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View Full Version : Is Luol Deng really all-star material?



canzano55
03-22-2013, 07:29 AM
Don't get me wrong, he's a very talented player with excellent defensive ability combined with an innate potency to score. But if anyone has had them on their fantasy like I have, you have to be majorly disappointed.

I realize he's not the focal point of the Bulls offence but that doesn't mean he shouldn't assert himself more. All that offensive talent but no significant numbers to back it up this season.

Waste of a fantasy pick...

sep11ie
03-22-2013, 08:05 AM
Lol, he's not all-star worthy cause he's let you down in your fantasy world. Here's an idea coach, sit his butt on the benvh for a few games, that'll get the message across. Better yet, suspend him without fantasy pay for conduct detrimental to your fantasy team.

koreancabbage
03-22-2013, 08:54 AM
in the East the last couple of years, yes, but with Rudy Gay, Carmelo, Granger, et al, there should be no reason why Deng would be an all-star going forward.

he is a great glue guy but he is no way an all-star. great all round player and championship teams would love him as that 3rd or 4th option. but his defense is what is needed over any of his other abilities

D-Leethal
03-22-2013, 09:06 AM
He's basically an elite role player. Great defense, great team leader, but hes really just a catch and shoot guy and needs to play OFF another all star.

GiantsSwaGG
03-22-2013, 09:06 AM
Hell no

Rndy
03-22-2013, 09:09 AM
Hell no

:rolleyes: Because every all star needs to be a superstar? Deng gets voted in by coaches for a reason.

pacofunk64
03-22-2013, 09:24 AM
He's not your typical all-star in the fact he isn't an offensive force. He's fringe but it'll be because of his all around game.

chicagocubsfan
03-22-2013, 09:28 AM
in the East the last couple of years, yes, but with Rudy Gay, Carmelo, Granger, et al, there should be no reason why Deng would be an all-star going forward.

he is a great glue guy but he is no way an all-star. great all round player and championship teams would love him as that 3rd or 4th option. but his defense is what is needed over any of his other abilities
Rudy Gay lol. There's a reason why Memphis traded his inefficient *** to Toronto.

Dade County
03-22-2013, 09:30 AM
Deng is a good tough hard noise player... Every team needs a guy like him, he shouldn't be counted on to score like 20pts a night but he is still very important to any team, that desires a championship.

He is also getting paid a little to much.

JasonJohnHorn
03-22-2013, 09:37 AM
Firstly, when it comes to All-Star game appearances, people reward offence before defence even though they are equally important.

At his position, I cannot name 5 players who are better than him defensively. At SF, guys like Prince, Marion and MWP are amazing (and I'm speaking over their careers, not just this season), and LBJ is perhaps the most versatile defender at the SF position in the league. I would say that Deng defends the SF position as wellas any of those players, even LBJ (though I don't think Deng would be able to defend some other positions as well as LBJ can). So when it comes to defence, he is certainly worthy of recognition as one of the best as his position in the league. That, for me, makes him an All-Star candidate.


Offensively, he has had much better seasons than this season. In the past I'd say his offensive was boarder-line All-Star material. There were certainly seasons where his shooting percentages were better than some All-Stars. This year (and last) his FG% is down a little bit.


But yeah... I would say Deng is an All-Star caliber player. Statistically he doesn't always look great, but his defence is huge... he knows how to make guys take uncomfortable shots, or force shots, or makes it hard for them to get the ball where they like it, and those things don't show up in the stat line. Look at Rodman, he never had amazing defensive stats, but he won 2 DPOY awards, because he was so good at doing those things.

