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View Full Version : NBA All-time Redraft: (2) San Diego VS (7) Sao Paulo



The_Jamal
06-21-2013, 08:23 PM
Disclaimer: Hello Everyone. Welcome to the NBA All-time redraft playoffs. These will be a battle between two made up teams from our host of GMís in to see who reigns superiority over all of basketball. There is a slight twist in this All-time: each team has a starter from each decade. Please read the write-ups and vote for who you think would win in a 7 game series.
San Diego has HCA


Depth Chart:

PG: Tony Parker - 00s (32)/Norm Van Lier 70s (16)/Baron Davis - 00s (0)
SG: Reggie Miller - 90s(38)/ Hal Greer - 50s/60s (10)
SF: James Worthy - 80s (34)/ Caron Butler - 00s(14) /Dennis Scott 90s (0)
PF: Dan Issel - 70s (34)/Terry Cummings 80s (14)
C: Wilt Chamberlain - 60s (38)/ Brad Daugherty - 90s (10)

The usual pleasantries require me to congratulate MHC and Hawkeye for making it this far and to remind you guys that their playoff run ends here. I have a lot of respect for the opposing GMsí NBA knowledge, but there is a reason that we are the 2 seed and they are the 7 seed. We simply have too much firepower for Sao Paolo to handle. Letís outline the matchup:

PG: Tony Parker vs. Chauncey Billups
Tony Parker has elevated his game to a new level in the past few years, and weíre seeing it on display in these NBA Finals. Whether he is making absurd layups or hitting clutch game winners, Parker has asserted himself as an elite point guard in the NBA. His ability to make plays via penetration and dishing sets the table for our whole team. Parker is one of the quickest PGs in the game and will give Billups trouble on every play. When the defense is forced to collapse on Parker, guys like Reggie Miller and Dan Issel will have easy open looks on the perimeter. Billups is a great PG in his own right and will give Parker some trouble of his own, but we think this matchup is a wash at the very least.

SG: Reggie Miller vs. Marques Johnson
Reggie is undoubtedly one of the best shooters of all time, taking almost six 3s per game and making 42% of them in his prime. He will provide our offense with excellent floor spacing and driving lanes for Parker and Worthy. If you collapse on Parker as he is driving to the basket and leave Reggie open he will bury it with deadly accuracy. Sao Paolo will have to pick their poison on defense, as there is no way they can D up all of our weapons. Marques Johnson is a decent player that Iíve had in an All-Time Redraft before, but he is playing out of position at SG and does not have the ability to stick to Reggie.

SF: James Worthy vs. Larry Bird
Worthy earned his nickname ďBig Game JamesĒ for a reason, known for his huge playoff performances against teams like Bird's Celtics. He is a versatile force on offense, with the ability to post up, drive, finish at the basket, and shoot mid-range. Worthy is also considered an underrated defender, and there is no question that he will be dogging Bird all game long. Although Bird canít be stopped completely, we believe that these guys will have their hands full with each other.

PF: Dan Issel vs. Willis Reed
Issel played in the NBA from '77-'85 with Denver, averaging 21-23 points and 9-10 rebounds per game in his prime and helping lead his team deep into the playoffs on multiple occasions. He will be vital to the floor spacing of our team as he does most of his work on the perimeter. Drawing Reed out of the paint will allow Wilt more room to operate and dominate. Even though Reed is a bigger name than Issel, this is a pretty even matchup both statistically and physically (both are listed at 6'9'' 235 lbs).

C: Wilt Chamberlain vs. Rik Smits/Yao Ming
Our bread and butter. We took Wilt 3rd overall because we knew that he could be the foundation for our whole team to be built on. Once we picked Wilt, it became about putting the right pieces around him. We feel like we executed this plan to perfection by adding a playmaking PG in Parker, elite shooters and spacers in Miller and Issel, and a versatile threat in Worthy. Those four players are difficult to handle in their own right, but when you also have to factor in one of the most legendarily dominant players in NBA history, it becomes impossible. Wilt will absolutely eviscerate and bully Smits and Ming in the paint. Sao Paolo canít even afford to double him because it would leave one of our other options wide open.

