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View Full Version : Stacking assets... and then just losing them



DitchDat
07-25-2013, 05:14 AM
Legitimate big men are hard to come by in the NBA.

That's why I applauded the Jazz for having Big Al Jefferson, Paul Millsap, Derrick Favors and Enes Kanter on their roster. Now those are assets. They played Al and Paul and had Favors and Kanter developing and waiting in the wings.

What I don't understand, though, is why the Jazz didn't capitalize. Both Jefferson (Bobcats) and Millsap (Hawks) left via free agency, and Utah got nothing in return for them.

Personally I think stacking big men is the way to go, because sooner or later teams will come knocking for them.

Some other teams that are doing this are Detroit (Drummond, Monroe, Smith), Memphis (Gasol, Davis, Koufos) and Milwaukee (Ayon, Henson, Ilyasova, Sanders, Udoh).

Did I miss something on the Utah front? Did they try to trade them but fail?
What other teams held on to assets too long?

Keep it respectful.

IndyRealist
07-25-2013, 05:36 AM
I believe they thought one of the two would come back. But with Kanter and Favors, the writing was on the wall.

sunsfan88
07-25-2013, 05:45 AM
One thing I have noticed is that teams that draft big men, don't actually get to enjoy their performance for long after they are developed.

By the time NBA big men are developed, they are already on their 2nd contract and you will either have to dish out big money to a guy that just developed or is perhaps still developing or watch them leave via free agency due to some other team overpaying for the guy.

PhillyFaninLA
07-25-2013, 06:01 AM
Maybe they couldn't get the right deal, maybe they didn't want to take on salary. Maybe they thought they could keep one.

nycericanguy
07-25-2013, 08:40 AM
Yea that UTAH situation completely confused me.

I know just about every Knick fan was willing to send Shump & Camby's expiring for Milsap last year.

Even if Shump was the best they could do, which i kind of doubt, can you imagine plugging Shump into that young core in UTAH? They could definitely have used a lockdown athletic wing like that.

D-Leethal
07-25-2013, 09:05 AM
Utah = miniscule market = money coming off books more of a priority than bringing in talent that needs to be paid.

Pacerlive
07-25-2013, 09:18 AM
Yea that UTAH situation completely confused me.

I know just about every Knick fan was willing to send Shump & Camby's expiring for Milsap last year.

Even if Shump was the best they could do, which i kind of doubt, can you imagine plugging Shump into that young core in UTAH? They could definitely have used a lockdown athletic wing like that.
I doubt the KNY FO would have done that deal though.

I think it's obvious that the Jazz wanted a salary dump and didn't want salary back.

DitchDat
07-25-2013, 09:31 AM
Which is weird. Big men are so sought after, and they had two to spare. Doesn't really make sense to just let them walk.

MrfadeawayJB
07-25-2013, 10:59 AM
Yeah I think we were all waiting to see when a trade would go down, and it never happened. They could have taken expiring contracts and picks if they didn't want salary back

D-Leethal
07-25-2013, 11:03 AM
Utah is studying the Milwaukee Bucks book of asset management.

dhopisthename
07-25-2013, 11:08 AM
Yeah I think we were all waiting to see when a trade would go down, and it never happened. They could have taken expiring contracts and picks if they didn't want salary back

if they could have gotten expirings and a first for either of them last year they would have.

dhopisthename
07-25-2013, 11:08 AM
Yea that UTAH situation completely confused me.

I know just about every Knick fan was willing to send Shump & Camby's expiring for Milsap last year.

Even if Shump was the best they could do, which i kind of doubt, can you imagine plugging Shump into that young core in UTAH? They could definitely have used a lockdown athletic wing like that.

just because knick fans would have done that deal it does not mean the knicks FO would have

dhopisthename
07-25-2013, 11:10 AM
Legitimate big men are hard to come by in the NBA.

That's why I applauded the Jazz for having Big Al Jefferson, Paul Millsap, Derrick Favors and Enes Kanter on their roster. Now those are assets. They played Al and Paul and had Favors and Kanter developing and waiting in the wings.

