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spreadeagle
06-15-2013, 05:16 PM
Adrian Wojnarowski reports Kevin Garnett would waive his no-trade clause to go to the Clippers if Rivers is named the team's head coach. The deal would send DeAndre Jordan and two first-round picks to the Celtics for Garnett and the right to hire Rivers.

Wojnarowski reports Clippers owner Donald Sterling is prepared to offer Rivers $7 million per year. Rivers was also expected to speak with Chris Paul on Saturday to gauge his interest in re-signing if Garnett and Rivers were to come to Los Angeles.

Wojnarowksi states the final hurdle to a deal is the Clippers willingness to include guard Eric Bledsoe in the trade. http://www.thescore.com/nba/articles/930017-report-garnett-and-rivers-included-in-clippers-trade-talks

ChitownBears22
06-15-2013, 05:17 PM
Do it and cripple the Clippers!

KniCks4LiFe
06-15-2013, 05:21 PM
they need to include Bledsoe for this to be a good deal.

TRF929
06-15-2013, 05:23 PM
Awesome trade for Boston

THE MTL
06-15-2013, 05:24 PM
Most likely celtics would not pick up pierces option and he would join them as well. And yes if I'm the celtics I would demand bledsoe

WickedBadMan
06-15-2013, 05:26 PM
Celtics don't have a lot of leverage if Doc/KG just say they will retire if they don't make the trade.

ChitownBears22
06-15-2013, 05:27 PM
Celtics don't have a lot of leverage if Doc/KG just say they will retire if they don't make the trade.

Neither have said that from what I have seen. Any further insight into this would be great.

NYMetros
06-15-2013, 05:31 PM
honestly though why would the celts want Bledsoe? he's young and talented but we have:
Rondo
Avery Bradley
Courtney Lee under contract for 3 more years
Terry under contract for 2 more years
also still have Jordan crawford locked up for $2 mill next year

talk about a log jam at guard.

YoungOne
06-15-2013, 05:33 PM
honestly though why would the celts want Bledsoe? he's young and talented but we have:
Rondo
Avery Bradley
Courtney Lee under contract for 3 more years
Terry under contract for 2 more years
also still have Jordan crawford locked up for $2 mill next year

talk about a log jam at guard.

getting another asset atleast.

WickedBadMan
06-15-2013, 05:34 PM
Neither have said that from what I have seen. Any further insight into this would be great.

Just speculation with people in the know.

Of course, Ainge driving hard bargain--but if Doc says he'll retire instead, it's between Clipper offer or zip.
-Mark Heisler

Had fun talking Celts on @SeanGrandePBP 's new radio show today. I really think Doc Rivers will leave. If not for Clips, then for TV.
-Bill Simmons

Obviously he can't come out and threaten to retire, he would look like a douche.

mr.awesome
06-15-2013, 05:35 PM
honestly though why would the celts want Bledsoe? he's young and talented but we have:
Rondo
Avery Bradley
Courtney Lee under contract for 3 more years
Terry under contract for 2 more years
also still have Jordan crawford locked up for $2 mill next year

talk about a log jam at guard.
Lee and Terry are locks to be actively discussed in trade talks. They have no use to us going forward so I'd be surprised if at least one of the two weren't a Celtic next year.

Gators123
06-15-2013, 05:35 PM
Do it!

More-Than-Most
06-15-2013, 05:35 PM
honestly though why would the celts want Bledsoe? he's young and talented but we have:
Rondo
Avery Bradley
Courtney Lee under contract for 3 more years
Terry under contract for 2 more years
also still have Jordan crawford locked up for $2 mill next year

talk about a log jam at guard.

Finally trade condo as well?

The Flash
06-15-2013, 05:38 PM
no loyalty talk ?

ChitownBears22
06-15-2013, 05:40 PM
no loyalty talk ?

Not a HEAT thread. Bait somewhere else.

More-Than-Most
06-15-2013, 05:44 PM
no loyalty talk ?

**** some Loyalty. This is a business... If I were an owner I would trade my blood if it would put the team in a better position. Players love to speak about it being a business when it comes to getting their money. 2 way street.

shep33
06-15-2013, 05:57 PM
Good trade for Boston. If they get Bledsoe, that's just a huge failure on the Clips part.

Edit: I think Bledsoe is kind of a given. Those first rounders are likely to be in high 20s picks.

ChitownBears22
06-15-2013, 06:09 PM
Good trade for Boston. If they get Bledsoe, that's just a huge failure on the Clips part.

Edit: I think Bledsoe is kind of a given. Those first rounders are likely to be in high 20s picks.

Why would Boston want Bledsoe? I doubt he is even being talked about anymore. It would be Jordan and picks plus maybe an add in like Barnes.

grandsalami
06-15-2013, 06:09 PM
Marc Stein ‏@ESPNSteinLine56s
Sources tell ESPN that Clips want to keep Bledsoe out of trade with Celtics for KG (and Doc) to be able to put Bledsoe in separate deal
https://twitter.com/...026021939732480

shep33
06-15-2013, 06:14 PM
Why would Boston want Bledsoe? I doubt he is even being talked about anymore. It would be Jordan and picks plus maybe an add in like Barnes.

Bledsoe is a good asset to have. If Rondo gets pissed, keep Bledsoe and trade Rondo. People seem to forget that Rajon Rondo is basically the last guy left on the squad, coming off knee surgery. To go from contending for years to rebuilding (which the Celts will do quickly with these deals) is going to probably not sit well for him

bigsams50
06-15-2013, 06:14 PM
I would rather see KG retire in the Celtic green, but honestly if the C's want to move on, then its for the best.

shep33
06-15-2013, 06:14 PM
Marc Stein ‏@ESPNSteinLine56s
Sources tell ESPN that Clips want to keep Bledsoe out of trade with Celtics for KG (and Doc) to be able to put Bledsoe in separate deal
https://twitter.com/...026021939732480

Interesting

StriveGreatness
06-15-2013, 06:17 PM
Marc Stein ‏@ESPNSteinLine


Among scenarios Clips considering, sources say, is offer of Blake Griffin & Bledsoe in sign-and-trade pitch Lakers for Dwight after July 1

shep33
06-15-2013, 06:17 PM
Among scenarios Clips considering, sources say, is offer of Blake Griffin & Bledsoe in sign-and-trade pitch Lakers for Dwight after July 1

Read more: http://hoopshype.com/twitter/media.html#ixzz2WKGlZdIs

soundjunkies2
06-15-2013, 06:17 PM
Is Doc and an old KG really worth all that? 2 picks, Bledsoe and Jordan?

grandsalami
06-15-2013, 06:18 PM
I thought the LAL cant do a sign and trade due to the CBA and their cap?

shep33
06-15-2013, 06:21 PM
Nash/Bledsoe
Kobe
MWP/Clark
Blake/Jordan Hill
Pau

What's sad is that this team is probably better than last year's squad... still not a contender

shep33
06-15-2013, 06:22 PM
2 things I'm hearing: Celts holding tight for Bledsoe in this Clips deal, and C's trying to dump 1 or 2 contracts in it (Terry and/or Lee).


Read more: http://hoopshype.com/twitter/media.html#ixzz2WKHpnLqQ

Dade County
06-15-2013, 06:25 PM
**** some Loyalty. This is a business... If I were an owner I would trade my blood if it would put the team in a better position. Players love to speak about it being a business when it comes to getting their money. 2 way street.

So fans should look at it the same way, and don't hate on a star player for leaving.


moving on:

I like Jordan as a center, I don't think the clips should be so fast to trade him.

Dade County
06-15-2013, 06:26 PM
is doc and an old kg really worth all that? 2 picks, bledsoe and jordan?

no!

celtNYpatsHeels
06-15-2013, 06:27 PM
honestly though why would the celts want Bledsoe? he's young and talented but we have:
Rondo
Avery Bradley
Courtney Lee under contract for 3 more years
Terry under contract for 2 more years
also still have Jordan crawford locked up for $2 mill next year

talk about a log jam at guard.

Rondo - hurt
Bradey - not a pg
Lee - not a pg
terry - not a pg
Crawford - is terrible

if pierce kg and doc are all gone then id bet on terry being traded to a contender as well

grandsalami
06-15-2013, 06:32 PM
Adrian Wojnarowski ‏@WojYahooNBA 8m
Lakers have fully resisted Clippers overtures on a sign-and-trade for Dwight Howard. "They will never do it," source with knowledge tells Y!

raiderposting
06-15-2013, 06:33 PM
Am I the only one who think the clippers win? its just two 1sts in the 20s, a horrible contract for a decent center, for a top notch coach and a big veteran presence who can help them win in the next two years and if not open up money when he retires.

Wade n Fade
06-15-2013, 06:44 PM
LA is being stupid here. What is the point of taking KG? Doc is a good coach, but there are others around. How about Jerry Sloan? KG is not worth 2 first rounders and Deandre Jordan. Is it the LA mentality to trade for a bunch of bad contracts on aging players? First the Dodgers, now the Clippers. Don't sell the farm just to be contenders for the now. Think about long term stability as well. You just came out of the darkest time in your franchise and don't make it last for like 2-3 yrs.

topdog
06-15-2013, 06:44 PM
Marc Stein ‏@ESPNSteinLine56s
Sources tell ESPN that Clips want to keep Bledsoe out of trade with Celtics for KG (and Doc) to be able to put Bledsoe in separate deal
https://twitter.com/...026021939732480

Word had been that Clippers were talking to Orlando about Butler and Bledsoe for Afflalo as well.

smith&wesson
06-15-2013, 06:48 PM
ive never heard of a coach being traded in my life. this is crazyness. rivers is a top 3 coach in the league. i dont know what boston is thinking.

smith&wesson
06-15-2013, 06:50 PM
also the celtics would have rondo, crawford, terry, bradley, bledsoe ? giving up your hof player and championship caliber coach for a log jam ? i just dont get it.

KingstonHawke
06-15-2013, 06:51 PM
I wouldn't make this deal if I'm the Clippers. Not unless Paul is telling me that he won't re-sign unless I do. And even then, I might try to convince him that we could get better another way. A way that doesn't involve adding players in their mid to upper 30s.

Give Griffin, Jordan, and Bledsoe to the Lakers for Howard and that'll get Paul to stay. Then turn around and use those picks to fill out the team around them. The Hornets would probably take Butler and a 1st for Anderson. And then if Pierce doesn't get his option picked up he'd sign for the mid-level to take a chance at another ring. Right there you have Paul, Crawford, Pierce, Anderson, Howard. That's waaaay better long term than Paul, Crawford, Pierce, Griffin, and Garnett.

And don't anybody be crazy. The Lakers aren't giving up Howard for Bledsoe, Griffin and Butler. They had Butler before and he stunk up the joint.

Agar81
06-15-2013, 06:53 PM
ive never heard of a coach being traded in my life. this is crazyness. rivers is a top 3 coach in the league. i dont know what boston is thinking.

Doc will walk from the Celtics. The only way he's coaching next year is if it's with the Clippers.

grandsalami
06-15-2013, 06:56 PM
RT @BA_Turner: Clippers moving forward w/o Doc Rivers, now prepared to offer job to Brian Shaw or Lionel Hollins next week, sources

https://twitter.com/BA_Turner


DEAD

greg_ory_2005
06-15-2013, 06:58 PM
Wow it's a steal for the Celts if they can get Bledsoe too

shep33
06-15-2013, 07:01 PM
RT @BA_Turner: Clippers moving forward w/o Doc Rivers, now prepared to offer job to Brian Shaw or Lionel Hollins next week, sources

https://twitter.com/BA_Turner


DEAD

Is this dude legit

PraiseJesus
06-15-2013, 07:05 PM
If Celtics Get Bledsoe as well then this deal is WAY in thier favor

YoungOne
06-15-2013, 07:05 PM
so many different rumors, I just wait for the final result..

shep33
06-15-2013, 07:06 PM
The Clippers are insisting on the inclusion of Shav Randolph in any Celtics deal, said nobody's sources ever.

