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View Full Version : How the Nets Match Up with the Heat (Coach Nick)



Guppyfighter
08-03-2013, 07:53 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LHntcHNJTOE

JerseyPalahniuk
08-03-2013, 08:02 PM
I'm not one to post these kind of things but... nets forum.

D-Leethal
08-03-2013, 08:06 PM
Nets will get stifled by Miami's pressure D and run off the court with their speed and spread offense the same way they did last year and it won't look much different.

Guppyfighter
08-03-2013, 08:06 PM
I'm not one to post these kind of things but... nets forum.

It's a deep statistical analysis on two contending East teams.

We need more of this in the NBA forum.

****, I have people say this BS to me posting Bucks material and now this. I am a Warriors fan.

D-Leethal
08-03-2013, 08:08 PM
It's a deep statistical analysis on two contending East teams.

We need more of this in the NBA forum.

****, I have people say this BS to me posting Bucks material and now this. I am a Warriors fan.

I thought it was a pretty cool vid. I would like to see more of those.

I Rock Shaqs
08-03-2013, 08:15 PM
Nets will get stifled by Miami's pressure D and run off the court with their speed and spread offense the same way they did last year and it won't look much different.

As much as I completely disagree with you in the other thread I agree with you here lol.

Chill_Will_24
08-03-2013, 08:24 PM
I agree with his analysis. We will know so much more after we see what type of offense kidd will run and how the team responds to him. To this day Kidd and his Mavs are the only ones that managed to solve the Heat puzzle and they did it by taking care of the ball. The Nets got an upgrade in bbiq, interior defense, coaching, passing, and toughness this summer.

Basically if they can take care of the ball, play good team defense, and not fall to pieces when MIA goes small, they have a great shot

ryang
08-03-2013, 08:35 PM
Dallas beat Miami because Miami wasn't ready for that moment. They also had a higher pay roll then Miami and Miami had a lack luster bench compared to now. Oh and Lebron grew as a a player since then

ryang
08-03-2013, 08:36 PM
Do you honestly think coaches , executives etc etc dont know what it takes to beat Miami? They know but it's easier said then done

Guppyfighter
08-03-2013, 08:39 PM
Dallas beat Miami because Miami wasn't ready for that moment. They also had a higher pay roll then Miami and Miami had a lack luster bench compared to now. Oh and Lebron grew as a a player since then
:laugh:

ryang
08-03-2013, 08:43 PM
Look at the number before you go laughing.

Guppyfighter
08-03-2013, 08:44 PM
Look at the number before you go laughing.

I am laughing because of how much that doesn't matter and that implies the nets would beat the Heat. Payroll and all.

ryang
08-03-2013, 08:47 PM
The nets payroll is high due to the new cba. Dallas simply had more ammo. Look what happened to them the following year. They had to be gutted due to that payroll. Dallas beat the Heat because Miami wasn't ready. They are now tho

Guppyfighter
08-03-2013, 08:48 PM
The nets payroll is high due to the new cba. Dallas simply had more ammo. Look what happened to them the following year. They had to be gutted due to that payroll. Dallas beat the Heat because Miami wasn't ready. They are now tho

Uh. The Nets payroll would be higher than the Heat regardless of the CBA. Heat are also only the sixth highest payroll.

I am also finding the narrative they weren't ready particularly funny.

Chill_Will_24
08-03-2013, 08:49 PM
Dallas beat Miami because Miami wasn't ready for that moment. They also had a higher pay roll then Miami and Miami had a lack luster bench compared to now. Oh and Lebron grew as a a player since then

"wasnt ready for the moment" lol

Sounds like a lot of bull****

Mavs executed in the half court. Why is it so hard for Heat fans to give props to other teams even after back to back championships

Chill_Will_24
08-03-2013, 08:50 PM
The nets payroll is high due to the new cba. Dallas simply had more ammo. Look what happened to them the following year. They had to be gutted due to that payroll. Dallas beat the Heat because Miami wasn't ready. They are now tho

ooooh you are one of THOSE Heat fans. Yea moving on

ryang
08-03-2013, 08:52 PM
Who is taking something away from Dallas? Me why? Because I feel Lebron wasn't ready for the moment or the team didn't have enough help (supporting cast for the slow people). Either way who cares. The nets are not the mavs was my point.

Chill_Will_24
08-03-2013, 08:54 PM
Uh. The Nets payroll would be higher than the Heat regardless of the CBA. Heat are also only the sixth highest payroll.

I am also finding the narrative they weren't ready particularly funny.

I have met certain kind of Heat fans (not just here) that refuse to give props to any other team. Not the Bulls, not the Pacers last year and certainly not the 2011 Mavs. Its cute.

Guppyfighter
08-03-2013, 08:54 PM
Who is taking something away from Dallas? Me why? Because I feel Lebron wasn't ready for the moment or the team didn't have enough help (supporting cast for the slow people). Either way who cares. The nets are not the mavs was my point.

I can't believe you exist.

ryang
08-03-2013, 08:55 PM
ooooh you are one of THOSE Heat fans. Yea moving on

One of what? I said Miami wasn't ready for that series. Also said the mavs had more ammo. Pretty simple and reasonable to the normal fan. The fan who hates the Heat will obviously disagree. I could really care less. We've won back to back titles. Congrats on Dallas's accomplishment 3 years ago. I'm sure they gave us our props after beating them in 06. Oh wait no they didn't. That series was rigged I forgot.

Chill_Will_24
08-03-2013, 08:56 PM
Who is taking something away from Dallas? Me why? Because I feel Lebron wasn't ready for the moment or the team didn't have enough help (supporting cast for the slow people). Either way who cares. The nets are not the mavs was my point.

Funny you mention the slow people...

I am talking about basketball with actual analysis saying what my opinion is of how the Mavs did it and you come out with some ******** **** like "the Heat werent ready for the moment". Da fuq

ryang
08-03-2013, 08:56 PM
I can't believe you exist.

Says the 15 year old. Your a clown. My points aren't far fetched but you can continue to spew your garbage out and dismiss any other points people may have. Clown

Chill_Will_24
08-03-2013, 08:57 PM
I can't believe you exist.

:laugh2: There are a fair few of them out there. My 14y old little brother is one of them

ryang
08-03-2013, 08:58 PM
Funny you mention the slow people...

I am talking about basketball with actual analysis saying what my opinion is of how the Mavs did it and you come out with some ******** **** like "the Heat werent ready for the moment". Da fuq

The mavs had a better team then we did and we were not ready. Can you read? Or is my statement of Lebron shrinking and Miami not having enough ammo clouding your brain. Most basketball executives beleive the mavs had a better team (which i agreed with) they also feel we weren't ready! Lebron expecially.

Chill_Will_24
08-03-2013, 08:58 PM
One of what? I said Miami wasn't ready for that series. Also said the mavs had more ammo. Pretty simple and reasonable to the normal fan. The fan who hates the Heat will obviously disagree. I could really care less. We've won back to back titles. Congrats on Dallas's accomplishment 3 years ago. I'm sure they gave us our props after beating them in 06. Oh wait no they didn't. That series was rigged I forgot.

