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Aust
07-11-2013, 04:14 AM
Power transfer worried Howard


Dwight Howard's distaste for the offense and approach of coach Mike D'Antoni is widely cited as the biggest trigger in his decision to leave the Los Angeles Lakers. But another key factor that led the All-Star center to the Houston Rockets was the Lakers' refusal to establish a clear timetable for moving on from the Kobe Bryant era, according to sources with knowledge of Howard's thinking.

Sources told ESPN.com that Howard and his representatives -- in a handful of meetings with Lakers officials before he became a free agent July 1 -- strongly suggested the center would have a difficult time re-signing with the team if Bryant stayed with the franchise beyond the 2013-14 season, the final year of his contract.

The Lakers, almost from the moment Howard arrived in August 2012, had gone to great lengths to assure the 27-year-old that they saw him as the future face of the franchise and that the torch would be passed from Bryant to him in short order.

But with Bryant saying publicly just a week before free agency that he was thinking of playing at least two or three more seasons, it was hard for Howard to envision when he would assume that role, sources said.

"How can it be Kobe's team and Dwight's team?" one source said. "It was about the passing of the torch."

As an offshoot of those discussions, sources said, Howard's camp at one point asked the Lakers whether they were at least considering releasing Bryant through the league's amnesty provision, since Bryant's return date from Achilles tendon surgery remained in question.

ESPN The Magazine's Chris Broussard reported last month that Howard and All-Star point guard Chris Paul had discussions before free agency about trying to land with the same team. Howard and Paul had interest in playing together in Los Angeles, with either the Lakers or the Clippers, or with the Atlanta Hawks, sources said.

Releasing Bryant via the amnesty provision and shopping Pau Gasol and Steve Nash to teams with salary-cap space would have allowed the Lakers to try to recruit Paul in free agency. But the Lakers, sources said, made it clear the prospect of releasing Bryant or simply trying to lay out a finite timetable on the end of his career with the franchise was not under consideration, believing those decisions should and would be made by Bryant.

Bryant made it clear from the first day of training camp this past season that the Lakers were his team, and he saw it as his responsibility to prepare Howard for that responsibility one day. Howard stated that he was anxious to learn from Bryant, Nash and Gasol. Both Howard and Bryant were amenable to that arrangement early, but as the season wore on, it became clear to Howard that there wouldn't be a clean transfer of power, sources said.

"I just really think the timing in L.A., it wasn't right for me," Howard told ESPNLosAngeles.com's Dave McMenamin on Friday. "Maybe two years ago, or 2-3 years from now, it would have been the right time. But I just think right now the timing was off for me. That's not saying that L.A. is a bad place, but I just think it's all about timing and fit when you're talking about basketball. You can put anybody together on the court and expect them to win, but the pieces have to really fit in order for a team to be successful and it was very, very tough, man. It's probably one of the toughest decisions I've ever had to make in my life."

The Lakers, as ESPN.com has reported, were similarly unwilling to make a coaching change, even if it would have boosted their chances of retaining Howard, who has since publicly confirmed, in an interview with Hoopsworld.com, that he asked the Lakers to hire Phil Jackson in November.

"I think that we had our moments, but I think that his style was a little bit different than what I was accustomed to," Howard told ESPNLosAngeles.com of D'Antoni. "But I don't want to blame any of that on the coach as the reason why I'm leaving."

Howard also didn't feel especially close with anyone in the Lakers' organization outside of general manager Mitch Kupchak, sources said. One source added that Howard had concerns about how the Lakers planned to market him after being disappointed with the franchise in that aspect last season.

In his first public comments since Howard's departure, Bryant said Wednesday that he wasn't going to "waste my time trying to figure out what happened" and that he was "happy" for Howard, who "made the decision he feels is best for him."

"I think everybody is cut differently," Bryant said. "[Howard] has his way of leading that he feels like would be most effective and would work for him, and obviously the way we've gone about it with this organization and the leaders that we've had -- myself, Magic [Johnson] and Kareem [Abdul-Jabbar] -- we've done it a different way."

A handful of teams around the league, sources say, now believe Howard's decision to go to Houston had been set for weeks and that his meetings last week with potential suitors had little to no chance to change his mind.

Sources close to Howard counter that the decision was largely clinched by the fact that he felt his best and earliest chance to win his first championship would be realized by teaming up with James Harden, Chandler Parsons and coach Kevin McHale with the Rockets.

Golden State and Dallas made strong impressions on him in their pitch meetings, sources said, but ultimately Howard felt most comfortable, and much more enthusiastic about trying to win in Houston.

Sources close to Howard nonetheless insist the Lakers and the extra $30 million they could offer him were hard to turn down. Howard had developed a close relationship with Kupchak in the center's year with the team and intended to inform the GM in person of his decision after flying back to Los Angeles from Colorado, a source said.

Howard called the Mavericks and Warriors earlier in the day -- while his representative told the Hawks the night before -- so those teams could move on with their business in a timely fashion. By the time Howard landed late Friday evening, though, it had already been widely reported that he had decided on Houston, and Howard simply called Kupchak to deliver the news, a source said.

Taken from my man Shep.

Link (http://espn.go.com/los-angeles/nba/story/_/id/9468452/dwight-howard-wanted-end-kobe-bryant-era-los-angeles-lakers)

Aust
07-11-2013, 04:15 AM
IMO he didn't earn the right to have the torch passed to him. If you want it, go out there and get it. Prove yourself worthy.

True Sports Fan
07-11-2013, 04:17 AM
He is ******** if he ever deemed that possible.

raiderposting
07-11-2013, 04:22 AM
Lol **** Dwight

D1JM
07-11-2013, 04:26 AM
so basically howard wanted the lakers to surround him by the guys he preferred. where he could dictate what type of offense was run and who was coaching the team. that's a ****en diva right there

Leftcoast_yg
07-11-2013, 04:30 AM
An unloyal player trying to get rid of the loyal. Sad. Now i feel bad for the rockets.

raiderposting
07-11-2013, 04:42 AM
I can't wait until Dwight opts out in 3 years lol

MyDRoseLikeDeng
07-11-2013, 04:42 AM
I seriously feel bad for the Rockets. Got the biggest cancer in all of basketball, dudes not a winner in any sense of the word

raiderposting
07-11-2013, 04:50 AM
Yet he has shaq saying the dream is number 1 in his sig.

ArmLaker
07-11-2013, 04:52 AM
Pretend he wasn't a Laker. Pretend Lakers never existed. Just look at Howard the person and how it affects the game on the court.....is that really a player you would trust to help win you a championship. A challenging road deep with obstacles, issues of trust, the fortitude to pull through in crunch time? Quit being a fvcking homer like we have mistakenly been and look at the big picture here.

YouCan'tBeatLA
07-11-2013, 04:55 AM
Hayavari kunir lav@

Tash toosh. :dance:

YouCan'tBeatLA
07-11-2013, 04:56 AM
Fobolous acting like Dwight is the next GOAT. Calm your balls, dude.

FOBolous
07-11-2013, 04:59 AM
Fobolous acting like Dwight is the next GOAT. Calm your balls, dude.

you're the ones acting that way with how butt hurt yall are acting. if you REALLY think Dwight sucks, stop caring like how yall didn't care when all the other Lakers players left the Lakers during free agency (i.e. Antwan Jamison).

raiderposting
07-11-2013, 05:00 AM
Fabulous is right Dwight Howard is going to win at least 6 of the next 9 championships with harden. We're just hating at least I admit it. Howard is going to go down as a top 5 player. Fear the smile.

AI
07-11-2013, 05:02 AM
Dwight is such a diva. Poor Rockets, you don't know what you're getting into.

FOBolous
07-11-2013, 05:02 AM
Fabulous is right Dwight Howard is going to win at least 6 of the next 9 championships with harden. We're just hating at least I admit it. Howard is going to go down as a top 5 player. Fear the smile.

that's ridiculous with a Miami superteam, with how deep the Clippers how, which how good the warriors have gotten. dude do you know anything about basketball? to say the Rockets will win so many championships with the amount of the competition the Rockets have is absolutely ridiculous.

LakersMaster24
07-11-2013, 05:03 AM
Ara, es harif g7 ova?

Kunem lavuh

Gandon

YouCan'tBeatLA
07-11-2013, 05:04 AM
you're the ones acting that way with how butt hurt yall are acting. if you REALLY think Dwight sucks, stop caring like how yall didn't care when all the other Lakers players left the Lakers during free agency (i.e. Antwan Jamison).

When the **** did I say Dwight sucks? Are you that delirious? Stop acting like Laker fans are butthurt because we don't give two ***** about Howard. No-one on this board even approved of the #stayd12 banners. Dwight has done nothing in the past season to prove he was worthy of us getting down on our knees and hoping he'd stay. Now, shoo.

YouCan'tBeatLA
07-11-2013, 05:05 AM
nah man. i'm just so sick of seeing Lakers fans trashing our city and our team. every time someone says "Oh dwight will never win a championship..." and how "oh Dwight left his best chance to win a championship..." or "oh Dwight couldn't handle the spotlight..." it's an indirect insult to our team and our city.

Here's a tissue... Oh, boohoo people on the internet board insulted the glorious city of Houston. What a travesty!

raiderposting
07-11-2013, 05:06 AM
that's ridiculous with a Miami superteam, with how deep the Clippers how, which how good the warriors have gotten. dude do you know anything about basketball? to say the Rockets will win so many championships with the amount of the competition the Rockets have is absolutely ridiculous.

Naw dude you're underestimating dwight. I think the rockets can win 8-10 in a row if healthy

FOBolous
07-11-2013, 05:08 AM
Naw dude you're underestimating dwight. I think the rockets can win 8-10 in a row if healthy

lol i don't think that's true, but i'm flattered that you think the Rockets are that good. it really takes a big person to admit you're wrong. i applaud you for that. other Lakers fans should be more like you and stop crying over Dwight. seriously man, your fellow Lakers fans act like prepubescent girls who just experienced their first breakup. it's unbecoming of a fan base of such a great team.

ArmLaker
07-11-2013, 05:09 AM
Naw dude you're underestimating dwight. I think the rockets can win 8-10 in a row if healthy

Preseason games?

LakersMaster24
07-11-2013, 05:10 AM
Most Lakers fans felt neutral about Dwight staying or leaving. Why?

He never showed he is a player that can lead a team to a ring. He doesnt have the drive. He doesnt have the passion

raiderposting
07-11-2013, 05:12 AM
Preseason games?

I was just playing the rockets will win 12 of the next 13 and we would regret letting Dwight go

raiderposting
07-11-2013, 05:19 AM
:laugh2:

Nice sig hahah

FOBolous
07-11-2013, 05:20 AM
It's okay, I got him in mine.

lol way to make up something. it's ok. i ain't mad :) i give you credit for being mildly clever.

YouCan'tBeatLA
07-11-2013, 05:21 AM
lol way to make up something. it's ok. i ain't mad :) i give you credit for being mildly clever.

Way to use ninja edit... damn you. :(

raiderposting
07-11-2013, 05:22 AM
My sig is the best because he felt so dumb haha

Aust
07-11-2013, 05:22 AM
Guys, just report him.

MagicBucsSox
07-11-2013, 05:23 AM
Y'all quick to believe anything on the net, and the sad part is ,IT'S THE RIGHT BASKETBALL MOVE

lakers4sho
07-11-2013, 05:24 AM
Fobomaman

MyDRoseLikeDeng
07-11-2013, 05:30 AM
Just curios, how is this Rockets team at all better than the Laker team Dwight was previously on? Well, frankly, its not and its not even that close. After the achilles injury, maybe, but Dwight needs to understand the problem is DWIGHT, not everyone else.

Here's the thing about NBA players that I have noticed. As a Bulls fan, I will use Jimmy Butler as an example. Butler was homeless as a child, then adopted and went to JC, then worked his butt off and made the Marquette team, and then still had to work his butt off to become a star on the team and an eventual NBA player. When he made the NBA, most people thought of him as a benchwarmer, myself included, but he had a history of having to WORK hard for what he wanted. Guys like LeBron and Howard have always been anointed as being great, and hard work was not always necessary because sheer talent alone would almost always be enough. That is, until they went up against the best players in the world. Kudos to LeBron, he realized this and saved his legacy by working hard, getting in the gym and working on his shooting, his free throws, and his low post offense. Not to say Dwight doesn't get in the gym and work hard, but he always deflects blame on others. His free throw percentage is laughable, he has been in the league for I believe 9 seasons and has not even developed a jump shot of any sort. He is a cancer in every sense of the word, and that Houston troll fan that said Lakers fans are in denial is in for a big reality check. Maybe one day Dwight will realize its not Kobes fault, or Van Gundys fault, or soon to be Lin and whoever else's fault. Its on you, you big baby. grow up, rant over lol

FOBolous
07-11-2013, 05:32 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EP5BoM5AsFA

lol that's pretty good. i'm lol-ing right now watching it. i'm going to bookmark it. have you seen Joe's other videos? it's hilarious. he's like the ultimate troll.


check out this video, i'm lmao as i watch it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9x5XKmb5020

D1JM
07-11-2013, 06:00 AM
The three rocket fans and laker fans are getting annoying now. All this bickering is making it hard to keep up

rockets-fan
07-11-2013, 06:09 AM
Omg if Dwight sucks so bad and is such a cancer move the hell on. I can't wait to see him in a rockets uniform helping my boy James Harden win a championship.

FOBolous
07-11-2013, 06:12 AM
Omg if Dwight sucks so bad and is such a cancer move the hell on. I can't wait to see him in a rockets uniform helping my boy James Harden win a championship.

this.

jam
07-11-2013, 06:38 AM
I've stated consistently and repeatedly that dwight is a highly combustible and erratic basket case. He is both a megalomaniac, hyper-sensitive and almost comically passive-aggressive.

Despite the delusions of the HOU frontrunners, Howard is not in any way shape or form capable of a 180 where he somehow instantly transmogrifies into a model citizen. He has too much money, too many yes men, and too much influence to become a humble, ego-less saint.

I am going to be laughing at the HOU fans when Howard blows up in their faces. Get ready for dwightmare, part whatever.

Harden is Howard's strip club wingman, but everyone else in the org is a fair target for his punitive, childish, girlie wrath.



Power transfer worried Howard



Taken from my man Shep.

Link (http://espn.go.com/los-angeles/nba/story/_/id/9468452/dwight-howard-wanted-end-kobe-bryant-era-los-angeles-lakers)

ldawg
07-11-2013, 06:41 AM
Like i said the same reason Howard left Orlando is the same reasons he left Lakers. He felt they were not catering to his wishes. playing GM I want to chose who is on the team, I want this coach fired, I want more touches in the post. same old nothing new. Dude dont care about winning he just wana have fun. I think Houston can be great they have a good team but it will depend on which Howard show up. He would be great in the pick and role with Harden like the success he had in Olando before the obsession of wanting more post plays ran, I want this player and get this coach outta here. If Howard walk with those luggage Houston we have a problem. He is best used in the pick and role and the team will have more success with Harden being the closer with the ball. Not sure how that sits with Howard being the same reasons he left his old teams. Thats exactly what Howard hates so it will be interesting, Will he get the post up plays he desire, will he get the ball late in the game that he wishes, will he go to a third team only to be dump right back in what he hates the pick and role?

xxplayerxx23
07-11-2013, 06:42 AM
Poor rockets? Don't think many will say that after the year starts.

ldawg
07-11-2013, 06:48 AM
This will get interesting, I can see Kobe and Howard butting heads but Howard and Nash? He did not like Pau or Metta too? You want to tell non of those guys did not really care for you? i dont know about that. Mabe it time to look in the mirror. Both Orlando and LA really thats like 25 30 different people.

ldawg
07-11-2013, 06:50 AM
They better start sucking up because he has an exit set up if they dont.

Delrayhc
07-11-2013, 08:30 AM
Kobe helped bring the Lakers 5 championships. He's earned the right to hold on to the power for as long as he wants.

Rivera
07-11-2013, 08:57 AM
So Dwight tried to take kobe out like Kobe took out shaq

La still chose kobe n dantoni over the center in his prime considered the best center in the nba today

Should say something about dwights personallity that la didn't want to build around

kblo247
07-11-2013, 09:10 AM
Kareem saying Dwight never returned his calls nor tried to work with him said something about that. He posed with him when he got to LA and said I want to learn from him and let him teach me to the press and on twitter, and then never returned the guys call. And he tried to be a post up big to boot last year

cssdmark
07-11-2013, 09:10 AM
If you wanted to rebuild Dwight would have been a nice piece, especially if he could have got Cp3 to come I would have amnestied Kobe as with those two players LA would be setup for another 5-6years. I do understand the loyalty to Kobe as I think he should retire a Laker but if he continues with that I am the man attitude and this is my team the Lakers will be rebuilding for the next few years . I hate to say it but I knew once Kobe stated he could play for a few more years that Dwight was not coming back. Maybe Kobe said that because he did not want Dwight to come back.

jason6692
07-11-2013, 09:14 AM
Lol the Lakers are kobes team we know that. When Dwight had a chance to be the leader after Kobe injury he got swept. He won't win a chip in Houston 4th quarter he won't be seeing the ball and if he is he will be missing free throws which puts the ball and all the attention on harden. Their bench sucks too I mean maybe they'll be a decent regular season team that's about it

DaddyCool
07-11-2013, 09:19 AM
Superstars wield a lot of power in today's NBA. That's nothing new. He didn't get what he wanted in LA and so he moved over to Houston. The end. Butthurt Laker fans can twist this into how Dwight didn't deserve to be catered to and he didn't deserve to be the face of the franchise because he's a child and an idiot (which I totally agree with) but the fact remains, that in today's NBA, if you aren't willing to cater to every whim of your superstar and give him the supporting cast to compete with, he'll find some team with the cap space that will.

kblo247
07-11-2013, 09:19 AM
I would have to pistol whoop a hitch if Dwight got Kobe amnestied, Nash and Pau traded, and his guys in Josh Smith and Monta Ellis brought in for the max next to him. No fan should,have to experience those 3 and that's who Dwight wanted

RLundi
07-11-2013, 09:19 AM
Half of the posts in this thread have been deleted lol.