Read more: http://hoopshype.com/twitter/tag/boston_celtics#ixzz2WKSuQ48P

lol

h2r09
06-15-2013, 07:11 PM
Celtics should try to fit in some of their longer contracts and rebuild. However it will be completely useless if they go with VDN as their head coach. That would be a travesty if he gets another job and rondo might just kill him.

Jordan, Butler, Bledsoe for Garnett, Lee, Rivers, Terry. Clippers get closer to winning now while getting rid of a big possibly bad contract in Jordan and the Celtics get a possible star guard to pair with Rondo and Bradley off the bench.

Celtics would be very smart to put A LOT of thought into who they make their next coach. The only reason it didnt blow up in Boston with Rondo is because of Rivers and if they pick a bad coach it will not work with Rondo.

Clippers would be in a very good position to win now.

Paul
Crawford
Butler
Griffin
Garnett

That is a very good all around team if you have a competent coach, not to mention you just got a defensive backbone who is actually capable of playing in crunch time without being a liability. Add a few veterans and that is a contender.

OceanSpray
06-15-2013, 07:11 PM
LAL need Rajon Rondo. Steve Nash is done.

shep33
06-15-2013, 07:20 PM
Seems like this deal isn't happening with all these twitter vibes

shep33
06-15-2013, 07:22 PM
Doc Rivers been informed Clippers won't accept Celtics offer. Rivers prepared to stay in Boston, sources.

Read more: http://hoopshype.com/twitter/media.html#ixzz2WKXA65mO

Take it for what it's worth

OceanSpray
06-15-2013, 07:28 PM
Why doesn't Celtics go after Dwight Howard? Dwight+Rondo is better than whatever they're getting.

h2r09
06-15-2013, 07:30 PM
Why doesn't Celtics go after Dwight Howard? Dwight+Rondo is better than whatever they're getting.

are you aware of a thing called cap space?

bagwell368
06-15-2013, 07:38 PM
ive never heard of a coach being traded in my life. this is crazyness. rivers is a top 3 coach in the league. i dont know what boston is thinking.

Doc is good with vets and guys he's had for a few years. He's men with kids and plain awful with deadline guys.

He's also fatigued with the city, the job, the spectre of a long rebuild, and frickin' Rondo. If he doesn't want to come back you think Boston is wise to retain him? Think again.

Chitownhero1992
06-15-2013, 07:42 PM
Its a nice start for the Celtics to begin rebuilding but they need more 2 late 1sts aren't really going to put them back towards contention.

As for the Clippers this could potentially cripple them, KG is old as hell and whose to say that he doesn't go through another one of his injured seasons....Clippers then lose a young C, 2 1sts for nothing...

Cracka2HI!
06-15-2013, 07:50 PM
Even though there are reports that this dead, I think something will get done. I hope it doesn't involve Pierce and Bledsoe. I'd hope for Pierce to be bought out and sign for the MLE. The Clippers could then turn around and do the Afflalo trade with Orlando.

C Garnett
PF Griffin
SF Pierce
SG Afflalo
PG CP3

SG Crawford

ChitownBears22
06-15-2013, 07:51 PM
Its a nice start for the Celtics to begin rebuilding but they need more 2 late 1sts aren't really going to put them back towards contention.

As for the Clippers this could potentially cripple them, KG is old as hell and whose to say that he doesn't go through another one of his injured seasons....Clippers then lose a young C, 2 1sts for nothing...

Build depth through picks, build key players through FA with caproom

TheNumber37
06-15-2013, 08:04 PM
Wow Clippers make out so well here.

I guess in a seprate deal, they;ll do Bledsoe, Butler and more picks for PP. Or pierce will get Bought out and Sign there?

If KG and Rivers leave Beantown, why would Pierce want to keep playing for a 10th seed team?

OceanSpray
06-15-2013, 08:39 PM
are you aware of a thing called cap space?

And that's why I said Celtics should go after Dwight instead of DeAndre. They can make it happen.

mgsports
06-15-2013, 08:39 PM
Magic and Clippers will only do that Trade if the Magic Draft a SG with 2nd pick. How about Rivers/Garnett/Pierce for 2nd pick,Harkness,Nicholson/O'Quinn and so on other then Lamb or Harris or Starting Center?

tr3ymill3r
06-15-2013, 08:40 PM
Celtics can either buy out Pierce for $5 million or let him play and pay him $15 million. They are going to buy him out and it will be mutual, he will eventually sign a one day contract with Boston to retire as a Celtic. CP3 stays in LA while Dwight goes to Houston.

knicksfan1969
06-15-2013, 08:43 PM
If the Clippers do this deal, they are brain dead.

deaner
06-15-2013, 09:32 PM
What I'm interesting in is the possibility the relationship is strained. Does Doc want out? Will he give his all coaching a team that almost traded him.

shep33
06-15-2013, 09:44 PM
I think one of these teams will cave, and I think it'll be the Clips. CP3 might subtly force this to happen

5ass
06-15-2013, 09:56 PM
Magic and Clippers will only do that Trade if the Magic Draft a SG with 2nd pick. How about Rivers/Garnett/Pierce for 2nd pick,Harkness,Nicholson/O'Quinn and so on other then Lamb or Harris or Starting Center?

How about you stop coming up with trade scenarios ever again.

kobe4thewinbang
06-15-2013, 10:09 PM
LOL! How does Mr. No-Trade Clause/The Big Ticket feel about this?

*Superman*
06-15-2013, 10:14 PM
How about you stop coming up with trade scenarios ever again.

Lol :nod:

Clippersfan86
06-15-2013, 10:35 PM
I think one of these teams will cave, and I think it'll be the Clips. CP3 might subtly force this to happen

Actually doubtful. Hornets DEMANDED Eric Bledsoe and not only did we not include him for CP3 but we almost got away with not including Gordon. Ainge needs the Clippers more than they need him if he wants to rebuild, so it's his loss. We can just as easily flip a Bledsoe package for Afflalo, Granger etc.. and still have assets to trade DJ if need be.

gwrighter
06-15-2013, 10:36 PM
Ring Chasers, I would say no if I was the Clips.

Sportfan
06-15-2013, 10:38 PM
This might be a dumb question, but I heard on ESPN this morning the Celtics haven't given the Clippers permission to interview Doc yet. In that case, how is this whole situation not tampering? He's obviously communicating with the Clippers brass if he told them to keep Bledsoe. idk.

B'sCeltsPatsSox
06-15-2013, 10:39 PM
Actually doubtful. Hornets DEMANDED Eric Bledsoe and not only did we not include him for CP3 but we almost got away with not including Gordon. Ainge needs the Clippers more than they need him if he wants to rebuild, so it's his loss. We can just as easily flip a Bledsoe package for Afflalo, Granger etc.. and still have assets to trade DJ if need be.

The Celtics can still get pieces of value for Pierce and KG.

Sportfan
06-15-2013, 10:42 PM
Actually doubtful. Hornets DEMANDED Eric Bledsoe and not only did we not include him for CP3 but we almost got away with not including Gordon. Ainge needs the Clippers more than they need him if he wants to rebuild, so it's his loss. We can just as easily flip a Bledsoe package for Afflalo, Granger etc.. and still have assets to trade DJ if need be.

wtf is that supposed to mean? the lakers almost got cp3 too. clippers caved in for gordon.

also that's a completely different situation. Bledsoe was a throw in back then behind Gordon and the wolves pick. Bledsoe was pretty much as valuable as Aminu in that trade. Here Bledsoe is the main piece, no way in hell a deal goes down without him. Jordan is negative value by himself and 2 late picks don't help either. It's Bledsoe or bust. Doc and the gang aren't forcing their way out, they have no problem competing in Boston another year, it's just not Ainge's #1 choice, but he's not going to cave in to LAC for an overpaid center who can't play more than half a game

Clippersfan86
06-15-2013, 10:48 PM
The Celtics can still get pieces of value for Pierce and KG.

Like who? Sorry but NOBODY is trading for 15 a mill Pierce, especially when he will be bought out in 2-3 weeks anyways and be available for maybe a fifth of the price. 37 year old KG will retire at MAX in two years, maybe after this year. Hell he hasn't even said he's 100 percent coming back THIS SEASON. Good luck finding a trade partner willing to give you a choice of two, young players with upside and a couple picks for that.

Clippersfan86
06-15-2013, 10:50 PM
wtf is that supposed to mean? the lakers almost got cp3 too. clippers caved in for gordon.

also that's a completely different situation. Bledsoe was a throw in back then behind Gordon and the wolves pick. Bledsoe was pretty much as valuable as Aminu in that trade. Here Bledsoe is the main piece, no way in hell a deal goes down without him. Jordan is negative value by himself and 2 late picks don't help either. It's Bledsoe or bust. Doc and the gang aren't forcing their way out, they have no problem competing in Boston another year, it's just not Ainge's #1 choice, but he's not going to cave in to LAC for an overpaid center who can't play more than half a game

The issue isn't that the Clippers refuse to part with Bledsoe as much as it is... that Ainge is demanding BOTH AND picks. If the package is Bledsoe+fillers+a pick fine... but not both young players. Especially if Boston wants those late 1st rounders which they seem to want more than DJ anyways.

Clippersfan86
06-15-2013, 10:50 PM
wtf is that supposed to mean? the lakers almost got cp3 too. clippers caved in for gordon.

also that's a completely different situation. Bledsoe was a throw in back then behind Gordon and the wolves pick. Bledsoe was pretty much as valuable as Aminu in that trade. Here Bledsoe is the main piece, no way in hell a deal goes down without him. Jordan is negative value by himself and 2 late picks don't help either. It's Bledsoe or bust. Doc and the gang aren't forcing their way out, they have no problem competing in Boston another year, it's just not Ainge's #1 choice, but he's not going to cave in to LAC for an overpaid center who can't play more than half a game

The issue isn't that the Clippers refuse to part with Bledsoe as much as it is... that Ainge is demanding BOTH AND picks. If the package is Bledsoe+fillers+a pick fine... but not both young players. Especially if Boston wants those late 1st rounders which they seem to want more than DJ anyways.

Sportfan
06-15-2013, 10:50 PM
Like who? Sorry but NOBODY is trading for 15 a mill Pierce, especially when he will be bought out in 2-3 weeks anyways and be available for maybe a fifth of the price. 37 year old KG will retire at MAX in two years, maybe after this year. Hell he hasn't even said he's 100 percent coming back THIS SEASON. Good luck finding a trade partner willing to give you a choice of two, young players with upside and a couple picks for that.
you do realize Pierce's contract is an easy way for any team to clear cap space since he can be bought out for 5?

Clippersfan86
06-15-2013, 10:51 PM
This might be a dumb question, but I heard on ESPN this morning the Celtics haven't given the Clippers permission to interview Doc yet. In that case, how is this whole situation not tampering? He's obviously communicating with the Clippers brass if he told them to keep Bledsoe. idk.

The issue isn't that the Clippers refuse to part with Bledsoe as much as it is... that Ainge is demanding BOTH AND picks. If the package is Bledsoe+fillers+a pick fine... but not both young players. Especially if Boston wants those late 1st rounders which they seem to want more than DJ anyways.

Clippersfan86
06-15-2013, 10:51 PM
@Sportfan

The issue isn't that the Clippers refuse to part with Bledsoe as much as it is... that Ainge is demanding BOTH AND picks. If the package is Bledsoe+fillers+a pick fine... but not both young players. Especially if Boston wants those late 1st rounders which they seem to want more than DJ anyways.

PS... your inbox is full so it won't let people quote you.

ThaDubs
06-15-2013, 10:52 PM
I want to see Bledsoe go to a team where he will start.

Sportfan
06-15-2013, 10:55 PM
The issue isn't that the Clippers refuse to part with Bledsoe as much as it is... that Ainge is demanding BOTH AND picks. If the package is Bledsoe+fillers+a pick fine... but not both young players. Especially if Boston wants those late 1st rounders which they seem to want more than DJ anyways.

how did this answer my question of tampering lol

RLundi
06-15-2013, 10:56 PM
are you aware of a thing called cap space?