Benches: Van Lier/Greer/Butler/Cummings/Daugherty vs. Curry/Harper/Schrempf /Mason/Yao
None of these guys are going to realistically decide the series, so Iíll just talk about how we wanted to build our bench. We lucked into three guys who should be starters in this game in Greer, Cummings, and Daugherty. We love Van Lier and Butlerís defense and think that they complement our starting five very nicely. Sao Paolo has a solid bench too, but I donít think either of us has a very significant advantage.
Why weíll win:

Picture an ideal basketball team. They would have a distributing point guard, shooters, penetrators, and a dominant force under the basket. They would have a scoring threat at every position from 1-5. They would have beautiful spacing and ball movement. They would have pesky defenders on the perimeter and a rim protector inside.

San Diego meets every one of these conditions. On defense, we will have Wilt protect the paint and have Worthy match up on Bird. In addition, I truly believe that we have the most balanced and effective offense of any team in this redraft and that Sao Paolo has no chance to stop us. San Diego in 5.





Sao Paulo Write-up:

PG: Chauncey Billups (35) - Steph Curry (13)
SG: Marques Johnson (32) - Ron Harper (10) - Steph Curry (6)
SF: Larry Bird (28) - Detlef Schrempf (20)
PF: Willis Reed (35) - Larry Bird (10) Anthony Mason (3)
C: Rik Smits (14) - Yao Ming (34)

Congrats to San Diego for Making the playoffs

Preface: Our team is built to space any possible defense out, and has shooters, ball handlers, and passers. We can hit from anywhere on the floor, position by position. We can stretch the defense at any position, have documented clutch players, and we have a ton of size to combat the huge names at center in our conference.

Offense: We will employ a system that will include moving the ball as fast as possible to get the defense moving. With the strength of our ball handlers, and passers, we will force the issue with making the defense make reactionary rotations, which will set them up for failure.

PG: Billups is tasked with slowing Parker. He has the size to not allow bump and run, and is as smart as they come, with a 3 year peak making 2 all defensive teams for a tough Pistons team. As crafty as Parker is, he runs into a player who can match his wits, with more physical strength. And lets not forget we have 7-4+ waiting at the rim. Curry against VL or Baron is just going to wear them out with his movement and range. Our offensive philosophy will allow Curry to get open looks, and anyone who watched this season knows that is not good for the opposing team.

SG: Marques Johnson is a player from the old days, that just fits modern basketball. Size, physicality, ability to live in the midrange, play defense, and will give Reggie fits on the offensive side of the ball. Our defense has big enough guards to switch on picks to offset Millers movement. And quite frankly, Reggie Miller is one of the more overrated players in recent history. Marques's size and specific skill set nearly offset the advantage their one sniper has. Off the bench, we send a 3 year peak Ron Harper that many thought was the next great SG before his injuries. Our SG strength, for a 3 year window, is simply stronger, both statistically and on the eyes.

SF: Larry Bird. James Worthy. They fought many times in the finals. Larry Bird is a 3 time MVP, 2 time Finals MVP, who Worthy simply wouldn't be able to guard on the perimeter. We will force the team to go to their bench to a peak Butler, who has the only chance possible to slow Bird, and even then, not happening. This is our biggest matchup win, when you consider we also bring the German off the bench, who has range and will absolutely pummel the bench defense he sees from San Diego. Too big, too strong. Detlef can also stage in defensively against Issel or Cunningham for periods of time.

PF: Reed continues our goal of putting floor stretchers at every position. His 3 year peak included leading the league in win shares and WS/48, while winning the MVP. He also secured a finals MVP, and can play either frontcourt position. While Issel is a great player, he would struggle to meet the rotation needs to stop our team, and would get caught up chasing, which kills what he did well. Cummings is seeing Bird much of the time, with the occasional Mason, and while his midrange craftiness is tough to stop, as long as we hold him out of the lane (no problem with two of the biggest centers ever), you limit his ability to score.

C: Smits starts, Yao finishes. We plan on bringing Yao off the bench early, and utilizing him for the majority of the game. His floor spacing, and paint protection numbers will keep perimeter players out of the lane, and while Wilt is a ridiculous player and this is the one matchup they win, imagine having a better option to slow Wilt than having a 7'4"/7'5" center combo to run at him.