I'm not on Dwight's side in this, but you have to at least ask about Kobe. Financially and moving forward, amnestying Kobe makes a lot of sense. But emotionally, and considering how awful it would look and how it might alienate their fans, I can understand why the Lakers are willing to let Kobe dictate the rest of his career on his own.

jp611
07-11-2013, 09:25 AM
So when he realizes he's not the man in Houston... What happens next?

ManRam
07-11-2013, 09:25 AM
Y'all quick to believe anything on the net, and the sad part is ,IT'S THE RIGHT BASKETBALL MOVE

Agreed. We've seen how carried away people get blasting him. In Orlando there were cases of flat out lies about him. It wouldn't surprise me, because like you said it is the right move and if the Lakers wanted to get better as currently constructed they would have needed to free up that money.


It wouldn't surprise me because he's made similar demands, and it's not a totally stupid move...but who knows? Obviously people are jumping at the bit to continue to assassinate his character in LA.

Tried to do Kobe like Kobe did Shaq...but he doesn't have that clout in LA.

Which is another reason why if any Laker fan utters "loyalty" they're being idiots. There's no reason he should have loyalty to that franchise.

nickdymez
07-11-2013, 09:26 AM
I feel bad for Harden!

jp611
07-11-2013, 09:26 AM
He won't be the man in Houston though... So the whining will continue on

He won't be happy until he's in Brooklyn

jp611
07-11-2013, 09:28 AM
Agreed. We've seen how carried away people get blasting him. In Orlando there were cases of flat out lies about him. It wouldn't surprise me, because like you said it is the right move and if the Lakers wanted to get better as currently constructed they would have needed to free up that money.


It wouldn't surprise me because he's made similar demands, and it's not a totally stupid move...but who knows? Obviously people are jumping at the bit to continue to assassinate his character in LA.

Tried to do Kobe like Kobe did Shaq...but he doesn't have that clout in LA.

Which is another reason why if any Laker fan utters "loyalty" they're being idiots. There's no reason he should have loyalty to that franchise.

Dwight pretty much did that on his own

ManRam
07-11-2013, 09:30 AM
Dwight pretty much did that on his own

Well sure. He brought it on himself in Orlando. LA? Not so much. But still, the responsibility of journalists is to be accurate and fair. There wasn't a lot of that, and there rarely is. And just because the whole world hated him doesn't mean it was OK for them to spread out and out lies.

FYL_McVeezy
07-11-2013, 09:31 AM
If true.....

:laugh:


it's prolly not true though....

but if so....



:laugh:

lakers4sho
07-11-2013, 09:31 AM
Half of the posts in this thread have been deleted lol.

I'm not on Dwight's side in this, but you have to at least ask about Kobe. Financially and moving forward, amnestying Kobe makes a lot of sense. But emotionally, and considering how awful it would look and how it might alienate their fans, I can understand why the Lakers are willing to let Kobe dictate the rest of his career on his own.

It doesn't.

ManRam
07-11-2013, 09:33 AM
It doesn't.

Now it doesn't. With Dwight coming back it certainly could have. Especially if the talk of Kobe not willing to take a discount after this year.

Triple_Ocho
07-11-2013, 09:33 AM
I'm really surprised most post are in support of the Lakers decision haha. If the Lakers saw D12 as a guy who could bring them titles don't you think they would've made more of an effort to keep Dwight (fire dantoni, find some shooters, talk to Kobe about passing torch)??? The point when I knew I wanted Dwight gone was when Nash finally came back after breaking his leg. There was an article that pretty much compared Dwight's work ethic to other Lakers players. For example, Aftr practice Nash was seen running extra sprints while Dwight was playing on his phone lol. Guy didn't stick around and work on his free throws even haha. He did nothing to make the Lakers want to build around him. I speak for many Lakers fans when I say good riddance D12. How did Magic fans deal with you for so long?

Theyhateme459
07-11-2013, 09:34 AM
Sooooooo it seems like these days people can just say from my "sources" and write a story about whatever speculation they want.

Avenged
07-11-2013, 09:34 AM
Wow. What a dick. Time to start sucking up and hoping you do well, Houston, or else Dwight will start causing problems.

BigCityofDreams
07-11-2013, 09:36 AM
Well sure. He brought it on himself in Orlando. LA? Not so much. But still, the responsibility of journalists is to be accurate and fair. There wasn't a lot of that, and there rarely is. And just because the whole world hated him doesn't mean it was OK for them to spread out and out lies.

Are they lying detailing his time in LA or just telling the other side of the story. When he chose HOU every article or reporter trashed the Lakers in some way: Kobe turned him off with the comments in the meeting, Mike D didn't say anything and doesn't like Dwight, Buss ignored him, Nash didn't warm up to him, Kobe and Nash didn't defend him in the media, etc.

So now the other side is being told and ppl say it's not fair. How is that the case?

ManRam
07-11-2013, 09:40 AM
The Lakers would have been smart to prioritize Dwight over Kobe, but the fact that Dwight demanded it and the fact that he needs so much catered to him means they might be OK with this once-undesirable outcome. I don't think it's unlike what a lot of players want and do (we've seen Kobe, Shaq, T-Mac, MJ etc. make demands of similar natures) but I think his hubris got him once again. He probably wasn't quite in the situation to make these demands.

I think he'll be fine in Houston...and I'm not so sure he would have in LA. So in that regard, he made the right decision (is that still a debate?).

RLundi
07-11-2013, 09:40 AM
It doesn't.

Except it does. Lakers aren't going anywhere with an aging, injured Kobe poaching $30M in salary.

ManRam
07-11-2013, 09:41 AM
Are they lying detailing his time in LA or just telling the other side of the story. When he chose HOU every article or reporter trashed the Lakers in some way: Kobe turned him off with the comments in the meeting, Mike D didn't say anything and doesn't like Dwight, Buss ignored him, Nash didn't warm up to him, Kobe and Nash didn't defend him in the media, etc.

So now the other side is being told and ppl say it's not fair. How is that the case?

Who knows? I think a lot of that was overblown too. In fact, there were conflicting reports about the Kobe thing. There were even conflicting reports at the time whether Dwight met with the FO face-to-face to tell them his decision. There were conflicting reports about most everything...

...which just leads me to be hesitant in general. People are eager for stories here...probably too much so.

kblo247
07-11-2013, 09:42 AM
Well sure. He brought it on himself in Orlando. LA? Not so much. But still, the responsibility of journalists is to be accurate and fair. There wasn't a lot of that, and there rarely is. And just because the whole world hated him doesn't mean it was OK for them to spread out and out lies.

No one in LA said to say I will work with Kareem, take pictures with Kareem, and then not return his calls to set up said meetings to work on your post game, if you decide you won't vacate it to Pau

No one in LA told him to bad mouth Kobe and get caught by the media showing a box score around the locker room when Kobe wasnt there saying he deserved more shots than his average which was on par with Orlando.

No one in LA outside Shaq told him don't be a pick and roll big and ignore what he and Nash could have used to death

No one in LA made him act so sill that Pop cussed him out at an all star game for being childish.

No one in LA told Dwight to expect it would be easy. In fact worthy on the day the trade went down, said he better understand there's nothing less than rings, wins, and years of high level play going to be accepted by the Lakers to be thought of a true great.

Even Mitch gave him the West spill Shaq got and 17 year old Kobe got about see those names up there, you have to be this great, win this much, etc to get yours up there and a statue.

Dwight hurts himself when he said he and Harden will be the next Kobe and Shaq to Stephen A Smith. Dwight hurt himself when he opted in over just going to Brooklyn. Dwight hurt himself in LA when he has guys out there playing hurt and tired and he refused to play while cleared with a labrum and refused to get surgery, while Kobe logged 40+ minutes in the second half nightly to get the lakers the third best record in the nba in the second half of the season. No one told Dwight also exit how he did in game 4.

Dwight needs a pr guy, and a babysitter. You shouldn't be an issue on a team to the point where you have Metta saying chemistry went up and the team should win more games without you, Pau of all people won't wish you well in your endeavors, Nash goes on the radio and says you refused to sacrifice your game basically like everyone else adapted and weren't truly in, and you can't man up and tell Kobe anything to his face but will jabber behind his back when he's gone and shut up like a ***** when he says tell me what you think of me to your face in the Memphis locker room by the account of the players. LA wasnt for him as a basketball player or personality, and he somehow soured his teammates, coach, former laker legends who work around the team and are in the know, and fans all by himself.

Triple_Ocho
07-11-2013, 09:51 AM
Agreed. We've seen how carried away people get blasting him. In Orlando there were cases of flat out lies about him. It wouldn't surprise me, because like you said it is the right move and if the Lakers wanted to get better as currently constructed they would have needed to free up that money.


It wouldn't surprise me because he's made similar demands, and it's not a totally stupid move...but who knows? Obviously people are jumping at the bit to continue to assassinate his character in LA.

Tried to do Kobe like Kobe did Shaq...but he doesn't have that clout in LA.

Which is another reason why if any Laker fan utters "loyalty" they're being idiots. There's no reason he should have loyalty to that franchise.

Kobe and Shaq was a different case... Kobe had proven his value to the franchise thru helping bring titles. No Kobe, no titles. Shaq needed Kobe just as much as Kobe needed Shaq. Dwight, on the other hand, complained about touches (not sure why... Second most touches in the post of any center in the league ad he has 2 post moves - baseline spin, and the face up to the jab and go for a hook shot). Tho he may have worked hard, he didn't have the work ethic of a guy who could lead the lakers. Think of the guys who led this team over the years - Kobe, Magic, Kareem, West, Chamberlain, etc... Only guy who gets a pass is Shaq cuz he dominated when it was gametime. Dwight was not up to the challenge. He may have good work thic, but the Lakers were looking for champion work ethic from their future cornerstone.

ManRam
07-11-2013, 09:52 AM
No one in LA said to say I will work with Kareem, take pictures with Kareem, and then not return his calls to set up said meetings to work on your post game, if you decide you won't vacate it to Pau

No one in LA told him to bad mouth Kobe and get caught by the media showing a box score around the locker room when Kobe wasnt there saying he deserved more shots than his average which was on par with Orlando.

No one in LA outside Shaq told him don't be a pick and roll big and ignore what he and Nash could have used to death

No one in LA made him act so sill that Pop cussed him out at an all star game for being childish.

No one in LA told Dwight to expect it would be easy. In fact worthy on the day the trade went down, said he better understand there's nothing less than rings, wins, and years of high level play going to be accepted by the Lakers to be thought of a true great.

Even Mitch gave him the West spill Shaq got and 17 year old Kobe got about see those names up there, you have to be this great, win this much, etc to get yours up there and a statue.

Dwight hurts himself when he said he and Harden will be the next Kobe and Shaq to Stephen A Smith. Dwight hurt himself when he opted in over just going to Brooklyn. Dwight hurt himself in LA when he has guys out there playing hurt and tired and he refused to play while cleared with a labrum and refused to get surgery, while Kobe logged 40+ minutes in the second half nightly to get the lakers the third best record in the nba in the second half of the season. No one told Dwight also exit how he did in game 4.

Dwight needs a pr guy, and a babysitter. You shouldn't be an issue on a team to the point where you have Metta saying chemistry went up and the team should win more games without you, Pau of all people won't wish you well in your endeavors, Nash goes on the radio and says you refused to sacrifice your game basically like everyone else adapted and weren't truly in, and you can't man up and tell Kobe anything to his face but will jabber behind his back when he's gone and shut up like a ***** when he says tell me what you think of me to your face in the Memphis locker room by the account of the players. LA wasnt for him as a basketball player or personality, and he somehow soured his teammates, coach, former laker legends who work around the team and are in the know, and fans all by himself.

Dwight's a weird-*** dude, and has gone from ultra-likable to ultra-hatable. All of those are good points, and I can more than sympathize with them. He deserves a lot of the bashing. But I just think it has boiled over a bit much and has reached the excessive.

He deserves ire from Lakers fans. But the ire has gone overblown because of "Laker privilege". Dwight owed nothing to LA. Dwight didn't ever want to be there. Dwight's not a coward because he left LA. Dwight isn't suddenly a bad player who can't win. Just because he isn't Kobe and is repelled by much of that doesn't mean he's a terrible guy...it just means he has a different approach. And many people have been successful with a more loose and laid back approach.

At the same time he IS still immature and he still wants to be coddled. He thinks that he is a blessing to teams and clearly lucks some humbleness. But he was in a toxic environment and in a place he detested being. All the resultant behavior, however petty it was, boiled down to the fact that he was in a terrible situation for his well-being. It was a toxic environment to everyone that was there.


Who knows how this was even phrased if it was true. I don't think it's too crazy or unique for a player to say: "hey, if I sign, what's gonna happen with Kobe? I'm not sure we really can coexist and financially I think his contract really is a huge burden since he's hurt". He is a free agent after all...and I'm sure similar questions like these get posed by FAs to prospective teams ALL the time. Maybe he did say "Amnesty Kobe or I'm leaving". Who knows? But it certainly could have happened in a reasonable and fair manner. He was a free agent after all...he's gotta do his research

kblo247
07-11-2013, 09:55 AM
The Lakers would have been smart to prioritize Dwight over Kobe, but the fact that Dwight demanded it and the fact that he needs so much catered to him means they might be OK with this once-undesirable outcome. I don't think it's unlike what a lot of players want and do (we've seen Kobe, Shaq, T-Mac, MJ etc. make demands of similar natures) but I think his hubris got him once again. He probably wasn't quite in the situation to make these demands.

I think he'll be fine in Houston...and I'm not so sure he would have in LA. So in that regard, he made the right decision (is that still a debate?).
Based on play? Kobe out played him last year handedly.

Based on work ethic? Kobe's proving that now and has his whole career.

Based on marketability? Kobe's the best draw since MJ, he's adored in LA, the longest tenured laker ever, and owns the record book.

Based on leadership? Kobe led the youngest b2b champion team of the past two decades to three straight finals, over Dwight. He's had issue but make no mistake, when he rescinded the trade demand, he didnt decide the next day oh I don't want to be here trade me anyway like Dwight did. Likewise when it came to winning, Kobe sublimated his game for Shaq, took Shaq trying to get him traded more than once, Shaq hitting him, and Shaq telling the media don't comeback to his team in 04. Kobe welcomed Phil back after the book because it meant the chance to win. Dwight hasn't made one move realistically that says I want to win, have fun sure, but not purely about winning in spite of his own glory and ego. Last year Kobe did whatever they asked started the year off the balls scoring, moved on it to accommodated Dwight not wanting to play pnr with Nash and got everyone involved, defended PGs, played 40+ minutes per night, and with their playoff lives in the line got up withy ruptured Achilles and took and made 2 fts so Marc Jackson couldn't dictate Dwight shoot them.

In the words of Ice Cube ... He don't deserve to go on that god damn wall or be remembered over several role players for the lakers let alone sided with over Kobe when he hadn't proven anything last year besides being a distraction who partially mailed it in and pissed a lot of people off. Its telling not one legend actually tried to get him to stay, and that Jeanie and Phil actually went on vacation over meeting to get him to return. And even if he stayed, he was in for a hellish rude awakening from the FO, the locker room, and fans because they werent going to give him any slack for not winning.

Dwight wanted the torch, got news for you, in la you take the mother****er. That's what Kareem once told Magic. And it embodies the IT he lacked to last there

kblo247
07-11-2013, 09:58 AM
Dwight's a weird-*** dude, and has gone from ultra-likable to ultra-hatable. All of those are good points, and I can more than sympathize with them. He deserves a lot of the bashing. But I just think it has boiled over a bit much and has reached the excessive.

He deserves ire from Lakers fans. But the ire has gone overblown because of "Laker privilege". Dwight owed nothing to LA. Dwight didn't ever want to be there. Dwight's not a coward because he left LA. Dwight isn't suddenly a bad player who can't win. Just because he isn't Kobe and is repelled by much of that doesn't mean he's a terrible guy...it just means he has a different approach. And many people have been successful with a more loose and laid back approach.

At the same time he IS still immature and he still wants to be coddled. He thinks that he is a blessing to teams and clearly lucks some humbleness. But he was in a toxic environment and in a place he detested being. All the resultant behavior, however petty it was, boiled down to the fact that he was in a terrible situation for his well-being. It was a toxic environment to everyone that was there.


Who knows how this was even phrased if it was true. I don't think it's too crazy or unique for a player to say: "hey, if I sign, what's gonna happen with Kobe? I'm not sure we really can coexist and financially I think his contract really is a huge burden since he's hurt". He is a free agent after all...and I'm sure similar questions like these get posed by FAs to prospective teams ALL the time. Maybe he did say "Amnesty Kobe or I'm leaving". Who knows? But it certainly could have happened in a reasonable and fair manner. He was a free agent after all...he's gotta do his research

I agree with you that he has every right to leave. I agree he didnt want to be a laker and got traded there against his will, but I can't never get last the fact he did that to himself with the opt in.

