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LoveMeOrHateMe
06-06-2013, 06:26 PM
Dr J says if he had to pick between LeBron and Kobe he picks ... Bryant. Says Kobe 1 of top 5 players of all time.

@APgelston: Dr J says if he had to pick between LeBron and Kobe he picks ... Bryant. Says Kobe 1 of top 5 players of all time.

Take it for what it is, can't wait for PSD to go crazy! But yet another legend who actually played calling Kobe a top 5 player ever nothing new here and also another one who would rather take Kobe over lebron! Take notes kids, Kobe's prime was just as good as lebron a just in a total different way

Pakman
06-06-2013, 06:28 PM
Game knows game

ILLUSIONIST^248
06-06-2013, 06:30 PM
Dr J says if he had to pick between LeBron and Kobe he picks ... Bryant. Says Kobe 1 of top 5 players of all time.

@APgelston: Dr J says if he had to pick between LeBron and Kobe he picks ... Bryant. Says Kobe 1 of top 5 players of all time.

Take it for what it is, can't wait for PSD to go crazy! But yet another legend who actually played calling Kobe a top 5 player ever nothing new here and also another one who would rather take Kobe over lebron! Take notes kids, Kobe's prime was just as good as lebron a just in a total different way

He's almost their. Kobe is top 6 in my book. Kobe is a true winner. Lebron never won anything before joining a top3 team all time. He even won Bronze twice, how sad is that. I would choose a prime kobe over a prime Lebron 10/10 times.

ChitownBears22
06-06-2013, 06:31 PM
My life is ruined!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Someone quick, ask my grandpa who he would take!

ChitownBears22
06-06-2013, 06:32 PM
He's almost their. Kobe is top 6 in my book. Kobe is a true winner. Lebron never won anything before joining a top3 team all time. He even won Bronze twice, how sad is that. I would choose a prime kobe over a prime Lebron 10/10 times.

Yeah Kobe never teamed up with other greats. You know a top 5 Center of all time or anything.

Slug3
06-06-2013, 06:33 PM
I would like for players careers to be over and done with before I would make decisions on who I would take.

Greedy22
06-06-2013, 06:34 PM
Yeah Kobe never teamed up with other greats. You know a top 5 Center of all time or anything.

Hey now, he was traded to LA on draft day. He didn't take his talents there in free agency :D


It's a joke, please don't kill me :hide:

bucketss
06-06-2013, 06:35 PM
oscar says lebron can be goat

oscar>dr.j

Greedy22
06-06-2013, 06:36 PM
Picks him for what though, to build around? As much as I love Kobe and have been a huge fan it's much easier to build around lebrons all around game.

bucketss
06-06-2013, 06:36 PM
karl malone has lebron in his starting 5... kobe no where to be found

ChitownBears22
06-06-2013, 06:37 PM
Hey now, he was traded to LA on draft day. He didn't take his talents there in free agency :D


It's a joke, please don't kill me :hide:

Oh I understand sarcasm.

LeBron is a coward for going into FA and getting to make a choice where he plays. At least he didn't force himself off a team like Kobe, or threaten to leave because he couldn't get it done by himself after Shaq left.

xxplayerxx23
06-06-2013, 06:38 PM
Lol Kobe is barley top 10 no way top 5. Lebron has a chance to be top 3-5 all time lebrons peak>> Kobe's peak

ManRam
06-06-2013, 06:38 PM
thanks for sharing!

you can go back and forth with this game all day. there's plenty of lebron love out there from the greats. the fact that he, at 28, is already being picked by many says something...

seikou8
06-06-2013, 06:39 PM
do you ,illusionist and amoster post all the time about kobe every thread and post damn

LoveMeOrHateMe
06-06-2013, 06:40 PM
karl malone has lebron in his starting 5... kobe no where to be found

That's because there is a guy named MJ in front of Kobe if lebron was a sg he would still pick MJ

kingsdelez24
06-06-2013, 06:40 PM
Nothing you idiots Dr. J's dead, he's locked up in my basement


had to..

ChitownBears22
06-06-2013, 06:40 PM
do you ,illusionist and amoster post all the time about kobe every thread and post damn

If Kobe poops these guys will let you know. So deep down on Kobe, it is almost concerning.

PhillyFaninLA
06-06-2013, 06:41 PM
There are atleast 3 Lakers (and possibly 4 or 5) better than him so no sorry Dr J I love you as player but gotta disagree

LoveMeOrHateMe
06-06-2013, 06:41 PM
do you ,illusionist and amoster post all the time about kobe every thread and post damn

I rarely post anymore but thanks for asking

seikou8
06-06-2013, 06:41 PM
He's almost their. Kobe is top 6 in my book. Kobe is a true winner. Lebron never won anything before joining a top3 team all time. He even won Bronze twice, how sad is that. I would choose a prime kobe over a prime Lebron 10/10 times.

because your not baised as kobe and llaker fan and you hate LeBron telling by your sig:D

ChitownBears22
06-06-2013, 06:41 PM
That's because there is a guy named MJ in front of Kobe if lebron was a sg he would still pick MJ

Thanks for letting us know Karl.

PhillyFaninLA
06-06-2013, 06:42 PM
Mods could he have a separate board for each Kobe and Lebron threads.

LoveMeOrHateMe
06-06-2013, 06:42 PM
There are atleast 3 Lakers (and possibly 4 or 5) better than him so no sorry Dr J I love you as player but gotta disagree

Lol Philly fans smh Kobe is arguably the greatest laker, he will be when he retires

5ass
06-06-2013, 06:44 PM
The NBA finals are upon us, and Kobephiles are starting to experience Lebronophobia.

PhillyFaninLA
06-06-2013, 06:45 PM
Lol Philly fans smh Kobe is arguably the greatest laker, he will be when he retires

First of all this is me saying this not all Philly fans, don't trash an entire fan base for my comments, disagree but don't be disrepectful that says wonders about the kind of person you are.

Lastly Magic, Shaq, Wilt, Kareem....I would not put Kobe in front of any of them.

smith&wesson
06-06-2013, 06:45 PM
My life is ruined!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Someone quick, ask my grandpa who he would take!


jordan agrees with dr j.. these guys opinions are worth more than mine or yours.


