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View Full Version : Does this year's finals feel.... staged?



Snakeyestx
06-14-2013, 11:40 AM
I've been working for a boss who's a slightly tin-foil hat, conspiracy theorist type.

He's convinced the league is run by a mafia and bookie types based on a lot of the game turnouts - I'm not really convinced, but every once in a while you get these results that make you scratch your head.

So the question is simple - do you feel like this year's Finals are a bit staged/set-up? Think of the NBA Blu-Ray of this years finals with all the epic commentary of the back and forth, and the ticket sales, and hype!

I just feel like there's no way the "two best teams" in the league could be blowing each other out every other game like they have; I mean c'mon, the Rockets/Thunder series was full of very close margin wins either way which felt more like competitive basketball - and these were supposedly lesser teams!

This is the breakdown so far -


Game 1 in Miami - Spurs win by a small margin to set the 'shock' tone.
Game 2 in Miami - redemption for the Heat, blowout victory - order is restored for Miami fans
Game 3 in San Antonio - Spurs blowout the Heat, SA fans get excited, now willing to pay more for game 4 tickets
Game 4 in San Antonio - Heat blowout the Spurs, SA fans are reeling, but they still have game 5 to look forward to - this sets up Miami fans to pay more for Game 6 tickets since the series will most certainly go back to Miami



In a tin-foil hat moment of my own, this is how I'm predicting the rest of the series to play out, thinking on a staged/setup line of thinking :


Game 5 in San Antonio - Spurs come back and win by a narrow margin, adding anxiety to the Heat fans anticipating Game 6
Game 6 in Miami - Order is restored yet again, Heat wins by the skin of their teeth (score spreads are getting tighter since the series is winding down and it'll make a great Finals DVD in July when they go on sale with epic soundtracks and commentary to hype you up into buying 10 copies for your friends)
Game 7 in Miami - Predictable that it went to 7 because it'll make the league, the bookmakers, and both teams a lot of extra revenue. My optimistic side puts the Spurs ahead for shock factor to win on the road, and to fire up the rumor mill about Chris Bosh trades - My pessimistic side lets the Heat win in stunning blowout fashion to secure their dominance and to remove the asterisk for winning a shortened season the year before.



What say you? I don't *really* buy into all the conspiracy theories, but you have to admit for the two best in the league, these blowouts make you raise a brow.

dodie53
06-14-2013, 11:48 AM
heat in 6

Max.This
06-14-2013, 11:54 AM
The question really is do you think the NBA gives two licks about fairness if unfairness generates more profit? You can say theres no definitive proof against both sides, but this league is no better than WWE. For the idiots that say "ooh the league wouldn't risk rigging it if its being monitored" ... Madoff? 50 Billion dollar Ponzi scheme? How many people do you know invested millions of dollars only to find out someone on the other end has been sucking you dry. It is dumb to not be suspicious of the blatant inconsistencies in the way they call games. On top of that everyone dismisses that referee who got caught gambling and ratted every ref out, only for the league/ stern to say... ooh hes the only one. Are people really that stupid to think everything is fair?

Dade County
06-14-2013, 11:58 AM
Yes it's stage!

NBA = Entertainment

HEAT wore their Black jerseys last night ( ask OCK what happened last year in game two of the finals; HEAT didn't loss another game and they didn't look back )... all is good now... Big 3 will play for real the rest of the way.

RaiderLakersA's
06-14-2013, 12:02 PM
Yes, it does feel contrived. The Heat are behaving like little boys that like to play with their food before eating...and leaving way too much on the plate, even when they say they're full.

Come on, put on your big boy pants and end the series already. Everyone knows the only really intriguing thing about the NBA at this point is what happens in the offseason.

heyman321
06-14-2013, 12:04 PM
Yes, the NBA mafia affects the physics of air flow and momentum around the ball, therefore they decide whether a player will do well before hand or not. It's a government conspiracy, like the moon landing and how they get caramel into the middle of chocolate bars.

ManRam
06-14-2013, 12:05 PM
Illuminati.

D-Leethal
06-14-2013, 12:06 PM
No.

It is awfully easy to predict thus far though.

ILLUSIONIST^248
06-14-2013, 12:07 PM
Yes it's stage!

NBA = Entertainment

HEAT wore their Black jerseys last night ( ask OCK what happened last year in game two of the finals; HEAT didn't loss another game and they didn't look back )... all is good now... Big 3 will play for real the rest of the way.The NBA makes me wonder sometimes.

Stinkyoutsider
06-14-2013, 12:23 PM
The NBA is in it to make money...

But I think this series reflects how unfamiliar both teams are to each other. If I remember correctly, the Spurs sat some of their players for an away game against the Heat and the Heat may have sat players for an away game against the Spurs.

Plus, both teams have opposite styles too, which makes me think the series is just fine the way it is (Heat being the full court running team and the Spurs being the half court execution team).

FYL_McVeezy
06-14-2013, 01:22 PM
I've been working for a boss who's a slightly tin-foil hat, conspiracy theorist type.

He's convinced the league is run by a mafia and bookie types based on a lot of the game turnouts - I'm not really convinced, but every once in a while you get these results that make you scratch your head.

So the question is simple - do you feel like this year's Finals are a bit staged/set-up? Think of the NBA Blu-Ray of this years finals with all the epic commentary of the back and forth, and the ticket sales, and hype!

I just feel like there's no way the "two best teams" in the league could be blowing each other out every other game like they have; I mean c'mon, the Rockets/Thunder series was full of very close margin wins either way which felt more like competitive basketball - and these were supposedly lesser teams!

This is the breakdown so far -


Game 1 in Miami - Spurs win by a small margin to set the 'shock' tone.
Game 2 in Miami - redemption for the Heat, blowout victory - order is restored for Miami fans
Game 3 in San Antonio - Spurs blowout the Heat, SA fans get excited, now willing to pay more for game 4 tickets
Game 4 in San Antonio - Heat blowout the Spurs, SA fans are reeling, but they still have game 5 to look forward to - this sets up Miami fans to pay more for Game 6 tickets since the series will most certainly go back to Miami



In a tin-foil hat moment of my own, this is how I'm predicting the rest of the series to play out, thinking on a staged/setup line of thinking :


Game 5 in San Antonio - Spurs come back and win by a narrow margin, adding anxiety to the Heat fans anticipating Game 6
Game 6 in Miami - Order is restored yet again, Heat wins by the skin of their teeth (score spreads are getting tighter since the series is winding down and it'll make a great Finals DVD in July when they go on sale with epic soundtracks and commentary to hype you up into buying 10 copies for your friends)
Game 7 in Miami - Predictable that it went to 7 because it'll make the league, the bookmakers, and both teams a lot of extra revenue. My optimistic side puts the Spurs ahead for shock factor to win on the road, and to fire up the rumor mill about Chris Bosh trades - My pessimistic side lets the Heat win in stunning blowout fashion to secure their dominance and to remove the asterisk for winning a shortened season the year before.



What say you? I don't *really* buy into all the conspiracy theories, but you have to admit for the two best in the league, these blowouts make you raise a brow.

You had it spot on until you suggested the Spurs win game 7 on the road.

Assuming there is a storyline here (I believe there is, but it's my opinion I can't prove it) King James cannot keep losing in the finals. He payed his debt (giving Dallas the chip in 2011) to become the top dog in the NBA. Lebron will win this year....and more than likely a 3-peat.

Riodagoat
06-14-2013, 01:24 PM
Yea it's stage. On a close out Game 6, Lebron will break both his legs and miraculously come back to hit a game winning shot.

FYL_McVeezy
06-14-2013, 01:24 PM
Yes it's stage!

NBA = Entertainment

HEAT wore their Black jerseys last night ( ask OCK what happened last year in game two of the finals; HEAT didn't loss another game and they didn't look back )... all is good now... Big 3 will play for real the rest of the way.

I wish more people understood your posts......I was about 98% sure that the Heat would win last night but it turned into 100% when I saw they put on the black jerseys....

Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't LBJ and Heat wear a lot of Red jerseys in the series against Dallas?

And a lot of Black in the series against OKC last year?

JordansBulls
06-14-2013, 01:34 PM
Yes it's stage!

NBA = Entertainment

HEAT wore their Black jerseys last night ( ask OCK what happened last year in game two of the finals; HEAT didn't loss another game and they didn't look back )... all is good now... Big 3 will play for real the rest of the way.

Ha. Reminds me of the feel I got from the Bulls back in the day when they wore the black sneakers come playoff time.
Didn't they wear red jersey's vs Dallas in game 3 and 4 of 2011 and then black in game 5?,I know they wore red in game 6 in 2006 vs dallas

OceanSpray
06-14-2013, 01:44 PM
And when Miami loses, it's not staged. When Miami wins, it's staged. I just don't get it.

Muttman73
06-14-2013, 01:48 PM
**** Yeah it's staged, David Stern is a criminal ... that game last night was a disgrace, any time the Spurs got some momentum the refs took it away.
The HEAT have ruined the NBA and Stern is letting it happen, what a shame.

SlapintheClip
06-14-2013, 01:50 PM
Would you be happy if we said yes?

selassi3
06-14-2013, 01:50 PM
Staged no, manipulated for entertainment purposes yes. Meaning, horrible officiating at times. Heat in 7 if anything. I actually could see Miami doing the exact same thing again, defense, close out those shooters and have the big 3 operate. Too dominant, however if it is for entertainment purposes it's going to game 7.