:sigh: stupid is as stupid is...

ryang
08-03-2013, 08:59 PM
:laugh2: There are a fair few of them out there. My 14y old little brother is one of them

You to are clowns. I said Dallas had more ammo (meaning better team) also said Lebron and company weren't ready and Lebron shrunk. Yea I'm off the wagon big time here huh

Chill_Will_24
08-03-2013, 09:00 PM
Says the 15 year old. Your a clown. My points aren't far fetched but you can continue to spew your garbage out and dismiss any other points people may have. Clown

:laugh: You have no points. You have no argument. The only garbage i have read on this thread goes to the tune of: "The 2011 Mavs won because the Heat werent ready for the moment".

ryang
08-03-2013, 09:01 PM
:sigh: stupid is as stupid is...

A point you obviously understand and can relate to. Anyways good luck with those nets. Gonna be fun watching you get bounced out the playoffs again.

Guppyfighter
08-03-2013, 09:01 PM
Says the 15 year old. Your a clown. My points aren't far fetched but you can continue to spew your garbage out and dismiss any other points people may have. Clown

Typically when people go for someone's age it means they are that age.

Stop projecting. We know you are 15.

Guppyfighter
08-03-2013, 09:03 PM
:laugh2: There are a fair few of them out there. My 14y old little brother is one of them

Yeah, kids have some really hilarious opinions.

Chill_Will_24
08-03-2013, 09:03 PM
You to are clowns. I said Dallas had more ammo (meaning better team) also said Lebron and company weren't ready and Lebron shrunk. Yea I'm off the wagon big time here huh

You completely shredded that one. FYI make sure you spell your insults correctly. Makes it more impressive.

Further FYI because you seem to need a lot of it. First sign of an idiot without an argument: Resorts to insults.

ryang
08-03-2013, 09:03 PM
:laugh: You have no points. You have no argument. The only garbage i have read on this thread goes to the tune of: "The 2011 Mavs won because the Heat werent ready for the moment".

Good job. Now keep reading. I also said they had more ammo. Again 15 year olds and people who dislike Miami can never see any reason. It's called reading. I know it's hard for you but try if you want to have any type of conversation. Or are you only on here to make up bull**** to make yourself feel better from your daily in counters with society. Alls I read from you is the Heat lost to Dallas and it was the greatest moment of my life.

D-Leethal
08-03-2013, 09:06 PM
I don't really get it. He said Dallas was the better team, he said LeBron shrunk in the Finals, he said the Heat as a team weren't ready yet.

I think all 3 are pretty true. Not many teams are 'ready' and gelled like a well oiled machine during their first season together.

His posts don't really reek of homerism or denial at all.

Captain Moroni
08-03-2013, 09:06 PM
PSD....where you can have an opinion, and it instantly makes you a moron.

ryang
08-03-2013, 09:07 PM
You completely shredded that one. FYI make sure you spell your insults correctly. Makes it more impressive.

Further FYI because you seem to need a lot of it. First sign of an idiot without an argument: Resorts to insults.

Auto correct. You do realize the insults weren't started from my end? Again you keep making **** up. Oh and usually when someone gets called out and know there wrong resort to spellcheck. Have fun with this one. My opinion is Dallas had more help and Miami wasn't ready. A lot of nba personnel feel the same. Do some research and stop making **** up. Makes you seem ********.

Guppyfighter
08-03-2013, 09:08 PM
Good job. Now keep reading. I also said they had more ammo. Again 15 year olds and people who dislike Miami can never see any reason. It's called reading. I know it's hard for you but try if you want to have any type of conversation. Or are you only on here to make up bull**** to make yourself feel better from your daily in counters with society. Alls I read from you is the Heat lost to Dallas and it was the greatest moment of my life.

I like Miami I just think everything you said is hysterical.

ryang
08-03-2013, 09:09 PM
I don't really get it. He said Dallas was the better team, he said LeBron shrunk in the Finals, he said the Heat as a team weren't ready yet.

I think all 3 are pretty true. Not many teams are 'ready' and gelled like a well oiled machine during their first season together.

His posts don't really reek of homerism or denial at all.

Not really sure what there problem is. Ill just assume there very young and have nothing better to do.

Guppyfighter
08-03-2013, 09:09 PM
I don't really get it. He said Dallas was the better team, he said LeBron shrunk in the Finals, he said the Heat as a team weren't ready yet.

I think all 3 are pretty true. Not many teams are 'ready' and gelled like a well oiled machine during their first season together.

His posts don't really reek of homerism or denial at all.

That line of thinking is from the skip bayless handbook.

It ignores actual basketball play and analysis for ****** narratives that should only exist in the WWE.

ryang
08-03-2013, 09:11 PM
I like Miami I just think everything you said is hysterical.

That's fine you can disagree. I won't call you ******** because of it tho. Not sure what's so funny? Dallas had a better team. Miami wasn't ready. And Lebron needed his nuts to drop. My opinion tho doesn't have to be yours

ryang
08-03-2013, 09:12 PM
That line of thinking is from the skip bayless handbook.

It ignores actual basketball play and analysis for ****** narratives that should only exist in the WWE.

What? You understand the whole team concept right? You do understand Lebron mentally was still a little boy who was rattled easily? You understand my statement of Dallas having the better team? Wwe? Lmao.

Guppyfighter
08-03-2013, 09:13 PM
That's fine you can disagree. I won't call you ******** because of it tho. Not sure what's so funny? Dallas had a better team. Miami wasn't ready. And Lebron needed his nuts to drop. My opinion tho doesn't have to be yours


Lebron has always been great in the playoffs, any other line of thought is lack of basketball knowledge and getting your opinion from Skip Bayless.

Heat weren't ready? They went up 2-0?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hv2jqFd2-qI

Watch that video.

Guppyfighter
08-03-2013, 09:14 PM
What? You understand the whole team concept right? You do understand Lebron mentally was still a little boy who was rattled easily? You understand my statement of Dallas having the better team? Wwe? Lmao.


Watch the video and stop saying embarrassing things.

D-Leethal
08-03-2013, 09:14 PM
That line of thinking is from the skip bayless handbook.

It ignores actual basketball play and analysis for ****** narratives that should only exist in the WWE.

Game doesn't take place in a vaccum and there is a mental/psychological factor in every sport.

Chill_Will_24
08-03-2013, 09:15 PM
A point you obviously understand and can relate to. Anyways good luck with those nets. Gonna be fun watching you get bounced out the playoffs again.

Lets start over Little Nicky. As far as your "weapons" go. IDK what the hell you are talking about cuz the heat had the best weapons on the whole court. The Mavs had a bunch of "old guys" (funny since thats what people are calling the Nets), and they had to make 4th quarter comebacks in EVERY game so its not like the Heat were outclassed by superior firepower as you are attempting to say.

Nope. Despite what your interesting brain may think about the Heat's "readiness for the moment" (lol), i think the answer lies more in the coaching and execution by the Mavs. They had a shot blocker in the middle, size, basketball iq, ball movement, 3pt shooting, and they took care of the ball i.e they executed in the half court.