TheLegend
03-22-2013, 09:37 AM
Deng is not an all-star caliber player. He's a role player that tries hard. But he's not the kind of guy that can be your 2nd best player if u want to win a championship. And maybe not even a good 3rd option. Personally, I don't care for Dengs game and the sooner Chicago get rid of him the happier I will be. Last night against Portland he had 5 pts, 2 Rebs., and 2ast... That's pathetic if ur suppose to be an all star. Against OKC about a month ago, Perkins switched on Deng and Deng tried to isolate and go around Perkins. Deng tried to shake and bake but he could NOT shake the flat footed Perkins. Perkins eventually bottled him up and forced him into a wild shot that wasn't even close. I know a lot of Bulls fans don't want to see it but they need to rebuild if they truly want to win a title. Start wit Noah and Rose, then build from there. Yes, Deng plays good hard defense but its not elite defense. He's not a ball hawk like Lebron or how Pip was. lebrons athletic ability lets him do unique things defensively, like Pippen. Dengs not going to go from A to Z in 3 seconds to block a shot out of nowhere.

LeperMessiah
03-22-2013, 09:40 AM
Lol, he's not all-star worthy cause he's let you down in your fantasy world. Here's an idea coach, sit his butt on the benvh for a few games, that'll get the message across. Better yet, suspend him without fantasy pay for conduct detrimental to your fantasy team.

Oh my god yes :facepalm:

chicagocubsfan
03-22-2013, 09:41 AM
Deng is not an all-star caliber player. He's a role player that tries hard. But he's not the kind of guy that can be your 2nd best player of u want to win a championship. And maybe not even a good 3rd option. Personally, I don't care for Dengs game and the sooner Chicago get rid of him the happier I will be. Last night against Portland he had 5 pts, 2 Rebs., and 2ast... That's pathetic if ur suppose to be an all star. Against OKC about a month ago, Perkins switched on Deng and Deng tried to isolate and go around Perkins. Deng tried to shake and bake but he could NOT shake the flat footed Perkins. Perkins eventually bottled him up and forced him into a wild shot that wasn't even close. I know a lot of Bulls fans don't want to see it but they need to rebuild if they truly want to win a title. Start wit Noah and Rose, then build from there.
Rebuilding with an MVP PG and an all star C is not rebuilding.

JiffyMix88
03-22-2013, 09:43 AM
I really thought with the Derrick Rose injury he would take more controll and I thought he could average 20 6 6 but now I'm starting to think he is just an average offensive player but a great defender that needs someone who can penetrate and find him on spot up shots or on his slashes and cuts through the lanes to make his offensive input better.

2-ONE-5
03-22-2013, 09:44 AM
i hate these losers that judge a player off their fantasy impact. get a life, watch the game

TheLegend
03-22-2013, 09:45 AM
Rebuilding with an MVP PG and an all star C is not rebuilding.

What you call it then?

TheLegend
03-22-2013, 09:47 AM
I really thought with the Derrick Rose injury he would take more controll and I thought he could average 20 6 6 but now I'm starting to think he is just an average offensive player but a great defender that needs someone who can penetrate and find him on spot up shots or on his slashes and cuts through the lanes to make his offensive input better.

You are correct.

cubbiefan_est88
03-22-2013, 09:50 AM
Rebuilding with an MVP PG and an all star C is not rebuilding.

What you call it then?

A team who fell in love with its players and has cap problems because of it.

koreancabbage
03-22-2013, 09:53 AM
Rudy Gay lol. There's a reason why Memphis traded his inefficient *** to Toronto.

inefficient last year and this one. i know there is a downward extrapolation but I think 2013-2014 will be different. 26/27 years old entering his prime player and a fresh start in a new year.

but my point remains the same, Deng is not an all-star (not a worthy one anyways)

JiffyMix88
03-22-2013, 09:55 AM
i hate these losers that judge a player off their fantasy impact. get a life, watch the game

He hasn't been playing that well in real life either though.... :(

TheLegend
03-22-2013, 09:58 AM
A team who fell in love with its players and has cap problems because of it.