Yeah Kobe never teamed up with other greats. You know a top 5 Center of all time or anything.

shaq is easily the best C of all time. He would dominate any C of any era in his prime. russell, kaj, wilt, etc. all great C's but all should be happy they never had to face the monster shaq in his prime...

seikou8
06-06-2013, 06:46 PM
Mods could he have a separate board for each Kobe and Lebron threads.
there would be no nba forum then

ChitownBears22
06-06-2013, 06:46 PM
The NBA finals are upon us, and Kobephiles are starting to experience Lebronophobia.

I understand the fear. I mean LeBron is greater in every personal statistic category at this point of their careers. Could you imagine if LeBron had prime Shaq, they would have ruled the league for 5+ years, because LeBron wouldn't have gotten Shaq kicked off the team.

smith&wesson
06-06-2013, 06:48 PM
First of all this is me saying this not all Philly fans, don't trash an entire fan base for my comments, disagree but don't be disrepectful that says wonders about the kind of person you are.

Lastly Magic, Shaq, Wilt, Kareem....I would not put Kobe in front of any of them.

kobe's not done yet... we'll see where he ends up on the list when he retires.

ChitownBears22
06-06-2013, 06:49 PM
productive...

jordan agrees with dr j.. these guys opinions are worth more than mine or yours.



shaq is easily the best C of all time. He would dominate any C of any era in his prime. russell, kaj, wilt, etc. all great C's but all should be happy they never had to face the monster shaq in his prime...

My first response was just pointing out that these players opinions mean as much as ours.

And yes Shaq is the best of all time IMO as well. I just said top 5 to not make this a thread about Shaqs all time ranking.

PhillyFaninLA
06-06-2013, 06:50 PM
kobe's not done yet... we'll see where he ends up on the list when he retires.

I strongly disagree....there is nothing he can do that he hasn't. His legacy is established. I get why people disagree with me, but even if he wins another ring or two or another MVP we know what he is and that won't change.

smith&wesson
06-06-2013, 06:50 PM
I understand the fear. I mean LeBron is greater in every personal statistic category at this point of their careers. Could you imagine if LeBron had prime Shaq, they would have ruled the league for 5+ years, because LeBron wouldn't have gotten Shaq kicked off the team.

:laugh: this was actually pretty funny.

there is an easy way to sum this up.

kobe will go down as 2nd best sg of all time
lebron will go down as the best sf of all time

thats as it stands now. when they both finish playing it will be a lot more clear where each stands on the on time list.

is that fair to say ?

ChitownBears22
06-06-2013, 06:52 PM
:laugh: this was actually pretty funny.

there is an easy way to sum this up.

kobe will go down as 2nd best sg of all time
lebron will go down as 3rd best sf of all time

thats as it stands now. when they both finish playing it will be a lot more clear where each stands on the on time list.

is that fair to say ?

I agree with the Kobe #2. But LBJ is still 28, his ranking could be from 1-3 when he is finished for sf.

smith&wesson
06-06-2013, 06:54 PM
I strongly disagree....there is nothing he can do that he hasn't. His legacy is established. I get why people disagree with me, but even if he wins another ring or two or another MVP we know what he is and that won't change.

you dont think more rings and finals mvp awards would add to his legacy :confused: charles barkley, karl malone, reggie miller, john stockton say hi. imagine what just 1 ring would have done for their legacies.

it makes a difference if kobe retires with 5 rings or 6, 7 etc. it makes a difference if he ends up with more finals mvp's.

LoveMeOrHateMe
06-06-2013, 06:54 PM
First of all this is me saying this not all Philly fans, don't trash an entire fan base for my comments, disagree but don't be disrepectful that says wonders about the kind of person you are.

Lastly Magic, Shaq, Wilt, Kareem....I would not put Kobe in front of any of them.

Lol Philly fans hate Kobe

And lol at Shaq and wilt being better then Kobe wilt played less then 5 years with the lakers and Shaq 8 so no Kareem is out as well

Only magic has a case goodbye

smith&wesson
06-06-2013, 06:55 PM
I agree with the Kobe #2. But LBJ is still 28, his ranking could be from 1-3 when he is finished for sf.

i already have him ahead of bird. honestly ..

Minimal
06-06-2013, 06:55 PM
I agree with the Kobe #2. But LBJ is still 28, his ranking could be from 1-3 when he is finished for sf.
LeBron might not be the greatest sf now, but he is the best sf of all time period.

rhd420
06-06-2013, 06:57 PM
LeBron isn't even done in terms of his career yet .. Kobe much closer to retirement

It's opinion and in the end, I'm a Kobe fan not just on talent but because he's on the Lakers and I'm a Laker fan, just like I would root for LeBron on any other player if they joined the Lakers.

xxplayerxx23
06-06-2013, 06:57 PM
:laugh: this was actually pretty funny.

there is an easy way to sum this up.

kobe will go down as 2nd best sg of all time
lebron will go down as 3rd best sf of all time

thats as it stands now. when they both finish playing it will be a lot more clear where each stands on the on time list.

is that fair to say ?

3rd?? He's already arguably 2nd and he's only 28

smith&wesson
06-06-2013, 06:58 PM
Lol Philly fans hate Kobe

And lol at Shaq and wilt being better then Kobe wilt played less then 5 years with the lakers and Shaq 8 so no Kareem is out as well

Only magic has a case goodbye

as of right now, this is actually true. kobe's longgevity + the amount of championships he has brought to this franchise outweighs what those guys have done for this franchise.

reason why i agree with magic having a case is because if he didnt have a life threatning disease he would have played much more.. i def give him that.

bucketss
06-06-2013, 06:59 PM
That's because there is a guy named MJ in front of Kobe if lebron was a sg he would still pick MJ

lmao he didn't pick mj either, so he doesn't even think kobe is 2nd on that list.