I hope he stays healthy, likes his new spot, and brings it. Likewise I hope Kobe gets healthy, same with Pau and Nash who have bones to pick with him and they meet in the real season. Let their play do the talking to see if he was the problem or not, or if they were simply holding him back from winning. Will be interesting in my opinion if they do get seeding that matches them up

4milesperday
07-11-2013, 09:59 AM
Howard really hurt the Lakers ego. "you can't always get what you want". How does it feel not having a top 10 player in the league on your team? Life sucks, deal with IT

nickdymez
07-11-2013, 10:02 AM
Based on play? Kobe out played him last year handedly.

Based on work ethic? Kobe's proving that now and has his whole career.

Based on marketability? Kobe's the best draw since MJ, he's adored in LA, the longest tenured laker ever, and owns the record book.

Based on leadership? Kobe led the youngest b2b champion team of the past two decades to three straight finals, over Dwight. He's had issue but make no mistake, when he rescinded the trade demand, he didnt decide the next day oh I don't want to be here trade me anyway like Dwight did. Likewise when it came to winning, Kobe sublimated his game for Shaq, took Shaq trying to get him traded more than once, Shaq hitting him, and Shaq telling the media don't comeback to his team in 04. Kobe welcomed Phil back after the book because it meant the chance to win. Dwight hasn't made one move realistically that says I want to win, have fun sure, but not purely about winning in spite of his own glory and ego. Last year Kobe did whatever they asked started the year off the balls scoring, moved on it to accommodated Dwight not wanting to play pnr with Nash and got everyone involved, defended PGs, played 40+ minutes per night, and with their playoff lives in the line got up withy ruptured Achilles and took and made 2 fts so Marc Jackson couldn't dictate Dwight shoot them.

In the words of Ice Cube ... He don't deserve to go on that god damn wall or be remembered over several role players for the lakers let alone sided with over Kobe when he hadn't proven anything last year besides being a distraction who partially mailed it in and pissed a lot of people off. Its telling not one legend actually tried to get him to stay, and that Jeanie and Phil actually went on vacation over meeting to get him to return. And even if he stayed, he was in for a hellish rude awakening from the FO, the locker room, and fans because they werent going to give him any slack for not winning.

Dwight wanted the torch, got news for you, in la you take the mother****er. That's what Kareem once told Magic. And it embodies the IT he lacked to last there

Probably the best post in PSD history

ManRam
07-11-2013, 10:06 AM
I'm arguing for the sake of arguing at this point.

Buuuttt....

I'll stand by the whole I don't think it's crazy for free agents to want to clarify roster issues or ask how things will be managed before signing. I mean, read the article. It doesn't say Dwight wanted Kobe amnestied, it says Dwight's camp wanted to know if the Lakers were considering it. Dwight seemed more concerned knowing what would happen after 2013-14 than anything else. That's a perfectly valid question to have. Free agents SHOULD ask these things.


He and Kobe didn't get along, the rest of Ramona's article illustrates that. The reasblame for that can be spread thick across both players.


I take it back. This article isn't even that damning. The interpretations are. Once again: PUMP THE BRAKES!

Triple_Ocho
07-11-2013, 10:07 AM
Glad Dwight is gone...

ManRam
07-11-2013, 10:10 AM
Based on play? Kobe out played him last year handedly.

Based on work ethic? Kobe's proving that now and has his whole career.

Based on marketability? Kobe's the best draw since MJ, he's adored in LA, the longest tenured laker ever, and owns the record book.

Based on leadership? Kobe led the youngest b2b champion team of the past two decades to three straight finals, over Dwight. He's had issue but make no mistake, when he rescinded the trade demand, he didnt decide the next day oh I don't want to be here trade me anyway like Dwight did. Likewise when it came to winning, Kobe sublimated his game for Shaq, took Shaq trying to get him traded more than once, Shaq hitting him, and Shaq telling the media don't comeback to his team in 04. Kobe welcomed Phil back after the book because it meant the chance to win. Dwight hasn't made one move realistically that says I want to win, have fun sure, but not purely about winning in spite of his own glory and ego. Last year Kobe did whatever they asked started the year off the balls scoring, moved on it to accommodated Dwight not wanting to play pnr with Nash and got everyone involved, defended PGs, played 40+ minutes per night, and with their playoff lives in the line got up withy ruptured Achilles and took and made 2 fts so Marc Jackson couldn't dictate Dwight shoot them.

In the words of Ice Cube ... He don't deserve to go on that god damn wall or be remembered over several role players for the lakers let alone sided with over Kobe when he hadn't proven anything last year besides being a distraction who partially mailed it in and pissed a lot of people off. Its telling not one legend actually tried to get him to stay, and that Jeanie and Phil actually went on vacation over meeting to get him to return. And even if he stayed, he was in for a hellish rude awakening from the FO, the locker room, and fans because they werent going to give him any slack for not winning.

Dwight wanted the torch, got news for you, in la you take the mother****er. That's what Kareem once told Magic. And it embodies the IT he lacked to last there

Based on age, injury concerns, finances and the future.

Everything you said is based on the past. The future is what matters. Dwight in the future is a much more valuable building block than Kobe. If you prioritize you take Dwight :shrug:

The Lakers would have gone nowhere as currently constructed with Dwight there and Kobe re-signing to a big deal. Nowhere. Dwight knew that.


In the end I actually think both sides got what's best...that is, if the Lakers don't eff things up in FA next year.

4milesperday
07-11-2013, 10:11 AM
Based on play? Kobe out played him last year handedly.

Based on work ethic? Kobe's proving that now and has his whole career.

Based on marketability? Kobe's the best draw since MJ, he's adored in LA, the longest tenured laker ever, and owns the record book.

Based on leadership? Kobe led the youngest b2b champion team of the past two decades to three straight finals, over Dwight. He's had issue but make no mistake, when he rescinded the trade demand, he didnt decide the next day oh I don't want to be here trade me anyway like Dwight did. Likewise when it came to winning, Kobe sublimated his game for Shaq, took Shaq trying to get him traded more than once, Shaq hitting him, and Shaq telling the media don't comeback to his team in 04. Kobe welcomed Phil back after the book because it meant the chance to win. Dwight hasn't made one move realistically that says I want to win, have fun sure, but not purely about winning in spite of his own glory and ego. Last year Kobe did whatever they asked started the year off the balls scoring, moved on it to accommodated Dwight not wanting to play pnr with Nash and got everyone involved, defended PGs, played 40+ minutes per night, and with their playoff lives in the line got up withy ruptured Achilles and took and made 2 fts so Marc Jackson couldn't dictate Dwight shoot them.

In the words of Ice Cube ... He don't deserve to go on that god damn wall or be remembered over several role players for the lakers let alone sided with over Kobe when he hadn't proven anything last year besides being a distraction who partially mailed it in and pissed a lot of people off. Its telling not one legend actually tried to get him to stay, and that Jeanie and Phil actually went on vacation over meeting to get him to return. And even if he stayed, he was in for a hellish rude awakening from the FO, the locker room, and fans because they werent going to give him any slack for not winning.

Dwight wanted the torch, got news for you, in la you take the mother****er. That's what Kareem once told Magic. And it embodies the IT he lacked to last there

Your post is reminiscent of Zimmerman supporters, you only see things your way. Kobe is opposite of how you described him...he wanted the team to get rid of Bynum in favor of Jason Kidd (guess what, Bynum was a huge factor in their 2 championships), he wanted out of LA if they re-signed Shaq (thus making them choose btw him and Shaq), he rants about wanting out damn near every year when he doesn't have star players around him, he raped a girl in Colorado then went on and snitched on Shaq and other Lakers players on how they pay off girls not to talk...when we talk character, Kobe is worse than Howard.

Wrigheyes4MVP
07-11-2013, 10:13 AM
Lakers fans: "I feel bad for the Rockets. They have no idea what they are getting into."

Lol how laughable that is.

The Rockets are in a much better position with Howard than without. How can this even be argued? Are they gonna contend for a championship with Asik starting at C rather than Howard? This is a huge upgrade for them and something to truly build around for the first time in a while. And I bet my bottom dollar that Howard performs at a very high level for them. The Rockets are thrilled to have him and they absolutely should be.

Feeling bad for the Rockets just makes zero sense.

I mean seriously, lets not pretend that Howard isn't the best Center in the league by a wide margin. He absolutely is a stud. By far the best defensive center in the league right now and one of the most efficient offensive centers as well.

I just don't see how he deserves all this blame for the Laker's struggles last year. They are an old team with an overrated coach. Beyond that, Kobe and Dwight just did fit together in that system. This isn't about maturity as much as it seems.

Yes, Dwight has an ego. So do a lot of star atheletes. I would take Dwight on my team over any other big man right now though, without thinking twice. Its a no brainer.

4milesperday
07-11-2013, 10:14 AM
Lakers fans: "I feel bad for the Rockets. They have no idea what they are getting into."

Lol how laughable that is.

The Rockets are in a much better position with Howard than without. How can this even be argued? Are they gonna contend for a championship with Asik starting at C rather than Howard? This is a huge upgrade for them and something to truly build around for the first time in a while. And I bet my bottom dollar that Howard performs at a very high level for them. The Rockets are thrilled to have him and they absolutely should be.

Feeling bad for the Rockets just makes zero sense.

I mean seriously, lets not pretend that Howard isn't the best Center in the league by a wide margin. He absolutely is a stud. By far the best defensive center in the league right now and one of the most efficient offensive centers as well.

I just don't see how he deserves all this blame for the Laker's struggles last year. They are an old team with an overrated coach. Beyond that, Kobe and Dwight just did fit together in that system. This isn't about maturity as much as it seems.

Yes, Dwight has an ego. So do a lot of star atheletes. I would take Dwight on my team over any other big man right now though, without thinking twice. Its a no brainer.

Their feelings is hurt. They don't know how to move on from Kobe, so they take their attitude out on everyone else.

TheNumber37
07-11-2013, 10:20 AM
first round knockout for the rockets. calling it.

MaloDaw9
07-11-2013, 10:24 AM
Lakers fans: "I feel bad for the Rockets. They have no idea what they are getting into."

Lol how laughable that is.

The Rockets are in a much better position with Howard than without. How can this even be argued? Are they gonna contend for a championship with Asik starting at C rather than Howard? This is a huge upgrade for them and something to truly build around for the first time in a while. And I bet my bottom dollar that Howard performs at a very high level for them. The Rockets are thrilled to have him and they absolutely should be.

Feeling bad for the Rockets just makes zero sense.

I mean seriously, lets not pretend that Howard isn't the best Center in the league by a wide margin. He absolutely is a stud. By far the best defensive center in the league right now and one of the most efficient offensive centers as well.

I just don't see how he deserves all this blame for the Laker's struggles last year. They are an old team with an overrated coach. Beyond that, Kobe and Dwight just did fit together in that system. This isn't about maturity as much as it seems.

Yes, Dwight has an ego. So do a lot of star atheletes. I would take Dwight on my team over any other big man right now though, without thinking twice. Its a no brainer.

^This guy obviously didn't watch 1 Laker game last year.

Dwight Howard is a great rebounder and plays great D... Thats it. Dwight Howard is also a turn over machine with ZERO post moves, I mean have you ever watched Dwight in the post? He's like a bull in a china shop. He can't hit a free throw to save his life (hack a Howard anybody?) and he's a cancer and has the mental fortitude of a child.

So yeah, your obviously mistaken.

4milesperday
07-11-2013, 10:27 AM
When you ask a Laker fan why they're crying, they be like; I popped a molly, i'm sweating. Not tears bro, just sweat. Aiight then.

Wrigheyes4MVP
07-11-2013, 10:28 AM
Seriously though, what annoys me most is that Lakers fans really believe that Howard was the source of the Laker's struggles last year.

They guy averaged 17 and 12, and did so taking only 10 shots per game. He got about 2.5 blocks per game and shot 57% from the floor.

I don't care how you slice it, a guy putting up those type of numbers isn't going to prevent a contending team from contending.

The team's struggles were MUCH deeper than that.

First, you have Kobe who is taking 20 shots per game on 46% from the field while Howard is taking only 10 shots per game on 57% from the field. I'm sorry, but does anyone else see what is wrong with that picture?

Then you have Nash who was injured and clearly wasn't himself (and probably won't ever be himself playing alongside a guy like Kobe who takes so many shots and wants the ball in his hands).

Then you have Gasol who is regressing every season.

You also have Metta World Piece...another aging players who is regressing mightely on the defensive end.

Beyond that you have a lousy asortment of role players...lets face it.

And lastly, you have the most overrated coach who also doesn't work for an older, slower team like LA in D'antoni.

Its just assanine to put the blame on Howard because of "chemistry issues". And the guy wasn't playing hard? He averaged 12.5 boards and 2.5 blocks per night in 35 minutes alongside PF like Gasol who is also strong in both areas. Lol please....Howard wasn't playing hard my ***.

The guy is shooting 57% from the floor averageing 17 points on just 10 shots a night...what an offense problem he is out there.

Lol this is just ridiculous.

Wrigheyes4MVP
07-11-2013, 10:31 AM
^This guy obviously didn't watch 1 Laker game last year.

Dwight Howard is a great rebounder and plays great D... Thats it. Dwight Howard is also a turn over machine with ZERO post moves, I mean have you ever watched Dwight in the post? He's like a bull in a china shop. He can't hit a free throw to save his life (hack a Howard anybody?) and he's a cancer and has the mental fortitude of a child.

So yeah, your obviously mistaken.

57% is 57%.

He had proven in Orlando that he can continue to produce at that level with more than 10 shots per night too.

There is no reason for Kobe taking 20 shots a night and Dwight only taking 10.

That is either bad coaching or Kobe just being Kobe (which isn't always a good case).

I gaurantee if Phil Jackson was coaching, he wouldn't let that **** happen.

Wrigheyes4MVP
07-11-2013, 10:33 AM
And for the record, I don't think Dwight is a "beast" on offense.

I am very well aware of his lack of versatility.

Still though, he is extremely efficient in the paint and deserves more than 10 shots compared to Kobe's 20.

As I said right above...Phil Jackson would never let that fly.

And beyond that, when we talk about Howard...you are kidding yourself if you think he was the source of LA's issues. The dude is still the best center in the league by a wide margin even in an "off year". And defensively, he is an absolute stud.

LA had so many other issues beyond Howard, and the chemistry issues weren't all to be blamed on Howard. I would say Kobe deserves equal criticism in that regard.

Truth is, LA was starting to decline before Howard arrived.

MaloDaw9
07-11-2013, 10:36 AM
When you ask a Laker fan why they're crying, they be like; I popped a molly, i'm sweating. Not tears bro, just sweat. Aiight then.

Get off the Lakers nuts... That's all you do is grip and tug on sweaty nuts.
I don't think I've ever seen a more bitter or jealous poster. Ever.

TheIlladelph16
07-11-2013, 10:43 AM
I'll continue to say this in every thread that pops up on this subject because its only getting worse. The LA media and a large faction of their fans are absolutely pathetic fans and deserve every bit of awfulness that came out of last season. These threads are a perfect enough indication of that.

MaloDaw9
07-11-2013, 10:47 AM
57% is 57%.

He had proven in Orlando that he can continue to produce at that level with more than 10 shots per night too.

There is no reason for Kobe taking 20 shots a night and Dwight only taking 10.

That is either bad coaching or Kobe just being Kobe (which isn't always a good case).

I gaurantee if Phil Jackson was coaching, he wouldn't let that **** happen.

I agree with some of what you say. Laker fans we're screaming all year to pound the post... Doesn't change the fact that Dwight's offense is horrid.

And don't forget that bad ****ing back either. Back injuries are no joke my friend, I give Dwight's back 2 years tops before he needs a brace to stand up.

4milesperday
07-11-2013, 10:48 AM
Get off the Lakers nuts... That's all you do is grip and tug on sweaty nuts.
I don't think I've ever seen a more bitter or jealous poster. Ever.

Jealous? They have nothing of value I will want.

Wrigheyes4MVP
07-11-2013, 10:50 AM
I agree with some of what you say. Laker fans we're screaming all year to pound the post... Doesn't change the fact that Dwight's offense is horrid.

And don't forget that bad ****ing back either. Back injuries are no joke my friend, I give Dwight's back 2 years tops before he needs a brace to stand up.

I never knew that 17 points on 10 shots a night, shooting 57% was considered "horrid".

ManRam
07-11-2013, 10:53 AM
^This guy obviously didn't watch 1 Laker game last year.

Dwight Howard is a great rebounder and plays great D... Thats it. Dwight Howard is also a turn over machine with ZERO post moves, I mean have you ever watched Dwight in the post? He's like a bull in a china shop. He can't hit a free throw to save his life (hack a Howard anybody?) and he's a cancer and has the mental fortitude of a child.

So yeah, your obviously mistaken.

Perhaps multiple people here are mistaken. If you can sum up Dwight Howard in one sentence, and that's a pretty piss poor attempt at even doing so

pd1dish
07-11-2013, 10:53 AM
i had little respect for Howard already, but this is the icing on the cake for me. i have lost ALL respect for him now

MaloDaw9
07-11-2013, 10:54 AM
Jealous? They have nothing of value I will want.

You're jelly from watching the Lakers dance around with the Larry O'brien so many times and it's evident by your posts.

nickdymez
07-11-2013, 10:55 AM
These Rocket fans sound just like us Lakers fans last year.. lmao Good luck. Your pathetic franchise needs much more than lin, dwight, and harden to compete.

ManRam
07-11-2013, 10:55 AM
Can we all agree that this title of this thread is, if nothing else, a stretch of the truth.

MaloDaw9
07-11-2013, 10:57 AM
I never knew that 17 points on 10 shots a night, shooting 57% was considered "horrid".

