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View Full Version : Mark Cuban explains why 5 Year MAX Contracts are Overrated



waveycrockett
05-26-2013, 10:13 AM
On the sales pitch to convince a max free agent to decline the fifth year and larger raise his current team can offer: “First, you try to look what is important to the play. All players say they want to win rings, and that’s true. All players want to make as much money as they can and that’s true. They all view their careers differently, and I try to focus on what we can do to help them reach their career goals and put them in a position to succeed.

"In terms of that fifth year, that really is overrated from the perspective that if he’s young enough, he’s going to get another contract or two. When you sit down with them and say that there might be the issue of this contract ends before we can opt out of this current CBA. That may sound silly since we just signed a new CBA two years ago, but the ability for the league to opt out after six years means a five-year contract signed now puts you other side of that CBA, which may not be a good thing. You may want to be in a position where you want to sign another long-term deal before the NBA has the option to opt out of this CBA. I’m not suggesting that anything is going to happen with this CBA, but it’s just something to consider. On the second side of that, you’re young enough to get another contract.

"The third point, look at what LeBron [James], Kevin Durant, [Chris] Bosh and all those guys did. They all signed deals with opt-outs after three years, so there’s plenty of precedent. It’s not like all of these guys have to have that fifth year. A lot of them look at the flexibility and the options, and they have enough confidence in their ability to get that next contract. They have enough confidence in their ability to find insurance contracts in case they get hurt.”


http://espn.go.com/blog/dallas/mavericks/post/_/id/4696165/mark-cuban-on-the-mavs-summer-goals-and-two-year-plan


All Good points

3Blueforyou
05-26-2013, 10:25 AM
It is also depends on the player, I think a 24-25 years old in good health can make this decision with a little more ease than maybe a 28-30 year old who could be on his last contract. I am sure there are a lot of different thoughts that go through a player and his agents head prior to singing.

Dade County
05-26-2013, 11:19 AM
The third point, look at what LeBron [James], Kevin Durant, [Chris] Bosh and all those guys did. They all signed deals with opt-outs after three years, so thereís plenty of precedent. Itís not like all of these guys have to have that fifth year.

Wade, Lbj & bosh signed 6yr contract... option to opt-out after 4th year.

KD signed a five year deal...waived option to opt-out.

phoenix_bladen
05-26-2013, 11:29 AM
It is also depends on the player, I think a 24-25 years old in good health can make this decision with a little more ease than maybe a 28-30 year old who could be on his last contract. I am sure there are a lot of different thoughts that go through a player and his agents head prior to singing.

But usually the players that every team most sought out for ARE 24-25 year olds and not 28-30 year olds.

Look at joe Johnson and amare stoudamire, although they got 5 year contracts most teams didnt want to sign them anyways so Atlanta and New York were able to get them very easily.

On the other hand we had Lebron, wade, bosh on that summer of 2010 where all the teams just were begging for them to join them and were ready to even throw a 10 year contract had that even existed. But I'm sure that 5th extra year was never a factor (6th year at that time with the old CBA) because all of them aside from wade left their previous teams via sign and trade. Wade would have left if his buddies didnt come either.

Cuban is right, 5 years are overrated and even back then teams could have just did a sign and trade anyways leaving the existing team with real no advantage.

Not sure how the new rule can affect free agents this time with a limited sign and trade, does Howard leave the 5th year option off the table with his bad back?

TylerSL
05-26-2013, 11:32 AM
Wade, Lbj & bosh signed 6yr contract... option to opt-out after 4th year.

KD signed a five year deal...waived option to opt-out.

unless the Heat dont win championships, Wade, Lebron, and Bosh are not leaving Miami either.

LongWayFromHome
05-26-2013, 11:39 AM
Wade, Lbj & bosh signed 6yr contract... option to opt-out after 4th year.

KD signed a five year deal...waived option to opt-out.

Yeah but Dwight doesn't know that stuff. I bet that guy will be so easy to sell. Its a matter of which team he meets with first lol.

3Blueforyou
05-26-2013, 11:40 AM
But usually the players that every team most sought out for ARE 24-25 year olds and not 28-30 year olds.

Look at joe Johnson and amare stoudamire, although they got 5 year contracts most teams didnt want to sign them anyways so Atlanta and New York were able to get them very easily.

On the other hand we had Lebron, wade, bosh on that summer of 2010 where all the teams just were begging for them to join them and were ready to even throw a 10 year contract had that even existed. But I'm sure that 5th extra year was never a factor (6th year at that time with the old CBA) because all of them aside from wade left their previous teams via sign and trade. Wade would have left if his buddies didnt come either.

Cuban is right, 5 years are overrated and even back then teams could have just did a sign and trade anyways leaving the existing team with real no advantage.

Not sure how the new rule can affect free agents this time with a limited sign and trade, does Howard leave the 5th year option off the table with his bad back?

I think this that point was a given, I was just trying to point out that a 24 year old at the end of a 4 year contract is now the Amare and JJ at 28. Now as you pointed out, these players become not necessarily become the most desirable Free agents but still able to sign a lucrative contract.

LongWayFromHome
05-26-2013, 11:40 AM
unless the Heat dont win championships, Wade, Lebron, and Bosh are not leaving Miami either.

