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View Full Version : NBA All-time Redraft: Vancouver (1) VS Jacksonville (8)



PatsSoxKnicks
06-19-2013, 11:34 PM
Disclaimer: Hello Everyone. Welcome to the NBA All-time redraft playoffs. These will be a battle between two made up teams from our host of GM’s in to see who reigns superiority over all of basketball. There is a slight twist in this All-time: each team has a starter from each decade. Please read the write-ups and vote for who you think would win in a 7 game series.
Vancouver has HCA


C: Moses Malone (40) | Larry Nance (8) | Jeff Ruland
PF: Shawn Kemp (35) | Larry Nance (13) | Kermit Washington
SF: Dale Ellis (31) | Paul George (10) | Michael Finley (7)
SG: Dwyane Wade (39) | Michael Finley (9)
PG: Lenny Wilkens (30) | Gilbert Arenas (18) | Darrell Armstrong


C: Moses Malone: 27.8 PPG | 14.9 RPG | 6.2 ORB | 1.8 BPG | 58% TS% | .222 WS/48 | 4x All-NBA 1st Team | 3x NBA MVP
PF: Shawn Kemp: 18.8 PPG | 11.0 RPG | 3.8 ORB | 1.7 BPG | 61.1% TS% | .204 WS/48 | 3x All-NBA 2nd Team
SF: Dale Ellis: 26.1 PPG | 4.7 RPG | 2.5 APG | 1.2 SPG | 42.4% 3P% | 58.3% TS% | .154 WS/48 | 1x All-NBA 3rd team
SG: Dwyane Wade: 27.5 PPG | 6.2 APG | 5.2 RPG | 1.2 BPG | 1.8 SPG | 57.2% TS% | .225 WS/48 | 2x All-NBA 1st Team | 3x All-Defensive 2nd Team | Finals MVP
PG: Lenny Wilkens: 18.5 PPG | 9.3 APG | 4.6 RPG | 52.3% TS% | .115 WS/48 | 2x Leader in Assists

PF/C: Larry Nance: 20.6 PPG | 8.7 PPG | 2.1 BPG | 3.3 APG | 60.4% TS% | .172 WS/48 | 1x All-Defensive 1st Team
PG: Gilbert Arenas: 27.7 PPG | 5.7 APG | 4.3 RPG | 1.9 SPG | 36.1% 3P% | 57% TS% | .180 WS/48 | 1x All-NBA 2nd Team
C: Jeff Ruland: 18.6 PPG | 10.8 RPG | 0.9 BPG | 61.7% TS% | .160 WS/48 | 1x All-Star
SG|SF: Paul George: 12.9 PPG | 5.8 RPG | 2.7 APG | 35.8% 3P% | 54% TS% | .135 WS/48 | 1x All-Defensive 2nd Team | 1x All-NBA 3rd Team
SG: Michael Finley: 21.6 PPG | 5.6 RPG | 4.4 APG | 1.3 SPG | 36.2% 3P% | 52.4% TS% | .115 WS/48 | 2x All-Star

I’d like to start off by saying congrats to NYK for making it to the playoffs. You did a nice job, but I just cannot see you winning this matchup. Vancouver has too much talent to overcome for Jacksonville. Featuring at center, Moses Malone provides an elite presence down low on both ends. Moses in his prime dominated Kareem in the finals and was an All-NBA and All-Defensive 1st team member. The guy did it all. To compliment Malone in the post, we have superstar SG Dwyane Wade. Dwyane in his prime was one of the best penetrators in the game while playing phenomenal defense and feeding his teammates. These two are the leaders of this team, and arguably the best duo in this game. At PF, we are starting one of the most athletic and fun players to play the 4 spot, Shawn Kemp. Kemp provides great help defense, uber-efficient scoring, phenomenal rebounding, and insane athleticism. Between Wade, Moses, and Kemp, the help defense will be swarming. At PG running the offense is Lenny Wilkens. Wilkens was one of the best distributors of his time and was phenomenal at getting his teammates involved (2x leader in assists). To cap it off, Dale Ellis is starting at small forward. Ellis is an extremely efficient scorer that can absolutely light it up from deep (42% from 3) and is great at moving without the ball. With this star studded starting lineup and a versatile bench, I think Jacksonville would be hard pressed to steal even two games. Now, onto the matchups.

PG Matchup: Lenny Wilkens vs. Walt Frazier
The advantage here is in favor of Jacksonville, but keep in mind that it’s not a big advantage. Wilkens faired pretty well against Frazier in his career matchups, averaging 18.4 PPG in their career matchups. Wilkens will be for the most part running the offense along with Wade. He was the leader in assists twice in his career and could also get to the hole to draw contact and score. The guy is no joke. Frazier has the name value here, but Wilkens should still be able to get his buckets and run the offense effectively. On the defensive end, Wade will be guarding Frazier, and Wilkens will be guarding Lever. Wade will give Frazier fits with his size and length. Wade is the best shot blocking guard to ever play the game and would make it difficult for Vancouver to get into its offense.
Advantage: Jacksonville