I don't think they are in-love with their players. Give the Bulls organization credit, they don't make lateral moves. But I think it's becoming obvious that this team isn't going to win a ship as constructed. And with the new CBA, what team don't have cap problems. Going forward, the team has some options. They can amnesty boozer, Deng don't have much left on his contract. Excluding Taj, most on the bench are on 1yr contracts. Rip will be gone, we have the Bobcats pick, which could either land a superstar or become one through the draft. Mirotic is out there. I think we have some pluses to rebuild if you will moving forward.

chicagocubsfan
03-22-2013, 10:00 AM
What you call it then?

Retooling. Still maintaining a competitive team while building around 2-3 key players.

Jarvo
03-22-2013, 10:01 AM
Rudy Gay lol. There's a reason why Memphis traded his inefficient *** to Toronto.

But Rudy Gay is better than him though :shrug:

Jarvo
03-22-2013, 10:02 AM
But like someone said before he's an elite role player.

TheLegend
03-22-2013, 10:13 AM
Retooling. Still maintaining a competitive team while building around 2-3 key players.

Oh ok, I see what your saying. I agree, they definitely will be able to remain competitive. It won't be a typical rebuild where u are garbage for a year or two. With Rosť, Thibs, and Noah, that won't happen. Rebuild, retool, all the same to me. Especially when you change your core.

meloman1592
03-22-2013, 10:35 AM
Elite role player...not an all star by any means.

canzano55
03-22-2013, 10:35 AM
Lol, he's not all-star worthy cause he's let you down in your fantasy world. Here's an idea coach, sit his butt on the benvh for a few games, that'll get the message across. Better yet, suspend him without fantasy pay for conduct detrimental to your fantasy team.


Oh my god yes :facepalm:


i hate these losers that judge a player off their fantasy impact. get a life, watch the game

Lol this is my first year playing fantasy and I agree with all three of you that the fantasy nerds are annoying and make false assumptions all the time.

However, now that I've played a full year I will concede that fantasy ball is, to its credit, an advanced polling system with millions of players that ultimately signify a players statistical worth in a given season.

Statistically Deng is not worth a lot, he used to be at one point and is still a hell of a player but I instinctively knew, without delving into endless topic posts in the Bulls forum, that fans of Chicago are far from pleased with this guy and not surprisingly they seem split on the issue.

I saw Deng hit a game winner against my Raps on a Illinois TV broadcast and the commentators were screaming all star and so at the time I felt good about having him in my fantasy team - not long after he's contributing very little statistically and low and behold, a lot of Bulls fans are frustrated.

The End.

2-ONE-5
03-22-2013, 10:49 AM
But Rudy Gay is better than him though :shrug:

no hes not

2-ONE-5
03-22-2013, 10:52 AM
Lol this is my first year playing fantasy and I agree with all three of you that the fantasy nerds are annoying and make false assumptions all the time.

However, now that I've played a full year I will concede that fantasy ball is, to its credit, an advanced polling system with millions of players that ultimately signify a players statistical worth in a given season.

Statistically Deng is not worth a lot, he used to be at one point and is still a hell of a player but I instinctively knew, without delving into endless topic posts in the Bulls forum, that fans of Chicago are far from pleased with this guy and not surprisingly they seem split on the issue.

I saw Deng hit a game winner against my Raps on a Illinois TV broadcast and the commentators were screaming all star and so at the time I felt good about having him in my fantasy team - not long after he's contributing very little statistically and low and behold, a lot of Bulls fans are frustrated.

The End.

Deng is overworked and palying without the teams best player. He is playing a role that he is not exactly fit for, he is playing the role that my Sixers wanted Iggy to play when he ended up not being capable of it leading to people thinking hes not any good. Deng has a lot more vlaue around the league then guys like Gay and Granger

chicagocubsfan
03-22-2013, 10:54 AM
Also Deng has been playing with a tornup wrist for the entire season and still is the league leader in minutes played. The guy is a horse.

kozelkid
03-22-2013, 10:57 AM
Rudy Gay lol. There's a reason why Memphis traded his inefficient *** to Toronto.

inefficient last year and this one. i know there is a downward extrapolation but I think 2013-2014 will be different. 26/27 years old entering his prime player and a fresh start in a new year.

but my point remains the same, Deng is not an all-star (not a worthy one anyways)

No, you have no point.