:laugh2:

Clippersfan86
06-15-2013, 10:57 PM
how did this answer my question of tampering lol

I was talking about you saying they won't do a deal without Bledsoe. Yes it's tampering if Doc Rivers is getting involved in trade talks telling the Clippers to keep Bledsoe, but who's going to prove it to the league?

RLundi
06-15-2013, 10:57 PM
How about you stop coming up with trade scenarios ever again.

Bingo.

kylem4711
06-16-2013, 02:48 PM
Even though there are reports that this dead, I think something will get done. I hope it doesn't involve Pierce and Bledsoe. I'd hope for Pierce to be bought out any sign for the MLE. The Clippers could then turn around and do the Afflalo trade with Orlando.

C Garnett
PF Griffin
SF Pierce
SG Afflalo
PG CP3

SG Crawford

This seems pretty darn realistic. That lineup will have to rely on their bench to make all of the threes though

Chronz
06-16-2013, 03:10 PM
This seems pretty darn realistic. That lineup will have to rely on their bench to make all of the threes though

Explain (the bench part) You dont like the spacing of the starting unit for some reason?

Clippersfan86
06-16-2013, 04:19 PM
Explain

Ramona Shelburne reported that the main reason the Clippers refuse to include Bledsoe is so that they can flip him for Afflalo. Which is why the Clippers plan is...

1. Trade DJ package for KG+Doc.

2. Flip Bledsoe for Afflalo

3. Sign Pierce for MLE when Celtics inevitably cut him in a couple weeks. Rather than taking on his 15 mill a year now. Why trade assets for a guy who wants to join you anyways and will be a free agent soon?

bagwell368
06-16-2013, 04:21 PM
I want to see Bledsoe go to a team where he will start.

If he goes to the Celts he will as soon as Rondo is dealt.

richiesaurus310
06-16-2013, 04:38 PM
Ramona Shelburne reported that the main reason the Clippers refuse to include Bledsoe is so that they can flip him for Afflalo. Which is why the Clippers plan is...

1. Trade DJ package for KG+Doc.

2. Flip Bledsoe for Afflalo

3. Sign Pierce for MLE when Celtics inevitably cut him in a couple weeks. Rather than taking on his 15 mill a year now. Why trade assets for a guy who wants to join you anyways and will be a free agent soon?

This is the Clippers dream scenario other than one that ends with Dwight on the Clippers. I hope it happens, but idk if Boston is gonna budge though.

Clippersfan86
06-16-2013, 04:43 PM
This is the Clippers dream scenario other than one that ends with Dwight on the Clippers. I hope it happens, but idk if Boston is gonna budge though.

Like Eric Pincus just said on Twitter.. Boston needs the Clippers far more than the other way around. NO other team is trying to take on 37 year old KG right now, Pierce.. or pay Doc obscene money to coach. It's Clippers or bust for Boston, not to mention Ainge likes our assets and we have the cap situation to make a number of deals fit.

Chronz
06-16-2013, 05:03 PM
....

My bad, I should have bolded his 3pt claim.

hugepatsfan
06-16-2013, 09:45 PM
Late first round picks are pretty much useless. BOS is better just letting KG retire and having the cap space. Jordan at 10 mil is the type of contract that cripples a rebuilding team. Unless we get Bledsoe back no offer with the Clippers makes sense for us IMO.

hugepatsfan
06-16-2013, 10:07 PM
Like Eric Pincus just said on Twitter.. Boston needs the Clippers far more than the other way around. NO other team is trying to take on 37 year old KG right now, Pierce.. or pay Doc obscene money to coach. It's Clippers or bust for Boston, not to mention Ainge likes our assets and we have the cap situation to make a number of deals fit.

You're forgetting that the Clippers have to make themselves the most championship caliber roster. If BOS holds strong on demanding Bledsoe and the Clippers decline is last year Clippers squad really just swapping Bledsoe for Affalo away from being a legitimate title contender? I don't think so. If BOS forces the Clippers to choose one - KG/Doc or Affalo you guys are better off accepting the Celtics offer. KG/Doc makes you much better over the next 1-2 seasons compared to Affalo and would probably be more appealing to CP3 if he could only pick one. You'd guys have the cap space once KG retires to sign a player as good as Affalo (or even just him as he can opt out of his deal w/ ORL the same year KG's money comes off the books).

shep33
06-16-2013, 10:28 PM
Wrong thread

Vinny642
06-16-2013, 11:45 PM
Why in all hell would the Clippers do this? A coach is whatever, but a center and 2 first rounders for Garnett? Garnett is trash now honestly... him and PP are both meh players at best right now

PraiseJesus
06-17-2013, 12:29 AM
So we are looking a Clipper team consisting of:

CP3/Bledsoe
Billups/Crawford
Pierce/Crawford
Griffin/Barnes
Garnett/Odom

Coached by Doc Rivers

Needs a true C and looks like an old team

hugepatsfan
06-17-2013, 12:49 AM
So we are looking a Clipper team consisting of:

CP3/Bledsoe
Billups/Crawford
Pierce/Crawford
Griffin/Barnes
Garnett/Odom

Coached by Doc Rivers

Needs a true C and looks like an old team

As of now the trade the Clips want to make is Jordan and the #25 pick for KG/Doc (maybe next year's pick as well - I've seen reports of 1 and 2 picks going to BOS). Then they would then trade Bledsoe for Aaron Affalo. Then Pierce for the MLE. They'd have:

CP3
Affalo/Crawford
Pierce/Butler
Blake
KG

They would need to add big man depth and a backup PG with vet min contracts. Maybe trade Butler's expiring deal for help in those areas too.

BOS can throw a monkey wrench into the plan by refusing to accept any deal that doesn't bring Bledsoe back. If the Clips are forced to choose between KG and Affalo, KG makes more sense. Yes he's older but both are only signed for 2 years and there's no question that KG is the superior player. If I'm the Clippers I try to get Courtney Lee involved in the deal. I'd rather KG at C signed for 2 years and Lee at SG signed for 3 years than Affalo at SG and Jordan at C (both signed for 2 years).

BOS gets: G Eric Bledsoe, C DeAndre Jordan, G Willie Green, #25 pick
LAC gets: F/C Kevin Garnett, HC Doc Rivers, G Courtney Lee

That gives the Clips a lineup after signing Pierce to the MLE of:

CP3
Lee/Crawford
Pierce/Butler
Blake
KG

They'd need big man depth with no MLE to acquire it so the BOS trade could be expanded to include Butler going to BOS for Brandon Bass. BOS might want LAC to throw in another first as well because Bass is signed pretty reasonably and he's a solid role player.

kylem4711
06-17-2013, 12:51 AM
....

My bad, I should have bolded his 3pt claim.

Well correct me if im wrong, but ive never thought of pierce, cp3, and afflalo as knockdown 3 point shooters.

85BearsDefense
06-17-2013, 12:52 AM
Why in all hell would the Clippers do this? A coach is whatever, but a center and 2 first rounders for Garnett? Garnett is trash now honestly... him and PP are both meh players at best right now

Do you watch basketball? Based of this I don't think you do.

PraiseJesus
06-17-2013, 12:53 AM
As of now the trade the Clips want to make is Jordan and the #25 pick for KG/Doc (maybe next year's pick as well - I've seen reports of 1 and 2 picks going to BOS). Then they would then trade Bledsoe for Aaron Affalo. Then Pierce for the MLE. They'd have:

CP3
Affalo/Crawford
Pierce/Butler
Blake
KG

They would need to add big man depth and a backup PG with vet min contracts. Maybe trade Butler's expiring deal for help in those areas too.

BOS can throw a monkey wrench into the plan by refusing to accept any deal that doesn't bring Bledsoe back. If the Clips are forced to choose between KG and Affalo, KG makes more sense. Yes he's older but both are only signed for 2 years and there's no question that KG is the superior player. If I'm the Clippers I try to get Courtney Lee involved in the deal. I'd rather KG at C signed for 2 years and Lee at SG signed for 3 years than Affalo at SG and Jordan at C (both signed for 2 years).

BOS gets: G Eric Bledsoe, C DeAndre Jordan, G Willie Green, #25 pick
LAC gets: F/C Kevin Garnett, HC Doc Rivers, G Courtney Lee

That gives the Clips a lineup after signing Pierce to the MLE of:

CP3
Lee/Crawford
Pierce/Butler
Blake
KG

They'd need big man depth with no MLE to acquire it so the BOS trade could be expanded to include Butler going to BOS for Brandon Bass. BOS might want LAC to throw in another first as well because Bass is signed pretty reasonably and he's a solid role player.

Where is the Afflalo stuff coming from?

IT would make more sense to trade Bledsoe for a center

Clippersfan86
06-17-2013, 12:54 AM
Well correct me if im wrong, but ive never thought of pierce, cp3, and afflalo as knockdown 3 point shooters.

That's a well above average 3 point shooting trio. CP3 had a down year from 3 but year before shot 37 percent from deep. Afflalo again had a down shooting year but is a CAREER 38.3 percent shooter from deep. Pierce is a career 37 percent 3 point shooter, shot 38 percent last year. Probably what Chronz was saying.

hugepatsfan
06-17-2013, 12:56 AM
Well correct me if im wrong, but ive never thought of pierce, cp3, and afflalo as knockdown 3 point shooters.

I'm not sure if you're being serious because all 3 are great 3 point shooters. Afflalo and CP3 had down %s last year but if you look at their careers it's an outlier for both of them.

Vinny642
06-17-2013, 12:59 AM
Do you watch basketball? Based of this I don't think you do.

K tool, keep thinking in the past :)

kylem4711
06-17-2013, 01:10 AM
I'm not sure if you're being serious because all 3 are great 3 point shooters. Afflalo and CP3 had down %s last year but if you look at their careers it's an outlier for both of them.

Ha calm down. I just saw that afflalo shot 30% and I have never relied on cp3 to be a serious 3 point threat. If im wrong, im wrong

Clippersfan86
06-17-2013, 11:30 PM
http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nba--sources--kevin-garnett--doc-rivers-trade-may-come-down-to-clippers-surrendering-two-first-round-draft-picks-to-celtics-030159443.html

Are we really going to fight tooth and nail over giving them an extra 1st rounder that will be 25-30?? They agreed to back off us taking a bad contract and back off Bledsoe... I think DJ+2 picks is pretty fair for KG+Doc. Then sign Pierce as a free agent in July.

Sounds like OP was right, this is the exact offer Boston has come down to.

Clippersfan86
06-17-2013, 11:33 PM
BTW Clippers are murdering Boston. First get Bledsoe out of deal, now get salary dump out of deal. Now it comes down to simply KG for DJ straight up.. and 2 late 1st rounders for Doc. No brainer deal for Clips.

king4day
06-17-2013, 11:34 PM
Yea if Boston just wants Jordan and two late first rounders, LA must pull the trigger. They don't take an additional cap hit and they keep their most valuable trade piece.
This will be their best shot at being title contenders. Have to take advantage of it.

Aust
06-17-2013, 11:50 PM
Why in all hell would the Clippers do this? A coach is whatever, but a center and 2 first rounders for Garnett? Garnett is trash now honestly... him and PP are both meh players at best right now

Wouldn't the addition of Garnett and Doc persuade CP3 to stay with them? You could also add Dwight for Blake and bam, you now have a franchise anchoring PG, C and Coach.

goingfor28
06-18-2013, 12:10 AM
^lol fk Dwight. And that Dwight Blake swap has 0 chance of happening

ANKUSH
06-18-2013, 12:17 AM
Wouldn't the addition of Garnett and Doc persuade CP3 to stay with them? You could also add Dwight for Blake and bam, you now have a franchise anchoring PG, C and Coach.

Who comes out better in the scenario you just mentioned?
LAC:
PAUL
GREEN/LEE?
PIERCE
GARNETT
DWIGHT

-or-

LAL:
NASH/BLEDSOE
KOBE
ARTEST
GRIFFIN
GASOL

I think LAC wins that one obviously. That team would be crazy good in terms of defense. If the LAL could somehow land Iggy as a free agent signing; they'd look much better and be more adept at running. Talk about two OLD teams, though.

