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ManRam
07-08-2013, 06:17 PM
Was discussing this in the Magic forum, but wanted to get outsider input, perhaps from the teams in question.

There's a lot of talk about how so many teams are looking to "tank for Wiggins", but I'm not so sure that's the case.

Here's what I came up with...

Not tanking (DUH!):

Miami, San Antonio, Oklahoma City, Denver, Clippers, Memphis, Golden State, Houston, New York, Indiana, Brooklyn, Chicago

12 teams

Most likely not going to be bad enough:

Atlanta: Brought in Millsap, obviously not bottoming out. Too much talent.
Lakers: Had them on the fringe yesterday, but the Kaman signing kinda shows they don't want to bottom out + Kobe/organization's pride = gonna try to win
Detroit: Should improve upon their 29 win season, adding Smith means looking up not down
Portland: Adding depth, which was their biggest problem. Not looking to move LMA
Cleveland: The young talent will pay off, brought in Jack and Clark (overpaid, but a slight upgrade), interested in Bynum. They're looking up not down.
New Orleans: Too much talent, should only get better.

6 teams

Fringe tankers:

Fringe Tankers:

Minnesota: probably should be on the list above, but they are the T-Wolves and they very well could disappoint again. Added Martin. They'll have a healthy Love and an improved/healthy Rubio. Right now I see too much talent, especially if they retain Pek (I think yes). They aren't looking to tank, that's for sure.

Dallas: taking L after L in free agency, but they've brought in Harris and Calderon and aren't looking to move Marion. Too much pride, but also not a deep nor good team. Probably should be on the list above, but we'll see.

Wizards: Healthy Wall, improved Beal and are looking to ADD in free agency to get better.

Bobcats: addressed their biggest need in getting Zeller and Jefferson. They're instant upgrades. Kemba/MKG/Henderson (assuming they retain him) could be quite solid. They have underrated depth too. Could win 30.

Raptors: Kinda unknown what they'll do, but odds are it will be a patient transition either way. They could be terrible, but Ujiri is savvy-enough to perhaps improve them. The biggest unknown for me.

Bucks: Trying to get better, but there will be a ton of turnover. Brought in Delfino, Zaza and Mayo. Seem to be okay with mediocrity. Also, Sanders and Henson gon' beast this year!

6 teams

Prime Contenders

Sixers: Clearly looking to the future. Will have growing pains galore.

Suns: Did bring in Bledsoe, but he's not gonna make a huge difference. New regime will look look to cleanse and rebuild.

Jazz: Lost Millsap and Jefferson in the end for NOTHING. Their roster is going to be thin, especially when/if Mo leaves. Kanter and Favors are nice, but you can't count on them yet.

Kings: lost Evans; brought in Landry, Vasquez and McLemore. Depending on how their youth develops they'll probably be about the same team.

Celtics: Potential tank contenders. They do have some vets who might have too much pride in Rondo, Wallace and Humph, but they clearly know it's time to rebuild.

Orlando: I like or core, but it's so young, we're probably gonna look to move Jameer, Baby and Afflalo, and winning absolutely is NOT going to be a priority.

6 teams




So, I guess in the end, with all the talk about tanking for Wiggins, I think most teams aren't actually going all-in for it. Even some of those 6 prime candidates aren't quite going all-in. Philly clearly is, I think Utah clearly has to (whether or not they wanted to), and Boston should as well.


Any major disagreements with my list? I think those 6 teams are the prime tankers.

ThuglifeJ
07-08-2013, 06:21 PM
Yay mentioning Lakers as fringe tankers just because you're obsessed with Dwight

Greet
07-08-2013, 06:23 PM
Well I do agree with most of your list except that: Celtics and Kings are probably not on the tank list. Unless the Celtics move Rondo.

slashsnake
07-08-2013, 06:25 PM
Nah, I would put them on the fringe as well. Kobe with a potential career wrecking injury, old players with bad contracts. I wouldn't be gung ho about using up long term cap space to make this team work. Instead they are going to short term re-tool. See what happens, but not tie up long term money in the process.

RLundi
07-08-2013, 06:28 PM
Are tankers synonymous with bad teams? I don't think the Wizards, Kings, Bobcats, Wolves or Mavs are trying/content with being bad or are after a high draft pick. I wouldn't call them tankers.

I do agree with everyone else in the Prime Contender slot. They're either consigned to being bad and realize rebuilding is ongoing or they are purposely trying to tank. I'd also add Toronto to that list.