OceanSpray
06-14-2013, 01:53 PM
And what makes NBA staged over other major sports? Can you guys give it a rest? Mavs won, people said it was staged when Miami was up 2-1. After that, all the talk about it being staged was laid down and everyone just talked smack about LeBron. If it ain't this or that, you guys always got something in that bag of yours to ridicule LeBron.

ManRam
06-14-2013, 01:54 PM
**** Yeah it's staged, David Stern is a criminal ... that game last night was a disgrace, any time the Spurs got some momentum the refs took it away.
The HEAT have ruined the NBA and Stern is letting it happen, what a shame.

why did you even bother watching then?

ILLUSIONIST^248
06-14-2013, 01:55 PM
You had it spot on until you suggested the Spurs win game 7 on the road.

Assuming there is a storyline here (I believe there is, but it's my opinion I can't prove it) King James cannot keep losing in the finals. He payed his debt (giving Dallas the chip in 2011) to become the top dog in the NBA. Lebron will win this year....and more than likely a 3-peat.

Starting to believe it.

FYL_McVeezy
06-14-2013, 01:57 PM
And when Miami loses, it's not staged. When Miami wins, it's staged. I just don't get it.

you obviously didn't read the OP's post in it's entirety...

ILLUSIONIST^248
06-14-2013, 01:57 PM
**** Yeah it's staged, David Stern is a criminal ... that game last night was a disgrace, any time the Spurs got some momentum the refs took it away.
The HEAT have ruined the NBA and Stern is letting it happen, what a shame.

If the Heat win in seven then I fully believe the nba is rigged.

OceanSpray
06-14-2013, 01:58 PM
you obviously didn't read the OP's post in it's entirety...

You're right, I didn't read it. That's because it's always the same thing over and over again. Miami wins, referees must've done something. SPURS win, LeBron choked. Which one is it?

OceanSpray
06-14-2013, 01:58 PM
If the Heat win in seven then I fully believe the nba is rigged.

And then can you please go away, forever?

FYL_McVeezy
06-14-2013, 01:58 PM
**** Yeah it's staged, David Stern is a criminal ... that game last night was a disgrace, any time the Spurs got some momentum the refs took it away.
The HEAT have ruined the NBA and Stern is letting it happen, what a shame.

I don't know how old you are....not that I am old myself..but Stern ruined the league LONG before LBJ decided to form a superteam in Miami....

OceanSpray
06-14-2013, 02:00 PM
I don't know how old you are....not that I am old myself..but Stern ruined the league LONG before LBJ decided to form a superteam in Miami....

No, Stern turned NBA into a major sport. You clearly know nothing. NBA players all love David Stern because of the opportunities he gave all of them. If it weren't for Stern, there would be no Jordan.

FYL_McVeezy
06-14-2013, 02:03 PM
You're right, I didn't read it. That's because it's always the same thing over and over again. Miami wins, referees must've done something. SPURS win, LeBron choked. Which one is it?

This is my opinion...I can't prove it....

The Heat are a great team...Lebron is a great player....if the Heat play like how they played last night they would sweep the Spurs....but the league needs to generate as much $$$ as possible so they create storylines....The spurs win a couple of games to give the illusion of a competitive series (not to take anything away from the Spurs they are a well coached team who played their ***** of) but you know and I know who will ultimately wins this series....

I dont blame LBJ or Wade for this, I don't blame Duncan or Parker for this...I blame that money hungry grubbing bastard Stern for this...

FYL_McVeezy
06-14-2013, 02:04 PM
No, Stern turned NBA into a major sport. You clearly know nothing. NBA players all love David Stern because of the opportunities he gave all of them. If it weren't for Stern, there would be no Jordan.

They love Stern because he generates $$$$$$ for them....not because he's kept the game of basketball pure....these are two seperate things....nothing you said in that post proves anything one way or another...

OceanSpray
06-14-2013, 02:09 PM
They love Stern because he generates $$$$$$ for them....not because he's kept the game of basketball pure....these are two seperate things....nothing you said in that post proves anything one way or another...

Exactly. So the only ones complaining are the bums on their computer crying about Stern fixing games for entertainment purposes. There would be no reason for Spurs to be against Miami, no? I think fans would rather watch Kobe vs LBJ. Explain that? I don't care how you put it, Stern was the driving factor of the NBA. He took Jordan and marketed the hell out of him.

krazylegz
06-14-2013, 02:17 PM
it doesnt take a tin foil hat to see that pro sports is rigged...too much money in it for it not to be,just to what extent is the better question

Snakeyestx
06-14-2013, 02:18 PM
You're right, I didn't read it. That's because it's always the same thing over and over again. Miami wins, referees must've done something. SPURS win, LeBron choked. Which one is it?

If you didn't read the post in its entirety, you shouldn't be posting your opinion because you clearly missed the point of this thread.

You instantly took it as "omg, another Heat hater" which was nothing farther from the truth.

I'm asking about the Finals in general, I couldn't care less if it was Indiana v. Memphis which some people thought was a possibility early in the 2nd round.

I just find it a little peculiar that the results of the games so far are such wildly swung spreads for two of the "best teams in the league." You'd think it'd be a grind-out, close-scoring, absolute war each and every game down to the last play of each game, but it's not even close to that yet.

koberulesall
06-14-2013, 02:19 PM
its fixed no way around it, james' lowered shoulder play is not basketball its football he gets away with murder this league is becoming a joke like the wwe

OceanSpray
06-14-2013, 02:20 PM
If you didn't read the post in its entirety, you shouldn't be posting your opinion because you clearly missed the point of this thread.

You instantly took it as "omg, another Heat hater" which was nothing farther from the truth.

I'm asking about the Finals in general, I couldn't care less if it was Indiana v. Memphis which some people thought was a possibility early in the 2nd round.

I just find it a little peculiar that the results of the games so far are such wildly swung spreads for two of the "best teams in the league." You'd think it'd be a grind-out, close-scoring, absolute war each and every game down to the last play of each game, but it's not even close to that yet.

And who is making these players lose one and win one? Are you saying the players are just as involved? If so, Jordan isn't GOAT. No one is GOAT.

krazylegz
06-14-2013, 02:22 PM
ive stopped taking pro sports seriously when i was,i dont know,14 years old....its entertaining,thats why i watch,but to take it seriously is a joke on you...

FYL_McVeezy
06-14-2013, 02:23 PM
Exactly. So the only ones complaining are the bums on their computer crying about Stern fixing games for entertainment purposes. There would be no reason for Spurs to be against Miami, no? I think fans would rather watch Kobe vs LBJ. Explain that? I don't care how you put it, Stern was the driving factor of the NBA. He took Jordan and marketed the hell out of him.

100% spot on....

At the end of the day Stern is a business man, he job is to maximize the profit of the league......IF fixing games/storylines is true...it is not a crime....

Myself (and i guess the other bums on the computer crying) don't appreciate the fact that it gets predictable after a while (not game to game but series to series) but I have learned to accept it for what it is because whether it is real or fake it is only ENTERTAINMENT.

krazylegz
06-14-2013, 02:28 PM
100% spot on....

At the end of the day Stern is a business man, he job is to maximize the profit of the league......IF fixing games/storylines is true...it is not a crime....

Myself (and i guess the other bums on the computer crying) don't appreciate the fact that it gets predictable after a while (not game to game but series to series) but I have learned to accept it for what it is because whether it is real or fake it is only ENTERTAINMENT.

exactly,its fun to watch...for me,its a break from the grind of my job,but for most people,they take it too seriously...dont do it,youll have a heart attack:)

tr3ymill3r
06-14-2013, 02:29 PM
Spurs win the next 2 games and it's a non issue. Do you really think they need help selling Finals tickets? They could sell them for $1000 a piece and it would still be a sell out, even in the nose bleeds.

tredigs
06-14-2013, 02:43 PM
Screw the naysayers, I ****ing love this forum. "Think of the back and forths, the HYPE!".

Hahahah -- there literally is NO scenario that could occur where a segment of fans would not scream foul.

RaiderLakersA's
06-14-2013, 02:48 PM
Spurs win the next 2 games and it's a non issue. Do you really think they need help selling Finals tickets? They could sell them for $1000 a piece and it would still be a sell out, even in the nose bleeds.

All jokes aside, the sad thing is that there are so many people that feel that way. If Miami wins the series, it's staged. If the Spurs win, though, it's mildly dramatized manipulation for effect, but otherwise a legitimate championship win.

The Heat can't win for losing.

Big Zo
06-14-2013, 02:49 PM
A series with a small market like San Antonio, and blowout games that cause fans to tune out, is exactly what the NBA wants. : /

Minimal
06-14-2013, 02:50 PM
Its definitely looks staged, but it just can't be. Its a competitive sport, not WWE. The only way it can be staged if the refs are working for 1 team or players themselves follow the orders, which is absolutely not true.

Obviously the "staged" story would follow as this:
Spurs take game 5, Miami take game 6 and 7, LeBron has uberultramegajordanesques last 2 games.
We will see what happens.

