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View Full Version : Pistons offered Knight, expiring contract to Boston for Rondo



sunsfan88
07-17-2013, 06:10 PM
The Detroit Pistons offered Brandon Knight and an expiring contract to the Boston Celtics for Rajon Rondo.

The Celtics would seek Andre Drummond, who the Pistons will not give up in a trade for Rondo.

The Pistons want to evaluate the frontcourt of Drummond, Greg Monroe and Josh Smith before making any major decisions about their future.

http://www.hoopzing.com/post/52101/pistons-offer-knight-expiring-to-celtics-for-rondo.php


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spreadeagle
07-17-2013, 06:15 PM
brutal offer, no one cares about your expiring contracts detroit

RipCity32
07-17-2013, 06:17 PM
Dumars denies that he ever offered Boston anything but its not like he would admit it if he did for Knights sake.

Bishnoff
07-17-2013, 06:30 PM
Lol. Nice try Detroit.

KnickaBocka.44
07-17-2013, 06:33 PM
brutal offer, no one cares about your expiring contracts detroit

Expiring contracts are an asset to a rebuilding team like Boston.


I could see them revisiting this towards the deadline when the Pistons realize their front court doesn't work.

Aust
07-17-2013, 06:37 PM
Add in a pick?

Gators123
07-17-2013, 06:43 PM
http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2013/07/16/dumars-denies-rondo-jennings-trade-rumors/

“Bogus, bogus,” Dumars said. “I haven’t even talked to [Celtics general manager] Danny Ainge about what they were reporting, like Brandon [Knight]. That’s never happened, like never even a conversation about Brandon.

He doesn't deny them talking though. Just not about Brandon Knight.

abe_froman
07-17-2013, 06:51 PM
c's can do better than that,they hold onto rondo til deadline show he's fully healthy

YoungOne
07-17-2013, 06:53 PM
maybe if they take on wallace and bass lol

ATX
07-17-2013, 06:54 PM
Ya, that's not going to do it. Insulting really

Sly Guy
07-17-2013, 07:10 PM
lol, and what did he offer for rudy gay?

Seems to me Dumars in Detroit has some powerful illusions of his team, or his qualifications as a GM

RipCity32
07-17-2013, 07:16 PM
lol, and what did he offer for rudy gay?

Seems to me Dumars in Detroit has some powerful illusions of his team, or his qualifications as a GM

Why wouldn't he try lowball offers just to see what kind of counter offers he might get.

Stunner
07-17-2013, 07:16 PM
Knight and Monroe for Rondo and Bass

sunsfan88
07-17-2013, 07:30 PM
Why wouldn't he try lowball offers just to see what kind of counter offers he might get.

Because it would help you lose credibility as an executive.

You think that if Dumars offered Knight and Villinueva for LeBron, the Miami FO will take Dumars seriously ever again?

hugepatsfan
07-17-2013, 07:32 PM
Knight and Monroe for Rondo and Bass

You guys would have to kick us back an expiring to make the money work I believe. But every BOS fan would love this deal. You guys don't even have to take back Bass' contract for us to be happy. Are you including him to help us shed money or do you just like him as a piece?

Hawkeye15
07-17-2013, 07:56 PM
Rondo for Knight/expiring= ripoff for Detroit
Rondo for Drummond or Monroe= ripoff for Boston

none of it makes sense.

Stunner
07-17-2013, 08:48 PM
Rondo for Knight/expiring= ripoff for Detroit
Rondo for Drummond or Monroe= ripoff for Boston

none of it makes sense.


Not really , Smith at the 3 is a joke , them getting Rondo is something and Smith always wanted and moves him back to the 4 . C's get a young Big to rebuild around and they actually need big man help because theirs kind of average . They also get Knight to take a look at him to see if he's worth keeping and to keep Bradley at the SG spot where he excell . Boston would have to take a expiring like Charlie V back too . It's actually makes sense . I don't think Monroe wants to stay in Detroit and will go where the money is first chance he gets . Rondo is a beast and a floor general for that kind of roster is exactly what they need . Celtics get cap room and young pieces and Pistons get a top 5 PG

That should be healthy a month into the season .




Knight
Bradley
Green
Monroe
Olynek


Rondo
Billups
Singler
Smith
Drummond

TorontoHuskies
07-17-2013, 09:19 PM
Pistons are so dumb first that awful offer for Gay now this.

kobe4thewinbang
07-17-2013, 09:28 PM
Let's be honest, though. Rondo can't shoot a lick but he's better than than Knight, Bynum and Stuckey.
The Pistons seem like they want another Chauncey Billups in his prime. If not Rondo, who else is there?
I know Detroit is hoping Monroe/Drummond amount to something, but they are struggling right now.

Hawkeye15
07-17-2013, 09:33 PM
Not really , Smith at the 3 is a joke , them getting Rondo is something and Smith always wanted and moves him back to the 4 . C's get a young Big to rebuild around and they actually need big man help because theirs kind of average . They also get Knight to take a look at him to see if he's worth keeping and to keep Bradley at the SG spot where he excell . Boston would have to take a expiring like Charlie V back too . It's actually makes sense . I don't think Monroe wants to stay in Detroit and will go where the money is first chance he gets . Rondo is a beast and a floor general for that kind of roster is exactly what they need . Celtics get cap room and young pieces and Pistons get a top 5 PG

That should be healthy a month into the season .