Our defense will be a switching defense, with size at every position, our offense moves the ball with minimal to no isolations. Shooters galore, get the defense moving, rebound on the defensive end, and force San Diego to shoot long jumpers.

We win.

The_Jamal
06-21-2013, 10:44 PM
Interesting match-up. Sao Paulo has some nice advantages (Bird over Worthy, Billups defending Parker), but Im not sure it's enough to overcome the offense of SD. I also would have liked to see Reed get some time on Wilt.

Mile High Champ
06-22-2013, 01:12 AM
I actually would argue we take 3 of the match ups comfortably. Reed and Bird have serious edges over their coiner parts while Wilt is the I my true advantage for SD.

PatsSoxKnicks
06-22-2013, 01:13 AM
Interesting matchup. I'll wait to hear more from both GMs. Could go either way right now I think.

PatsSoxKnicks
06-22-2013, 01:36 AM
Did MHC just call Reggie Miller overrated? I wholeheartedly agree. :cheers:

Looking at this matchup more and more, I am starting to lean towards Sao Paulo. Like their team, not sure how they're a 7 seed to be honest.

SD has great spacing for sure but I think Sao Paulo might have even better spacing. And I think with Bird and Billups, they have better perimeter defenders. The big issue is Wilt obviously. Yao has a ton of size, still not sure that he'd stop Wilt though. A lot of the other matchups I like for Sao Paulo though.

Hawkeye15
06-22-2013, 01:50 AM
I called Reggie overrated. Beat him up with contact and we can switch defenders while he makes his way around the perimeter. Take away his jumper, and he is an average player. One of the more overrated stars of the past 3 decades imo.

PatsSoxKnicks
06-22-2013, 01:56 AM
I called Reggie overrated. Beat him up with contact and we can switch defenders while he makes his way around the perimeter. Take away his jumper, and he is an average player. One of the more overrated stars of the past 3 decades imo.

Agreed. Admittedly I'm biased against Reggie cause I just don't like him but I still think he's overrated. 1 trick pony.

PhillyLuver
06-22-2013, 03:51 AM
I actually would argue we take 3 of the match ups comfortably. Reed and Bird have serious edges over their coiner parts while Wilt is the I my true advantage for SD.

Okay, I'll give you advantages with Reed and Bird, but I don't seriously believe that you think Billups is comfortably better than Parker, which is what I think you are implying. They have different skill sets, but I don't think you can argue one is significantly better than the other.

PhillyLuver
06-22-2013, 01:36 PM
Can we get some more votes, please? Nothing in Sao Paolo's writeup convinces me even a little that their less talented, lower seeded team would beat ours, so I am surprised to see it tied up. Would like to remind literally every GM besides one who ranked me ahead of Sao Paolo to vote.

The_Jamal
06-22-2013, 02:11 PM
Sao Paulo has some good match-ups, but it's not enough to overcome the SD offense. Plus, I don't think Wilt has much of a problem with Smits and Yao. SD in 6

The_Jamal
06-22-2013, 02:19 PM
SD isn't asking Reggie to be a lead option. They're asking him to do what he does best (elite shooting, and being an incredible off-ball scorer). TP+Wilt+Worthy will take of creating aspect. Personally, I think Reggie has a HUGE series with how much attention those 3 attract.

roshan3ai
06-22-2013, 02:29 PM
I just see no answer for Wilt

greg_ory_2005
06-22-2013, 03:00 PM
I'll give SD the edge

Hawkeye15
06-22-2013, 03:07 PM
6'9",6'9", 7'4",7'5" across the front line with good perimeter defenders that will not allow system entrance passes and with our defensive scheme to get back and not worry about crashing the offensive glass and instead limiting transition poimts, Wilt won't be able to get deep catches as often as many think. I seriously don't see how SD stops our offense either. We are going to steer away from isolations, instead getting them moving. Wilt and co are going to be forced out if their comfort zone, and our bigs can shhot and hit cutters behind their scattering defense. They can't stop our shooters, and the majority of their perimeter players are easily neutralized with pick and pops. Our extended shhoting ability, with playmaking at every position, would be too much.