Clippersfan86
06-18-2013, 12:48 AM
http://www.clipsnation.com/2013/6/17/4440566/sacks-the-negotiator

Transcript of the negotiations between Sacks and Ainge.

IndiansFan337
06-18-2013, 01:04 AM
Boston isn't going to give these guys away for DeAndre Jordan and low draft picks, even if it means Rivers won't return to coach next year. If Boston does this trade without getting Bledsoe they are crazy. It's not even worth it if LAC takes on the contracts of both JET and Lee too.

Clippersfan86
06-18-2013, 01:05 AM
Boston isn't going to give these guys away for DeAndre Jordan and low draft picks, even if it means Rivers won't return to coach next year. If Boston does this trade without getting Bledsoe they are crazy. It's not even worth it if LAC takes on the contracts of both JET and Lee too.

Are you sure? Ainge seems to disagree.

http://www.clipsnation.com/2013/6/17/4440566/sacks-the-negotiator

cubs1st
06-18-2013, 01:11 AM
Not including Bledsoe or taking on bad contracts would be a steal for the Cippers. Plus those picks are worth so little since they're going to be near the end of the first round. And they get to rid of Jordan and his contract.

PraiseJesus
06-18-2013, 01:19 AM
The longer this drags on the more I realize that the Celtics are trying to essentially Trade KG for Jordan and 2 1st rounders.

Rivers, Pierce, KG, and even Terry have all checked out. I heard that Doc was considering broadcasting over coaching the Celtics.

THere is no way the Celtics get back together at this point, it is OVER

At this point the Clips could keep their 1st rounders, Blesoe, Deandre and add Pierce and Doc for nothing

eternal slumber
06-18-2013, 09:22 AM
looks likes it up to the Clippers to make this deal finalized.

http://www.hoopsrumors.com/2013/06/clippersceltics-updates-monday.html

seems like Bledsoe is totally out of the picture. Boston seems desperate though.

Chronz
06-18-2013, 11:38 AM
Well correct me if im wrong, but ive never thought of pierce, cp3, and afflalo as knockdown 3 point shooters.
I dont know whats wrong with CP3, he had a poor year (by his standards) from distance but Afflalo is a classic 3 and D player, the reason Denver got rid of him was because he was trying to expand his game outside of the championship role expected of him. But if we can get him back into that mindset (Butler has reshaped his game to fit this mentality) he will be the efficient wing we've lacked.

I think his defense is overrated but hes definitely gonna put in more effort on that end than anyone we've had (assuming we get him).

Whats wrong with Pierce tho? Hes a great set shooter, I believe well above 40% when set. I just hope CP3 hones his jumper, that midget is gonna need it to prolong his career.

CELTICS4LYFE
06-18-2013, 11:53 AM
Jordan + 2 1st's....Get it done already!

hugepatsfan
06-18-2013, 12:02 PM
Celtics should just let KG retire if LAC won't take back Lee or Terry. DJ could maybe be flipped to a C needy team, but only contenders would be interested in him so you're going to get a late first rounder back (along with a contract). So essentially you'd be trading KG for 2 late first round picks that would combine to make about 3.5 million or so each year. BOS is better off getting the ~10 mil of cap space. You can sign an upside young layer for about 5 mil (i.e. OJ Mayo type deal w/ DAL this year) and be better off than 2 late first round crap shoots (they rarely amount to anything in the NBA).

If BOS buys out Pierce and goes into rebuild mode KG won't come back. He'll retire. And if Doc can't coach a contender, he'll go back to broadcasting. So BOS doesn't need the Clips to get out of Doc's money.

KnickaBocka.44
06-18-2013, 12:08 PM
Are you sure? Ainge seems to disagree.

http://www.clipsnation.com/2013/6/17/4440566/sacks-the-negotiator

this response is a joke, right?

kylem4711
06-18-2013, 12:08 PM
Aaaaaaand the deal looks to be off because the clips dont want to give a second 1st rounder.
They will move forward with interviews.

hugepatsfan
06-18-2013, 12:13 PM
The deal will get done. The Clippers front office isn't dumb enough to greatly reduce their title chances because they didn't want to give up a late 1st round pick that most likely won't amount to anything or pay Lee (or Terry) $10.675 million over 2 years instead of Butler $8 million over 1. Eventually it will either be KG for DJ + 2 picks or KG + Lee/Terry for DJ + 1 pick.

If the deal doesn't get done the Clippers GM is an idiot. If BOS doesn't get either a 2nd pick or dump a contract than Ainge is an idiot. (And dump a contract isn't even really accurate - more like push all the money into 1 year because they'd have to take Butler back.)

BoSox47
06-18-2013, 12:14 PM
trade pieces.

310Casper
06-18-2013, 12:20 PM
If this deal doesn't go through and Doc stays in boston, how awkward is that for him, the players, the franchise.

He clearly wants to move on.

Sportfan
06-18-2013, 12:23 PM
Thank God Ainge finally found his head+

leprechaun5
06-18-2013, 12:26 PM
Thank God Ainge finally found his head+

Let's hope he has a plan what to do with doc and KG now ! I can't see any of them getting back in green next year .

hugepatsfan
06-18-2013, 12:28 PM
If this deal doesn't go through and Doc stays in boston, how awkward is that for him, the players, the franchise.

He clearly wants to move on.

He won't be back in BOS even if the deal falls through. If the Celtics don't make the trade BOS will still buy out Pierce. KG won't come back to play for a rebuilding team and if the Clippers scenario falls through that's his only option so he'd likely retire. Doc would just go back to broadcasting and spend more time with his family if coaching a contender isn't an option.

Danny has enough leverage to get either a second pick or swap Lee/Terry's 2 year deals for Butler's. He just has to be enough of an *** hole to screw Pierce, KG and Doc over like that. Or rather just convince the Clippers' GM that he's enough of an *** that he'd actually do it.

bagwell368
06-18-2013, 12:37 PM
DA overplayed his hand. That 2nd 1st rounder from the Clips could be a real good pick.

Drop that demand, take this years Clips 1st, toss them our 2nd in '14 (liable to be very good), and make them take a stiff: Lee, Terry, Bass - and get back a contract that expires a year earlier - and take whatever stiff they they offer, it's about the money/flexibility not the player.

Anyone that thinks the '13 and '15 firsts and DA wasn't enough for Doc and KG has no idea of what they are talking about.

shep33
06-18-2013, 12:38 PM
Ainge found his head. You can't trade KG and Doc basically straight up for DJ. That doesn't really help the rebuilding process at all. Plus that late 1st rounder is pretty useless.

shep33
06-18-2013, 12:39 PM
DA overplayed his hand. That 2nd 1st rounder from the Clips could be a real good pick.

Drop that demand, take this years Clips 1st, toss them our 2nd in '14 (liable to be very good), and make them take a stiff: Lee, Terry, Bass - and get back a contract that expires a year earlier - and take whatever stiff they they offer, it's about the money/flexibility not the player.

Anyone that thinks the '13 and '15 firsts and DA wasn't enough for Doc and KG has no idea of what they are talking about.

Two picks yes, but I don't think a 2013 first is worth much at all. Weakest draft in a while.

eternal slumber
06-18-2013, 12:43 PM
if i was the Clips i would have done this deal. DJ plus two 20+ picks for Doc, KG, a good chance to get PP and a strong case for CP3 to resign, that would have been a great deal for them, don't know why they pulled it off.

kdspurman
06-18-2013, 12:43 PM
Adrian Wojnarowski ‏@WojYahooNBA 35s
Clippers refused to give additional 1st-round pick, but ultimately $35M extension for Rivers and $3M-plus Jordan trade kicker played part.

hugepatsfan
06-18-2013, 12:48 PM
Once the Clippers sign CP3 to a max deal (let's say 15 mil) and Pierce to the MLE (let's say 5 mil) they'll be at about 65 million for this year. Add in all the vet min deals they'll give out and they'll be in the luxury tax. Swapping Butler's 8 million expiring deal for Terry's 10.675 over two years would lower their salary for this year so they'd pay less luxury tax (or not even be in it, depending on what the threshold is). I don't understand why the Clippers would be reluctant to expand the deal to include that.

(Lee's contract is the same as Terry's for the next 2 years but he has a 3rd year after that which would cut into the Clippers cap space in the year they're set to be able to be big spenders.)

hugepatsfan
06-18-2013, 12:49 PM
Once the Clippers sign CP3 to a max deal (let's say 15 mil) and Pierce to the MLE (let's say 5 mil) they'll be at about 65 million for this year. Add in all the vet min deals they'll give out and they'll be in the luxury tax. Swapping Butler's 8 million expiring deal for Terry's 10.675 over two years would lower their salary for this year so they'd pay less luxury tax (or not even be in it, depending on what the threshold is). I don't understand why the Clippers would be reluctant to expand the deal to include that.

(Lee's contract is the same as Terry's for the next 2 years but he has a 3rd year after that which would cut into the Clippers cap space in the year they're set to be able to be big spenders.)

310Casper
06-18-2013, 12:49 PM
Doc would just go back to broadcasting and spend more time with his family if coaching a contender isn't an option.

Doc is still owed like 30+ million, doubt he just retires and leaves that money on the table just because his team is rebuilding. but i could be wrong.

also:

Adrian Wojnarowski ‏@WojYahooNBA 2m
Danny Ainge has called Doc Rivers to tell him that talks are done, sources tell Y! Sports. Ainge told him he still wants him as coach.


Hey Ainge, good luck keeping Doc as a coach and hoping everyone pretends this week never actually happened and goes their merry way.

Gibby23
06-18-2013, 12:59 PM
Doc is still owed like 30+ million, doubt he just retires and leaves that money on the table just because his team is rebuilding. but i could be wrong.

also:

Adrian Wojnarowski ‏@WojYahooNBA 2m
Danny Ainge has called Doc Rivers to tell him that talks are done, sources tell Y! Sports. Ainge told him he still wants him as coach.


Hey Ainge, good luck keeping Doc as a coach and hoping everyone pretends this week never actually happened and goes their merry way.

Why would they pretend it never happened? Doc wanted to go to the Clippers and DA tried to make it happen for him. DA still has a job to do and has to look out for the C's first.

Clippersfan86
06-18-2013, 01:00 PM
Sterling reminds us all how little he's truly changed. Willing to spend on players but not the foundation (front offices, coaches). Idiot.

gotoHcarolina52
06-18-2013, 01:02 PM
CP3 to ATLANTA!!!!

Green_Monster
06-18-2013, 01:05 PM
So the final offer was DJ + two firsts for KG + Doc? Why didn't the Clippers take that? They most likely would have signed Pierce after he was bought out, too. :laugh2:

Now they have to worry about CP3 possibly signing somewhere else to team up with Dwight.

Heediot
06-18-2013, 01:08 PM
Until the Clippers hire a new coach, I still think the deal is a possibility. Both teams are just seeing who caves in first. All these media reports are to feed the sheep who are anxious for something big to happen.

grandsalami
06-18-2013, 01:12 PM
i still think CP3 stays, he has been part of this whole process I think (which coaches to hire)

310Casper
06-18-2013, 01:13 PM
Watch cp3 get mad about still not having a good coach, then signing with ATL along with Dwight. Theyd be a pretty good team!

YankeesR#2
06-18-2013, 01:13 PM
So the final offer was DJ + two firsts for KG + Doc? Why didn't the Clippers take that? They most likely would have gotten Pierce after he was bought out, too. :laugh2:

Now they have to worry about CP3 possibly signing somewhere else to team up with Dwight.