Knight
Bradley
Green
Monroe
Olynek


Rondo
Billups
Singler
Smith
Drummond

I will put it more simple. Sending away Drummond or Monroe for Rondo is a loss for Detroit.

But hey, I am known for thinking Rondo is severely overrated.

rocket
07-17-2013, 09:49 PM
Drummond is untouchable. Monroe for Rondo I'll do it.

010957
07-17-2013, 09:50 PM
detroit should definately give knight atleast one more year to see how he progresses

RipCity32
07-17-2013, 10:03 PM
Pistons are so dumb first that awful offer for Gay now this.

Who says this is even true at all?Also why would Dumars just throw out a homerun offer with Monroe without even seeing Rondo back from injury.

bagwell368
07-17-2013, 10:21 PM
I will put it more simple. Sending away Drummond or Monroe for Rondo is a loss for Detroit.

But hey, I am known for thinking Rondo is severely overrated.

Rondo is overrated. But by the deadline the Pistons will be looking at a loaded front court a weak backcourt (how long can Billups last and how good will he be? Knight - a SG playing the point?, Stuckey - ugh, and Monroe heading to a big contract.

Celts can take some extra salary (Villaneuava or Stuckey at least, maybe both), maybe wave a cheap defender like Bradley, and put in a rider that if Rondo missed too many games due to his ACL they get a 1st, and if he misses almost all the games they get 2.

They say you shouldn't trade a big for a small - but how do the Pistons get a real PG without giving what they have too much of?

bagwell368
07-17-2013, 10:23 PM
Drummond is untouchable. Monroe for Rondo I'll do it.

I don't see the Pistons giving up Drummond. The only drawback with Rondo, Drummond, Smith is that the FT shooting could be pretty ghastly.

rocket
07-17-2013, 11:18 PM
Pistons are so dumb first that awful offer for Gay now this.

Yes, we're dumb for trying to rape teams via trades.

Makes sense.

Tmath
07-17-2013, 11:25 PM
Is Dumars trying to piss off every GM in the league?

RipCity32
07-17-2013, 11:39 PM
Is Dumars trying to piss off every GM in the league?

Looks like it

Deception
07-17-2013, 11:51 PM
If Mitch Kupchak can do it, Dumars can as well.

Celticsfan2007
07-18-2013, 12:23 AM
Drummond or bust. I'm not really a huge fan of having to pay Monroe a big contract after next season.

RipCity32
07-18-2013, 12:40 AM
Drummond or bust. I'm not really a huge fan of having to pay Monroe a big contract after next season.

Looks like it will be a bust then because that will never happen.

RiceOnTheRun
07-18-2013, 06:13 AM
lol, and what did he offer for rudy gay?

Seems to me Dumars in Detroit has some powerful illusions of his team, or his qualifications as a GM

Because a great GM would offer up multiple picks and Drummond right?

I'd say Drummond is the ultimate untouchable as far as trade deals go. Kid has too much potential to even be offered unless it's some crazy trade for Lebron, Kobe and Durant. I'd say future 1st rounder, 2nd rounder, Knight and expiring contracts for Rondo and Gerald Wallace. Boston may say they're not trying to tank, but let's be real, this team isn't a contender and I hope for Boston's sake, that Danny Ainge isn't stupid enough to be want to stay in the middle of the eastern conference. They drop Gerald Wallace's 30m contract over the next 3 years and get assets, expiring deals and a solid guard in Knight.

bagwell368
07-18-2013, 06:23 AM
Drummond or bust. I'm not really a huge fan of having to pay Monroe a big contract after next season.

Forget it. Not for Rondo. Maybe if you trade Green and a couple of #1's for some crappy contracts, and that's only if Drummond doesn't show growth offensively in season.

Well - I'd much rather be paying Monroe $13.5M a year for 5 years then paying Rondo the same thing for the same term.

c.c.
07-18-2013, 06:27 AM
Pistons trying to make some moves!

bagwell368
07-18-2013, 06:41 AM
Because a great GM would offer up multiple picks and Drummond right?

I'd say Drummond is the ultimate untouchable as far as trade deals go. Kid has too much potential to even be offered unless it's some crazy trade for Lebron, Kobe and Durant. I'd say future 1st rounder, 2nd rounder, Knight and expiring contracts for Rondo and Gerald Wallace. Boston may say they're not trying to tank, but let's be real, this team isn't a contender and I hope for Boston's sake, that Danny Ainge isn't stupid enough to be want to stay in the middle of the eastern conference. They drop Gerald Wallace's 30m contract over the next 3 years and get assets, expiring deals and a solid guard in Knight.

Not the worst offer. And please Knight is not "solid", he's a project in the works. Make the 2nd rounder a 1st rounder - and I'll counter by giving back one of the firsts if Rondo doesn't play 110 games combined the next two seasons directly related to his ACL - Celts choice of which they give back if just one. If Rondo plays less than 70 games next two years you get both picks back. I want 2017 and 2019 - '17 bottom 3 portected, '19 bottom 5 protected.