And I agree, Minnesota should probably be a notch above Fringe, if healthy that is.

I think it'll be a race between Orlando, Boston, Utah, Phoenix and Philadelphia. I'd say Philly, Utah and Orlando have the upper hands as of now.

shep33
07-08-2013, 06:31 PM
I wish we'd tank. Wiggins or Parker + 2 max free agents would be craaazy

RLundi
07-08-2013, 06:32 PM
I wish we'd tank. Wiggins or Parker + 2 max free agents would be craaazy

That'd be the fastest and best rebuild into championship contender status EVER. Even better than Boston.

Lo Porto
07-08-2013, 06:35 PM
Utah is NOT tanking. They are just starting their 5 top 12 draft picks from the last few drafts (#9 Burke, #12 Burks, #9 Hayward, #3 Favors, #3 Kanter).

People think just because they are acquiring picks and not re-signing Al and Millsap that they are tanking. Utah is just going to play their youth to see what they have going into a year when Hayward and Favors need to be resigned and they'll have more cap space than anybody.

slashsnake
07-08-2013, 06:35 PM
Celtics just moved their coach, who doesn't want to rebuild a team, and two of their three best players (and Terry)... What did they do that for? 9 first rounders in the next 5 years. First round draft picks aren't winning them any games this year like players might. The rights to a future draft pick doesn't score a single point. They gave up on a run this season with their best option (keeping the players) in order to build in the future (draft picks in future years). That is as close to the definition of tanking as you can have, though nobody in Boston would ever admit it.

5ass
07-08-2013, 06:39 PM
Utah is NOT tanking. They are just starting their 5 top 12 draft picks from the last few drafts (#9 Burke, #12 Burks, #9 Hayward, #3 Favors, #3 Kanter).

People think just because they are acquiring picks and not re-signing Al and Millsap that they are tanking. Utah is just going to play their youth to see what they have going into a year when Hayward and Favors need to be resigned and they'll have more cap space than anybody.

So do you expect them to compete for the play offs with that line up? They're still so young. They will be horrible next year.

Teeboy1487
07-08-2013, 06:40 PM
I want the Lakers to tank because we need a cornerstone to the franchise. I don't see the point in banking on Lebron or Melo next summer. Both are highly unlikely to leave their current teams. The Lakers would have a better chance at Wiggins or Parker if they traded Gasol and Nash. There is nothing wrong with trying to rebuild. You just can't be on top forever. I'm afraid the Lakers will stand pat and try to compete which is a mistake. Right now, they are not bad enough to get a top 5 pick, yet they are not good enough to contend. They are a 8th seed at best with aging players. They would be best serve trading Nash and Gasol and rebuilding.

ManRam
07-08-2013, 06:42 PM
Yay mentioning Lakers as fringe tankers just because you're obsessed with Dwight

1. No
2. I didn't put them on fringe
3. Many Lakers fans wish they would

But thanks for the input!

ManRam
07-08-2013, 06:44 PM
Utah is NOT tanking. They are just starting their 5 top 12 draft picks from the last few drafts (#9 Burke, #12 Burks, #9 Hayward, #3 Favors, #3 Kanter).

People think just because they are acquiring picks and not re-signing Al and Millsap that they are tanking. Utah is just going to play their youth to see what they have going into a year when Hayward and Favors need to be resigned and they'll have more cap space than anybody.

I will say that people do use the term "tanking" too liberally. I just recently talked about that.

They're not making an effort to "tank", for sure. But they are going to be young and future a ton of brand new starters.


You're right, it's not "tanking", but they might be in the fight for a bottom 5 seed however you wanna label it.

Aust
07-08-2013, 06:50 PM
I wish we'd tank. Wiggins or Parker + 2 max free agents would be craaazy


I want the Lakers to tank because we need a cornerstone to the franchise. I don't see the point in banking on Lebron or Melo next summer. Both are highly unlikely to leave their current teams. The Lakers would have a better chance at Wiggins or Parker if they traded Gasol and Nash. There is nothing wrong with trying to rebuild. You just can't be on top forever. I'm afraid the Lakers will stand pat and try to compete which is a mistake. Right now, they are not bad enough to get a top 5 pick, yet they are not good enough to contend. They are a 8th seed at best with aging players. They would be best serve trading Nash and Gasol and rebuilding.

:nod: Our FO needs to swallow their pride and allow us to tank.