Dade County
06-14-2013, 03:36 PM
**** Yeah it's staged, David Stern is a criminal ... that game last night was a disgrace, any time the Spurs got some momentum the refs took it away.
The HEAT have ruined the NBA and Stern is letting it happen, what a shame.

Have you ever tried to look at it from this point of view... Every-time you see Lbj forgetting how to shoot or drive to the basket; he could be following orders?

Meaning that, whatever team is benefiting from Lbj not taking over the game is most likely going to win that game. So if you are thinking that, DAMN this team could beat the HEAT ( Boston last year playoffs, Pacers this year playoffs and last, Spurs this year ), but what if Lbj and co, didn't forget how to take over a game, or fake injures, and that other teams gets beat 4-0, would that make you happy as a fan trying to be entertained?

NBA = Entertainment.

Try to look at it from both sides, you might start to see the truth.

Dade County
06-14-2013, 03:40 PM
its fixed no way around it, james' lowered shoulder play is not basketball its football he gets away with murder this league is becoming a joke like the wwe

Do you also point to your team past, and call out stuff they got away with or have done?


Because the Lakers are the poster boys of rigged fandom.

JordansBulls
06-14-2013, 04:35 PM
Since neither team seems to be able to lose two in a row, then that means SA wins game 5, Miami game 6 and SA in 7.

ChitownBears22
06-14-2013, 04:38 PM
Since neither team seems to be able to lose two in a row, then that means SA wins game 5, Miami game 6 and SA in 7.

What does this have to do with the topic? Reading is really hard.

PhillyFaninLA
06-14-2013, 04:53 PM
No.

It is awfully easy to predict thus far though.


I'm with you on this, I was talking to someone at work about this exact thing earlier.

cmellofan15
06-14-2013, 04:57 PM
What happens next game guys?

PhillyFaninLA
06-14-2013, 05:11 PM
What happens next game guys?

Spurs win close then the Heat win big then win close in game 7.

shep33
06-14-2013, 05:13 PM
They feel boring. 1 good game so far.

pacofunk64
06-14-2013, 05:25 PM
Really...the only thing I'm surprised is 3 of the 4 games have been blowouts. i'm not surprised that it's been a slug fest back in forth though. We got to get over everything being a conspiracy.

RaiderLakersA's
06-14-2013, 05:46 PM
Spurs win close then the Heat win big then win close in game 7.

Miami wins game 5. It's not close.

Game 6 the Spurs win in OT.

Game 7 the Heat win. They're down early, but come back in the 4th quarter to seal the deal.

MyDRoseLikeDeng
06-14-2013, 06:13 PM
If Miami brings it like last night, the Spurs just cannot win another game. The Spurs need every single person to be productive and Pop has got to be better. For as much as Spo gets scrutinized, Pop deserves some blame for the loss last night. His subs at the end of the third and into the fourth were awful

Minimal
06-14-2013, 06:26 PM
I believe the next game will be really close and the outcome will be decided in the last minute of the game.

KingsOfQueens
06-14-2013, 07:00 PM
The league has been rigged. Do we need to re-visit the 2002 WC finals? The NBA will do anything to make sure their most marketable stars are winning. I wasn't always a proponent of this assertion but the exponential increase in questionable calls by officials has me skeptical.

The NBA is entertainment. Enjoy it. However, it's a business. As is the music industry, Hollywood, and politics. In the end its all about a green piece of paper. Don't overthink it. But that's why things are the way they are.

ChitownBears22
06-14-2013, 07:09 PM
The league has been rigged. Do we need to re-visit the 2002 WC finals? The NBA will do anything to make sure their most marketable stars are winning. I wasn't always a proponent of this assertion but the exponential increase in questionable calls by officials has me skeptical.

The NBA is entertainment. Enjoy it. However, it's a business. As is the music industry, Hollywood, and politics. In the end its all about a green piece of paper. Don't overthink it. But that's why things are the way they are.

Please explain how the Spurs are in over LAC, LAL, OKC then. Spurs notoriously have low rated finals series. See 2007, 2013 (Games 1-3).

OceanSpray
06-14-2013, 07:12 PM
The league has been rigged. Do we need to re-visit the 2002 WC finals? The NBA will do anything to make sure their most marketable stars are winning. I wasn't always a proponent of this assertion but the exponential increase in questionable calls by officials has me skeptical.

The NBA is entertainment. Enjoy it. However, it's a business. As is the music industry, Hollywood, and politics. In the end its all about a green piece of paper. Don't overthink it. But that's why things are the way they are.

This guy really thinks he's Einstein. So how did NBA profit off Dirk beating James?

ChitownBears22
06-14-2013, 07:14 PM
This guy really thinks he's Einstein. So how did NBA profit off Dirk beating James?

How does the NBA profit in any way? These TV contracts are in place years in advance, they get money no matter what.

ManRam
06-14-2013, 07:25 PM
The NBA will do anything to make sure their most marketable stars are winning.

Then why did only one (two I guess) of their most marketable stars have a good playoff run?

OceanSpray
06-14-2013, 07:33 PM
How does the NBA profit in any way? These TV contracts are in place years in advance, they get money no matter what.

I'm pretty sure they get royalties. But that doesn't make sense, if NBA was fixed for profit, Kobe vs James would've been established by now.

Bruins2012
06-14-2013, 07:38 PM
"Studying under Dick Bavetta for 13 years was like pursuing a graduate degree in advanced game manipulation. He knew how to marshal the tempo and tone of a game better than any referee in the league, by far. He also knew how to take subtle — and not so subtle — cues from the NBA front office and extend a playoff series or, worse yet, change the complexion of that series."


"You would think that the NBA would love a guy who plays such great defense. Think again! Star stoppers hurt the promotion of marquee players. Fans don't pay high prices to see players like Raja Bell — they pay to see superstars like Kobe Bryant score 40 points. Basketball purists like to see good defense, but the NBA wants the big names to score big points.
If a player of Kobe's stature collides with the likes of Raja Bell, the call will almost always go for Kobe and against Bell. As part of our ongoing training and game preparation, NBA referees regularly receive game-action video tape from the league office. Over the years, I have reviewed many recorded hours of video involving Raja Bell. The footage I analyzed usually illustrated fouls being called against Bell, rarely for him. The message was subtle but clear — call fouls against the star stopper because he's hurting the game."

KingsOfQueens
06-14-2013, 08:54 PM
Please explain how the Spurs are in over LAC, LAL, OKC then. Spurs notoriously have low rated finals series. See 2007, 2013 (Games 1-3).

Because the Spurs are a damn good team. Obviously refs can't control everything, but as noted, they can certainly change the direction of a game and/or series and have done so. They have 3 HOFers on that squad, they're obviously going to find a way to win.


This guy really thinks he's Einstein. So how did NBA profit off Dirk beating James?

Lebron wet the bed in 2011. The NBA, Nike, SI, etc. all profit off a marketable superstar. That is just a fact of business. Nike made $300M in 2012 alone from Lebron's sneakers. A 50% increase from 2011!!


How does the NBA profit in any way? These TV contracts are in place years in advance, they get money no matter what.

Yes the NBA profits no matter what, but more stars generate more money via TV ratings, endorsements, jersey sales, ticket sales, etc.


Then why did only one (two I guess) of their most marketable stars have a good playoff run?

Huh? I'm assuming you mean Kobe & Lebron? The Lakers path the finals was paved for them in 2002. Which is enough conclusive evidence in itself. And we've been seeing questionable calls go the Heat's way for the past few years now.

(For the record, yeah, I'm a Knicks fan...but I'm not a Lebron hater by any means. Dude is an incredible player and I've spent close to $3,000 on his sneakers lol)

ChitownBears22
06-14-2013, 08:59 PM
Because the Spurs are a damn good team. Obviously refs can't control everything, but as noted, they can certainly change the direction of a game and/or series and have done so. They have 3 HOFers on that squad, they're obviously going to find a way to win.



Lebron wet the bed in 2011. The NBA, Nike, SI, etc. all profit off a marketable superstar. That is just a fact of business. Nike made $300M in 2012 alone from Lebron's sneakers. A 50% increase from 2011!!


Yes the NBA profits no matter what, but more stars generate more money via TV ratings, endorsements, jersey sales, ticket sales, etc.



Huh? I'm assuming you mean Kobe & Lebron? The Lakers path the finals was paved for them in 2002. Which is enough conclusive evidence in itself. And we've been seeing questionable calls go the Heat's way for the past few years now.

(For the record, yeah, I'm a Knicks fan...but I'm not a Lebron hater by any means. Dude is an incredible player and I've spent close to $3,000 on his sneakers lol)

I would like a citiation on the Nike profits increasing. Nike doesn't break their annual report down in such a way.

Endorsements, TV ratings, jersey sales, ETC are not inflated because of the Finals. TV contracts are set up way in advanced years before a finals game is even played. Endorsements are between a player and company, NBA doesn't gain anything from this. And jersey sales don't inflate enough to fix games. You are talking risking a leagues integrity for maybe 10 million in sales and I am being generous on that figure.

ManRam
06-14-2013, 09:05 PM
Huh? I'm assuming you mean Kobe & Lebron? The Lakers path the finals was paved for them in 2002. Which is enough conclusive evidence in itself. And we've been seeing questionable calls go the Heat's way for the past few years now.