BTW to make the money work you have to send both Villanuevo or Stuckey (and it's still 3 million short) - which should be seen as a sweetener to you guys.

So: Knight, Villanuevo, Stuckey, '17 1st, '19 1st
for
Rondo, Wallace, and provisional give back of one of the picks if Rondo doesn't play enough, give back of 2nd if he hardly plays.

Celts get large contracts - but both are expiring. With Rondo's money off the books, and having gotten rid of our worst contract it'll be big doings next year for Celts in FA, and/or getting big contracts in trade. Celts take a risk that Rondo is healthy and cash in big time down the road if so. Celts get Knight. Rondo is off the Celts books, with that line-up Celts wins totals just went down - tank baby!

RiceOnTheRun
07-18-2013, 06:57 AM
Not the worst offer. And please Knight is not "solid", he's a project in the works. Make the 2nd rounder a 1st rounder - and I'll counter by giving back one of the firsts if Rondo doesn't play 110 games combined the next two seasons directly related to his ACL - Celts choice of which they give back if just one. If Rondo plays less than 70 games next two years you get both picks back. I want 2017 and 2019 - '17 bottom 3 portected, '19 bottom 5 protected.

BTW to make the money work you have to send both Villanuevo or Stuckey (and it's still 3 million short) - which should be seen as a sweetener to you guys.

So: Knight, Villanuevo, Stuckey, '17 1st, '19 1st
for
Rondo, Wallace, and provisional give back of one of the picks if Rondo doesn't play enough, give back of 2nd if he hardly plays.

Celts get large contracts - but both are expiring. With Rondo's money off the books, and having gotten rid of our worst contract it'll be big doings next year for Celts in FA, and/or getting big contracts in trade. Celts take a risk that Rondo is healthy and cash in big time down the road if so. Celts get Knight. Rondo is off the Celts books, with that line-up Celts wins totals just went down - tank baby!

I mean personally, idgaf about the Pistons, just throwing out some ideas there.

I meant solid as in, we know he belongs in the NBA and actually deserves some minutes rather than being a bench warmer. He could develop into either a good piece for the Celtics or a trading chip down the line.

Honestly, it's a bit of a risk for the Celtics not to trade Rondo before the season starts. On one hand, he could recover and play like a boss again, raising his trade value or he could be a shell of his former self, which would probably kill any offer they were likely to get prior. While I think the first is definitely more likely than the latter, the point is, right now he's still worth a little less than a superstar, because of his injury. If his recovery doesn't go as well as planned, the Celtics just lost their biggest bargaining chip. I would try and come up with a decision on whether to keep him long term or deal him, before the start of the season. Especially if the Celtic's are going into tank mode, I'm not sure he has the Paul Pierce in him to want to endure that.

That being said, it's a hard decision for Dumars to make. Like the Celtics, he must weigh whether Rondo is worth that risk or not. The provision definitely helps a bit, but dumping the trade chips they have in expiring contracts for nothing would set them back at least a tiny bit, if they were interested in making a play for other FAs. Overall, I think it's a pretty fair deal. I think it works well for the Celtics that Rondo's a feisty guy who won't try and pull a D-Rose to skip the whole season type deal haha. Because hypothetically, if he sat out all 82 games to be "110%", the Pistons would get back a pick.

bagwell368
07-18-2013, 07:15 AM
Overall, I think it's a pretty fair deal. I think it works well for the Celtics that Rondo's a feisty guy who won't try and pull a D-Rose to skip the whole season type deal haha. Because hypothetically, if he sat out all 82 games to be "110%", the Pistons would get back a pick.

I said "ACL" which has to be agreed too by doctors, not due to some mental/emotional defect of Rondo's.

RiceOnTheRun
07-18-2013, 08:16 AM
I said "ACL" which has to be agreed too by doctors, not due to some mental/emotional defect of Rondo's.

Haha not sure if that was a shot at Rose or at myself, but appreciated nonetheless. Rondo is one of them crazy mother****ers though, let's be real.

Guppyfighter
07-18-2013, 08:20 AM
The only fair deal would be Monroe + Knight and Rondo.

bagwell368
07-18-2013, 08:25 AM
The only fair deal would be Monroe + Knight and Rondo.

I'm a Celt fan, and that's not fair, plus the Pistons are taking cash too. More like Stucky and Monroe for Rondo and a Celts #1 in 2016 (Celts have several) Celt's choice as long as it isn't worse than #24.

Given the risks of Rondo that's a minimum package.

skeemz617
07-18-2013, 08:30 AM
Ainge is looking for a haul a la Deron Williams to the Nets, and he shouldn't budge unless he absolutely runs the risk of destroying the locker room or losing him to FA for nothing...which would obviously force his hand. Until then any Rondo deal with Detroit would have to include Drummond and a salary dump. Drummond because he's younger with more upside and would be under the team's control longer than Monroe (though I personally love Monroe). Salary dump because they have no first round picks to offer the Celtics. Unless it's Bass and Lee no deal can be done for quite some time anyway because Humphries or Wallace can't be traded in a package with other players just yet. Detroit needs to put up an offer like Drummond/Knight/CV/Stuckey for Rondo/Bass/Lee/Wallace to realistically get this done. Idk if Dumars would do it but I know the Coach would. Sorry Pistons fans Drummond can have all the potential in the world but he's not makong Detroit a contender right now. Trade him for a centerpiece and don't look back.