ManRam
06-22-2013, 04:41 PM
Yao vs. Wilt would be such an interesting and weird sight to behold.

I really wanna go with the upset. I agree with most everything Hawk said, but I think Wilt would end up being the difference, and that they have enough offense to survive Bird.

PatsSoxKnicks
06-22-2013, 04:48 PM
SD isn't asking Reggie to be a lead option. They're asking him to do what he does best (elite shooting, and being an incredible off-ball scorer). TP+Wilt+Worthy will take of creating aspect. Personally, I think Reggie has a HUGE series with how much attention those 3 attract.

But SP has the defenders to matchup with Bird and Billups, not to mention that Billups and Bird will both make TP and Worthy play defense as well. There's also the Reed vs. Issel matchup.

Also, why is it a one way street? What about SD defending Sao Paulo. I feel like I haven't heard enough about that. I really like the way SP's offense meshes itself and I'm not sure SD has the D to really stop it. I do wonder if Bird is being a bit underrated.


I just see no answer for Wilt

Yeah I mean obviously this is huge. I'm not convinced that Yao/Smits could stop Wilt either but I basically like the matchups for SP at the other 4 positions or in the case of TP-Billups, it's at least a draw.

NYMetros
06-22-2013, 05:12 PM
Our defense will be a switching defense, with size at every position, our offense moves the ball with minimal to no isolations.

Not sure how well that would work out for SP, there'd be mismatches everywhere. For example, Parker high screen and roll with Wilt, Billups switches on to Wilt, Wilt posts up, entry pass, they then have to double Wilt since billups switched onto him, Wilt passes to an open man, and then SP is chasing the ball. With capable shooters in Issel and Miller and an accomplished slasher in Worthy, we'd get a ton of high percentage shots. Plus, a switching defense make it much harder to rebound, so we'll probably be getting lots of 2nd chance opportunities.

Sadds The Gr8
06-22-2013, 05:41 PM
I didn't realize that SD didn't have much perimeter D...they have Van Lier off the bench but that's it...

PatsSoxKnicks
06-22-2013, 05:46 PM
I didn't realize that SD didn't have much perimeter D...they have Van Lier off the bench but that's it...

Yeah and as awesome as he is, he's a PG who is 6-1. So while he could provide some D on Billups, I wonder how much use he'd be for Sau Paulo's wings. I would've liked to hear more about him though.

Chronz
06-22-2013, 06:31 PM
Why are people hating on Yao's individual defense? If you can check Shaq 1 on 1, you can check a more finesse version of him.

Hawkeye15
06-23-2013, 01:59 AM
Seriously, are people really saying that Wilt would just be Wilt against Yao, who was able to sustain success guarding Shaq? And SD's attempt to guard our high amount of shooters, passers, and ball handlers is being neglected. I feel people are bading this off seeds, while not realizing we took a hit in the voting for making a legal move that gave us a dominant center late that we simply bring off the bench.

Our offense is potent, can score in any way possible, will cause matchup problems all over the floor, and has closers. Our perimeter defense is not letting Wilt get easy catches, and Yao is more than capable of checking Wilt for enough portion of the game that our superior team outside that span a lead.

Mr. Baller
06-23-2013, 11:32 AM
Official count is 12-7 due to bloomis being under 100

Mile High Champ
06-23-2013, 12:34 PM
Honestly, I don't get why SD is up right now. Yes I am biased but Yao on Wilt is a good match up. Wilt relied on his unusual length and size when he played. Now he goes up against an all-star center in Yao whose 7'6 and he dominates. Don't understand that one bit.

Mile High Champ
06-23-2013, 12:35 PM
Why are people hating on Yao's individual defense? If you can check Shaq 1 on 1, you can check a more finesse version of him.

Makes no sense what so ever. But again, people see a name and its over. Yao was a very good post defender and his size alone would make Wilt rethink a lot of his shots.