ILLUSIONIST^248
06-06-2013, 07:00 PM
Yeah Kobe never teamed up with other greats. You know a top 5 Center of all time or anything.Kobe grew up on the team, he didn't cowardly take a **** on his home state and skip town with his two girlfriends.


karl malone has lebron in his starting 5... kobe no where to be found
MJ wants to know who Karl is?

xxplayerxx23
06-06-2013, 07:00 PM
Lol Philly fans hate Kobe

And lol at Shaq and wilt being better then Kobe wilt played less then 5 years with the lakers and Shaq 8 so no Kareem is out as well

Only magic has a case goodbye

I actually agree. All are higher on the alltime list but fact is Kobe outlasted all of them execpt magic. Wilt wasn't tere long enough, shaq is close but longevity helps Kobe there playing what is it 14? Years .magic was better then Kobe though

bucketss
06-06-2013, 07:01 PM
:laugh: this was actually pretty funny.

there is an easy way to sum this up.

kobe will go down as 2nd best sg of all time
lebron will go down as 3rd best sf of all time

thats as it stands now. when they both finish playing it will be a lot more clear where each stands on the on time list.

is that fair to say ?

almost;) lebron will go down as goat SF :cool: lol

elledaddy
06-06-2013, 07:01 PM
I dont know what it is but when I watch Lebron play, I just dont feel like Im witnessing GREATNESS. He just seems like a very very skilled athlete IMO. Im not a Lebron or Kobe hater or fan, but I do feel like Im watching greatness when Kobe plays. It's weird.

LayBraun
06-06-2013, 07:01 PM
Karl Malone has LeBron in his top 5 with Kobe nowhere to be found...? So I'm missing the point of this thread

bucketss
06-06-2013, 07:01 PM
I dont know what it is but when I watch Lebron play, I just dont feel like Im witnessing GREATNESS. He just seems like a very very skilled athlete IMO. Im not a Lebron or Kobe hater or fan, but I do feel like Im watching greatness when Kobe plays. It's weird.

because kobe hits cooler shots, its really just that.

ThunderousDemon
06-06-2013, 07:02 PM
What's going on here?

Where's the comment from Hawkeye?

ILLUSIONIST^248
06-06-2013, 07:02 PM
I strongly disagree....there is nothing he can do that he hasn't. His legacy is established. I get why people disagree with me, but even if he wins another ring or two or another MVP we know what he is and that won't change.
So when Lebron is over 30 years old he can't climb the ladder anymore right?

lmao he didn't pick mj either, so he doesn't even think kobe is 2nd on that list. Karl who?

xxplayerxx23
06-06-2013, 07:02 PM
Kobe grew up on the team, he didn't cowardly take a **** on his home state and skip town with his two girlfriends.


MJ wants to know who Karl is?

Yeah he *****ed his way to la through a trade on draft day not cowardly at all. Or how about the time when his team sucked and he went nowhere demanded a trade to Chicago until they brought talent around. Yeah not cowardly at all.. Being a number two option for 3 of his 5 championships something lebron won't be. Lebron will get at least 2-3 more rings as the number on option

ChitownBears22
06-06-2013, 07:02 PM
I dont know what it is but when I watch Lebron play, I just dont feel like Im witnessing GREATNESS. He just seems like a very very skilled athlete IMO. Im not a Lebron or Kobe hater or fan, but I do feel like Im watching greatness when Kobe plays. It's weird.

I don't even know what this means. Do you not think a two way player that is super efficient is greatness?

PhillyFaninLA
06-06-2013, 07:02 PM
you dont think more rings and finals mvp awards would add to his legacy :confused: charles barkley, karl malone, reggie miller, john stockton say hi. imagine what just 1 ring would have done for their legacies.

it makes a difference if kobe retires with 5 rings or 6, 7 etc. it makes a difference if he ends up with more finals mvp's.

So you think Robert Horry is better then Kobe.


It does not matter. Kobe has already had most of his career, we already know how great he is/was more success does not change that, we know what he is.

I don't judge careers with jewelry I judge players on their own merit. I would still take John Stockton over almost any PG ever without ring, Malone and Barkley are 2 of the best forwards ever, and Reggie Miller is one of the greatest shooters ever, ring or no ring they are amongst the best ever. I don't need jewelry to judge, I just need eyes.

ChitownBears22
06-06-2013, 07:04 PM
Yeah he *****ed his way to la through a trade on draft day not cowardly at all. Or how about the time when his team sucked and he went nowhere demanded a trade to Chicago until they brought talent around. Yeah not cowardly at all.. Being a number two option for 3 of his 5 championships something lebron won't be. Lebron will get at least 2-3 more rings as the number on option

qft.

Kobe screwed the Hornets. At least LeBron played out his contract. I remember when Kobe recruited Malone and the Glove and then didn't win a championship then wanted out.

sunnyice
06-06-2013, 07:04 PM
Dr J says if he had to pick between LeBron and Kobe he picks ... Bryant. Says Kobe 1 of top 5 players of all time.

@APgelston: Dr J says if he had to pick between LeBron and Kobe he picks ... Bryant. Says Kobe 1 of top 5 players of all time.

Take it for what it is, can't wait for PSD to go crazy! But yet another legend who actually played calling Kobe a top 5 player ever nothing new here and also another one who would rather take Kobe over lebron! Take notes kids, Kobe's prime was just as good as lebron a just in a total different way

LOL. A couple hours to go before the NBA finals begin with San Antonio and Miami the last two teams standing and this is what a kobephile comes up with!? SMH..

PhillyFaninLA
06-06-2013, 07:04 PM
Lol Philly fans hate Kobe

And lol at Shaq and wilt being better then Kobe wilt played less then 5 years with the lakers and Shaq 8 so no Kareem is out as well

Only magic has a case goodbye


Have the balls to talk to me and not about an entire fan base, I represent my opinions not all Philly fans....not all Philly fans hate Kobe, many love him.

So you can only use years to make your case....way to shoot down my opinion.

Chronz
06-06-2013, 07:07 PM
Well yeah, careers arent yet over

smith&wesson
06-06-2013, 07:14 PM
3rd?? He's already arguably 2nd and he's only 28

i meant the best. I already have him as the best smallforward of all time. my bad for the typo


almost;) lebron will go down as goat SF :cool: lol


yes i agree, thats what i meant. my bad.

So you think Robert Horry is better then Kobe.


It does not matter. Kobe has already had most of his career, we already know how great he is/was more success does not change that, we know what he is.

I don't judge careers with jewelry I judge players on their own merit. I would still take John Stockton over almost any PG ever without ring, Malone and Barkley are 2 of the best forwards ever, and Reggie Miller is one of the greatest shooters ever, ring or no ring they are amongst the best ever. I don't need jewelry to judge, I just need eyes.