JOSKOMANG4
07-18-2013, 08:56 AM
Knight, stuckey, Charlie v and two future 1st rd picks for rondo(coming off season ending surgery), lee, and Wallace to me is the best deal Boston and Detroit should agree on.

IMO, Boston would win the deal. They rid of lengthy deals in exchange for expirings & future draft picks. They also take a rookie contract. IMO, Brandon knight would flourish in Boston's new coach off scheme.

C- olynyk
Pf- bass
Sf- green
Sg- brooks
Pg- knight
Bradley- 6 man

Pistons would make this trade as a win-now mentality. Imo, a healthy rondo, j-smoove, and their young front court would put them over the bulls & pacers in the central division.

driz
07-18-2013, 09:16 AM
Rondo's value is currently as low as it's ever been. He's coming off an ACL. Won't be good to go until December. MAYBE. There's question marks around him about how he'd play without the big guys around him. Yeah, he's an All Star caliber point guard. Yeah, I think he's got the stuff regardless of who he plays with. But from an NBA trade asset standpoint, his value is as low as it's been.

Also, expiring deals are valued higher than they've been in quite a while. Next year's free agent class is considered to be one of the best in a long time. Free money is a valuable thing next year.

I don't think the proposed deal is too far off. With Rondo - and his competitiveness - still running your point, Boston isn't losing as many games as it wants to. A disgruntled Rondo come trade deadline time I think loses a little more value.

Sure, as a Pistons fan I'm a bit bias. But it's my two cents taking every attempt to leave that bias at the door.

skeemz617
07-18-2013, 09:58 AM
Rondo's value is currently as low as it's ever been. He's coming off an ACL. Won't be good to go until December. MAYBE. There's question marks around him about how he'd play without the big guys around him. Yeah, he's an All Star caliber point guard. Yeah, I think he's got the stuff regardless of who he plays with. But from an NBA trade asset standpoint, his value is as low as it's been.

Also, expiring deals are valued higher than they've been in quite a while. Next year's free agent class is considered to be one of the best in a long time. Free money is a valuable thing next year.

I don't think the proposed deal is too far off. With Rondo - and his competitiveness - still running your point, Boston isn't losing as many games as it wants to. A disgruntled Rondo come trade deadline time I think loses a little more value.

Sure, as a Pistons fan I'm a bit bias. But it's my two cents taking every attempt to leave that bias at the door.

Let's not forget Rondo didn't even know he tore his acl...and while no acl injury is good this one defintely seems less severe than a Noel, Rose, or even Shumpert.

Stop the posturing Pistons fans you all know exactly what Rondo is capable of and he's one of the very few players "available" that could potentially get this team above a 6th seed. MIA,BK,IND,CHI,NYK...all are better teams than the Pistons right now. Unless you want to be stuck in the same NBA purgatory that you're using as leverage to get Rondo on the cheap then you make Drummond available and get these negotiations under way. Even if Boston "wins" the trade Detroit wins the games. I don't know when Andre Drummond became untouchable but that's a Boston point of view.

driz
07-18-2013, 10:41 AM
This is an NBA where Darko signed like a 7M dollar deal a few years ago. Multiple teams are tripping over themselves trying to throw contracts at Greg Oden. Potential in a big man is a golden ticket right now. And Drummond's numbers for the limited time he's played indicate something incredibly special in the kid.

Draft pick numbers aside, I liken it to New Orleans trading Anthony Davis.

He's such an instrumental piece to the big picture puzzle, letting him go isn't an option. There's plenty more potential floor generals available than there are 20 year old athletic freaks who can put up a double double on small minutes against any team out there.

Player's values rise and fall like the stock market. Rondo is at a 12-month low right now on the NASDAQ. And Drummond is Mad Money Kramer's Pick of the Week over on the Dow Jones.

TheChampIsHere9
07-18-2013, 11:41 AM
Ainge is looking for a haul a la Deron Williams to the Nets, and he shouldn't budge unless he absolutely runs the risk of destroying the locker room or losing him to FA for nothing...which would obviously force his hand. Until then any Rondo deal with Detroit would have to include Drummond and a salary dump. Drummond because he's younger with more upside and would be under the team's control longer than Monroe (though I personally love Monroe). Salary dump because they have no first round picks to offer the Celtics. Unless it's Bass and Lee no deal can be done for quite some time anyway because Humphries or Wallace can't be traded in a package with other players just yet. Detroit needs to put up an offer like Drummond/Knight/CV/Stuckey for Rondo/Bass/Lee/Wallace to realistically get this done. Idk if Dumars would do it but I know the Coach would. Sorry Pistons fans Drummond can have all the potential in the world but he's not makong Detroit a contender right now. Trade him for a centerpiece and don't look back.