Then you will have to actually watch the bum play instead of reading his stats.

Wrigheyes4MVP
07-11-2013, 10:58 AM
These Rocket fans sound just like us Lakers fans last year.. lmao Good luck. Your pathetic franchise needs much more than lin, dwight, and harden to compete.

Lol Most of us aren't even Rockets fans.

Pathetic franchise?

Lol please.

MaloDaw9
07-11-2013, 11:00 AM
Perhaps multiple people here are mistaken. If you can sum up Dwight Howard in one sentence, and that's a pretty piss poor attempt at even doing so

You lost me... I admit he plays great D (when he feels like it) and is the best rebounder in the league.

Have you ever watched Dwight work the post? You see Laker fans are accustomed to watching the best centers that ever walked or talked and Dwight ain't even close. Sorry to bust your bubble.

Odominator
07-11-2013, 11:00 AM
An unloyal player trying to get rid of the loyal. Sad. Now i feel bad for the rockets.

Lets remember how loyal Kobe was when he forced the Shaq trade, then had a team built around him and struggled to make the playoffs/pass the first round, then demanded to get traded.

Jarvo
07-11-2013, 11:03 AM
Oh look! Another day and another thread to trash Dwight :dance:

Wrigheyes4MVP
07-11-2013, 11:04 AM
Then you will have to actually watch the bum play instead of reading his stats.

I watch him play plenty. He is not without his faults.

He is still by far the best center in the league and is far from horrid on offense. He is efficient in the paint, very efficient.

Do you remember Shaq? He was like a bull in a china shop too. And just like Howard, he put the round ball into the circular, netted rim at a very effecient rate.

He also couldn't make freethrows (although improved a bit over time).

Not comparing the two because Shaq was clearly better but....

You just being a blatant homer right now with this Dwight discussion. Stats are still stats. Scoring at 57% with 17 points on only 10 shots in not horrid at all and far from it. And quite frankly, a better coach like IDK that Phil Jackson dude, would have forced Kobe to take less contested, lower percentage shots with more of a focus on feeding the extremely effecient Dwight Howard in the paint.

Instead, they under utilized Dwight, over utilized Kobe, and played a style that was not condusive at all to their lack of youth and speed.

Only a Laker fan/Dwight hater would say that Dwight is horrid on offense and isn't by far the best center in the league when all evidence says otherwise.

The Rockets got themselves a player.

ElChinoLatino
07-11-2013, 11:08 AM
Might as well call this thread "Laker fans venting because D12 left" thread.

Goose17
07-11-2013, 11:09 AM
Your pathetic franchise needs much more than lin, dwight, and harden to compete.

Yeah. You need 2 pensioners and a Spanish guy that was nearly traded if you want to be a contender.

Nash is my favourite player of all time but he's in his twighlight years now as is Kobe. Gasol is 50/50.

Houston are closer to competing than the Lakers are.

BigCityofDreams
07-11-2013, 11:14 AM
Can we all agree that this title of this thread is, if nothing else, a stretch of the truth.

That's fair

BigCityofDreams
07-11-2013, 11:17 AM
Lets remember how loyal Kobe was when he forced the Shaq trade, then had a team built around him and struggled to make the playoffs/pass the first round, then demanded to get traded.

So Shaq demanding to be paid a high salary while putting on a good amount of weight had no impact on him being traded. Even when he yelled at Jerry Buss to "pay me my money"

Sandman
07-11-2013, 11:21 AM
He asked questions about where the Lakers were going and what moves they might make to bring back a championship

The answer was Kobe Bryant and cap space, which is odd considering they dont have cap space or Kobe Bryant for the upcoming sesason. So basically a 36 yo Kobe after he misses most of this season, uncertainty, and a promised free agent named Max without a face.

The only guarantee there is that 2013-2014 will not only be a wasted season, there won't even be a chance to grow with Kobe out and this guy Max still on whatever team he is still with now. Maybe Dwight was looking for a long term vision, and wasn't necessarily turned off by Kobe Bryant but rather the fact the Lakers want to build around a player 2 years older when it didn't come close to working this season.

As opposed to Houston, who has shown they will move aggressively, already has James Harden. One thing is certain here, with Harden-Howard they can start building toward something now. They may have long term contracts but none of them are toxic, they are very tradeable. Whether they win a championship this year or not, the opportunity to go deep in the playoffs and then re-tool and revamp and continue building is definitely there.

Laker fans have invented this situation where Dwight doesn't deserve some legacy, wasn't worthy, didn't want the spotlight blah blah blah. How is this not a better basketball decision? Why should Dwight want something just because a bunch of people say he should?

PraiseJesus
07-11-2013, 11:23 AM
I'm sitting here, trying to visualize Harden passing the ball inside to Dwight so that he can try post up.

He will instead get fouled. Now Harden will watch Dwight miss 2 FTs or make 1. Then play Defense, then go back and pass it again to Dwight...

I don't see Harden liking that and I surely don't see it winning any rings

Pittz
07-11-2013, 11:35 AM
Dwight reminds me a lot of Alex Rodriguez. Great talent, bigger ego. Causes a lot of chemistry problems. Maybe you will eventually win with him, but you'll still hate him.

Wrigheyes4MVP
07-11-2013, 11:37 AM
He asked questions about where the Lakers were going and what moves they might make to bring back a championship

The answer was Kobe Bryant and cap space, which is odd considering they dont have cap space or Kobe Bryant for the upcoming sesason. So basically a 36 yo Kobe after he misses most of this season, uncertainty, and a promised free agent named Max without a face.

The only guarantee there is that 2013-2014 will not only be a wasted season, there won't even be a chance to grow with Kobe out and this guy Max still on whatever team he is still with now. Maybe Dwight was looking for a long term vision, and wasn't necessarily turned off by Kobe Bryant but rather the fact the Lakers want to build around a player 2 years older when it didn't come close to working this season.

As opposed to Houston, who has shown they will move aggressively, already has James Harden. One thing is certain here, with Harden-Howard they can start building toward something now. They may have long term contracts but none of them are toxic, they are very tradeable. Whether they win a championship this year or not, the opportunity to go deep in the playoffs and then re-tool and revamp and continue building is definitely there.

Laker fans have invented this situation where Dwight doesn't deserve some legacy, wasn't worthy, didn't want the spotlight blah blah blah. How is this not a better basketball decision? Why should Dwight want something just because a bunch of people say he should?

Spot on.

UKblazers
07-11-2013, 11:38 AM
Crazy how history repeats itself. Most of the things being said about Dwight were said about Lebron. This isn't to say Dwight will even win a single title, but all this talk about lack of passion despite returning to play on opening day, from an injury that was supposed to sideline him until January is ridiculuous.

Gibby23
07-11-2013, 11:39 AM
He asked questions about where the Lakers were going and what moves they might make to bring back a championship

The answer was Kobe Bryant and cap space, which is odd considering they dont have cap space or Kobe Bryant for the upcoming sesason. So basically a 36 yo Kobe after he misses most of this season, uncertainty, and a promised free agent named Max without a face.

The only guarantee there is that 2013-2014 will not only be a wasted season, there won't even be a chance to grow with Kobe out and this guy Max still on whatever team he is still with now. Maybe Dwight was looking for a long term vision, and wasn't necessarily turned off by Kobe Bryant but rather the fact the Lakers want to build around a player 2 years older when it didn't come close to working this season.

As opposed to Houston, who has shown they will move aggressively, already has James Harden. One thing is certain here, with Harden-Howard they can start building toward something now. They may have long term contracts but none of them are toxic, they are very tradeable. Whether they win a championship this year or not, the opportunity to go deep in the playoffs and then re-tool and revamp and continue building is definitely there.

Laker fans have invented this situation where Dwight doesn't deserve some legacy, wasn't worthy, didn't want the spotlight blah blah blah. How is this not a better basketball decision? Why should Dwight want something just because a bunch of people say he should?

Kobe is going to start training next month and is playing in game 1. After next season, the Lakers have all the cap space they need. We won't be that good next year, and we finally have a 1st round pick when we need it most.

seikou8
07-11-2013, 11:43 AM
its funny how lakers fans act like they won the rings the lakers have

ManRam
07-11-2013, 11:45 AM
What do you know about smart? A magic fan rooting for a team with 0 titles saying a team with 16 championships doesn't know what they are doing. Get out of here with that. The Lakers will win a ring before the Magic get back to the finals.

:laugh:

Forgot. Only fans of teams that have had success know "smart"?

My god....

Very mature retort. Completely swayed me. I've been wrong all along! How could I argue with this logic?



You really think a 35 year-old Kobe Bryant is a better long-term building block than a 27 year-old Dwight Howard?



Stop me when this scenario becomes unjust.

Dwight was a free agent. As a free agent, according to this report, he went and talked with the Lakers about the future. He was concerned about how malleable he and Kobe were and wanted to know the team's plans for the future. Because of these worries, he wanted to know what the Lakers were going to do with Kobe when he became a free agent. He had been told all along that the torch would be passed to him, but at this meeting that wasn't made clear. A week prior Kobe had just said publicly that he wanted to play at least 2-3 more seasons. Dwight now is worried what that will do to the team. How much money will he command? Will they be able to make a big splash in FA if they bring Kobe back? With their respective roles, right or wrong, Dwight might not feel that is the best circumstance for success. It didn't work out at all last year, why will the same plan continue to work? Dwight's camp then somewhere somehow asks if amnestying Kobe is an option. We don't know the response to that. We certainly don't know that "Dwight wanted LA to amnesty Kobe" as this thread title suggests. Not hearing what he wanted, as a free agent, and not being convinced that it was the best environment he decided to leave. Maybe they didn't put forth a coherent plan as to how they'll contend in the future. Maybe they said "we're gonna keep you, Kobe, Pau and Nash together and ride it out". We don't know what was said. All we know is that Dwight didn't love it. And as a free agent, that's his right.

So, where did Dwight commit such atrocities?

Maybe he's wrong about Kobe. Maybe he is a terrible person for not being able to coexist with Kobe. Maybe he did need to check his ego and realize that it IS Kobe's team. But either way, he handled this completely acceptable for a free agent.

Don't sit here and tell me free agents don't ask these questions and expect to hear answers they want. It's the courting process...all the stars have done it.



Another case of taking an article that really says nothing damning and turning it into "OMG Dwight told LA that Kobe had to go". Because no where in this article did it suggest he made demands like that.

But I'm the dumb one because I like the Magic and have decent reading comprehension skills!

Gibby23
07-11-2013, 11:47 AM
its funny how lakers fans act like they won the rings the lakers have

Just like every other fan base, unless your team hasn't won one or you haven't seen your team ever win one.

ManRam
07-11-2013, 11:50 AM
its funny how lakers fans act like they won the rings the lakers have

Or that they're, apprarently, smarter and better fans because of it!

Yes, liking the most blessed team in the NBA means you're a smarter and better fan!!

If the Lakers missed the playoffs for the next 10 years I wonder how many would still be Lakers fans? Who you root for means nothing. Hell, I gave more credence to the fans of teams that disappoint and disappoint, yet they stick around. Suggesting they're some how better people merely because they're Lakers fans is hilarious to me. I mean, many Lakers fans here are tremendous posters...some of the very best. But it's not because they're Lakers fans, it's because they're smart and good fans in general.

Gibby really throwing some eye-openers at us!

Gibby23
07-11-2013, 11:50 AM
:laugh:

Forgot. Only fans of teams that have had success know "smart"?

My god....

Very mature retort. Completely swayed me. I've been wrong all along! How could I argue with this logic?



You really think a 35 year-old Kobe Bryant is a better long-term building block than a 27 year-old Dwight Howard?


Stop me when this scenario becomes unjust.

Dwight was a free agent. As a free agent, according to this report, he went and talked with the Lakers about the future. He was concerned about how malleable he and Kobe were and wanted to know the team's plans for the future. Because of these worries, he wanted to know what the Lakers were going to do with Kobe when he became a free agent. He had been told all along that the torch would be passed to him, but at this meeting that wasn't made clear. A week prior Kobe had just said publicly that he wanted to play at least 2-3 more seasons. Dwight now is worried what that will do to the team. How much money will he command? Will they be able to make a big splash in FA if they bring Kobe back? With their respective roles, right or wrong, Dwight might not feel that is the best circumstance for success. It didn't work out at all last year, why will the same plan continue to work? Dwight's camp then somewhere somehow asks if amnestying Kobe is an option. We don't know the response to that. We certainly don't know that "Dwight wanted LA to amnesty Kobe" as this thread title suggests. Not hearing what he wanted, as a free agent, and not being convinced that it was the best environment he decided to leave. Maybe they didn't put forth a coherent plan as to how they'll contend in the future. Maybe they said "we're gonna keep you, Kobe, Pau and Nash together and ride it out". We don't know what was said. All we know is that Dwight didn't love it. And as a free agent, that's his right.

So, where did Dwight commit such atrocities?

Maybe he's wrong about Kobe. Maybe he is a terrible person for not being able to coexist with Kobe. Maybe he did need to check his ego and realize that it IS Kobe's team. But either way, he handled this completely acceptable for a free agent.

Don't sit here and tell me free agents don't ask these questions and expect to hear answers they want. It's the courting process...all the stars have done it.



Another case of taking an article that really says nothing damning and turning it into "OMG Dwight told LA that Kobe had to go". Because no where in this article did it suggest he made demands like that.

The Lakers decided that Cap space and Kobe in a year is a better option for them instead of giving Howard what he wanted. They didn't even fire a coach who will most likely be out in a year for Howard. The Lakers have the tools to rebuild within 2 years, not just rebuild like a team like the Magic, but rebuild and be back in the Finals with a chance to win.

ManRam
07-11-2013, 11:52 AM
The Lakers decided that Cap space and Kobe in a year is a better option for them instead of giving Howard what he wanted. They didn't even fire a coach who will most likely be out in a year for Howard. The Lakers have the tools to rebuild within 2 years, not just rebuild like a team like the Magic, but rebuild and be back in the Finals with a chance to win.

Well, thanks for finally providing arguments and not just dishing out insults! Well...at least for two sentences...

The Lakers didn't "decide" anything. Dwight made that decision for them. They wanted him. Period. If you truly think they didn't sell out and go all in for him, well, denial is an amazing things. They might have said they wouldn't amnesty Kobe, but that's all we know. By all other accounts they put everything they had into this.

Gibby23
07-11-2013, 11:53 AM
Or that they're, apprarently, smarter and better fans because of it!

Yes, liking the most blessed team in the NBA means you're a smarter and better fan!!

If the Lakers missed the playoffs for the next 10 years I wonder how many would still be Lakers fans? Who you root for means nothing. Hell, I gave more credence to the fans of teams that disappoint and disappoint, yet they stick around. Suggesting they're some how better people merely because they're Lakers fans is hilarious to me. I mean, many Lakers fans here are tremendous posters...some of the very best. But it's not because they're Lakers fans, it's because they're smart and good fans in general.

Gibby really throwing some eye-openers at us!

Eye openers? You act like you know how to run a team and what is best for the Lakers. You are just a kid on a fan site that just found out drinking is fun and it helps you pick up chicks.

Sandman
07-11-2013, 11:53 AM
Kobe is going to start training next month and is playing in game 1. After next season, the Lakers have all the cap space they need. We won't be that good next year, and we finally have a 1st round pick when we need it most.

That still remains to be seen but I'll give that to you. Even with Kobe back next season you're asking Dwight to give it another go when it didn't work and everybody else is a year older, and you're still telling him to wait and see another season. You can't promise Max when you don't know who he is.

Even if the Lakers situation is promising from a fan standpoint, that they won't be down for long b/c of cap space, that doesn't paint a clear path to a title or make the Rockets' stance a weak one.

I won't even get into D'antoni.

Gibby23
07-11-2013, 11:54 AM
Well, thanks for finally providing arguments and not just dishing out insults! Well...at least for two sentences...

The Lakers didn't "decide" anything. Dwight made that decision for them. They wanted him. Period. If you truly think they didn't sell out and go all in for him, well, denial is an amazing things. They might have said they wouldn't amnesty Kobe, but that's all we know. By all other accounts they put everything they had into this.

They didn't hire Phil.

The didn't fire Mike D.

They didn't say Kobe wouldn't be around.

They didn't say he would be the number 1 guy for the Lakers going forward.

Sandman
07-11-2013, 11:55 AM
The Lakers decided that Cap space and Kobe in a year is a better option for them instead of giving Howard what he wanted. They didn't even fire a coach who will most likely be out in a year for Howard. The Lakers have the tools to rebuild within 2 years, not just rebuild like a team like the Magic, but rebuild and be back in the Finals with a chance to win.

Not so fast. I'm pretty sure it was DWIGHT who had his choice, and it was the Lakers who simply COULDNT give Dwight what he wanted. All the Lakers could do was promise 36yo Kobe would stay and they would pursue Max in 2014.

scissors
07-11-2013, 11:59 AM
Daryl Morey is really smart and has shown us that he considers players "assets" more than "people". What if Dwight is just another "asset" for him to use? I would bet more on Morey screwing Howard before Howard has a chance to screw Morey.

ThunderousDemon
07-11-2013, 11:59 AM
I'm sitting here, trying to visualize Harden passing the ball inside to Dwight so that he can try post up.

He will instead get fouled. Now Harden will watch Dwight miss 2 FTs or make 1. Then play Defense, then go back and pass it again to Dwight...

I don't see Harden liking that and I surely don't see it winning any rings

lol

ManRam
07-11-2013, 12:00 PM
They didn't hire Phil.

The didn't fire Mike D.

They didn't say Kobe wouldn't be around.

They didn't say he would be the number 1 guy for the Lakers going forward.