Teeboy1487
07-08-2013, 06:50 PM
1. No
2. I didn't put them on fringe
3. Many Lakers fans wish they would

But thanks for the input!
Pretty much. Just look at that Magic. You guys have a promising young stud in Oladipo. For once in my lifetime, I want to see the Lakers draft a promising young player in the Top 5 and build around him. If they somehow win with this method, the journey would be that much more sweet.

Aust
07-08-2013, 06:56 PM
I'm tired of just buying talent. I'd love to draft and develop some young studs.

Iron24th
07-08-2013, 07:01 PM
I wish we'd tank. Wiggins or Parker + 2 max free agents would be craaazy

+ Kobe and Pau taking some paycuts

Iron24th
07-08-2013, 07:03 PM
I'm tired of just buying talent. I'd love to draft and develop some young studs.

Bynum was one, and he became an all star, too bad his knees were exposed.

5ass
07-08-2013, 07:08 PM
Bynum was one, and he became an all star, too bad his knees were exposed.

He probably should've worn longer shorts.

OceanSpray
07-08-2013, 07:31 PM
Boston tanking for sure.

celtics 34
07-08-2013, 07:45 PM
Boston tanking for sure.
Full on tank let rondo rest or if he is healthy let him show case he can be good then trade him and have no legit ball handler so they can have turnovers galore and lose more games .

lakers4sho
07-08-2013, 07:54 PM
LakeShow Tank Nation is fully operational at this point!!!

abe_froman
07-08-2013, 07:59 PM
lakers fans want them to tank,but i doubt they will.kobe's pride just wont let them do that(kind of a downside to having such a competitor)

FarOutIos
07-08-2013, 08:02 PM
Utah is NOT tanking. They are just starting their 5 top 12 draft picks from the last few drafts (#9 Burke, #12 Burks, #9 Hayward, #3 Favors, #3 Kanter).

People think just because they are acquiring picks and not re-signing Al and Millsap that they are tanking. Utah is just going to play their youth to see what they have going into a year when Hayward and Favors need to be resigned and they'll have more cap space than anybody.

Utah is executing the best form of tanking. The tanking with purpose form. They start all of their young players and let them progress on the court. Obviously, they will not perform great together. They really are missing the one star player to put it all together.

So... 3 out of 5 players will prove to be good/great starters. When they draft next year, they get the star to be the fourth. Then they add a vet to be the fifth. And bingo!

dtmagnet
07-08-2013, 08:18 PM
Raptors need to try harder to tank or they're just going to end up picking in the 10th range again.

DDynO
07-08-2013, 08:24 PM
I think the Wizards are trying to compete. Atlanta and LA should tank. Raptors might be trying to as well. I like what Utah is doing, though.

Korman12
07-08-2013, 09:30 PM
Leading the tank train down here.

smith&wesson
07-09-2013, 03:58 AM
Was discussing this in the Magic forum, but wanted to get outsider input, perhaps from the teams in question.

There's a lot of talk about how so many teams are looking to "tank for Wiggins", but I'm not so sure that's the case.

Here's what I came up with...

Not tanking (DUH!):

Miami, San Antonio, Oklahoma City, Denver, Clippers, Memphis, Golden State, Houston, New York, Indiana, Brooklyn, Chicago

12 teams

Most likely not going to be bad enough:

Atlanta: Brought in Millsap, obviously not bottoming out. Too much talent.
Lakers: Had them on the fringe yesterday, but the Kaman signing kinda shows they don't want to bottom out + Kobe/organization's pride = gonna try to win
Detroit: Should improve upon their 29 win season, adding Smith means looking up not down
Portland: Adding depth, which was their biggest problem. Not looking to move LMA
Cleveland: The young talent will pay off, brought in Jack and Clark (overpaid, but a slight upgrade), interested in Bynum. They're looking up not down.
New Orleans: Too much talent, should only get better.

6 teams

Fringe tankers:

Fringe Tankers:

Minnesota: probably should be on the list above, but they are the T-Wolves and they very well could disappoint again. Added Martin. They'll have a healthy Love and an improved/healthy Rubio. Right now I see too much talent, especially if they retain Pek (I think yes). They aren't looking to tank, that's for sure.

Dallas: taking L after L in free agency, but they've brought in Harris and Calderon and aren't looking to move Marion. Too much pride, but also not a deep nor good team. Probably should be on the list above, but we'll see.

Wizards: Healthy Wall, improved Beal and are looking to ADD in free agency to get better.

Bobcats: addressed their biggest need in getting Zeller and Jefferson. They're instant upgrades. Kemba/MKG/Henderson (assuming they retain him) could be quite solid. They have underrated depth too. Could win 30.