I'm going to honest with you. If you think that's what is a far offer, then you have no knowledge of basketball at all. I mean little to none. I promise you, Drummond has more trade value (to the Celtics and Pistons and everyone else in the league) right now then Rondo does. The offer that is reasonable is the one that JOSKOMANG4 proposed. If Celtics don't want to do it then fine, move on. It's simple Rondo will win the Celtics 5 or 6 more games this year than Knight would (difference of getting Wiggins or not). Plus getting rid of Wallace would allow them to sign a top tier free agent next year. Go ahead keep Rondo and Wallace and be terrible for 5 years...

Celticsfan2007
07-18-2013, 11:43 AM
Forget it. Not for Rondo. Maybe if you trade Green and a couple of #1's for some crappy contracts, and that's only if Drummond doesn't show growth offensively in season.

Well - I'd much rather be paying Monroe $13.5M a year for 5 years then paying Rondo the same thing for the same term.

Don't get me wrong, I like Monroe. I just don't like signing him to a long term deal if we're still years away from competing.

I'd rather take on Drummond, suck for a few years and let him develop along with the rest of the team. Also, I've always viewed Monroe as more of a 4 who can play the 5 so I feel like having him on the same team as sullinger/Olynck is kind of reduntant especially when your trying to develop players.

I'd gladly trade green + rondo in a package if it netted us Drummond and some expirings and a draft pick. But there's no way in hell you trade Rondo, Green AND draft picks for Drummond and expirings. Too much IMO.

Celticsfan2007
07-18-2013, 11:49 AM
To elaborate on my last post: http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ompaato

DET gets-
Rondo
Green

BOS gets-
Drummond
Stuckey
Villenuava
Top 10 protected 1st rounder in 15'

Rondo
Billups
Green
Smith
Monroe

TheChampIsHere9
07-18-2013, 11:54 AM
To elaborate on my last post: http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ompaato

DET gets-
Rondo
Green

BOS gets-
Drummond
Stuckey
Villenuava
Top 10 protected 1st rounder in 15'

Rondo
Billups
Green
Smith
Monroe

Pistons can't give up a first rounder till at least 2017 because of the Bobcats own protected rights for the next few years.

bagwell368
07-18-2013, 11:56 AM
Ainge is looking for a haul a la Deron Williams to the Nets, and he shouldn't budge unless he absolutely runs the risk of destroying the locker room or losing him to FA for nothing...which would obviously force his hand. Until then any Rondo deal with Detroit would have to include Drummond and a salary dump. Drummond because he's younger with more upside and would be under the team's control longer than Monroe (though I personally love Monroe). Salary dump because they have no first round picks to offer the Celtics. Unless it's Bass and Lee no deal can be done for quite some time anyway because Humphries or Wallace can't be traded in a package with other players just yet. Detroit needs to put up an offer like Drummond/Knight/CV/Stuckey for Rondo/Bass/Lee/Wallace to realistically get this done. Idk if Dumars would do it but I know the Coach would. Sorry Pistons fans Drummond can have all the potential in the world but he's not makong Detroit a contender right now. Trade him for a centerpiece and don't look back.

Ummm no. Rondo is not a centerpiece. He's a player with some skills that fit some of what the Pistons want. Any talk about Drummond would be Ainge aiming high while Detroit talks as if Knight was a big prize. The deal has to come down to Monroe and Rondo and the Celts have to add to that because over the next 5 years Monroe's value will squash Rondo's.

Blink
07-18-2013, 12:14 PM
To elaborate on my last post: http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ompaato

DET gets-
Rondo
Green

BOS gets-
Drummond
Stuckey
Villenuava
Top 10 protected 1st rounder in 15'

Rondo
Billups
Green
Smith
Monroe

As a Pistons fan I'd respectively decline this trade.

hugepatsfan
07-18-2013, 12:38 PM
I will put it more simple. Sending away Drummond or Monroe for Rondo is a loss for Detroit.

But hey, I am known for thinking Rondo is severely overrated.

I think Rondo is overrated but Monroe is fair value for him. Especially in DET's situation. A Smith-Monroe-Drummond front court is a stupid idea destined to fail. All good players but the fit just isn't there. Monroe is a RFA next offseason and w/ the C position always in high demand you have to figure some team will make an offer of 11-13 mil per year to him like POR did w/ Hibbert a few years back. DET can't match that when his game doesn't fit with long term investment Smith and signed for multiple years Drummond. So the smart move for them is to trade him now for a PG or a wing. Rondo is a guy Dumars has had interest in before and also a guy Smith has wanted to play with for a while. (This is speculation on my part but I think pursuing Rondo might have been part of Dumars' pitch to Smith to get him to turn down S&T scenarios w/ HOU.) You also have to look beyond basketball because after all, this is a business. Let's say a Monroe for Rondo swap goes down - DET instantly becomes times over more marketable and that would bring in a lot of money. BOS on the other hand takes a huge marketability hit. These ownership groups have real money invested in these teams so this isn't a factor that can be overlooked.