That is how they won. Sure the Heat got better since then. However lets not act like their entire team doesnt start and end with LBJ

ryang
08-03-2013, 09:16 PM
Lebron shrunk in that series. Looked like he was on the verge of that again this year against the spurs. He said himself he wasn't ready. Also said it again this year before the spurs series. Remember? I was half the player I was the first time I met the spurs in the finals? Wade co signed to that as well as pop. He has grown tremendously since that Dallas series.

Chill_Will_24
08-03-2013, 09:17 PM
Good job. Now keep reading. I also said they had more ammo. Again 15 year olds and people who dislike Miami can never see any reason. It's called reading. I know it's hard for you but try if you want to have any type of conversation. Or are you only on here to make up bull**** to make yourself feel better from your daily in counters with society. Alls I read from you is the Heat lost to Dallas and it was the greatest moment of my life.

:laugh: OMG this is pure gold

D-Leethal
08-03-2013, 09:19 PM
And saying they 'werent ready' doesn't necessarily mean if they 'were ready' or if they had 'been through the wars' as a unit already, that they would have won the series.

Do you not believe in team chemistry either?

Something tells me you haven't played many sports. Your the same guy saying the hot hand doesn't exist.

ryang
08-03-2013, 09:21 PM
Lets start over Little Nicky. As far as your "weapons" go. IDK what the hell you are talking about cuz the heat had the best weapons on the whole court. The Mavs had a bunch of "old guys" (funny since thats what people are calling the Nets), and they had to make 4th quarter comebacks in EVERY game so its not like the Heat were outclassed by superior firepower as you are attempting to say.

Nope. Despite what your interesting brain may think about the Heat's "readiness for the moment" (lol), i think the answer lies more in the coaching and execution by the Mavs. They had a shot blocker in the middle, size, basketball iq, ball movement, 3pt shooting, and they took care of the ball i.e they executed in the half court.

That is how they won. Sure the Heat got better since then. However lets not act like their entire team doesnt start and end with LBJ

Lets try this.

Chandler > Joel
Dirk > bosh.
Kidd , barrea >>>> chalmers, bibby

There bench outclassed ours that year in every way imaginable. Hence me saying the better team. Did they execute better? Yea. Did they out coach us? Yea even tho most coaches will out coach spo. Dude they had the better team and Miami was half the team they are now. Dam your confused. Let me say it again. Miami wasn't ready. Lebron shrunk and Dallas had the better team

Guppyfighter
08-03-2013, 09:22 PM
And saying they 'werent ready' doesn't necessarily mean if they 'were ready' or if they had 'been through the wars' as a unit already, that they would have won the series.

Do you not believe in team chemistry either?

Something tells me you haven't played many sports. Your the same guy saying the hot hand doesn't exist.


Always the last resort of a bad argument. I played a ton of sports and I was ****ing good. What does that mean in terms of this argument? Nothing. That's completely pointless. It doesn't alter reality.

That team was the second seed and played two months of playoff basketball and you are trying to tell me they didn't win a title of because chemistry? **** off.

Michael Jordan was a selfish ****ing player and his teammates hated him on court and off court. Guess what? They won.

Give me five self great players over five average players and you will win more chips.

Guppyfighter
08-03-2013, 09:23 PM
Lebron shrunk in that series. Looked like he was on the verge of that again this year against the spurs. He said himself he wasn't ready. Also said it again this year before the spurs series. Remember? I was half the player I was the first time I met the spurs in the finals? Wade co signed to that as well as pop. He has grown tremendously since that Dallas series.

What people say when they only watch the ball instead of basketball.

ryang
08-03-2013, 09:25 PM
And saying they 'werent ready' doesn't necessarily mean if they 'were ready' or if they had 'been through the wars' as a unit already, that they would have won the series.

Do you not believe in team chemistry either?

Something tells me you haven't played many sports. Your the same guy saying the hot hand doesn't exist.

He's confused. I personally wouldn't want to play that Dallas team again if age were the same as it were that year. There PGs ate us alive and chandler plugged the middle up. Stephenson and Marion caused Lebron more problems then I've ever seen him go through. Not sure why there so confused

Chill_Will_24
08-03-2013, 09:26 PM
Dallas beat Miami because Miami wasn't ready for that moment. They also had a higher pay roll then Miami and Miami had a lack luster bench compared to now. Oh and Lebron grew as a a player since then

This was his original statement in response to why he believes the Mavs beat the Heat in response to me talking about things like taking care of the ball, half court execution etc.

The only portion in that that isnt completely ridiculous is the part about the bench which would be a solid argument if that was what his main point of contention was. What you said and what he said are completely different things as i understood them


I don't really get it. He said Dallas was the better team, he said LeBron shrunk in the Finals, he said the Heat as a team weren't ready yet.

I think all 3 are pretty true. Not many teams are 'ready' and gelled like a well oiled machine during their first season together.

His posts don't really reek of homerism or denial at all.

D-Leethal
08-03-2013, 09:26 PM
Always the last resort of a bad argument. I played a ton of sports and I was ****ing good. What does that mean in terms of this argument? Nothing. That's completely pointless. It doesn't alter reality.

That team was the second seed and played two months of playoff basketball and you are trying to tell me they didn't win a title of because chemistry? **** off.

Michael Jordan was a selfish ****ing player and his teammates hated him on court and off court. Guess what? They won.

Give me five self great players over five average players and you will win more chips.

Well when you say things like the hot hand does not exist, its tough to actually believe you ever played the game. When you claim the hot hand is nothing but a statistical variation, its tough to believe your not some stat nerd who likes to watch sports for nothing more than your statistical fix.

If you don't think on-the-court team chemistry develops over years and doesn't fully develop in one season, or 2 months of playoff basketball, you've probably never played on a competitive sports team.

It seems you give little to no credence at all to the mental, psychological side of the game, and thats an indication of someone who has never experienced the game.

ryang
08-03-2013, 09:27 PM
What people say when they only watch the ball instead of basketball.

So Lebron was and is the same guy as he was in that series? Wrong. Do they Heat have better role players now? Yes. We losses to the better team. We also didn't play as well as we can now. You sound foolish to say the least.

D-Leethal
08-03-2013, 09:28 PM
This was his original statement in response to why he believes the Mavs beat the Heat in response to me talking about things like taking care of the ball, half court execution etc.

The only portion in that that isnt completely ridiculous is the part about the bench which would be a solid argument if that was what his main point of contention was. What you said and what he said are completely different things as i understood them

Well that post right there is just silly and that is definitely fair game for some bashing. Seems like he came to his senses though so you don't need to keep harping on him.

ryang
08-03-2013, 09:30 PM
This was his original statement in response to why he believes the Mavs beat the Heat in response to me talking about things like taking care of the ball, half court execution etc.

The only portion in that that isnt completely ridiculous is the part about the bench which would be a solid argument if that was what his main point of contention was. What you said and what he said are completely different things as i understood them

What? Why don't you show your statement then? You weren't talking about execution. Hell you weren't even talking about that series at all besides saying kidd can help solve Miami's puzzle because
Dallas did. Read my man read.