What I don't understand, though, is why the Jazz didn't capitalize. Both Jefferson (Bobcats) and Millsap (Hawks) left via free agency, and Utah got nothing in return for them.

Personally I think stacking big men is the way to go, because sooner or later teams will come knocking for them.

Some other teams that are doing this are Detroit (Drummond, Monroe, Smith), Memphis (Gasol, Davis, Koufos) and Milwaukee (Ayon, Henson, Ilyasova, Sanders, Udoh).

Did I miss something on the Utah front? Did they try to trade them but fail?
What other teams held on to assets too long?

Keep it respectful.

zach lowe in his last recent article said they would have taken a first for either of them, but no one was willing to do it without the jazz taking on long term salary

nycericanguy
07-25-2013, 11:16 AM
just because knick fans would have done that deal it does not mean the knicks FO would have

agreed, but a 28 year old big man could have obviously netted them something good.

And I think NY FO would have done it... Camby was useless, Amare out for the year, and Shump was a shell of himself for like 30 games when he first came back.

TheMightyHumph
07-25-2013, 12:51 PM
One thing I have noticed is that teams that draft big men, don't actually get to enjoy their performance for long after they are developed.

By the time NBA big men are developed, they are already on their 2nd contract and you will either have to dish out big money to a guy that just developed or is perhaps still developing or watch them leave via free agency due to some other team overpaying for the guy.

Are you talking about bigmen who play for the Suns?

TheMightyHumph
07-25-2013, 12:52 PM
Maybe they couldn't get the right deal, maybe they didn't want to take on salary. Maybe they thought they could keep one.

Not sure Jazz made an offer to either.

They are trying a different approach

TheMightyHumph
07-25-2013, 12:54 PM
Yeah I think we were all waiting to see when a trade would go down, and it never happened. They could have taken expiring contracts and picks if they didn't want salary back

That's exactly what they did

Chronz
07-25-2013, 01:04 PM
Massive failure on their part, at least get a 2nd rounder that may never come. Jazz have committed to rebuilding but they are making it take longer and more money than necessary IMO. Their entire off-season has been a C+ when it should have been a B+

TheMightyHumph
07-25-2013, 01:21 PM
Massive failure on their part, at least get a 2nd rounder that may never come. Jazz have committed to rebuilding but they are making it take longer and more money than necessary IMO. Their entire off-season has been a C+ when it should have been a B+

The way I'm reading the trade, Utah received the expiring contracts of Richard Jefferson and Biedrens, 2 1st rd picks, 4 2nd rd picks and cash for Randy Foye and Kevin Murphy.

Spanklin
07-25-2013, 01:55 PM
By letting them both walk, the Jazz cleared enough cap room to land two unprotected first round picks and three second rounders. That's a lot more haul than s&t for a second rounder or Shumpert.

Besides, Jefferson is worthless, and middle of the pack bigs like Paul Millsap can be had every summer (i.e. David West in 2011 & again in 2013, David Lee in 2011).

sunsfan88
07-25-2013, 06:30 PM
Are you talking about bigmen who play for the Suns?

No big men in general. How many big men have developed completely or become a star player while on their rookie contract in the past 5-6 years?

None. Closest one is probably Blake Griffin.

TheMightyHumph
07-25-2013, 07:15 PM
Lopez, Hibbert, Horford, Noah, Dwight, Marc Gasol, Ibaka, Love, Aldridge, Millsap

astonmartin10
07-25-2013, 07:26 PM
They could have gotten at least 2nd round draft picks. Weird that they let them walk.

TheMightyHumph
07-25-2013, 07:35 PM
They could have gotten at least 2nd round draft picks. Weird that they let them walk.

They got two 1st rd picks, 4 2nd rd picks and cash, and two expiring contracts.

Not a bad haul.

OKC
07-25-2013, 10:01 PM
not sure how they did it or if they intended to do it but the Jazz are one of the most impressive rebuilding projects in the NBA.
they have a young core of burke, burks, Hayward, favors, kanter and they are in position to get a very high draft pick, perhaps even the first with a bit of luck.