Rudy Gay will always be an underachiever and a detriment to any team that has serious championship aspirations. Meanwhile, until you can name enough forwards in the East that are more deserving of an all star spot, Deng will continue to make them.

LeperMessiah
03-22-2013, 11:10 AM
No, you have no point.

Rudy Gay will always be an underachiever and a detriment to any team that has serious championship aspirations. Meanwhile, until you can name enough forwards in the East that are more deserving of an all star spot, Deng will continue to make them.

Woa.. You take that back he's taking the Raptors to the promised land!!!

LeperMessiah
03-22-2013, 11:12 AM
Deng is overworked and palying without the teams best player. He is playing a role that he is not exactly fit for, he is playing the role that my Sixers wanted Iggy to play when he ended up not being capable of it leading to people thinking hes not any good. Deng has a lot more vlaue around the league then guys like Gay and Granger

But becoming the primary option for the team, he hasn't really stepped up to that role in Rose's absence at all.

canzano55
03-22-2013, 11:25 AM
Deng is overworked and palying without the teams best player. He is playing a role that he is not exactly fit for, he is playing the role that my Sixers wanted Iggy to play when he ended up not being capable of it leading to people thinking hes not any good. Deng has a lot more vlaue around the league then guys like Gay and GrangerThat still doesn't explain why he isn't making shots (or taking more shots for that matter)?

Ok if he has a torn up wrist, I didn't know that but he's supposed to be a top 10SF and yet there have been
endless weeks this season where he couldn't score more than 20 points (I counted 18). I could understand that if Rose was taking shots away from Deng because he's Chicago superstar player, but you'd think Luol would have more incentive to score with Rose being out seeing as how Deng is considered a solid mid-range player (or was)

Just look a the game log : http://www.hoopsstats.com/basketball/fantasy/nba/chicago-bulls/players/luol-deng/gamelog/13/4/62

Outside of a few good games here and there, he's been mostly ****.

Ezio
03-22-2013, 11:33 AM
Take a look at those games where he was **** and then look at who his PG was.

Bookey
03-22-2013, 11:45 AM
I love Luol Deng as a Bulls fan, but I'd be the first to admit that he is not all-star worthy. He is far too inconsistent. With Howard leaving to the West and players such as Deron Williams, Paul Pierce, & Joe Johnson having down years, as well as injuries to D.Rose, Amare, & Bynum along with the Eastern Conference being so weak you are seeing more and more undeserving all-stars. Same goes with Noah I love on my team, but he should never be making all-star games. Our only true all-star hasn't played at all this year, if we were in the West we would be out of the playoff hunt the way we've played this season in my opinion.

He115ing
03-22-2013, 11:56 AM
No, he is not. I remember laughing when he called himself a superstar during the Olympics.

Cubby
03-22-2013, 12:50 PM
Deng is a good tough hard noise player... Every team needs a guy like him, he shouldn't be counted on to score like 20pts a night but he is still very important to any team, that desires a championship.

He is also getting paid a little to much.

He's absolutely not getting overpaid. I'm ****ing tired of people saying that because it's 100% false.

(To the OP) What you're seeing is a guy who has to step up as a scorer (more than he's ever been) in the absence of the team's best player/scorer. He's not comfortable in that role, but he's an elite defender, an elite rounder, and a good second scorer (when Rose is there).

So stop *****ing about him. It's your fault for picking him.

Cubby
03-22-2013, 12:52 PM
I don't think they are in-love with their players. Give the Bulls organization credit, they don't make lateral moves. But I think it's becoming obvious that this team isn't going to win a ship as constructed. And with the new CBA, what team don't have cap problems. Going forward, the team has some options. They can amnesty boozer, Deng don't have much left on his contract. Excluding Taj, most on the bench are on 1yr contracts. Rip will be gone, we have the Bobcats pick, which could either land a superstar or become one through the draft. Mirotic is out there. I think we have some pluses to rebuild if you will moving forward.