1. stupid move
2. stupid move
3. fine
4. did they explicitely say that? because, again, even according to this article, it says the lakers have long made it clear to dwight that it would be his team going forward. it doesn't say they didn't say that here, it's just that it sounds like dwight didn't like what he heard on the kobe front.

to act like they didn't want dwight desperately is just dumb. sure, they didn't make a rash decision and amnesty kobe, but that doesn't mean they weren't bending over backwards to get him. but hey, whatever makes the loss easier.


the lakers didn't make this choice :laugh2:

dwight didn't get along with anyone there so he left to go somewhere he felt was more comfortable and better suited to win. that was the decision. nothing more, nothing less.

3RDASYSTEM
07-11-2013, 12:01 PM
IMO he didn't earn the right to have the torch passed to him. If you want it, go out there and get it. Prove yourself worthy.

I guess a FINALS appearance, 3x DPOY, coming back early from a career ending type surgery(would have gotten zero games from BYNUM), and even led the league hobbled and was put in a offense that catered to 3pt shooting/guard play

he played with HEDO-NELSON dominant ball handlers who passed the ball in the flow(not to prove a point like bean was doing) of the offense which resulted in alley oops or wide open 3's and DWIGHT had plenty of touches, its not about the points more so the touches and what type of effect that has, it landed them a FINALS berth without another allnba player on its roster like he has now

after 9yrs in im pretty sure just signing a max contract off a major injury(add the labrum also) he's pretty proven, you guys get caught up in the dumb ring hype, its clearly he is a mvp candidate when healthy and perennial DPOY candidate(3x winner in 9yrs)

ManRam
07-11-2013, 12:03 PM
Eye openers? You act like you know how to run a team and what is best for the Lakers. You are just a kid on a fan site that just found out drinking is fun and it helps you pick up chicks.

We all have our opinions. You're sharing yours, I'm sharing mine. How are you doing anything different than me? Isn't that the point of this site. I don't think I could run an NBA team. I just have opinions on things, much like you.

But keep the insults coming!

And you still haven't answered my question...the one that led you to attack me.

Better building block right now: Kobe or Dwight?

ManRam
07-11-2013, 12:04 PM
I guess a FINALS appearance, 3x DPOY, coming back early from a career ending type surgery(would have gotten zero games from BYNUM), and even led the league hobbled and was put in a offense that catered to 3pt shooting/guard play

he played with HEDO-NELSON dominant ball handlers who passed the ball in the flow(not to prove a point like bean was doing) of the offense which resulted in alley oops or wide open 3's and DWIGHT had plenty of touches, its not about the points more so the touches and what type of effect that has, it landed them a FINALS berth without another allnba player on its roster like he has now

after 9yrs in im pretty sure just signing a max contract off a major injury(add the labrum also) he's pretty proven, you guys get caught up in the dumb ring hype, its clearly he is a mvp candidate when healthy and perennial DPOY candidate(3x winner in 9yrs)

He doesn't get along with Kobe and had one bad year so therefore he's not worthy. Don't argue with it, just go with it. It totally makes sense.

kobe4thewinbang
07-11-2013, 12:21 PM
Anybody know if Dwight has a shrink? Cuz the dude needs one bad. Or some meds.

NOheisman
07-11-2013, 12:25 PM
I see alot of good points, however; in truth Dwight would've had the opportunity to GRAB the torch while Kobe was out until possibly January or longer, you don't think he knew that. Grasp this concept with me now, Dwight....alone.....in LA....no sharing for half the season lol. Dude just didn't want it man, only thing on the mind of a shark is eat (kobe), dwights just trying to survive. I have respect for all players even tho I am a laker fan because being a past college athlete I know what they put into it but I absolutely can not stand a player that shy's away from opportunity in every situation and deflect reasoning and generate excuses. Just one mans opinion though

ManRam
07-11-2013, 12:28 PM
A good response from Dan Devine, with a much more appropriate title than this thread (and Shep's in the Lakers forum).


There were plenty of reasons for Dwight Howard to choose to leave the Los Angeles Lakers and join the Houston Rockets in free agency last week — the chance to earn $88 million in a state with no income tax, the chance to play with a dynamic young All-Star guard in James Harden and darn good role-player/pal Chandler Parsons, the chance to work with a Hall-of-Fame big man in Kevin McHale who's proven to be a sharp, flexible head coach, etc. Perhaps the biggest factor of all, though, as Yahoo! Sports NBA columnist Adrian Wojnarowski wrote after Howard's decision, was the chance to be the No. 1 "face of the franchise."

Apparently, Howard didn't think he'd ever really get that chance at Staples Center, despite claims by Lakers brass to the contrary, because of a certain legendary shooting guard who wears No. 24.

It seems Howard's move to Texas was keyed, in part, by the Lakers' "refusal to establish a clear timetable for moving on from the Kobe Bryant era," according to a report citing "sources with knowledge of Howard's thinking" — which seems like a pretty difficult thing to reliably pin down, so, y'know buyer beware — by Ramona Shelburne and Marc Stein of ESPN.com:


Sources told ESPN.com that Howard and his representatives — in a handful of meetings with Lakers officials before he became a free agent July 1 — strongly suggested the center would have a difficult time re-signing with the team if Bryant stayed with the franchise beyond the 2013-14 season, the final year of his contract.

The Lakers [...] had gone to great lengths to assure the 27-year-old that they saw him as the future face of the franchise and that the torch would be passed from Bryant to him in short order.

But with Bryant saying publicly just a week before free agency that he was thinking of playing at least two or three more seasons, it was hard for Howard to envision when he would assume that role, sources said.

"How can it be Kobe's team and Dwight's team?" one source said. "It was about the passing of the torch."

Before we go further, let's address a note in the Shelburne/Stein story that sounds like a backstabbing bit of internecine politics: that "Howard's camp [...] asked the Lakers whether they were at least considering releasing Bryant through the league's amnesty provision." All that really means, though, is that Howard's "camp" is pretty much just like the rest of us.

Bryant will make more than $30 million this season as he comes off Achilles tendon surgery, eating up more than half the Lakers' salary cap and ensuring that, once again, they will be an capped-out, luxury-tax-paying club with few instruments at their disposal to improve their roster. Yes, using the amnesty on Metta World Peace would get them under the "apron" (the point $4 million above the luxury-tax line), which would afford the Lakers a bit more flexibility in terms of adding pieces with cap exceptions and (depending on how they're structured) possibly sign-and-trade deals moving forward. Jettisoning Kobe, though, would get the Lakers back under the cap, putting everything back in play in terms of a total franchise reboot.

If you're Howard — if you want to be competing for titles yesterday and your future is tied to L.A. being able to rebuild around you — that matters. There are tons of reasons why the Lakers would never amnesty Bryant — and, according to Shelburne and Stern, the Lakers said they weren't considered it — but it's a question worth asking.

OK, now to the meat:

It's somewhat difficult to square Howard's discomfort with not being a clear No. 1 in L.A. with his prior reported desire to play alongside Chris Paul (one of the NBA's snarliest alpha dogs) and his reported interest in Houston adding a third max-level superstar alongside him and Harden. That sounds an awful lot like wanting to have your cake (surround me with elite superstars who make it easier for me to win a championship) and eat it (make sure I'm the leader, the singular voice, the most popular, famous and important player) in a way that doesn't seem realistic.

Then again, those scenarios would involve Dwight playing alongside superstars either in their prime or on their way toward reaching it, rather than on the other side of it and coming off a serious late-career injury. Given the salary cap/roster-building stuff discussed above, Howard being reticent to re-up without a coherent plan for when the Buss family and Mitch Kupchak intend to part ways with Bryant and what they intend to do afterward seems extremely reasonable — especially when you consider that Bryant doesn't want to take a pay cut in a new deal when his current contract runs out next summer. For Dwight, the prospect of spending his prime on teams paying max money to a no-longer-game-changing Kobe approaching 40 had to have been daunting.

Let's be honest, though — that's also mostly because it would have meant spending those years playing with Kobe. That's where a "me or him" stance from Dwight feels odd, because before he ever came to L.A., it was clear that Bryant wasn't going anywhere any time soon and wouldn't be "passing the torch" right away.
Immediately following the four-team trade that sent Howard to Los Angeles, Bryant told Woj, "I'll play two or three more years, and then the team is his." As Bryant batted around the idea of retirement last summer and fall, he was always looking two or three years down the line. That the torn Achilles tendon he suffered in April and the disappointing season through which the Lakers had suffered to that point might have extended his timetable by a season (or two) isn't surprising in the context of how maniacally competitive and title-focused Bryant is.

But why do we have to fault Dwight for maybe not wanting to deal with a maniacally competitive guy who always seems to be talking down to him for the next handful of years?

At every step along the way — from Dwight's preseason debut ("Let's play some mother-bleepin' ball") through the early-season struggle in getting things together ("I'll kick everybody's *** in this locker room if it doesn't happen") and on-and-off play from Howard that bled into late January ("I've constantly tried to help him out, tried to talk to him") and all the way through a disappointing close to the season and his eventual "pitch" for Dwight to stay ("You need to learn how it's done first, and I can teach you here") — Kobe asserted his primacy, his dominance, his alpha-dog status. For all the proclamations, whether delivered verbally or visually, by Kupchak that Howard was the Lakers' future, that message always sort of seemed to be drowned out by the messaging that came from Bryant throughout the season.

Now, that's not to say Bryant was necessarily wrong on the latter score — last year's Lakers were Kobe's team, and for the Lakers to be a title contender, they needed Howard to be better, more committed, a more consistent defensive deterrent and a more willing participant in the pick-and-roll game than he was. He'll need to be all those things in Houston, too, and it will be McHale's job to succeed where Mike D'Antoni didn't in getting Howard on-board with the Rockets' high-volume, spread screen-and-roll-based attack.

To some degree, though, this is workplace decision-making.

Let's say you worked with a very talented, experienced and accomplished project leader who you also felt constantly talked down to you. This is a person whom management has told you time and again wouldn't be your project leader for long, but whom management also isn't going to push out the door, because he's still good for business and still popular with the client base. Moreover, despite management telling you they would deal with this situation, they've shown a repeated disinclination to do so or to lay out any sort of framework for actually following through on that promise.

When your contract comes up, if you get a great job offer from a competitor promising equivalent salary at a lower cost of living in what you think looks like a much healthier professional and personal atmosphere, and your current employer isn't going to make any movement toward improving your situation so that you don't have to deal with that overbearing project leader anymore ... I mean, the list of "pros" associated with making that move is substantially longer than the "con" side, right?

You can understand Kobe feeling like Dwight hasn't earned the right to be the top dog yet and that, from his perspective, offering the challenge of learning from him how to be that guy represents coming toward the middle. You can understand the Lakers not wanting to accelerate Bryant's departure for fear of how moving away from him would be perceived by the fans who've cheered him for 17 years, and not wanting to be viewed as choosing a player without a championship who's come to be viewed as an immature waffler (or perhaps even a liar) over one of the greatest players in franchise and league history.

But you can understand Dwight not wanting to wait around for a day that might never come, too.

Seems fair. I find it easy to understand both sides and all perspectives here.

The only reason I'm quick to defend the stuff I don't believe in, even though I still hate Dwight, is that I think we've gotten too eager to pin this all on Dwight being a mentally-unstable, egomaniac who thinks that everything should be his way or the highway. It's much more simple than that...it's actually probably something we can all relate to if we remove emotions from it all. I liked the analogy at the end.

TheIlladelph16
07-11-2013, 12:34 PM
The mental gymnastics LA fans are going through attempting to spin this in their favor is astounding. Posters are literally spinning this to seem like the Lakers actually made this decision not to resign Dwight.:facepalm:

static_inferno
07-11-2013, 12:51 PM
More unfounded ESPN bull.

Sandman
07-11-2013, 12:52 PM
"It's somewhat difficult to square Howard's discomfort with not being a clear No. 1 in L.A. with his prior reported desire to play alongside Chris Paul (one of the NBA's snarliest alpha dogs) and his reported interest in Houston adding a third max-level superstar alongside him and Harden. That sounds an awful lot like wanting to have your cake (surround me with elite superstars who make it easier for me to win a championship) and eat it (make sure I'm the leader, the singular voice, the most popular, famous and important player) in a way that doesn't seem realistic."

Its almost like the leader, most popular most famous thing JUST MIGHT be a crocashit. :shrug:

Federal Reserve
07-11-2013, 12:55 PM
Kobe is the biggest diva in the NBA. Howard acted appropriately in this situation.

Hawkize31
07-11-2013, 12:55 PM
Dwight Howard is garbage.

If you want the torch, just go get it. Lebron joined Wade's team, but he led it, and it became his team.

ManRam
07-11-2013, 12:56 PM
It just seems to me that people who are fans of lesser teams really don't understand the mentality of Lakers fans, and thats fine.

We probably don't. I certainly don't. I can imagine what it's like. Never been so spoiled by a team I root for (not to this extent). Hopefully some day it happens, but that's doubtful.

But still, irrational is irrational. Misconstruing and twisting words is still doing just that. The "mental gymnastics" don't magically become correct. Perhaps I don't get why and where it's all coming from, but it's happening a lot. Not all of you guys, but a lot.

Part of the coping process. A lot of irrational things were being thrown around Orlando during the Dwightmare. Time has caused more clarity and rationality to return, but yeah. It certainly wasn't like LA, but the residual effects of something like this are going to cause a lot of stupid things to be said out of states of passion.

NOheisman
07-11-2013, 12:58 PM
so you your dont want to play with Kobe who averages more than Harden and is on his final tier, why would you go play on Harden's team who is only 23 years old. Is he going to demand the torch there as well. Didnt think so #Excuses

Teeboy1487
07-11-2013, 01:01 PM
I'm not a fan of getting rid of one player for another to stay especially superstars. I'm not going to lie, I resented Kobe a long time for the Shaq trade. I love Kobe but he pulled the same hostage crap Dwight did. I loved the Lakers too much to resent Kobe for long, but I was pissed for years. Dwight to me is not worth it though. I would not give him the keys to my car let alone a franchise.

JeremiahWing
07-11-2013, 01:06 PM
What a punk. Amnesty Kobe??? For his bull? Unbelievable.

ElChinoLatino
07-11-2013, 01:06 PM
What do you know about smart? A magic fan rooting for a team with 0 titles saying a team with 16 championships doesn't know what they are doing. Get out of here with that. The Lakers will win a ring before the Magic get back to the finals.

What perfect way to counter his argument. Talk about how many titles him team has won compared to yours. You really got him there. It really shows how much Laker fans are still in denial of Howard leaving. Well it is one of the 5 steps.

http://psychcentral.com/lib/2006/the-5-stages-of-loss-and-grief/

J4KOP99
07-11-2013, 01:07 PM
If I'm Howard (or his agent) I would ask the same damn question. Hell, as a Lakers fan, I'm very curious as to what their plan is as well.

PSD is a funny place. Nobody is sane. Everyone is overreacting on one side of the spectrum.

Why can't we just leave it at Howard is incredibly immature AND that the Lakers handled his situation very poorly. He left... it doesn't even matter the reason. He left. It's over. Move on.

dee279
07-11-2013, 01:07 PM
If he didnt already, Dwight has lost all respect. Kobe earned his place. No one should be able to take that from him. Kobe at 35 and banged up is worth more then Dwight will ever be. Dwight is a straight bia bia!

J4KOP99
07-11-2013, 01:09 PM
And as for Dwight's immaturity, why are we beating a dead horse here? Nothing has changed with him in that regard but do we really need to harp on it in every single thread?

RLundi
07-11-2013, 01:13 PM
What do you know about smart? A magic fan rooting for a team with 0 titles saying a team with 16 championships doesn't know what they are doing. Get out of here with that. The Lakers will win a ring before the Magic get back to the finals.

How old are you? You seem easily offended by someone you've never met and who you will probably never meet. That's usually a characterization of immaturity or lack of self-esteem brought upon by inexperience.

If the internet is too much for you, maybe you need a timeout.

FOBolous
07-11-2013, 01:20 PM
These Rocket fans sound just like us Lakers fans last year.. lmao Good luck. Your pathetic franchise needs much more than lin, dwight, and harden to compete.

I'm the only rockets fan that posted in this thread so far and most of my posts got deleted.

NOheisman
07-11-2013, 01:33 PM
I hope he does well, I wish everybody well. I just hope he bangs his big toe on the coffee table one good time tho

GMpunk
07-11-2013, 01:40 PM
kobe is are franchise player.... dwight is stupid 2 think we would pick him over kobe....

FOBolous
07-11-2013, 01:41 PM
He doesn't get along with Kobe and had one bad year so therefore he's not worthy. Don't argue with it, just go with it. It totally makes sense.

his "bad" year wasn't even that bad. he averaged 17/12/2..still a better average than all other Centers in the league. if Dwight Howard was as lazy and unmotivated (and injured) as they claim he was and he averaged THAT, the Rockets will be alright

J4KOP99
07-11-2013, 01:44 PM
his "bad" year wasn't even that bad. he averaged 17/12/2..still a better average than all other Centers in the league. if Dwight Howard was as lazy and unmotivated (and injured) as they claim he was and he averaged THAT, the Rockets will be alright

The Rockets will be all right, which is why I don't understand why you get so worked up in these threads. Calm down and enjoy. You're team is a solid championship contender, and yet you seem to worry more about the Lakers and their fans. Get it together buddy.

FOBolous
07-11-2013, 01:51 PM
The Rockets will be all right, which is why I don't understand why you get so worked up in these threads. Calm down and enjoy. You're team is a solid championship contender, and yet you seem to worry more about the Lakers and their fans. Get it together buddy.

yea you're right.