I view Rondo and Monroe as similar players. Good enough to be the 3rd best players on great teams. But Monroe is better for BOS to have because starting with bigs is easier than a pass first PG and Rondo is better for DET because they already have a starting front court they can win with.

Oldmantrash
07-18-2013, 12:39 PM
It's simple
Dumars I'm sure tried to see if Boston was in complete rebuild mode, and checked to see if Rondo was available for Knight, who stinks so far, but is still young.

Detoit is not giving up one of there bigs for him.no shot.

skeemz617
07-18-2013, 02:37 PM
I'm going to honest with you. If you think that's what is a far offer, then you have no knowledge of basketball at all. I mean little to none. I promise you, Drummond has more trade value (to the Celtics and Pistons and everyone else in the league) right now then Rondo does. The offer that is reasonable is the one that JOSKOMANG4 proposed. If Celtics don't want to do it then fine, move on. It's simple Rondo will win the Celtics 5 or 6 more games this year than Knight would (difference of getting Wiggins or not). Plus getting rid of Wallace would allow them to sign a top tier free agent next year. Go ahead keep Rondo and Wallace and be terrible for 5 years...

I think it's fair offer. It's Rondo, an established all-star pg for Drummond, a player who averaged about 8 ppg last year and has done nothing but show flashes of potential. Deandre Jordan did too. The other players would be great pieces for Detroit on the floor and boston gets cap space for the rebuild. I know PLENTY about basketball and what I do know is Rondo's going nowhere unless he comes at Ainge's price. All this posturing about "being terrible" for the next few years doesn't help the Pistons at all. So go ahead and keep Knight as your pg, or even Billups. Trade value is purely speculative, but who's more valuable to that team, on the court, next season? If your answer is Drummond than you know nothing about basketball.

skeemz617
07-18-2013, 03:21 PM
Ummm no. Rondo is not a centerpiece. He's a player with some skills that fit some of what the Pistons want. Any talk about Drummond would be Ainge aiming high while Detroit talks as if Knight was a big prize. The deal has to come down to Monroe and Rondo and the Celts have to add to that because over the next 5 years Monroe's value will squash Rondo's.

I'd agree that Monroe would logically be the happy medium, we're not taking Knight and they'd prefer not to give up Drummond. I'm well aware of you're opinion of Rondo and we definitely differ there but I feel like guys are really selling extremely high on Drummond and low on Rondo. I had my questions about the KG deal way back and a lot of people on this forum didn't want to give up Al Jefferson because of youth and potential and I'd go as far as to say Al was a better prospect than Drummond. Now I know KG is in a class by himself but the point is if you feel a particular player puts your team over the top then that's the basis of determining his value. What Rondo would produce on the floor is by far more valuable to Detroit than any potential that Drummond may have in my opinion. And when you've just signed Josh Smith to that type of deal you're clearly in not necessarily win now but contend asap mode. Not to mention Bass and Lee would be excellent role players for that team. Taking on Wallace would substitute the draft picks we'd command but at the end of the day if the deal doesn't include Drumond or Monroe plus a salary dump then it's not happening.

THE MTL
07-18-2013, 03:57 PM
The pistons offer is a start. Now add 2 protected firsts and maybe take back a bad contract.

I really think Boston should trade Rondo. His value can ONLY decrease from here if u ask me, he has no one around him to produce those gaudy assist numbers, he's coming off a major injury, and he's known for having a poor attitude.... imagine how bad it might get with a new coach, no veteran presence, and alot of losing.

Hawkeye15
07-18-2013, 03:59 PM
I think Rondo is overrated but Monroe is fair value for him. Especially in DET's situation. A Smith-Monroe-Drummond front court is a stupid idea destined to fail. All good players but the fit just isn't there. Monroe is a RFA next offseason and w/ the C position always in high demand you have to figure some team will make an offer of 11-13 mil per year to him like POR did w/ Hibbert a few years back. DET can't match that when his game doesn't fit with long term investment Smith and signed for multiple years Drummond. So the smart move for them is to trade him now for a PG or a wing. Rondo is a guy Dumars has had interest in before and also a guy Smith has wanted to play with for a while. (This is speculation on my part but I think pursuing Rondo might have been part of Dumars' pitch to Smith to get him to turn down S&T scenarios w/ HOU.) You also have to look beyond basketball because after all, this is a business. Let's say a Monroe for Rondo swap goes down - DET instantly becomes times over more marketable and that would bring in a lot of money. BOS on the other hand takes a huge marketability hit. These ownership groups have real money invested in these teams so this isn't a factor that can be overlooked.

I view Rondo and Monroe as similar players. Good enough to be the 3rd best players on great teams. But Monroe is better for BOS to have because starting with bigs is easier than a pass first PG and Rondo is better for DET because they already have a starting front court they can win with.

If they believe Drummond is the answer long term at center, I can get with your point.