......because when it's all said and done the Clippers are still the Clippers. There is a reason they have never won an NBA title even though they have been picking in the lottery for a generation.

bleedprple&gold
06-18-2013, 01:16 PM
The Clippers are morons. Boston taking Jordan's contract for KG was worth a first round pick as compensation alone, plus another first rounder as compensation for Doc. They didn't even have to take back Lee or Terry? They just got too greedy. Those picks would be late first rounders at best, and probably get you some average players. KG and Doc and getting rid of Jordan wasn't worth that. Idiots! :facepalm:

Rain City
06-18-2013, 01:18 PM
The Clippers are morons. Boston taking Jordan's contract for KG was worth a first round pick as compensation alone, plus another first rounder as compensation for Doc. They didn't even have to take back Lee or Terry? They just got too greedy. Those picks would be late first rounders at best, and probably get you some average players. KG and Doc and getting rid of Jordan wasn't worth that. Idiots! :facepalm:

agree 100%

Jetsguy
06-18-2013, 01:20 PM
I am guessing Celtics were insisting on Bledsoe

310Casper
06-18-2013, 01:20 PM
well, there it goes

Adrian Wojnarowski ‏@WojYahooNBA 2m
Y! Sources: After a deal to the Clippers falls apart, Doc Rivers is unsure about his return to the Celtics as coach. http://tinyurl.com/l73xgju


This pushes the celtics to reopen the deal and take what clippers offered. The deal will get made in the next few hours for sure.

bleedprple&gold
06-18-2013, 01:20 PM
agree 100%

Not to mention it would almost assure that CP3 re-signs. Now who knows...

grandsalami
06-18-2013, 01:21 PM
Not to mention it would almost assure that CP3 re-signs. Now who knows...

i am pretty pretty postive that it was reported that CP3 has/is a part of the coaching search process...

bleedprple&gold
06-18-2013, 01:23 PM
I am guessing Celtics were insisting on Bledsoe

No, they said it was that second 1st round pick that the Clips did not want to give up. That was not asking too much for the Celtics, actually I think the two 1st rounders plus sending back Lee or Terry was the most fair.

bleedprple&gold
06-18-2013, 01:25 PM
i am pretty pretty postive that it was reported that CP3 has/is a part of the coaching search process...

Even so, he could still bolt if he wants too. Having KG and Doc there (and possibly Pierce too) he would have 100% stayed for sure.

hugepatsfan
06-18-2013, 01:27 PM
well, there it goes

Adrian Wojnarowski ‏@WojYahooNBA 2m
Y! Sources: After a deal to the Clippers falls apart, Doc Rivers is unsure about his return to the Celtics as coach. http://tinyurl.com/l73xgju


This pushes the celtics to reopen the deal and take what clippers offered. The deal will get made in the next few hours for sure.

How does that push the Celtics to open up talks again? Doc doesn't want to coach here... fine, retire and we don't have to pay you. If anything, Doc coming back would make the Celtics want to make the deal more because they don't want to pay him 7 mil to coach a rebuilding team.

Chacarron
06-18-2013, 01:31 PM
Come on Clippers, don't fall back into old habits.

Pakman
06-18-2013, 01:32 PM
Come on Clippers, don't fall back into old habits.same old owner, same old clippers

mgsports
06-18-2013, 01:37 PM
Another Team will come with a Trade offer for Rivers like Orlando.

PraiseJesus
06-18-2013, 01:39 PM
The Celtics got way too greedy here.

They should have taken whatever the best offer was from the Clippers and started with a clean slate. They are now destined to be a non contending team without youth.

That is the worst place to be in the NBA

PraiseJesus
06-18-2013, 01:39 PM
So the final offer was DJ + two firsts for KG + Doc? Why didn't the Clippers take that? They most likely would have signed Pierce after he was bought out, too. :laugh2:

Now they have to worry about CP3 possibly signing somewhere else to team up with Dwight.

They didn't take it because the Celtics had no leverage at all

PraiseJesus
06-18-2013, 01:42 PM
well, there it goes

Adrian Wojnarowski ‏@WojYahooNBA 2m
Y! Sources: After a deal to the Clippers falls apart, Doc Rivers is unsure about his return to the Celtics as coach. http://tinyurl.com/l73xgju

This pushes the celtics to reopen the deal and take what clippers offered. The deal will get made in the next few hours for sure.

Ladies and Gentleman,

THIS is why the Celtics were being way too greedy.

DO you HONESTLY think Rivers, KG, and Pierce are going to stick around and really give this thing a shot?

NO way in the world. Especially after this trade talk dragged out.

The Celtics completely blew it I can't even believe they thought they had any footing to make demands on the Clippers at all

Green_Monster
06-18-2013, 01:43 PM
The Celtics got way too greedy here.

They should have taken whatever the best offer was from the Clippers and started with a clean slate. They are now destined to be a non contending team without youth.

That is the worst place to be in the NBA

What? How did they Celtics get greedy? They we're going to accept the deal without Bledsoe and without dealing Lee/Terry.

Someone will give a 1st rounder for KG. It's so early in the off-season, anything can happen.

Green_Monster
06-18-2013, 01:46 PM
They didn't take it because the Celtics had no leverage at all

How did they have no leverage? There's teams that would take KG/Pierce for an offer just as good, if not better than the Clippers. The NBA finals haven't even ended. Teams will be making offers for both of them after the draft most likely.

Doc will most likely retire and we won't have to worry about paying him.

richiesaurus310
06-18-2013, 01:53 PM
How did they have no leverage? There's teams that would take KG/Pierce for an offer just as good, if not better than the Clippers. The NBA finals haven't even ended. Teams will be making offers for both of them after the draft most likely.

Doc will most likely retire and we won't have to worry about paying him.

Kg isn't waiving his no trade clause without doc and/or pierce. What teams other than the Clippers can do this that also would be contenders?

PraiseJesus
06-18-2013, 02:00 PM
What? How did they Celtics get greedy? They we're going to accept the deal without Bledsoe and without dealing Lee/Terry.

Someone will give a 1st rounder for KG. It's so early in the off-season, anything can happen.

Did you read the latest update that Doc is going to leave Boston?

How do you expect the Celtics to trade a coach that is going to leave anyways?

THis means that Rivers is essentially a non factor in the deal. With that being the case, the deal is KG for jordan and 2 first rounders.

...Thats absurd!

IF the Celtics were honest with themselves and the situation they would have SNATCHED up DeAndre and a first roudner for KG.

Instead, they got greedy and believed that they had pull in the situation. Now they have no Doc, no Pierce, and a very unhappy KG that you will likely have to give away...

Bravo Celtics

Meanwhile the Clippers got to keep all their assets. Pierce and Rivers may still end up there anyways

Green_Monster
06-18-2013, 02:00 PM
Kg isn't waiving his no trade clause without doc and/or pierce. What teams other than the Clippers can do this that also would be contenders?

Oh, did KG tell you that? Plus, the Celtics won't be a contender. So it's either retire or get traded if he wants to play for a contender.

Heediot
06-18-2013, 02:01 PM
It doesn't makes sense. Why would you negotiate knowing DOC's salary and then all of a sudden stop? Again these reports and tweets are to feed anxious sheep. I'm just going to wait and see where the chips fall as they may.

bagwell368
06-18-2013, 02:06 PM
Two picks yes, but I don't think a 2013 first is worth much at all. Weakest draft in a while.

Right, '13 pick is arguably the same thing as the Celts 2nd in '14 if they suck enough, but that '15 Clips pick could be pretty decent.

Green_Monster
06-18-2013, 02:10 PM
Did you read the latest update that Doc is going to leave Boston?

Yes, what does that have to do with the leverage of the Celtics? Plus, he never came out and said "I'm leaving if I don't get traded."


How do you expect the Celtics to trade a coach that is going to leave anyways?

I don't. If the Clippers aren't going to give you a good deal, than you let him retire. It's better than being stuck with DJ's **** contract and only having a 1st round pick to show for it.


THis means that Rivers is essentially a non factor in the deal. With that being the case, the deal is KG for jordan and 2 first rounders.

...Thats absurd!

:laugh2: What? How does that add up? Doc now has no value? Either way, trading KG and taking a crappy contract from the Clippers is easily worth 2 firsts.


IF the Celtics were honest with themselves and the situation they would have SNATCHED up DeAndre and a first roudner for KG.

No, that's a bad deal for the Celtics. That's common sense. KG is worth more than taking on a bad contract and only getting a first rounder.


Instead, they got greedy and believed that they had pull in the situation. Now they have no Doc, no Pierce, and a very unhappy KG that you will likely have to give away...

Bravo Celtics

How did the Celtics get greedy? The took Bledsoe and Lee/Terry out of their offer.

Oh, Doc and Pierce already left the Celtics? Wow, I must have missed that. I also didn't know KG was unhappy, did he tell you that?


Meanwhile the Clippers got to keep all their assets

Meanwhile, the Clippers have to worry about CP3 leaving. Trading for KG and Doc, and signing Pierce after, would give CP3 a good team.

Heediot
06-18-2013, 02:13 PM
Clips before and after all this drama = all their assets.

Celtics after all this drama = lose 3 assets.

Let's stop bickering over who has leverage and all of these conflicting reports and tweets and see how it plays out.

PraiseJesus
06-18-2013, 02:14 PM
Yes, what does that have to do with the leverage of the Celtics? Plus, he never came out and said "I'm leaving if I don't get traded."



I don't. If the Clippers aren't going to give you a good deal, than you let him retire. It's better than being stuck with DJ's **** contract and only having a 1st round pick to show for it.



:laugh2: What? How does that add up? Doc now has no value? Either way, trading KG and taking a crappy contract from the Clippers is easily worth 2 firsts.



No, that's a bad deal for the Celtics. That's common sense. KG is worth more than taking on a bad contract and only getting a first rounder.



How did the Celtics get greedy? The took Bledsoe and Lee/Terry out of their offer.

Oh, Doc and Pierce already left the Celtics? Wow, I must have missed that. I also didn't know KG was unhappy, did he tell you that?



Meanwhile, the Clippers have to worry about CP3 leaving. Trading for KG and Doc, and signing Pierce after, would give CP3 a good team.

Haha. In my opinion, you are completely off base in your reasoning.

I don't consider any of your retorts to be valid and I reiterate what I said in my last post.

We will have to agree to disagree here Mr. Monster.

I guess time will tell who is right.

All I know is that the Clippers keep the Young athletic DeAngre Jordan, both of their 1st rounders, and may still sign Pierce and or rivers.

The Celtics meanwhile are a complete mess.

But yea, you can keep thinking whatever you want. I won't stop you pal =)

Atticus Finch
06-18-2013, 02:22 PM
Haha. In my opinion, you are completely off base in your reasoning.

I don't consider any of your retorts to be valid and I reiterate what I said in my last post.

We will have to agree to disagree here Mr. Monster.

I guess time will tell who is right.

All I know is that the Clippers keep the Young athletic DeAngre Jordan, both of their 1st rounders, and may still sign Pierce and or rivers.

The Celtics meanwhile are a complete mess.

But yea, you can keep thinking whatever you want. I won't stop you pal =)


Doc has a clause in his contract that states he can't coach anywhere else until his 5 years are up unless the celtics grant permission to do so. If he wants to leave he has to wait another 3 years before coaching anyone else, so it's not like he can just bail on Boston and immediately sign with the Clippers. That's why the Clippers were trying to trade for him in the first place

TrAv=MaGiCfReAk
06-18-2013, 02:33 PM
As an outsider looking in (magic fan) clippers should have just made the deal.... they would have been instant contenders with doc as coach and a line up of

Cp3
Granger/afflalo
Pierce(mle)
Blake
Garnett

They would contend for rings with that team and that is priceless. They already got out of giving up bledsoe and taking on Lee or terry.... seems like the clips should have pulled the trigger who cares about 2 draft picks when your having a chance at a championship

Swift Game
06-18-2013, 02:34 PM
I agree with everyone stating Boston made the mistake here. For some reason Boston seems to over value their assets.

They really set themselves back with not trading Bird or McHale until Paul Pierce and Antoine Walker arrived. They will walk a similar path due to their bad decisions. Like someone else said before, players and coaches don't like all the trade talk especially if it doesn't go through. Boston will be lucky to make the playoffs next season, same with the Lakers if they don't make the right moves.

bleedprple&gold
06-18-2013, 02:34 PM
I agree with everyone stating Boston made the mistake here. For some reason Boston seems to over value their assets.