Well, look who it is! Still haven't changed the avatar I see.

OceanSpray
03-22-2013, 12:54 PM
The Bulls have a great cast.. It's on Derrick Rose if they lose because James, Wade, Durant, and maybe Bryant can win on that team.

b@llhog24
03-22-2013, 01:06 PM
Firstly, when it comes to All-Star game appearances, people reward offence before defence even though they are equally important.

I disagree.


At his position, I cannot name 5 players who are better than him defensively. At SF, guys like Prince, Marion and MWP are amazing (and I'm speaking over their careers, not just this season), and LBJ is perhaps the most versatile defender at the SF position in the league. I would say that Deng defends the SF position as wellas any of those players, even LBJ (though I don't think Deng would be able to defend some other positions as well as LBJ can). So when it comes to defence, he is certainly worthy of recognition as one of the best as his position in the league. That, for me, makes him an All-Star candidate.


Offensively, he has had much better seasons than this season. In the past I'd say his offensive was boarder-line All-Star material. There were certainly seasons where his shooting percentages were better than some All-Stars. This year (and last) his FG% is down a little bit.


But yeah... I would say Deng is an All-Star caliber player. Statistically he doesn't always look great, but his defence is huge... he knows how to make guys take uncomfortable shots, or force shots, or makes it hard for them to get the ball where they like it, and those things don't show up in the stat line. Look at Rodman, he never had amazing defensive stats, but he won 2 DPOY awards, because he was so good at doing those things.

In terms of what I actually deem to be all star production, his 2010-11 year was worthy. The last couple of years? Not so much. Well maybe in terms of replacement value.


inefficient last year and this one. i know there is a downward extrapolation but I think 2013-2014 will be different. 26/27 years old entering his prime player and a fresh start in a new year.

but my point remains the same, Deng is not an all-star (not a worthy one anyways)

People said that same about Melo, spooky huh?


no hes not

+1

b@llhog24
03-22-2013, 01:10 PM
That still doesn't explain why he isn't making shots (or taking more shots for that matter)?

Ok if he has a torn up wrist, I didn't know that but he's supposed to be a top 10SF and yet there have been
endless weeks this season where he couldn't score more than 20 points (I counted 18). I could understand that if Rose was taking shots away from Deng because he's Chicago superstar player, but you'd think Luol would have more incentive to score with Rose being out seeing as how Deng is considered a solid mid-range player (or was)

Just look a the game log : http://www.hoopsstats.com/basketball/fantasy/nba/chicago-bulls/players/luol-deng/gamelog/13/4/62

Outside of a few good games here and there, he's been mostly ****.

Your problem is your expecting him to be something he's not, a shot creator. And can you name 10 SFs better than him?

koreancabbage
03-22-2013, 01:11 PM
People said that same about Melo, spooky huh?


true. I think Gay would be successful if the Raps got better 3 point shooters around ala Melo in NY. a lot more room to operate but both succumb to the shot happy -me first- ball stopping plays at times.

monzternipz12
03-22-2013, 01:13 PM
The Bulls have a great cast.. It's on Derrick Rose if they lose because James, Wade, Durant, and maybe Bryant can win on that team.

Good point. For the record, I hate Deng. He frustrates the hell outta me when I watch games. He is not an Allstar. But noah, to me, is a beast. He works hard every play, deserving all star. But he is expendable. Lol

seikou8
03-22-2013, 01:20 PM
deng is better than rudy gay

I Rock Shaqs
03-22-2013, 01:31 PM
i hate these losers that judge a player off their fantasy impact. get a life, watch the game

Bang Bang!

murphturph
03-22-2013, 01:37 PM
Gay has been playing better his last few games... He just got traded give him some time.... Before this year he was a pretty efficient scorer.... Next year Rudy will be a lot more efficient with added three point shooters around him and a full traing camp, and a solid team

