dirks doesn't make much sense to me..

Kevin Love isn't within 5000 atmospheres of Dirk.

One guy (Dirk) is a top 20 player of all timw while the other has never been the the playoffs and puts up meaningless stats and is already considered better than Dirk and is a lock to be better than him all time.

IKnowHoops
08-10-2013, 07:11 PM
Comparing head to head is important when all things are equal. But I think that what you do against the league is more important because the sample size is so much larger and equally that much more important. But if all things are equal as far as overall stats, then the head to head stats would serve as the tie breaker as someone has mentioned earlier. "The series" in which Hakeem gave it to "David" is the only piece of history where Olajuwan gets the better of David, but it is the Base, midsection and head of all Olajuwan > David stances.

ILLUSIONIST^248
08-10-2013, 07:42 PM
Pretty much what the title says. How much value do head 2 head stats have when you are comparing 2 great players. Larry Bird vs Magic johnson for example. Here are kobe and lebrons head to head stats

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=jamesle01&p2=bryanko01

Do these provide any sway when comparing 2 players?

Not much unless it's in the playoffs.

I gave you a eat down in a head to head account bet, how much does it mean the you didn't honor it and still post?

JerseyPalahniuk
08-10-2013, 07:47 PM
Only if they guard each other for more than half the game do those stats mean anything

el hidalgo
08-10-2013, 07:48 PM
Not much unless it's in the playoffs.

I gave you a eat down in a head to head account bet, how much does it mean the you didn't honor it and still post?
Why do you keep making this up and posting in in literally every thread? give it a break bro

bagwell368
08-10-2013, 09:43 PM
head to head of Bird vs Magic is almost useless. They didn't cover each other.

McHale v Barkley - that's a good one.

TC v KG - another good one.

Can't even imagine why this matters?
Only relevant if they're from the same or very close drafts/ same postion.

C-Wick925
08-10-2013, 10:01 PM
25

slashsnake
08-10-2013, 10:28 PM
They show a little but I would take every single one of them with a grain of salt. You look at Shaq vs. Ben Wallace or Dikembe and Shaq was still dominant as always. The difference was that while other teams were double and triple teaming Shaq and leaving other guys open, those two would play him straight up. Comparing across positions is pretty useless. What did Jordan have to do with Karl Malone maybe playing below his averages vs. him. That was more about what Hornacek and Rodman were doing on the other side of the ball.

el hidalgo
08-10-2013, 10:35 PM
They show a little but I would take every single one of them with a grain of salt. You look at Shaq vs. Ben Wallace or Dikembe and Shaq was still dominant as always. The difference was that while other teams were double and triple teaming Shaq and leaving other guys open, those two would play him straight up. Comparing across positions is pretty useless. What did Jordan have to do with Karl Malone maybe playing below his averages vs. him. That was more about what Hornacek and Rodman were doing on the other side of the ball.
I think head to head is very useful when comparing a player like Rodman. You can see how he did against all time greats like Shaq. He held shaq to a much lower FG% than Shaq normally got at the time. Not sure which years Rodman guarded shaq, though.

amos1er
08-10-2013, 11:30 PM
What a troll thread. We all see what you are up to here. You are obviously insinuating that since Lebron's stats are better than Kobe's, he is automatically the better player. Lame.

TheMightyHumph
08-10-2013, 11:35 PM
Pretty much what the title says. How much value do head 2 head stats have when you are comparing 2 great players. Larry Bird vs Magic johnson for example. Here are kobe and lebrons head to head stats

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=jamesle01&p2=bryanko01

Do these provide any sway when comparing 2 players?

None

b@llhog24
08-10-2013, 11:57 PM
It's like a tie breaker type factor.

Essentially this. One of the most meaningless factors imo, and that's after that subjective clutch, winner, heart mantra.

Delrayhc
08-11-2013, 12:28 AM
What a troll thread. We all see what you are up to here. You are obviously insinuating that since Lebron's stats are better than Kobe's, he is automatically the better player. Lame.

You were banned the other week for creating a troll thread yourself hypocrite.

slashsnake
08-11-2013, 06:31 AM
I think head to head is very useful when comparing a player like Rodman. You can see how he did against all time greats like Shaq. He held shaq to a much lower FG% than Shaq normally got at the time. Not sure which years Rodman guarded shaq, though.

Rodman never guarded shaq. He'd come help off the double a lot and cause some havoc there, but it wasn't like Shaq was coming down and trying to post up Rodman. He was usually on Horace Grant those early magic years (or JT).