I think championships matter. however I dont think they are the end all be all way of measuring a legacy. But when you say if kobe wins another ring or two + a finals mvp it wont add to his legacy. thats where you are wrong my friend.

robert horry was a role player bouncing from team to team chasing rings.

were talking about guys that were franchise players in the years they won a ship. in a convo with lebron and kobe, robert horry does not belong.

sjbirds
06-06-2013, 07:17 PM
Im a philly fan and I like kobe.. also he did force a trade to la before he played a min in the nba. is that worse or better then playing out your contract and leaving in this thing called FREE AGENCY.

smith&wesson
06-06-2013, 07:17 PM
Well yeah, careers arent yet over

exactly. . kobe has a couple more years to add to his legacy. lebron still has half his career.

smith&wesson
06-06-2013, 07:18 PM
Im a philly fan and I like kobe.. also he did force a trade to la before he played a min in the nba. is that worse or better then playing out your contract and leaving in this thing called FREE AGENCY.

i dont know how this relates. but its a good question, i really dont know which would be worse.

ChitownBears22
06-06-2013, 07:21 PM
i dont know how this relates. but its a good question, i really dont know which would be worse.

Honestly what Kobe did was worse. He held a team hostage like a true communist. LeBron tested the free-market like a true American.

smith&wesson
06-06-2013, 07:22 PM
Honestly what Kobe did was worse. He held a team hostage like a true communist. LeBron tested the free-market like a true American.

ya but what would hurt worse ? i think clevland fans def felt it worse

ChitownBears22
06-06-2013, 07:25 PM
ya but what would hurt worse ? i think clevland fans def felt it worse

Well Cleveland fans did get the short end of the stick. But you have to blame management. They refused to trade JJ Hickson to get Amare. They felt Anderson Varejo was a legitimate player to play alongside LBJ. They got a end of the line Shaq as a last ditch effort. How do you have such a great player, yet can't get a legit number two for LeBron. That is poor management.

Sly Guy
06-06-2013, 07:34 PM
Yeah Kobe never teamed up with other greats. You know a top 5 Center of all time or anything.

or second on the all time scoring list, or one of the greatest pgs of his generation, or played on a team where he couldn't crack the lineup as a rookie. Just cuz he didn't switch area codes doesn't mean he didn't have help.

smith&wesson
06-06-2013, 07:43 PM
Well Cleveland fans did get the short end of the stick. But you have to blame management. They refused to trade JJ Hickson to get Amare. They felt Anderson Varejo was a legitimate player to play alongside LBJ. They got a end of the line Shaq as a last ditch effort. How do you have such a great player, yet can't get a legit number two for LeBron. That is poor management.

funny thing is when lebron was drafted they had boozer. . . should have just kept him. i think they had darius miles as well but he ended up getting injured out of the league.

bagwell368
06-06-2013, 08:39 PM
Every since Dr. J. lost his cool and went after Bird he's had to resurface every few years to remind us that he existed.

I'm sure I'm the only guy on PSD that watched him play in the old cages at U Mass. He's fallen a long way..

bagwell368
06-06-2013, 08:43 PM
Honestly what Kobe did was worse. He held a team hostage like a true communist. LeBron tested the free-market like a true American.

Do you actually know what a Communist is?

No if we go by this comment.

BALLER R
06-06-2013, 08:55 PM
I never understood when players would say "Insert name here" is a top 5 player. But yet people on here say he's not even top 10. I mean these guys played against the greatest we only watch. I would take 5 legends opinion over a fan.

ThaDubs
06-06-2013, 09:04 PM
LeBron is better.

Hawkeye15
06-06-2013, 09:07 PM
I quit listening to ex-players years ago. They have as much bias as any of us, and many of them value rings way too much, as do many fans.

Hawkeye15
06-06-2013, 09:08 PM
Every since Dr. J. lost his cool and went after Bird he's had to resurface every few years to remind us that he existed.

I'm sure I'm the only guy on PSD that watched him play in the old cages at U Mass. He's fallen a long way..

yep, only watched him from 84' on.

RaiderLakersA's
06-06-2013, 10:28 PM
If you're just now joining the forum, let me recap for you.


One of the Greatest NBA Players Ever (Insert: Dr. J., Michael Jordan, Larry Bird, other NBA great):

"Kobe is a top 5 player of all time."


Most Kobe and Lakers fans:

"Damn straight!"


Most of PSD:

"That stupid son of a ***** doesn't know what he's talking about. Kobe sucks!!! And because I have 15 bajillion posts as a non-athlete in an internet sports forum, my opinion matters just as much as (Insert: Dr. J., Michael Jordan, Larry Bird, other NBA great), if not more!"


Does that about sum it up? I thought so. Nothing to see here. Let's keep it moving.

Riodagoat
06-06-2013, 10:29 PM
I wonder who Oprah would pick... Her pick is obviously more valid...

Kashmir13579
06-06-2013, 10:31 PM
Dr. J says...

Nothin' you idiots, Dr. Js dead (He's locked in my basement)

RaiderLakersA's
06-06-2013, 10:33 PM
I wonder who Oprah would pick... Her pick is obviously more valid...

She's a Jordan fan. And you know O stays faithful to one man only.

Hawkeye15
06-06-2013, 10:39 PM
If you're just now joining the forum, let me recap for you.


One of the Greatest NBA Players Ever (Insert: Dr. J., Michael Jordan, Larry Bird, other NBA great):

"Kobe is a top 5 player of all time."


Most Kobe and Lakers fans:

"Damn straight!"


Most of PSD:

"That stupid son of a ***** doesn't know what he's talking about. Kobe sucks!!! And because I have 15 bajillion posts as a non-athlete in an internet sports forum, my opinion matters just as much as (Insert: Dr. J., Michael Jordan, Larry Bird, other NBA great), if not more!"


Does that about sum it up? I thought so. Nothing to see here. Let's keep it moving.

not really true. But ok

netsgiantsyanks
06-06-2013, 10:42 PM
Yeah Kobe never teamed up with other greats. You know a top 5 Center of all time or anything.

he didn't team up with shaq. you can tell the big 3 was premeditated.