3RDASYSTEM
03-22-2013, 01:43 PM
DENG is pretty much the same player I saw at DUKE

I said he would be a good pro and could sneak in a allstar game or two but wasn't nothing special but had a little game to him, just solid and played hard

its like that pretty much with every player if you don't include the ring talk and look at

he played with MVP in ROSE and went to ECF, if he had DROSE impact like WADE is MVP type teaming with BRON than that series would have been different and went likely 7

DENG's impact is pretty much same from day1, very strong 3 option on title contending squad, pushing him to 2nd option gets you to ECF

Get ROSE a HOWARD type player and push DENG down a spot and there you have it

Stunner
03-22-2013, 01:45 PM
Deng was so cold in 2007 but injuries and him still not having surgery on his wrist has hampered his playing style and it shows. He should have a lil bit better year next year because he said he's finally going to get the surgery out of the way.

Stunner
03-22-2013, 01:46 PM
Wheres Iggy's " Is Andre a all star ?" because i think hes one of the worst chosen in history .

Stunner
03-22-2013, 01:49 PM
But Rudy Gay is better than him though :shrug:

Not really he just can create but he is under achieves at things he should be almost elite at such as rebounding and defense with his athletic ability .

VendettaRed07
03-22-2013, 03:00 PM
If stars are A: type players. Deng is a B+

SportsFanatic10
03-22-2013, 03:54 PM
yes i think he's worthy of being an all-star. coaches value a player who can play well on both ends of the court more than most fans do, and that is why they vote him in.

2-ONE-5
03-22-2013, 04:40 PM
Wheres Iggy's " Is Andre a all star ?" because i think hes one of the worst chosen in history .

there was one. and Iggy is far from one of the worst in history. he was picked for his all around game not his scoring.

TheLegend
03-22-2013, 05:01 PM
Take a look at those games where he was **** and then look at who his PG was.

Doesn't matter, it's not like he's a skilled post player that needs someone to get him the ball. He's a good decent player, just not a all- star

TheLegend
03-22-2013, 05:08 PM
He's absolutely not getting overpaid. I'm ****ing tired of people saying that because it's 100% false.

(To the OP) What you're seeing is a guy who has to step up as a scorer (more than he's ever been) in the absence of the team's best player/scorer. He's not comfortable in that role, but he's an elite defender, an elite rounder, and a good second scorer (when Rose is there).

So stop *****ing about him. It's your fault for picking him.

He's a good defender but not elite, he's not athletic enough. He's not going to come out of no where to block a shot like Lebron would. He's a smart player tho. But I wouldn't say elite defensively. Lebron and Pippen is elite defenders. And far as elite rebounder? That's just simply not true. He's a good rebounder easily, but clearly not elite. I respect how you feel, but seems like you have him overrated a tad bit tho.

gwrighter
03-22-2013, 05:19 PM
This year, yes. Next year, probably not. Rudy Gay is going to give him a run for his money in the east.

Kashmir13579
03-22-2013, 06:38 PM
I think so.

monty77
03-23-2013, 10:18 AM
If Joe Johnson has been more than 5 times all-star, Loul Deng deserve it without no doubt. In the NBA there are only 8-10 superstars so, the other players who play all-start game are selected among a lot of good players, and Deng is one of them.

Deng, Noah and Boozer are very good players but neither of them are a superstar players so, this was the only season that they could be prized playing all-star game because this season they are showing his high level without Rose on court.

Maybe he isn't a genuine scorer, but he can do many thinks well enough: score, rebound, defense... And he was leading (January end) a team which was situated among the four better teams in the East conference.

It's likely that he never play again another all-star game because Rose gets all the attention in Chicago, but if you see his career stats you are going to find out that he is a top 30 player in the league, and taking into account that there are only 10-15 star players around the league, it's normal that he had the chance to get it.

I would sort Noah at the same level than Deng (top 30 player), but it's probably that he will have more chances to play all-star because there are less good players at the Center positions. Deng competes with players such as Lebron, so it will be harder for him.