RiceOnTheRun
07-18-2013, 04:11 PM
I think it's fair offer. It's Rondo, an established all-star pg for Drummond, a player who averaged about 8 ppg last year and has done nothing but show flashes of potential. Deandre Jordan did too. The other players would be great pieces for Detroit on the floor and boston gets cap space for the rebuild. I know PLENTY about basketball and what I do know is Rondo's going nowhere unless he comes at Ainge's price. All this posturing about "being terrible" for the next few years doesn't help the Pistons at all. So go ahead and keep Knight as your pg, or even Billups. Trade value is purely speculative, but who's more valuable to that team, on the court, next season? If your answer is Drummond than you know nothing about basketball.

You must be mentally challenged. Either that or you have no idea how basketball works.

Good big men will always be worth more than good guards. Drummond is all about the potential, no ****. And Rondo is an established all-star PG coming off an ACL injury. Rondo is a great player, no doubt, but a young big man with elite potential is worth plenty more than an all-star PG. There are maybe 5-6 at most elite centers in the NBA, while the PG position goes at least 10 deep and a solid guard is a dime a dozen compared to big men.

So to answer your question as to who's more valuable over the next few years, it's Drummond until he himself proves otherwise.

dtmagnet
07-18-2013, 04:15 PM
Yes, we're dumb for trying to rape teams via trades.

Makes sense.

Yeah, you are. Keep making crappy offers to people and no one will pick up the phone when you call.

Gators123
07-18-2013, 04:22 PM
Yeah, you are. Keep making crappy offers to people and no one will pick up the phone when you call.

Well Dumars already laughed at the trade rumor this thread is about. He said they talked but never about Knight. Im sure even he knows that rumor didn't make any sense.

And why are you so upset about the Rudy Gay rumor? Hes nothing special. Getting large expiring contracts for a guy that takes 17-18 shots per game, scores 17-18 points per game, and makes $17-18M isn't that bad of a deal for the Raptors.

That was a hell of a lot better deal than Raptor fans thinking they could get Drummond for him :laugh2:

TheIlladelph16
07-18-2013, 04:57 PM
Are people seriously saying Drummond in any package for Rondo would be a fair deal? I'd be hard pressed to give up Monroe in a deal for Rondo, let alone the C with the most potential in the NBA (who is only 20 freaking years old).

Rondo is coming off a potentially devastating injury to a basketball player. His value is the lowest it has been his entire career.

rocket
07-18-2013, 05:08 PM
Drummond is never going to get traded. There's no point of putting him in trade scenarios.

Sly Guy
07-18-2013, 06:08 PM
Drummond is never going to get traded. There's no point of putting him in trade scenarios.

no he's not going to be traded. On the other hand, I see a whole lot of piston fans overrating him in this thread. Proven success > potential success, I don't care what height the player is. ACL injuries are a scary thing, but that's what you have team doctors and physical examinations for.

D-Leethal
07-18-2013, 06:23 PM
I would do Monroe for Rondo just for the fact that all of a sudden the pieces start to fit beautifully. Its not really addition by subtraction but the idea is similar. Any team around Rondo with Smoove/Drummond will be better than a team with Smoove/Monroe/Drummond frontcourt.

hugepatsfan
07-18-2013, 06:24 PM
DET gets: G Rajon Rondo, G Aaron Afflalo, F/C Glen Davis, G Jordan Crawford
ORL gets: G Brandon Knight, G Courtney Lee, F Charlie Villanueva, C Fab Melo
BOS gets: C Greg Monroe, G Jameer Nelson, G Rodney Stuckey

Deception
07-18-2013, 07:23 PM
DET gets: G Rajon Rondo, G Aaron Afflalo, F/C Glen Davis, G Jordan Crawford
ORL gets: G Brandon Knight, G Courtney Lee, F Charlie Villanueva, C Fab Melo
BOS gets: C Greg Monroe, G Jameer Nelson, G Rodney Stuckey

I have no problem with this.

Branwegner84
07-18-2013, 07:28 PM
The only deal I personally would do if I'm the Pistons is: Knight, Monroe, Villanueva, Stuckey, and a pick for Rondo, Green, and Melo

D-Leethal
07-18-2013, 07:46 PM
Knight pretty much blows, correct?

RipCity32
07-18-2013, 09:49 PM
Knight pretty much blows, correct?

He has talent but can't put it together yet.In other words though as of right now yes he blows.

Deception
07-18-2013, 10:53 PM
He's a system point guard, he may thrive with Mo Cheeks as a coach, but he knows this is his make or break year

mark1125
07-19-2013, 06:35 AM
Knight pretty much blows, correct?

As of now, I would say that is a fairly reasonable assessment. However, the talent is there and a season with Cheeks and Billups Could get things straightened out. Honestly, if Dumars can't get a good deal on a legit PG, I say they roll with Knight and let him sink or swim.

SeoulBeatz
07-19-2013, 07:00 AM
I can see why the Celts shot this down but I would love that trade for Detroit.

Rondo
KCP
Josh Smith
Monroe
Drummond

They might have trouble scoring but that line-up is pretty menacing on defense, would certainly be exciting to watch.

DitchDat
07-19-2013, 07:47 AM
Terrible offer.

Bmoss12
07-19-2013, 12:06 PM
As of now, I would say that is a fairly reasonable assessment. However, the talent is there and a season with Cheeks and Billups Could get things straightened out. Honestly, if Dumars can't get a good deal on a legit PG, I say they roll with Knight and let him sink or swim.