Hawkeye15
06-06-2013, 10:47 PM
he didn't team up with shaq. you can tell the big 3 was premeditated.

so finding your help because you don't play for an all timer front office is now looked at as a negative, versus accepting a player walked straight into an amazing front office that gave them chip help routinely?

will never understand that, no matter how many ways you, or anyone else explains it to me. If the bottom line is winning chips, stop penalizing players for finding it instead of being gifted it.

RaiderLakersA's
06-07-2013, 12:03 AM
so finding your help because you don't play for an all timer front office is now looked at as a negative, versus accepting a player walked straight into an amazing front office that gave them chip help routinely?

will never understand that, no matter how many ways you, or anyone else explains it to me. If the bottom line is winning chips, stop penalizing players for finding it instead of being gifted it.

Both Wade and James let it slip in interviews that they had serious discussions about teaming up well before they were free to do so. That's tantamount to tampering when you think about it, since they ended up with the Heat. I don't blame them for joining forces, but let's not pretend to be naive about it.

And let's not try to equate it anywhere on the same level of Jerry West using his shrewd acumen and foresight in going after Kobe to add to the huge free agency get in Shaq. No one knew what Kobe would become when he was drafted. He could have been the next Jordan, or the next Harold Minor. Most thought the latter at the time, including some of his fellow players and coaches. By contrast LeBron and Wade were already polished all-stars when they agreed to join forces. It's not the same.

Wade didn't "find" his help. He colluded with them, recruiting them before they were truly free agents. The rest of the Summer of LeBron was just a dog and pony show of the Heat 3 pulling the chains of the other interested franchises in order to make it look like they were acting above board and in good faith.

RaiderLakersA's
06-07-2013, 12:04 AM
Dupe.

Chitownhero1992
06-07-2013, 12:15 AM
Kobe isn't top 5 in my eyes but he is still hire then Lebron to me. Lebron is a fantastic player and athlete but hasn't done what Kobe has in my eyes yet, a few more rings, high stat seasons and dominant games then maybe we'll talk. Kobe still has had the better career and that is hard for me to say because I've never liked Kobe...lol

beliges
06-07-2013, 02:11 AM
Not news. Its Kobe Bryant. He's a living legend.

Losoway
06-07-2013, 02:48 AM
lol @ kobe never teamed up with anyone great

thats actually hilarious .

THE GIPPER
06-07-2013, 03:06 AM
I used to think Lebron was better than Kobe but this thread changed my mind.

Is that what the OP wants to hear?

jerellh528
06-07-2013, 03:26 AM
So what? Kobe just may be top 5

Jordan
Magic
Kaj
Shaq
Kobe

amos1er
06-07-2013, 03:45 AM
So what? Kobe just may be top 5

Jordan
Magic
Kaj
Shaq
Kobe

I have him at 6.

Jordan
Magic
Kareem
Wilt
Shaq
Kobe
Bird
Duncan
Hakeem
Russell

tapajafri
06-07-2013, 03:59 AM
I have him at 6.

Jordan
Magic
Kareem
Wilt
Shaq
Kobe
Bird
Duncan
Hakeem
Russell

Once again you lose credibility by not including James out of spite. Even Skip Bayless is more objective than that. You're a pitiful joke of a "fan" and you have a reputation on PSD, which is why nobody responds to you with posts about the topic. The only responses you get are fans from all different teams bashing your stupidity :laugh:

amos1er
06-07-2013, 04:14 AM
Once again you lose credibility by not including James out of spite. Even Skip Bayless is more objective than that. You're a pitiful joke of a "fan" and you have a reputation on PSD, which is why nobody responds to you with posts about the topic. The only responses you get are fans from all different teams bashing your stupidity :laugh:

Funny how you mention my "rep" on here yet you are in the small minority of fans foolish enough to prematurely include James in your top ten.

PSD...where one ring gets you compered to Jordan...what a joke.

sammyvine
06-07-2013, 04:49 AM
its his opinion
why are lebron fans on suicide watch?

sammyvine
06-07-2013, 04:50 AM
I quit listening to ex-players years ago. They have as much bias as any of us, and many of them value rings way too much, as do many fans.

Just because he prefer him, doesnt mean he doesnt know what he is talking about?

So Haweye15 has more knowledge than Julius Erving?

bagwell368
06-07-2013, 07:07 AM
Just because he prefer him, doesnt mean he doesnt know what he is talking about?

So Haweye15 has more knowledge than Julius Erving?

Erving obviously used to know a lot, but, he's let his emotions/biases get away from him.

Magic is one of the greatest players of all time, certainly top 5, and the spewage of moronic comments that come out of his mouth is staggering. He gets jacked up, and makes crazy claims. Try reading his quotes on Rondo sometime if you want to gag.

I used to play ball. I'm probably the 1,483,687th best player of all time (in my prime which is sadly a long time ago), and know a lot LOT less about NBA life/hoops than Magic, but I've got Rondo pegged better than Magic (without a doubt). So, the point is, just because a guy has a killer resume, doesn't mean he knows everything better than everyone else about his particular area in every case.

sammyvine
06-07-2013, 07:36 AM
Erving obviously used to know a lot, but, he's let his emotions/biases get away from him.

Magic is one of the greatest players of all time, certainly top 5, and the spewage of moronic comments that come out of his mouth is staggering. He gets jacked up, and makes crazy claims. Try reading his quotes on Rondo sometime if you want to gag.

I used to play ball. I'm probably the 1,483,687th best player of all time (in my prime which is sadly a long time ago), and know a lot LOT less about NBA life/hoops than Magic, but I've got Rondo pegged better than Magic (without a doubt). So, the point is, just because a guy has a killer resume, doesn't mean he knows everything better than everyone else about his particular area in every case.
You have to realise that Magic works for ESPN whoa renown for saying outlandish comments to spark attention and debate amongst viewers and fans. If Magic Johnson is at home and you take away the cameras I guarantee he has diff viewpoints than the ones he makes on TV.