But if I was Lebron I would at least opt-out and sign a max with MIA under bird rights.

ldawg
05-26-2013, 11:52 AM
I am sorry but with the way the NBA is on a youth movement i dont agree. A player like Howard who has limited offensive skills that depends heavy on his athletic ability will not get a Max deal after this one if he sign a 4 or 5 year deal. Cuban has been loyal to one player, Dirk. You know why? under the old cba plus He has skills he is still a good shooter at his age so he is still useful but guess what his next contract will not be a max player contract. You saw what Cuban said about Cutting Kobe, About the amount and length of Nash contract, And what about the way he let terry and Chandler walk? So IMO it depends on position played and the Player himself. While that might hold truth to very healthy skill player like Lebron its not so good for not so healthy players on limited skills maybe like a Amare/Howard. Most players between 29-35 will not get a max deal. A nice contract just not max.

3RDASYSTEM
05-26-2013, 11:52 AM
It is also depends on the player, I think a 24-25 years old in good health can make this decision with a little more ease than maybe a 28-30 year old who could be on his last contract. I am sure there are a lot of different thoughts that go through a player and his agents head prior to singing.

But HOWARD-CP3 on on verge of being 28 and could have same opt out after yr 3 and not longer than yr 4 to reup on another 5yr max, pretty wise thing to mention by CUBAN since free agency is right around the corner

TX will flex its muscle this free agency, or at least give a home run swing effort

ldawg
05-26-2013, 12:19 PM
Cuban break up his championship team because they were old or he think they were not worth the money so he let the free agents walk. Mark will not extend a 31/32 one year old Howard with a bad back with limited skills to a second max contract.

waveycrockett
05-26-2013, 12:24 PM
Cuban break up his championship team because they were old or he think they were not worth the money so he let the free agents walk. Mark will not extend a 31/32 one year old Howard with a bad back with limited skills to a second max contract.
Extending a 31/32 year old Tyson Chandler who was ridiculously injury prone is alot different than extending Howard.

knicksfan42
05-26-2013, 12:36 PM
Extending a 31/32 year old Tyson Chandler who was ridiculously injury prone is alot different than extending Howard.

Chandler is 30 now, he was 28 at the time.

JasonJohnHorn
05-26-2013, 12:44 PM
Players want the long contract with the player option for flexibility. It's as simple as that.

shep33
05-26-2013, 01:12 PM
Depends. A guy like Howard say, would be 31 by the end of a 4 year deal. With back and shoulder issues, and the year he just had, not to mention that his game is built upon his athletic ability, that 5th year worth 25 mill or so, sounds pretty good.

waveycrockett
05-26-2013, 01:13 PM
Chandler is 30 now, he was 28 at the time.

Ok my mistake but point remains the same. The choice between A guy who has been a runner up MVP and pretty much a top-5 MVP candidate year in and out versus extending a 28 year old guy who at the time was never an allstar is an easy one.

Goose17
05-26-2013, 01:52 PM
Cuban is a smart guy.

BALLER R
05-26-2013, 01:57 PM
Cuban is a smart guy.

Most billionaires are

naps
05-26-2013, 02:04 PM
Yea, it is overrated if the player can get equal or close to equal in one year of his next deal. Howard should easily receive another max deal if he stays healthy. I would pick Houston in heartbeat over anyone else if I was Howard.

ldawg
05-26-2013, 02:59 PM
Yea, it is overrated if the player can get equal or close to equal in one year of his next deal. Howard should easily receive another max deal if he stays healthy. I would pick Houston in heartbeat over anyone else if I was Howard.I dont thinks so. He will get another nice deal or extension with the one he sign but he wont get another max deal if he leaves that team. Howard will be a bit of a liability as he ages. He is not skill like kg or Duncan his ft shooting is awful so he relies on his athletic ability. I think he will be a journey man has he ages. Cuban is smart so he says the right thing to get you in the door but once he feel your game is limited he will get rid of you and Howard game is limited. Howard is a paint protector but he is not huge, cant shoot, limited back to the basket game and never avg pass 25ppg.

Hawkeye15
05-26-2013, 03:02 PM
depends. Not giving Love a 5 year deal, with an opt out after 3, is stupid. Not giving Eric Gordon a 5 year deal is a good idea (though Love needs a couple healthy seasons to justify my claim). If you are chasing Dwight, at his age, why give him a 5 year deal?

ldawg
05-26-2013, 10:25 PM
Howard has been in the NBA for a while and we still feel his game still need work dude cant shoot. After this max deal it will be a stretch for him.

IndyRealist
05-27-2013, 12:57 PM
Not really. It's great from CUBAN's perspective, because he can land free agents vs. having to trade for their Bird rights. Players get a higher possible percentage raise if they stay with their own team, I believe. But most importantly, they get security. A lot can happen in 4 years. Look at Jermaine O'Neal. Once he signed his max deal, his knees were never the same. His contract after that was what, the MLE? He would have been out over $22M if he signed a deal that was a year shorter. How much did Orlando pay Grant Hill to wear a suit? Denver and Kenyon Martin?

There is NO financial benefit to taking a shorter deal, unless:
1) You are on the last year of a rookie contract, and
2) You are a max player, and
3) You do NOT qualify for the Derrick Rose rule (All-star starter x2, All-NBA team x2, or MVP x1)
In which case it would benefit you to take a 3yr deal (or opt out at year 3) to sign your next deal for 30% of the salary cap instead of 25%. A player who qualifies for the Derrick Rose rule gets 30% anyway.

Every other player should take as much money as possible on their contract, from a financial perspective.