(For the record, yeah, I'm a Knicks fan...but I'm not a Lebron hater by any means. Dude is an incredible player and I've spent close to $3,000 on his sneakers lol)


Maybe I took that quote too much out of context. I didn't really read much of this thread and just saw someone quoting you.

I was referring to this year. I see very little compelling evidence suggesting anything fishy has gone on this year. The refereeing has universally been lauded. We have small market teams everywhere beating their bigger market/more popular counterparts. We had quick (or at least quicker than expected) exits for every one of the league's most marketable superstars, besides Wade and LeBron.

It just doesn't seem like much has been staged here. :shrug:

The two best teams in the league are squaring off and it's tied 2-2. Don't see what's off about that.


Funny how things are always staged when it's the best teams being involved.

scaramantula
06-14-2013, 09:06 PM
if anything about the nba is rigged it isnt the game, its where the players end up and how the draft plays out, the actual games still seem to be about skill, you have to make the basket right? the nba just gives the teams they like a bigger advantage

KingsOfQueens
06-14-2013, 09:06 PM
I would like a citiation on the Nike profits increasing. Nike doesn't break their annual report down in such a way.

Endorsements, TV ratings, jersey sales, ETC are not inflated because of the Finals. TV contracts are set up way in advanced years before a finals game is even played. Endorsements are between a player and company, NBA doesn't gain anything from this. And jersey sales don't inflate enough to fix games. You are talking risking a leagues integrity for maybe 10 million in sales and I am being generous on that figure.


Nike generated $300 million in U.S. retail sales in 2012 for James’ signature shoes, according to research firm SportsOneSource. Nike’s haul represents a 50% increase from sales of James’ kicks in 2011.
-Forbes.com

And if you get caught lying once, your integrity is in question. It leaves the door open for the possibility to be lied to again. This applies to normal people, politicians, and in this case, the NBA.

The 2002 Western Conference Finals is CLEAR example of the league being rigged. If they did it then, there's no reason why it wouldn't be present today.

Unless of course, you accepted their apology when they said they won't do it again. lol.

KingsOfQueens
06-14-2013, 09:09 PM
Maybe I took that quote too much out of context. I didn't really read much of this thread and just saw someone quoting you.

I was referring to this year. I see very little compelling evidence suggesting anything fishy has gone on this year. The refereeing has universally been lauded. We have small market teams everywhere beating their bigger market/more popular counterparts. We had quick (or at least quicker than expected) exits for every one of the league's most marketable superstars, besides Wade and LeBron.

It just doesn't seem like much has been staged here. :shrug:

The two best teams in the league are squaring off and it's tied 2-2. Don't see what's off about that.


Funny how things are always staged when it's the best teams being involved.

Oh yeah, to be honest, I don't think anything in this particular series has much to do with being rigged. Maybe some calls, but I think the better team won in all 4 games.

However, the integrity of the league as a whole, that is what I question.

Why do you think the NBA fines more than any other league when you openly question officiating? :rolleyes:

ChitownBears22
06-14-2013, 09:12 PM
-Forbes.com

And if you get caught lying once, your integrity is in question. It leaves the door open for the possibility to be lied to again. This applies to normal people, politicians, and in this case, the NBA.

The 2002 Western Conference Finals is CLEAR example of the league being rigged. If they did it then, there's no reason why it wouldn't be present today.

Unless of course, you accepted their apology when they said they won't do it again. lol.

Didn't know that about his shoes. I usually wear Kobe's. I do have the Soldier 6's though and they are comfortable for game play.

As for the lying. We don't know to what extent the rigging went in 2002. We don't know if it was Stern that ordered it or if it was part of the better scheme going on with the refs. But since then a number of checks and balances have been put into place. Does it stop every little negative thing from happening, no. But it is hard to say that there has been any rigging in these playoffs.

ManRam
06-14-2013, 09:12 PM
if anything about the nba is rigged it isnt the game, its where the players end up and how the draft plays out, the actual games still seem to be about skill, you have to make the basket right? the nba just gives the teams they like a bigger advantage

I say it all the time, but I think the draft is the one thing I'd say with certainty isn't rigged any more.

The way it's set up, the private third parties involved, the amount of people you'd have to silence to get it done, and so on. Maybe when they were drawing envelopes, but not now. There are too many entities involved with too much money at stake to ever be complicit in it all.

KingsOfQueens
06-14-2013, 09:19 PM
Didn't know that about his shoes. I usually wear Kobe's. I do have the Soldier 6's though and they are comfortable for game play.

As for the lying. We don't know to what extent the rigging went in 2002. We don't know if it was Stern that ordered it or if it was part of the better scheme going on with the refs. But since then a number of checks and balances have been put into place. Does it stop every little negative thing from happening, no. But it is hard to say that there has been any rigging in these playoffs.

Yeah I love Kobe's too. His 8's are definitely my favorite summertime shoe.

I don't know man, I guess it depends how you look at the game. I try to look at it more from a spectator/observer standpoint than a fan. Recent years have really made me question the league. I try not to think about it because it gets depressing.

But I definitely think that 2002 WCF was set by Stern.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qjRcTiwVEwo

Thats just a short 8 minute video. The entire game is also on YouTube in separate parts...You have to type in "The Greatest Tragedy in Sports" Lol

Bruins2012
06-14-2013, 09:20 PM
if anything about the nba is rigged it isnt the game, its where the players end up and how the draft plays out, the actual games still seem to be about skill, you have to make the basket right? the nba just gives the teams they like a bigger advantage



"To have a little fun at the expense of the worst troublemakers, the referees working the game would sometimes make a modest friendly wager amongst themselves: first ref to give one of the bad boys a technical foul wouldn't have to tip the ball boy that night. In the NBA, ball boys set up the referees' locker room and keep it stocked with food and beer for the postgame meal. We usually ran the kid ragged with a variety of personal requests and then slipped him a $20 bill. Technically, the winner of the bet won twice — he didn't have to pay the kid and he got to call a T on Mr. Foul-Mouthed Big-Shot Du Jour.
After the opening tip, it was hilarious as the three of us immediately focused our full attention on the intended victim, waiting for something, anything, to justify a technical foul. If the guy so much as looked at one of us and mumbled, we rang him up. Later in the referees' locker room, we would down a couple of brews, eat some chicken wings, and laugh like hell.
We had another variation of this gag simply referred to as the "first foul of the game" bet. While still in the locker room before tip-off, we would make a wager on which of us would call the game's first foul. That referee would either have to pay the ball boy or pick up the dinner tab for the other two referees. Sometimes, the ante would be $50 a guy. Like the technical foul bet, it was hilarious — only this time we were testing each other's nerves to see who had the guts to hold out the longest before calling a personal foul. There were occasions when we would hold back for two or three minutes — an eternity in an NBA game — before blowing the whistle. It didn't matter if bodies were flying all over the place; no fouls were called because no one wanted to lose the bet.
We played this little game during the regular season and summer league. After a game, all three refs would gather around the VCR and watch a replay of the game. Early in the contest, the announcers would say, "Holy cow! They're really letting them play tonight!" If they only knew...
During one particular summer game, Duke Callahan, Mark Wunderlich, and I made it to the three-minute mark in the first quarter without calling a foul. We were running up and down the court, laughing our ***** off as the players got hammered with no whistles. The players were exhausted from the nonstop running when Callahan finally called the first foul because Mikki Moore of the New Jersey Nets literally tackled an opposing player right in front of him. Too bad for Callahan — he lost the bet.
I became so good at this game that if an obvious foul was committed right in front of me, I would call a travel or a three-second violation instead. Those violations are not personal fouls, so I was still in the running to win the bet. The players would look at me with disbelief on their faces as if to say, "What the hell was that?"



"From my earliest involvement with Bavetta, I learned that he likes to keep games close, and that when a team gets down by double-digit points, he helps the players save face. He accomplishes this act of mercy by quietly, and frequently, blowing the whistle on the team that's having the better night. Team fouls suddenly become one-sided between the contestants, and the score begins to tighten up. That's the way Dick Bavetta referees a game — and everyone in the league knew it."


"ESPN.com: So explain then, how a referee could control the outcome of a game so that he or associates of his could win a bet?

BL: Totally with the fouls he calls. If he has fixed the total and has a number he's thinking of, he can get the team in the bonus earlier in the quarter. Let's say he wants a final score where both teams tally more than 205 points and he needs 59 points in the fourth quarter to make that happen. If he puts both teams in the penalty with 8:00 to go and every foul is a free throw, it's not too hard to have a 60-point quarter. "

ChitownBears22
06-14-2013, 09:23 PM
Yeah I love Kobe's too. His 8's are definitely my favorite summertime shoe.

I don't know man, I guess it depends how you look at the game. I try to look at it more from a spectator/observer standpoint than a fan. Recent years have really made me question the league. I try not to think about it because it gets depressing.

But I definitely think that 2002 WCF was set by Stern.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qjRcTiwVEwo

Thats just a short 8 minute video. The entire game is also on YouTube in separate parts...You have to type in "The Greatest Tragedy in Sports" Lol

I have the 8's, but I don't think anything will ever replace my Zoom 4's. Fit my foot perfectly. I have like 8 pairs of them now. Only thing available online now is the Carpe Diem version though.