My point is alot of fans tend to label past players ''as not knowing what they are talking about'' when they say something they don't want to hear or isn't praising their fav player.
Fans were attacking MJ when he said that only Dirk, Kobe, Lebron and Duncan would fair well in his era. Whist that is debatable, its the irony of posters thinking they know enough about basketball to call his comments as ''stupid'' and ''his record as an executive means he knows nothing about ball''.
I don't think Kobe is a top 5 player but Dr. J saying he is better than lebron isnt an outlandish statement. I think Lebron is a better player than Kobe in his prime, but it is very close. People forget how good Kobe was and always bring in the fact he played Shaq to discredit him when most great players played with other great players.

What did Magic say about Rondo? Rondo is a great player so...

TheNumber37
06-07-2013, 07:56 AM
if LeBron loses to the Spurs it only strengthen the argument.

Greedy22
06-07-2013, 08:04 AM
Both Wade and James let it slip in interviews that they had serious discussions about teaming up well before they were free to do so. That's tantamount to tampering when you think about it, since they ended up with the Heat. I don't blame them for joining forces, but let's not pretend to be naive about it.

And let's not try to equate it anywhere on the same level of Jerry West using his shrewd acumen and foresight in going after Kobe to add to the huge free agency get in Shaq. No one knew what Kobe would become when he was drafted. He could have been the next Jordan, or the next Harold Minor. Most thought the latter at the time, including some of his fellow players and coaches. By contrast LeBron and Wade were already polished all-stars when they agreed to join forces. It's not the same.

Wade didn't "find" his help. He colluded with them, recruiting them before they were truly free agents. The rest of the Summer of LeBron was just a dog and pony show of the Heat 3 pulling the chains of the other interested franchises in order to make it look like they were acting above board and in good faith.

Nothing says the players can't talk about joining forces, it'd be a little different if management was involved though.

BklynKnicks3
06-07-2013, 09:40 AM
to me kobe is 2nd. He proved it when he won without shaq. Would love to see Lebron win without wade. Magic never won without kareem/bird never won with out mchale. I kind of put bigmen on their own list
Yeah Kobe never teamed up with other greats. You know a top 5 Center of all time or anything.

Davidgta1
06-07-2013, 10:22 AM
Lebron and kobe will be top 10 of all time when there both done but what dose it matter Jordan will always be number 1 no one will surpass him unless some kid comes outta no where and wins 7 championship in a role but doubt that happens.

bagwell368
06-07-2013, 10:51 AM
You have to realise that Magic works for ESPN whoa renown for saying outlandish comments to spark attention and debate amongst viewers and fans. If Magic Johnson is at home and you take away the cameras I guarantee he has diff viewpoints than the ones he makes on TV.



I sincerely hope so.


My point is alot of fans tend to label past players ''as not knowing what they are talking about'' when they say something they don't want to hear or isn't praising their fav player.

I'm a lot more objective than most here, so that doesn't resonate for me.


Whist that is debatable, its the irony of posters thinking they know enough about basketball to call his comments as ''stupid'' and ''his record as an executive means he knows nothing about ball''.

Obviously fan objectivity and knowledge are not clear in this example, so it certainly happened in some cases as you say.


I don't think Kobe is a top 5 player but Dr. J saying he is better than lebron isnt an outlandish statement.

Kobe is not top 5 and so far given career length, it's hard to argue Kobe doesn't have James.


What did Magic say about Rondo? Rondo is a great player so...

He said earlier this season that he was the best PG in the NBA which is wrong. Rondo was scraping at the back end of the top 5 in 2008-2010, but since has fallen off (man D, shooting efficiency, attacking the hoop), and wasn't even top 10 last year (adjusting for games played), never mind #1.

Casual fans have an idea that more assists means a better PG. But when the PG in quesiton only strong plus value on offense is passing, he's going to dominate the ball and get assists. he also passed up bunnies to stoke up his assist totals which I'm aghast at. Rondo is terrible at foul shots and shots more then 10-12' out. While he's a fine offensive rebounder for a PG, he often makes that effort against his defensive assignment, and his net total of rebounds isn't all that large in any event.

While Rondo went for too many steals in his heyday, he could play superb defense. Well, he doesn't play superb D any longer.

His triple double count which is near legendary has been earned to a massive extent while on National TV. He seems far less interested in regular season games against "boring" teams/PG's. Maybe that's why Magic loves him so much. Magic ought to tune in for one of those "classic" local TV: FG: 3/8 FT: 2/5 AST: 11 TOV: 5 with the turnstile D games.

Don't even get me into all the off court immaturity and baloney out of this guy.

ChicagoJ
06-07-2013, 10:53 AM
I've been watching the nba since late 80s, and Kobe is probably the best I've seen play outside of mj. Maybe it's because he reminds me so much of mj, idk.

The thing people need to realize with lebron is his level depends on how good his teammates are. He's still one of the all time greats regardless, but we may be seeing him at his peek right now. When he has to score 40 he's not the same player. It will be interesting to see his game when he doesn't have the defense and outside shooters he has currently.

RaiderLakersA's
06-07-2013, 11:08 AM
Honestly what Kobe did was worse. He held a team hostage like a true communist. LeBron tested the free-market like a true American.

Clearly political economics (and analogies) are not your bailiwick. Please avoid at all costs. :D

todu82
06-07-2013, 11:12 AM
I'd still take Kobe over Lebron all time but give Lebron another year or 2 and I think he passes Kobe all time.

RaiderLakersA's
06-07-2013, 11:13 AM
Nothing says the players can't talk about joining forces, it'd be a little different if management was involved though.

Right, because there's no way that Wade would then turn around and tell Riles that he's already secured LeBron and Bosh, so don't make any moves in FA. You betcha.

blastmasta26
06-07-2013, 11:35 AM
I don't put much stock in the opinions of former players, even if legends. Sure, they know how to play the game, but it doesn't necessarily mean they know how to evaluate other players or that they are completely objective and unbiased. Also, taking the opinion of one of these players is probably biased in of itself since so many Hall of Famers have differing opinions.

The unsupported opinion of a former player isn't a good enough argument to convince anyone that Kobe is top 5.

OceanSpray
06-07-2013, 11:36 AM
There are so many legends who say LeBron can and probably surpassed Jordan as the GOAT...

Heatcheck
06-07-2013, 01:41 PM
i wonder if Dr. J would be as effective and successful a talent evaluator for a team, as Isaiah and Jordan were, two other greats who actually played the game.