Htownballa1622
07-11-2013, 01:59 PM
I'd amnesty Kobe too. Then again, I don't have 30 million to pay anyone :p

Chacarron
07-11-2013, 01:59 PM
I hope the Rockets don't get the same Dwight who changes his mind constantly and is always complaining about something every day.

shep33
07-11-2013, 02:09 PM
He'll be fine in Houston, he was a quitter in LA though. Dude just needs to shut up and win.

ManRam
07-11-2013, 02:10 PM
If I'm Howard (or his agent) I would ask the same damn question. Hell, as a Lakers fan, I'm very curious as to what their plan is as well.

PSD is a funny place. Nobody is sane. Everyone is overreacting on one side of the spectrum.

Why can't we just leave it at Howard is incredibly immature AND that the Lakers handled his situation very poorly. He left... it doesn't even matter the reason. He left. It's over. Move on.

Preach!

zn23
07-11-2013, 02:14 PM
Lakers should have listened...

t_money25
07-11-2013, 02:20 PM
How many more daily "Dwight Howard left LA and i'm gonna roast him for it" threads are necessary?

BigCityofDreams
07-11-2013, 02:46 PM
I hope the Rockets don't get the same Dwight who changes his mind constantly and is always complaining about something every day.


Depends on how well things go. I don't think he'll rock the boat to start the season because everyone is going to be looking to see what he does. I think he'll be on his best behavior because he knows ppl are waiting to see him overreact and cause trouble.

Wrigheyes4MVP
07-11-2013, 02:55 PM
The mental gymnastics LA fans are going through attempting to spin this in their favor is astounding. Posters are literally spinning this to seem like the Lakers actually made this decision not to resign Dwight.:facepalm:

:laugh:

So true.

I didn't understand originally what people meant when they said that Laker's fans are in denial. I thought they were just unfairly blaming Dwight for the team's current downward trend, but in the context of the Laker's "choosing to let Dwight walk", its definitely true that Laker's fans are in denial.

I should also say though that this is not all Laker's fans. I won't lump them all together. It's just a large group of them. I am sure there are plenty of Laker's fans who aren't posting as much in the main forum and are staying in their own forum who are a bit more objective and level headed.

But my God, what's going on here is just absurd.

ChicagoJ
07-11-2013, 03:11 PM
Who cares what Howard thinks (regarding when he was in la). He's a quality rebounder and defensive player with average offensive skills. And a terrible free throw shooter.

He didn't earn the right to question the lakers or their coach. It's best that he's out of there.

futureman
07-11-2013, 03:17 PM
If the lakers really wanted to keep dwight they would've done as he asked and fired dantoini

sunsfan88
07-11-2013, 03:23 PM
I seriously feel bad for the Rockets. Got the biggest cancer in all of basketball, dudes not a winner in any sense of the word

Exactly. All the Rockets fans are all excited and everything now but wait until he starts fighting with Harden for more touches, or when he demands more playing time in the 4th QTR despite opposing teams intentionally fouling him and putting him at the FT line to keep from him or Harden getting a FG.

FOBolous
07-11-2013, 03:27 PM
If the lakers really wanted to keep dwight they would've done as he asked and fired dantoini

I would respond to this with logical reasonings as to why the Lakers didn't fire D'Antoni and hire Phil Jackson but I don't want to validate to absurd assertion by entering into a discussion with you.

TheIlladelph16
07-11-2013, 03:28 PM
:laugh:

So true.

I didn't understand originally what people meant when they said that Laker's fans are in denial. I thought they were just unfairly blaming Dwight for the team's current downward trend, but in the context of the Laker's "choosing to let Dwight walk", its definitely true that Laker's fans are in denial.

I should also say though that this is not all Laker's fans. I won't lump them all together. It's just a large group of them. I am sure there are plenty of Laker's fans who aren't posting as much in the main forum and are staying in their own forum who are a bit more objective and level headed.

But my God, what's going on here is just absurd.

Of course not. Being a Philly fan has taught me that a few fans doesn't reflect that majority, but since this has happened its just getting absurd. Everyday its a new story from the media about Dwight did this, he said that and then the Lakers nuts (not all :)) eat it up and spin that story like a damn record haha. I really hoped the Dwight drama would go away which is clearly not the case.

What I see right now is two monkeys sitting there with one throwing buckets of poo on the other haha

ManRam
07-11-2013, 03:38 PM
If the lakers really wanted to keep dwight they would've done as he asked and fired dantoini

Compelling argument. You're right...the Lakers clearly didn't want Howard!

Shlumpledink
07-11-2013, 03:55 PM
Amensty-ing Kobe makes realistic basketball and financial sense. It would be a horrid pr move though, that would take forever for the Lakers to recover from. They weren't going to amnesty him before Dwight Howard signed anyhow. Also, if you amnesty Kobe and sign dwight to the max, what do you do with the team? Trade Pau and try to move metta so you could free up cap to sign some people? They would still be a year away from being a contender if they amnesty Kobe.

Realistically, their best move would be to play together. I know all the talk about James Harden being Kobe of the future, but why is that better than the Kobe right now? Plus, they have a couple valuable expirings in Pau and Metta that could bring in another player, or a couple good players. Or you let them expire and use your cap room to sign some great pieces, then in the middle of Howard's contract Kobe moves on and Howard has his team.

I don't buy the Kobe not passing the torch excuse. I think Howard just wanted to play in houston, he didn't like playing in LA. I think that is all there is to it.

JordansBulls
07-11-2013, 04:01 PM
He should had just stayed in Orlando then if that was the case and then just signed in Houston this offseason.

TheIlladelph16
07-11-2013, 04:13 PM
I'm not sure why its such an absurd question to ask as a FA who is looking to be a franchise cornerstone... :shrug: If I'm Dwight going into that meeting, I'm sure as **** asking whether or not the guy making 30 million dollars and coming off an Achilles surgery could be amnestied.

WadeKobe
07-11-2013, 04:55 PM
everyone should tell LA to amnesty him....

http://www.thenbageek.com/articles/the-lakers-would-be-fools-to-keep-kobe
http://www.thenbageek.com/articles/the-nba-geek-s-amnesty-guesses-part-1

YouCan'tBeatLA
07-11-2013, 05:07 PM
everyone should tell LA to amnesty him....

http://www.thenbageek.com/articles/the-lakers-would-be-fools-to-keep-kobe
http://www.thenbageek.com/articles/the-nba-geek-s-amnesty-guesses-part-1

Everyone ignored you the first and second time you posted this. Nothing's gonna change. Shoo.

ztilzer31
07-11-2013, 05:11 PM
Pretend he wasn't a Laker. Pretend Lakers never existed. Just look at Howard the person and how it affects the game on the court.....is that really a player you would trust to help win you a championship. A challenging road deep with obstacles, issues of trust, the fortitude to pull through in crunch time? Quit being a fvcking homer like we have mistakenly been and look at the big picture here.

Yeah how dare he try to get an over the hill better player removed from his team so he can take over, and get a better surrounding cast...

I haven't seen that done since... since...

Anyone else see where I'm going with this? Kobe did the exact same thing...

It's so funny how the Lakers fan base literally gives Kobe a pass for ****ING EVERYTHING, and if LBJ or Dwight do anything similar they're the worst players all time.

Gonna be another season of dissapointed Laker fans wrong about everything. I give it 2 months before Lakers fans are already saying they're title defenders, and Rockets are 8th seed at best.

Then we'll start the 70 game win thread again like when you guys got Dwight LOL.

Sandman
07-11-2013, 05:14 PM
He should had just stayed in Orlando then if that was the case and then just signed in Houston this offseason.

I think that was a ****fail attempt to go to Jersey

Orlando dealt him because they knew he wouldnt come back

LA thought for sure he'd re-sign

Gibby23
07-11-2013, 05:14 PM
Yeah how dare he try to get an over the hill better player removed from his team so he can take over, and get a better surrounding cast...

I haven't seen that done since... since...

Anyone else see where I'm going with this? Kobe did the exact same thing...

It's so funny how the Lakers fan base literally gives Kobe a pass for ****ING EVERYTHING, and if LBJ or Dwight do anything similar they're the worst players all time.
Gonna be another season of dissapointed Laker fans wrong about everything. I give it 2 months before Lakers fans are already saying they're title defenders, and Rockets are 8th seed at best.

Then we'll start the 70 game win thread again like when you guys got Dwight LOL.

You were wrong about the Kings moving to Seattle. It will be so funny watching basketball in Seattle.. Lol

YouCan'tBeatLA
07-11-2013, 05:30 PM
Yeah how dare he try to get an over the hill better player removed from his team so he can take over, and get a better surrounding cast...

Well, now he signed with a team where he's still not the "man". Better surrounding cast? How? In this FA? Kobe should probably get a 2 yr/24 mil contract, and he's worth every penny. That will allow us to go after another max player in 2014.



Anyone else see where I'm going with this? Kobe did the exact same thing...

It's so funny how the Lakers fan base literally gives Kobe a pass for ****ING EVERYTHING, and if LBJ or Dwight do anything similar they're the worst players all time.

What are we giving Kobe a pass for? He hasn't done anything similar to LBJ or Dwght. Idk what the **** you are talking about.


Gonna be another season of dissapointed Laker fans wrong about everything. I give it 2 months before Lakers fans are already saying they're title defenders, and Rockets are 8th seed at best.

Then we'll start the 70 game win thread again like when you guys got Dwight LOL.

Just stop spewing BS, every Laker fan knows this season is a bust. After 2014, all I have to say is: Enjoy the crow!

Lake_Show2416
07-11-2013, 05:36 PM
Dwight can go **** himself, wut a clown

RLundi
07-11-2013, 05:42 PM
Well, now he signed with a team where he's still not the "man". Better surrounding cast? How? In this FA? Kobe should probably get a 2 yr/24 mil contract, and he's worth every penny. That will allow us to go after another max player in 2014.




What are we giving Kobe a pass for? He hasn't done anything similar to LBJ or Dwght. Idk what the **** you are talking about.



Just stop spewing BS, every Laker fan knows this season is a bust. After 2014, all I have to say is: Enjoy the crow!

Kobe did the same exact thing Dwight did. The only difference is he was successful in ousting Shaq. He was younger, he was better, and he he had a brighter future. Hence, Shaq was traded.

How is that any different than what Dwight tried to do?

ShowtimeNo24
07-11-2013, 05:46 PM
I'm think Dwight has the most annoying personality i have come across NBA stars. I'm happy he's gone, he never deserved to wear the purple and gold.

YouCan'tBeatLA
07-11-2013, 05:47 PM
Kobe did the same exact thing Dwight did. The only difference is he was successful in ousting Shaq. He was younger, he was better, and he he had a brighter future. Hence, Shaq was traded.

How is that any different than what Dwight tried to do?

The FO told Shaq to **** off because he wanted 30 mil a year, not because of Kobe. Even according to Shaq, he said he was promised 30 mil, but FO wouldn't go higher than 25 mil when it came time for negotiations.

ShowtimeNo24
07-11-2013, 05:48 PM
Kobe did the same exact thing Dwight did. The only difference is he was successful in ousting Shaq. He was younger, he was better, and he he had a brighter future. Hence, Shaq was traded.

How is that any different than what Dwight tried to do?

Yeah, Dwight is younger and thats about all there is to the comparison.

mrblisterdundee
07-11-2013, 05:50 PM
IMO he didn't earn the right to have the torch passed to him. If you want it, go out there and get it. Prove yourself worthy.

You're totally right, although it would have been the better decision to amnesty Kobe and start an even bigger rebuild using Dwight as bait for other stars.

mrblisterdundee
07-11-2013, 05:52 PM
Everyone ignored you the first and second time you posted this. Nothing's gonna change. Shoo.

You've got to love these idiotic Los Angeles fans. All logic points to amnestying Kobe and moving on. It'd even be better for him, because he'd get to move on to a team that has a chance of winning a championship before he retires. It's not like he hasn't already given the Lakers enough.

YouCan'tBeatLA
07-11-2013, 05:56 PM
You've got to love these idiotic Los Angeles fans. All logic points to amnestying Kobe and moving on. It'd even be better for him, because he'd get to move on to a team that has a chance of winning a championship before he retires. It's not like he hasn't already given the Lakers enough.

What logic? He's off the books after this year. We aren't winning **** this year anyway. Kobe will take a paycut of 2 yr/24-26 mil, and will still be playing like a top 10 player in the league.

RLundi
07-11-2013, 05:57 PM
Yeah, Dwight is younger and thats about all there is to the comparison.

Okay. What is your point? That you expect Kobe to continue playing as long as Dwight will? Or at a high level?

When Dwight is healthy, he is a top 5 player. Will we see that again, who knows? But the smart money says he is the far better option moving forward.

If this was any other 2 players, I guarantee any fans would agree with me, including LA fans. Don't cherry pick because it's your beloved Kobe and you despise Dwight. Logically, it makes more sense to move forward witha 27 year Dwight as opposed to a 35 year old Kobe.

RLundi
07-11-2013, 06:01 PM
What logic? He's off the books after this year. We aren't winning **** this year anyway. Kobe will take a paycut of 2 yr/24-26 mil, and will still be playing like a top 10 player in the league.

No anyway in hell that happens.

Kobe is going to still consider himself a superstar and he's going to command superstar money. Whatever the max salary for a player of his experience, he will command it and not a penny less. Doing so would be to admit that he's no longer a superstar, and I don't see him playing at a level where he's not still at least near-elite. He'll retire before that happens.

BigCityofDreams
07-11-2013, 06:01 PM
Yeah how dare he try to get an over the hill better player removed from his team so he can take over, and get a better surrounding cast...

I haven't seen that done since... since...

Anyone else see where I'm going with this? Kobe did the exact same thing...

It's so funny how the Lakers fan base literally gives Kobe a pass for ****ING EVERYTHING, and if LBJ or Dwight do anything similar they're the worst players all time.

Gonna be another season of dissapointed Laker fans wrong about everything. I give it 2 months before Lakers fans are already saying they're title defenders, and Rockets are 8th seed at best.

Then we'll start the 70 game win thread again like when you guys got Dwight LOL.

You must be missing all those threads in the Laker forum where a number of posters kill him for playing poorly or missing shots.

YouCan'tBeatLA
07-11-2013, 06:04 PM
No anyway in hell that happens.

Kobe is going to still consider himself a superstar and he's going to command superstar money. Whatever the max salary for a player of his experience, he will command it and not a penny less. Doing so would be to admit that he's no longer a superstar, and I don't see him playing at a level where he's not still at least near-elite. He'll retire before that happens.

Don't think so. Kobe's a pretty smart dude, he wants to finish his carreer in LA. He knows very well what the Lakers are going to offer is more than anything he would wish to sniff from any other team.

Aust
07-11-2013, 06:07 PM
No anyway in hell that happens.

Kobe is going to still consider himself a superstar and he's going to command superstar money. Whatever the max salary for a player of his experience, he will command it and not a penny less. Doing so would be to admit that he's no longer a superstar, and I don't see him playing at a level where he's not still at least near-elite. He'll retire before that happens.

Care for a sig bet?

RLundi
07-11-2013, 06:08 PM
Don't think so. Kobe's a pretty smart dude, he wants to finish his carreer in LA. He knows very well what the Lakers are going to offer is more than anything he would wish to sniff from any other team.

Jordan got $30M his last year in Chicago. I'm sure Kobe took note. Even when his contract is up, Kobe will still be a top 10 player. It would be noble -- stupid though -- for him to take a massive pay cut while still being elite. He's not settling for $12-14M, not when he's eligible to receive $22M, if not for anything but pride, money inconsequential.

Aust
07-11-2013, 06:09 PM
Jordan got $30M his last year in Chicago. I'm sure Kobe took note. Even when his contract is up, Kobe will still be a top 10 player. It would be noble -- stupid though -- for him to take a massive pay cut while still being elite. He's not settling for $12-14M, not when he's eligible to receive $22M, if not for anything but pride, money inconsequential.

And he would probably get that if the old CBA was still around. There is no longer a soft cap.

RLundi
07-11-2013, 06:11 PM
Care for a sig bet?

:rolleyes:

If I'm wrong, I'm wrong. If you're wrong, you're wrong. Let's refrain from participating in juvenile pissing contests, shall we?

I'm confident he won't accept a substantially lower contract; you're obviously of a different school of thought. How about we let our discussions do the wagering in themselves?

RLundi
07-11-2013, 06:14 PM
And he would probably get that if the old CBA was still around. There is no longer a soft cap.

Except the Lakers will be drastically under the cap and can pay him close to $22M (depending in the cap during that offseason). Not to mention, he will still have Bird rights.

EDIT: The salary cap is still soft.

Gibby23
07-11-2013, 06:15 PM
No anyway in hell that happens.

Kobe is going to still consider himself a superstar and he's going to command superstar money. Whatever the max salary for a player of his experience, he will command it and not a penny less. Doing so would be to admit that he's no longer a superstar, and I don't see him playing at a level where he's not still at least near-elite. He'll retire before that happens.

Direct quote from Kobe from ESPNLA

http://espn.go.com/los-angeles/nba/story/_/id/9469767/kobe-bryant-believes-los-angeles-lakers-extension-no-problem


"As a businessman the goal is always to not take a pay cut," Bryant said. "But ..."

RLundi
07-11-2013, 06:17 PM
Direct quote from Kobe from ESPNLA

http://espn.go.com/los-angeles/nba/story/_/id/9469767/kobe-bryant-believes-los-angeles-lakers-extension-no-problem

Lol that article literally said nothing but the word "but."

That's the smoking gun?