Knight = Poor Man's Jason Terry.

Jabears85
07-19-2013, 12:18 PM
Why wouldn't he try lowball offers just to see what kind of counter offers he might get.

I could see Knight and Monroe for Rondo

Or Drummond and Knight for Rondo and Jeff Green considering they lack a SF. Idk if the Celtics would do that to unless some expiring and picks were thrown in.

Rip City would have a pretty good line up with:
Rondo/Billups/Bynum
Stuckey/Caldwell-Pope
Jeff Green/Singlar
Josh Smith/etc
Monroe/etc

MiamiBoy77
07-19-2013, 12:33 PM
Knight, Stuckey, CV, and a future pick for rondo, bass, Wallace

RipCity32
07-19-2013, 12:33 PM
I could see Knight and Monroe for Rondo

Or Drummond and Knight for Rondo and Jeff Green considering they lack a SF. Idk if the Celtics would do that to unless some expiring and picks were thrown in.

Rip City would have a pretty good line up with:
Rondo/Billups/Bynum
Stuckey/Caldwell-Pope
Jeff Green/Singlar
Josh Smith/etc
Monroe/etc

I'm not even kidding that if Dumars traded Drummond for Rondo that I would probably quit watching basketball.I don't think you could find one piston fan on this forum or any other one that would be happy about this.The rest of you guys haven't really seen Drummond play like Pistons fans have and we know we have a serious star in the making.So maybe trading Drummond sounds like a good idea to you but to Pistons fans it sounds completely idiotic.

LeperMessiah
07-19-2013, 12:46 PM
If detroit wants Rondo they will have to throw in drummond or monroe at the very least.

Deception
07-19-2013, 02:24 PM
Boston fans need to realize if you're getting Knight and Monroe and shedding Wallace's contract (which is horrendous, who the hell signed this guy?), you're high if you think you're getting a first rounder along with it.

hugepatsfan
07-19-2013, 02:28 PM
I'm not even kidding that if Dumars traded Drummond for Rondo that I would probably quit watching basketball.I don't think you could find one piston fan on this forum or any other one that would be happy about this.The rest of you guys haven't really seen Drummond play like Pistons fans have and we know we have a serious star in the making.So maybe trading Drummond sounds like a good idea to you but to Pistons fans it sounds completely idiotic.

I don't think a single reasonable Celtics fan is demanding Drummond back. The consensus seems to be that we NEED to get Monroe back. Some think we should get Knight back as well, which I don't think it too unreasonable.

The only serious talk of getting Drummond back are people saying we should send Jeff Green back too. Personally I still don't think DET should give up Drummond even for Rondo and Green but I also don't think it's a ridiculous proposal either. I look for Green to really take off this year. He had never gotten the chance for starter's minutes at his natural position before until last year when we moved Pierce to SG and started Green at SF. As a starting SF for the last 13 games last year he averaged 35.8 minutes, 18.7 points, 6.1 rebounds, 3.0 assists, 0.8 steals, 0.7 blocks, only 2.2 turnovers, 49.5% from the field, 48.7% from 3, 75% FT shooting. He also plays solid/good defense. Small sample size I know but those aren't too far off from his career per 36 #s (other than the 3 point %) and that was with him constantly playing out of position at SF. By the end of next season mark my words - Green will be looked at as a more valuable player than Rondo or Monroe. And his game fits better on most teams because Rondo's a PG that can't shoot and Monroe is a C that doesn't defend well - a versatile wing like Green fits on pretty much every team.

hugepatsfan
07-19-2013, 02:31 PM
Boston fans need to realize if you're getting Knight and Monroe and shedding Wallace's contract (which is horrendous, who the hell signed this guy?), you're high if you think you're getting a first rounder along with it.

Most Celtics fans aren't pushing for DET to take back Wallace or even give up a pick. Monroe and Knight is a return most Celtics fan seem to be willing to take. Mainly because we can't see DET taking Wallace back. A Rondo-Pope-Wallace-Smith-Drummond core would have horrific floor spacing. DET taking back Lee or Bass is a more reasonable idea that some have mentioned.

Deception
07-19-2013, 02:41 PM
Most Celtics fans aren't pushing for DET to take back Wallace or even give up a pick. Monroe and Knight is a return most Celtics fan seem to be willing to take. Mainly because we can't see DET taking Wallace back. A Rondo-Pope-Wallace-Smith-Drummond core would have horrific floor spacing. DET taking back Lee or Bass is a more reasonable idea that some have mentioned.

I'll take Lee since we already have a **** ton of forwards.

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=bxv47k2

We need to clear an extra spot to sign Siva, it would help, plus it wouldn't hurt the Celtics since Stuckey is an expiring.

5ass
07-19-2013, 02:47 PM
DET gets: G Rajon Rondo, G Aaron Afflalo, F/C Glen Davis, G Jordan Crawford
ORL gets: G Brandon Knight, G Courtney Lee, F Charlie Villanueva, C Fab Melo
BOS gets: C Greg Monroe, G Jameer Nelson, G Rodney Stuckey

Good trade.