At work I can't get to youtube. I just think there is too much to lose by rigging the league. If there was real corruption don't you think the owners of a bunch of small market teams would call it out? They would be the ones getting screwed.

3RDASYSTEM
06-14-2013, 09:23 PM
And who is making these players lose one and win one? Are you saying the players are just as involved? If so, Jordan isn't GOAT. No one is GOAT.

Now you're on to something

just look at LEBRON body language from game 4 compared to game 3

basically night and day outside of that late 3rd qtr spurt

it was almost like me watching him guard TERRY in 11' FINALS and going the opposite way when he saw TERRY breaking the other way and him passing the ball when he had wide open layups or looks from pointblank range at times

JORDAN is the media GOAT, not amongst the majority of nba peers behind closed doors, WILT and RUSSELL and a lot of players don't think he is, WILT feel like the nba did JORDAN a favor and went away from handcheck to softening the rules for JORDAN, even WALTON said ALCINDOR is the best he has ever saw and played against, BIRD said WILT is the best/greatest alltime, just look at the record books

JORDAN was marketed the heaviest and most, but he did have game, so that made it space jam gravy

Bruins2012
06-14-2013, 09:24 PM
Yeah I love Kobe's too. His 8's are definitely my favorite summertime shoe.

I don't know man, I guess it depends how you look at the game. I try to look at it more from a spectator/observer standpoint than a fan. Recent years have really made me question the league. I try not to think about it because it gets depressing.

But I definitely think that 2002 WCF was set by Stern.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qjRcTiwVEwo

Thats just a short 8 minute video. The entire game is also on YouTube in separate parts...You have to type in "The Greatest Tragedy in Sports" Lol


The 2002 Western Conference Finals between the Los Angeles Lakers and the Sacramento Kings presents a stunning example of game and series manipulation at its ugliest. As the teams prepared for Game 6 at the Staples Center, Sacramento had a 3–2 lead in the series. The referees assigned to work Game 6 were Dick Bavetta, Bob Delaney, and Ted Bernhardt. As soon as the referees for the game were chosen, the rest of us knew immediately that there would be a Game 7. A prolonged series was good for the league, good for the networks, and good for the game. Oh, and one more thing: it was great for the big-market, star-studded Los Angeles Lakers.

In the pregame meeting prior to Game 6, the league office sent down word that certain calls — calls that would have benefitted the Lakers — were being missed by the referees. This was the type of not-so-subtle information that I and other referees were left to interpret. After receiving the dispatch, Bavetta openly talked about the fact that the league wanted a Game 7.

"If we give the benefit of the calls to the team that's down in the series, nobody's going to complain. The series will be even at three apiece, and then the better team can win Game 7," Bavetta stated.

As history shows, Sacramento lost Game 6 in a wild come-from-behind thriller that saw the Lakers repeatedly sent to the foul line by the referees. For other NBA referees watching the game on television, it was a shameful performance by Bavetta's crew, one of the most poorly officiated games of all time.

The 2002 series certainly wasn't the first or last time Bavetta weighed in on an important game. He also worked Game 7 of the 2000 Western Conference Finals between the Lakers and the Trail Blazers. The Lakers were down by 13 at the start of the fourth quarter when Bavetta went to work. The Lakers outscored Portland 31–13 in the fourth quarter and went on to win the game and the series. It certainly didn't hurt the Lakers that they got to shoot 37 free throws compared to a paltry 16 for the Trail Blazers.

Two weeks before the 2003–04 season ended, Bavetta and I were assigned to officiate a game in Oakland. That afternoon before the tip-off, we were discussing an upcoming game on our schedule. It was the last regular-season game we were scheduled to work, pitting Denver against San Antonio. Denver had lost a game a few weeks prior because of a mistake made by the referees, a loss that could be the difference between them making or missing the playoffs. Bavetta told me Denver needed the win and that it would look bad for the staff and the league if the Nuggets missed the playoffs by one game. There were still a few games left on the schedule before the end of the season, and the standings could potentially change. But on that day in Oakland, Bavetta looked at me and casually stated, "Denver will win if they need the game. That's why I'm on it."

I was thinking, How is Denver going to win on the road in San Antonio? At the time, the Spurs were arguably the best team in the league. Bavetta answered my question before it was asked.

"Duncan will be on the bench with three fouls within the first five minutes of the game," he calmly stated.

Bavetta went on to inform me that it wasn't the first time the NBA assigned him to a game for a specific purpose. He cited examples, including the 1993 playoff series when he put New Jersey guard Drazen Petrovic on the bench with quick fouls to help Cleveland beat the Nets. He also spoke openly about the 2002 Los Angeles–Sacramento series and called himself the NBA's "go-to guy."

As it turned out, Denver didn't need the win after all; they locked up a spot in the playoffs before they got to San Antonio. In a twist of fate, it was the Spurs that ended up needing the win to have a shot at the division title, and Bavetta generously accommodated. In our pregame meeting, he talked about how important the game was to San Antonio and how meaningless it was to Denver, and that San Antonio was going to get the benefit of the calls that night. Armed with this inside information, I called Jack Concannon before the game and told him to bet the Spurs.

To no surprise, we won big. San Antonio blew Denver out of the building that evening, winning by 26 points. When Jack called me the following morning, he expressed amazement at the way an NBA game could be manipulated. Sobering, yes; amazing, no. That's how the game is played in the National Basketball Association.

4milesperday
06-14-2013, 09:30 PM
One thing that perplexes me is body language after 3rd quarter, it almost seem like each team knows who will win and decide not to show up for fourth

KingsOfQueens
06-14-2013, 09:32 PM
I have the 8's, but I don't think anything will ever replace my Zoom 4's. Fit my foot perfectly. I have like 8 pairs of them now. Only thing available online now is the Carpe Diem version though.

At work I can't get to youtube. I just think there is too much to lose by rigging the league. If there was real corruption don't you think the owners of a bunch of small market teams would call it out? They would be the ones getting screwed.

You have some classics then. The 4s are what made Kobes what they are today.

Watch the video when you get a chance. It's really worth watching and I guarantee you'll show it to your fellow basketball heads.

And to answer your question, no I don't think they'd call anything out for one second. Money talks.

In this case, money silences. They're being paid millions to play a game. If they are considered detrimental to the league, the NBA can easily have that player/owner/whatever blackballed. (Allen Iverson)

ChitownBears22
06-14-2013, 09:37 PM
You have some classics then. The 4s are what made Kobes what they are today.

Watch the video when you get a chance. It's really worth watching and I guarantee you'll show it to your fellow basketball heads.

And to answer your question, no I don't think they'd call anything out for one second. Money talks.

In this case, money silences. They're being paid millions to play a game. If they are considered detrimental to the league, the NBA can easily have that player/owner/whatever blackballed. (Allen Iverson)

Can you imagine how much money some of these lower level execs would get in book rights, movie rights, ETC if they whistleblew on the NBA. Especially if it led all the way to the top. Tens of millions of dollars that they wouldn't make over their career lifetimes.

NJrockPD
06-14-2013, 10:45 PM
I don't know about the mafia, but I feel like the revenue the owners are getting from their respective teams has something to do with the result of the games. How many heat fans do you see now a days? How many did you see before Lebron and the boys went down there to win their 8 rings? Three consecutive years in the finals. I'm not saying the Heat aren't a great team, but I wouldn't be surprised if forces beyond the players control gave them a slight boost when they need it.

bholly
06-15-2013, 12:12 AM
So the question is simple - do you feel like this year's Finals are a bit staged/set-up? Think of the NBA Blu-Ray of this years finals with all the epic commentary of the back and forth, and the ticket sales, and hype!

I just feel like there's no way the "two best teams" in the league could be blowing each other out every other game like they have; I mean c'mon, the Rockets/Thunder series was full of very close margin wins either way which felt more like competitive basketball - and these were supposedly lesser teams!

This is the funniest bit to me. You think they're staging the finals to increase ticket sales and hype and sell dvds, and they decided to do it with blowouts that people switch off after 3 quarters and never want to watch again? Um, what?

tredigs
06-15-2013, 12:18 AM
Outside of ManRam and BHolly, I want you all castrated.

cmellofan15
06-15-2013, 12:23 AM
Can we stage the next finals somewhere better than San Antonio or Oklahoma City?

OceanSpray
06-15-2013, 02:22 AM
Because the Spurs are a damn good team. Obviously refs can't control everything, but as noted, they can certainly change the direction of a game and/or series and have done so. They have 3 HOFers on that squad, they're obviously going to find a way to win.



Lebron wet the bed in 2011. The NBA, Nike, SI, etc. all profit off a marketable superstar. That is just a fact of business. Nike made $300M in 2012 alone from Lebron's sneakers. A 50% increase from 2011!!



Yes the NBA profits no matter what, but more stars generate more money via TV ratings, endorsements, jersey sales, ticket sales, etc.



Huh? I'm assuming you mean Kobe & Lebron? The Lakers path the finals was paved for them in 2002. Which is enough conclusive evidence in itself. And we've been seeing questionable calls go the Heat's way for the past few years now.