Hawkeye15
06-23-2013, 07:15 PM
very surprised that one name trumps everything, when we clearly presented an option to slow Wilt. Yao has neutralized Shaq. Why wouldn't he be able to do the same with Wilt? Furthermore, our perimeter is just simply better from top to bottom, when you factor in the type of offense and defense we will employ.

Hawkeye15
06-23-2013, 07:17 PM
Not sure how well that would work out for SP, there'd be mismatches everywhere. For example, Parker high screen and roll with Wilt, Billups switches on to Wilt, Wilt posts up, entry pass, they then have to double Wilt since billups switched onto him, Wilt passes to an open man, and then SP is chasing the ball. With capable shooters in Issel and Miller and an accomplished slasher in Worthy, we'd get a ton of high percentage shots. Plus, a switching defense make it much harder to rebound, so we'll probably be getting lots of 2nd chance opportunities.

obviously you don't just do a flat switch on a PnR with PG/C, you force over the top and rotate. It's not that difficult considering Wilt wasn't a PnR player, and wouldn't be utilized that way by SD.

PatsSoxKnicks
06-23-2013, 07:35 PM
very surprised that one name trumps everything, when we clearly presented an option to slow Wilt. Yao has neutralized Shaq. Why wouldn't he be able to do the same with Wilt? Furthermore, our perimeter is just simply better from top to bottom, when you factor in the type of offense and defense we will employ.

For me, even if I assumed Wilt would go off, I thought you had an advantage at the other 4 positions which was enough for me to vote for you. Thought you matched up well vs. San Diego. I do wonder if Smits starting hurt you. Also, I don't think enough people gave you credit for your offense vs. San Diego's D.

Hawkeye15
06-23-2013, 07:38 PM
For me, even if I assumed Wilt would go off, I thought you had an advantage at the other 4 positions which was enough for me to vote for you. Thought you matched up well vs. San Diego. I do wonder if Smits starting hurt you. Also, I don't think enough people gave you credit for your offense vs. San Diego's D.

our offense would score with no problem. Look at the shootings, ball handling, and passing versatility across our roster. You are not stopping them from scoring.

Chronz
06-23-2013, 07:49 PM
I think the strat of getting Yao was brilliant (its why I ranked the team highly), but you also have to deal with the consequence of his popularity on the boards. While he was a great player, he has some pretty big stigmas against him.

Still the biggest problem Yao had was defending sweet shooting bigs, particularly if they could PnP.
Yao was woefully unsuited for the task of hedging and recovering on a guy who could space him out or put it on the deck. Wilt cant do that.

Come to think about it, are there even alot of PnR oriented teams? I feel like the Nash team I just eliminated was one that would have manhandled you offensively.

Chronz
06-23-2013, 07:57 PM
Reggie may be overrated, but to have a player who is so singularly dominant at shooting is a benefit to EVERY offense. Hes a peripheral player here, not the main option. The only weakness you can go to is his frailness defensively.

Hawkeye15
06-23-2013, 08:34 PM
Reggie may be overrated, but to have a player who is so singularly dominant at shooting is a benefit to EVERY offense. Hes a peripheral player here, not the main option. The only weakness you can go to is his frailness defensively.

sure, you make sure and not leave him open, but the defense is capable of keeping size and speed on him in this situation. He is the last guy you leave open. But how else he is hurting you, when he is also playing the lions share of minutes?

Chronz
06-23-2013, 10:15 PM
sure, you make sure and not leave him open, but the defense is capable of keeping size and speed on him in this situation. He is the last guy you leave open. But how else he is hurting you, when he is also playing the lions share of minutes?
At the same time, hes not exactly Danny Green here. Reggie didn't score like he did because teams left him open, hes among the best at moving without the ball to get free. Even the best of defenses are going to give Reggie some 3's. If you completely focus to taking him away then you have to be giving up something elsewhere.

Hawkeye15
06-23-2013, 10:16 PM
At the same time, hes not exactly Danny Green here. Reggie didn't score like he did because teams left him open, hes among the best at moving without the ball to get free. Even the best of defenses are going to give Reggie some 3's. If you completely focus to taking him away then you have to be giving up something elsewhere.

no need to focus on stopping him entirely. They have usage players that will limit his opportunities despite movement.