Raptors: Kinda unknown what they'll do, but odds are it will be a patient transition either way. They could be terrible, but Ujiri is savvy-enough to perhaps improve them. The biggest unknown for me.

Bucks: Trying to get better, but there will be a ton of turnover. Brought in Delfino, Zaza and Mayo. Seem to be okay with mediocrity. Also, Sanders and Henson gon' beast this year!

6 teams

Prime Contenders

Sixers: Clearly looking to the future. Will have growing pains galore.

Suns: Did bring in Bledsoe, but he's not gonna make a huge difference. New regime will look look to cleanse and rebuild.

Jazz: Lost Millsap and Jefferson in the end for NOTHING. Their roster is going to be thin, especially when/if Mo leaves. Kanter and Favors are nice, but you can't count on them yet.

Kings: lost Evans; brought in Landry, Vasquez and McLemore. Depending on how their youth develops they'll probably be about the same team.

Celtics: Potential tank contenders. They do have some vets who might have too much pride in Rondo, Wallace and Humph, but they clearly know it's time to rebuild.

Orlando: I like or core, but it's so young, we're probably gonna look to move Jameer, Baby and Afflalo, and winning absolutely is NOT going to be a priority.

6 teams




So, I guess in the end, with all the talk about tanking for Wiggins, I think most teams aren't actually going all-in for it. Even some of those 6 prime candidates aren't quite going all-in. Philly clearly is, I think Utah clearly has to (whether or not they wanted to), and Boston should as well.


Any major disagreements with my list? I think those 6 teams are the prime tankers.

I agree with much of this all valid points.

I really hate the fact that the raptors have an unknown direction and no one knows wtf they are doing. really gripes me

smith&wesson
07-09-2013, 03:59 AM
Raptors need to try harder to tank or they're just going to end up picking in the 10th range again.

or they need to try harder to win. bench players are not as hard to attain as starters are. we just need some depth.

FYL_McVeezy
07-09-2013, 09:57 AM
LakeShow Tank Nation is fully operational at this point!!!

If I was a Laker fan I would want them to tank too. Can't blame them. What good is being an 8th seed with nothing to look forward to in the future.....might as well lose and try your luck in the lotto at Wiggins....

And I can't understand why the Bucks and Hawks love mediocrity so much....might as well gamble and try their luck in the lotto....

king4day
07-09-2013, 10:14 AM
If the Suns move Gortat and Scola, then I really think we are in full tank mode. Hopefully we do :)

Pierzynski4Prez
07-09-2013, 10:16 AM
Nobody tanks as far as players/coaches go. You don't become a professional at this level and go out there hoping to lose games.

Pierzynski4Prez
07-09-2013, 10:20 AM
I will say that people do use the term "tanking" too liberally. I just recently talked about that.

They're not making an effort to "tank", for sure. But they are going to be young and future a ton of brand new starters.


You're right, it's not "tanking", but they might be in the fight for a bottom 5 seed however you wanna label it.

Didn't see this post at 1st. 100% agreed, the term gets tossed around to frequently.

InYoBicCuddy
07-09-2013, 10:26 AM
i dont see why people are so obscessed with the word "tank"

i guess cleveleland has been taking since lebron left

and i guess minnesota has been tanking since garnett left

and the sixers have been tanking isnce iverson left

or maybe

they all just suck

not improving /= tanking

teams dont just get better out of thin air

bagwell368
07-09-2013, 11:15 AM
Well I do agree with most of your list except that: Celtics and Kings are probably not on the tank list. Unless the Celtics move Rondo.

Rondo could easily miss ~half the season if he stays. The Celts as of right now have junk at Center, back-ups at PF, an erratic trick or treat player at SF, a SG that can't shoot, and Rondo who is as erratic and flawed as any supposedly great player in the NBA.

Seems worse than fringe to me (as is).

bagwell368
07-09-2013, 11:20 AM
Nobody tanks as far as players/coaches go. You don't become a professional at this level and go out there hoping to lose games.

But GM's do. Strip away enough players or trade for lesser players to get expirings and picks. Than despite the best efforts of the players and coach - you've got yourself a tank.

bagwell368
07-09-2013, 11:20 AM
dupe

J4KOP99
07-09-2013, 11:22 AM
Kobe Bryant and the lakers

Gators123
07-09-2013, 11:23 AM
Maybe 1 or 2 teams will actually tank. The rest just suck.