They really set themselves back with not trading Bird or McHale until Paul Pierce and Antoine Walker arrived. They will walk a similar path due to their bad decisions. Like someone else said before, players and coaches don't like all the trade talk especially if it doesn't go through. Boston will be lucky to make the playoffs next season, same with the Lakers if they don't make the right moves.



I disagree. I think it was smart of the Celtics not to do the deal for Deandre and only 1 draft pick. KG's contract ends a year earlier than Deandre so that means they get more cap space sooner to help with the rebuild. The picks would be low first rounders and not help much anyway. Crappy draft picks and Deandre Jordan is not much of haul. Don't think that is overvaluing.

Lo Porto
06-18-2013, 02:39 PM
This deal really didn't make much sense anyway. Has there ever been a player and coach traded together to another team? Just weird...

The Clippers should concentrate on trying to sign Dwight. How do they do that:

Bledsoe and Butler to Utah for #14 and #21 (Utah has had interest in Bledsoe and they have the cap space to absorb Butler's $8 million)
then
Jordan to Atlanta for #17 and #18

Clippers then sign Paul and Dwight to max or near max deals. Their roster next year is Paul, Jamal, Blake, Dwight and 4 draft picks. Not bad.

bleedprple&gold
06-18-2013, 02:41 PM
This deal really didn't make much sense anyway. Has there ever been a player and coach traded together to another team? Just weird...

The Clippers should concentrate on trying to sign Dwight. How do they do that:

Bledsoe and Butler to Utah for #14 and #21 (Utah has had interest in Bledsoe and they have the cap space to absorb Butler's $8 million)
then
Jordan to Atlanta for #17 and #18

Clippers then sign Paul and Dwight to max or near max deals. Their roster next year is Paul, Jamal, Blake, Dwight and 4 draft picks. Not bad.

Utah might do #14 for Bledsoe. The rest of those deals would get laughed at.

TrAv=MaGiCfReAk
06-18-2013, 02:41 PM
^ lmao .... dream much @lo Porto?

Lo Porto
06-18-2013, 02:45 PM
^ lmao .... dream much @lo Porto?

I'm a Jazz fan so I could see the value of adding Bledsoe for #14 and #21. He's a much more proven commodity than anything Utah can get with those picks, and Utah needs a leader at the PG position. He would help in Utah's rebuild.

Jordan next to Al Horford makes sense. And much like Utah's situation, Atlanta would see more value in Jordan than anything they would get with #17 or #18.

As for the Clippers, they would have the space if they did the two deals above.

Swift Game
06-18-2013, 02:48 PM
I disagree. I think it was smart of the Celtics not to do the deal for Deandre and only 1 draft pick. KG's contract ends a year earlier than Deandre so that means they get more cap space sooner to help with the rebuild. The picks would be low first rounders and not help much anyway. Crappy draft picks and Deandre Jordan is not much of haul. Don't think that is overvaluing.

I understand your point, but what does Boston really expect to get for KG? We all know a scrub team would pay more for him so to speak, but KG will only agree to play for a contender and cant blame him. So which contender would overay for an aging KG? Remember Ray Allen took less money to play in Miami. That is all on Ainge, and the vets are getting tired of his act imo.

2-ONE-5
06-18-2013, 02:50 PM
This deal really didn't make much sense anyway. Has there ever been a player and coach traded together to another team? Just weird...

The Clippers should concentrate on trying to sign Dwight. How do they do that:

Bledsoe and Butler to Utah for #14 and #21 (Utah has had interest in Bledsoe and they have the cap space to absorb Butler's $8 million)
then
Jordan to Atlanta for #17 and #18

Clippers then sign Paul and Dwight to max or near max deals. Their roster next year is Paul, Jamal, Blake, Dwight and 4 draft picks. Not bad.

those are ridiculous offers. Just bcuz Utah can take on Buterls deal doesnt mean they should. They would be better off trying to move up and take someone like MCW or even Schroeder (spelling) at 14.

There is no way ATL who has been clearing cap space is going to deal to first round picks for Jordan, just no. thats actually laughable even in a weak draft like this

Clippersfan86
06-18-2013, 02:53 PM
Both teams lost in the end, but more so the Celtics.

1. Doc still wants out, they will have to buy him out now.

2. KG will retire since Doc is out.

3. They will be buying Pierce out soon, and he likely finds his way to the Clippers anyways in free agency.

So the Celtics are about to lose Pierce, KG and Doc for NOTHING.

Clippers only issue is they stirred the pot a little with their players probably being uncertain about the future, although they are all vets and understand it's a business.

Lo Porto
06-18-2013, 02:54 PM
those are ridiculous offers. Just bcuz Utah can take on Buterls deal doesnt mean they should. They would be better off trying to move up and take someone like MCW or even Schroeder (spelling) at 14.

There is no way ATL who has been clearing cap space is going to deal to first round picks for Jordan, just no. thats actually laughable even in a weak draft like this

Bledsoe will only be dealt for another good player or to be able to dump a contract so LA can acquire a good player (such as Dwight). So in other words, Utah couldn't get Bledsoe for #14 and #21 in a weak draft.

As for the Hawks, I'd love to see them do something with their cap space. But if Howard and Paul don't want to go there, Jordan for a couple non-lottery picks isn't a bad consolation. Horford and Jordan works.

Clippersfan86
06-18-2013, 02:56 PM
Mark Heisler ‏@MarkHeisler 42s
#Celtics-Clippers, the fallout… Clipper source says they're in constant contact w/CP3--and he's OK w/deal falling apart.

Clippersfan86
06-18-2013, 02:56 PM
Mark Heisler ‏@MarkHeisler 36s
With #CP3 on board,#Clippers will wait for #Celtics to call back… if not will hire coach: I'm hearing Byron Scott over Brian Shaw in photo.

Clippersfan86
06-18-2013, 02:57 PM
Mark Heisler ‏@MarkHeisler 49s
#Clippers say this wasn't Donald cheeping out--that there was already an agreement on what Doc would get.

Gibby23
06-18-2013, 03:05 PM
Both teams lost in the end, but more so the Celtics.

1. Doc still wants out, they will have to buy him out now.

2. KG will retire since Doc is out.

3. They will be buying Pierce out soon, and he likely finds his way to the Clippers anyways in free agency.

So the Celtics are about to lose Pierce, KG and Doc for NOTHING.

Clippers only issue is they stirred the pot a little with their players probably being uncertain about the future, although they are all vets and understand it's a business.

They don't have to buy out Doc. He ca coach the C's and get paid or retire and not get paid. Would also have to wait 4 years to coach again. I think the C's woul be happy with KG retiring.

Green_Monster
06-18-2013, 03:08 PM
Haha. In my opinion, you are completely off base in your reasoning.

I don't consider any of your retorts to be valid and I reiterate what I said in my last post.

We will have to agree to disagree here Mr. Monster.

I guess time will tell who is right.

All I know is that the Clippers keep the Young athletic DeAngre Jordan, both of their 1st rounders, and may still sign Pierce and or rivers.

Care to explain how I'm off base in my reasoning?

Young and athletic, that's all DJ is. He's not worth the $10 he's making.


The Celtics meanwhile are a complete mess.

But yea, you can keep thinking whatever you want. I won't stop you pal =)

The Celtics aren't a complete mess. They're going into rebuilding mode. They have Rondo, Green, Bradley and Sullinger who are all good, young pieces.

A team that's a mess is the Lakers.

bleedprple&gold
06-18-2013, 03:10 PM
I understand your point, but what does Boston really expect to get for KG? We all know a scrub team would pay more for him so to speak, but KG will only agree to play for a contender and cant blame him. So which contender would overay for an aging KG? Remember Ray Allen took less money to play in Miami. That is all on Ainge, and the vets are getting tired of his act imo.

I'm saying they are better off keeping KG than taking Deandre. You don't always have to get compensated for your players. Sometimes the best compensation is the cap space they will free up. Deandre is overpaid and doesn't help them with the rebuilding process and eats up cap space in 2014 that could be put to better use. They were doing the Clips a favor by taking him on and should be compensated with an extra draft pick for taking him on top of the first one for KG, plus giving them Doc.

PraiseJesus
06-18-2013, 03:10 PM
Care to explain how I'm off base in my reasoning?

Young and athletic, that's all DJ is. He's not worth the $10 he's making.



The Celtics aren't a complete mess. They're going into rebuilding mode. They have Rondo, Green, Bradley and Sullinger who are all good, young pieces.

A team that's a mess is the Lakers.

In general all of your retorts were illogical. Just as your last post was. You say the Celtics aren't a mess I say they clearly are. You say the Clippers are a mess, I say they are sitting pretty.

Again, this is my final word to you, we must agree to disagree.

Green_Monster
06-18-2013, 03:10 PM
Doc has a clause in his contract that states he can't coach anywhere else until his 5 years are up unless the celtics grant permission to do so. If he wants to leave he has to wait another 3 years before coaching anyone else, so it's not like he can just bail on Boston and immediately sign with the Clippers. That's why the Clippers were trying to trade for him in the first place

Wow, I didn't know about that clause. So much for the Clippers being able to sign him if the deal falls completely apart.

hugepatsfan
06-18-2013, 03:14 PM
Both teams lost in the end, but more so the Celtics.

1. Doc still wants out, they will have to buy him out now.

2. KG will retire since Doc is out.

3. They will be buying Pierce out soon, and he likely finds his way to the Clippers anyways in free agency.

So the Celtics are about to lose Pierce, KG and Doc for NOTHING.

Clippers only issue is they stirred the pot a little with their players probably being uncertain about the future, although they are all vets and understand it's a business.

You're so wrong on this one. The Clippers are trying to win a title. Now they have to do it with a significantly worse C than KG and their 2nd choice of HC. KG even at his age is still a huge upgrade over Jordan and after BOS backed off of demanding Bledsoe the Clips weren't being asked to give up any player that would be a significant piece to them. Not getting KG is a big blow to their title hopes.

We don't have to buy out Doc. If he coaches again we have a great coach. If he retires, we don't have to pay him. KG retiring is good for the Celtics - it clears cap space. BOS is buying Pierce out regardless of what happens with LAC. We could care less about spiting the Clippers - makes no difference to us if he signs there anyway. BOS gets 10 mil in cap space next offseason instead of Jordan and a late first rounder in a weak draft. That's barely a drop off in positioning. We really didn't miss out on anything valuable.

Green_Monster
06-18-2013, 03:14 PM
In general all of your retorts were illogical. Just as your last post was. You say the Celtics aren't a mess I say they clearly are. You say the Clippers are a mess, I say they are sitting pretty.

Again, this is my final word to you, we must agree to disagree.

First off you continue to say my retorts are illogical but you aren't pointing them out. If anything, the things you're saying are illogical.


All I know is that the Clippers keep the Young athletic DeAngre Jordan, both of their 1st rounders, and may still sign Pierce and or rivers.

Second, where did I say the Clippers are a mess? Having to resort to putting words in my mouth is a sign that your argument has flaws.

PraiseJesus
06-18-2013, 03:17 PM
First off you continue to say my retorts are illogical but you aren't pointing them out. If anything, the things you're saying are illogical.



Second, where did I say the Clippers are a mess? Having to resort to putting words in my mouth is a sign that your argument has flaws.

I guess the question is why you are talking about the Lakers when they arent involved in this convo at all

The Clippers are in a better position than the Celtics after the deal fell through

If you can admit that then all of your points are moot

hugepatsfan
06-18-2013, 03:18 PM
In general all of your retorts were illogical. Just as your last post was. You say the Celtics aren't a mess I say they clearly are. You say the Clippers are a mess, I say they are sitting pretty.

Again, this is my final word to you, we must agree to disagree.

How are the Clippers sitting pretty? There stuck right now in a #3-5 seed trap, assuming CP3 even comes back. There a step below the Spurs and a healthy OKC team in the West and MIA is ahead of them should they sneak into the Finals. There isn't an upgrade at C for them other than KG this offseason (Dwight going there isn't happening).

And BOS is really in no worse position now that the trade fell through. Instead of Jordan and a late first round pick from a weak draft (and late picks usually suck anyway) we'll have 10 mil in cap space next year. Hardly a difference.