Guppyfighter
08-03-2013, 09:30 PM
Well when you say things like the hot hand does not exist, its tough to actually believe you ever played the game. When you claim the hot hand is nothing but a statistical variation, its tough to believe your not some stat nerd who likes to watch sports for nothing more than your statistical fix.

If you don't think on-the-court team chemistry develops over years and doesn't fully develop in one season, or 2 months of playoff basketball, you've probably never played on a competitive sports team.

It seems you give little to no credence at all to the mental, psychological side of the game, and thats an indication of someone who has never experienced the game.

I recognize any feeling people have is just that, a feeling. Even if I feel better about my shot, it doesn't actually change how well I do.

And, like I said, you have probably never played a sport if you think it takes years to play with new teammates. It's the most naive cliche I have ever heard.

Everything you are arguing for is essentially a placebo and if it was real it would show up in the stats. The Heat's efficiency metrics didn't get better over time, they stayed relatively the same over all three seasons. They were equally good in all three seasons.

I know, I know

"Stats don't real, only feels reals."

ryang
08-03-2013, 09:31 PM
He said Kidd can solve the puzzle because Dallas did. Sorry I didn't explain it in detail for you. Figured you had some common sence and could read. I responded to a bs statement with a half *** answer.

ryang
08-03-2013, 09:32 PM
Well that post right there is just silly and that is definitely fair game for some bashing. Seems like he came to his senses though so you don't need to keep harping on him.

That's not how it was worded. Read his statement that I responded to

Chill_Will_24
08-03-2013, 09:33 PM
That line of thinking is from the skip bayless handbook.

It ignores actual basketball play and analysis for ****** narratives that should only exist in the WWE.

Exactly the issue i am having with all of this. Because the only growth i have seen from Lebron since then is that now he has a good jump shot making him unguardable not the whole narrative of "he wasnt clutch" "he shrunk" and all that BS

The whole MIA wasnt ready thing is a narrative that keeps getting repeated and its stupid. Mavs had to come back in the 4th every game and fought tooth and nail and they did it with half court basketball execution. Not because of higher pay rolls and "Lebron shrinking"

ryang
08-03-2013, 09:34 PM
I agree with his analysis. We will know so much more after we see what type of offense kidd will run and how the team responds to him. To this day Kidd and his Mavs are the only ones that managed to solve the Heat puzzle and they did it by taking care of the ball. The Nets got an upgrade in bbiq, interior defense, coaching, passing, and toughness this summer.

Basically if they can take care of the ball, play good team defense, and not fall to pieces when MIA goes small, they have a great shot

And my statement stands. We as a team were not ready. They had the better team. Lebron shrunk

D-Leethal
08-03-2013, 09:35 PM
I recognize any feeling people have is just that, a feeling. Even if I feel better about my shot, it doesn't actually change how well I do.

And, like I said, you have probably never played a sport if you think it takes years to play with new teammates. It's the most naive cliche I have ever heard.

Everything you are arguing for is essentially a placebo and if it was real it would show up in the stats. The Heat's efficiency metrics didn't get better over time, they stayed relatively the same over all three seasons. They were equally good in all three seasons.

I know, I know

"Stats don't real, only feels reals."

It doesn't take years to play with new teammates, but over those years, your ability to play with those teammates, feed off those teammates, know exactly where and how those teammates like to play and how to position yourself to compliment them improves. The trajectory doesn't just flatten out, team chemistry continuously develops.

And the bold is 1000% flat out not true, and nobody that has ever shot a basketball would agree with that.

Chill_Will_24
08-03-2013, 09:36 PM
And saying they 'werent ready' doesn't necessarily mean if they 'were ready' or if they had 'been through the wars' as a unit already, that they would have won the series.

Do you not believe in team chemistry either?

Something tells me you haven't played many sports. Your the same guy saying the hot hand doesn't exist.

Never said such a thing.

And of course you could reword something stupid to make it a legit argument but there is a vast difference between what you are arguing and what he was arguing until he switched it up from talking about high pay rolls and narratives to bench play

D-Leethal
08-03-2013, 09:36 PM
Exactly the issue i am having with all of this. Because the only growth i have seen from Lebron since then is that now he has a good jump shot making him unguardable not the whole narrative of "he wasnt clutch" "he shrunk" and all that BS

The whole MIA wasnt ready thing is a narrative that keeps getting repeated and its stupid. Mavs had to come back in the 4th every game and fought tooth and nail and they did it with half court basketball execution. Not because of higher pay rolls and "Lebron shrinking"

Choking away a 2-1 lead, not being able to step on the throats of a downed opponent both late in games, and in the series as a whole, is a clear token sign of a team that 'isn't ready'. The term itself is stupid and can be said 100 different ways, but what it refers to is definitely real.

ryang
08-03-2013, 09:36 PM
Exactly the issue i am having with all of this. Because the only growth i have seen from Lebron since then is that now he has a good jump shot making him unguardable not the whole narrative of "he wasnt clutch" "he shrunk" and all that BS

The whole MIA wasnt ready thing is a narrative that keeps getting repeated and its stupid. Mavs had to come back in the 4th every game and fought tooth and nail and they did it with half court basketball execution. Not because of higher pay rolls and "Lebron shrinking"

There team was stacked. They had the advantage everywhere but sg.

JerseyPalahniuk
08-03-2013, 09:38 PM
It's a deep statistical analysis on two contending East teams.

We need more of this in the NBA forum.

****, I have people say this BS to me posting Bucks material and now this. I am a Warriors fan.

I had already seen the video early this morning when it was posted on netsdaily.com. I believed a lt of it can be thrown out since the players mentioned have yet to play any minute of even practice time together. Individually, I see the reasoning of ak + Pierce being better defense players guarding Lebron than Wallace but I need to see them play a few games under the new defensive scheme they'll be learning. Same applies to the other players and on the offensive end.

With that said. I'm extremely excited our home opener agains them. It'll take a while to click but it's great to see that we'll compete against the best right out of the gate. See what we need to get to playoff time.

D-Leethal
08-03-2013, 09:38 PM
Never said such a thing.

And of course you could reword something stupid to make it a legit argument but there is a vast difference between what you are arguing and what he was arguing until he switched it up from talking about high pay rolls and narratives to bench play

Hot hand comment was Gup, not you.

ryang
08-03-2013, 09:40 PM
Never said such a thing.

And of course you could reword something stupid to make it a legit argument but there is a vast difference between what you are arguing and what he was arguing until he switched it up from talking about high pay rolls and narratives to bench play

Your statement of kidds mavs figured out the puzzle and discrediting there payroll is laughable. You do realize if you have a higher payroll more then likely you have better players right? If your players aren't better then your a clueless gm. A higher payroll usually means better players. You needed me to explain that to you?

ryang
08-03-2013, 09:41 PM
I can see where my original statement doesn't explain all of this but it shouldn't have been as confusing for you as it was

Guppyfighter
08-03-2013, 09:42 PM
It doesn't take years to play with new teammates, but over those years, your ability to play with those teammates, feed off those teammates, know exactly where and how those teammates like to play and how to position yourself to compliment them improves. The trajectory doesn't just flatten out, team chemistry continuously develops.