Pierzynski4Prez
07-09-2013, 11:26 AM
But GM's do. Strip away enough players or trade for lesser players to get expirings and picks. Than despite the best efforts of the players and coach - you've got yourself a tank.

I call that building for the future, which in my opinion isn't the same as tanking.

KniCks4LiFe
07-09-2013, 11:26 AM
Sixers and Celtics.

D1JM
07-09-2013, 11:40 AM
Sixers and Celtics.

crazy pitch :drool:

ATX
07-09-2013, 11:48 AM
I don't understand the whole Lakers tanking thing. They still have Kobe (For probably most of the season) Gasol, Nash, and Kaman...That is a decent enough squad to win 35+ games. While I do expect them in the lottery, their odds of receiving the #1 overall pick is remote at best.

J4KOP99
07-09-2013, 11:49 AM
Nobody has any idea what Kobe will look like when he comes back.

Yes, his work ethic is 2nd to none but sometimes your body just won't cooperate.

ManRam
07-09-2013, 11:50 AM
Maybe 1 or 2 teams will actually tank. The rest just suck.

...or are rebuilding properly.

"tank" is a term that is used too liberally. i used it liberally in this thread because all i wanted to do was find out who will have poor records.

ManRam
07-09-2013, 11:51 AM
I don't understand the whole Lakers tanking thing. They still have Kobe (For probably most of the season) Gasol, Nash, and Kaman...That is a decent enough squad to win 35+ games. While I do expect them in the lottery, their odds of receiving the #1 overall pick is remote at best.

35 games is the worst record a team can have. especially when they basically have everyone coming off the books next year

sixer04fan
07-09-2013, 11:52 AM
Tankadelphia!

ATX
07-09-2013, 12:02 PM
35 games is the worst record a team can have. especially when they basically have everyone coming off the books next year

I agree...But do you see LA purposely tanking for the remote shot at Wiggins, when there are so many worse teams out there next season?

SugeKnight
07-09-2013, 12:11 PM
He probably should've worn longer shorts.

lol

ManRam
07-09-2013, 12:20 PM
I agree...But do you see LA purposely tanking for the remote shot at Wiggins, when there are so many worse teams out there next season?

No. They won't. But pride and being scared to lose are stupid reasons not to. It's their fault. Better hope they don't turn into Dallas part 2 in that they strike out on FAs and get nothing in the draft...all because they wanted to maybe sneak into the playoffs.

futureman
07-09-2013, 02:51 PM
Utah is NOT tanking. They are just starting their 5 top 12 draft picks from the last few drafts (#9 Burke, #12 Burks, #9 Hayward, #3 Favors, #3 Kanter).

People think just because they are acquiring picks and not re-signing Al and Millsap that they are tanking. Utah is just going to play their youth to see what they have going into a year when Hayward and Favors need to be resigned and they'll have more cap space than anybody.

We have no bench. We are tanking. Also we are evaluating our young guys to figure out how good they really are before they are due for extensions. But I believe that this next player, hopefully Wiggins or Parker will be the player that brings it all together. We are rebuilding Spurs style.

jp611
07-09-2013, 08:06 PM
Celtics are gonna win the lottery next year

Wiggins to Boston

Aust
07-09-2013, 09:30 PM
I agree...But do you see LA purposely tanking for the remote shot at Wiggins, when there are so many worse teams out there next season?

It's not just Wiggins. That draft is stacked.

FriedTofuz
07-09-2013, 09:41 PM
Celtics are tanking and I hate how Danny Ainge denies it, and the same with sullinger, they will flat out suck

FriedTofuz
07-09-2013, 09:42 PM
Lakers will probably tank LOL, kobe shoul take an extended rest, but knowing kobe, that is probably not gonna happen

blastmasta26
07-09-2013, 09:52 PM
Celtics are tanking and I hate how Danny Ainge denies it, and the same with sullinger, they will flat out suck

Why would they admit it? You risk alienating fans and maybe players by admitting that you're tanking.

Aust
07-09-2013, 09:53 PM
Why would they admit it? You risk alienating fans and maybe players by admitting that you're tanking.

Not to mention I doubt the league would be very happy with you admitting to such a thing.

KingPosey
07-09-2013, 10:13 PM
In everyone's opinion HOW good is Wiggins supposed to be? both initially and long term? Is he going to step in day one and play near all star level like LBJ and Melo or is he going to need to develop for a two years like Kobe? In your opinions.

ArmLaker
07-09-2013, 11:07 PM
I think the Lakers are the biggest question mark of any tanking that could happen.