Gibby23
06-18-2013, 03:18 PM
I guess the question is why you are talking about the Lakers when they arent involved in this convo at all

The Clippers are in a better position than the Celtics after the deal fell through

If you can admit that then all of your points are moot

The Clippers were already in a better position than the Celtics. Does the deal falling through make the Clippers better than they were last year?

Clippersfan86
06-18-2013, 03:20 PM
You're so wrong on this one. The Clippers are trying to win a title. Now they have to do it with a significantly worse C than KG and their 2nd choice of HC. KG even at his age is still a huge upgrade over Jordan and after BOS backed off of demanding Bledsoe the Clips weren't being asked to give up any player that would be a significant piece to them. Not getting KG is a big blow to their title hopes.

We don't have to buy out Doc. If he coaches again we have a great coach. If he retires, we don't have to pay him. KG retiring is good for the Celtics - it clears cap space. BOS is buying Pierce out regardless of what happens with LAC. We could care less about spiting the Clippers - makes no difference to us if he signs there anyway. BOS gets 10 mil in cap space next offseason instead of Jordan and a late first rounder in a weak draft. That's barely a drop off in positioning. We really didn't miss out on anything valuable.

Eh I guess we differ on who has leverage but either way it was a fair deal that should have gotten done. Neither team missed out if you put it the way you did though. Clippers still will make a couple trades, sign PP and hire a noticeable upgrade at coach over Vinny in Hollins for example. My main reason for wanting the trade was the idea of KG mentoring Blake for a year or two on the way out.

Green_Monster
06-18-2013, 03:20 PM
I guess the question is why you are talking about the Lakers when they arent involved in this convo at all

The Clippers are in a better position than the Celtics after the deal fell through

If you can admit that then all of your points are moot

I'm talking about the Lakers because you said the Celtics are a complete mess when the Lakers aren't in a good situation either?

Obviously the Clippers were in a better situation after this deal fell through. How does that make all of my points moot? :laugh2:

Where did I say the Clippers are a mess? Or are you going to ignore that?

The goods
06-18-2013, 03:23 PM
This deal really didn't make much sense anyway. Has there ever been a player and coach traded together to another team? Just weird...

The Clippers should concentrate on trying to sign Dwight. How do they do that:

Bledsoe and Butler to Utah for #14 and #21 (Utah has had interest in Bledsoe and they have the cap space to absorb Butler's $8 million)
then
Jordan to Atlanta for #17 and #18

Clippers then sign Paul and Dwight to max or near max deals. Their roster next year is Paul, Jamal, Blake, Dwight and 4 draft picks. Not bad.


Why would Atlanta help the Clippers get Dwight when their trying to get him as well?

bleedprple&gold
06-18-2013, 03:25 PM
You're so wrong on this one. The Clippers are trying to win a title. Now they have to do it with a significantly worse C than KG and their 2nd choice of HC. KG even at his age is still a huge upgrade over Jordan and after BOS backed off of demanding Bledsoe the Clips weren't being asked to give up any player that would be a significant piece to them. Not getting KG is a big blow to their title hopes.

We don't have to buy out Doc. If he coaches again we have a great coach. If he retires, we don't have to pay him. KG retiring is good for the Celtics - it clears cap space. BOS is buying Pierce out regardless of what happens with LAC. We could care less about spiting the Clippers - makes no difference to us if he signs there anyway. BOS gets 10 mil in cap space next offseason instead of Jordan and a late first rounder in a weak draft. That's barely a drop off in positioning. We really didn't miss out on anything valuable.

Yes ++ to all of your points. I agree Clips messed up more than the Celtics.

Heediot
06-18-2013, 03:26 PM
Wow people are making it seem like the Celtics are the only team LAC can trade with. There are other teams and other players available and potentially available after the Draft and FA. They can try to find upgrades elsewhere.

I do concede that land Boston seems to be the best fitting trade partner. LAC keep their assets, that can be used elsewhere. I don't think they lose anything except for potential (a championship contender at that).

hugepatsfan
06-18-2013, 03:32 PM
Wow people are making it seem like the Celtics are the only team LAC can trade with. There are other teams and other players available and potentially available after the Draft and FA. They can try to find upgrades elsewhere.

I do concede that land Boston seems to be the best fitting trade partner. LAC keep their assets, that can be used elsewhere. I don't think they lose anything except for potential (a championship contender at that).

KG is still one of the best Cs in the NBA despite his old age. There isn't any other team that's going to trade them that. The only assets they have to trade are DJ, Bledsoe and Butler's expiring deal. Butler and Bledsoe will have to be used to get Afflalo which they seem to want to do regardless of the KG deal. That leaves only Jordan as a tradable asset. If they move him they have to get a C back because they're already have zero depth in the front court with nothing but vet min contracts to address that (assuming their MLE goes to Pierce). No C as good as KG or even Jordan is available for trade so it's this deal or bust for the Clippers after Bledsoe for Afflalo happens like it seems destined to.

PraiseJesus
06-18-2013, 04:01 PM
I'm talking about the Lakers because you said the Celtics are a complete mess when the Lakers aren't in a good situation either?

Obviously the Clippers were in a better situation after this deal fell through. How does that make all of my points moot? :laugh2:

Where did I say the Clippers are a mess? Or are you going to ignore that?

Which brings us FULL CIRCLE very neatly to my original point that I was trying to explain to you all,

The Celtics have ZERO leverage. The Clippers were and will remain in a better position than the Celtics

Thanks for tying up my point so well ;)

hugepatsfan
06-18-2013, 04:10 PM
Which brings us FULL CIRCLE very neatly to my original point that I was trying to explain to you all,

The Celtics have ZERO leverage. The Clippers were and will remain in a better position than the Celtics

Thanks for tying up my point so well ;)

The Clippers are in better position but what does that have to do with anything? They had more to gain in this trade than BOS did. A huge upgrade at C and a better coach is more valuable to a championship competing team than an average C making 10 million and a late first round pick is to a rebuilding team.

Green_Monster
06-18-2013, 04:13 PM
Which brings us FULL CIRCLE very neatly to my original point that I was trying to explain to you all,

The Celtics have ZERO leverage. The Clippers were and will remain in a better position than the Celtics

Thanks for tying up my point so well ;)

What? How does that bring us to the Celtics having zero leverage, (which is absolutely false).

You have several people calling you out for the statements you're making. You should stop and think that maybe you're the one who is wrong. The post I just made did nothing to prove your point, (which I have no idea what your point is).

Also, you continue to ignore my question of, where did I say the Clippers were a mess?

Lakers + Giants
06-18-2013, 05:05 PM
Green Monster, ignore the troll.

bleedprple&gold
06-18-2013, 05:09 PM
KG is still one of the best Cs in the NBA despite his old age. There isn't any other team that's going to trade them that. The only assets they have to trade are DJ, Bledsoe and Butler's expiring deal. Butler and Bledsoe will have to be used to get Afflalo which they seem to want to do regardless of the KG deal. That leaves only Jordan as a tradable asset. If they move him they have to get a C back because they're already have zero depth in the front court with nothing but vet min contracts to address that (assuming their MLE goes to Pierce). No C as good as KG or even Jordan is available for trade so it's this deal or bust for the Clippers after Bledsoe for Afflalo happens like it seems destined to.

I agree with just about everything you have written, but I'm gonna correct you here. The only trade assets the Clippers have are Butler, Bledsoe and draft picks. DJ is not a tradeable asset. He is way overpaid and everybody knows it. That's why he has to be packaged with draft picks for somebody to take him (in this case two draft picks). He is not the asset the C's want, and is actually counterproductive to their rebuilding process, that's why the C's need to two draft picks as compensation if they are going to give them KG AND take on a contract they don't need in DJ.

Green_Monster
06-18-2013, 05:11 PM
Green Monster, ignore the troll.

I didn't know he was a troll, or I wouldn't have wasted my time. Thanks for warning me.

PraiseJesus
06-18-2013, 05:15 PM
I didn't know he was a troll, or I wouldn't have wasted my time. Thanks for warning me.

Thats why me telling you "we must agree to disagree"

Thats totally trolling right?

I hope Lakers+Giants gets an infraction

kylem4711
06-18-2013, 05:50 PM
http://m.espn.go.com/general/blogs/blogpost?blogname=truehoop&id=59849&src=desktop


Some reading that speaks to why maybe the world isnt coming to an end for the clippers

Rndy
06-18-2013, 06:42 PM
Worst case senario for Boston is keeping one of the best coaches how do they not have more leverage on a team that could lose their best player if he isn't interested in who they bring in.

Cracka2HI!
06-18-2013, 06:45 PM
The Clippers aren't suck if this doesn't go down and should stick to their guns. I'm not sure DJ 2 #1's and Lee's contract seems like a deal they should take tho. I think's funny how down people are on the Clippers right now. Something could easily still happen.

TrAv=MaGiCfReAk
06-18-2013, 06:56 PM
Yea I think its dumb clips didnt just give up the 2 picks and Jordan but I still think if you say a team has leverage IMO its clipps just cause they have other option they don't need this deal

Sure Boston doesnt need it either but its better then nothing ... kg doesn't seem to want to play elsewhere so its doubtful he waives be trade clause and sure Boston keeps a great coach but what good is that when your rebuilding and its quite obvious he doesn't wanna be there ...

But still clips should have taken the deal and not killed it because of an extra pick

Celticsfan2007
06-18-2013, 06:59 PM
What are some peoples views of Deandre Jordan's value combined with his current contract?

Is he worth a mid-top 10 first rounder?

Is he worth a 2nd round pick?

Is he worth an all star caliber player?

Is he worth nothing and the clips should pay someone to take him off their hands?

Just curious to see what peoples overall consensus is.

hugepatsfan
06-18-2013, 07:00 PM
If the trade goes down it still looks to me like the Clippers will trade Bledsoe and Butler's expiring deal for Afflalo and maybe Andrew Nicholson and then sign Pierce for the MLE for a lineup of:

CP3
Afflalo/Crawford
Pierce
Blake/Nicholson
DJ
(whoever they take at #25 and bunch of vet min signings)

Coach: Lionel Hollins




Would Clippers fans like this as an alternative plan:

BOS gets: G Eric Bledsoe, C DeAndre Jordan, F Caron Butler, G Willie Green
LAC gets: F/C Kevin Garnett, HC Doc Rivers, F Brandon Bass, G Courtney Lee, #16 pick

That yields a lineup of:

CP3
Lee/Crawford
Pierce
Blake/Bass
KG
(whoever they take at #16, #25 and a bunch of vet min signings)

Coach: Doc Rivers

Lee isn't as good a SG as Afflalo but Bass is much better than Nicholson and KG is a huge improvement over DJ, Doc is their first choice over Lionel Hollins and they also get an extra 1st round pick to add youth. Plus they'd still have flexibility under the cap 2 years from now.

kylem4711
06-18-2013, 07:22 PM
ArashMarkazi: Perceptions are hard to change but this isn't about the Clippers being cheap. They agreed to pay Doc $7 million/ year for 5 years.

Cracka2HI!
06-18-2013, 07:23 PM
I think it's still going to happen. I think it's funny that sources come out and say something is dead like it's over. They just need to get more teams involved. There really isn't an urgency until draft night. The rest of the coaches out there will wait for the Clippers. The media is down on the Clippers right now but this isn't done. They just need to find homes for Terry, Lee and possibly Bass for this to happen. Personally I'd take Bass on the Clippers. Orlando should be involved. It sounds like Afflalo is coming to the Clipps and they may part with Nicholson too. They may be willing to throw in a pick to make the deal. They won't want to add contract from Boston, they'll take Butler. You could send that Orlando pick with Lee and Terry and someone would probably take it. Pierce get's bought out. Clippers end up like this;

C KG/FA
PF Blake/Bass
SF Pierce/Barnes or FA
SG Afflalo/Crawford
PG Paul/Billups or FA

numba1CHANGsta
06-18-2013, 07:27 PM
Jordan plus 2 first round picks isnt worth it for an aging KG with a year left on his contract, if im the Clippers id offer the Lakers Bledsoe/Griffin/2 first round picks for Dwight

Cracka2HI!
06-18-2013, 07:30 PM
Rather keep Blake than add Howard. Couldn't stand seeing Blake on the Lakers.