And the bold is 1000% flat out not true, and nobody that has ever shot a basketball would agree with that.

Except me of course. Which doesn't agree with it despite still hooping at a gym regularlry and played all four years in high school.

It statistically doesn't affect anything. Look up what a placebo is and then study some statistics. Stop arguing over feelings. Feelings don't matter, at all.

You know why people in basketball would agree with hot hand? Because when they feel it is better they experience confirmation bias. It's all just feelings with no substance. It's quite stupid.

Chill_Will_24
08-03-2013, 09:48 PM
Lets try this.

Chandler > Joel
Dirk > bosh.
Kidd , barrea >>>> chalmers, bibby

There bench outclassed ours that year in every way imaginable. Hence me saying the better team. Did they execute better? Yea. Did they out coach us? Yea even tho most coaches will out coach spo. Dude they had the better team and Miami was half the team they are now. Dam your confused. Let me say what D-Lethal said and attempt to claim it as my own statement. Miami wasn't ready. Lebron shrunk and Dallas had the better team

Fixed.

Also this whole >> and << stuff is stupid. Any person that argues basketball thus needs to stop trying. The Heat bench was not great but heh i dont think the Mavs was that great either. Barrea had his moments and so did Terry but it was a team effort. I like to judge overall teams and the Heat had 2 of the big 3 on the court at all times in that series. The Heat still had more talent on their team than the Mavs. The Mavs were just more well rounded and better coached both on the floor and off.

May i remind you that they led every single game in the series going into the 4th and the Mavs still come back sometimes from blowout deficits. You cant put that on a bench especially when the Heat bench in particular even to this day plays a relatively small role compared to what they need from the big 3

D-Leethal
08-03-2013, 09:53 PM
Except me of course. Which doesn't agree with it despite still hooping at a gym regularlry and played all four years in high school.

It statistically doesn't affect anything. Look up what a placebo is and then study some statistics. Stop arguing over feelings. Feelings don't matter, at all.

You know why people in basketball would agree with hot hand? Because when they feel it is better they experience confirmation bias. It's all just feelings with no substance. It's quite stupid.

So there is zero mental aspect to the game of basketball? Players don't feed off confidence? That is straight up hogwash and again, nobody that has ever played the game would agree with such nonsense. The game is performed by humans in reality, not on a piece of paper or a computer simulation. Humans respond to feelings. The same way your mental state/mood/feelings/confidence can affect your job performance in any field, it can, and does do the same in sports.

Chill_Will_24
08-03-2013, 09:59 PM
I agree with his analysis. We will know so much more after we see what type of offense kidd will run and how the team responds to him. To this day Kidd and his Mavs are the only ones that managed to solve the Heat puzzle and they did it by taking care of the ball. The Nets got an upgrade in bbiq, interior defense, coaching, passing, and toughness this summer.

Basically if they can take care of the ball, play good team defense, and not fall to pieces when MIA goes small, they have a great shot

Ummmm...


What? Why don't you show your statement then? You weren't talking about execution. Hell you weren't even talking about that series at all besides saying kidd can help solve Miami's puzzle because
Dallas did. Read my man read.

This was the post you responded to.

I very highly doubt there is much here that D-Lethal would disagree with that would make him give your ridiculous post, which i quoted, his stamp of approval.

You are falling to pieces in your attempts to backtrack my man. Wouldnt it be far easier to just say "in hindsight my statement was pretty stupid and i take it back"

EDIT: Sorry. Playing catch up on this thread cuz im on my phone

ryang
08-03-2013, 10:01 PM
Fixed.

Also this whole >> and << stuff is stupid. Any person that argues basketball thus needs to stop trying. The Heat bench was not great but heh i dont think the Mavs was that great either. Barrea had his moments and so did Terry but it was a team effort. I like to judge overall teams and the Heat had 2 of the big 3 on the court at all times in that series. The Heat still had more talent on their team than the Mavs. The Mavs were just more well rounded and better coached both on the floor and off.

May i remind you that they led every single game in the series going into the 4th and the Mavs still come back sometimes from blowout deficits. You cant put that on a bench especially when the Heat bench in particular even to this day plays a relatively small role compared to what they need from the big 3

Again your just making **** up. If you knew how to read I explained myself every step of the way. Can't wait to knock your nets out the playoffs by the way. Assuming they make it far enough that is. Oh and our bench is ten times better today then it was in year one. That Dallas team was stacked and couldn't miss a 3. So what they came from behind. They still won. Dallas had the better team but Miami was no where near as good them as they are today. Period.

ryang
08-03-2013, 10:04 PM
Ummmm...



This was the post you responded to.

I very highly doubt there is much here that D-Lethal would disagree with that would make him give your ridiculous post, which i quoted, his stamp of approval.

You are falling to pieces in your attempts to backtrack my man. Wouldnt it be far easier to just say "in hindsight my statement was pretty stupid and i take it back"

EDIT: Sorry. Playing catch up on this thread cuz im on my phone

Not back tracking at all. They had the higher payroll (meaning better players). Lebron shrunk. Very true IMO and plenty of people would agree including nba players. Miami wasn't ready. Again very true. In hindsight wouldn't it just be better that you say I disagree and move along?

Chill_Will_24
08-03-2013, 10:04 PM
There team was stacked. They had the advantage everywhere but sg.

Oh my goodness! :laugh2:

D-Lethal how can you condone this? Rephrase this one for him as well.

ryang
08-03-2013, 10:05 PM
Alls you said was Dallas took care of the ball. Where did you talk about execution or coaching?

ryang
08-03-2013, 10:07 PM
Oh my goodness! :laugh2:

D-Lethal how can you condone this? Rephrase this one for him as well.

There center was better agree?
Dirk outplayed bosh in every way agree?
Lebron better
Wade better
There PGs ate us alive agree?
There bench was better agree?

Ment to say sg and sf also on my phone

SwatTeam
08-03-2013, 10:07 PM
Hey guys I just posted a video on YouTube about why I think Greg Oden is the greatest center of all time based on some analysis I made. I also stumble through my home made video and look like a noob. Please watch it and give me your thoughts.

That video was hilarious. Hahahahahahahahaha what a f$&king joke this site has become. What makes that duche an analyst? Is the OP really coach nick? Hahahahahahaha

Chill_Will_24
08-03-2013, 10:08 PM
Your statement of kidds mavs figured out the puzzle and discrediting there payroll is laughable. You do realize if you have a higher payroll more then likely you have better players right? If your players aren't better then your a clueless gm. A higher payroll usually means better players. You needed me to explain that to you?

This is just.. im done. I think at this point D-Lethal just feels sorry and wants to stick up for you cuz your posts are getting funnier and funnier. So i guess the Nets are winning the chips this year :) Horrayy for me!

ryang
08-03-2013, 10:11 PM
[QUOTE=Chill_Will_24;26821510]This is just.. im done. I think at this point D-Lethal just feels sorry and wants to stick up for you cuz your posts are getting funnier and funnier. So i guess the Nets are winning the chips this year :) Horrayy for me![

Not sure how that's funny. Look at what you wrote. My statement was that just a statement when asked to explain (if that's what you call it by name calling and laughing) I did. Please explain to me where I backtracked? I can explain how your making statements and not responding to them in there entirety if you'd like

D-Leethal
08-03-2013, 10:12 PM
Oh my goodness! :laugh2:

D-Lethal how can you condone this? Rephrase this one for him as well.