SG Matchup: Dwyane Wade vs. Fat Lever
This matchup is largely in favor of Vancouver. Wade in his prime was getting to the line almost ten times a game and could single handedly dominate a game. Lever is a great defender in his own right, but Wade has 50 pounds on him while being one of the greatest finishers in the history of the game. Wade’s post-up game will pose a problem for Lever. Don’t forget about Wade’s midrange game either. The guy was automatic from 15 feet and could even hit the occasional three. With the team assembled, it would be virtually impossible to send help defense also. Ellis is a sniper from deep and Moses Malone and Kemp are great finishers downlow. Should Jacksonville put Scottie Pippen on Wade, foul trouble may be a problem for Pippen. Pippen is one of the best defenders to ever play the game, but this is a classic defense vs. offense matchup. Wade in his prime could not be denied when going to the hoop, and with this squad, it will be hard for help defense to arrive downlow. With Wade on Frazier, Lever will be guarded by Lenny Wilkens. Wilkens was considered a very good defender, and because Wilkens should be able to limit Lever’s production.
Huge Advantage: Vancouver

SF Matchup: Dale Ellis vs. Scottie Pippen
Ellis is a perfect player for this team. He averaged 26 points per game in his prime on 42% shooting from 3 and a TS% of 58%. Ellis was a phenomenal scorer who never really got the right help around him. Should Pippen be guarding Wade, then Ellis will have the size advantage over Lever and would be able to shoot right over him. Either way, Ellis will be spreading the floor effectively for this squad. On the defensive end, Pippen will see some different players including Paul George, Shawn Kemp and Dale Ellis. Pippen isn’t an elite scorer so we don’t see him as a huge problem for this team, although he will probably get his points.
Advantage: Jacksonville

PF Matchup: Shawn Kemp vs. Dave Debusschere
This is a clear advantage for Vancouver. Kemp’s athleticism poses a huge problem for DeBusschere, a 6-6 guy who played SF for a good portion of his career. Kemp sported an absurd TS% of 60% in his prime and was one of the most electric players in the game. His ability to run the pick and roll, play great defense and rebound with the best of them makes him a nightmare matchup for Jacksonville. DeBusschere doesn’t have the size or offensive skill to match up with Shawn Kemp. Kemp is a great team defender and is going to be a huge factor regarding blocked shots and altered shots near the rim. Advantage: Vancouver

C Matchup: Moses Malone vs. Marcus Camby
This is the game over matchup. Malone will not even be hindered in this matchup. Averaging 28 PPG, 15 RPG, 6.2 ORB, and 1.8 BPG in his prime, Moses is unquestionably a top 6 center of all time and a dominant force on both ends of the court. Malone will have a field day with Camby offensively, and Jacksonville knows that Malone will have a hard time even being limited in this series. Moreover, Camby is almost a non-threat on offense. This allows for Malone to step in to deter penetrators. Another huge issue for Camby will be grabbing boards. Malone averaged an absurd 6.2 offensive boards per game and this stat holds up against some of the greatest centers of all time. Imagine him going against Camby? Domination.
Monstrous Advantage: Vancouver

Bench: Nance/Arenas/Finley/George vs. Richardson/O’Neal/Love/Coleman/Miller
Off the bench, Nance and Arenas will be key pieces. Nance was an all-defensive member who could score 20 PPG on great efficiency while grabbing 9 boards per game and deterring 2 shots per game. He could easily be a starter in this game. Arenas in his prime was a straight up scorer. Off the bench, he provides a huge sparkplug that can get hot at any time, and can light it up from three. Michael Finley was a very solid floor spacer and scorer who could score in a variety of ways and also play good defense. Paul George provides a defensive specialist for the longer wings. He has the ability to defend most guards and forwards in this league with his length and quickness. As for their bench, Richardson is a good defender and distributor but he’s another guy that struggled with efficiency. Same goes for Jermaine O’Neal. It’s also hard to imagine that guys like Coleman, Dawkins, Harper and Mike Miller are making an impact in a game, let alone a series, playing less than 5 minutes.

This matchup is pretty clear cut. Jacksonville lacks a post presence and a number one option, while having no answer for Moses Malone. They are also playing an absurd rotation, going 12 deep. With Home Court Advantage, the two best players in this series, and good surrounding pieces and options, Vancouver takes this series in 5.


Depth Chart

Point Guards
Walt Frazier (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/f/fraziwa01.html) 32 minutes
Michael Ray Richardson (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/r/richami01.html) 10 minutes
Fat Lever (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/l/leverfa01.html) 3 minutes
Derek Harper (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/h/harpede01.html) 3 minutes


Shooting Guards
Fat Lever (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/l/leverfa01.html) 29 minutes
Michael Ray Richardson (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/r/richami01.html) 11 minutes
Mike Miller (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/m/millemi01.html) 5 minutes
Scottie Pippen (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/p/pippesc01.html) 3 minutes


Small Forwards
Scottie Pippen (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/p/pippesc01.html) 30minutes
Bob Love (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/l/lovebo01.html) 10 minutes
Dave DeBusschere (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/d/debusda01.html) 8 minutes