BigCityofDreams
07-11-2013, 06:19 PM
So that's a no on the sig bet :)

RLundi
07-11-2013, 06:20 PM
:nod:
So that's a no on the sig bet :)

:nod:

Gibby23
07-11-2013, 06:20 PM
Lol that article literally said nothing but the word "but."

That's the smoking gun?

Why is he going to throw out a number. He will talk to managment and see who they are going to target and come up with a respectable number for him. I assume in the 12 million range.

Aust
07-11-2013, 06:20 PM
Except the Lakers will be drastically under the cap and can pay him close to $22M (depending in the cap during that offseason). Not to mention, he will still have Bird rights.

EDIT: The salary cap is still soft.

Can. Just because they can doesn't mean they will. You're being silly.
It's more of a semi-hard cap. It's by no means soft.

Sandman
07-11-2013, 06:20 PM
Jordan got $30M his last year in Chicago. I'm sure Kobe took note. Even when his contract is up, Kobe will still be a top 10 player. It would be noble -- stupid though -- for him to take a massive pay cut while still being elite. He's not settling for $12-14M, not when he's eligible to receive $22M, if not for anything but pride, money inconsequential.
Jordan won a championship and an MVP his last year in Chicago, no comparison

Gibby23
07-11-2013, 06:23 PM
Lol that article literally said nothing but the word "but."

That's the smoking gun?

The Lakers are not a team like the Magic. They are expected to win and players just don't stop by here for a big payday. Kobe has 5 rings in his time here, Im sure he is going to give the Lakers a chance to build a team that can help get him another one.

RLundi
07-11-2013, 06:24 PM
Can. Just because they can doesn't mean they will. You're being silly.
It's more of a semi-hard cap. It's by no means soft.

Not sure why you feel the need to insult me but okay :)

It's still a soft cap. With a hard cap, you cannot go over the cap for almost any reason and it is very limited and rare that it happens. In the NBA there are several provisions that allow a team to go over the cap. Call it what you'd like, but you're wrong. It's a soft cap. It's more stringent than it used to be, but it's still soft to a degree.

RLundi
07-11-2013, 06:26 PM
Jordan won a championship and an MVP his last year in Chicago, no comparison

Logically, maybe, but I doubt Kobe is going to reason like that. He's going to want to be paid like a superstar because he will still absolutely consider himself a superstar.

ShowtimeNo24
07-11-2013, 06:26 PM
Okay. What is your point? That you expect Kobe to continue playing as long as Dwight will? Or at a high level?

When Dwight is healthy, he is a top 5 player. Will we see that again, who knows? But the smart money says he is the far better option moving forward.

If this was any other 2 players, I guarantee any fans would agree with me, including LA fans. Don't cherry pick because it's your beloved Kobe and you despise Dwight. Logically, it makes more sense to move forward witha 27 year Dwight as opposed to a 35 year old Kobe.

You guys are kinda overrating because of the system they played in Orlando. DW can't be the man on the team unless you space floor with 4 3pt shooters like in Orlando. Dwight is 27 years old, he has got no offensive game whatsoever. He doesn't like pick and roll and he can't play with his back to the basket, no hook, no jumpshot, no footwork. Dwight Howard is like a brick with springs on offense and he sure as hell ain't getting any better in that department at his age. Thats the same false hope as Amare starts to play defense and rebounding the ball. In 3 years Dwight will be even worse than the previous season because he starts to lose his athleticism.

My point is amnesting K. and keeping Dwight does not bring anything to the table when Kobes contract ends after this season. What does that give the Lakers? A **** load of thrown away money. Pay kobe 30 mil, send him to anaother team and lose the fans and marketing sales in the process, yeah really smart move!

it's smarter to wait this season out, see what options remain in the upcoming FA, how Kobe recovers and then decide if or how big of a contract to give KB.

Your logic makes no sense to me! If Dwight does not have the balls to play in LA or with Kobe then that is his problem, but as we saw this season he didn't show anything to look forward to reagrdless.

Aust
07-11-2013, 06:27 PM
Not sure why you feel the need to insult me but okay :)

It's still a soft cap. With a hard cap, you cannot go over the cap for almost any reason and it is very limited and rare that it happens. In the NBA there are several provisions that allow a team to go over the cap. Call it what you'd like, but you're wrong. It's a soft cap. It's more stringent than it used to be, but it's still soft to a degree.

You seem a bit thin-skinned to consider "silly" an insult.
To a degree. I consider it a semi-hard cap. You're right, it definitely is not a hard cap, just look at the Nets. It's a much different cap than the last CBA cap.

RLundi
07-11-2013, 06:28 PM
The Lakers are not a team like the Magic. They are expected to win and players just don't stop by here for a big payday. Kobe has 5 rings in his time here, Im sure he is going to give the Lakers a chance to build a team that can help get him another one.

I understand, the Lakers are a superior franchise. Where am I disputing they are "like the Magic"?

So far, all you've presented is "I'm sure." Kobe himself said he wouldn't take a pay cut. So forgive me if I take his word over yours ;)

Gibby23
07-11-2013, 06:31 PM
I understand, the Lakers are a superior franchise. Where am I disputing they are "like the Magic"?

So far, all you've presented is "I'm sure." Kobe himself said he wouldn't take a pay cut. So forgive me if I take his word over yours ;)

He was asked if he would take the minimum by a fan website. He told ESPNLA this:


Earlier Tuesday, Bryant was asked by Lakers Nation, a fan website, if he would take a huge pay cut, possibly to a one-year minimum salary at $1.45 million, to stay with the Lakers. Bryant later told ESPN that since negotiations have yet to begin, it was pointless to bring up a number that he'd be willing to play for.

RLundi
07-11-2013, 06:33 PM
You seem a bit thin-skinned to consider "silly" an insult.
To a degree. I consider it a semi-hard cap. You're right, it definitely is not a hard cap, just look at the Nets. It's a much different cap than the last CBA cap.

Not at all. If you want to have a logical discussion, do so and leave it there. You bringing in anything that could be considered a slight just makes it look like you're either angry or losing. Keep it civil, or do you want another Laker thread derailed?

The cap has aspects of a hard one, but as long as it can be surpassed for multiple reasons, it's a soft cap. Coon calls it semi-soft, because there are more penalties and less ways than there used to be.

RLundi
07-11-2013, 06:34 PM
He was asked if he would take the minimum by a fan website. He told ESPNLA this:

That's code for "**** no" :laugh2:

Inconclusive, but on both sides.

I guess we'll just play a waiting game. $12-14M is not going to happen though. I'd be very shocked.

Aust
07-11-2013, 06:35 PM
Not at all. If you want to have a logical discussion, do so and leave it there. You bringing in anything that could be considered a slight just makes it look like you're either angry or losing. Keep it civil, or do you want another Laker thread derailed?

The cap has aspects of a hard one, but as long as it can be surpassed for multiple reasons, it's a soft cap. Coon calls it semi-soft, because there are more penalties and less ways than there used to be.

lol GL trying to enforce those rules.

ShowtimeNo24
07-11-2013, 06:36 PM
What Kobe said is that he will try to get the best deal out of it. It's like going to play against a very strong team, you won't admit defeat before the game although there isn't much you can help about it.

Gibby23
07-11-2013, 06:36 PM
That's code for "**** no" :laugh2:

Inconclusive, but on both sides.

I guess we'll just play a waiting game. $12-14M is not going to happen though. I'd be very shocked.

It doesn't matter if you would be shocked.

RLundi
07-11-2013, 06:37 PM
It doesn't matter if you would be shocked.

Just like it doesn't matter if you're incorrect?

I can do that too, see? :)

kblo247
07-11-2013, 06:40 PM
We probably don't. I certainly don't. I can imagine what it's like. Never been so spoiled by a team I root for (not to this extent). Hopefully some day it happens, but that's doubtful.

But still, irrational is irrational. Misconstruing and twisting words is still doing just that. The "mental gymnastics" don't magically become correct. Perhaps I don't get why and where it's all coming from, but it's happening a lot. Not all of you guys, but a lot.

Part of the coping process. A lot of irrational things were being thrown around Orlando during the Dwightmare. Time has caused more clarity and rationality to return, but yeah. It certainly wasn't like LA, but the residual effects of something like this are going to cause a lot of stupid things to be said out of states of passion.

I think the reality is that's true.

Los Angeles is the place where basketball trumps all. The Lakers have a mentality of good isnt good enough, and great isnt deserving of notice without it being epic.

By this I mean any other team retires role players jerseys like Fisher, Fox, Horry, Shaw, Cooper, Scott, Rambis, Green, and Odom. Any other team like SA sees what they did and acknowledges it with retired jerseys or at least paintings for their contribution. With the Lakers they will always be remembered, many of them given spots around or in the team and community afterward, but they go down in lore more than anything else. Championship role player Good is remembered forever but its not good enough to be acknowledged.

Being great but not being epic isn't accepted either. Look up at the ceiling of staples. The lakers refuse to hand banners for the pacific division title or western conference championships they won. And they won a lot of western conference titles as they've represented the west for almost half of all final series. Likewise when you see backstage lakers, they don't even keep the western conference trophies on display. To them that isn't a sign of greatness only nba titles are.

The biggest shock is the mentality and culture. If Dwight played anywhere else and won a conference title, he would be celebrated; as a Laker it isn't even acknowledged that Kobe, West, and Magic teams have been that close to 10x each for example. It isn't great, it is meaningless to the city, fans, owners, and taught to be meaningless to the franchise players if they don't come back with Larry O Brian and a ring. In any other city his stats would be celebrated, his personality cheered, but when Shaq wasn't winning in 96-99 he got media hate for being too goofy, too Hollywood, and not living up to the legacy. Like West told a 17 year old Kobe, you have to be great to get in that ceiling, titles are expected, its expected that you play hurt and sick, and its expected you form a dynasty.

Not everyone is cut out for that life on the court, that mentality. Kobe's one of the people that took it to heart, much like Kareem. And smiling along isnt what got Dwight exiled from the locker room or fans, Magic and Shaq smiled, but they kicked ***. Dwight had the best C numbers there were but they werent seen as great just eh because of Shaq, Kareem, Wilt, and even title Pau who brought it without the hacking and turnovers.

Dwight left because it was best for him. We can argue it was or wasn't the best place to win, going to houston when GSW was on the table, but we can't argue the personality for him best as he's the old guy on that team who the young guys can look up to. He doesn't and didnt want to be Kobe who was the 17-24 year old looking up to everyone on the team who were all older than him and who he couldn't truly relate to. Likewise the Lakers let him leave by refusing to change coaches, not amnestying Kobe, and not having one legend or Phil or Jeanie even show up because they didnt figure he was worth the time or effort to give the keys or torch to. Now we can argue about the billboards, that was a lets see what you're worth and if you're up for the challenge test, but when it came down to it, they didnt coddle Dwight and they didnt try to work everything out like with Kobe in the past or even with Shaq when he had problems with Van Exel and Eddie, Magic when he wanted Westphal gone, etc because they didnt and don't see him as the captain of the ship (a co-pilot sure).

Wish both sides the best. Dwight can try his thing in Houston and hopefully he doesn't make it a circus there. Likewise LA will try theirs with Kobe, plus whoever they have him recruit this summer, and for all we know it can be a guy like Melo who Kobe has a similar mentality too that not asks for the torch be handed to him but takes it like Kareem challenged magic to do and they win together.

Cracka2HI!
07-11-2013, 06:42 PM
Yea, that might have been a smart move for the Lakers but I think they are probably better off not letting Howard run the team.

Sandman
07-11-2013, 06:58 PM
If this were the Mets, everyone would be calling this nothing more than media spin for whiffing on a huge move

xnick5757
07-11-2013, 07:16 PM
in a vacuum, amnestying kobe makes complete sense.

in the real world, not so much. mainly because lakers fans would go *******

rhd420
07-11-2013, 07:40 PM
in a vacuum, amnestying kobe makes complete sense.

in the real world, not so much. mainly because lakers fans would go *******

it would truly be the issue if Kobe's injury is severe enough to keep him out for more than a season ... for example, if the Bulls knew that Derek Rose was going to be out another year as well - you'd consider that.

Kobe is still vital IF he is healthy, big IF ... the Lakers are going to pay the luxury tax next year and keeping Kobe isn't that big of a deal if he can come back to form for the second half of the season.

In terms of Dwight Howard though ... while I think he's talented, until otherwise proven he can be committal to anything no torch (heck maybe the one he's smoking) should be passed to him.

mrblisterdundee
07-11-2013, 10:46 PM
What logic? He's off the books after this year. We aren't winning **** this year anyway. Kobe will take a paycut of 2 yr/24-26 mil, and will still be playing like a top 10 player in the league.

If Kobe plays for the Lakers next year, you might as well delete that Andrew Wiggins signature and find someone who's going between the 10th and 20th pick.

ElChinoLatino
07-12-2013, 12:06 AM
Well, now he signed with a team where he's still not the "man". Better surrounding cast? How? In this FA? Kobe should probably get a 2 yr/24 mil contract, and he's worth every penny. That will allow us to go after another max player in 2014.




What are we giving Kobe a pass for? He hasn't done anything similar to LBJ or Dwght. Idk what the **** you are talking about.



Just stop spewing BS, every Laker fan knows this season is a bust. After 2014, all I have to say is: Enjoy the crow!

Actually he did a lot worse, right after he got picked by the Hornets, he demanded a trade just to the Lakers. He didn't give the Hornets a chance like D12/LeBron did to the small market teams, he said trade me or I won't play. What's worse was that he caused a feud between the most dominant center at the time with Shaq, even so that Phil acknowledge that it was impossible to coach him (Kobe). After 2 years of 1st round exits and one not making the playoffs along with constant ballhogging, he told Mitch to trade him or get him some help, very loyal of him I know. Which then follows up with the constant barrage of insults and finger-pointing in attempt to making Pau tougher, great coaching. And lets not forget, the salty D12 debacle which of course Kobe also had a hand on his decision to leave to Houston, another dominant center off of Lakerland.

kyubi256
07-12-2013, 12:11 AM
A guy who has never won anything in his career wanted the team to amnesty their best player who has won so many championships? WHAT?!

kblo247
07-12-2013, 12:22 AM
Actually he did a lot worse, right after he got picked by the Hornets, he demanded a trade just to the Lakers. He didn't give the Hornets a chance like D12/LeBron did to the small market teams, he said trade me or I won't play. What's worse was that he caused a feud between the most dominant center at the time with Shaq, even so that Phil acknowledge that it was impossible to coach him (Kobe). After 2 years of 1st round exits and one not making the playoffs along with constant ballhogging, he told Mitch to trade him or get him some help, very loyal of him I know. Which then follows up with the constant barrage of insults and finger-pointing in attempt to making Pau tougher, great coaching. And lets not forget, the salty D12 debacle which of course Kobe also had a hand on his decision to leave to Houston, another dominant center off of Lakerland.

Kobe didnt get selected by the Hornets. They prearranged the deal because the Hornets wanted Vlade to replace a leaving Zo. West went around to ther GMs and brags to this day, saying Kobe wasnt ready just is he would slip to a spot where they could find a likely trade partner to eat Vlades deal thus getting them Kobe and opening money for Shaq. The only team who was interested in Kobe were the Nets, and West talked their gm into not drafting him as he is on record of admitting. The Hornets selected Kobe as much as the Bucks selected Dirk; this wasnt a Francis scenario

YouCan'tBeatLA
07-12-2013, 12:25 AM
Actually he did a lot worse, right after he got picked by the Hornets, he demanded a trade just to the Lakers. He didn't give the Hornets a chance like D12/LeBron did to the small market teams, he said trade me or I won't play. What's worse was that he caused a feud between the most dominant center at the time with Shaq, even so that Phil acknowledge that it was impossible to coach him (Kobe). After 2 years of 1st round exits and one not making the playoffs along with constant ballhogging, he told Mitch to trade him or get him some help, very loyal of him I know. Which then follows up with the constant barrage of insults and finger-pointing in attempt to making Pau tougher, great coaching. And lets not forget, the salty D12 debacle which of course Kobe also had a hand on his decision to leave to Houston, another dominant center off of Lakerland.

Kobe forcing his way to LA is the biggest myth. LMFAO, you're telling me a 17 year old forced his way into the greatest franchise? And you're comparing a 17 year old to two players who made their decisions in their primes? So much wrong in one post. Kobe's agent and advisers threatened NJ that if they drafted Kobe, he would go and play in Italy. The GOAT Jerry West got the Hornets to draft Kobe in exchange for Divac. Kobe did not drive out Shaq for the 100000000x time. Shaq demanded 30 million and the FO told him to **** off. It had more to do with our FO lying to Shaq by promising him 30 mil than any exaggerated "problems" Shaq had with Kobe. Constant ballhogging? You mean, he should have relied on the great Smush Parker and Kwame Brown? OMFG, just shut the hell up. Dwight had been a ****ing diva all season long, and Kobe made an attempt to change up his game this year for the sake of the team (that didn't work out). Dwight leaving because of a single player means that he has the problem, not Kobe. Dwight leaving had more to do with FO's incompetence of not hiring Phil. Kobe did nothing wrong, he risked his body playing nearly 45 minutes a game night in and night out (and out performing Dwight). If Dwight doesn't appreciate that, then he can go **** himself.

nickdymez
07-12-2013, 12:56 AM
Kobe forcing his way to LA is the biggest myth. LMFAO, you're telling me a 17 year old forced his way into the greatest franchise? And you're comparing a 17 year old to two players who made their decisions in their primes? So much wrong in one post. Kobe's agent and advisers threatened NJ that if they drafted Kobe, he would go and play in Italy. The GOAT Jerry West got the Hornets to draft to Kobe in exchange for Divac. Kobe did not drive out Shaq for the 100000000x time. Shaq demanded 30 million and the FO told him to **** off. It had more to do with our FO lying to Shaq by promising him 30 mil than any exaggerated "problems" Shaq had with Kobe. Constant ballhogging? You mean, he should have relied on the great Smush Parker and Kwame Brown? OMFG, just shut the hell up. Dwight had been a ****ing diva all season long, and Kobe made an attempt to change up his game this year for the sake of the team (that didn't work out). Dwight leaving because of a single player means that he has the problem, not Kobe. Dwight leaving had more to do with FO's incompetence of not hiring Phil. Kobe did nothing wrong, he risked his body playing nearly 45 minutes a game night in and night out (and out performing Dwight). If Dwight doesn't appreciate that, then he can go **** himself.