I'm too busy trying to get Guppy to start forming opinions based on what he sees with his eyes watching the game of basketball instead of what he derives out of his calculator studying spreadsheets.

ryang
08-03-2013, 10:12 PM
Oh my goodness! :laugh2:

D-Lethal how can you condone this? Rephrase this one for him as well.

Ment to say sg and sf. Do you disagree? If so explain

Chill_Will_24
08-03-2013, 10:13 PM
Again your just making **** up. If you knew how to read I explained myself every step of the way. Can't wait to knock your nets out the playoffs by the way. Assuming they make it far enough that is. Oh and our bench is ten times better today then it was in year one. That Dallas team was stacked and couldn't miss a 3. So what they came from behind. They still won. Dallas had the better team but Miami was no where near as good them as they are today. Period.

Where have i disputed this?

and i still think MIA had the better team and has had the best team every year since then. Just imo

Also one of the weaknesses of the Heat is ball movement and 3pt shooting even to this day so idk what you are arguing here.

I still do not understand how mu original post about Kidd and the Mavs solving the Heat puzzle could incite such ridiculousness from you

ryang
08-03-2013, 10:14 PM
I'm too busy trying to get Guppy to start forming opinions based on what he sees with his eyes watching the game of basketball instead of what he derives out of his calculator studying spreadsheets.

You can read. Do you agree Dallas had an advantage everywhere but sg and sf?
Do you agree Lebron shrunk?
Did they have a higher payroll?
Was there bench better?
Is Miami better now then they were then? Role players included.

Pretty sure you'd agree with all of those points

ryang
08-03-2013, 10:16 PM
Where have i disputed this?

and i still think MIA had the better team and has had the best team every year since then. Just imo

Also one of the weaknesses of the Heat is ball movement and 3pt shooting even to this day so idk what you are arguing here.

I still do not understand how mu original post about Kidd and the Mavs solving the Heat puzzle could incite such ridiculousness from you

Not sure why you feel Lebron didn't shrink. Or how Dallas had the better supporting cast. Can you name anyone from Miami bench that year not named mike miller? Answer those questions above. You say something and then ignore my response. If its so stupid explain

Chill_Will_24
08-03-2013, 10:16 PM
Hey guys I just posted a video on YouTube about why I think Greg Oden is the greatest center of all time based on some analysis I made. I also stumble through my home made video and look like a noob. Please watch it and give me your thoughts.

That video was hilarious. Hahahahahahahahaha what a f$&king joke this site has become. What makes that duche an analyst? Is the OP really coach nick? Hahahahahahaha

I like Coach Nick even though his logic is at times faulty. I do agree with him here that the Nets will get close but ultimately fail vs the Heat.

I think people really like him cuz he makes basketball really understandable for the people that dont really understand advanced stats and such. He breaks it down with videos and stuff like that and few people on youtube do that

ryang
08-03-2013, 10:24 PM
Never backtracked just explained myself further. You've failed to do that. Explain how Miami was better. Explain go Dallas didn't have a higher payroll. Only thing out my statement that can't be proven 100% is Lebron shrinking. Gotta use your eyes for that. Let me know how Dallas didn't have they advantage everywhere but sg and sf? You can't. I've explained each comment I've made and responded to all of yours. Answer those questions up top

Chill_Will_24
08-03-2013, 10:27 PM
Not sure why you feel Lebron didn't shrink. Or how Dallas had the better supporting cast. Can you name anyone from Miami bench that year not named mike miller? Answer those questions above. You say something and then ignore my response. If its so stupid explain

I havent had a chance to read everything. I am out. Give me time young Skywalker

Lebron did not shrink. He got better as a player since then if thats possible but by no means did he shrink in 2011. He was nothing short of amazing and has been for a long time. The whole "Lebron shrinking" thing is some stupid narrative that the media came up with and idiot fans ran with. So is the whole "welp they were up 2-0 and were up every 4th quarter and still lost so they must not have been ready for the moment". These are idiotic statements imo that offer zero basketball analysis and have no statistical merit

The Heat were still statistically elite then and they had the best 2 arguably 3 players along with 3pt shooters. In fact looking at the numbers i am still astounded that the Mavs pulled it off. They executed better. They played better basketball. They did not turn the ball over. They moved the ball leading to open 3s. that all started and ended with Kidd who was the leader and led the charge on both ends of the floor.

All i said which ruffled your jimmies is that it is possible that Kidd could help the nets solve the Heat puzzle which he and his Mavs did. The Nets certainly have the tools.

ryang
08-03-2013, 10:34 PM
That's the first statement you made that makes sence. It's still my beleive Lebron folded (since you don't like shrink) in those finals. He played scared. Is that a better word. He let them get into his head.

As far as not being ready. The heat took the mavs as a joke. Look at Lebron and wade mocking dirk for being sick. We had no bench help. That can be considered to not being ready. We also had no where near as much bench help. We also weren't 100% comfortable next to each other. Sorry dont put links up but if you want look for wade and Lebrons statements on how comfortable they were in year one.

As far as payroll goes sorry I didn't explain that there high payroll led them to having a good supporting cast. But that stamens is true. There payroll was higher. Look it up.

Not sure if your drunk or your phone is messed up but when you wake up Tomm read our conversation start to finish. It might make more sence then. Also let me know your answers to the questions above when you have a chance.

Chill_Will_24
08-03-2013, 10:45 PM
That's the first statement you made that makes sence. It's still my beleive Lebron folded (since you don't like shrink) in those finals. He played scared. Is that a better word. He let them get into his head.

As far as not being ready. The heat took the mavs as a joke. Look at Lebron and wade mocking dirk for being sick. We had no bench help. That can be considered to not being ready. We also had no where near as much bench help. We also weren't 100% comfortable next to each other. Sorry dont put links up but if you want look for wade and Lebrons statements on how comfortable they were in year one.

As far as payroll goes sorry I didn't explain that there high payroll led them to having a good supporting cast. But that stamens is true. There payroll was higher. Look it up.

Not sure if your drunk or your phone is messed up but when you wake up Tomm read our conversation start to finish. It might make more sence then. Also let me know your answers to the questions above when you have a chance.

I dont drink. I understand well what you are now trying to say. I just cannot subscribe to your line of thinking nor this whole ESPN logic that you go by.