Heatcheck
06-07-2013, 01:43 PM
Right, because there's no way that Wade would then turn around and tell Riles that he's already secured LeBron and Bosh, so don't make any moves in FA. You betcha.

Awww yes the conspiracy theories....whatever helps you sleep at night

beliges
06-07-2013, 02:51 PM
to me kobe is 2nd. He proved it when he won without shaq. Would love to see Lebron win without wade. Magic never won without kareem/bird never won with out mchale. I kind of put bigmen on their own list

That is the knock that Lebron will have until he is finally able to win without a Wade and a superstar team. Kobe was criticized heavily for winning with Shaq then he responded by winning 2 straight without Shaq. Lebron will cement his legacy if and when he wins outside of Miami, or without a Wade caliber player.

But he is a beast and I have no doubt that Lebron can pull it off. Although, he NEEDS to win this year's Finals otherwise the discussion between Lebron and the greatests will be over and done with.

Raps18-19 Champ
06-07-2013, 03:08 PM
He has an opinion. So what?

I've heard all time greats say Lebron is a great player. I've heard all time greats say Kobe is a great player.

Nothing new at all.

RaiderLakersA's
06-07-2013, 03:38 PM
Awww yes the conspiracy theories....whatever helps you sleep at night

Gee, thanks. It's the bright gleam coming from all of the Lakers O'Brien trophies that's to blame for my sleepless nights. When it was just 1 or 2, they made for a decent nite lite. I'm sure you know what I mean. :D

JordansBulls
06-07-2013, 03:53 PM
if LeBron loses to the Spurs it only strengthen the argument.

What do you mean?

RaiderLakersA's
06-07-2013, 03:58 PM
What do you mean?

Never mind that -- Are we really at the point where we're saying that if the Heat lose, it's LeBron's loss?! NFW! That's just not right. I mean unless LBJ really stinks up the joint in this series, he should not get all of the blame.

RiceOnTheRun
06-07-2013, 04:43 PM
He's almost their. Kobe is top 6 in my book. Kobe is a true winner. Lebron never won anything before joining a top3 team all time. He even won Bronze twice, how sad is that. I would choose a prime kobe over a prime Lebron 10/10 times.

Kobe never won anything without a supporting cast either.

I'm pretty sure Prime Shaq > Wade and Bosh together.

Also, Gasol and Bynum were at the time two of the top 15 big men in the league at worst.

ILLUSIONIST^248
06-07-2013, 04:50 PM
Kobe never won anything without a supporting cast either.

I'm pretty sure Prime Shaq > Wade and Bosh together.

Also, Gasol and Bynum were at the time two of the top 15 big men in the league at worst.

Wade bosh>>>>>>> Gasol/Bynum.

Bynum played a miniscule role in both our championships. It was a two man wrecking crew in Kobe and Gasol.

Hawkeye15
06-07-2013, 07:22 PM
Both Wade and James let it slip in interviews that they had serious discussions about teaming up well before they were free to do so. That's tantamount to tampering when you think about it, since they ended up with the Heat. I don't blame them for joining forces, but let's not pretend to be naive about it.

And let's not try to equate it anywhere on the same level of Jerry West using his shrewd acumen and foresight in going after Kobe to add to the huge free agency get in Shaq. No one knew what Kobe would become when he was drafted. He could have been the next Jordan, or the next Harold Minor. Most thought the latter at the time, including some of his fellow players and coaches. By contrast LeBron and Wade were already polished all-stars when they agreed to join forces. It's not the same.

Wade didn't "find" his help. He colluded with them, recruiting them before they were truly free agents. The rest of the Summer of LeBron was just a dog and pony show of the Heat 3 pulling the chains of the other interested franchises in order to make it look like they were acting above board and in good faith.

did you miss the second portion of my post? It can not be explained to me where I find it acceptable. If people want to judge players on whether they win rings, then leave it at that, and let the player figure out how he can win them if his FO can't.

Hawkeye15
06-07-2013, 07:24 PM
Just because he prefer him, doesnt mean he doesnt know what he is talking about?

So Haweye15 has more knowledge than Julius Erving?

Its repetition amongst so many ex players to **** the bed when making evaluations on players. There are plenty I do respect, but they need to have a track record of making the right call. Dr. J is not one of these.

Purple_n_Gold
06-08-2013, 12:01 AM
There are so many legends who say LeBron can and probably surpassed Jordan as the GOAT...
Names other than pippen? The same Pippen who said James is better than Jordan and just said he could easily check Lebron? I guess Pippen is the Goat by his account.

Cubby
06-08-2013, 12:24 AM
Hey now, he was traded to LA on draft day. He didn't take his talents there in free agency :D


It's a joke, please don't kill me :hide:

Oh I understand sarcasm.

LeBron is a coward for going into FA and getting to make a choice where he plays. At least he didn't force himself off a team like Kobe, or threaten to leave because he couldn't get it done by himself after Shaq left.

And when LeBron "chooses" to go back to CLE you can follow him there too.

amos1er
06-08-2013, 12:51 AM
Kobe never won anything without a supporting cast either.

True, but he never had a supporting cast as strong as Lebron's Heat.


I'm pretty sure Prime Shaq > Wade and Bosh together.

:laugh: Get out out of here bro. Who you tryin to fool. Wade is a top 5 player and Bosh is a top 15 player. Plus Lebron also has 5 three point snipers on his team who all shoot above 40% from deep including Allen who is arguably the best shooter in NBA history. Kobe had Shaq who was top five, but his supporting cast other than him was mediocre at best.


Also, Gasol and Bynum were at the time two of the top 15 big men in the league at worst.

:laugh: Bynum hardly contributed in 2009 and was perhaps a top 15 big man in 2010, but hardly a top 15 player unlike Bosh. Go look up Bynum's numbers in those championship runs. They were very average. Lulz.

amos1er
06-08-2013, 12:53 AM
Its repetition amongst so many ex players to **** the bed when making evaluations on players. There are plenty I do respect, but they need to have a track record of making the right call. Dr. J is not one of these.

Let me guess. Every ex player that says Lebron is the GOAT you agree with. Lulz

Not too many of those by my account either.

amos1er
06-08-2013, 12:54 AM
Wade bosh>>>>>>> Gasol/Bynum.