Man, Lakers fans are shittin on the haters at an alarming rate. I like how Lakers fans post FACTS and not speculations like the haters do.. Great post..

kblo247
07-12-2013, 01:10 AM
Funniest thing is having a dirk sig and talking about Kobe being drafted by the Hornets, when its known dirk was a prearranged pick by Dallas using the bucks too.


The only one to dig his heels in and be an *** was Francis

naps
07-12-2013, 01:11 AM
If Dwight felt this way then I can't blame him. It's not like a contender can't be built around him. He's already proved that if you construct a team surrounding him he can take you to the deepest in the post-season. No superstar in his prime would be happy to surrender to a 35 year old shooting guard. Mike D'Antonie doesn't have balls to man up to Kobe. If Phil was still there then he would have made a seamless and nice transition of power and Kobe wouldn't oppose that with Phil making it happen.

Why are Lakers fans acting so hurt if Dwight is such a bad player and person as they are making him out to be just because he chose the best place for himself as a FA? He handled this situation a LOT better than he did in Orlando. I don't remember you guys saying all these stuff when he acted like a real ***** and dumped the Orlando Magic, most of you were hailing him like the next Shaq. The more you bash him now, the more it shows that you guys actually care about him. Let it go. Your team will be fine soon.

SouthSideRookie
07-12-2013, 01:19 AM
No one in LA said to say I will work with Kareem, take pictures with Kareem, and then not return his calls to set up said meetings to work on your post game, if you decide you won't vacate it to Pau

No one in LA told him to bad mouth Kobe and get caught by the media showing a box score around the locker room when Kobe wasnt there saying he deserved more shots than his average which was on par with Orlando.

No one in LA outside Shaq told him don't be a pick and roll big and ignore what he and Nash could have used to death

No one in LA made him act so sill that Pop cussed him out at an all star game for being childish.

No one in LA told Dwight to expect it would be easy. In fact worthy on the day the trade went down, said he better understand there's nothing less than rings, wins, and years of high level play going to be accepted by the Lakers to be thought of a true great.

Even Mitch gave him the West spill Shaq got and 17 year old Kobe got about see those names up there, you have to be this great, win this much, etc to get yours up there and a statue.

Dwight hurts himself when he said he and Harden will be the next Kobe and Shaq to Stephen A Smith. Dwight hurt himself when he opted in over just going to Brooklyn. Dwight hurt himself in LA when he has guys out there playing hurt and tired and he refused to play while cleared with a labrum and refused to get surgery, while Kobe logged 40+ minutes in the second half nightly to get the lakers the third best record in the nba in the second half of the season. No one told Dwight also exit how he did in game 4.

Dwight needs a pr guy, and a babysitter. You shouldn't be an issue on a team to the point where you have Metta saying chemistry went up and the team should win more games without you, Pau of all people won't wish you well in your endeavors, Nash goes on the radio and says you refused to sacrifice your game basically like everyone else adapted and weren't truly in, and you can't man up and tell Kobe anything to his face but will jabber behind his back when he's gone and shut up like a ***** when he says tell me what you think of me to your face in the Memphis locker room by the account of the players. LA wasnt for him as a basketball player or personality, and he somehow soured his teammates, coach, former laker legends who work around the team and are in the know, and fans all by himself.


Pretend he wasn't a Laker. Pretend Lakers never existed. Just look at Howard the person and how it affects the game on the court.....is that really a player you would trust to help win you a championship. A challenging road deep with obstacles, issues of trust, the fortitude to pull through in crunch time? Quit being a fvcking homer like we have mistakenly been and look at the big picture here.


Fabulous is right Dwight Howard is going to win at least 6 of the next 9 championships with harden. We're just hating at least I admit it. Howard is going to go down as a top 5 player. Fear the smile.


Kobe forcing his way to LA is the biggest myth. LMFAO, you're telling me a 17 year old forced his way into the greatest franchise? And you're comparing a 17 year old to two players who made their decisions in their primes? So much wrong in one post. Kobe's agent and advisers threatened NJ that if they drafted Kobe, he would go and play in Italy. The GOAT Jerry West got the Hornets to draft Kobe in exchange for Divac. Kobe did not drive out Shaq for the 100000000x time. Shaq demanded 30 million and the FO told him to **** off. It had more to do with our FO lying to Shaq by promising him 30 mil than any exaggerated "problems" Shaq had with Kobe. Constant ballhogging? You mean, he should have relied on the great Smush Parker and Kwame Brown? OMFG, just shut the hell up. Dwight had been a ****ing diva all season long, and Kobe made an attempt to change up his game this year for the sake of the team (that didn't work out). Dwight leaving because of a single player means that he has the problem, not Kobe. Dwight leaving had more to do with FO's incompetence of not hiring Phil. Kobe did nothing wrong, he risked his body playing nearly 45 minutes a game night in and night out (and out performing Dwight). If Dwight doesn't appreciate that, then he can go **** himself.


Man, Lakers fans are shittin on the haters at an alarming rate. I like how Lakers fans post FACTS and not speculations like the haters do.. Great post..




http://assets.smokingmeatforums.com/3/30/30154564_butthurt_report_form.jpeg







/ thread

naps
07-12-2013, 01:26 AM
in a vacuum, amnestying kobe makes complete sense.


Agreed there. Lakers would be in terrific position next summer. So much cap space+ Dwight+Nash+Los Angeles. What's not to like?

YouCan'tBeatLA
07-12-2013, 01:27 AM
http://assets.smokingmeatforums.com/3/30/30154564_butthurt_report_form.jpeg





/ thread

Great contribution...

I don't know why Rockets fans think we're butthurt.

Whatever, look at sig. 5 in 13.

Bye.

RLundi
07-12-2013, 02:37 AM
http://assets.smokingmeatforums.com/3/30/30154564_butthurt_report_form.jpeg







/ thread

:laugh2:

LakersMaster24
07-12-2013, 03:20 AM
:laugh2:

What the **** you laughing at? If I were I'd be worried about your **** franchise.

5ass
07-12-2013, 03:23 AM
What the **** you laughing at? If I were I'd be worried about your **** franchise.

Dwight left you, get over it. Our franchise is doing just fine. Atleast we got something for Dwight.

LakersMaster24
07-12-2013, 03:29 AM
Dwight left you, get over it. Our franchise is doing just fine. Atleast we got something for Dwight.

:laugh:

Check my previous posts, I never cared if Dwight stayed. Would I prefer it? Yeah, why not? However I was never emotionally hurt or something like that.

All of you people are trying to convince us, that us LAKERS fans are having suicidal thoughts and are completely lost in depression because Dwight Howard chose the Rockets. Who cares?

We know our franchise will be fine, in fact we aren't terrible right now either. Funny thing is, I can guarantee at least one championship for the Lakers in the next 7-10 years, while you can't say the same thing about your team.

5ass
07-12-2013, 03:37 AM
:laugh:

Check my previous posts, I never cared if Dwight stayed. Would I prefer it? Yeah, why not? However I was never emotionally hurt or something like that.

All of you people are trying to convince us, that us LAKERS fans are having suicidal thoughts and are completely lost in depression because Dwight Howard chose the Rockets. Who cares?

We know our franchise will be fine, in fact we aren't terrible right now either. Funny thing is, I can guarantee at least one championship for the Lakers in the next 7-10 years, while you can't say the same thing about your team.

Clearly.

FOBolous
07-12-2013, 06:40 AM
http://assets.smokingmeatforums.com/3/30/30154564_butthurt_report_form.jpeg







/ thread

:laugh:

jam
07-12-2013, 08:23 AM
:laugh:

It's only amusing until he becomes the same dwightmare in hou that he was in LA and ORL.

RLundi
07-12-2013, 09:44 AM
What the **** you laughing at? If I were I'd be worried about your **** franchise.

Your level of butthurtness is astounding. I'm not worried about my franchise whatsoever, we have a clear direction.

But even if I was concerned, that doesn't mean I can't appreciate humor. Remove the sand from your vagina.

LOOTERX9
07-12-2013, 09:46 AM
lakers should have amestied kobe and signed cp3 and howard. cause without phil jackson and the triangle players like kobe / melo can't win titles with their style of play

RLundi
07-12-2013, 09:51 AM
:laugh:

Check my previous posts, I never cared if Dwight stayed. Would I prefer it? Yeah, why not? However I was never emotionally hurt or something like that.

All of you people are trying to convince us, that us LAKERS fans are having suicidal thoughts and are completely lost in depression because Dwight Howard chose the Rockets. Who cares?

We know our franchise will be fine, in fact we aren't terrible right now either. Funny thing is, I can guarantee at least one championship for the Lakers in the next 7-10 years, while you can't say the same thing about your team.

You're honestly one of the most juvenile Lakers fans on PSD. You're on that nickdymez-Vinylman-Gibby level.

TheIlladelph16
07-12-2013, 09:52 AM
Kobe's taking a pay cut for sure, but I find it difficult to believe he will take an $18 million dollar a year pay cut down to $12 million like some are suggesting.

Wrigheyes4MVP
07-12-2013, 10:24 AM
:laugh:

Check my previous posts, I never cared if Dwight stayed. Would I prefer it? Yeah, why not? However I was never emotionally hurt or something like that.

All of you people are trying to convince us, that us LAKERS fans are having suicidal thoughts and are completely lost in depression because Dwight Howard chose the Rockets. Who cares?

We know our franchise will be fine, in fact we aren't terrible right now either. Funny thing is, I can guarantee at least one championship for the Lakers in the next 7-10 years, while you can't say the same thing about your team.

You can gaurantee at least on championship in the next 7-10 years?

Lol

Wrigheyes4MVP
07-12-2013, 10:24 AM
Kobe's taking a pay cut for sure, but I find it difficult to believe he will take an $18 million dollar a year pay cut down to $12 million like some are suggesting.

Lol awesome sig

Sandman
07-12-2013, 10:26 AM
You can gaurantee at least on championship in the next 7-10 years?

Lol

Yeah I'm sure we can all SAY the same things about our team :laugh:

ElChinoLatino
07-12-2013, 10:29 AM
http://assets.smokingmeatforums.com/3/30/30154564_butthurt_report_form.jpeg







/ thread

:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:

They need to vent, let them be.

ackar
07-12-2013, 10:51 AM
:laugh:

Check my previous posts, I never cared if Dwight stayed. Would I prefer it? Yeah, why not? However I was never emotionally hurt or something like that.

All of you people are trying to convince us, that us LAKERS fans are having suicidal thoughts and are completely lost in depression because Dwight Howard chose the Rockets. Who cares?

We know our franchise will be fine, in fact we aren't terrible right now either. Funny thing is, I can guarantee at least one championship for the Lakers in the next 7-10 years, while you can't say the same thing about your team.

I always thought D12 leaving was best for the Lakers long term. i know that i am in the minority I just don't see d12 leading the team being the man and getting that ship as a second tier player sure as the man not so much. Plus in today's CBA driven NBA you need cap space to win.

Gibby23
07-12-2013, 10:55 AM
Yeah I'm sure we can all SAY the same things about our team :laugh:

Sure you can, but Lakers fans really mean it, they have seen it. Have you seen your team win it all? 1 time? 2 times? 3 times? 4 times? 5 times? 6 times? 7 times? have to stop at 7 because I eas too young to remember Magics first 3. Have you seen your teams win in 2 different decades?

Sandman
07-12-2013, 10:57 AM
Sure you can, but Lakers fans really mean it, they have seen it. Have you seen your team win it all? 1 time? 2 times? 3 times? 4 times? 5 times? 6 times? 7 times? have to stop at 7 because I eas too young to remember Magics first 3. Have you seen your teams win in 2 different decades?

How many times have you seen your team win in the next decade?

I don't care how many championships they have it is SMUG AS HELL to say that on those grounds and a crazy spin on reality when you have no clue about all 15 players + coach involved.

Gibby23
07-12-2013, 11:01 AM
How many times have you seen your team win in the next decade?

I don't care how many championships they have it is SMUG AS HELL to say that on those grounds and a crazy spin on reality when you have no clue about all 15 players + coach involved.

They just won 2 of the last 5, and I feel good about them getting one more in the next 5. I can't be sure, but the Laker franchise over the 25 years I have been a fan has shown me that they can lose a star and put a championship team together pretty quick. What about your team? What have they shown you?

Sandman
07-12-2013, 11:06 AM
They just won 2 of the last 5, and I feel good about them getting one more in the next 5. I can't be sure, but the Laker franchise over the 25 years I have been a fan has shown me that they can lose a star and put a championship team together pretty quick. What about your team? What have they shown you?
My team has shown me marginal BS aside from a missed opp when Jordan was playing baseball and an accident finals run in 99

then the Magic team I was watching here got swatted by your Lakers

but none of that = future. also my team or teams have nothing to do with your championship guarantee.

2 of the last 5 is nice, its also 0 of the last 3 and the core from that team is gone or old and will never win another one

Is your team lottery ****ed? Maybe if Kobe doesn't play, but no not long term. They could attract players. Dwight walked away, if he's not the type of player you wish to attract I don't know who is. All beside the point still, they are not ****ed forever.

But "not ****ed" =/= championship

Guaranteeing such things without even the idea of who the first player on that roster = :crazy:

Gibby23
07-12-2013, 11:12 AM
My team has shown me marginal BS aside from a missed opp when Jordan was playing baseball and an accident finals run in 99

then the Magic team I was watching here got swatted by your Lakers

but none of that = future. also my team or teams have nothing to do with your championship guarantee.

2 of the last 5 is nice, its also 0 of the last 3 and the core from that team is gone or old and will never win another one

Is your team lottery ****ed? Maybe if Kobe doesn't play, but no not long term. They could attract players. Dwight walked away, if he's not the type of player you wish to attract I don't know who is. All beside the point still, they are not ****ed forever.

But "not ****ed" =/= championship

Guaranteeing such things without even the idea of who the first player on that roster = :crazy:

We just don't have a loser mentality like some other fan bases that wish they could see there team win just on championship. It's a good feeling, trust me. That is why most Laker fans are ok with this. You wont see any team win every year, but I have seen my team win 4 times in my 20's and once when I was 30. What else can I ask for? You would be happy with one from your team in the last 10 years. ****, you are cheering for 2 teams and still haven't seen one. Why should Laker fans care what fans like you have to say about the future of our team?

Sandman
07-12-2013, 11:18 AM
We just don't have a loser mentality like some other fan bases that wish they could see there team win just on championship. It's a good feeling, trust me. That is why most Laker fans are ok with this. You wont see any team win every year, but I have seen my team win 4 times in my 20's and once when I was 30. What else can I ask for? You would be happy with one from your team in the last 10 years. ****, you are cheering for 2 teams and still haven't seen one. Why should Laker fans care what fans like you have to say about the future of our team?
Twist your smug BS any way you want, it has nothing to do with the future and you're guaranteeing a title when you don't even know the 1st player on the roster. You could have LeBron (***you don't) and it doesn't guarantee you a title. Howard just walked away from you and you think whatever FA hits the market is in the bag? Flawed logic, even if they do get a title.

Gibby23
07-12-2013, 11:23 AM
Twist your smug BS any way you want, it has nothing to do with the future and you're guaranteeing a title when you don't even know the 1st player on the roster. You could have LeBron (***you don't) and it doesn't guarantee you a title. Howard just walked away from you and you think whatever FA hits the market is in the bag? Flawed logic, even if they do get a title.

Good stuff. Like I said, I have seen my fair share and I trust the franchise. I stand by my statement, I feel good about them getting another one in the next 5 years. This is going to be a lost year, so the 4 years after this one, I feel good about them getting number 17. You seem to care too much about a team that has proven to win, is that because you know your 2 teams wont win anything anytime soon?

Sandman
07-12-2013, 11:25 AM
Good stuff. Like I said, I have seen my fair share and I trust the franchise. I stand by my statement, I feel good about them getting another one in the next 5 years. This is going to be a lost year, so the 4 years after this one, I feel good about them getting number 17. You seem to care too much about a team that has proven to win, is that because you know your 2 teams wont win anything anytime soon?
This is still more smug BS

It doesn't have anything to do with the Lakers winning a title

And I don't see how I "care too much", I'm calling you out for making a crazy guarantee.

You can't name the first player on this supposed title team

TheIlladelph16
07-12-2013, 11:36 AM
We just don't have a loser mentality like some other fan bases that wish they could see there team win just on championship. It's a good feeling, trust me. That is why most Laker fans are ok with this. You wont see any team win every year, but I have seen my team win 4 times in my 20's and once when I was 30. What else can I ask for? You would be happy with one from your team in the last 10 years. ****, you are cheering for 2 teams and still haven't seen one. Why should Laker fans care what fans like you have to say about the future of our team?

This **** is why people despise the Lakers and a large portion of their fans.