BTW Guppy thanks for that video. I had never watched it. I am actually surprised at how basketball savvy Cuban is. I always thought of him as a rich dope that liked basketball. Anyone that subscribes to this idiotic "the Heat werent ready for the moment and Lebron shrunk crap" needs to watch that. God ESPN is such a joke. Not one single fact came out of the mouth of that clown Skip

ryang
08-03-2013, 10:52 PM
It's not espn logic tho. Lebron folded. He stopped attacking. He let them get in his head. Shrink is a poor choice of words but he was not himself

RiceOnTheRun
08-03-2013, 10:59 PM
"wasnt ready for the moment" lol

Sounds like a lot of bull****

Mavs executed in the half court. Why is it so hard for Heat fans to give props to other teams even after back to back championships

Because the "best player" in the league was playing like a little girl. Mavs did do a good job, but if Lebron played like he should've been, it could have been different as well.

I think having KG and PP there definitely take off some of the pressure from D-Will, he'll be a lot better this year and Lopez looks like he can still improve. The thing about the Nets that concerns me is their cohesion. I think it'll take a while for 5 all-stars to learn to work with one another. Other than that they have a great starting lineup, a very solid bench and a bit of a coin flip at head coach. I'd say it's more than likely it turns out that Kidd becomes a great coach, but it definitely isn't a certainty either. The Nets definitely the most volatile team in the East, with the potential to either finish at the top or become a flop ala Lakers 2012-13.

Guppyfighter
08-03-2013, 11:23 PM
Mark Cuban basically destroys everyone who thinks Lebron just stopped attacking theory.

Most have no idea what defensive sets they ran.

Guppyfighter
08-03-2013, 11:25 PM
D-Lethal, how can you try to argue people who use stats don't watch basketball or that I don't.

I have game footage of every game last season for every team downloaded on my computer. People who use stats watch the most basketball because they want to understand it better. The only people I see using the psychology aspect for professional sports are people who don't know what they are talking about.

These are professional athletes. Confidence isn't a problem. I frequently use diagrams from videos to show why some people have good or bad advanced stats.

I showed why JR Smith is actually a bad defender, something I think you'd like to know since you are a Knick fan.

ohreally
08-04-2013, 12:23 AM
Nets will get stifled by Miami's pressure D and run off the court with their speed and spread offense the same way they did last year and it won't look much different.


The Nets had a thin bench last year and two starters who basically didn't score. The Heat's gamble defense had very safe gambles. That will be very different this year, or should be.

ohreally
08-04-2013, 01:12 AM
Except me of course. Which doesn't agree with it despite still hooping at a gym regularlry and played all four years in high school.

It statistically doesn't affect anything. Look up what a placebo is and then study some statistics. Stop arguing over feelings. Feelings don't matter, at all.

You know why people in basketball would agree with hot hand? Because when they feel it is better they experience confirmation bias. It's all just feelings with no substance. It's quite stupid.

Placebos do have an affect, maybe not as statistically relevant as an effective drug, but if people really think they are getting an effective drug there is definitely better response than from those getting nothing. And positive attitude also has an effect.

If you don't believe psychology played a major role in MJ's dominance, or in the play of Kobe, Pierce, Garnett, etc. or, on the other hand, Marbury, I really don't know what to say.

Games aren't played on paper, but if you're going to argue that all is statistics, or that statistics really provide any one clear indicator, the games may as well be played on paper and you should be betting every penny you can come by on the outcome of games.

As to the hot hand, it does get tossed around too often, but there are a lot of streak shooters in the game, so discounting it so adamantly seems odd. Everyone has good and bad days or periods, in any occupation, and wasn't there a recent study that showed there really is a statistical confirmation of the idea? I don't remember where I saw that, but it was recent.

Guppyfighter
08-04-2013, 03:17 AM
Placebos do have an affect, maybe not as statistically relevant as an effective drug, but if people really think they are getting an effective drug there is definitely better response than from those getting nothing. And positive attitude also has an effect.

If you don't believe psychology played a major role in MJ's dominance, or in the play of Kobe, Pierce, Garnett, etc. or, on the other hand, Marbury, I really don't know what to say.

Games aren't played on paper, but if you're going to argue that all is statistics, or that statistics really provide any one clear indicator, the games may as well be played on paper and you should be betting every penny you can come by on the outcome of games.

As to the hot hand, it does get tossed around too often, but there are a lot of streak shooters in the game, so discounting it so adamantly seems odd. Everyone has good and bad days or periods, in any occupation, and wasn't there a recent study that showed there really is a statistical confirmation of the idea? I don't remember where I saw that, but it was recent.

WELL GEE GOLLY REALLY THANKS. This changes everything. I didn't know that they didn't play on paper.

Anyways, I do gamble and I make quite a bit of money doing it and no, betting a lot at once is dumb because in a one game sample anything can happen. You need to bet in units and it has to be done through value.

If a game is statistically 50/50, but one team is at +200, you take the +200. It has good value. But seriously, if you think the point of stats is to predict every game with 100 percent accuracy you don't understand stats.

No. It's call random variation. If you have a good game, you regress to the mean eventually by having a bad game. It follows the same statistical pattern as flipping a coin.

Jtirado16
08-04-2013, 03:20 AM
It'd be a great series! Maybe we get to see it. The Nets are a legit team this year. The Heat are beatable. We'll see if this is the year they get beat

ryang
08-04-2013, 03:57 AM
Fat drunk and stupid is no way to go through life son.

Bostonjorge
08-04-2013, 04:32 AM
After reading that thread about how the heat had the worst supporting cast in playoff history I say nets match up good. Since the nets are the better team now.

krisxsong
08-04-2013, 04:52 AM
In the regular season I see Miami easily beating Brooklyn. In a 7 game series, I see it going 6 or 7 games. When you get in the playoffs where you're forced to play half court offense, good luck to Bosh/Oden/Battier stopping KG/Lopez/Blatche.

I say Miami wins in 6 or 7.

shep33
08-04-2013, 05:13 AM
The big issue with the Nets is that they're arguably one of the least athletic teams in the NBA. With Lopez and KG, they need to slow the pace down big time and not turn it over.

Any turnover is a layup on the other end with the projected starting lineup. I would maybe consider closing things out with Lopez on the bench and KG at the 5 with AK at the 4. Those two can cover up a lot of mistakes on defense.

Minimal
08-04-2013, 06:06 AM
You've got to defend well to win against Miami, I don't really see that in Brooklyn.

Kyben36
08-04-2013, 06:15 AM
Im going to be totaly honest here, and I am not a nets hatter, but I worry for them, they seem like a team on paper that should win a ton of games, however, just as we saw last year, paper doesnt win games, I know I know, Williams, Johnson,Peirce, KG, Lopez look great when you look at it but I think that 3 of their 5 starters ( ill let you figure out which ones im talking about) are way out of their primes, I think that coaching is going to be huge for them, in whether or not they can do anything, I mean, hell, all of these guys have played with Kidd, and now they are suspoed to respect him as a coach, im not sure I see that working well. but I think if they can pull it together, its going to be big time top 4 in the east battle with the Heat, Pacers, Knicks, Nets, and Bulls (pending healthy rose)

DoMeFavors
08-04-2013, 11:44 AM
We have way too much depth for Miami

HiphopRelated
08-04-2013, 12:03 PM
We have way too much depth for Miami

Depth doesn't mean much in the playoffs.