PraiseJesus
06-18-2013, 07:43 PM
Wtf? How does that bring us to the Celtics having Zero leverage (which is absolutely false).

You just spewed out **** that made zero sense. You have several people calling you out for the statements you're making. You should stop and think that maybe you're the one whose wrong.

The post I just made did nothing to prove your point, (which I have no idea what your point is). My head is spinning from the post you made, it makes zero sense. I have no idea what your thought process is, but it's way off.

Also, you continue to ignore my question of, where did I say the Clippers were a mess?

Your problem is reading comprhension.

Why are you still talking to me?

For the 3rd time, WE MUST AGREE TO DISAGREE

Its obvious to me from your posts that you are on a COMPLEteLY different wavelength than me on this and we will never see eye to eye.

Can you accept that?

For the 3rd time, lets wait and see how it all turns out, then we will know who was completely WRONG in their thinking

PAOboston
06-18-2013, 07:50 PM
LOL @ the clippers. I guess there's a reason they've been a laughingstock their entire existence. Cheaping out b/c of late firsst round draft picks and a trade kicker?

Solid move by Ainge for holding out for more. I dont care how much younger Jordan is. He's waaay overpaid and KG, even at 37, is still a vastly superior player. Jordan and a first for KG/Doc isnt enough.

richiesaurus310
06-18-2013, 08:19 PM
I think both teams win with a trade, only time will tell who wins this non-trade I guess.

Chronz
06-18-2013, 08:43 PM
Clips should take all the time they need before cashing in our chips.

Celtics have pretty much nothing else.

Green_Monster
06-18-2013, 08:58 PM
Your problem is reading comprhension.

Why are you still talking to me?

For the 3rd time, WE MUST AGREE TO DISAGREE

Its obvious to me from your posts that you are on a COMPLEteLY different wavelength than me on this and we will never see eye to eye.

Can you accept that?

For the 3rd time, lets wait and see how it all turns out, then we will know who was completely WRONG in their thinking

The same could be said to you. Why do you continue to respond to my posts, then call me out for responding to your posts?

I kept responding to your posts because they made zero sense. Then I found out it was pointless because you're a known troll.

Once again, thanks for continuing to ignore my question.

PraiseJesus
06-18-2013, 09:06 PM
The same could be said to you. Why do you continue to respond to my posts, then call me out for responding to your posts?

I kept responding to your posts because they made zero sense. Then I found out it was pointless because you're a known troll.

Once again, thanks for continuing to ignore my question.

Saying that the Celtics messed this deal up is not trolling. Stop calling me that

You are baiting me over and over I hope you get banned

NYMetros
06-18-2013, 09:13 PM
Clips should take all the time they need before cashing in our chips.

Celtics have pretty much nothing else.

and what is the Clippers Plan B?

Green_Monster
06-18-2013, 09:18 PM
Saying that the Celtics messed this deal up is not trolling. Stop calling me that

You are baiting me over and over I hope you get banned

I'm not calling you a troll because of that. I've had more than one person (in this thread and PM), tell me that you're a well known troll. I've done nothing to get infracted or banned. I tried to have a civil argument but you kept posting nonsense.

Green_Monster
06-18-2013, 09:38 PM
Ive got haters.

And you have been baiting me into an argument for 6 pages by calling me a troll over and over.

All I did was say that the Celtics got greedy and messed up the deal.

Now back off and stop calling me a troll you loser

I never called you a troll. I said people have told me that you're a know troll.

Calling me a loser is baiting/trolling. Pot meet kettle.

shep33
06-18-2013, 09:41 PM
I'm sorry, but Doc needs to be called out. I don't understand how he's getting such a pass. Ridiculous

Chronz
06-18-2013, 10:17 PM
and what is the Clippers Plan B?
Who knows, but they certainly have options that the Celtics lack. I dont think KG would be receptive to going to any other team unless they have Doc.

Last year there was talk of a Anderson V trade for DeAndre Jordan, hes still an athletic monster of a center with decent regular season production, according to ESPN, he reminds some managers of a young Tyson Chandler.

PraiseJesus
06-18-2013, 11:05 PM
I didn't know he was a troll, or I wouldn't have wasted my time. Thanks for warning me.

This is where you started it

kylem4711
06-18-2013, 11:11 PM
I didn't know he was a troll, or I wouldn't have wasted my time. Thanks for warning me.

This is where you started it

How about both of you just stop. You are both acting like babies.

Hustla23
06-19-2013, 12:22 AM
Wasn't KG meant to retire? Now, they're demanding two first round picks for him? :laugh2:

Cracka2HI!
06-19-2013, 04:26 PM
According to at least 1 source the deal isn't "dead" yet.

http://www.sportscity.com/source-trade-talks-arent-over-between-the-celtics-and-clippers/2013/06/19/

I really can't believe the backlash the Clippers and especially Sterling are taking on this. Stephan A Smith made himself like more of an idiot than usual just BASHING Sterling and team about the way they were run a decade ago. The guy clearly has no clue how they've been operating for many years no. There is a HUGE difference between being cheap and paying more than you have to. The Clippers have the leverage, Boston has none. It is likely the price comes down or they find a 3rd team to take on a bad contract from Boston. I think the deal still gets done and Stephan A Smith will still run his mouth like he knows what is coming out of it.

Clippersfan86
06-19-2013, 04:30 PM
Well according to pretty much everybody involved... Sterling already had Doc's 5 year/35 millions dollar contract settled. That wasn't the snag. It was related to Boston's demands of extra pick+salary dump for a 1 year rental of KG. As long as we don't go hire Byron Scott, I'm okay with it. If we DO hire Scott, we've compounded this error significantly. If we hire Hollins for example, trade Bledsoe for an Afflalo type, Swap DJ for another center... I'll be just as happy as with Doc and KG.

Cracka2HI!
06-19-2013, 04:34 PM
Yea I heard the thing about Rivers too. SAS had no clue what he was talking about during his rant. Oh well just another dumbass working for ESPN going WAY over the top trying to get ratings. I also would like to see this deal go though but as long as Byron Scott is not hired I think we will do just fine this offseason!

jon32
06-19-2013, 05:57 PM
Adrian Wojnarowski ‏@WojYahooNBA 4m
The Celtics and Clippers have started talks again on the Doc Rivers-Kevin Garnett deal, league sources tell Y! Sports.


aaaannnnd the talks are back on

jon32
06-19-2013, 05:58 PM
Adrian Wojnarowski ‏@WojYahooNBA 1m
The Clippers reached out to the Celtics this afternoon to resume dialogue on a possible deal, league sources tell Y! Sports.

Clippersfan86
06-19-2013, 06:35 PM
WOJ and Simmons reporting CP3 got involved to start up talks again. Glad he did. Just throw in another pick and take Lee. I was great with that proposal anyways.

jon32
06-19-2013, 06:42 PM
Adrian Wojnarowski ‏@WojYahooNBA 10m
Y! Sources: With a nudge from Chris Paul, the Clippers-Celtics are discussing Garnett-Rivers deal again. http://tinyurl.com/lk92w48

TrAv=MaGiCfReAk
06-19-2013, 06:50 PM
Sweeeeet ! Hope a bledsoe for afflalo deal is soon to follow

Rain City
06-19-2013, 06:51 PM
Adrian Wojnarowski ‏@WojYahooNBA 10m
Y! Sources: With a nudge from Chris Paul, the Clippers-Celtics are discussing Garnett-Rivers deal again. http://tinyurl.com/lk92w48

i hope the celts make em up the ante for it too.

DJ and 2 late 1sts is not enough for doc and KG.

id like em to throw in a Lee for green swap so celts can shed more $... lee is a nice piece for LAC anyways....

sterling is such an awful owner.

TrAv=MaGiCfReAk
06-19-2013, 06:54 PM
DJ and 2 picks is as good its getting

mgsports
06-19-2013, 07:03 PM
Cavs or Raptors as 3 team and hope it gets done.

Agar81
06-19-2013, 07:17 PM
The Clips lost some leverage by this coming out (by Paul being at the root of it). The C's will once again try for Bledsoe and just might get him this time

TrAv=MaGiCfReAk
06-19-2013, 07:24 PM
I still think bledsoe is off limits in this deal ... they need him to get a better player at the sg

But it will deaf be DJ and 2 picks now with clipps taking back terry or Lee

Agar81
06-19-2013, 07:32 PM
I still think bledsoe is off limits in this deal ... they need him to get a better player at the sg

But it will deaf be DJ and 2 picks now with clipps taking back terry or Lee

Not as off limits as you think. The C's could demand Bledsoe knowing that CP3 would be upset and ultimately walk from the team if Doc/KG aren't there.

Clippersfan86
06-19-2013, 07:36 PM
Arash Markazi ‏@ArashMarkazi 40s
Clippers, Celtics deal was so far along when the plug was pulled yesterday. If both sides want to do this it won't take long.

Marc Stein ‏@ESPNSteinLine 1m
Most likely framework, amid signs of progress in talks, remains DeAndre Jordan for KG & two first-rounders for Doc Rivers' coaching rights


Celtics fans move on from Bledsoe. Ainge accepted him not being in the deal long ago. He would have been a good fit if Rondo is traded but don't act like just because CP3 wants this done.. Celtics suddenly have ALL the leverage because they definitely don't.

Clippersfan86
06-19-2013, 07:36 PM
http://www.csnne.com/boston-celtics/wojnarowski-they-know-has-be-done

Woj interview.

Agar81
06-19-2013, 07:42 PM
We might not have all the leverage but we definitely have A LOT more now. As I said, the Clips risk losing CP3. Ainge will either get his deal done or no deal at all. Woj confirms this...

mgsports
06-19-2013, 07:48 PM
Bradley plays SG. The Celtics get Varejao/Luke R. Cavs get Williams/Celtics first round pick and Minnesota gets Lee or Terry if not Celtics/Clips deal that could get done tonight per ESPN and future Picks.

DODGERS&LAKERS
06-19-2013, 08:29 PM
i hope the celts make em up the ante for it too.

DJ and 2 late 1sts is not enough for doc and KG.

id like em to throw in a Lee for green swap so celts can shed more $... lee is a nice piece for LAC anyways....

sterling is such an awful owner.

What? A 37 year old center and a coach is not worth more than that. Especially since that coach is about retire and go back to t.v. If I was the Clippers I would wait till Doc walked away from the Celtics and then hire him. Keep the picks

goingfor28
06-19-2013, 08:34 PM
i hope the celts make em up the ante for it too.

DJ and 2 late 1sts is not enough for doc and KG.

id like em to throw in a Lee for green swap so celts can shed more $... lee is a nice piece for LAC anyways....

sterling is such an awful owner.

What? A 37 year old center and a coach is not worth more than that. Especially since that coach is about retire and go back to t.v. If I was the Clippers I would wait till Doc walked away from the Celtics and then hire him. Keep the picks

Can't. Clause in doc contract say he can't retire and go pursue another coaching gig. Gotta wait til his contract would be up

DODGERS&LAKERS
06-19-2013, 08:42 PM
Can't. Clause in doc contract say he can't retire and go pursue another coaching gig. Gotta wait til his contract would be up

Oh, thanks for that.

Well then if the Celtics want to play hardball, I let them keep the old man, have the coach walk away and use my resources elsewhere. The Celtics have shown they want to blow it up. The Clippers would still be good if they did not make the trade. That is leverage

RLundi
06-19-2013, 08:43 PM
Can't. Clause in doc contract say he can't retire and go pursue another coaching gig. Gotta wait til his contract would be up

Is it when his contract would be up? I heard it was 5 years after quitting prematurely, but idk if that's true.

mgsports
06-19-2013, 08:44 PM
Could get done tonight per ESPN Mark Stein and Ramona S. and maybe involve Cavs and Minnesota has Derek Williams on the block.