(For the record, yeah, I'm a Knicks fan...but I'm not a Lebron hater by any means. Dude is an incredible player and I've spent close to $3,000 on his sneakers lol)

You don't make any sense. NBA doesn't make more with James losing than winning. James sneaker sales is irrelevant as it has nothing to do with NBA. Then you go and say that Spurs are still in this because they are just too good even if the refs are against them? So how do you explain the refs giving Spurs more free throws and calls this entire series?

joshhorvath
06-17-2013, 01:23 AM
I've been working for a boss who's a slightly tin-foil hat, conspiracy theorist type.

He's convinced the league is run by a mafia and bookie types based on a lot of the game turnouts - I'm not really convinced, but every once in a while you get these results that make you scratch your head.

So the question is simple - do you feel like this year's Finals are a bit staged/set-up? Think of the NBA Blu-Ray of this years finals with all the epic commentary of the back and forth, and the ticket sales, and hype!

I just feel like there's no way the "two best teams" in the league could be blowing each other out every other game like they have; I mean c'mon, the Rockets/Thunder series was full of very close margin wins either way which felt more like competitive basketball - and these were supposedly lesser teams!

This is the breakdown so far -


Game 1 in Miami - Spurs win by a small margin to set the 'shock' tone.
Game 2 in Miami - redemption for the Heat, blowout victory - order is restored for Miami fans
Game 3 in San Antonio - Spurs blowout the Heat, SA fans get excited, now willing to pay more for game 4 tickets
Game 4 in San Antonio - Heat blowout the Spurs, SA fans are reeling, but they still have game 5 to look forward to - this sets up Miami fans to pay more for Game 6 tickets since the series will most certainly go back to Miami



In a tin-foil hat moment of my own, this is how I'm predicting the rest of the series to play out, thinking on a staged/setup line of thinking :


Game 5 in San Antonio - Spurs come back and win by a narrow margin, adding anxiety to the Heat fans anticipating Game 6
Game 6 in Miami - Order is restored yet again, Heat wins by the skin of their teeth (score spreads are getting tighter since the series is winding down and it'll make a great Finals DVD in July when they go on sale with epic soundtracks and commentary to hype you up into buying 10 copies for your friends)
Game 7 in Miami - Predictable that it went to 7 because it'll make the league, the bookmakers, and both teams a lot of extra revenue. My optimistic side puts the Spurs ahead for shock factor to win on the road, and to fire up the rumor mill about Chris Bosh trades - My pessimistic side lets the Heat win in stunning blowout fashion to secure their dominance and to remove the asterisk for winning a shortened season the year before.



What say you? I don't *really* buy into all the conspiracy theories, but you have to admit for the two best in the league, these blowouts make you raise a brow.

looks like you were right, now onto game 6 were the Heat will win.

jerellh528
06-17-2013, 01:30 AM
No, spurs shooters and hitting 3s, lebron is choking.

PHX2daDEATH
06-17-2013, 01:50 AM
We will see BEAST MODE, Cavalier Lebron James in games six and seven ..you know the one from the game 5 in the indy series. The ways San Antone defends Lebron and how he either passes or shoots a half assed jumper make,me believe this whole series is fixed. Rodman was right Jordans 96,97,98 teams would wipe the floor with miami. If SA wins Duncan goes down as the best player of the era over Shaq, Kobe, lebron, anybody.

Ironman5219
06-17-2013, 02:09 AM
Wow there is always excuses for Bandwagon Miami fans.... GO SPURS!

majestic
06-17-2013, 04:02 AM
This guy really thinks he's Einstein. So how did NBA profit off Dirk beating James?

Mavs beat the heat so the heat haters/lebron haters which is more fans then actually lbj fans more involved in basketball. Now when the heat lose a game it catches people eyes and they will pay attention. Notice how the Heat lose alot of game 1's? Or go down a game and then they win the series like vs Boston last year?. Same thing will happen in this series Heat will win in 7. It's all for Drama. It's scripted a way Stern wants it and then the refs place bets and control the series. Donaghey told us everything we needed. Anybody that actually think this league is legit is blind.

FYL_McVeezy
06-17-2013, 09:26 AM
Mavs beat the heat so the heat haters/lebron haters which is more fans then actually lbj fans more involved in basketball. Now when the heat lose a game it catches people eyes and they will pay attention. Notice how the Heat lose alot of game 1's? Or go down a game and then they win the series like vs Boston last year?. Same thing will happen in this series Heat will win in 7. It's all for Drama. It's scripted a way Stern wants it and then the refs place bets and control the series. Donaghey told us everything we needed. Anybody that actually think this league is legit is blind.

It looks more and more like the master plan is coming into fruition

LBJ turns into Optimus Prime on Tuesday....

Heat in 7.....

koreancabbage
06-17-2013, 09:31 AM
Yea it's stage. On a close out Game 6, Lebron will break both his legs and miraculously come back to hit a game winning shot.

wait, isn't that paul pierce in the wheelchair?

koreancabbage
06-17-2013, 09:31 AM
Wow there is always excuses for Bandwagon Miami fans.... GO SPURS!

says the rest of the fans who are bandwagon Spurs fans.

4milesperday
06-17-2013, 09:32 AM
If you don't believe there is something suspicious about this series, then you don't believe that a basketball game can be controlled. Anyone notice that Miami didn't get any of the calls they get in game 2 and 4, in game 1, 3 and 5? Somehow the refs only focused on Miami lastnight and exposes any potential mistake, things they just happen to miss when the Spurs do it. LOL

D-Leethal
06-17-2013, 09:43 AM
You guys sound like a bunch of 12 year olds. Is Stern bribing LeBron to choke away the 2nd halves and shoot like 2-11? Is he bribing Danny Green to shoot like 75% from 3 for the series? The officiating hasn't even been that bad, and there is not one legitimate reason the NBA would want the Spurs to beat the Heat just like the theory above about why he would want Dallas and one of the most uninteresting superstars/championship teams of all time to beat the Heat is as stupid a theory as I have ever heard.

Every single game outside of game 1 was an easy win that different officiating would have made no difference at all in.

ColtsSpursTerps
06-17-2013, 09:45 AM
I wouldn't be surprised if a good bit of that was true, but not specifically because of this series. point-shaving has been an issue/controversy in the league for some time now.

D-Leethal
06-17-2013, 09:48 AM
If you don't believe there is something suspicious about this series, then you don't believe that a basketball game can be controlled. Anyone notice that Miami didn't get any of the calls they get in game 2 and 4, in game 1, 3 and 5? Somehow the refs only focused on Miami lastnight and exposes any potential mistake, things they just happen to miss when the Spurs do it. LOL

There were at least 4 blatantly bad calls that went against San Antonio last night that weren't even judgement calls - just wrong calls. Thats the nature of the beast dude, you are a Heat fan so your not even going to acknowledge the crappy calls that go your way, your gonna focus on the ones that go against you and cry about them when you lose. You should probably grow a pair and discuss the actual basketball reasons your team continues to get spanked and your superstar continues to hide.

Snakeyestx
06-17-2013, 09:48 AM
Game 5 in San Antonio - Spurs come back and win by a narrow margin, adding anxiety to the Heat fans anticipating Game 6


Well... narrower than the previous 3 games. :p

D-Leethal
06-17-2013, 09:50 AM
Do you conspiracy theorists believe the players are in on it too? Is LeBron throwing games purposefully and magnets being activated to attract Danny Green's 3 balls to the net?

FYL_McVeezy
06-17-2013, 09:54 AM
If you don't believe there is something suspicious about this series, then you don't believe that a basketball game can be controlled. Anyone notice that Miami didn't get any of the calls they get in game 2 and 4, in game 1, 3 and 5? Somehow the refs only focused on Miami lastnight and exposes any potential mistake, things they just happen to miss when the Spurs do it. LOL

Did you realize this before or after the refs trolled Miami last night? LOL

But seriously it goes deeper than bad calls and good calls, it's the timing of the calls and the consistency.

Refs choose when to make certain calls.....it seemed like every time Mia was creeping away at the lead, the refs would make some BS call (whether it was a good call or a bad call) and kill thier momentum...

But hey what do I know? I'm just a tin-foil hat wearing conspiracy theorist to some. The rest of you can go back to thinking the NBA is 100% legit and there is no way possible that games can be manipulated to increase the revenue of a series....

D-Leethal
06-17-2013, 10:12 AM
Did you realize this before or after the refs trolled Miami last night? LOL

But seriously it goes deeper than bad calls and good calls, it's the timing of the calls and the consistency.

Refs choose when to make certain calls.....it seemed like every time Mia was creeping away at the lead, the refs would make some BS call (whether it was a good call or a bad call) and kill thier momentum...

But hey what do I know? I'm just a tin-foil hat wearing conspiracy theorist to some. The rest of you can go back to thinking the NBA is 100% legit and there is no way possible that games can be manipulated to increase the revenue of a series....

There are way too many holes in your conspiracy arguments for anyone to legitimately believe it.

Why would they allow 4 small markets in the Conference Finals? Lakers getting swept? Knicks not making it to ECF to face the Heat? Memphis vs SA in the most unwatchable and unwatched conference Final in history? Why didn't OKC make it more of a series last year when that had the superstars capable of making it an all time great series? Does Stern just pick and choose when he wants to maximize revenue and just allow some series to be complete and utter revenue failures? Most conspiracy theorists argued for years how much Stern hated the Spurs, their boring style of dominance, they were the anti-hype machine for years and years and now Stern wants them to beat THE biggest NBA hype machine of all time? They wanted the most unmarketable superstar in the league to take out THE biggest NBA hype machine of all time 2 years ago?