Get a tight 8/9 man rotation and roll. If you're trying to slot in the 11th man, you've already lost

IndyRealist
08-04-2013, 12:23 PM
It amazes me how many people blindly attack statistical analysis. Everyone does understand that EVERY SINGLE NBA TEAM EMPLOYS STATISTICAL ANALYSTS to help make decisions? Just because you don't take the time to understand it doesn't mean it's irrelevant. Just because it tells you that you're favorite player isn't as good as you thought, doesn't mean it's wrong.

Is it the end all, be all of basketball decision making? Absolutely not. Statistics are a tool to help observers understand what they are seeing, because HUMAN PERCEPTION AND MEMORY ARE FALLIBLE. If you are a Knicks decision maker, it is unlikely you watched every single Kings game, let alone remember every play. At a certain point replay footage becomes a blur, and you can't differentiate between the first play and the 53rd you saw. So how do you know if you should trade for DeMarcus Cousins? Exactly. Impressions are fallible because we give disproportionate weight to emotional attachment (my favorite player, highlight reel dunks, game winning 3's, etc.). Our mind makes those things stick out because we attached emotion to them. Dunking on Mosgov's face is still only 2 points.

Two things matter in statistical analysis. 1) That the data tells you something you didn't already know. If it only confirms what you already believe to be true (i.e. PER) then be immediately suspicious. Is it accurately modeling what's going on, or is it simply reflecting your perception? 2) When the data tells you something you didn't know, or contradicts what you believe to be true, THEN FIND OUT WHY. Dismissing data because it disagrees with your point of view is burying your head in the sand.

On the topic, the Nets were already a more or less average defensive team, so replacing a nonfactor and a rebounding specialist with two good defenders is a significant upgrade. Having KG take the best post player leaves Lopez free to roam for blocks, which is a better role for him than straight up man D. Pierce/Wallace may be a wash defensively, but Pierce is a significant upgrade offensively. I disagree with Coach Nick, the 6th man had better be Kirilenko. Pierce and Garnett are older, and limiting their minutes will maximize their effectiveness. They seemed prone to fading and taking games off late last season. Kirilenko can play both positions.

/BOOK

DoMeFavors
08-04-2013, 03:12 PM
Depth doesn't mean much in the playoffs.

Get a tight 8/9 man rotation and roll. If you're trying to slot in the 11th man, you've already lost

Miami went more than 8/9 deep in the finals

ILLUSIONIST^248
08-04-2013, 03:16 PM
LMAO! I thought DMF was perma banned? This Zombie never dies.:laugh:

Chronz
08-04-2013, 03:28 PM
Everyone does understand that EVERY SINGLE NBA TEAM EMPLOYS STATISTICAL ANALYSTS to help make decisions?
From what I heard, the Lakers only feign statistical curiosity .

ohreally
08-04-2013, 04:35 PM
WELL GEE GOLLY REALLY THANKS. This changes everything. I didn't know that they didn't play on paper.

Anyways, I do gamble and I make quite a bit of money doing it and no, betting a lot at once is dumb because in a one game sample anything can happen. You need to bet in units and it has to be done through value.

If a game is statistically 50/50, but one team is at +200, you take the +200. It has good value. But seriously, if you think the point of stats is to predict every game with 100 percent accuracy you don't understand stats.

No. It's call random variation. If you have a good game, you regress to the mean eventually by having a bad game. It follows the same statistical pattern as flipping a coin.


But the guy having a good game is the hot hand, an idea you dismissed. As you dismissed psychology and placebos. I don't dismiss statistics, but they are limited and far from the full story unless they include every variable, which is rare and impractical at best. If statistics are used to come up with averages there certainly is validity to them but their utility is limited.

My point isn't to dismiss statistics, it's in response to your dismissal of psychology and the entire idea of a hot hand.

Guppyfighter
08-04-2013, 04:48 PM
But the guy having a good game is the hot hand, an idea you dismissed. As you dismissed psychology and placebos. I don't dismiss statistics, but they are limited and far from the full story unless they include every variable, which is rare and impractical at best. If statistics are used to come up with averages there certainly is validity to them but their utility is limited.

My point isn't to dismiss statistics, it's in response to your dismissal of psychology and the entire idea of a hot hand.

If someone with a great game didn't eventually regress to th8e mean I'd believe it more. The statistical patterns are just like any other statistical pattern.

Yes, I am dismissing the psychology of something without evidence. If you want to produce evidence for it I will gladly accept it. And if it does exist, evidence does exist.

That's just how things work.

ryang
08-04-2013, 06:31 PM
Evidence? Go talk with an Nba star. Maybe that will give you some evidence. Or is a players opinion irrelevant to you?

ryang
08-04-2013, 06:44 PM
We have way too much depth for Miami

Fat drunk and stupid is no way to go through life son.

Chill_Will_24
08-04-2013, 10:46 PM
Evidence? Go talk with an Nba star. Maybe that will give you some evidence. Or is a players opinion irrelevant to you?

These two gentlemen are having an intelligent basketball conversation that is very above you. Best stay out of it unless you wanna derail the thread again with your Skip Bayless comedy skit style analysis

Krizzle88
08-04-2013, 11:02 PM
Lets see how Nets match up to Bulls & Pacers before they can be put in the same sentence as the heat

Krizzle88
08-04-2013, 11:03 PM
We have way too much depth for Miami

Lol Nets wont beat Bulls

ryang
08-04-2013, 11:48 PM
[QUOTE=Chill_Will_24;26826851]These two gentlemen are having an intelligent basketball conversation that is very above you. Best stay out of it unless you wanna derail the thread again with your Skip Bayless comedy skit style analysis[/


Skip?? Your a clown. Have fun with your puzzle.

ryang
08-04-2013, 11:53 PM
These two gentlemen are having an intelligent basketball conversation that is very above you. Best stay out of it unless you wanna derail the thread again with your Skip Bayless comedy skit style analysis

It's not an intelligent conversation. You are a clown. Your the same guy who doesn't feel Dallas had a higher payroll then Miami. You also feel Lebron was Lebron in that series. You also feel Miami as a team was ready for that series because Dallas came back late in games.

The hot hand is very much a term NBA players use. That conversation was over before it started. You fail to ask why people feel a certain way and just use your opinion as fact. Calm down and try and figure out that sports have a lot more to them then you can understand. Clown

Chill_Will_24
08-05-2013, 12:31 AM
It's not an intelligent conversation. You are a clown. Your the same guy who doesn't feel Dallas had a higher payroll then Miami. You also feel Lebron was Lebron in that series. You also feel Miami as a team was ready for that series because Dallas came back late in games.

The hot hand is very much a term NBA players use. That conversation was over before it started. You fail to ask why people feel a certain way and just use your opinion as fact. Calm down and try and figure out that sports have a lot more to them then you can understand. Clown

:laugh2:

waveycrockett
08-05-2013, 12:37 AM
As a Nets fan I will be the 1st person to admit we dont match up well with the Heat at all BUT they dont match up well with us either.

ryang
08-05-2013, 12:46 AM
That's all a clown can do is laugh huh? One day you'll grow up and when you do come back to psd and look at the stuff you say. Bet you laugh at yourself kid.