Power Forwards
Dave DeBusschere (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/d/debusda01.html) 22 minutes
Jermaine O'Neal (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/o/onealje01.html) 18 minutes
Derrick Coleman (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/c/colemde01.html) 6 minutes
Bob Love (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/l/lovebo01.html) 2 minutes


Centers
Marcus Camby (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/c/cambyma01.html) 33 minutes
Jermaine O'Neal (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/o/onealje01.html) 10 minutes
Darryl Dawkins ("http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/d/dawkida01.html') 5 minutes


My defensive scheme:

Walt Frazier on Dwayne Wade (Frazier was one of the best defensive guards of all time)
Fat Lever on Lenny Wilkens
Scottie Pippen on Shawn Kemp (reducing his impact dramatically)
Dave DeBusschere on Dale Ellis (making him a non-factor offensively, think Rodman-esque type of D)
Marcus Camby on Moses Malone.

There's no way Vancouver wins this in 5. It's a 7 game series and please learn more about the whole rosters before voting.


While there's no real answer for Moses, my superior defense will make half the Vancouver team a non-factor offensively. If you can't go over 80, you can't beat my team. And Moses can't really score over 35 points consistently against my team.

Going 12 deep is a good sign because my team is all about TEAM. Not having a "first option" being a factor is absurd. I have 4 players who can go 25 PPG and no one really is a below 10 PPG player. And all of my players are excellent defenders. Vancouver's D is around Moses and Lenny. Frazier can kill Lenny and Moses'd D on Camby won't matter as I don't expect more than 15 ppg from my center position.
I'd love to watch Kemp chase DeBusschere at the 3 point line where he'd pull some of his long range shots which helped the Knicks win two championships.

And when Michael Ray Richardson gets on the court, it's RUN-TIME. Vancouver can't keep up with my bench's pace.

NYKalltheway
06-20-2013, 12:24 AM
I thought I had one more day for the write up, was gonna do it today :/

Just put my last minute post below on the top please :D

NYKalltheway
06-20-2013, 12:26 AM
My defensive scheme:

Walt Frazier on Dwayne Wade (Frazier was one of the best defensive guards of all time)
Fat Lever on Lenny Wilkens
Scottie Pippen on Shawn Kemp (reducing his impact dramatically)
Dave DeBusschere on Dale Ellis (making him a non-factor offensively, think Rodman-esque type of D)
Marcus Camby on Moses Malone.

There's no way Vancouver wins this in 5. It's a 7 game series and please learn more about the whole rosters before voting.


While there's no real answer for Moses, my superior defense will make half the Vancouver team a non-factor offensively. If you can't go over 80, you can't beat my team. And Moses can't really score over 35 points consistently against my team.

Going 12 deep is a good sign because my team is all about TEAM. Not having a "first option" being a factor is absurd. I have 4 players who can go 25 PPG and no one really is a below 10 PPG player. And all of my players are excellent defenders. Vancouver's D is around Moses and Lenny. Frazier can kill Lenny and Moses'd D on Camby won't matter as I don't expect more than 15 ppg from my center position.
I'd love to watch Kemp chase DeBusschere at the 3 point line where he'd pull some of his long range shots which helped the Knicks win two championships.

And when Michael Ray Richardson gets on the court, it's RUN-TIME. Vancouver can't keep up with my bench's pace.

Chronz
06-20-2013, 01:56 AM
Centers who are light of build are swallowed by the brute that is Moses. Camby was a DPOY on the strength of his help defense, and even then there are hints that he was overrated. Regardless, when Denver played any post player worth his chops (like say Duncan in the playoffs) they put Nene on him because of Camby's shortcomings 1 on 1.

Its really unfortunate you didn't take my advice of starting Jermaine, hes much stronger on the blocks and was a vastly superior 2-way player. I know you want to get a running game going but its going to be hard to run when the other team is pummeling you inside. I can see Pippen and Frazier having to exhaust alot of energy scrambling to help defensively.

Kemp was a beast PF, can Pippen really check him for a game/series? I do think you have advantages elsewhere, but Kemp and Moses are a good compliment defensively and can contain the interior. Neither may be an otherworldly anchor but both have contributed heavily to elite defenses.

Wilkens and Wade arent a great fit imo but by playing small, both of you will be relying on transition buckets to get them going.

Overall, Im just having trouble visualizing a win against such brutes. Your basically undersized at every position, great defenders can be undersized but not with Camby as the anchor IMO. You need a rugged interior player to compliment the speed and agility you have elsewhere. Camby is simply too finesse.

Raps18-19 Champ
06-20-2013, 02:06 PM
Blowout.

roshan3ai
06-20-2013, 02:50 PM
Yeah I'd respond to the posts if this was closer. Not really a point though.

PatsSoxKnicks
06-20-2013, 04:05 PM
bump

KnicksorBust
06-20-2013, 05:13 PM
I love teams like Jax who can get stops and control the game defensively but Vancouver just has too much firepower and a better mix of talent in my opinion. They are a favorite in this conference.

knicks=love
06-21-2013, 12:18 AM
so this is what tmac feels like..

PatsSoxKnicks
06-21-2013, 04:22 PM
I don't think this should be a shut out