Assuming Kobe comes back to form, Nash and Gasol stay healthy and the team clicks under D'Antoni shooting lights out.....I see us as a 45-50 Win team during the REGULAR SEASON

However, whether Kobe regains his form or not and Nash and Gasol end up with another injury-ridden season, I could potentially see us challenging Charlotte, Orlando, Tankadelphia and the likes.

SINCESTARBURY25
07-09-2013, 11:36 PM
Wiggins should be on the Raptors it just seems too right to not happen but it probably wont if he goes to the magic that will be the new OKC type franchise with their talent.

OceanSpray
07-09-2013, 11:42 PM
I think the Lakers are the biggest question mark of any tanking that could happen.

Assuming Kobe comes back to form, Nash and Gasol stay healthy and the team clicks under D'Antoni shooting lights out.....I see us as a 45-50 Win team during the REGULAR SEASON

However, whether Kobe regains his form or not and Nash and Gasol end up with another injury-ridden season, I could potentially see us challenging Charlotte, Orlando, Tankadelphia and the likes.

Big market teams will never tank because they can always grab anyone to take over. It's only small market teams like Cleveland that will tank.

BlahaTRUTH
07-10-2013, 12:47 AM
Philly is about to put on a clinic in tanking. Meanwhile, they've likely assembled the best Front Office in basketball, hands down. They should head into next season with Noel, MCW, top 5 pick (their own), potentially still a lottery pick in Pelicans pick. 25-30 mil in cap space, and like an empty roster aside from that. They can decide what to go with Turner and Thad Young after having a good look featuring them this season and then reevaluate. They struck out on Bynum, and now are about to totally rebuild in a season. Making what the Magic did/are doing look like amateur hour (mean that as still a copliment to ORL).

Magic, yea, year two of the rebuild. Things are going well. Oladipo and some assests. One more good draft and a big trade away from being relevant again. Houston EAST basically.

I'm interested to see what UTAH does. It could go either way there... If their young talent puts it all together that team could be a great league pass team to watch maybe make a playoff run. Odds are they are likely going to suck, but, it will be a good showcase. Their starting five is Burke/Burkes/Gordon/Favors/Kanter. I'm excited to watch that!

PHX, even with the Bledsoe trade that team is garbage, tank mode for sure. Hopefully soon they can get a blue-chipper to pair with Bledsoe and begin rebuilding.

Kings, aren't they always tanking? Maybe this is finally the year they all stop being headcases?

Bobcats I think are trying to make a push into the playoffs. What's scary is that Big Al couldn't drag a better UTA team there, not sure, he can take the bobcats. If they add Monta it could be intersting. If MKG takes the leap, team could be fun to watch. Likely should be tanking still, but, are irrational going other direction.

Toronto, they should tank, but, they won't. Team roster is a mess. Lowry/Derozen/Gay/Amir/JV? Not a playoff team, but, not bad enough to get a blue-chipper. Gross. I hope Masai blows this team up and tries to get rid of the cloud of horribleness Colangelo left hanging around. They have great fans, shame, their franchise has been so terribly managed up until now.

Celtics. I think if that team is around .500 or slightly worse, they could end up making a run into the playoffs. Rondo(healthy)/Bradley/Green/Wallace/Hump isn't terrible. They got some decent depth too, and some of their draft picks are looking good. I think everyone expects tank from the celtics and they may try too, but, I think this team can overachieve.

Most other teams in the league seem to be on a clear upward trajectory. That is exciting. I'm sure a few teams come All-star break will be in full tank mode that we didn't expect. However, I think it's great for basketball that so many teams seem to be on the rise again like the Wizards, Pistons, Cavs, and so many others. I excited for this season and the race for the playoffs between a lot of these teams climbing up from the basement. I can't really embrace tank nation til halfway point ha.

BHF
07-10-2013, 01:14 AM
idk what you are talking about but Lowry/Derozen/Gay/Amir/JV is easily a playoff team its the bench that needs to improve.

THE MTL
07-10-2013, 01:16 AM
Why does everyone think raptors are tanking? If they had started the season with rudy gay then they might have made the playoffs. They got rid of 2 players calderon/bargnani who they been trying to lose for years

BHF
07-10-2013, 01:21 AM
Why does everyone think raptors are tanking? If they had started the season with rudy gay then they might have made the playoffs. They got rid of 2 players calderon/bargnani who they been trying to lose for years

these 2 players alone are the reason why Raptors sucked on defense not the best defensive coach in the world could have done anything with these 2 scrubs, not to mention both of them started for us the last 4-5 years lol