Present a legitimate argument with less holes than swiss cheese that doesn't contradict itself all over the place and you might get some dudes that aren't whiney little pre-teen Miami fans to agree with you.

h2r09
06-17-2013, 10:21 AM
I dont think the refs are making it go 7. the teams are doing that themselves. I just think the refs that work the finals are absolutely incompetent. Tony Brothers and Monty Mccutchen are the worst refs ive ever seen. Not even against 1 team, just awful in every aspect of every team.

The way certain refs control the games with inconsistent and downright awful calls is pitiful and the fact that whoever decides the refs for each game keeps putting the same 3 crews on rotation in the finals is pathetic. How Joey Crawford, Monty Mccutchen, Tony Brothers, Dan Crawford. How are these guys reffing at this point in the year when they are universally the worst refs the league has? HOW ON EARTH CAN THAT BE POSSIBLE?

D-Leethal
06-17-2013, 10:23 AM
I dont think the refs are making it go 7. the teams are doing that themselves. I just think the refs that work the finals are absolutely incompetent. Tony Brothers and Monty Mccutchen are the worst refs ive ever seen. Not even against 1 team, just awful in every aspect of every team.

The way certain refs control the games with inconsistent and downright awful calls is pitiful and the fact that whoever decides the refs for each game keeps putting the same 3 crews on rotation in the finals is pathetic. How Joey Crawford, Monty Mccutchen, Tony Brothers, Dan Crawford. How are these guys reffing at this point in the year when they are universally the worst refs the league has? HOW ON EARTH CAN THAT BE POSSIBLE?

I think the refereeing has been pretty poor but I don't see it as one-sided at all. I see a lot of blatant **** ups for both teams and its been that way in pretty much every series since round 1.

Jagged QT
06-17-2013, 10:25 AM
Not for nothing the league is under a small market cba.

Miami is a pre cba built team, so it's hard to control their capapbilities, but they certainly are not a big market team.

Small markets will rule in this cba, the league will make sure of it.

I won't say the league is staged but it definitely follows a scripts and has for years.

My first thought of the league being scripted was the Hugh Hollins call against the Bulls.

There was no way the league was gonna allow the Bulls to make it to the finals WITHOUT Jordan, the first marketed superstar.

Sly Guy
06-17-2013, 10:40 AM
if it were staged they'd be doing a better job of keeping the games tight. I'm a big believer in the fixing the officiating conspiracy, but the Indy-Miami series has me believing this year might actually be one of the few in which the league's hands are not messing around with outcomes.

FYL_McVeezy
06-17-2013, 10:45 AM
There are way too many holes in your conspiracy arguments for anyone to legitimately believe it.

Why would they allow 4 small markets in the Conference Finals? Lakers getting swept? Knicks not making it to ECF to face the Heat? Memphis vs SA in the most unwatchable and unwatched conference Final in history? Why didn't OKC make it more of a series last year when that had the superstars capable of making it an all time great series? Does Stern just pick and choose when he wants to maximize revenue and just allow some series to be complete and utter revenue failures? Most conspiracy theorists argued for years how much Stern hated the Spurs, their boring style of dominance, they were the anti-hype machine for years and years and now Stern wants them to beat THE biggest NBA hype machine of all time? They wanted the most unmarketable superstar in the league to take out THE biggest NBA hype machine of all time 2 years ago?

Present a legitimate argument with less holes than swiss cheese that doesn't contradict itself all over the place and you might get some dudes that aren't whiney little pre-teen Miami fans to agree with you.

I'm not here to convince anyone of anything. You either believe it or you don't.

There is also a lot that goes on behind the scenes that none of us knows as well....A lot of what I say is speculation...anyone that says they have what the leagues does down to a tee is lying to you...

The ideas that I share are for those that understand my line of thinking already. Everyone has the right to their own opinion...

However we do agree that Miami fans are whiny SOB's :laugh2: #Knickstape

bucketss
06-17-2013, 10:48 AM
the purity of the game died when air jordan was born.

FYL_McVeezy
06-17-2013, 10:53 AM
Dp

FYL_McVeezy
06-17-2013, 10:56 AM
the purity of the game died when air jordan was born.

This is true....

MJ was one helluva player....one of the greatest talents the game has seen....

But a lot of Air Jordan's aura was manufactured by Marketing/Superstar Calls.....

It is argued that the league's marketing of MJ invented the superstar call..

Green_Monster
06-17-2013, 12:24 PM
wait, isn't that paul pierce in the wheelchair?

No, it was Dwyane Wade (http://cdn.niketalk.com/f/f7/350x700px-LL-f7a1bc7b_a84e32803e8dc4771280da4b530ce11c_dwaynewa decrying.jpeg).

JDMVP
06-17-2013, 12:51 PM
the fact Indiana got screwed in the last series made me already think but hey who am I to judge these finals, i mean who are we to suggest that these NBA playoffs have been staged or what not at the end of the day we Still Watch, haha. Wether this finals is staged or not its still pretty impressive how D-league Danny Green is about to become the Finals MVP if they win and the fact that Boris Diaw is somehow doing a good job in LeBron, its pretty fun. haha at the end of the day, like i said before. WE STILL WATCH, haha.

G-Menfan4lyfe
06-17-2013, 12:53 PM
Did you realize this before or after the refs trolled Miami last night? LOL

But seriously it goes deeper than bad calls and good calls, it's the timing of the calls and the consistency.

Refs choose when to make certain calls.....it seemed like every time Mia was creeping away at the lead, the refs would make some BS call (whether it was a good call or a bad call) and kill thier momentum...

But hey what do I know? I'm just a tin-foil hat wearing conspiracy theorist to some. The rest of you can go back to thinking the NBA is 100% legit and there is no way possible that games can be manipulated to increase the revenue of a series....

That is absolutely true. In the 4th quarter Miami had TWO 2 on 1 fast breaks where they could have cut the lead and players were fouled but no call was made. Both times the Spurs got easy transition 3's to keep it out of reach. Couple that with the weak illegal screen calls that cost Miami 5 points, it was obvious to me that the refs were trying to keep the Heat from making a comeback run.

Dade County
06-17-2013, 12:58 PM
the purity of the game died when air jordan was born.

Truer words have never been spoken... I thank you!

SoFreshNsoClean
06-17-2013, 01:03 PM
David Stern was interviewed (I think it was during the Memphis, San AN series) and was asked about what he thought regarding the series and he said something along the lines of him wanting to show NBA fans that "small market teams" like the Grizzlies and Spurs can contend and win the title. I was getting the vibe Stern wanted to go out on a note that not all "Hollywood-esque" teams such as Miami and LA win it every year. He said he liked the way the new CBA or something was set up and how it gives every team a fair shake to win the title.

Those that believe in the "staged" idea could make the case Stern has more vested interest in seeing the Spurs win this series over Miami. Stern has amassed a reputation that he favors large market teams and is partially responsible for star treatment which has been heavily criticized by fans and certain commentators. Spurs winning this series would do more damage control on that reputation as he rides out into the sunset (Stern is retiring next year for those that don't know) which would make sense and give the league a better image. Spurs have always been Sterns "small-market but popular internationally" crutch.

I also remember Stern being interviewed around the early 2000's on what finals matchup he would like to see and he remarked something like "honestly Lakers vs. Lakers". It seems Stern foreshadows the outcome of certain finals matchups occasionally. Some fans know how controversial the Lakers dynasty was during that era. Maybe im reading too much into it or it may be a coincidence but it would make sense to some.

FYL_McVeezy
06-17-2013, 01:04 PM
the fact Indiana got screwed in the last series made me already think but hey who am I to judge these finals, i mean who are we to suggest that these NBA playoffs have been staged or what not at the end of the day we Still Watch, haha. Wether this finals is staged or not its still pretty impressive how D-league Danny Green is about to become the Finals MVP if they win and the fact that Boris Diaw is somehow doing a good job in LeBron, its pretty fun. haha at the end of the day, like i said before. WE STILL WATCH, haha.

100% true...

Whether we think this whole **** is rigged, or we think it is 100% legit we all still watch! At the end of the day this is all entertainment, and either way, there is some good basketball being played in this series....it is what it is...

Dade County
06-17-2013, 01:06 PM
Did you realize this before or after the refs trolled Miami last night? LOL

But seriously it goes deeper than bad calls and good calls, it's the timing of the calls and the consistency.

Refs choose when to make certain calls.....it seemed like every time Mia was creeping away at the lead, the refs would make some BS call (whether it was a good call or a bad call) and kill thier momentum...

But hey what do I know? I'm just a tin-foil hat wearing conspiracy theorist to some. The rest of you can go back to thinking the NBA is 100% legit and there is no way possible that games can be manipulated to increase the revenue of a series....

Don't soften your stance, by saying that tin foil crap... What you are saying is fact, just because some nerd in a suit hasn't came of the news reporting that the NBA is rigged, doesn't mean it is not.

Don't ever fuel the people that are blind, by making it seem that maybe you are crazy for believing the NBA is rigged... They're the crazy ones, they're the blind ones.

They should put on the tin foil and run around the street saying, I'm a dump consumer, tell me anything and I'll believe it, sale me anything and I'll buy it.