Bynum played a miniscule role in both our championships. It was a two man wrecking crew in Kobe and Gasol.

I know. I love when these guys try to act like Bynum was a stud during those years. He was a young big man with promise for sure, but hardly a the top tier player these Lebronites make him out to be. I still remember when Andrew32 said that Odom was an All-Star caliber player. LMAO

Dnovakovic099
06-08-2013, 01:33 AM
I know. I love when these guys try to act like Bynum was a stud during those years. He was a young big man with promise for sure, but hardly a the top tier player these Lebronites make him out to be. I still remember when Andrew32 said that Odom was an All-Star caliber player. LMAO

Do you guys actually ever show facts or do you just spew **** all day? I want to see the stats that show me that Bosh and Wade have had a bigger impact on the Heat winning than Gasol and Bynum on the Lakers. I know, I am going to be waiting my whole life.The funny part is I should be asking for you to prove that Wade and Bosh are better than Kobe and Bynum because Gasol was the actual best player in the playoffs for the Lakers.

Dnovakovic099
06-08-2013, 01:36 AM
I know. I love when these guys try to act like Bynum was a stud during those years. He was a young big man with promise for sure, but hardly a the top tier player these Lebronites make him out to be. I still remember when Andrew32 said that Odom was an All-Star caliber player. LMAO

This is coming from a guy who respects Kobe and dislikes James.... The only thing I hate more than a player getting his dick sucked dry by some bandwagon fans is for a player to be **** on by fans who have C0CKS so far down their throat they cannot think straight.

Dnovakovic099
06-08-2013, 01:38 AM
I know. I love when these guys try to act like Bynum was a stud during those years. He was a young big man with promise for sure, but hardly a the top tier player these Lebronites make him out to be. I still remember when Andrew32 said that Odom was an All-Star caliber player. LMAO

Go meet Mr. Collins he might share the same enthusiasm for sucking Kobe's D1CK as you do.

WARRIORS@GR
06-08-2013, 02:45 AM
Kobe had Shaq who was top five, but his supporting cast other than him was mediocre at best.

Kobe HAD Shaq?KOBE'S supporting cast?What do u mean by that?

Shaq had Kobe and it was Shaq's supporting cast.

Try again.

amos1er
06-08-2013, 02:57 AM
Go meet Mr. Collins he might share the same enthusiasm for sucking Kobe's D1CK as you do.

Oh thats real classy, attack someone for having the courage to come out of the closet. I wonder how the mods will feel about this sort of anti-gay remark. :pity:

Dnovakovic099
06-08-2013, 12:33 PM
Oh thats real classy, attack someone for having the courage to come out of the closet. I wonder how the mods will feel about this sort of anti-gay remark. :pity:

I could care less if I get banned. This site is getting ruined everyday by you and a few others like you. You guys literally make every single thread about Kobe or LeBron. If the mods don't want to ban you I might as well join in on the huge baitfest you guys are having.

Dnovakovic099
06-08-2013, 12:35 PM
Oh thats real classy, attack someone for having the courage to come out of the closet. I wonder how the mods will feel about this sort of anti-gay remark. :pity:

On the other hand I am really impressed with your baiting skills. I mean jeez I am almost at a point where I believe you are delusional and have a mental illness either that or the IQ of a pigeon. That is some dedication to baiting I must admit.

Hawkeye15
06-08-2013, 02:07 PM
Kobe never won anything without a supporting cast either.

I'm pretty sure Prime Shaq > Wade and Bosh together.

Also, Gasol and Bynum were at the time two of the top 15 big men in the league at worst.

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/playoffs/2013/story/_/id/9353115/2013-nba-playoffs-top-10-all-nba-finals-players

Kobe not even on the list of top 10 finals performance, Gasol with Kobe is...

Purple_n_Gold
06-08-2013, 03:35 PM
Everyone has their opinion. It's an OPINION. Doesn't make it right or wrong but to say the opinions on here are more valid than some people who played the game professionally is a joke. It's funny there are people on here who seem to get offended if NBA legends don't bow to the "KING" and then the common consensus among these people is that they are off their rockers. This is not really that big of a deal but you see the "kings knights" out in full force. An opinion is an opinion and if you feel differently that's your thoughts, doesn't make them right. Most are saying NBA players opinions hold no weight but flood these threads with counter arguments. If it doesn't matter let it go. The Lebron fanatics as well as the Kobe fanatics are holding this forum hostage with the constant baiting, arguing about nothing more than opinion. There is no right answer when it comes to opinions, but you disagreeing with someone's thoughts does not make you right.

ThaDubs
06-08-2013, 03:42 PM
Go meet Mr. Collins he might share the same enthusiasm for sucking Kobe's D1CK as you do.

Real classy man.

ThaDubs
06-08-2013, 03:45 PM
Everyone has their opinion. It's an OPINION. Doesn't make it right or wrong but to say the opinions on here are more valid than some people who played the game professionally is a joke. It's funny there are people on here who seem to get offended if NBA legends don't bow to the "KING" and then the common consensus among these people is that they are off their rockers. This is not really that big of a deal but you see the "kings knights" out in full force. An opinion is an opinion and if you feel differently that's your thoughts, doesn't make them right. Most are saying NBA players opinions hold no weight but flood these threads with counter arguments. If it doesn't matter let it go. The Lebron fanatics as well as the Kobe fanatics are holding this forum hostage with the constant baiting, arguing about nothing more than opinion. There is no right answer when it comes to opinions, but you disagreeing with someone's thoughts does not make you right.

I think LeBron > Kobe but great post.

ThaDubs
06-08-2013, 03:47 PM
I could care less if I get banned. This site is getting ruined everyday by you and a few others like you. You guys literally make every single thread about Kobe or LeBron. If the mods don't want to ban you I might as well join in on the huge baitfest you guys are having.

If you don't care about getting banned then leave. Amount of people who care: 0

jerellh528
06-08-2013, 05:08 PM
Nothing you idiots! dr.J's dead, he's locked in my basement!

hoggin88
06-08-2013, 05:21 PM
Go meet Mr. Collins he might share the same enthusiasm for sucking Kobe's D1CK as you do.

You're making a fool of yourself.