FYL_McVeezy
06-17-2013, 01:06 PM
David Stern was interviewed (I think it was during the Memphis, San AN series) and was asked about what he thought regarding the series and he said something along the lines of him wanting to show NBA fans that "small market teams" like the Grizzlies and Spurs can contend and win the title. I was getting the vibe Stern wanted to go out on a note that not all "Hollywood-esque" teams such as Miami and LA win it every year. He said he liked the way the new CBA or something was set up and how it gives every team a fair shake to win the title.

Those that believe in the "staged" idea could make the case Stern has more vested interest in seeing the Spurs win this series over Miami. Stern has amassed a reputation that he favors large market teams and is partially responsible for star treatment which has been heavily criticized by fans and certain commentators. Spurs winning this series would do more damage control on that reputation as he rides out into the sunset (Stern is retiring next year for those that don't know) which would make sense and give the league a better image. Spurs have always been Sterns "small-market but popular internationally" crutch.

I also remember Stern being interviewed around the early 2000's on what finals matchup he would like to see and he remarked something like "honestly Lakers vs. Lakers". It seems Stern foreshadows the outcome of certain finals matchups occasionally. Some fans know how controversial the Lakers dynasty was during that era. Maybe im reading too much into it or it may be a coincidence but it would make sense to some.

I caught that interview and that half answered my question as to why Indy made it to the ECF over NY and Memphis over OKC (OKC is a small market team, but has a top 5 marketable player on the team)

FYL_McVeezy
06-17-2013, 01:07 PM
Don't soften your stance, by saying that tin foil crap... What you are saying is fact, just because some nerd in a suit hasn't came of the news reporting that the NBA is rigged, doesn't mean it is not.

Don't ever fuel the people that are blind, by making it seem that maybe you are crazy for believing the NBA is rigged... They're the crazy ones, they're the blind ones.

They should put on the tin foil and run around the street saying, I'm a dump consumer, tell me anything and I'll believe it, sale me anything and I'll buy it.

I was saying that to be sarcastic...but I agree with you!

akagiredsuns
06-17-2013, 01:08 PM
These conspiracy theories are pathetic. It's a good series between two elite teams. Just be a fan and enjoy the games. I could understand people who placed bets on this series and stand to win or lose some cash, but if you didn't then just drop it and watch. If it goes 6 or 7, doesn't matter, the last team standing would have gone through 16 grueling victories to get here. Don't talk about what you don't know. You just stress yourself out for no good reason. At the end of the day, there will be a champion. The pointless threads on PSD sometimes just makes me :facepalm:

celtNYpatsHeels
06-17-2013, 01:11 PM
I'm a betting man.... the only game of this series that I lost was game 1. Im going heavy on the Heat in game 6 as 7 point favorites. Everyone knew this was going 7 games, and the heat are going to win it in 7

JDMVP
06-17-2013, 01:13 PM
plus 1, if you dont like it then Dont watch. haha

Jenceman
06-17-2013, 01:54 PM
Yep, Stern has given Danny Green to power to have the greatest 3 point shooting performance in league history.

Heediot
06-17-2013, 01:56 PM
Yes. Tim Donaghuy has some interesting points, and I believe where there's smoke there's fire.

8kobe24
06-17-2013, 02:06 PM
Of course it's rigged. NBA is all about the $$$. A dramatic game 7 will bring in top $$$. A dramatic victory for the heat will bring in even more top $$$. Money money money money money...hahahaha.

JC_
06-17-2013, 02:46 PM
I'm a betting man.... the only game of this series that I lost was game 1. Im going heavy on the Heat in game 6 as 7 point favorites. Everyone knew this was going 7 games, and the heat are going to win it in 7

It makes sense that the Heat would win game 6 but don't underestimate the Spurs, they will be extra-confident tonight and even if the refs call the game in favor of Miami (which they should after last game) the Spurs will be tough to beat.

Chazm
06-17-2013, 02:49 PM
I'm a betting man.... the only game of this series that I lost was game 1. Im going heavy on the Heat in game 6 as 7 point favorites. Everyone knew this was going 7 games, and the heat are going to win it in 7

It makes sense that the Heat would win game 6 but don't underestimate the Spurs, they will be extra-confident tonight and even if the refs call the game in favor of Miami (which they should after last game) the Spurs will be tough to beat.

They should be extra confident tonight, being they don't have a game

Nick O
06-17-2013, 03:47 PM
dear god.....

MonroeFAN
06-17-2013, 03:56 PM
no

dannyy08
06-17-2013, 04:16 PM
It doesn't feel anymore staged than any other finals... Or any Super Bowl... or World Series... or boxing match... or... Olympics or any major sport.

Heediot
06-17-2013, 04:21 PM
There is more extortion and corruption in this world than people realize. It's not totally rigged. There are certain numbers and spreads that can be controlled through controlling the ft numbers. Even causing certain people to get into foul trouble impacts the game. It's more subtle and less obvious than people think.

It's not about the NBA wanting the heat to win, it's the Mob and the bookies.

kubernetes
06-17-2013, 07:54 PM
Yes, the NBA mafia affects the physics of air flow and momentum around the ball, therefore they decide whether a player will do well before hand or not. It's a government conspiracy, like the moon landing and how they get caramel into the middle of chocolate bars.

"Control, this is Stern HQ, what's the update on Green?"

"HQ, this is Control. Sir, his 3-point max-accuracy setting is still stuck. We're trying to isolate the problem, but in the meantime we'll just have to compensate on the other side of the ball."

"Understood, Control. And remember to max out the refs' flop-tolerance for the Heat tomorrow. Stern HQ out."

mgsports
06-17-2013, 08:28 PM
If Juan Howard is activated for the game the Heat will win.

KnickNyKnick
06-17-2013, 09:08 PM
why dont we just ask Alex jones?

KingPosey
06-17-2013, 09:18 PM
I've got an idea, lets stage a finals where every game is a comete blowout where it's over before the fourth quarter. Our advertisers will love people not watching he final quarter of every game.

Ya and we will have that one guy hit 75% of his threes, and we will have him shoot lots of them!

BcEuAbRsS
06-17-2013, 09:59 PM
This series has been exactly what it should be, the best coach in the world vs. the best player in the world. I'm really tired of the "rigged" or "staged" crap. Is the draft sometimes fishy? Sure, but no matter how hard anyone tries they can't dictate every game of a 7 game series when both teams are playing their ***** off.

BcEuAbRsS
06-17-2013, 10:00 PM
I've got an idea, lets stage a finals where every game is a comete blowout where it's over before the fourth quarter. Our advertisers will love people not watching he final quarter of every game.

Ya and we will have that one guy hit 75% of his threes, and we will have him shoot lots of them!

Damn Stern and him making Green hit those threes.

ziglur
06-17-2013, 10:10 PM
I've been working for a boss who's a slightly tin-foil hat, conspiracy theorist type.

He's convinced the league is run by a mafia and bookie types based on a lot of the game turnouts - I'm not really convinced, but every once in a while you get these results that make you scratch your head.

So the question is simple - do you feel like this year's Finals are a bit staged/set-up? Think of the NBA Blu-Ray of this years finals with all the epic commentary of the back and forth, and the ticket sales, and hype!

I just feel like there's no way the "two best teams" in the league could be blowing each other out every other game like they have; I mean c'mon, the Rockets/Thunder series was full of very close margin wins either way which felt more like competitive basketball - and these were supposedly lesser teams!

This is the breakdown so far -


Game 1 in Miami - Spurs win by a small margin to set the 'shock' tone.
Game 2 in Miami - redemption for the Heat, blowout victory - order is restored for Miami fans
Game 3 in San Antonio - Spurs blowout the Heat, SA fans get excited, now willing to pay more for game 4 tickets
Game 4 in San Antonio - Heat blowout the Spurs, SA fans are reeling, but they still have game 5 to look forward to - this sets up Miami fans to pay more for Game 6 tickets since the series will most certainly go back to Miami



In a tin-foil hat moment of my own, this is how I'm predicting the rest of the series to play out, thinking on a staged/setup line of thinking :


Game 5 in San Antonio - Spurs come back and win by a narrow margin, adding anxiety to the Heat fans anticipating Game 6
Game 6 in Miami - Order is restored yet again, Heat wins by the skin of their teeth (score spreads are getting tighter since the series is winding down and it'll make a great Finals DVD in July when they go on sale with epic soundtracks and commentary to hype you up into buying 10 copies for your friends)
Game 7 in Miami - Predictable that it went to 7 because it'll make the league, the bookmakers, and both teams a lot of extra revenue. My optimistic side puts the Spurs ahead for shock factor to win on the road, and to fire up the rumor mill about Chris Bosh trades - My pessimistic side lets the Heat win in stunning blowout fashion to secure their dominance and to remove the asterisk for winning a shortened season the year before.



What say you? I don't *really* buy into all the conspiracy theories, but you have to admit for the two best in the league, these blowouts make you raise a brow.

This series is a rerun of the Heat , Pacer series and its all rehearsed.

SportsFanatic10
06-17-2013, 11:18 PM
all the rigged talk needs to stop, there's really no point in watching if you seriously think that.

Hawkeye15
06-17-2013, 11:40 PM
closed